S08.E23: The Maternal Combustion

[shapeshifter]

Personalities collide when Sheldon and Leonard’s mothers finally meet. Meanwhile, Howard finally decides to “man up” and do his fair share of the housework – but not without a little help from his friends.

This episode had a lot of good lines. A few moments were cringey, and the B plot was boring, but any 20 minute show that can make me laugh 5 or 6 times is worth the time.

[anna0852]

I felt so awful for Leonard watching Mary and Bev both fawning over Sheldon. And I'm so glad that Penny was nothing but loving and supportive. I think my heart broke a little when Mary went to make dinner and he said like he felt he hadn't earned it. I continue to hope that when we meet more of Penny's family they are immediately welcoming to him. We know her dad likes him a lot.

 

Nice to see Howard finally owning up to the fact that Bernie is babying him. And that she was able to convey her annoyance with resorting to total shrew-ville.

[califred]

I loved the Hard Knock Life at the end.

This wasn't my favorite episode. I like the Moms seperately but didn't care for them together and I really wanted to.

[chocolatine]

This wasn't my favorite episode. I like the Moms seperately but didn't care for them together and I really wanted to.

 

Yeah, I feel the same way. Maybe I set my expectations too high based on how much liked both Laurie Metcalf's and Christine Baranski's other appearances, but I didn't enjoy their scenes together at all.

 

Regarding the B-plot, at first I could relate to Bernadette because I also hate it when people walk around my house without pants, but then it fell back into the old trope of Howard being a man-child who plays video games with his buddies all day and doesn't know how to mop the floor (seriously, most people have been doing household chores since elementary school). Will Howard and Bernadette ever get to evolve in their marriage, or will it be the same thing over and over until the end of the show?

[sinkwriter]

I thought the two moms clashing was interesting, but I just don't like how cruel and dismissive Beverly is to her own son.

[Helena Dax]

I loved  this episode. I didn't know the moms were going to be in this episode  and they were a wonderful surprise.  They never fail to make me laugh and  this time wasn't an exception. The stuff about the lions and the Ark  had me rolling. Mary had a good answer there, I must say. I just cringed a bit when Beverly and she were talking about religion because atheist characters on American TV shows are usually so annoying when it comes to religion -and in RL, we're not like that. But then I thought Beverly was always dismisive, so...

 

Sheldon looked so happy to have his mom  there... I liked him a lot in this episode.

 

The B plot was a total meh until the musical number, heh. 

[Browncoat]

I actually laughed out loud several times this ep, which is rare these days. The first was for the lions and the Ark answer, then when Howard's shoe (and sock!) stuck to the floor -- that was a brilliant bit of physical comedy! And finally Hard Knock Life had me in stitches.

[ari333]

I loved this eppy. But I'm a pushover. Loved the moms. But beverly is too mean to Leonard.

"A good Texan woulda shot her."

"Little bowl of lion chow."

"Yella cake from Chad."

[adhoc]

 

I thought the two moms clashing was interesting, but I just don't like how cruel and dismissive Beverly is to her own son.

Yeah, that dynamic always bugs me. Especially considering that Beverly is supposed to be some sort of renowned expert in her field. When Mary stated "You must be proud of your son" and Beverly responded "Yes, he just argued a case in front of the Supreme Court," that cemented my dislike for the character.  There are whacky but loving parents (Mary) and then there are inexcusable ones like Beverly. 

 

BTW, I never saw the episode where Penny got the ring. Is it really that stunning (repurposed drill bit aside)?  Because I don't buy that Leonard would stint on a ring for Penny, who totally rocks his world. If anything, I would think he would feel worried that he didn't get a good enough ring. I mean, he might not go to Tiffany's, but I don't see him buying a repurposed diamond from a drill. Unless perhaps it's just spectacular.

[Frost]

Sheldon and Leonard arguing about the correct terminology for the mothers-Sheldon dynamic was hysterical.  "Super weaner!" vs  "Double suckler!" 

 

When Mary stated "You must be proud of your son" and Beverly responded "Yes, he just argued a case in front of the Supreme Court," that cemented my dislike for the character.

Not only that, it isn't true to Beverly's character.  In a prior season, someone said something similar about her son's fiance and her reply was, "Why?  I'm not marrying her."  Having her be 100% analytical when in came to all of her children is still sad but it doesn't have the ring of a specific personal  dislike of Leonard. 

