NFL Thread

[Growsonwalls]

Some Black Lives Matter conflict spilling into the gridiron. Drew Brees made some controversial comments and some NFL players really didn't like it:

 

[mojoween]

Bomani Jones made a great point when he said that he can’t believe that it sounds like Drew is saying how *he* feels about the flag and his grandfathers going off to war is how *everyone* should feel about the flag.

[Sew Sumi]

Malcolm Jenkins speaks out regarding Brees' remarks.

 

[AimingforYoko]

1 hour ago, mojoween said:

Bomani Jones made a great point when he said that he can’t believe that it sounds like Drew is saying how *he* feels about the flag and his grandfathers going off to war is how *everyone* should feel about the flag.

I've said the only difference between Bomani and the late Ralph Wiley is a bit of age. He's really been making strides during this quarantine.

[Growsonwalls]

Now Aaron Rodgers has weighed in:

 

[mojoween]

The worst part about all of this is once again, some more, the focus has switched to WHAT Colin did rather than WHY he did it.

Groundhog Day was not supposed to be a primer for life, people.

[Bastet]

53 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Malcolm Jenkins speaks out regarding Brees' remarks.

 

Damn, that was good.

In other refusing to get it news, Broncos coach Vic Fangio doesn't think racism exists in the NFL. 

Quote

"I think our problems in the NFL along those lines are minimal. We're a league of meritocracy. You earn what you get, you get what you earn. I don't see racism at all in the NFL, I don't see discrimination in the NFL," Fangio told reporters Tuesday when asked about his experiences in the league over the past four decades. "We all live together, joined as one, for one common goal, and we all intermingle and mix tremendously. If society reflected an NFL team, we'd all be great."

The only way not to see it is to refuse to see it.

[Sew Sumi]

Fangio apologized, but it was too little, too late 

[Bastet]

Martellus Bennett is speaking some serious truth on Twitter tonight about all this.

 

[Growsonwalls]

I must admit I'm surprised at Drew Brees.  It's not so much what he said but WHEN HE SAID IT. This is possibly the WORST TIME EVER to make some sort of "Kap disrespected the flag" statement considering, you know, Kap might have taken a knee to the flag but a man actually died after Derek Chauvin pressed HIS knees to George Floyd's neck for 8 minutes. Brees has a right to his politics, he has a right to be very conservative and patriotic. But right now he's being an incredibly shitty teammate and afaik no other NFL player has said anything remotely as tactless and insensitive. Boo. 

[Bastet]

It's a fundamental, and at this point quite willful, mischaracterization of what staying seated and later kneeling in protest during the national anthem was about, and what it will be about if it resumes when NFL play does.

Kaepernick and those who joined him were never protesting against Brees's grandpas or anyone else in the military.  They were protesting against the ongoing systemic oppression of people of color in this country, including police brutality against black people, during the pre-game singing of the national anthem. They were saying such oppression, including lethal examples of racism, betrays America's claimed purpose and promise, so they're going to use this weekly moment to protest it, to encourage those working against it, and invite more people to unite in opposition and change so that the America lauded in the anthem ritual is one actually deserving of universal pride.

This has been stated by Kaepernick and others in great detail and numerous times over the past four years.  There can be no innocent misunderstanding.  For Brees to characterize this particular means of protest as wrong, and specifically to accuse his fellow players of "disrespecting" this country by engaging in it?  It's not just when he said it.  It's what he said.  Protest is every bit as American as the anthem or the flag.  But some of his fellow players lost their livelihoods for doing it.  And he's going to call them out, challenge their patriotism, their very validity as Americans?  It's what he said!  He's very much part of the problem.

Like Jenkins said in the video he originally posted, which was deleted and replaced with the one linked above saying generally the same things to him:

Quote

To stay silent when your peers are screaming from the mountain top, "We need help, our communities are under siege and we need help!" and what you're telling us is, "Don't ask for help that way, ask for it a different way; I can't listen to it when you ask that way."  We're done asking, Drew.  And people who share your sentiments, who express those and push them throughout the world and airways, are the problem.

