S03.E06: Dolce

[penguinnj]

My first thought was "No, this won't happen.  If anything, Hannibal would eat Will's heart, not his brain."

Frustrating show- but I love it!

[AimingforYoko]

 

LOL! Hannibal getting his Chuckie on when he cut Jack's achilles tendon from under the table. Wasn't that a famous scene in the movie but Chuckie the doll did it from under the bed? That freaked me the hell out as a child (and adult to be honest LOL!).

It was Pet Sematary. The evil reanimated Gage cut Fred Gwynne's achilles.

[saber5055]

I've only walked out of one movie in my life of seeing multiple movies per week. Now I'm walking out on a television show I used to love. I'm done. Thanks, Fuller, for freeing up my Thursday nights.

 

I am glad this show is canceled. I'm just canceling it a few weeks before NBC.

[JennyMominFL]

I will never ever be able to see Mason without thinking of Jim Carrey. Thanks

[Neurochick]

I am still giggling over the insanity. I love that Bryan Fuller has basically said fuck it I will do what I want. I am so glad this is the last season. This cannot be topped. Epic weirdness. In a tidy 43 minutes.

Also this was a nice reminder that Hannibal is unsentimental about Will. His plan to eat his brain was also a dig at Jack. This was the monster Hannibal in full view.

Why did Will pull that knife?

 

I agree, I love that this show is basically batshit insane, sometimes I wish this wasn't the last season, but other time I'm like, "fuck it, it's all good."  Really I'm enjoying what I'm watching, it's fucked up and insane and sometimes makes no sense but when I compare it to most stuff on TV today, this show is a fucking little gem.

[Crossbow]

Lesbian kaleidoscope sex was a bridge too far. Not the sex itself but the overproduced, art house quality of it. It is just too much for me now that it almost appears amateurish no matter that it is well shot, etc. It might as well have been a star wipe at this point. 

 

I agree, it looked like the kind of thing you would think was cool if you were a kid just learning film.

[lulee]

I gotta say -- I logically knew at the time that the kaleidoscope was ridiculous and self indulgent film-making, but I'll be darned if I didn't feel very ... in the moment ... with Alana and Margot.

[Bruinsfan]

Has Alana ever even hinted at lesbian leanings before this? Because if not, I am calling foul on the necessity of Hannibal and Will's affection for one another remaining strictly platonic wheras the female lead is free to experiment with her sexuality in kaleidoscope-vision. And I'd like to get whatever network executive is responsible under a spotlight in an interrogation room so I can question him at length about it.

 

To be honest I was surprised she didn't kill the Italian police officer.

When she questioned him about the officialness of the capacity he was acting in, I thought for sure he was a goner. Girlfriend has to be proficient in making bodies disappear after spending months on the lam with Hannibal.

Mason is reminding me of Jim Carrey as Fire Marshall Bill during his In Living Color day.

Thank you! It has been bothering me for weeks trying to figure out who he reminded me of, and that's it exactly.

[CatLady]

Well well.  I feel used and abused as a viewer.

 

First off the lesbian kaleidoscope sex went on too long and almost made me think artsy-fartsy clips were inserted to cover up the sex and steam.  Go there but be tasteful and make the audience feel it.  My eyes almost crossed with the endless prisms.

 

Bedelia is a real snake-able to wriggle out of any situation. I did love it that she let Hannibal know she knew she would have eventually been on his menu had circumstances not intervened.  Snakes are smart.

 

The chemistry and adoration between Hannibal and Will is quite compelling.  Then Will pulled the knife.  The knife led to Hannibal's disappointment and that led to the saw.  The character in Red Dragon was loathesome that I quite enjoyed the squeamish scenes where his brain was excised and prepared. Ray Liotta was wonderful. Will, on the other hand, made me immeasurably sad even though Hannibal did not complete his malevolence.

 

The show has become so tense with no relief that it is work to watch it- not to mention the badly it scenes.

Edited July 10, 2015 by CatLady

[Crossbow]

The kaleidoscope ws like, http://www.criticalcommons.org/Members/ccManager/clips/busby-berkeley-machine-inspired-dance-sequence-from-dames

 

The character in Red Dragon was loathesome that I quite enjoyed the squeamish scenes where his brain was excised and prepared. Ray Liotta was wonderful. Will, on the other hand, made me immeasurably sad even though Hannibal did not complete his malevolence.

