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Brienne of Tarth: The Oathkeeper

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She is one of my favourite characters in the books and I love the actress they chose to play her. It's always good to see a female character in a show like this that is smart, battle worthy and vulnerable. I also love her dynamic with Jaime

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Just adding to the Brienne love. Gwendoline Christie is doing a fabulous job. She portrays innocence and vulnerability well. She was just glowing in the bathtub scene. I know that she isn't an ugly woman and Brienne is supposed to be ugly, but the way she holds her face provides such "ugly" expressions.

Her goodbye scene in Harrenhal, she certainly wasn't ugly. I actually find the girl who plays Gilly (Jilly? The girl with the baby traveling with Sam) to be much less attractive.

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Too bad she's not serving Daenerys, the Breaker of Chains, since Brienne is obviously looking for a cause.

On the other hand, even Daenerys might not be able to overcome the combined bad luck of Barristan Selmy and Brienne since everyone either one has served ends up murdered.  On the other other hand, third time's a charm.

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In a way brienne is kind of a butch version of Sansa. They both start out with very romanticized ideas about knights and honor and gradually evolve as they are exposed to reality. Plus, at least on the show, Sansa may catch up to her in height lol.

The actress does a great job. She's not ugly, but neither is the show version of Tyrian.

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Too bad she's not serving Daenerys, the Breaker of Chains, since Brienne is obviously looking for a cause

 

If Dany had Brienne and Arya on her side, Westeros wouldn't have a chance in any of the seven hells of defeating her. Maybe those are other two parts of her trifecta that was prophesied last season. That would be awesome, a monarchy ruled by 3 women who are all powerful in their own rights. 

Just popping in to note that Gwen Christie has been cast in the latest Hunger Games. Thrilled for her

 

 

That's awesome news. I really hope this show opens up a lot of doors for her in movies. Her height might make it hard for her to have versatility but I hope she can open doors for other tall female actresses

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If Dany had Brienne and Arya on her side, Westeros wouldn't have a chance in any of the seven hells of defeating her. Maybe those are other two parts of her trifecta that was prophesied last season. That would be awesome, a monarchy ruled by 3 women who are all powerful in their own rights. 

That's awesome news. I really hope this show opens up a lot of doors for her in movies. Her height might make it hard for her to have versatility but I hope she can open doors for other tall female actresses

Yes, great news.  Also, didn't I hear that Natalie Dormer will also be there?

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Well, I like to fanwank that Brienne loves Jaime, but I'm not sure that her feelings are that clear.  I mostly thought she was as stunned as I was that Cersei would throw an accusation like that out in a not particularly private location, not to mention the going straight from "thank you for rescuing my brother" to "wait, don't leave before I have a chance to make you feel like crap," but I might be misreading the expressions there.

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I thought the books implied at least some romantic interest from both Brienne & Jaime, but not "love." GRRM wrote the ep tho, so maybe he wanted to make it more explicit or set up something down the road.

It could also just have been a bookend to Jaime threatening Loras to demonstrate that while the Twincest relationship is on the rocks, they're still jealous of potential rivals, even if the rivals are a gay knight and a woman not considered attractive enough to be in Jaime's league.

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I could see Brienne having romantic feelings for Jaime and not realizing it, whatever Jaimie's faults he truly respects Brienne. I get the sense that being a warrior woman she probably hasn't gotten much of that from men in the past. He also essentially saved her life and I noted the small smile on her face when she said that. I think for Brienne having Jaimie's trust and respect probably means a lot, add in the bear pit and I could see a crush. Brienne still has a woman's heart no matter how tough she is on the outside. Then again Jaime was pretty awful to her in the beginning and from last weeks episodes still gets a snarky comment in so I don't know...

Jaime on the other hand is still all about Cersei in that department. Interesting that he hadn't told Cersei about the bear pit, then again she probably wouldn't believe Jaime putting his own life in danger for a non Lannister.

Also does anyone know WHY Brienne was inlove with Renly? I've always wondered about that.

Edited by bluvelvet
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So do we think Brienne loves Jaime or was Cersei barking up the wrong tree ?

