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The Crown In The Media

Meredith Quill

By Meredith Quill
in The Crown

formerlyfreedom
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Posts in this topic should be about the media for The Crown. Off topic posts may be removed with notification; repeated infractions may result in warnings.

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dubbel zout
dubbel zout

I think Matt Smith should keep his money, and Netflix should pay Claire Foy more and make a donation to Time's Up. Men giving up part of their salary to women isn't the way to achieve salary parity. T

PinkRibbons
PinkRibbons

Gotta hand it to Netflix, this is actually pretty great! Trailer for The Crown if it was a horror movie:

Pallas
Pallas

"...with the heat of 1,000 nuns" is an old chestnut from PTV's forebear, Television Without Pity (TWoP), and even originally, a deliberate malapropism (I think: dubbel zout, do you recall the origin?)

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ItCouldBeWorse

ItCouldBeWorse

19 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

I am here for how they deal with Andrew/Fergie. Andy is the queen's favorite son, but Philip hates Fergie with the heat of 1,000 nuns. I'm convinced he's hanging on solely to keep those two from remarrying.

Do nuns give off a lot of heat?

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Pallas

Pallas

"...with the heat of 1,000 nuns" is an old chestnut from PTV's forebear, Television Without Pity (TWoP), and even originally, a deliberate malapropism (I think: dubbel zout, do you recall the origin?). When used with regard to Philip -- whose mother founded an Orthodox nursing order -- the phrase has the cheek of a 1,000 puns.

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doodlebug

doodlebug

1 hour ago, Pallas said:

"...with the heat of 1,000 nuns" is an old chestnut from PTV's forebear, Television Without Pity (TWoP), and even originally, a deliberate malapropism (I think: dubbel zout, do you recall the origin?). When used with regard to Phillip -- whose mother founded an Orthodox nursing order -- the phrase has the cheek of a 1,000 puns.

The origin was an episode of The Amazing Race where there were a bunch of nuns on an escalator in an airport someplace which got a lot of amusing commentary in the episode thread , I think the show even played appropriately heavenly music over the shot. A poster, in speaking of a contestant pair that was widely disliked claimed to hate them with the 'heat of a 1000 nuns'.  And, yeah, I've used the phrase myself a few times and gotten odd looks.  What can I say?  It's still funny.

I think it might've been the season where Freddie and K-K-K Kendra won because I am thinking they were the ones who were the original target of the phrase.

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VCRTracking

VCRTracking

(edited)

I love Olivia Colman ever since Hot Fuzz("Nothin' like a bit of 'girl on girl'!") and she blew me away in Night Manager. She'll make a great 40 something QEII.
 

I assume s3 will cover the ill-adviced 1969 documentary that we've only seen snippets of since it originally aired. Also the attempted kidnapping of Princess Anne.

Edited by VCRTracking
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cali1981

cali1981

(edited)

Just finished Season 2 which, IMHO, was even better than Season 1.  Olivia Colman is great choice for the older Elizabeth and Season 3 should be a killer especially it's getting into an era that more people in the US are familiar with.  The betting is on for who will play Philip. Matt Smith thinks that he knows who is replacing him but isn't sure and, obviously, couldn't say yet if he did know for certain.

Edited by cali1981
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GaT

GaT

This isn't exactly about The Crown, so I hope it's OK to post it here, but Prince Philip had a portrait done (not sure if this is his final official portrait or not) & it's really nice IMO. I can't believe this is a painting, it looks like a photo.

rs_600x600-171211113537-600.Prince-Phili 

And on a slightly amusing note, I did a Google search on this photo, & Google's best guess was Joe Alwyn, Taylor Swift's boyfriend LOL

joe-alwyn.jpg?w=620

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AnnieBeez

AnnieBeez

On 12/11/2017 at 9:30 AM, cali1981 said:

Just finished Season 2 which, IMHO, was even better than Season 1.  Olivia Colman is great choice for the older Elizabeth and Season 3 should be a killer especially it's getting into an era that more people in the US are familiar with.  The betting is on for who will play Philip. Matt Smith thinks that he knows who is replacing him but isn't sure and, obviously, couldn't say yet if he did know for certain.

I hope it's someone who looks more like Philip. Matt Smith's nose and putty face are just wrong. 

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Spotlight

Spotlight

I don’t know where else to post this...

I wish they would release season three sooner rather than later. It’s making me crazy knowing that I have to wait another year to see more episodes. Have they even hired the new actors for season three yet? I’m fearing that it may take even longer than a year to get season three streaming on Netflix 

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OtterMommy

OtterMommy

On 12/23/2017 at 5:21 AM, Spotlight said:

I don’t know where else to post this...