 

I did like her discussion with Sheldon about her parenting style and the fact that she did at least attempt to embrace Leonard at the end.   I especially liked the fact that Sheldon would still have picked his own mother, even though she did foist things like birthdays and presents on him.

Edited May 1, 2015 by Frost

[theatremouse]

This played sort of like they knew they had two great actresses and just sort of floated on that. Every thing about all their interaction was totally predictable. And predictable in the general plot would've been fine with me if the dialogue had been especially funny, but it wasn't.

I know part of the point was probably that we've heard the Sheldon-do-gooder-give-the-neighborhood-free-power story before, but if they're going with a story we've literally heard before, something needed to be different this time as it was relayed to Beverly. It wasn't. I know it wasn't word-for-word identical, but we got nothing new of that tale having heard it again. Other than Leonard's mom reacting to it. Meh. Redundant.

I am bored of Leonard's "mommy doesn't love me" and/or "likes everyone else more than me" plots. Hoping they're done with that well given the ending, but I won't be surprised if we hear more of the same.

Also after sobering up did she forget she liked Penny? Because I'd thought they'd left on good-ish terms.

I love musicals. I love when people burst into song. But the Hard Knock Life scene didn't do it for me. All I was thinking was "oh really? They paid for the rights to that?"

Edited May 1, 2015 by theatremouse

[peeayebee]

I too was expecting to be entertained by Baranski and Metcalf acting together, but I didn't really like it. Maybe because their interaction was not surprising at all, what with the Bible vs science clash. 

 

There were good lines in the ep, so there's that.

 

I can't remember what Amy had said that made me laugh, but it was all in the delivery. She should have been in the ep more.

 

Seeing Laurie Metcalf just made me miss Getting On and her fantastic performance there.

[Frost]

 

Maybe because their interaction was not surprising at all, what with the Bible vs science clash.

It seems like they could have done a lot more with that.  I remember when Amy first met Sheldon and she said didn't mind the idea of a deity but was baffled by the concept of one that took attendance.  That considered analytical thinking and religion with a creative twist.  Which they also did with the lion's diet.   The Beverly / Mary interaction was very straightforward and predictable.

[ari333]

Well, I liked the "Hard Knock Life" finish....especially the footwork of Stuart in the background as he dances with his mop.  The man-boy theme is part of the Howard storyline and it is something Bernadette has to deal with, as do many women who make the mistake of thinking they can change a guy by marrying him.  Howard will try to revert to being a child because that's easier than acting like an adult, and Bernadette is the force that keeps him from de-evolving.  Unfortunately that means she loses some of her gentler side (at heart, that character is tough).  The mothers were not as funny as I had hoped (they are usually my favorite part of the show when they are on) but it seems clear that part of Sheldon's relative success is due to his mother unfailing love for him.  He may be dismissive of his "mouth breather" siblings but, as I recall, his twin sister was also gracious and supportive of him.  One can see why Leonard keeps going back to Penny--she has the warmth and acceptance that his own mother lacked (Penny is one female character that consistently breaks through to Sheldon as well).  I was sorry that Amy wasn't part of the group because she really should have been (I understand why she wasn't there; it just would have seemed natural that she was), but that probably would have taken away from the dynamics of the mothers.  I am glad they make the women equally strong though I always feel sorry for Leonard at the end of it.  I'm dreading the finale because it looks like a romance driven plot line, and those are never as interesting to me (yeah, I'm in the minority on that but that's the way I am). 

 

 

Agree with so many points here. I don't always enjoy the finale plots either.

 

Loved Hard Knock Life! too.

 

Also, IDK why Amy couldn't have had more to do in this eppy. It's not like MAry can disapprove of Amy since Shamy are not having the dreaded, sinful, unwed coitus!!

Edited May 1, 2015 by ari333

[Spartan Girl]

You had to appreciate the fact that even though Sheldon relates more to Leonard's mom, he still loves his own mother and is grateful for how lovingly she raised him.

 

And I too loved the guys singing "Hard Knock Life."

[CherryAmes]

Also, IDK why Amy couldn't have had more to do in this eppy. It's not like MAry can disapprove of Amy since Shamy are not having the dreaded, sinful, unwed coitus!!