I don't think it's a coincidence that Cersei accused Brienne of being in love with Jaime. I mean, someone doing something noble and honourable? Cersei don't know shit about that, so she'll assume that Brienne had another agenda. I've felt that Brienne likes and respects Jaime, but I never got the sense that she loved him. Yet, her reaction to Cersei's question seemed kind of damning, IMO.

Can anyone tell me what Brienne said after "actually, he saved me...." She says a couple words after that and I just cannot make them out.

I'm a bit disappointed that Jaime didn't ask Brienne to spar with him while he learned to fight with his left hand.

I've been impressed with Brienne in KL. She went straight to the Tyrells to tell them what she knew about Renly's death and has managed to play nice with the Lannisters, and publicly say/do all the right things. She's playing well among vipers, bless her. I just hope that Cersei doesn't set her sights on destroying her.

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I think Brienne is safe, Cersei may get her jabs in here and there but I don't think she would go further than that. Also with Joffrey dead, Brienne is going to be the last thing on Cersei's mind.

Yet, her reaction to Cersei's question seemed kind of damning, IMO.

 

Basically and this was GRRM's episode..*side eye*

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I think Brienne doesn't know what her feelings are and was really thrown by the question.

 


Also does anyone know WHY Brienne was inlove with Renly? I've always wondered about that.

He was nice to her and respected her as a warrior. A man, let alone a member of the royal family doing that would mean a lot. She told Jaime that all her life men like him had been insulting her, so Renly was probably the first such other than her own father to treat her decently. I think Brienne responds really strongly to that, hence suggesting swearing her sword to Cat instead of Robb. She looked pretty unsure of herself when Olenna got excited to see her, as if she was afraid that was mockery too.

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Can anyone tell me what Brienne said after "actually, he saved me...." She says a couple words after that and I just cannot make them out.

"...more than once."

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I think Brienne doesn't know what her feelings are and was really thrown by the question.

That's a good interpretation...I like that. I suppose her lack of response could have been her being in shock and/or confused that anyone would make that leap.

 

"...more than once."

Ah...thank you!

I find myself amused at the number of times poor Brienne has had to clarify "I do not serve X". I am curious though...who DOES she serve now? Renly's dead, Cat's dead, she's done her duty by delivering Jaime to KL...is she part of the Kingsguard now? Is she just sticking around, keeping an eye on Sansa? Margaery? Both? Is she acting as Jaime's conscience re: his promise about the Stark girls?

I'm a little disappointed that we didn't get to see Tywin meet her. I think, in his own weird way, that he'd like and respect her. There are very few strong and principled characters in KL and I like to think that Tywin would be impressed by her even though he'd realize that she can't be bought.

I kind of want Brienne, Tyrion and Oberyn to team up. That trio would be awesome.

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As for being in love with Renly, he was a good looking man who payed attention to her.  Even though Brienne is a warrior, she was still innocent in most ways.  She may not have even realized Renly and Loras were getting it on.  Renly was also married to Margaery, so there was no chance of getting intimate with him, either. Unrequited first loves are a bitch!

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What's the "more than once " referring to? Bear pit obviously but what's the other ?

Also if Brienne was in love with Renly because he was nice to her then I definitely see her feeling the same about Jaime who she's spent a lot more time with and saved her life.

Edited by bluvelvet

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When Jamie made up the sapphire story to prevent Brienne to become the camp entertainment.

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Jaime saved Brienne from rape when he told Hoat about her father having sapphires.  They likely would have had to kill her to rape her.  Jaime knew that from the discussion they'd had on horseback before they made camp.

It seems as if Brienne is so unsophisticated in her emotions.  Men have not been kind to her.  When a man is kind, her affections latch on.  Kind of like a high school crush, with all the accompanying embarrassment and denial of said crush.

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As for being in love with Renly, he was a good looking man who payed attention to her.  Even though Brienne is a warrior, she was still innocent in most ways.  She may not have even realized Renly and Loras were getting it on.  Renly was also married to Margaery, so there was no chance of getting intimate with him, either. Unrequited first loves are a bitch!