 

I thought it was interesting that in the book, it seemed that Hannibal thought that guy (Kendall? Krender?) deserved an extra dramatic execution for being so foul, but with Will it was more like some kind of Jeffrey-Dahmer-esque attempt to keep Will with him in death.

Edited July 10, 2015 by Crossbow

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Mason is reminding me of Jim Carrey as Fire Marshall Bill during his In Living Color day.

Now I am going to be waiting for Mason to do that Fire Marshall Bill laugh in all of his scenes!

 

The kaleidoscope sex reminded me of all those youtube videos where people use the mirror effect because they think it's so cool (for the record, every time I see one of those mirror videos, I roll my eyes and stop watching).

[Primetimer]

Eve Batey collects the images you can't get out of your head.

Read the story

[RafaelBarbas]

I've seen many complaints about Hannigram vs Marlana- why Marlana get a sex scene with little relationship development, while Hannigram get nothing. And I have come up with a few thoughts for it.

1. Margot and Alana seem like "in the background" types, at least where relationships are concerned. A quiet, in the background buildup is exactly right for them. The bedroom scene is a way of showing that they have made that jump, but us as an audience, like the people in their lives, won't see them.
2. Hannibal and Will, conversely, will air everything. That's why there's been so much of what amounts to teasing. Their feelings for each other are nearly their entire lives at this point.
3. Corollary to the above, while Hannigram are open about their emotions, Hannibal's versions of normal human emotions are completely incomprehensible to us. In some versions he's a sociopath and in this one, Mads said he's basically playing Hannibal as satan himself. In this version of Hannibal, he killed and ate his own sister because he couldn't understand her love for him.
Love for Hannibal isn't about kisses and dates (and when he does do this it's to lead the other person along, not for himself- like with Alana), it's about another person giving him complete ownership over them. And Will gave him that. Will is at a point of not being able to function without Hannibal in his life, and finally gave himself over to him completely. For a Hannibal ship, this was a more true consummation than what he had with Alana. This is also why he wanted to eat Will, from early on this season. Chilton got one thing right last year- cannibalism IS an act of dominance. By cannibalizing Will he'd have control of him forever, which means he would have Will's love and vice versa forever.

TL;DR version: Margot and Alana are a relationship as we understand it; Hannigram is not. Both relationships became canon in ways that are true of them, not necessarily what the audience sees a real relationship as.

[Kristen]

Well, kudos to Bryan Fuller for getting abstract, kaleidoscopic lady finger-banging on network TV.

And kudos to Gillian Anderson and Caroline Dhavernas for consistently giving me the heart-eyes even when I'm sitting there watching this show like "WTF, mate?"

[venezia54]

 

I was cracking up during the first scene when Hannibal was stumbling around the streets of Florence with blood soaked clothes and no one noticed or called the police. It was light out so it must have been at least a few hours after Jack tossed him out the window.

 

I presumed it was around dawn, and where he was walking is the historic center and around the Uffizi/Ponte Vecchio--not many cars or traffic that early, so I didn't find it unrealistic.  In both Venice and Florence, I've drunkenly teetered home and not seen a soul at 6 a.m., except for other drunken teeter-ers. 

Edited July 10, 2015 by venezia54

[Anela]

Well expecting or wishing these people to act like rational human beings is a mistske. They eat human beings. I think most of them are Apex predators and we are watching a battle to see which is the apexyiest preditor of them all.

I thought Bedelia's plan was brilliant; using one of Hannibals past actions as an alibi is something she would do. Mind control doesn't stop you from doing daily activity stuff like going to the shop it just.....controls your mind. Besides going to the cops or telling Jack everything has its own problems. She may not have purposely killed anyone but she was on the run with one of FBI Most Wanted it really doesn't matter. His crimes are her crimes. Being drugged and manipulated by scary Hannibal makes her another of his victims. To be honest I was surprised she didn't kill the Italian police officer.

Bedelia wasn't eating people, and Will knows just what it's like to be screwed with by him, as does Jack. We just wouldn't have had the trippy images, as we got her view of things. 

