S29.E08: Wrinkle In The Plan

[Nashville]

Maybe I'm dumb (totally possible), but I didn't think the location of the idol on Exile was related in any way to the clue Jon got.

I think the major gist of the clue was that the idol was at a location which was only accessible - or only easily accessible - at low tide. The episode didn't show it (THANKS AGAIN FOR THE GREAT EDIT JOB GUYS!), but the pools of water among the rocks at the base of the rock outcropping would seem to indicate its base would be underwater at high tide.

 

But eventually those two people are going to be voting *against* you, or at least voting in favor of each other over you.  When the numbers are down to 5, or even 9, 2 votes that can't be broken up could really affect the tribal council vote.  Having 2 bloc votes is great early on, but I think that within a vote or two after the merge, you really want to break that up.​

Sure - as soon as you've liquidated the threat to your alliance.  THEN your first move should be to break up the bloc.

Unless, of course, you've managed to solidify a F3 deal with them in the interim (maybe F4, if you're still part of a remaining BvW pair).  In which case you crack them on the vote for F4 (F5)....  ;>

Edited November 13, 2014 by Nashville

[SunshineOnMe]

I was excited Jeremy won, he really needed it.

 

The taco bar... all I was doing was praying they didn't show the tacos in reverse. I was really worried for a minute there.

[BK1978]

Seriously, you have a worthy player like Josh getting voted out so early and that doofus Alec still there. There's no justice in the world. Hopefully, he has fun at Ponderosa.

 

I brought this over from Josh's thread because my comment has more to do with the episode in general.  I was thinking the same thing, I freely admit the editors fooled me a bit tonight I thought that Alec was probably going to go because of how they were focusing on his rudeness.  Obviously I figured out that Josh was still the target when the kept on saying it over and over again but there was a brief moment where I was sure Alec was going to be the next to go.

[GaT]

Why isn't anyone trying to vote Alec out? I feel like I'm missing out on some information. Or maybe I would just stab him in the head & call it a day.

[Nashville]

Why isn't anyone trying to vote Alec out? I feel like I'm missing out on some information. Or maybe I would just stab him in the head & call it a day.

 

Because as far as Goats go, Alec was born for the job.

[RedheadZombie]

Josh really should of paid more attention to Jaclyn at camp to make her feel more included. Jon really impressed me tonight by listening to Jaclyn after all the chauvinistic behavior I've seen on Big Brother and Survivor it was really nice to see a couple working together. I didn't like Jon & Jaclyn before, after tonight I hope their the last pair remaining. Also did the immunity challenge seem like an HoH competition to anyone else?

 

I didn't like them either until tonight.  When Jaclyn said Jon would listen to her, I thought - yeah right.  And he did!   And it wasn't so much that they didn't give her attention, I think she realized they don't see her as their equal, but as an appendage of Jon.  And Jon would "handle her" (tell her what to do).  When you're the only female in your alliance and you realize the guys don't respect you - not good.

 

 

 

Whose idea was it to send Jon to Exile? If you're going for fair play and safety, Alec would've been the correct pick, because he probably wouldn't have been able to decipher the clue. He doesn't strike me as a bright boy. Jon acts like he's got a few marbles in his head, so his figuring out the clue was all but guaranteed.

 

But wasn't it the first time the HII was on Exile Island?  They couldn't have known they were practically giving Jon the idol.

 

I didn't hate Josh, but I wasn't bothered by him going.  He can go back to his successful (non) Broadway career.

[BK1978]

I was just on Survivor Wiki and I noticed that after tonight Baylor has fifteen votes cast against her.  I was wondering if she was coming close to the record for having the most votes cast against her in a single season.  I am not sure who even has the record, I think at one time it was Penner during his first season but I am not sure if that is still the case.

[green]

I'm a terrible strategist . . .

 

Can someone explain to me why everyone on that stupid island is just accepting the fact that Jon and Jaclyn are ALWAYS going to vote together, but no one has verbalized the idea that the smart thing to do is vote out one of them (probably Jon)?  That would be an amazing blindside.  The remaining person would be REALLY pissed, but this is Survivor . . . it's part of the game to be pissed at someone.  And that person would then only be ONE vote, not an automatic TWO votes.

 

Am I missing something?

 

Yes I think you are.  Jeremy-Natalie-Missy-Baylor needed TWO votes to survive, not one.  Also with Josh the obvious guy in charge of the other alliance they need him out first and foremost. 