 

Unless the writers decide to forget what happened the last time Sheldon visited his Mom in Texas I don't think even Mary Cooper could get away with disapproving of it if they did!

[PinkRibbons]

I've been disappointed with the lack of Amy in the last few episodes, but I checked Mayim Bialik's blog and it turns out her father recently passed away, and that he'd been in hospice care for several months before. I suspect the writers have stripped down her role as much as they could so she could have more time with her family.

[HelenBaby]

 

BTW, I never saw the episode where Penny got the ring. Is it really that stunning (repurposed drill bit aside)?  Because I don't buy that Leonard would stint on a ring for Penny, who totally rocks his world. If anything, I would think he would feel worried that he didn't get a good enough ring. I mean, he might not go to Tiffany's, but I don't see him buying a repurposed diamond from a drill. Unless perhaps it's just spectacular.

When they decided to get married for real, it seems like he just pulled the ring out of his wallet, no Tiffany box or anything, and Penny was surprised. He made some kind of comment about having it just in case.

[Runningwild]

I loved this episode! I thought it was hilarious. The double weaner/mother suckler was great. And the bit about lion chow. And "Hard Knock Life."

[iMonrey]

If Howard is such a man-child then moving back into his childhood home was probably a bad idea, since that's where he's most likely to fall into old habits. They should have sold the house and bought another place.

 

I don't think they actually turn repurposed diamond drill bits into rings, although they are used for other things.

[Calamity Jane]

Sheldon's mom has always looked fairly stylish, even if in a "country," east-Texas way, but this time with the hair pulled back, it seemed to me they were aiming for country-mouse-plain vs Leonard's mom's East Coast chic.  Didn't appreciate that.  And something just went all wrong with the chemistry I expected between those two.  You would think two such great actresses would knock our socks off, but it seemed pretty predictable yet somehow forced.  Something more unexpected would have been so much fun.  

 

I too love a musical almost more than anything, so I enjoyed the end, even though that makes Bernadette Miss Hannigan. Which I guess she pretty much is these days.  

[soapfaninnc]

It seems like they could have done a lot more with that.  I remember when Amy first met Sheldon and she said didn't mind the idea of a deity but was baffled by the concept of one that took attendance.  That considered analytical thinking and religion with a creative twist.  Which they also did with the lion's diet.   The Beverly / Mary interaction was very straightforward and predictable.

I was bummed by it too - I thought Freud had pretty much been proved a fraud and with quite the unsavory reputation. Why would a scientist like Leonard's mother even give his theories the time of day? I agree that it felt flat and forced.

 

Plus Leonard seems to be turning into the character of Alan on Two and a half men. I hate that. 

[SmithW6079]

Why did they turn Beverly from emotionally distant mother to outright emotionally abusive mother? I so wanted Mary to really and truly put her in her place. No wonder Leonard is such a mess -- it really is his mother's fault. I love Christine Baranski, but not as Beverly Hofstadter.

 

Except for the one time Penny and Beverly got drunk together, all subsequent interactions between the two have been cold and distant.

 

Seems kind of mean to refer to the other two children as "dumb as stumps" or "mouth breathers," especially since we've met Sheldon's sister -- his twin. Mary's talk of her pregnancy with him almost made it sound like it was a single birth.

 

Bernadette and Raj were tolerable in this episode. At least she wasn't quite as shrewish as she's been, and he wasn't the selfish prick he usually is.

[LADreamr]

I guess I'm in the minority, but I hated the Hard Knock Life bit. It was them feeling sorry for themselves for ever having to get off their butts and clean up after themselves. If they had been putting any effort into it, which they didn't seem to be, three of them in that space could have had everything done in an hour. I still love the show and look forward to it every week. I just want to see one inch of growth in these boys.

[mojoween]

I thought Beverly was a psychologist, not a psychiatrist? Also I was shouting at the TV "Beverly doesn't shake hands!" but then she got all squirrelly about the hug and I was pacified.

Leonard was over getting affection from his mother. He told her so. No take-backs, Leonard.

[ari333]

Unless the writers decide to forget what happened the last time Sheldon visited his Mom in Texas I don't think even Mary Cooper could get away with disapproving of it if they did!

 

Oooh! Good catch! I totally forgot about that. How can they reconcile that indeed.