Edited July 10, 2015 by Anela

[Snookums]

Little surprised by the tryst between Alana and Margot. I remember Margot telling Will she preferred women. Did not know Alana swung that way also. I am interested to see them get Mason to the FBI, or deal with him in some other manner.

 

 

 

I question this decision, because I hate "Lesbian for the sake of the plot" characters. If Alana had been gay/bi from the get, that'd be one thing, but as far as I can tell she was pretty consistently hetero before this. Now, it's not like you can't have a turn in your preferences, or (more likely) that Alana is playing both Margot and Mason as a means to insinuate themselves into their lives and capture Hannibal, but it just bugs. I was far less offended by Margot's seduction of Will because it was clear she was doing it to conceive a child and using him. Not that that's good thing to do but it wasn't presented as Will's So Awesome That Margot Got Pants Feelings Out Of Nowhere.

 

But anyway! Holy fuck, everybody, that was some trippy shit. I'm starting to think Fuller is going around secretly dosing the viewing audience with Bedelia's "medicine." And what a brilliant play by her, by the by--use Hannibal's past against him, as he used her past with the patient he sicced on her. Learn from the master, then walk away. Only Dr. Du Marier seems to be grasping this lesson.

 

Poor Will cannot catch a break! I mean, it's mostly his own fault, but damn, even Jack didn't say "dude, you look like you got chucked off a train, what the hell happened?" It's like he's invisible to everybody but Hannibal and "Quit Playing With My Toy" Chiyo.

[Helena Dax]

Wow, what a chapter!

 

Chiyoh was my less favourite character. She looks like 25 and  her youth doesn't  help. I mean  when did she start to take care of Hannibal's prisoner? When she finished high school?

 

But everything else was perfection. Loved Bedelia's game. She's  survived  Hannibal without losing any part of her body or her freedom. How many people can say that?

 

I'm okay with the lesbian sex,  just disappointed  that we don't get to see anything sexual between Hannibal and Will. If the writers don't want to make it real , it could be a dream or an hallucination, but  the UST between them is killing me. And thank God Hannibal didn't have the chance to eat poor Will's brain. 

 

Mason's disgusting and he's found a friend as disgusting as he is. I don't know if  the assistant is showing him fancy ways to eat Hannibal or training  him to become a cannibal. Both possibilities are darkly hilarious.

[RazzleberryPie]

What happened to Michael Pitt and why does this Mason sound like a bad Jimmy Stewart impersonator?

Edited July 11, 2015 by RazzleberryPie

[Dot Com]

Dolce. Italian for ... Tripping?

[Anela]

Dolce. Italian for ... Tripping?

It's apparently Italian for "sweet", so sweetbreads? As in Will's brain? Along with the love connections between people. 

Edited July 11, 2015 by Anela

[MisterGlass]

Janice Poon in this week's blog has a picture of a plate with fruits, honey, and cake labeled 'dolce'.  I wonder if it refers to generally some kind of sweet meal addition.

 

The actor playing Mason now is named Joe Anderson.  He's English, and his efforts at a quasi-southern American accent combined with the prosthetics are probably what lead to this somewhat odd voice.  It sounds very pinched and gravelly, which given the damage Mason did to himself makes some sense.

 

From the recap, about Will and Hannibal's reunion at the museum:

 

 

Props to the show for making this reunion so understated.

 

I agree.  It's fascinating this way.  Quiet, contemplative, and intense.

[Tippi Blevins]

And thank God Hannibal didn't have the chance to eat poor Will's brain. 

 

The more I think about it, the more disappointed I am that the show went this route. It seems rushed. If Hannibal couldn't eat Bedelia because she hadn't been acorned enough, why does Will only get a couple sips of parsley soup before becoming an entree?

 

I mean, baste him for a few days at least, you know? All that damn buildup and then this? Will should have been like, "Dude, I sailed single-handed across the ocean to find and/or kill you, I deserve a better death than this!"

 

Also, why is the pairing portmanteau for Hannibal and Will "Hannigram" instead of "Winnibal"?