 

Josh also needed their votes plus his selling point to bring in Jon-Jaclyn was that his was "the couples alliance" where all couples would remain safe until after the singles were voted out.  If he betrayed a couple too early it would upset Keith/Wes probably.  And he saw Jeremy and the hard core four he "headed" as the main opponents gunning for him.

 

Most likely one if not both of team Jon-Jaclyn will be voted out sometime but this is not the time for either to go.  Their two-person voting block was way too valuable to both sides.  Plus they aren't the only two person voting block right now so they don't stand out as a singular, unique danger to others at his point.  After awhile the fact that they are a voting block of two will make them the obvious choice.  But not now.

 

I really enjoyed this episode.  I can't see Jon-Jaclyn flipping again for a few votes cause if Jon is thinking that far ahead that he imagines himself next to Jeremy at the end then he should also realize he needs to count jury votes and getting both sides pissed at him would mean he would get zero votes.  This was the episode where they chose their side and any flip-flopping after this will screw them over.

 

And since I'm rooting for Jeremy-Natalie-Baylor, I'm happy about that.  Thank you Jerks Inc. (Alex, Wes & Keith).  Nice to see jerks doing themselves in like that.  Great to see nasty behavior get it's just reward.

 

I'm really enjoying this season.  I don't find it dull at all.  More like somewhat pleasant once that disgusting bigot Rocker got sent packing.  Dumb, chauvinist jerks I can handle on Survivor short term especially when their actions have immediate consequences for their side.  Give me a season of instant karma like this so far and I'm all in on it.

 

Also props to Baylor taking that jerk's garbage to the ocean and biting her tongue.  Waiting for a real revenge is way better than exploding all over the guy in the moment and screwing yourself over making yourself a target.  Shows a lot of discipline and smarts on how to play the game.  In this case justice delayed won't be justice denied I think given the editing we are getting regards Mister Jerk Brother #2.

 

My only question is why did they send Jon to Exile Island since people usually get clues for immunity idols there.  Now it turned out the perfect choice for the fortunes of the Jeremy-Natalie-Missy-Baylor side but they were not to know it at that time.

Edited November 13, 2014 by green

[green]

... . But the hell did Josh mean by he "showed too much of his real self" and that's why he was voted out? Waht you bully people that "owe you" favors in real life too? Though I'm pretty sure he meant that he feels he was turned on because he's gay, which sucks if he feels that way from a myriad of angles.

 

I don't think he meant he was turned on because he was gay.  I saw no anti-gay behavior from the other alliance ever.  I think he meant he was too out in front of being the head of his alliance and the one making all the moves.  He was too much almost badgering Baylor into feeling guilty.  He couldn't stop plotting and working things constantly and dial it back a notch and fade more into the background like Reed did.  He was the upfront major strategist in his alliance and clearing running things.  That is what put the target on his back.

[green]

Why isn't anyone trying to vote Alec out? I feel like I'm missing out on some information. Or maybe I would just stab him in the head & call it a day.

 

Alec (I thought it was Alex, shows how little attention I've been paying him) isn't the threat.  Josh was.  Josh was the "mastermind" running Alec's alliance.  Alec can only run his mouth.  He is fish bait (or possibly a goat) without Josh.  He is the last person in that alliance I'd worry about at this point.  Jaclyn is way too smart to take her vengeance out on Alec personally.  If you are upset with your treatment then you have to assure you can gain control of that situation in which case you destroy the offending parties (plural) alliance while setting yourself up in a winning alliance.  That is true revenge Survivor style.

 

Knee jerk reactions don't get anyone anywhere in a strategy game unless those emotions get re-channeled into taking a look at the big picture again.  It's a game of strategy, not personal revenge.  Emotions can't be shut off but using those negative actions taken against you to step back and  re-asses a choice you almost made and decide to go with the other alliance instead to further your own chances in the game is the best way to get that revenge.

 

Sorry, I still don't know how to do more than one quote in a single post.  Thus the three in a row posts.  Can anyone point me to instructions on how to do multi-quotes in one post?  All I see when I click on the quote icon is access to one single quote.  Not multiple ones or quotes inside quote multiples either.  Been trying to figure this out for over a month or more now.  Why is it not clear when clicking the quote icon how to do this stuff or is it just me?