But still I guess I just love the Amy character and missed  only having her in the small mushroom log bit. Penny was there for the whole visit. I wish Amy had been.

[Browncoat]

Maybe the ring is a "chocolate" diamond -- common, and commonly used for industrial purposes.

[MaryMitch]

When Howard's sock stuck to the floor, I almost fell of my couch laughing. I wonder how they managed that?

 

That and the "feeding the lions dead sinners" were the best parts of the episodes. And I think Mary won this Mom vs Mom round.

[Calamity Jane]

I guess I'm in the minority, but I hated the Hard Knock Life bit. It was them feeling sorry for themselves for ever having to get off their butts and clean up after themselves. If they had been putting any effort into it, which they didn't seem to be, three of them in that space could have had everything done in an hour. I still love the show and look forward to it every week. I just want to see one inch of growth in these boys.

I agree about how long they were taking on a pretty simple task, but I got a kick out of it anyway because it expresses how they really are - boys in men's bodies, all three.  At least Leonard and Sheldon do their own housework and keep their place clean, neat, and tidy. 

[shura]

I guess I'm in the minority, but I hated the Hard Knock Life bit. It was them feeling sorry for themselves for ever having to get off their butts and clean up after themselves.

 

I thought they were just having fun with the situation, not feeling sorry for themselves.

 

Could someone remind me what happened in Texas that should make Mary be okay with whatever Sheldon and Amy are doing? I know I watched that episode, but I'm blanking here.

[Calamity Jane]

I thought they were just having fun with the situation, not feeling sorry for themselves.

 

Could someone remind me what happened in Texas that should make Mary be okay with whatever Sheldon and Amy are doing? I know I watched that episode, but I'm blanking here.

Sheldon and Howard were in Texas for some conference, I believe, and stopped by Sheldon's house unannounced, to find Mary, um, in a compromising situation with a man.  On the living room sofa.  

[AD35]

 

Could someone remind me what happened in Texas that should make Mary be okay with whatever Sheldon and Amy are doing? I know I watched that episode, but I'm blanking here.

 

I could be the episode where Sheldon, on a visit to his mother in Texas, found out she was having (gasp!!) sex outside of marriage with a man she met in her Bible study group.  Mary told Sheldon that she wasn't perfect, but that man's booty was.  As far as the main plot with this ep, I expected something more with the moms meeting face to face for the first time.  Maybe if it had taken place earlier in the show's run the writers would have been more up to the task. But there was this little gem from Mary.  "A good Christian would've turned the other cheek. A good Texan would have shot her."

[sinkwriter]

 

Why did they turn Beverly from emotionally distant mother to outright emotionally abusive mother? I so wanted Mary to really and truly put her in her place. No wonder Leonard is such a mess -- it really is his mother's fault. I love Christine Baranski, but not as Beverly Hofstadter.

 

I had hoped for that as well. In fact, I kept wishing for Mary, Penny or even Sheldon to stand up for Leonard and show him some love. Anything to say, "Hey now, wait just a minute, stop talking about him that way. It's not okay." I kept waiting for the moment when Beverly went too far and someone said something to her, maybe even Sheldon making a smart point, but alas... we just got her half-assed "needy baby, come over here and accept this pathetic attempt at a hug." Hell, even Sheldon has hugged Leonard better than that.

[theatremouse]

I guess I'm in the minority, but I hated the Hard Knock Life bit. It was them feeling sorry for themselves for ever having to get off their butts and clean up after themselves.

I didn't like it, but not for that reason. I didn't get the impression the show was trying to say the guys were expressing the same emotions the children do in the musical when they sing that song. I thought it was moreso, while cleaning, the song popped into Howard's head, he started singing it, and the amusing part was supposed to be the other two not only join in and singing along, but also knowing far more of the words than one might expect them to.

I thought it was a shortcut in the writing, and not all that funny, but I didn't think they were actually implying what they were doing was all that hard.

Edited May 1, 2015 by theatremouse

[DkNNy79]

Bernadette knew what she was getting when she married Howard.  If she doesn't like it now, then that is her problem.  No one to blame but herself.  To expect Howard to change who he is just for her, is an incredibly selfish act on Bernadette's part.  That being said, I do hope Howard does change and act more like an adult, that is when everyone will find out that Howard and Bernadette are incompatible as a couple.  Bernadette likes to be in control.  That all changes if Howard becomes something that he is not.