I wish they would release season three sooner rather than later. It’s making me crazy knowing that I have to wait another year to see more episodes. Have they even hired the new actors for season three yet? I’m fearing that it may take even longer than a year to get season three streaming on Netflix 

They have hired at least the actress to play Elizabeth.

As for sooner rather than later--that tends to be the nature of the beast with streaming shows.  It's also, unfortunately, a downfall of binge watching.  If someone had the willpower to watch one episode a week (that would NOT be me, by the way!), I think the "hiatus" might be a bit more bearable.  Don't worry...I sincerely doubt that we'll have to wait more than a year for season 3.  This is one of Netflix's biggest shows and they know they need to stick to a schedule with it.

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Spotlight

Spotlight

18 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

They have hired at least the actress to play Elizabeth.

As for sooner rather than later--that tends to be the nature of the beast with streaming shows.  It's also, unfortunately, a downfall of binge watching.  If someone had the willpower to watch one episode a week (that would NOT be me, by the way!), I think the "hiatus" might be a bit more bearable.  Don't worry...I sincerely doubt that we'll have to wait more than a year for season 3.  This is one of Netflix's biggest shows and they know they need to stick to a schedule with it.

I really hope u r right OtterMommy. 

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OtterMommy

OtterMommy

17 minutes ago, jjj said:

Another article on Claire Foy being paid less than Matthew Smith.  I find this astonishing, but why am I even surprised.  FFS, if CLAIRE FOY is not worthy of pay parity, what hope is there for the rest of us?  They totally should pay Claire Foy the difference now.  She was magical in this role. 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/crown-will-embrace-salary-parity-star-claire-foy-earned-matt-smith-1094270 

Not to mention that Foy was nominated for everything and won quite a few of those awards.  Was Smith even nominated for anything?

I understand that there are always negotiations around salaries and such, but it boggles my mind that as studio would willingly pay an actress who plays a much larger role and, as things progress, earns far more accolades, than an actor in a lesser role.  Do they not understand the PR backlash they will face when the truth comes out?  And, oh yeah, the truth always comes out.

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OtterMommy

OtterMommy

27 minutes ago, voiceover said:

Matt Smith was Doctor Who.  Claire Foy was Little Dorrit.  

I actually know a person who refused to watch The Crown because she hated Matt Smith as Dr. Who (I've never actually seen a single episode of Dr. Who, so I have no opinion there).  I get that there is some salary negotiation involved but, honestly, I didn't think that Smith's portrayal was such that I could not picture anyone else in the role.  I did feel that way about Foy's performance.  And while I do understand how past roles can play a part in these negotiations, I don't think they should be such a prominent bargaining chip that you end up with a situation like you have here.  

I mean, let's face it...who wore The Crown here?

It's great that Olivia Coleman will receive equal pay going forward (we assume).  I have to wonder if that would be the case if this situation with Smith and Foy hadn't come to light, especially if someone like Hugh Laurie is cast as Prince Philip.

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jjj

jjj

3 minutes ago, OtterMommy said:

I actually know a person who refused to watch The Crown because she hated Matt Smith as Dr. Who (I've never actually seen a single episode of Dr. Who, so I have no opinion there).  I get that there is some salary negotiation involved but, honestly, I didn't think that Smith's portrayal was such that I could not picture anyone else in the role.  I did feel that way about Foy's performance.  And while I do understand how past roles can play a part in these negotiations, I don't think they should be such a prominent bargaining chip that you end up with a situation like you have here.  

I mean, let's face it...who wore The Crown here?

I only know these actors from this series, so don't know what they brought to the negotiating table.  But I know who was resplendent in "The Crown", and yes, it was the person wearing it.   Netflix really needs to fix this.  I have not seen how much Matt Smith actually was paid, so don't know if it would mean doubling Foy's salary retroactively.  But I'll bet he was not just paid an extra $5000 per episode; probably something much more significant. 

(Ha, I also have never seen an episode of "Dr. Who") 

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dubbel zout

dubbel zout

I sort of get it for the first season, but the second? There's no excuse.

53 minutes ago, supposebly said:

Are women's agents asleep on the job?

This is what I don't understand at all. Don't agents want their clients, regardless of gender, to get as much money as possible so the agents get as much money as possible? The agents are hurting themselves, too.

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ProudMary

ProudMary

32 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

I sort of get it for the first season, but the second? There's no excuse.

This is what I don't understand at all. Don't agents want their clients, regardless of gender, to get as much money as possible so the agents get as much money as possible? The agents are hurting themselves, too.

I have no inside information but I would bet that their contracts were locked in for two seasons (20 episodes.) 