Edited November 13, 2014 by green

[cooksdelight]

Do they get food on Exile? If so, what? Or do they have to try to find fish or plants to eat?

No food, no flint, nothing. Remember them eating snails there when Josh and Keith went?

These dumb people cannot look around and figure out they need to vote off the strong alliance threats. Jon, Alec, Wes... voting out Jeremy was their first bright idea but it's for all the wrong reasons. If they could rid themselves of Alec and Jon, in that order, Jaclyn would crumble and probably be no threat whatsoever. I understand wanting to keep the Power Couple around for a while in order to have them voting with you, but at some point they are going to turn on you and/or go on an immunity run. I actually fell asleep during part of this episode, and that's not like me....not that early in the evening.

[riley702]

I'd say he should have been paying more attention to those morons in his alliance and reading how their behavior was coming across to others. I noticed during the entire gross segment, he and Reed were just quietly sitting by. Instead he should have pulled the guys aside and tried to talk some sense into them. That's a key aspect of the game, recognizing if your alliance mates may be about to screw everything up and try to diffuse the situation as best as possible.

Yeah, he realized too late he'd screwed the pooch when Jaclyn spoke up at Tribal. 

 

If I were Baylor I'd give Josh the good ole "Man... I don't owe you shit!" Now if you say you'd like to continue working together that's cool but don't get all high and mighty like this is a game in which we're all keeping tallies of everything we do and say. That my so-called friend is bullshit.

I rolled my eyes when he described that encounter as "feeling her out" or trying to persuade her or whatever he said. Seriously, Josh? Between this and not realizing how Jaclyn was being alienated, that's pretty damned inept game play. I didn't think he'd screw up that badly.

 

When Jaclyn said Jon would listen to her, I thought - yeah right.  And he did!   And it wasn't so much that they didn't give her attention, I think she realized they don't see her as their equal, but as an appendage of Jon.  And Jon would "handle her" (tell her what to do).  When you're the only female in your alliance and you realize the guys don't respect you - not good.

This. I was incredulous that Missy and Jeremy thought the problem was uncouth behavior or language.

Edited November 13, 2014 by riley702

[Lnmop]

While Jaclyn wanting to switch was a bit emotional, I also think it was plenty smart, because she pointed out something else: aligning themselves with an alliance full of men would make it harder for either of them to win Immunity Challenges against all of these big, strong guys. With Jeremy and three other women (Natalie, Missy, and Baylor), they'll have an easier shot at it once Reed, Keith, Wes, and Alec more than likely follow Josh out the door.

I don't get that. At this point, the IC is played by everyone remaining, not within alliances. Maybe she was reasoning why they should vote off a man?

[vb68]

I think if Keith was a smart and cunning player or hell even a merely good player, he would have whipped out that idol after the votes and given it to Josh.  I know it's hard to see beyond using it strictly for yourself, but that could have been a turning point.  I just keep thinking that's what somebody who really has game like Parvati would have done.  Alas, I knew he wouldn't  even think of it. 

[green]

I think there was a ton of sexist footage shown myself.  Mileage varies etc but Alec, to me, is as much of a chauvinist as anyone I've ever seen on Survivor and that is saying a lot.  And Keith & Wes are just a step behind him.

[JudyObscure]

The woman has been divorced three times, so yeah she's taken a fair number of shots to the head in the Game of Life.

 

I have a feeling Missy was behind the trigger.  Those three dudes probably dared to say she was cooking too much and wasting food, or, heaven forbid, suggested Princess Baylor help with the dishes.  Somebody taught Baylor that it was alright to lie back and let everyone else do the work, and that same someone taught her that the rule of not expecting anything in return for gifts you give, extended to not needing to be grateful for the ones you receive.  Not that I think Baylor owed Josh a thing, but the way she took that old rule to another, entitled, level made me laugh out loud. Baylor and Missy are kind of fascinating to me.

[Bryce Lynch]

Good job by Jaclyn getting the "power couple" to make the best strategic decision and punish the rude idiots in the camp at the same time.

Her comment about thinking long term being stupid sounded dumb, but was actually true.

a) She was correct that Josh's alliance had more men who have done well in challenges that they would need to complete with. You can't win FTC if you don't make it to FTC.

b) The idea that Jeremy would be unbeatable at FTC because of his "story" of being a fireman struggling to get by is absurd. First, I would probably take the financial future of a cop and fireman couple, with their job security, pension and benefits over that of a couple of "successful Broadway guys" whose careers could be over next week.