Edited July 11, 2015 by Tippi Blevins

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Janice Poon in this week's blog has a picture of a plate with fruits, honey, and cake labeled 'dolce'. I wonder if it refers to generally some kind of sweet meal addition.

The literal translation of dolce is sweet but it usually refers to dessert or sweet treats in reference to food.

[kmm49]

Everything but the kitchen sink was thrown into this episode and it didn't make any sense. How frustrating! Are we who never read the books to be punished for nothing making sense? Why was Bedelia drugging herself? Is Chiyo working with Hannibal? Are Jack and Will really that stupid? The lesbian scene was dumb and just thrown in to have a lesbian scene. What's with the incest/baby thing between Margot and Mason?

 

The chemistry and adoration between Hannibal and Will is quite compelling.

 

It's always been the strongest aspect of the show and it was great to see them have scenes together because I really missed it!

Edited July 11, 2015 by kmm49

[mertensia]

To me Mason Verger sounds like a bad Connery impersonation.

[pasdetrois]

 

The poor messed up guy can't catch a break. Gutted by Hannibal, thrown off a train, shot, drugged, almost lobotomized. Hopefully whatever attachment he feels to Hannibal is now gone.

 

He is the Will E. Coyote of the series. I wonder if Dancy wearily thinks "oh my god what now" every time he's in a scene.

 

I snorted at the lesbian kaleidoscope stuff. I've worked in video production and everyone has fooled around with cheap graphics packages that produce similar effects.

 

In all the rushed storyline and arty effects, the little moments of good acting are almost lost. Mads' brief facial expressions, when they shift from his usual detached affect to emotion, continue to delight. Even his portrayal of someone suffering grievous bodily injury is realistic, compared to the typical exaggerated thrashing about and moaning we usually see. I think it's his dancer's background. I notice his physical movement much more than I do other actors.

 

I guess the sperm storyline is about angling for the family inheritance.

 

I'm trying to get interested in the women in this series but I cannot. The story belongs to Hannibal, Will and Jack.

Edited July 11, 2015 by pasdetrois

[jeansheridan]

Everything but the kitchen sink was thrown into this episode and it didn't make any sense. How frustrating! Are we who never read the books to be punished for nothing making sense? Why was Bedelia drugging herself? Is Chiyo working with Hannibal? Are Jack and Will really that stupid? The lesbian scene was dumb and just thrown in to have a lesbian scene. What's with the incest/baby thing between Margot and Mason?

 

It's always been the strongest aspect of the show and it was great to see them have scenes together because I really missed it!

This show doesn't really follow the books. It is a mashup at best. Bedelia is a glorious Fuller addition. She is a bit Clarice and her own person. Which I love because Anderson as Scully was made to resemble Jody Foster from Silence of the Lambs. Fuller works in layers.

Will has no European adventure. He might be a bit wiser and warier in Red Dragon. I do wish our Will was a bit wiser sometimes but I am all in. Fuller can drive this show off a cliff so long as it all wasn't just a fever dream. If we end at the beginning, I might get mad. Or love him for it. I am that delighted with his joyful insanity. Plus he brought Mads to me. That will be a lifelong gift.

[sluggish neko]

He is the Will E. Coyote of the series. I wonder if Dancy wearily thinks "oh my god what now" every time he's in a scene.

 

And Bedelia would be the Road Runner. The first time Hannibal goes to kill her, she vanishes. This second time, she essentially sticks her tongue out at him and escapes again. *meep meep*

 

Gillain Anderson once described the dynamic between Will and Bedelia as mistress and wife. Bedelia definitely has the better deal. She gets to go on the European travel vacation that Will missed out on, spend a lot of time taking luxurious baths while taunting the Devil, and get high for an alibi. Will gets falsely imprisoned, stabbed, thrown off a train, shot...etc. I can see why a certain angsty someone would be jealous.

 

I guess Will getting thrown off the train last time was so he can have matching facial injuries with Hannibal. It's a nice effect for the lovely museum reunion scene... but seriously, couldn't they have done it another way? Falling off a moving train is dangerous, yo. I can't fathom how Will walked away from that... then again, if he is Wile E. Coyote, I've answered my own question, haven't I?

