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Michelle and JimBob aka J'Chelle and Boob

OSM Mom

By OSM Mom
in Counting On

cm-soupsipper
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Closure Notice: This Thread is now closed due to the name (and much of the posting within it). Please be mindful going forward by naming topics in a way that invites a healthy community conversation. If you name something for a cheap laugh, this thread may be closed later because it encourages discrimination and harm. 

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Tabbygirl521

Tabbygirl521

The Duggars and people of their cult literally reproduce to make an army for God in this world and beyond and if they are doing it well God rewards them with 'blessings' of more and more offspring. The more the merrier. They take things very literally and arrows and archery are taught as skills that will be needed in God's war. I can't make this stuff up - that's really what they believe.

This makes it extra weird that they buried poor Jubilee in an ammo can.

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doodlebug
doodlebug

I'm from a fairly big city and raised mostly in town though also the suburbs.  I've had the same experience.  I attend a Catholic church and am active in several volunteer things there including medic

Aja
Aja

Once again, Michelle, I'm going to have to bum you out with a big old steaming pile of fact: I was born a girl, I'm glad to be a girl, I'm very feminine looking, I love being feminine looking...AND I'

doodlebug
doodlebug

Happens all the time.  Had someone tell us they couldn't pay the bill for prenatal care because they were building a new house and couldn't spare the money.  Another had just bought a new car.  BTW, i

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Defrauder

Defrauder

This makes it extra weird that they buried poor Jubilee in an ammo can.

Holy sheesh. I didn't even know that, that is weird.

This is why I'm #bettingonpurgatory.

If any of the Christian ideas about the afterlife are correct, I'm hoping the Catholics are the ones who have got it right and there's a purgatory. Fingers crossed.

If there's an afterlife (and no purgatory) and if JimBob is the type of person I'd be stuck around for eternity in heaven, I might be willing to checkout what was going on in hell.

Mark Twain quote:  Go to heaven for the climate.  Hell for the company.

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SomePity1066

SomePity1066

Holy sheesh. I didn't even know that, that is weird.

Yep - I would not have believed it if I hadn't seen it with my very own eyes on TV...

 

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-O9A5PgmEj2o/UMakPFn_w7I/AAAAAAAAFiY/VyAuWpAXZ9c/s1600/Picture6.png

 

It would be one thing if they were dirt poor and had to scramble to find something for the burial, but they had they all-out funeral for Jubille at a HUGE church, so where on God's green earth is this even remotely appropriate ?! 

 

That would be touching if Patton or MacArthur had been cremated and ASKED to be placed in something an old gunny would be carrying around, but this was just...bizarre. Creepy. Inexplicable.

 

Even MORE creepy ??? The Duggars posing on the stage/alter at the funeral like they're about to open another Fort Rock Marriage Counseling Center and Hootin' Hollerin' Diner !

 

http://cdn2.crushable.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/jubilee-cover.jpg

 

So many smiles...

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Defrauder

Defrauder

Yep - I would not have believed it if I hadn't seen it with my very own eyes on TV...

 

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-O9A5PgmEj2o/UMakPFn_w7I/AAAAAAAAFiY/VyAuWpAXZ9c/s1600/Picture6.png

 

It would be one thing if they were dirt poor and had to scramble to find something for the burial, but they had they all-out funeral for Jubille at a HUGE church, so where on God's green earth is this even remotely appropriate ?! 

 

That would be touching if Patton or MacArthur had been cremated and ASKED to be placed in something an old gunny would be carrying around, but this was just...bizarre. Creepy. Inexplicable.

 

Even MORE creepy ??? The Duggars posing on the stage/alter at the funeral like they're about to open another Fort Rock Marriage Counseling Center and Hootin' Hollerin' Diner !

 

http://cdn2.crushable.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/jubilee-cover.jpg

 

So many smiles...

Now I've seen everything.  The ammo box for Jubilee and the family smiling funeral picture.  These people will stop at nothing for I don't even know what to call it.  Jordyn was the only one with any sense to hide her face.  You're right they do look like they're posing to open another Fort Rock Marriage Center. I'm not sure if I had read the sign at the funeral correctly but it looks like it said - Jesus won.   