More importantly, the jury generally votes based upon who played the best and who didn't betray or offend them. Jon acts as if FTC is a contest to convince the jury you have had the roughest life, like George Costanza and the Andrea Dorea survivor fighting over the apartment.

[Yogi Nomad]

Alec, Wes and his father were obnoxious. Missy was annoying too but I kinda see her point. I bet if the girls do that same thing they would rake them to the coals. "That's not ladylike and ladies should not do this and that and in meantime can you throw out the trash, get some firewood, and get the fire going?" Such douche.

Don't these people know that what you do or say can help or kill your game just like that? You gotta think long term guys! OK Jaclyn can say it's stupid all she wanted (because she's hot and sorta look like a hotter version of Heather Morris, )I kid I kid, I do agree with her that it's easier for J&J to beat Missy/Baylor in the IC. I don't see the flaw in that plan. Get to the top five and then you can worry about Final stuff then.

I don't really understand why they worry about Jeremy so much about the final. Plenty of times juries reward good game player. Oh wait they have to actually watch survivor to know this. Damn it recruits!

I just LOVED how angry Jaclyn was when she was offended by the guys. She basically told Baylor and Missy she's the one wearing pants in relationship. And then Alec went..Jon is down with us, Jaclyn will do whatever Jon wants. Haha serve you right Alec.

Not surprised to see Josh voted out. He looked so defeated. I'm not a fan of him but I gotta say, I felt bad for Josh and Reed that they have to ally with clueless people.

I'm still not sure who to root for, Missy is such a mom and Baylor is such a mommy's girl. Oh they throw my name around? Mom you talk to Jon. Seriously? Do something girl. I want to root for you but your sass is just not enough. I guess then I'm rooting for Natalie and Jeremy by default, even J&J too a little bit. Tho, based on the edit so far I don't think Natalie will win and for Jeremy I could see lose his temper and shoot himself in the foot. Jon could be a strong contender for the grand prize if people stupid enough to let him be in the final.

[ProfCrash]

Alec, Wes, and Keith are obnoxious, rude and over bearing. Yes people burp, fart, and spit but you can do it in a manner that is at least polite. If you burp or fart, say excuse me, don't discuss making someone smell it. If you need to spit, walk out of sight of the group. Yah know, basic stuff. Instead they are parading around camp burping, farting, spitting and complaining about how the women don't do anything. Baylor is their favorite target for some reason although I have not seen footage that shows Natalie, Missy, or Jaclyn doing much around camp. I would say that the Neanderthals were so sure of their alliance that they thought they could get away with being "Men" but I really think that they would behave that way any way because they have no idea what social skills are.

 

Natalie, who most of the Neanderthals seem to like and respect, is fed up with their bullshit. Jeremy sees the behavior as rude. His whole yeah we do this in the firehouse but when a woman arrives we behave differently thing was perfect. For some reason, many men seem to think that body noises are funny and cute and love the potty humor but they seem to know that most women think that smelly stuff is bad and adjust their behavior.

 

The best part is that the Neanderthals have no clue that what they are doing is rude. The looks on their faces when called on the behavior at camp and tribal was hilarious. I find it more then ironic that the Broadway Couple is aligned with the Neanderthals. I have a feeling that Reed and Josh were equally offended by the behavior but did not know how to approach the guys. I think that they are in an interesting position, they are aligned with the Neanderthals because of the whole couples thing and Alec a carry over from the original alliance and they don't want to remind those three that they really come from a different place in life in oh so many ways because they are two to the Neanderthals three.

 

Jeremy is right, Keith is trying to play the game but he is awful at it. He has no social skills and is not smart enough to play a strategic game. So I get why they targeted Josh and not any of the Neanderthals. Josh is the brains of that group. Get rid of the people who can think and make a convincing argument for why people should flip. There is no way that Natalie, Missy or Baylor will flip on Jeremy to align with Keith, Wes, or Alec. Heck, I have difficulty seeing Jaclyn flipping to work with the Neanderthals, which means Jon is a safe vote. Reed is the only one who might be able to sway Jaclyn and Jon, maybe Natalie but he essentially will become the low man in the now 6 person alliance. The Neanderthals are obnoxious but they will go one by one over the next nine days. If they had gotten rid of Alec or Wes, Josh could have rallied Jon and Jaclyn to his side. Josh was the threat.