Bernadette has been very shrewish this season, but I was on her side this episode.  I don't care if Howard's mother took care of everything for him growing up, things change and I don't think its unrealistic for people to make small changes.  He doesn't need to change who he is, but its not unreasonable for her to expect him to contribute in the household duties.  I'm glad she told the boys that they need to help out around the house.

 

I enjoyed the mothers.  It wasn't as great as I thought it would be, but I blame that on the writing.  I did think that Laurie Metcalf looked really old this episode vs previous appearances.  I know a previous poster thought that might be to show the contrast between the two.  I didn't find Beverly to be especially harsh this episode, maybe it just seems that way when compared to Mary.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

Because I don't buy that Leonard would stint on a ring for Penny, who totally rocks his world.

I suspect he was influenced by Sheldon, whom we've heard be dismissive about diamonds when he was getting Amy an apology gift. And he was right. I've seen selling people on the "value" of diamonds called one of the greatest marketing achievements of the 20th century.

[numbersix]

I was really hoping to see some interaction between Amy and Beverly. It could have gone one of two ways. Either they bond completely over their adoration of Sheldon or Amy could see Beverly as competition while Sheldon remained oblivious. Probably the latter, though.

[mojoween]

. I thought it was moreso, while cleaning, the song popped into Howard's head, he started singing it, and the amusing part was supposed to be the other two not only join in and singing along, but also knowing far more of the words than one might expect them to.

Raj was humming it at the stove, then Howard did and then they started singing. It's not at all unreasonable that Raj would know all the words, heh.

[Pop Tart]

 

Yeah, I feel the same way. Maybe I set my expectations too high based on how much liked both Laurie Metcalf's and Christine Baranski's other appearances, but I didn't enjoy their scenes together at all.

 

I think a big part of the problem is how short the episodes have become. They're at about 16-17 minutes at this point and since they also include a b-plot there just isn't time to really develop the interactions or the jokes a lot of the time. Earlier episodes were probably around 20 minutes long and I think an additional few minutes makes all the difference. There just wasn't time for all the beats that should have played out between Beverly and Mary. They went the quick and dirty route with jokes about religion vs science, but could have done so much more. In past episodes Mary has been very motherly to Leonard (and the others too) and I just didn't believe that she wouldn't say something about how Beverly was treating Leonard.

 

And there's always been an undercurrent of how much better a match the mother/son pairings would be if they were switched - cerebral Sheldon with cerebral Beverly and loving Leonard with loving Mary - so to have there only be that one line about Sheldon kind of getting that his mom really was a good fit for him wasn't enough either. 

 

These super short episodes in an aging series are kind of killing it.

[jaytee1812]

 

And there's always been an undercurrent of how much better a match the mother/son pairings would be if they were switched - cerebral Sheldon with cerebral Beverly and loving Leonard with loving Mary - so to have there only be that one line about Sheldon kind of getting that his mom really was a good fit for him wasn't enough either. 

Johnny Galecki said a Comic Con a couple of years ago that Sheldon and Leonard each have the mother other wishes they had.

[sinkwriter]

 

In past episodes Mary has been very motherly to Leonard (and the others too) and I just didn't believe that she wouldn't say something about how Beverly was treating Leonard.

 

Especially when he came into the room, still arguing with Sheldon, and yelled outright that his mother likes anyone more than she likes her own son. I felt that needed a follow-up between Mary and Beverly. I would think Mary would find that shocking and disturbing. 

 

I did love that scene Mary had with Penny and Leonard near the end, though. At least that was something. And I liked how Penny teased Leonard about the ring. She didn't seem terribly troubled about it by that point, just giving him a ribbing about it by pretending to drill his arm. Heee.

Edited May 1, 2015 by sinkwriter

[Pop Tart]

 

I did love that scene Mary had with Penny and Leonard near the end, though. At least that was something. And I liked how Penny teased Leonard about the ring. She didn't seem terribly troubled about it by that point, just giving him a ribbing about it by pretending to drill his arm. Heee.

 

I liked that Mary was making them spaghetti with cut-up hotdogs - but wanted Sheldon to come in and see them eating it together. Just so that he'd have a moment of feeling what Leonard was feeling when both moms were fawning over Sheldon.