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Defrauder

Defrauder

Bonus hanging a lantern off it points for the poet at TLC who chose to put the MY CREEPY OBSESSION SEASON FINALE promo on the screen exactly then.

Well that about sums it up now doesn't it.  I can't imagine how that could in any way be healthy for their young children to witness.   Their dead fetus sibling being buried in an ammo box followed by a smiling family photo.

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Liz Tudor

Liz Tudor

When I say this headline I thought it was going to be about JimBoob and either of the marrieds http://www.people.com/article/brelyn-bowman-tim-bowman-jr-virgin-bride-purity-certificate

A daughter gave a certificate signed by her dr that her hymen was intact to her dad on her wedding day. I have no words.

I really wish people would keep their creepy customs to themselves. The whole world didn't really need to know about this, but, like the Duggars, these "Christians" have to get on their soapbox and scream, "Loooook aaaat meeeeee! Aren't I awesome! Isn't this neat, sweet, and cool???" And I have some swampland in Florida (really, I do!) for anyone who believes hubs is a virgin in any way, shape, or form. I'm sorry, but unless he was locked in a tower from age 13, I don't believe him. Puh-leeeze.
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Vaysh

Vaysh

When I say this headline I thought it was going to be about JimBoob and either of the marrieds

http://www.people.co...ity-certificate

A daughter gave a certificate signed by her dr that her hymen was intact to her dad on her wedding day. I have no words.

 

But, but but... there is no such thing as a hymen to keep "intact". The existence of a hymen that breaks upon first entry so to speak, is nothing but a lovingly perpetuated myth with absolutely no basis in biological fact. There is literally no physical way to determine whether a woman is a virgin or not. What kind of quack doctor did she go to anyway, the same one who blamed Michelle's miscarriage on the Pill? Also, ew.

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kalamac

kalamac

(edited)

What happens to the poor virgins who turn out to be one of the many many women whose hymen naturally breaks/wears away as they're growing up just because they're active etc. Most of the time the "blood on the sheets" is from vaginal abrasions due to the new virgin bride not being properly aroused/lubricated not due to a broken hymen.

Ick.

At least JB & M didn't make the girls have invasive exams to prove themselves. That we know of.

ETA: posted at the same time as Vaysh.

Edited by kalamac
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Defrauder

Defrauder

When I say this headline I thought it was going to be about JimBoob and either of the marrieds http://www.people.com/article/brelyn-bowman-tim-bowman-jr-virgin-bride-purity-certificate

A daughter gave a certificate signed by her dr that her hymen was intact to her dad on her wedding day. I have no words.

I want a certificate from a psychiatrist that examines her father that says he's an abusive misogynist that's  not playing with a full deck.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

When I say this headline I thought it was going to be about JimBoob and either of the marrieds http://www.people.com/article/brelyn-bowman-tim-bowman-jr-virgin-bride-purity-certificate

A daughter gave a certificate signed by her dr that her hymen was intact to her dad on her wedding day. I have no words.

Oh my. It's my guess that most fathers have NO thoughts of their daughters vaginas once their girls are potty trained, and hymens, uhm never. And why is the purity stuff always committed to the father? Mothers don't care?!? It is just a weird level of intimacy to me that feels, I don't know, kind of wrong.

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Defrauder

Defrauder

Oh my. It's my guess that most fathers have NO thoughts of their daughters vaginas once their girls are potty trained, and hymens, uhm never. And why is the purity stuff always committed to the father? Mothers don't care?!? It is just a weird level of intimacy to me that feels, I don't know, kind of wrong.

It totally crosses the line into sexual abuse disguised as maintaining sexual purity and any parent (like JB and Michelle) who insists on their children telling them their sexual thoughts and fantasies is abusing them sexually and emotionally in my opinion and I'm right.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

It totally crosses the line into sexual abuse disguised as maintaining sexual purity and any parent (like JB and Michelle) who insists on their children telling them their sexual thoughts and fantasies is abusing them sexually and emotionally in my opinion and I'm right.