[Bryce Lynch]

As to why Josh rather than Alec was voted off, I think it was because he was clearly the head of the alliance and a much bigger threat than Alec. Cutting off the head of Alec's alliance punishes him while being better strategy at the same time.

[Haleth]

Logic escapes me. Alec and Wes are being mean to the girls, so they band together to vote Josh out? Huh?

I didn't really get why they voted Josh out instead of Alec or Wes, but I guess it's because brains > brawn.  Josh is clearly smarter than the chuckleheads so taking him out of the game will diminish any strategic thought for the opposing alliance.  It remains to be seen how well Reed (who seems to be the only one left with some smarts) can regroup his alliance and talk Jon or someone else into defecting.

Maybe I'm dumb (totally possible), but I didn't think the location of the idol on Exile was related in any way to the clue Jon got.

In addition to the suggestion of being accessible at low tide there was wording in the clue about it being a "double edged sword," so Jon looked for the only landmark that looked like a sword.

 

Sorry, I still don't know how to do more than one quote in a single post.  Thus the three in a row posts.  Can anyone point me to instructions on how to do multi-quotes in one post?

Copy and paste.  Takes more steps but I believe it's the only way to do it.

Edited November 13, 2014 by Haleth

[ProfCrash]

The quote button allows for multiple posts being quoted. Just click on the posts that you want with the quote button

[Whimsy]

Sorry, I still don't know how to do more than one quote in a single post.  Thus the three in a row posts.  Can anyone point me to instructions on how to do multi-quotes in one post?  All I see when I click on the quote icon is access to one single quote.  Not multiple ones or quotes inside quote multiples either.  Been trying to figure this out for over a month or more now.  Why is it not clear when clicking the quote icon how to do this stuff or is it just me?

 

 

Copy and paste.  Takes more steps but I believe it's the only way to do it.

 

 

The quote button allows for multiple posts being quoted. Just click on the posts that you want with the quote button

This is not Survivor specific, but since a couple of you have mentioned it, there is a much easier way to quote multiple posts- as long as you're on a computer or tablet (not a phone, I don't think).

When you're reading through the thread and you realize you want to reply to a few posts, just hit the quote button underneath ALL of the posts you want to quote.  There is a pop up box that keeps a running tally and says "Respond to 3 quoted post(s)" (for example).  When you're done, just click that pop up box and it'll put all the quotes in the one box.  This is what I did to quote all of  the above.  If it's still not clear, please PM me.

 

There's also a Questions thread with instructions on quoting here http://forums.previously.tv/topic/4049-how-do-i-quote-a-post/#entry166558

[Primetimer]

Jon and Jaclyn get pulled in both directions, and we hear about it incessantly.

Read the story

[Kromm]

The subtitle of this episode should have been "Josh... it's about the social game, stupid!" or maybe "You need to suss out who ACTUALLY wears the pants".

[leighdear]

I did not completely and actively loathe either Jeremy or Natalie this episode.  Progress for me, I guess. 

 

I really dislike watching the food-only rewards.  Too much attention paid to people's digestive processes.  I prefer the picturesque group outing that includes a food component, but has some sort of local activity or interaction with local people.   

 

I think Wes is basically a decent kid, but he's being influenced by Alec more than by his own character.  Wes is a follower, and he's gotten into the "yeah, me too!" mindset with Alec.  Annoying but fairly harmless.  

 

Yes, Reed is looking quite scrumptious as he scruffs up.  I like the eye candy.  

[TheFinalRose]

Ugh. This is the worst cast ever. Worse than Rob and his harem. I'm wondering if the CBS casting department accidentally switched the "yes, this is the final cast, full of fans of the game or at least interesting characters" list with the "looks good on paper but after talking to them in our extensive vetting process we have determined they don't understand the game and have nothing to offer as a contestant" list and flew the wrong group out to the set.

 

I'm sure people have burped and farted ad nauseam in the other seasons, but there was no reason to focus on it as there were strategy talks and other dynamics going on.  Just goes to show how this group has zero to offer.  

 

Alec is one of the worst ever. I'm rooting for Jeremy, he is the only one left whose victory I could find satisfying.  