She referred to it as "foul rumors" when Jaime brought up Renly/Loras. So, yes, not much better than Sansa in the gaydar department.

She was kinda smiling like a schoolgirl when she mentioned Jaime rescuing her. And a guy sworn to the Kingsguard would also count as unavailable, even without the lifelong obsession with his own sister. Which is a rumor Brienne does know to be true, since Jaime talked about only being with Cersei right before she helped Catelyn free him.

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It seems as if Brienne is so unsophisticated in her emotions.  Men have not been kind to her.  When a man is kind, her affections latch on.  Kind of like a high school crush, with all the accompanying embarrassment and denial of said crush.

It seems to apply to anyone who treats her well, such as Catelyn and even Margaery.

I think her feelings for Jaime are a little more complex than school-girl crush, because she’s willing to call him out when he’s doing something she disagrees with.  “Look me in the eye and tell me you think [sansa] is safe in King’s Landing.”

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I think her feelings for Jaime are a little more complex than school-girl crush, because she’s willing to call him out when he’s doing something she disagrees with.  “Look me in the eye and tell me you think [sansa] is safe in King’s Landing.”

Well, she was very dismissive of Jaime initially. It was only after she got to know him that I think she realized that he wasn't just a villain. I wouldn't say that she has a crush on him; I think she sees that there is good in him, and she's doing her best to bring that out.

She's lived her life with honour and is trying to appeal to his better nature; she's his conscience, IMO.

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This is one of the most jarring differences between the book and the series.

 

In the book, Brienne is just as

promiscuous as any of the other knights, did her share of tent hopping and was very pleased with her success, not realizing that her male colleagues were just daring each other to tdo her.

But in the series she's actually a

virgin who is afraid of intimacy and Jamie actually accuses her of secretly wishing that one of the boys she shoved away would fight back and rape her.

That really changes her character.


Separate from that, i think it would have been much more logical for Brienne to attach herself to Sansa as her personal bodyguard. People would just say, oh she's got a Houind, too.

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This is one of the most jarring differences between the book and the series.

In the book, Brienne is just as

promiscuous as any of the other knights, did her share of tent hopping and was very pleased with her success, not realizing that her male colleagues were just daring each other to tdo her.

In the books,

Brienne was trying to gain acceptance in Renly's camp as a knight, and did not realize there was a bet on who's going to take her maidenhead. They never did complete the wager as Randyll Tarly intervened. If promiscuous means she enjoyed flowers and compliments from multiple assholes who were mocking her and trying to bed with her so they can win a bet, while she had no idea what everything really meant, than I agree, she was. Other than that, I disagree ;)

Edited by TormundsWoman
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I wonder if because Renly isn't interested in women, he didn't apply personal sexual aesthetics to Brienne, and thus didn't insult her the way all of the other men did.  As was mentioned, that lack of contempt (and practicality in recognizing her fighting ability) seems like honor, virtue, and nobility to a person who had been treated terribly their whole life.  So I could see Brienne having a "virtue crush" - imprinting on Renly as someone who looks and plays the benevolent ruler worthy of respect and loyalty - and then developing feelings naturally over time towards Renly the icon.

Meanwhile, Jaime's continued insistence on insulting her kind of resembles the boy who keeps cruelly teasing a girl he actually likes. There is a phenomenon noted by Dan Savage where a guy who is actually into unconventionally attractive women (like curvier women) will insult them when he's around his buddies to keep up appearances because that's what you're supposed to do. There is a nice ambiguity to his feelings on the matter, and with his emasculation from the loss of his sword hand (putting him into a similar category as Brienne, just in a worse way), it'll be interesting to see if his perspective changes.

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Oh good point Zalyn. (I can't seem to make full editor work on my iPad or I'd have quoted you). I couldn't put into words why I thought there was something and you just did. Jaime maybe is even in love with her but since he associates love with looks he hasn't figured it out yet.

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I don't know if Jaime is in love with Brienne, I can see him having some "feeling " but not realizing it since he's only ever loved Cersei to the exclusion of all other women.