[jeansheridan]

My first thought was "No, this won't happen.  If anything, Hannibal would eat Will's heart, not his brain."

Frustrating show- but I love it!

True but I think with Jack there, the whimsy kicked in. For Jack it has been about Will's brain. Maybe the heart would have come later. As much as I adore Mads &Hugh' s chemistry, Jack has always been a big piece of theirstory. Hannibal eating Will's heart is a private thing. But his brain he can share with Jack.

[jeansheridan]

To me Mason Verger sounds like a bad Connery impersonation.

Poor Joe Anderson. He is a Brit having to mimic Michael Pitt' s very stylized speaking patterns while wearing a lot of rubber on his face. A thankless task. I still like him.

Can we discuss Margot' s horrible hair? I didn't recognize her at first. Great dress. Bad hair. She looked like a doll. Her looks are so changeable. Great smoky voice however.

Edited July 12, 2015 by jeansheridan

[greenbean]

I thought the lesbian sex scene was ridiculously pretentious and student level. It's exactly what I mean when I say scenes often look like a music video. The visual artistry is now so self-indulgent, and it's used in place of actual plot and character development, at times it's been like watching mtv. Well, I want my Hannibal back!

[Bruinsfan]

The actor playing Mason now is named Joe Anderson.  He's English, and his efforts at a quasi-southern American accent combined with the prosthetics are probably what lead to this somewhat odd voice.  It sounds very pinched and gravelly, which given the damage Mason did to himself makes some sense.

I'm hearing it as a New England accent - I half expect him to chime in with "If you obey all the rules you miss all the fun" and other Katharine Hepburn quotes.

 

I'm trying to get interested in the women in this series but I cannot. The story belongs to Hannibal, Will and Jack.

Alana is still fascinating to me, but then I watched Off the Map strictly for Caroline Dhavernas. I only draw the line at sitting through Out Cold and M. Night Shayamalan movies for her sake.

[Chaos Theory]

I gotta say -- I logically knew at the time that the kaleidoscope was ridiculous and self indulgent film-making, but I'll be darned if I didn't feel very ... in the moment ... with Alana and Margot.

 

I don't think it was ridiculously  self indulgent.  I think it was more overly and overtly artistic and why the hell not?  At this point Bryan Fuller can go full on artsy-fartsy if he wants.  I know a lot of people don't like it but I am finding it refreshing  to see a full on no holds barred art film.  I mean hell it nothing else, is beautiful to watch.  

 

<----Edited because autocorrect keeps making up words.  

Edited July 12, 2015 by Chaos Theory

[Captanne]

I'm not understanding the "at this point why not" observations.  (I've seen a few.)  These episodes are made months ago.  Long before the notice of cancellation.  So, when these episodes are story-boarded, brain-stormed, written, blocked, directed, and aired -- current events are not relevant.  Certainly not as motivators for artistic choices.

[kmm49]

 

I'm trying to get interested in the women in this series but I cannot. The story belongs to Hannibal, Will and Jack.

I agree with this totally. The women on this show have always been written very weak except Beverly but she was killed off way too early. Too much Bedelia's not a good thing for me. I liked her better in season two when she had just a few scenes.

 

Until this season I thought Jack and Will were interesting but now except for Hannibal no one's interesting to me. I hope this changes now that Hannibal and Will are actually having scenes together. I loved their museum scene! The Hannibal/Will scenes keep me coming back for more. I missed their scenes every week so I hope we get more because in the first two seasons the psychiatrist/patient ones were great. Now I'm not sure where this is going.

 

Well I did complain the first couple of episodes had no development but we definitely got a lot of development in Dolce. I'm just not sure if it was good or not. I would've liked to see more credible writing where Hannibal's on the run in Europe with Jack/Will hunting him down. It would've made more sense to me than this current path at the moment.

[pasdetrois]

Another thing I noticed was when Hannibal leaned in to kiss Bedelia. He felt a connection there - a rare personal connection - and she pulled away from him and delivered her coup de grace. He's rarely one-upped like that. And there's such intimacy when he cradles Will in his arms.

[Snookums]

And there's such intimacy when he cradles Will in his arms.