First, I love the line that I bolded! And I agree that is does border on emotional abuse. I'm not sure I agree on sexual abuse, but it sure could screw up a kid's adult sex life.

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SomePity1066

SomePity1066

It totally crosses the line into sexual abuse disguised as maintaining sexual purity and any parent (like JB and Michelle) who insists on their children telling them their sexual thoughts and fantasies is abusing them sexually and emotionally in my opinion and I'm right.

I LOVE that you added "and I'm right" at the end there ! You ARE right - the whole thing is just so creeptastically twisted and incest-y it makes me gag !

 

As GeeGolly said, fathers should have NO thoughts about their daughters' bits after diaper time is over. 

 

All of this just makes my skin crawl - it reminds me of the scene in Pretty Baby when Brooke Shields' virginity is auctioned off and everyone there is maintaining that it's some super normal, everyday thing that people do - la, la, la, nothing to see here, folks, we're just selling a 12 year old for sex, la, la, la...

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Vaysh

Vaysh

(edited)
First, I love the line that I bolded! And I agree that is does border on emotional abuse. I'm not sure I agree on sexual abuse, but it sure could screw up a kid's adult sex life.

I'm gonna start using that line, it's perfect.

 

I do think parents who demand to know their children's every sexual thought and impulse (and, perhaps more importantly, espouse that those thoughts are evil and sinful) are leaning heavily into abusive territory. If any other adult would do the same, approach a child or teen and demand detailed information on their sexual fantasies, we'd be calling the cops. Abusive or not, the whole practice is really icky in my opinion (and I'm right!)

Edited by Vaysh
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Defrauder

Defrauder

I'm gonna start using that line, it's perfect.

 

I do think parents who demand to know their children's every sexual thought and impulse (and, perhaps more importantly, espouse that those thoughts are evil and sinful) are leaning heavily into abusive territory. If any other adult would do the same, approach a child or teen and demand detailed information on their sexual fantasies, we'd be calling the cops. Abusive or not, the whole practice is really icky in my opinion (and I'm right!)

When I think of an adult, any adult, expecting a child to tell them their sexual thoughts, fantasies, and feelings, all I can think of is a child predator who is  violating their sexual privacy and being sexually aroused by such information.  It's just plain wrong imo and I'm right - again.

We're all freaking right about the whole sexually abusive situation going on with adults prying into children's sexual territory.

Call the cops is right.

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doodlebug

doodlebug

(edited)

But, but but... there is no such thing as a hymen to keep "intact". The existence of a hymen that breaks upon first entry so to speak, is nothing but a lovingly perpetuated myth with absolutely no basis in biological fact. There is literally no physical way to determine whether a woman is a virgin or not. What kind of quack doctor did she go to anyway, the same one who blamed Michelle's miscarriage on the Pill? Also, ew.

Yep, an imperforate hymen (ie, no opening) is extremely rare.  We couldn't have menstrual periods if there wasn't an opening to the outside world.  Virgins couldn't use tampons if there wasn't already a sizeable outlet at the vaginal introitus.  I suspect the doctor wasn't so much a quack as he was concerned about what sort of repercussions she might face if he/she didn't provide the requested documentation.  And, there is no reliable 'test' for virginity.  There's also the fact that any exam that looks solely at the hymen is defining virginity in a very narrow way.

 

True story: when I was about 14, my older sister and I wanted to use tampons so we could go swimming. My mother insisted on calling her gyn first to ask if we would still be virgins if we used them.  He said, "Mrs. M. that is not the definition of virginity". And reminded her of the obvious, that there must be an opening or we wouldn't be having periods.

Edited by doodlebug
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Tabbygirl521

Tabbygirl521

Did her dentist provide a note, too?

Or her proctologist?