 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Bastet

[merylinkid]

6 hours ago, Bastet said:

To stay silent when your peers are screaming from the mountain top, "We need help, our communities are under siege and we need help!" and what you're telling us is, "Don't ask for help that way, ask for it a different way; I can't listen to it when you ask that way."  We're done asking, Drew.  And people who share your sentiments, who express those and push them throughout the world and airways, are the problem.

Just because this can't be said enough.     

 

[mojoween]

So.  What are the chances in the next few weeks we get a retirement notification from New Orleans?

[mojoween]

On the other hand

I can’t get all of his statement to show, it’s pretty long.

[emma675]

For me, it's too little too late for Brees' apology. He's apologizing because people are outraged over his comments (the line about the way his comments were "perceived" stood out to me) and are screaming back at him. Maybe he'll prove me wrong and really change his thinking and actions and learn from this, but I don't know. I wonder what it will be like when he gets together with his teammates for the first time to play again?

Edited June 4, 2020 by emma675d

[DoctorAtomic]

I certainly have zero issues with athletes speaking their minds, but dude. 

Honestly if/when the season starts, I hope nearly everyone kneels and it's total chaos. 

[Growsonwalls]

Meh, it might be too little too late but he did the best thing anyone can do after saying something that insensitive and assy which is to apologize with a minimum of excuse-making.

[DoctorAtomic]

He doesn't affect my life either way, but there's a difference between apologizing because everyone is on your case for saying something stupid, or whether you had some actual insight and understand the issue better. I don't know which it is and I don't really care about him, but people aren't obligated to accept his apology either. 

I'm all for athletes speaking out, but I don't consider them the sages of our time, and the freedom to speak out also carries the risk of stepping it in too. 

The fact that he couldn't read the room in the first place is the fundamental problem. 

Edited June 4, 2020 by DoctorAtomic

[Growsonwalls]

Brees said he should do "less talking and more listening." Yeah, he should.

[NUguy514]

Drew, it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt.

Honestly, none of this surprises me; he's shown himself to be passively racist and homophobic behind his cloak of straight, white privilege, and this is just the most egregious instance.  This apology is the very definition of damage control, I don't think it's sincere, and it's too little, too late for me.

[DoctorAtomic]

That was kind of my point. How did you think people were going to respond right now?

[Irlandesa]

3 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

The fact that he couldn't read the room in the first place is the fundamental problem. 

My issue with his apology is that he can't really claim that he didn't know what his comments would do or how they'd be perceived.  Nor do I believe he'll actually learn.  It's not like he's a heavy hitter in some other field and never watched a football game in his life so his exposure to what Kap did, and the message, was gotten through second hand sources.

He's considered one of the premiere QB's in the league. He's a figurehead of his team and arguably the NFL.  He was around when Kap first took a knee. He was around when others started taking a knee.  He was around when the debate raged over taking a knee.  He was around when multiple teams, and even some owners, did it in alleged "solidarity." And yet he returns to the same twisting of motives. 

 

[Growsonwalls]

Ugh Laura Inghram:

 

[Danny Franks]

I have to say, I'm thoroughly enjoying a host of NFL players (and other athletes) dragging that self-righteous prig, Drew Brees. He always comes across as smug and holier-than-thou, and it doesn't surprise me at all that he's self involved and ignorant enough to spout "All Lives Matter" bullshit right now.

His apology is just about protecting his brand, and his chances of success in the upcoming season. It won't convince anyone except people who are desperate to absolve him of his own shitty views.

I bet there are some NFL passrushers who are already circling the day their team plays the Saints, in the upcoming season.

[xaxat]

27 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

I bet there are some NFL passrushers who are already circling the day their team plays the Saints, in the upcoming season.

Social media allow you to do it in public!

 

[doodlebug]

41 minutes ago, Growsonwalls said:

Ugh Laura Inghram:

 

Of course, he's allowed to have an opinion.  What is not allowed is to discount or ignore the opinions of others.  Drew Brees can think and say anything he wants about the anthem protests.  It's his arrogance in telling us all what those protests mean while ignoring what the protesters have actually said about their reasons that is egregious.  The protests were never about the flag or veterans in the first place and for Brees to continue to use this false narrative to imply that those who are protesting are being disrespectful to those things is wrong.  What is really disrespectful to our nation and its principles is to think your opinion is the only correct one, especially when faced with a mountain of evidence that your opinion is, was and always will be incorrect.