[CleoCaesar]

Including the theme song, this episode was 18:34 minutes long. That is incredibly short. It felt way too rushed and superficial, and even the immense Christine Baranski was wasted. I would have preferred them to scrap the idiotic "Bernie married a manchild: Part 2,030" storyline entirely and just given us Sheldon, Leonard, Penny and the moms. Maybe then it would have actually been paced well and had some kind of depth and the jokes would have landed better.

[Chit Chat]

Raj was humming it at the stove, then Howard did and then they started singing. It's not at all unreasonable that Raj would know all the words, heh.

I think Raj likes musicals.  Weren't he & Stuart getting ready to go see the Sound of Music when Howard got back from Space?  I assumed from then that Raj enjoyed musicals.

 

I liked this episode, especially all of Mary's replies to Beverly.  "As a Christian, I'm supposed to turn the other cheek, but as a Texan, I should've shot her!  I split the difference!"   I loved that scene.   I do love how Sheldon can easily say that he loves his Mom.  That's not an emotion he expresses very often, but we've heard it a few times in regards to his Mom.  In real life, it would take a very strong woman to raise a son like Sheldon!   I like how the writer's have written Mary as far as how she handles Sheldon.   She's a strong woman in her own right, and Sheldon still respects her authority (most of the time!) 

 

One little inconsistency was when Mary told Beverly that she must be proud of her son.  Thinking it was the other son, she replied that yes, he successively argued a case before the Supreme Court.  Many years ago she told of how Leonard's sister successfully grew a pancreas in a gibbon, to which Howard said "you must be so proud," and she replied: "Why?  It wasn't my accomplishment."   It was no big deal.  I was just surprised that she actually admitted to being proud of him.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

I was just surprised that she actually admitted to being proud of him.

Is this an inconsistency, or character growth? One reason I like this show is that characters are allowed to change (however glacial that may seem at times, it's better than many other sitcoms).

[DrSpaceman]

I wasn't too impressed with the two moms on the episode. It was OK, some good lines, but a bit underwhelming.

I didn't like the ending song, but thats just because in general I hate songs like that on sitcoms. Three grown men singing Annie while cleaning a ktichen doesn't really interest me.

Then I also hated when they did the Bollywood ending as well, turned it off.

Howad should grow up. He and Bernadette seems to alternate each episode between who is more annoying.

[bichonblitz]

Since when is Leonards mother looking like an old frump? I always remembered her as a rather sophisticated scholar.  

Johnny Galecki and Laurie Metcalf are such good actors, I forget they ever worked together for so long on Roseanne. 

[shapeshifter]

I've been disappointed with the lack of Amy in the last few episodes, but I checked Mayim Bialik's blog and it turns out her father recently passed away, and that he'd been in hospice care for several months before. I suspect the writers have stripped down her role as much as they could so she could have more time with her family.

I didn't like it, but not for that reason. I didn't get the impression the show was trying to say the guys were expressing the same emotions the children do in the musical when they sing that song. I thought it was moreso, while cleaning, the song popped into Howard's head, he started singing it, and the amusing part was supposed to be the other two not only join in and singing along, but also knowing far more of the words than one might expect them to.I thought it was a shortcut in the writing, and not all that funny, but I didn't think they were actually implying what they were doing was all that hard.

Reading both of these posts make me wonder if Mayim had been part of the original script.

[Chit Chat]

Is this an inconsistency, or character growth? One reason I like this show is that characters are allowed to change (however glacial that may seem at times, it's better than many other sitcoms).

It's too bad she didn't tell Leonard that she was proud of his & Sheldon's paper while traveling from the airport to the apartment.  Instead, she heaped the praise on Sheldon when she saw him.  Sigh. Poor Leonard.  He just can't catch a break with his Mom! 

[LADreamr]

The conversation between her and Sheldon about her parenting style was confusing and didn't really seem to fit. He said she gave affection as a reward for accomplishment, but she didn't want to give him any affection or even congratulations for this accomplishment, which has garnered impressive recognition and the genesis of which was his revelation. So, if there is nothing for this, and she called him a greedy baby for needing her as an infant, when has there ever been any? It seems like the reason for her visit is not so much, "wow, congratulations! I want to share this moment with you," as it is, "you've done something extraordinary and are being rewarded for it. Let me come crap on it."