 

 

[Wings]

The fault lies in casting couples; it limited their choices.  Jeff taking responsibility for Julie's exit tells me they are not going to do this again.  

 

Enough with the creative casting.  Stick to those who apply, no pairs and no recruiting.  Please. 

[Slider]

All of these people suck so much.  I'm out.

[green]

This is not Survivor specific, but since a couple of you have mentioned it, there is a much easier way to quote multiple posts- as long as you're on a computer or tablet (not a phone, I don't think).

When you're reading through the thread and you realize you want to reply to a few posts, just hit the quote button underneath ALL of the posts you want to quote.  There is a pop up box that keeps a running tally and says "Respond to 3 quoted post(s)" (for example).  When you're done, just click that pop up box and it'll put all the quotes in the one box.  This is what I did to quote all of  the above.  If it's still not clear, please PM me.

 

There's also a Questions thread with instructions on quoting here http://forums.previously.tv/topic/4049-how-do-i-quote-a-post/#entry166558

 

Thanks so much.  I'd click on the first quote and see the box pop up and it looked like there were only two options I could do at that point.  Click on either 1 Quote or Clear.  I mean it popped-up so I had to select one or the other.  I never remotely considered I could just ignore the box and it would add more quotes as I went along.  What a weird quote tool dynamic.  But now that I know I'm ready to quote up a storm all in one post next time around.  Thanks again!  Makes a world of difference!

Edited November 13, 2014 by green

[NurseGiGi]

One thing this season doesn't lack and that's goats.  Lots and lots of goats to pick from.

 

Alec and Drew are really two of a kind.  I have to wonder what their family dynamic is like since they clearly have no respect for women.

 

Every time they focus on Jon/Jaclyn it makes me think "yep, I'll see them again on The Amazing Race".

[Jal]

Hey, something interesting finally happened this season!

 

I do enjoy the big ol' heap of crap the editors just keep dumping on Drew and Alec.  The show loves to show every moronic word out of these two idiots' mouths and then showing their immediate comeuppance and I love it.  Alec is a complete clown.

 

The best part is that Alec and Drew now claim they were edited poorly, when it's quite clear the editors have more crap than they could've hoped for. The words are coming out of your mouth, Alec. Stop acting like it's bad editing.

 

Glad Jon voted with Jaclyn, but I don't want them to win. Also, from the previews, it looks like I can start disliking Reed too.

 

I hope Jeremy and Natalie make it to the end and one of them win.

Edited November 13, 2014 by Jal

[Special K]

Can I just say that this forum is great:  Jerks Inc.  The Neanderthals.  Chuckleheads.  I'm loving all the names you guys have for those misogynistic losers out there.

 

Alec's most ridiculous moment was when, after bossing around Baylor, he said something like this, all puffed up, "Yeah, she's not ready to play with the big boys yet."  Hahahaha!  He's like the weeniest, most junior-high-acting "adult" male I've seen in a long time.  Big boy indeed.

 

And can I say that I kind of hate the plastic rainbow rosary?  If I was a Catholic, I might actually be offended.

 

J&J are going up in my estimation. They seem able to balance emotion and strategy in ways that are working so far.  Beyond them, I'm rooting for Natalie and Jeremy.  

 

Having said that, I was sad for Josh.  He clearly loved being out there.  And agree that Reed gets better looking every single episode. Good lord, those eyes!

 

I hope Jeremy and Natalie make it to the end and one of them win.

 

If they do it'll be interesting since they have played basically the entire game as "singles" -- their loved ones were the first two out.  It could show how having a loved one is a liability (either to your own game play or the way others perceive you).

[jenrising]

Please add my name to the list to find out how that team selection worked for the reward challenge. I really need to know who was responsible for creating Team "Snowball's Chance in Hell" so I can laugh at them. 

[Haleth]

And if I was Missy I would've gone off on him for daring to insult her parenting in front of her.  There's not much I hate worse than someone who thinks they somehow have the right to decide how EVERY child should be raised, and to say so.

 

Then again Keith is up for Parent of the Year since Wes has not been in jail.  Yet.  He's obviously an expert on parenting.

[needschocolate]

Remember the episode where Josh and Keith were on exile together and they both talked about how they were surprised that they got along so well?  There was a lot of discussion afterward about whether Keith's remarks were homophobic and whether Josh was being prejudice by implying (calling?) Keith was a hick.  According to this episode, Josh was right - he may have made an assumption based on a stereotype, but it is true - Keith is a hick.  Obviously, Alec proves that hick behavior can exist outside of the South - what are hicks called in the Northeast/Midwest/West?