Brienne is the daughter of a noble house so I assume that at some point in time she is expected to marry unless her father is okay with her just fighting all over Westeros for life. Does she have siblings ? Do we know.

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Brienne is the daughter of a noble house so I assume that at some point in time she is expected to marry unless her father is okay with her just fighting all over Westeros for life. Does she have siblings ? Do we know.

It's never been stated in-show, just that her father recommended her to Renly and her mother is dead. If you really want to know,

Brienne is Lord Selwyn's only surviving child, her siblings all having died young. She's had 3 failed betrothals so far, the first boy died also died young, the second guy was an asshole who rejected her once he met her, and the third was an older dude who told her any wife of his would have to act like a lady. She got to challenge him to fight which she handily won and that was the end of that. Daddy Tarth pretty much gave up even though it does fall to her to continue the family line. Brienne feels bad about that and sometimes feels wistful at what could have been if the first boy hadn't died before they both came of age, but she appreciates what freedom she has in the life she ended up with.

That's all revealed after the third book though, so there's still time for the show to give us more of Brienne's background.

I agree with Zalyn that that's what Jaime's doing, he might as well say "hey, I've seen you naked and that was a horrible experience hardy har har". But I don't think that constitutes true love so much as shows what a manchild Jaime is.

Edited by Lady S.
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Not sure what there is for Brienne to do since she lost track of Arya, and since she doesn't know Sansa is at the Eyrie.

 

She could head to the Bloody Gate / the Eyrie, but Lysa is dead, and Tyrion probably told Pod to tell Brienne not to trust Littlefinger.

 

Perhaps she'll head North to the Wall again, as was her original plan.

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I have questions about Brienne and her importance to the story.  Really, if she's not roadtripping with Jaime and with Catelyn dead, what happens?  The likelihood of Brienne finding Sansa or Arya and ...doing what with them, is low.

 

However, they just shot a fucking badass fight.  If the Hound dies and then Brienne becomes insignificant, what's the point of having a kickass fight between two characters who take the dirt nap or fall off the map?

Edited by BlackberryJam

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Unfortunately, the show has all but ignored the awesomeness of Stannis Baratheon, Grammar King by Right. He really is being short-changed. There have been no subtle reminders and hints about bad blood between Stannis and Brienne. And really, who would I root for in a Brienne/Stannis fight? She's my favorite warrior and he understands the subjunctive case of being. What is a fangirl to do?

I also loved her sword conversation with Arya. Arya would have wanted to grow up to be Brienne if not for that whole murdering of her family thing.

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Unfortunately, Arya isn't big enough to be a fully armored knight. I guess she could have ended up more like Bronn or maybe Maege Mormont. It seems women in the North are more hardy than other places. I'm as curious as anyone for what could be Brienne's next move, especially if there's no 

Lady Stoneheart. But given how different her character is supposed to look, are we sure she couldn't come back as another actress?

.

Edited by Paradigm14
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Brienne being sent to rescue Sansa is starting to remind me of Ned Stark going South to solve Jon Arryn's murder. Neither is really anywhere near a qualified investigator. But Brienne and Pod managing to survive the season is proof the series doesn't always crush the pure and noble. I feel more for Brienne than I ever could for Ned, that reaction of hers when Arya wanted to know why she didn't protect Cat, Brienne tries so hard and it's clear these failures really get to her.

 

Lord Tarth sounds like a cooler dad than Ned tbh, not only letting her learn how to fight properly but recommending her skills to Renly and sending Brienne to fight in the war. 

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I hope they give some more tidbits of Brienne back story next season. So far in the show we've gotten that she's the daughter of Lord Selwyn Tarth who, like Lady S pointed out, sounds pretty cool since he taught her to fight and recommended her to Renly. That's not a lot.
The book doesn't give much of her backstory either but it's a bit more than that at least. Also she'd younger in the book so it would be cool if the show gave some hints on what she'd been doing before joining up with Renly. Did she just hang out at Tarth before that? Or did she serve someone else or train with some bannermen?