About the smiling funeral picture: I once had the misfortune of attending a fundie funeral, for an in-law who died in his 50s. He left behind a wife and three adult kids. The funeral was horrible. Basically we got scream-preached at - the threatening hellfire kind. And basically we were told it was wrong to be sad because this was God's will and we should be happy that our dead relative was in Heaven. I still remember his widow having to act like it was all groovy. I don't recall anyone posing smiling for pictures, but I recount this to suggest that the Duggars were probably trained to believe that death for them is the gateway to a much better place and isn't it all just wonderful.

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NewDigs

NewDigs

(edited)

Sounds like a slippery slope to, I'd rather be dead.

I'm pretty sure I "lost my virginity" on the center bar of my older brother's bicycle. Ouch!

Please tell me they don't display the wedding night sheets.

Edited by NewDigs
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cmr2014

cmr2014

When I say this headline I thought it was going to be about JimBoob and either of the marrieds http://www.people.com/article/brelyn-bowman-tim-bowman-jr-virgin-bride-purity-certificate

A daughter gave a certificate signed by her dr that her hymen was intact to her dad on her wedding day. I have no words.

 

While many things creep me out about this, the thing that I noticed was that the young woman uses the exeact same language as Jill and Jessa.

 

"It's not that we didn't want to have sex because we were created that way," says Brelyn. "We wanted to, but we had that accountability with each other and others."

 

If this is not cultish and controlling behavior why is it that none of these young women can come up with her own thoughts or perspective on why this is a good idea? Why do we keep hearing the same gibberish over and over?

 

Personally, I don't care if people want to have sex or abstain until marriage -- that's their business. As others have pointed out, it is Berlyn's (Jill's, Jessa's, etc.) business, not the business of their fathers' -- so much ick and squick and nasty in that.

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Julia

Julia

There's (was) a marvellous writer named Robertson Davies - and seriously, if you haven't, you should - and one of his characters said that "Chastity is having the body in the soul's keeping." Which is what I told the kid when we had The Talk, so at least I'm at peace with what I'm going to hell for.

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cheatincheetos

cheatincheetos

When I say this headline I thought it was going to be about JimBoob and either of the marrieds http://www.people.com/article/brelyn-bowman-tim-bowman-jr-virgin-bride-purity-certificate

A daughter gave a certificate signed by her dr that her hymen was intact to her dad on her wedding day. I have no words.

Just saw this story on Salon tonight and sure enough, you guys had picked up on it too-- and posted it in the Jimchelle folder :)

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Julia

Julia

The greatest part of that story is the way it was framed as 'crazed internet mob is offended at couple's decision not to have sex.' Which, mazel tov, I guess. Everyone needs a place to feel at home, and I guess for people who want to wrap their retrograde world views in tinsel, it's People. I'm just surprised they haven't asked Jessa to weigh in yet.

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Tabbygirl521

Tabbygirl521

(edited)

I caught an old "Simpsons" last night. BART an the Flanders kids were playing a Christian video game where they shot non-Christians and when the avatars "died," they transformed into angels with haloes. At the end of a level, a voice announced, "Conversion complete!"

Edited by Tabbygirl521
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JoanArc

JoanArc

I  ... yeah ... I knit hats for the local NICU.

 

(My niece was born 3 months early and spent time in the NICU, so even though babies - and especially premies - creep me out - I feel I need to do this to give back.  Also, it means I'm not inundating my friends and relatives with unwanted, unsolicited hats.)

You could love offering some hats to Michelle...who'd take the credit.

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Sew Sumi

Sew Sumi

Just like those who put bombs in their underwear to wipe out 'infidels', except they also are promised several virgins.

But only virgins who can provide a certified Intact Hymen note from the family OBGYN....

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Missy Vixen

Missy Vixen

The father of the bride in question is so proud of himself and his insistence that anyone who disagrees with him is "negative" and doesn't understand the "fruits of the Spirit". I understand that he's a bit too concerned with his adult daughter's sexuality. I also understand that I have grave misgivings about any groom that is uninterested -- oops, showing off his "purity" with his fiancee. Maybe the guy's just super-religious. And maybe he's not interested in heterosexual sexual activity.