I would have thought however that a good agent would have at least built in performance bonuses for Emmys, SAGs, etc. all of which were deservedly won by Claire Foy. 
I remember years ago--I'm sure others will recall this also--that Paul Reiser was making a million dollars an episode for Mad About You.  Helen Hunt was making substantially less than Reiser but had a performance clause in her contract that should she win an Oscar, she would have to be paid the same amount as he was receiving.  When that contract was signed, HH was nowhere near getting the kind of film roles that would merit an Oscar; but then along came As Good As It Gets and Bam!  Oscar winner Helen Hunt had to be paid a million an episode too.  

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jjj

jjj

I include this Daily Mail link because it has a British perspective and a few tidbits about the stars and series.  It also says that Smith's salary has not been revealed, which to me says it is probably an embarrassing differential.   http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-5496603/Netflix-paid-Crowns-Claire-Foy-Matt-Smith.html

2 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

This is what I don't understand at all. Don't agents want their clients, regardless of gender, to get as much money as possible so the agents get as much money as possible? The agents are hurting themselves, too.

Agree.  This is why the agents who helped anyone at the start of their career (actors, writers, etc.) are sometimes jettisoned when they do not evolve to be in the same league as the talent they represent.

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voiceover

voiceover

My point is, it doesn't matter how you feel about Matt Smith, or the fact that Claire Foy had the bigger role.  Assuming the producers gave him the money for the name recognition value. Assuming the money people said, Put a name in there.   Assuming Claire could've held out over Season 2 money.  

I loved her in Little Dorrit, and I stopped watching his Doctor after his first season, but even I said, Wow, as Prince Philip?

Not saying I approve.  I am wondering, why is this just now hitting the fan?  Actors' salaries aren't state secrets.

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Ceindreadh

Ceindreadh

13 hours ago, OtterMommy said:

I actually know a person who refused to watch The Crown because she hated Matt Smith as Dr. Who (I've never actually seen a single episode of Dr. Who, so I have no opinion there).  I get that there is some salary negotiation involved but, honestly, I didn't think that Smith's portrayal was such that I could not picture anyone else in the role.  I did feel that way about Foy's performance.  And while I do understand how past roles can play a part in these negotiations, I don't think they should be such a prominent bargaining chip that you end up with a situation like you have here.  

I mean, let's face it...who wore The Crown here?

It's great that Olivia Coleman will receive equal pay going forward (we assume).  I have to wonder if that would be the case if this situation with Smith and Foy hadn't come to light, especially if someone like Hugh Laurie is cast as Prince Philip.

I’m the other way round in that I only watched The Crown because Matt Smith was in it. That said, I would have thought that Claire Foy was equally well known at least in the UK. 

As for Olivia Coleman, again, I would think she’d have enough name recognition in the UK to have  been paid equally even without this situation coming to light. 

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supposebly

supposebly

I would have thought, between Matt Smith's name recognition (that's mainly why I started watching) and Claire Foy having the title role and clearly being the lead, this should have been a no-brainer for equal pay regardless of her name recognition.

I am also surprised it took so long to make news.

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dubbel zout

dubbel zout

(edited)
11 hours ago, ProudMary said:

I have no inside information but I would bet that their contracts were locked in for two seasons (20 episodes.) 

I would have thought however that a good agent would have at least built in performance bonuses for Emmys, SAGs, etc. all of which were deservedly won by Claire Foy. 

The contracts were for two years, as it was always the plan to change actors as the decades passed. But that doesn't explain why Foy's agents didn't think to put in some sort of bonus system. I hope she has a conversation with them.

ETA: Or if her agents had no bonus system, why not have a clause that says as she's the lead actor, no one can make more than she does? Linda Evans and Joan Collins had a clause in their Dynasty contracts that neither could outearn the other, so if one got a raise, so did the other. I can't believe that's not done more frequently.

1 hour ago, supposebly said:

I am also surprised it took so long to make news.

I am and I'm not. I am because the show has an enormous budget—I think $100 million has been tossed around—and while you certainly see it in the production values, a decent chunk of the money has to go to cast salaries, no matter what the name recognition. I'm not surprised because the emphasis has been on the look of the show, so I think salaries were an afterthought. 

Edited by dubbel zout
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Pallas

Pallas

In this case, the disparity makes sense to me. Actors aren't paid by the hour but in recognition of their box-office value and of what competing producers might offer. When the contracts were negotiated, Claire Foy was by far the less well-known of the two actors, not only to American audiences but also to the niche American audience for a British-made drama. And the role was the stuff of a Broadway musical about a new star. Her agent's job was to secure her a part that would make her career -- against what must have been extraordinary competition. The pay-off for actor and agent begins now: over the whole course of that career, and especially, with her next few projects. 

At the same time, of course it's true that pay bias obtains at every level; that producers underestimate the box office value of women, and that people on either side of the table excuse their own prejudice with that rationalization. But this is an instance where, going into the project, the gap between the two actors' recognition was real, and more: where the role itself was the jewel in the crown.    