 

 

Dear God, yes. I liked the Kaleidoscope Of Artful Lesbian Sexing (except for my noted disapproval of its use only to further an obscure plotline), but the real passion was in the ripping off of Will's jacket post Chiyo bullet brushback. The savagery and snarling? Damn. If you have your eyes closed during that scene, let's just say it doesn't play as "removing a high-powered rifle bullet from a shoulder." 

[Whitley Trillbert]

Watching this episode, it's almost like Fuller knew this was the last season. There is squarely nothing welcoming about this show anymore. This show is on the air for the people who have been watching this show, and nobody else. And it's so damn satisfying.

 

I've seen some complaints, but I love how far up its own butt this show has gone this season. That sex scene was like...what is even going on right now? The mind hallucination stuff was like what is even going on right now? And I love it.

 

It's crazy to me that the first 3 eps felt incredibly methodical, and now it feels like Fuller and Co are trying to pack 3 eps worth of content into one.

[MisterGlass]

I agree it feels a bit rushed.  However, Hannibal opened this season with a Dante-esque trip through the Inferno, and I consider this to be a part of that, and free from the usual rules.

 

I think Bedelia is an interesting character with morbid curiosity and sophisticated survival instincts.  She's not a good person, but she is a good addition.

 

 

If Hannibal couldn't eat Bedelia because she hadn't been acorned enough, why does Will only get a couple sips of parsley soup before becoming an entree?

As a guess, I'd say it's the difference between farmed and hunted prey.  Will is free range, and therefore already the way he is supposed to be.

[LittleIggy]

When Gary Oldman played Verger in "Hannibal," he sounded rather like Jimmy Stewart.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Hannibal's Best Looks In 'Dolce' Don't Always Make Sense, But They Sure Are Fabulous / Eve Batey collects the images you can't get out of your head.

[jeansheridan]

 

As a guess, I'd say it's the difference between farmed and hunted prey.  Will is free range, and therefore already the way he is supposed to

Great distinction!

 

Regarding Captanne's fair question, I think of these 13 eps as a gift.  The show barely made it to a third season.  Fuller probably knew they were a gift and so he's making the show he wants, not the one to get ratings.  I feel that Season 2 was very accessible to a new audience.  Great opening ep with a good fight scene.  Gillian Anderson at the beginning of the season.  Will in prison, clearly in role reversal with Hannibal.  A court trial.  Cynthia Nixon in a guest role.  If the general audience didn't jump on the Fuller train last season, then why not do as he pleases this season? 

 

I'm not saying I love everything.  I do wish Will was more focused and had more obvious power.  I want him to be a hero very badly.  I wish Chiyo didn't exist.  I'm not thrilled seeing Abigail again.  But I love the insanity so much.  I love that Fuller doesn't care to reach a larger audience.  If we're still watching at this point, we're his people.  It's fun.  This board is fun.  I haven't had this much fun watching a show since Veronica Mars when Rob Thomas pretty much hoped to just get to the end of season one.  

[DeadlyEuphoric]

Never thought I'd say, "Thank God for Mason Verger."

 

And thank Bedelia too, as she is the one who told them where to find Hannibal!

 

 

I'm not sure she's very good for the health and safety of the rest of the world.

 

She doesn't have the murder instinct, thank God, but she will do just about anything to satisfy her professional curiosity, in a way that makes Chilton come off looking rather ethical and moral... I am guessing this played what made Hannibal choose her as his psychiatrist and stick with her (he knew she'd never call the cops on him, even if she figured things out), and during their time together I am sure he did his best to "free" her even more from whatever moral restrictions she may have so that she also became a murderer because that is what Hannibal does.

 

The poor messed up guy can't catch a break. Gutted by Hannibal, thrown off a train, shot, drugged, almost lobotomized. Hopefully whatever attachment he feels to Hannibal is now gone. I want to see Will fight for us life be damned whatever the consequences to Hannibal.

 

 

Seriously, so far in the series Will suffered from a brain infection, was shot by his friend/boss who thought he was a serieal killer, was jailed where his employer did his best to throw him under the bus which led to him being desperate enough to allow Chilton to run tests on him, was gutted, got thrown off a train, shot again (the other shoulder this time!)  and got almost lobotomized. and now I guess he is off to be fed to pigs or something. And before the season is over I am sure he is going to get a few more times. To think this all started when he was just a teacher at FBI academy who couldn't even make eye contact with people and tended to avoid them. I think he had the right idea back then, a quite simple life where he avoided everyone. He should really just quit FBI and run far far away from all this madness.