 

I do think Josh was ridiculous with that "you owe me" strategy and only served to piss Baylor off more and make her even more determined to get him out.

 

 

 

I can see why Josh tried to play the guilt card.  He was dealing with a girl who cries when she feels that her mother is about to cry. It would be logical to assume that someone like that is soft-hearted enough that she could be guilted into not voting for you. On the other hand, it would be more logical to assume that she would do whatever her mother wanted.   

 

I would have loved to have seen the schoolyard picks, and especially, who were the team captains?

 

Do we know for sure that it was a schoolyard pick?  I found it odd that Jon and Jaclyn ended up on separate teams.  Perhaps Jeff pulled names out of a hat.  I wish they would have at least told us how the teams were decided.

 

One thing this season doesn't lack and that's goats.  Lots and lots of goats to pick from.

 

Alec and Drew are really two of a kind.  I have to wonder what their family dynamic is like since they clearly have no respect for women.

 

Every time they focus on Jon/Jaclyn it makes me think "yep, I'll see them again on The Amazing Race".

 

Despite Amazing Race having a Survivor couple on this season and the Twinnies being on Survivor this season, the thought that any of these people would end up on Amazing Race never occurred to me.  And now I can see the possibility of the Amazing Race producers casting any of these couples.  I really don't want to watch Keith/Wes or Missy/Baylor on TAR, but I am undecided on Drew and Alec - they could be pretty funny racing around the world (not intentionally funny, of course).

[sigmaforce86]

Ugh, I can not deal with these people thinking women are some fragile species that need to be shielded from the basic realities of life.  Seems like Missy and Baylor should have been a lot more concerned that the men were treating them like second class citizens rather than worry so much that they were *gasp* farting.  jfc.

 

Yes, Yes, Yes!  So glad I'm not alone in this.  I was wishing I was part of tribal just so I could throw an epic eye roll at Missy for that.  I get that Keith and crew are not the most women friendly and I'm not sure they're wrong in saying that some of the females could be working harder.  But if you have your head in the game and keep it there you just don't say some of the things they said last night - checking Baylors pulse (not in front of Missy, don't poke the sleeping bear) or "girls" watch the fire (instead of "someone" keep an eye on the fire).  BUT - even as a fellow women I think what Missy said was just as bad or worse, you are in a camp using buffs as bra's sleeping spooned against total strangers.  You voluntarily signed up to do this and your fine female sensabilities are offended by belching and farting?  Get over it lady - you're human that means you belch and fart too.  There are a lot of females out there who wouldn't look twice if a guy did that, especially in their current situation.  Heck I'm pretty lady like (I think) but if someone can burp and get a good "grape ape" out at the same time they'll get a laugh from me not a nose in the air snob-a-tude.  She just pissed me off with that comment and her general attitude but I'm starting to see some reasons why she's been divorced more than once.

Player to root for?  For me there's never been a season where I didn't have at least one pick by the time they got to adding people to the Jury.  There's a lot of people I'm rooting against (Missy, Baylor, couple others).  I want to see how Reed plays without his loved one present since he's seemed to be a little more in the background so far.  Or maybe I'll just hope Keith wins, not because I really, really want him to, only for the fun factor because I know it'll annoy so many others

Edited November 13, 2014 by sigmaforce86

[Kromm]

Do we know for sure that it was a schoolyard pick?  I found it odd that Jon and Jaclyn ended up on separate teams.  Perhaps Jeff pulled names out of a hat.  I wish they would have at least told us how the teams were decided.

Probst said the actual words "schoolyard pick". Out loud.

 

Not that Jeff isn't occasionally a liar, but there's no reason to have done so here. If he used those actual words, that's probably exactly what it was.

[Special K]

I agree that Missy got it all wrong -- the burping and spitting isn't the problem (though why Keith has to spit so much, assuming he is not actually chewing tobacco, is beyond me).

 

No, it's (a few of) the men treating the women like they're their slaves, or definitely second-class citizens.  Like:  You may now throw my nasty fish-guts trash out.  You girls need to watch the fire.  Jaclyn will do whatever Jon says.