[Danny Franks]

20 minutes ago, doodlebug said:

Of course, he's allowed to have an opinion.  What is not allowed is to discount or ignore the opinions of others.  Drew Brees can think and say anything he wants about the anthem protests.  It's his arrogance in telling us all what those protests mean while ignoring what the protesters have actually said about their reasons that is egregious.  The protests were never about the flag or veterans in the first place and for Brees to continue to use this false narrative to imply that those who are protesting are being disrespectful to those things is wrong.  What is really disrespectful to our nation and its principles is to think your opinion is the only correct one, especially when faced with a mountain of evidence that your opinion is, was and always will be incorrect.

Not only that, but Kaepernick was actually advised by a military veteran that kneeling would be a way of protesting that didn't disrespect the flag or the military (as if the US flag only represents soldiers, and not anyone else).

But when he knelt peacefully, it was offensive to certain people, when players stood arm in arm it was offensive to certain people, and when people protest on the streets it's offensive to certain people. It seems to me that the manner of their protest isn't what upsets people like Brees, but the fact that they dare express their unhappiness at all.

[Bastet]

7 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

Meh, it might be too little too late but he did the best thing anyone can do after saying something that insensitive and assy which is to apologize with a minimum of excuse-making.

The best thing would be to acknowledge he completely misrepresented what kneeling in protest during the national anthem means, admit accusing his fellow players who engage in it of disrespecting the country was repugnant, and apologize clearly and directly for that. 

Then go on to say his teammate Malcom Jenkins was spot on in that his comments were self-centered, and that responding to a question about protesting systemic racism and police brutality with an off-topic story about his veteran grandparents that did not even acknowledge black people's grandparents had a very different experience than them in WWII America, just as his black teammates have a very different experience than him in America now, showed he's unaware of his privilege.

Not centering himself AGAIN.  None of this talking about "the way my comments were perceived" and how the words he chose to have come out of his mouth "misled" people into "somehow" branding him as an enemy, when he's "ALWAYS" been an ally (quick tip: if you have to tell people, especially in all caps, that you're an ally, it's because you've shown them you're not).  And certainly not talking about how he can "be a leader for the black community in this movement". 

No, Drew.  Go back to that talking less and listening more thing.  An ally's role is to use your platform to amplify black voices, not insert your own.  It's not about defending your "heart and character", it's about defending their lives.

Edited June 4, 2020 by Bastet

[Moose135]

3 hours ago, Bastet said:

responding to a question about protesting systemic racism and police brutality with an off-topic story about his veteran grandparents that did not even acknowledge black people's grandparents had a very different experience than them in WWII America, just as his black teammates have a very different experience than him in America now, showed he's unaware of his privilege.

One of the best parts about volunteering at the air museum back on Long Island was the opportunity to meet and get to know a number of the Tuskegee Airmen. Amazing, honorable gentlemen, real heroes in my book.

I was talking with one and told him I had been a pilot in the Air Force. He said "Well, then you know what we went through" - meaning pilot training. I said "No sir, I don't. All I had to do was learn to fly, I didn't have to deal with the rest of what you faced."

Edited June 5, 2020 by Moose135

[DoctorAtomic]

It was years ago, but there was an essay titled something like, 'no you're not entitled to your opinion' that addressed this type of situation. 

[Lamb18]

16 hours ago, Danny Franks said:

I bet there are some NFL passrushers who are already circling the day their team plays the Saints, in the upcoming season.

Ha ha, Vikings play them on Christmas Day!  Brees will have sacks instead of stockings.

A number of Vikings were at the George Floyd memorial service yesterday. I thought I saw Bradbury there. It took place at North Central University, a few blocks from US Bank Stadium (and my workplace). Martin Luther King III was there, too, and some celebrities like Kevin Hart. The service was very sad and moving.

[caracas1914]

In fairness to Drew, not just him but all the PR damage control releases people throw out there these days (look at actress Lea Michele) contain the same buzzwords, and babble about growth, change, "perceived" etc.   Whether they are sincere or not, they smack  of the handlers getting their hands all over the message.

 

Maybe a simple:

"Sorry,  I fucking screwed up.   Don't  pile up on me on  the field!" 

would have worked  better at this point.  