 

I think Bedelia was studying Hannibal and his methods, while enjoying the thrill of being on the run and in the midst of this spree.  Meanwhile, she had several plans in motion that converge so she escapes without blame.

 

The only thing I'm curious about is where Jack is after Will and Hannibal were spirited away.

 

DeadlyEuphoric, Hannibal was hanging upside down this time.

 

I think Bedelia does care a bit about Hannibal in that he makes the world more interesting and is unique, so she likes being able to observe him, and would rather he had behaved himself and not drawn the FBI to them this quickly... On the other hand, she loves herself more so was always planning to leave him, and hoping he'd one day get caught.

 

Oh, yes, Hannibal finds himself hanging once again, facing death (and second time Mason does this to him actually). And now that it is upside down, you know this is going to be the most serious attempt! heh!

 

'Hannibal'. The show that makes you go "Huh?". I guess Will was saved by the skin of his ... Umm head by Mason Verger. I really enjoyed the chat in the museum. The sketch Hannibal was doing of the painting had Will and Bedelia in it. I was surprised that the first words out of Jack and Hannibal's mouths upon seeing Will wasn't "What happened to you?" Chiyo certainly is persistent when it comes to wanting to hurt Will.

 

Hannibal doing fanfic drawings is the best!

 

Jack and Hannibal probably shrugged off Will being hurt as Will being Will. I mean, when is he NOT hurt in this series?

 

 

 

 

Will wanted to kill Hannibal. That was his plan all along. Chiyo realized that and wanted to stop him so she could do whatever she wants with Hannibal. Popular fella that cannibal.

 

 

I can do without Chiyo's " Murder/violence is bad. Let's cage the guy" approach. For one, where you are pretty much using "cage" as a means to torture a human being for years and years as Chiyo was, murder is probably more humane. And second, in her attempts to prevent Hannibal from being murdered she has been more than willing to murder Will or incapacitate him so Hannibal could murder him, so yeah, whatever Chiyo. She just doesn't want Hannibal to be harmed, which is Ok, I just wish she would be honest about it than try to appear all moral.

 

I thought Jack would be on the receiving end of the brain saw, with Will forced to watch... and I thought, for a second, Fuller would go through with it. I know Crawford is in the picture in Red Dragon, but it'd be just like Fuller to kill him off here. I was glad he didn't.

 

So did I and I am glad they didn't off Jack... But was really sad to see Will on the receiving end of the brain saw, if that doesn't do serious damage to his bromance with Hannibal don't know what will.

The chemistry and adoration between Hannibal and Will is quite compelling.  Then Will pulled the knife.  The knife led to Hannibal's disappointment and that led to the saw.  The character in Red Dragon was loathesome that I quite enjoyed the squeamish scenes where his brain was excised and prepared. Ray Liotta was wonderful. Will, on the other hand, made me immeasurably sad even though Hannibal did not complete his malevolence.

 

I felt there was an underlined "we need to seperate" message in their "we are too joined" speeches to one another, where they talked about if and how they could survive a separation. Will did mention he felt guilty for all Hannibal's crimes, which points out he is not Ok with what Hannibal is doing, which in turn suggests he will still try to stop it. So I don't know if Hannibal really thought Will was there to be buddies, or if he was there to catch him and/or possible kill him. All his conversation with Bedelia so far indicated he knew Will was coming to kill him. And eating Will was already his plan of "forgiveness". So I don't think he was that betrayed or taken by surprise. But a part of him was wishing it was otherwise. I think he was sad that he "had to" (from his POV) kill Will and eat his brain now to have his forgiveness, and when he said that he regrets not having the opportunity to show Will Florence, I was sad too. I could totally watch a few episodes of Will and Hannibal in Florence. I miss their conversations and interactions and solving cases together..

 

 

Mads said he's basically playing Hannibal as satan himself. In this version of Hannibal, he killed and ate his own sister because he couldn't understand her love for him.