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I'd love a scene of Brienne and Pod getting to know each other and exchanging stories of being misfits, but it looks like the show only wants to use them as comic relief and play Podrick as a nuisance to her, trying to re-capture the Jaime/Brienne bickering dynamic or something, which I think is a little forced for a very different combination of characters.

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Does anyone else want to see Brienne become a dragon rider? I'm stumped as to why the character hasn't been killed off already. She hasn't moved any plots along all season. She may or may not help Sans a - I'm not banking on it. But I do think look great on one of those .

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Its a good think Brienne isn't lieged (new word?) to Dany.  Frankly I'm worried about Sansa.  Pretty much everyone she's sworn to has died or lost a hand.  She may win individual sword fights but she seems pretty incompetent in carrying out any mission.  The latest......Sansa being married and raped.  Maybe she should swear herself to the WW's. She's a very effective Stark nemesis.

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Its a good think Brienne isn't lieged (new word?) to Dany.  Frankly I'm worried about Sansa.  Pretty much everyone she's sworn to has died or lost a hand.  She may win individual sword fights but she seems pretty incompetent in carrying out any mission.  The latest......Sansa being married and raped.  Maybe she should swear herself to the WW's. She's a very effective Stark nemesis.

 

1. Renly was killed by a magical smoke monster assassin.  It's essentially impossible to guard against that.

 

2. Brienne couldn't have protected Catelyn during the Red Wedding because Catelyn had already sent Brienne on a mission to drop Jamie off in King's Landing.  If Brienne had been at the Red Wedding, she might have taken out a few Freys before being killed, but Catelyn would still be dead.

 

3. Brienne and Jamie were prisoners when Jamie lost the hand.  They might have been captured if Jamie the Dipshit had not tried to escape.  Jamie gets extra stupid points for trying to escape to King's Landing, where Brienne was taking him anyway.

 

4. I'm not sure what Brienne could have done to stop what happened to Sansa once Sansa was in Winterfell.  Even if someone had lit the candle in tower, she and Pod are only 2 people against all the Bolton soldiers in Winterfell.

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In a way brienne is kind of a butch version of Sansa. They both start out with very romanticized ideas about knights and honor and gradually evolve as they are exposed to reality. Plus, at least on the show, Sansa may catch up to her in height lol.

The actress does a great job. She's not ugly, but neither is the show version of Tyrian.

 

I think Brienne is more like the female version of Ned Stark.

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I don't mind missing out on watching Brienne and Pod watch the tower all night for a candle. But I would like to see her training him. I'd even accept a single montage, except that none of the four or five songs in existence are quite right for it. Too bad Pod's not a little more bearlike.

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I'm rewatching season 4 ATM, and really struck by the way the writers are making it look like the last thing she really wants to do is unite Arya and Sansa. In the season 6 threads we wrote to some extent about Brianne's baffling choice to keep Sansa in the dark about Arya's traveling companion, the Hound.

Going back even further, in 4.7, Hotpie tried to cue Bri and Pod about the Hound, and then he gave them the Wolf pastry, intended for them to pass on to Arya.. So why the hell didn't they??

Doing so would have greatly increased the chance Arya would have trusted them enough to join them.

Clumbsy!

Edited by FemmyV

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11 minutes ago, Luckylyn said:

I watched this yesterday. I loved it. She's probably the most genuinely noble (if not slightly misguided at times) character on the show. `

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I hate that so much of her story line was about Jaime. She deserved a much more interesting arc. And as much as I despise her being paired with the sister fucker who threw a little boy out of a window, that doesn't hold a candle to how much I hate that her biggest scene in the finale was about preserving Jaime's "honor." Thankfully, they at least had the good sense not to make her pregnant.

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15 hours ago, slf said:

I hate that so much of her story line was about Jaime. She deserved a much more interesting arc. And as much as I despise her being paired with the sister fucker who threw a little boy out of a window, that doesn't hold a candle to how much I hate that her biggest scene in the finale was about preserving Jaime's "honor." Thankfully, they at least had the good sense not to make her pregnant.

Are you my long lost twin?? If I didn't know better, I'd swear I wrote this LOL

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