 

 

 

Edited June 5, 2020 by caracas1914

[xaxat]

I hope Goodell has a plan.

Because I think kneeling during the anthem is going to be a thing again.

[Bastet]

Following the NFL's disingenous statement last weekend, yesterday a group of players called for the league to do better:

Goodell responded today:

 

[Moose135]

We, the NFL, condemn racism and the systematic oppression of Black People. We, the NFL, admit we were wrong for not listening to NFL players earlier and encourage all to speak out and peacefully protest. We, the NFL, believe Black Lives Matter. #InspireChange

So what team will be signing Kaepernick for next season?

[merylinkid]

Bree released another statement in response to someone who can't be mentioned here.   He made it clear he finally got it that it was never about the flag.   This season is going to be interesting.   If everyone doesn't forget when the next shiny thing comes along.

[Danny Franks]

10 hours ago, xaxat said:

I hope Goodell has a plan.

Because I think kneeling during the anthem is going to be a thing again.

The plan should be no more complicated than - let them kneel if they choose to, and make it clear the league supports that choice.

Fuck the racist dipshit fans who get their panties in a bunch of fake outrage over "disrespecting" a flag that they probably disrespect regularly when they go around with confederate flag pins, clothes and banners.

[Haleth]

If it turns out that games will be played without fans in the stands this might be a good time to set aside the playing of the anthem.

[mojoween]

I’ve often wondered if the most vocal bitchers about kneeling stood up in their living rooms during the anthem, which isn’t even always shown on the broadcast.

I’ve been to one professional sporting event in my life and was caught in the concourse during the anthem and half the people there didn’t even leave the beer line.

[DoctorAtomic]

18 hours ago, caracas1914 said:

Maybe a simple:

"Sorry,  I fucking screwed up.   Don't  pile up on me on  the field!" 

would have worked  better at this point.  

 

I think the lack of genuineness is a lot of the problem. Everyone has said stupid shit. It's amazing to me how so many people just won't apologize or make it your fault - I'm sorry you felt that way. Or the stock pr statement. 

 

[Crs97]

Could someone please pass this along to Drew, or maybe it should be required reading for everyone?

 How to apologize

One of the most important rules in the article:

“No matter how well you apologize, 

you will still face consequences for what you did.

You might deserve to get fired. She might leave. He might never be a friend again. Your apology can't undo any of it. 

Your apology is not your exit slide 

off the airplane that you crashed.”

[DoctorAtomic]

That's very true, but you know what? An actual, sincere apology, you'll likely be forgiven for most dumb shit. 

 

[Fukui San]

4 hours ago, Haleth said:

If it turns out that games will be played without fans in the stands this might be a good time to set aside the playing of the anthem.

They'll probably still do fighter jet fly bys and fireworks to empty stadiums.

[Moose135]

3 minutes ago, Fukui San said:

They'll probably still do fighter jet fly bys and fireworks to empty stadiums.

NASCAR has been running races with empty stadiums, and have been doing the anthem and invocation before the races they have run. For the Coca Cola 600 in Charlotte, on the Sunday of Memorial Day weekend, they did the pre-race flyover. I think that was because the race was originally scheduled for that day (the others they have run so far were rescheduled events) and they already had the flyover scheduled. I live two miles from the track, and we did go out to get photos of it before heading home to watch the race.

I think they did have a flyover last Sunday afternoon before the Bristol race. I'll have to see what they do for the other races they are running with empty grandstands.

[mojoween]

Your pics are so amazing, do you have a public page you put them on?

The Dallas Cowboys have weighed in and they can take their anti-racism pledge and shove it up their ass.  This is the organization whose owner threatened his players who wanted to kneel but happily signed a convicted spousal abuser.

[Moose135]

17 minutes ago, mojoween said:

Your pics are so amazing, do you have a public page you put them on?

Thank you! I have a website at https://www.moose135photography.com/

Here's one from the Charlotte NASCAR flyover.

[TVbitch]

Roger Goodell looks like a hostage making a forced confession in that video. 

[mojoween]

Joe Montana is 64 today.

Like, I get how time works, but that’s still not possible.

[DoctorAtomic]

That ain't right. 

[xaxat]

Bye Jerry! Not going to miss you.