 

Love for Hannibal isn't about kisses and dates (and when he does do this it's to lead the other person along, not for himself- like with Alana), it's about another person giving him complete ownership over them. And Will gave him that. Will is at a point of not being able to function without Hannibal in his life, and finally gave himself over to him completely.

 

I don't think they ever confirmed that he killed his sister. He ate her, and her death is an important point in his life, but we don't know that he killed her. That is not my impression of the situation, and the post mortem with Mads makes me more inclined to believe he didn't kill her, he just wasn't able to save her, who was his last shred of humanity, in a way...

 

I also don't think Will gave himself to Hannibal completely. that actually has been the "problem" in their relationship, Will can not be corrupted like Hannibal wants. Hannibal isn't able to shape Will into the murder buddy that he wants. Hannibal gave Will a "rare gift" by letting him see him for who he really is and offering him friendship  and a chance to run away together and Will rejected him. That is why he was feeling so betrayed in S2 finale and still haven't really forgiven Will and knows the only way he can have Will to himself is if he eats him... Having said that, I think Hannibal's inability to shape Will completely is what makes Will so alluring and valuable and interesting to him. That moment in S2 when he was talking about how Will is a caterpillar and what he turns into is not something that can be guessed and controlled was one of the most genuine and affectionate moments for Hannibal ever in my opinion. He loves that about Will, even if it gets annoying because it prevents them from really being together.

 

Can we discuss Margot' s horrible hair? I didn't recognize her at first. Great dress. Bad hair. She looked like a doll. Her looks are so changeable. Great smoky voice however.

 

Indeed. The hair was horrible to the point it was a bit distracting...

[freebie]

Still processing ... I guess I should have seen the Margot-Alana hookup coming, once Alana started swanning around in a blouse cut down to there. Seriously, I think it was just a scrap of cloth with sleeves; no buttons whatsoever!

 

I did like how Bedelia gave Hannibal up while appearing merely to be sticking to her completely awesome alibi. Her delivery of "I am Lydia Fell" was perfect. And Jack was smart to realize that her story about "dining at Sogliato's many times" was a clue. In other news, I find Chiyoh tiresome.

[penelope79]

It's apparently Italian for "sweet", so sweetbreads? As in Will's brain? Along with the love connections between people. 

 

Dolce is both an adjective ("sweet") and a noun. As a noun, we usually use it referred to desserts, as in the course that closes the meal.

 

In this case, I guess, it means closure. But this episode left me like "huh?", so I'm afraid I can't tell much more.

Edited July 13, 2015 by penelope79

[Crossbow]

Dolce is both an adjective ("sweet") and a noun. As a noun, we usually use it referred to desserts, as in the course that closes the meal.

 

In this case, I guess, it means closure. But this episode left me like "huh?", so I'm afraid I can't tell much more.

 

I read it as being the end of the European story arc.

[rollerblade]

I uttered "what the fuck" several times in this episode. Maybe I need to stop eating while watching this show so I could pay full attention to it.

[Captanne]

rollerblade, welcome to my world. 

 

On the other hand, I found this episode strangely "good".  And in this show I use that term loosely.  

 

Until, of course, Will got hurt again by one of these chuckleheads.  Because, if it wasn't comical when he was thrown off the train after his recovery from being gutted, it sure as shit is now when he gets shot by a sniper.

 

Will is the most unlucky and most stupid man on the planet -- I'm not sure which to be more patient with.  

 

Thus far, this "circle of friends" have gas lighted him, had him thrown in jail, chained him to furniture, fed him human flesh, literally gutted him, thrown him off a train, and shot him.  Not to mention the whole "carving into his brain with a bone saw" thing.

 

He's the village idiot.

Edited July 14, 2015 by Captanne

[Crossbow]

 

 

Thus far, this "circle of friends" have gas lighted him, had him thrown in jail, chained him to furniture, fed him human flesh, literally gutted him, thrown him off a train, and shot him.  Not to mention the whole "carving into his brain with a bone saw" thing.

 

He's the village idiot.

 

But that was almost all just Hannibal. He only had help with throwing Will in jail and throwing him off a train. And apparently, this is what Will wants from him.