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Sakura12

Sakura12

I think this was more a name recognition issue then a gender issue. Claire Foy was a nobody/newcomer to the general audience. While Matt Smith starred in Doctor Who. I wouldn't be surprised if John Lithgow got paid more than Claire Foy too. For CF it was getting a starring role in a series that could make her a name star, which it did. Now if she gets another series she can ask for more. 

Since it was a two year role the contract was probably for 2 years so they would lock the actors down for that. Now in Season 2 she could've tried to renegotiate or Netflix could've paid more because the show and her were a hit. 

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Milburn Stone

Milburn Stone

6 hours ago, Pallas said:

...the role was the stuff of a Broadway musical about a new star. Her agent's job was to secure her a part that would make her career -- against what must have been extraordinary competition. The pay-off for actor and agent begins now: over the whole course of that career, and especially, with her next few projects.

This makes sense to me.

It's notable (in support of this rationale) that as far as I know, one person who hasn't been complaining about the pay disparity is Claire Foy.

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jjj

jjj

(edited)
3 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

It's notable (in support of this rationale) that as far as I know, one person who hasn't been complaining about the pay disparity is Claire Foy.

Of course she is not saying anything in public; Michelle Williams did the same thing (when Wahlberg was paid 1000 times more for reshoots) -- she let others create all the noise.  Foy has innumerable publications beating the drum for her, and has both her dignity and public support.  I continue to think that Netflix will do something to stop the discussion.   (They will say it is to be fair.)

Edited by jjj
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merylinkid

merylinkid

As noted, sometimes actors just want to work.   The money seems decent enough, and they don't know what the other cast members are making so they say yes.  They buy the bullshit of "well, we WOULD ask for more, but your name is well known enough yet."   So they sign the damn contract.   Then they find out their supporting actor is making 10 times what they are making.   Face it, you COULD have made The Crown without Prince Philip.   But you could not have made it without The Queen.   That should have been a factor in the contract.    Or put in performance bonuses as someone said.    That way everyone wins if it is a good product.  

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Milburn Stone

Milburn Stone

1 hour ago, merylinkid said:

As noted, sometimes actors just want to work.   The money seems decent enough, and they don't know what the other cast members are making so they say yes.  They buy the bullshit of "well, we WOULD ask for more, but your name is well known enough yet."   So they sign the damn contract.   Then they find out their supporting actor is making 10 times what they are making.

That's absolutely one possible interpretation of events--that Claire Foy was essentially "duped" by not knowing how much more Matt Smith was making. All I'm saying (with a hat tip to @Pallas, who put the entirely plausible idea into my head) is that another possibility is she went into it with eyes wide open, fully aware of the pay disparity, and highly disinclined to play hardball, then or later, in return for the amazing opportunity that any number of other actresses would kill for.

Whether she seeks redress from Netflix now or not, I wouldn't blame her either way. It's a career decision, hers alone to make. But she's in a position now to get that redress in the form of a big payday on her next project.

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dubbel zout

dubbel zout

2 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

another possibility is she went into it with eyes wide open, fully aware of the pay disparity, and highly disinclined to play hardball, then or later, in return for the amazing opportunity that any number of other actresses would kill for.

The problem with this is that it perpetuates pay disparity. It encourages women, especially, not to value themselves highly enough to demand a salary appropriate to their role. I seriously doubt a better-known actress in the supporting role would have been paid more than the lead actor had things been reversed.

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doodlebug

doodlebug

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

The problem with this is that it perpetuates pay disparity. It encourages women, especially, not to value themselves highly enough to demand a salary appropriate to their role. I seriously doubt a better-known actress in the supporting role would have been paid more than the lead actor had things been reversed.

I agree, in the ideal world, every woman would stand strong and demand parity.  But, that’s not how it works in the real world,  especially the real world of 3 years ago when Foy signed the contract. Presumably, this is the biggest project she’s ever been offered, an amazing opportunity to play the lead in a well written story involving an iconic character.  I think the largest role she’d had prior to that was a good, but supporting role as Anne Boleyn in a couple episodes of Wolf Hall.  Meanwhile, she knows who Matt Smith is and that he played the lead in one of the most iconic British TV series of all time.  Sure, she could’ve demanded pay parity, but maybe TPTB decide to look elsewhere.  I expect this show was by far the biggest payday she’d had as an actress.  To risk it to make a larger political point was not realistic.

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dubbel zout

dubbel zout

If no one pushes back, the vicious cycle continues. I’m not saying Claire Foy has to be the standard-bearer, but I really hope she has a serious talk with her agents about future projects. And that other actresses’ agents push harder.

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