 

There's an interesting story in Seattle along these lines right now. The QB of the Seahawks, Russell WIlson, announced recently that he is not having sex with his girlfriend, Ciara (the singer). He is super-religious. She has a child from a previous relationship and it is rumored that she is physically involved with someone else. I can't believe Russell Wilson would consider his celibacy an appropriate subject for anyone else to know besides him and the woman in question. And it strains belief at the least.

 

Duggar content: Bin and derickdillardduggar both agreed to the chaste courtship rules. I am guessing that there are many, many red flags with the two of them, which is why Bin married the first girl he could manage to attract and derickdillardduggar had no apparent contact with a female until he courted Jilly Muffin. The biggest red flag, at least for me: They were the best J-Chelle and Jim Boob could do for their (oh-so-chaste and sheltered) daughters?

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Wellfleet

Wellfleet

The father of the bride in question is so proud of himself and his insistence that anyone who disagrees with him is "negative" and doesn't understand the "fruits of the Spirit". I understand that he's a bit too concerned with his adult daughter's sexuality. I also understand that I have grave misgivings about any groom that is uninterested -- oops, showing off his "purity" with his fiancee. Maybe the guy's just super-religious. And maybe he's not interested in heterosexual sexual activity.

 

There's an interesting story in Seattle along these lines right now. The QB of the Seahawks, Russell WIlson, announced recently that he is not having sex with his girlfriend, Ciara (the singer). He is super-religious. She has a child from a previous relationship and it is rumored that she is physically involved with someone else. I can't believe Russell Wilson would consider his celibacy an appropriate subject for anyone else to know besides him and the woman in question. And it strains belief at the least.

 

Duggar content: Bin and derickdillardduggar both agreed to the chaste courtship rules. I am guessing that there are many, many red flags with the two of them, which is why Bin married the first girl he could manage to attract and derickdillardduggar had no apparent contact with a female until he courted Jilly Muffin. The biggest red flag, at least for me: They were the best J-Chelle and Jim Boob could do for their (oh-so-chaste and sheltered) daughters?

 

Excellent post - and very good points.

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Wellfleet

Wellfleet

(edited)

When I say this headline I thought it was going to be about JimBoob and either of the marrieds http://www.people.com/article/brelyn-bowman-tim-bowman-jr-virgin-bride-purity-certificate

A daughter gave a certificate signed by her dr that her hymen was intact to her dad on her wedding day. I have no words.

 

Did anyone go as far as the Comments with this article? Grain of salt time, kids. According to one commenter, the bride's family are famous - or rather, infamous - in the DC area for their own prolific religious grifting. Right up there with the Duggars - private planes etc.

Edited by Wellfleet
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queenanne

queenanne

The father of the bride in question is so proud of himself and his insistence that anyone who disagrees with him is "negative" and doesn't understand the "fruits of the Spirit". I understand that he's a bit too concerned with his adult daughter's sexuality. I also understand that I have grave misgivings about any groom that is uninterested -- oops, showing off his "purity" with his fiancee. Maybe the guy's just super-religious. And maybe he's not interested in heterosexual sexual activity.

 

There's an interesting story in Seattle along these lines right now. The QB of the Seahawks, Russell WIlson, announced recently that he is not having sex with his girlfriend, Ciara (the singer). He is super-religious. She has a child from a previous relationship and it is rumored that she is physically involved with someone else. I can't believe Russell Wilson would consider his celibacy an appropriate subject for anyone else to know besides him and the woman in question. And it strains belief at the least.

 

Duggar content: Bin and derickdillardduggar both agreed to the chaste courtship rules. I am guessing that there are many, many red flags with the two of them, which is why Bin married the first girl he could manage to attract and derickdillardduggar had no apparent contact with a female until he courted Jilly Muffin. The biggest red flag, at least for me: They were the best J-Chelle and Jim Boob could do for their (oh-so-chaste and sheltered) daughters?

 

I don't know if it works like that though.  I should think, for example, that Russell Wilson, if a closeted gay, would feel it was better to keep his lips zipped about his sex life entirely and just let people assume he is physically intimate with Ciara, not hang a lantern on it by making it religious (I mean, who would know?).

 

I also don't think Ben and Derick agreeing to the rules is outre, because I don't for a moment think that would be the first Christian girl they knew, if even just socially by rumor, who was brought up to believe they (the women in question, Ben, and/or Derick), were going to keep their own virginities until marriage.  I also don't think that every male who would agree to that is necessarily gay, or wholly happy about it, but church youth groups now teach sex ed for a reason, and it's not so the churches can necessarily be more liberal, or so the youths of the congregation can be tacitly winked at if they want to have sex.  It's fairly standard doctrine in any church with a "born-again stripe".  Back to the old "your body is a temple, and one of the best things you can do to keep your body pure - for your future mate or, just for you -  is not to engage in any situations where you might wind up with an STD."

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Jynnan tonnix

Jynnan tonnix

I don't have any significant problem believing that a guy idoctrinated into the whole "purity" mindset could take it seriously enough to actually refrain from sexual activity until marriage. Of course, people have all levels of sex drive, and it might be easier for some than others. Some will find that good intentions don't stand up to temptation, but others might have the strength to stand up to their convictions even without being secretly closeted or indifferent to sex for whatever reason. I'm not opposed to premarital sex or even particulartly concerned about saving one's self for the person they eventually marry. I think that sometimes it's a good thing, but depending on the individual and the dynamics of the relationship, it can be good to have other experience as well.

 

In any event, I do believe that the incidence of premarital sex was far lower in my parents' generation (pre birth control pill) than it has been since. I don't think my parents or my in-laws or others are lying when they say they waited, so why does it seem so impossible today?

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Jynnan tonnix

Jynnan tonnix

I suspect that they were able to wait because they got married pretty darn young. my parents were married in the late 60's at 20 y.o.

 

Yes, there is that, PityFree...my in-laws were married at 18 & 20. My parents at 22 & 24. On the other hand, my husband and I were both virgins when we met, when I was 24 and he 27! Not due to any particular religious convictions, just a combination of both being pretty shy and just not having dated enough that a relationship ever got to that point. Heck, it took him five dates to even kiss me goodnight. That was his first kiss, he claims. Of course, things did progress pretty rapidly after that point ;)

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Julia

Julia

There is some documentation for quite a lot of babies in Colonial America being less than nine months, and babies weren't often as a legal matter registered as illegitimate if their parents married before they were born, so I'm not sure what the accurate numbers are there.

I think, though, the larger point is that I don't believe anyone is offended that she chose to wait for marriage. I think the point is exactly the opposite, that it's nobody's business but hers and her fiancés what they chose to do or not do. And apparently she chose to involve her father, which is also absolutely her choice.

But then (since her relationship with her father seemingly doesn't involve enough trust for her to tell him about the state of her body and soul and have him believe her) she got some male doctor to sign a piece of paper purporting to prove based on the state of her hymen that she was a virgin. Which is not a thing, and which anyone who went to medical school has to know is not a thing, but which her father apparently placed the faith in that he didn't in his daughter's words. And then they made a public announcement not that they waited, but that her daddy was real happy about the results of her gynecological exam.

Nothing in the first paragraph bothers me a bit. Their bodies, their choices, and if they freely choose to wait, more power to them. Everything in the second paragraph bothers me. Because while it seems to be a bit of theater by a publicity-seeking family, it's bad science and it sends a horrible message about how women should be treated. I think the clever young lady involved has spun it as the secular world attacking chastity (I actually think she was as in your face as possible hoping for this reaction), but I don't believe that's the point for most of the people I've seen taking offense.

Also, it seems a bit creepy to build your life about a standard of modesty and then put out a press release about the structure of your genitals, but that part could be just me.

FWIW.

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GeeGolly

GeeGolly

There was a joke way back when that first babies were often 8 lb preemies. Trends and cultures vary. Marrying young, marrying old, remaining chaste until marriage or engagement, living together, etc.

 

But like Julia said, it is a private matter, and holding oneself as better than, is wrong.

 

I would also imagine that remaining a virgin (which definitions of vary wildly) would be easier if masturbation is not considered a sin.

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