 

I actually don't think complaining about Baylor's work ethic falls into this category at all.  There are always Survivors who are vilified as lazy and they are as likely to be men as women.  Hell, it's even a strategy for some of them not to expend unnecessary energy!

 

Missy really is the worst kind of woman -- she wants respect and deference as if she was a fully realized post-feminist woman, making her own way and knowing her own mind, but she also wants to be treated like a cherished princess, to be shielded from the harsh realities of life, like it was still the 1950s or something.  What does she even do for a living?  What do any of these people do for a living?  Other than the firefighters and the broadway guys, I don't even know!

 

 

 

[Latverian Diplomat]

I'm a terrible strategist . . .

 

Can someone explain to me why everyone on that stupid island is just accepting the fact that Jon and Jaclyn are ALWAYS going to vote together, but no one has verbalized the idea that the smart thing to do is vote out one of them (probably Jon)?  That would be an amazing blindside.  The remaining person would be REALLY pissed, but this is Survivor . . . it's part of the game to be pissed at someone.  And that person would then only be ONE vote, not an automatic TWO votes.

 

Am I missing something?

It's a numbers game. Team Josh had five solid votes. If J&J swing to Team Jeremy, they lose regardless, 6-5. If the J&J swing to Team Josh, then they throw away a chance to weaken Team Jeremy and cement J&J for a while. Suppose if instead of taking that win and having a 7-3 advantage for next time, they eliminate one of J&J with a 5-4-2 vote,  the other J goes to Team Jeremy, and it's tied up 5-5.

 

Basically, it was too soon to pull the trigger on J&J. They needed to wait until Team Jeremy was smaller before they could think about backstabbing J&J (though I think they would have got to that soon enough).

[ProfCrash]

I think Baylor and Missy's issues were far more then the burping and farting. Baylor has commented on how Alec treats her on a number of occasions and Missy reminder her to suck it up. Baylor is target enough without jumping all over Alec for treating her like she is two or yelling at Keith for forcing her to get wood. In their talking heads, all of the women commented on the disrespect in terms of how they are treated by Alec, Keith, and Wes as well as the burping and farting.  When it comes down to it, the bossing around and snide comments are the verbal signs of disrespect and the burping and farting is a physical sign of their disrespect. Toss in Alec's comment about not worrying about Jaclyn because Jon was with the guys and would control Jaclyn.

 

The behavior was bad enough that Natalie, who has been described as almost a guy, is wrinkling her nose at the behavior. Yes, it is strategic for her to point these things out and encourage Jaclyn to vote with them but Natalie's body language screamed that she was annoyed. She has a talking head in the bonus clips that deals with Baylor/Alec BS that is eye opening.

 

So this is not just a few burps and fart but Neanderthals who are full on into chest thumping and dragging the women around by their hair level of bullshit. Missy is right, and Baylor's rolling her eyes but doing what Alec says is correct. They know that a blow up over the behavior does them no good but voting their asses out of the game will be more rewarding. Keith's comments about whooping Baylor for her lack of work and attitude was so far out of line. Wes might be doing more at camp but his behavior is flat out wrong and Keith fails to see that.

 

I want to see Jeremy win this. He has played a good strategic game and I don't think he has been an ass. I would like to see Natalie win. She has played a good social and strategic game. I wouldn't mind seeing Jaclyn or Jon winning, they are working well together and I think playing a pretty strong game.

 

I don't want Keith, Wes, Alec, Baylor or Missy to win. Baylor and Missy are annoying and I have to believe that all the negative feelings towards Baylor in the exit interviews are there for a reason. Missy is less annoying but she raised Baylor and the annoying brat really grates on me.

[cooksdelight]

I agree that Missy got it all wrong -- the burping and spitting isn't the problem (though why Keith has to spit so much, assuming he is not actually chewing tobacco, is beyond me).

Not to be gross, but they don't have Kleenex. If your nose is running, the quickest way to clear it is to snort it back and spit. Sorry for being too descriptive, but that's what I've been told, anyway.

[ProfCrash]

Cool, walk away from the camp and spit in an area that is not close to where you live or people walk.

[cooksdelight]

I totally agree.

[SHOgirl]

Meanwhile...despite John's protestations there was no scenario where he was going to go afoul of his smoking hot girl friend. It's written in the manual on how to keep your girlfriend happy-look it up.

Yes, when Alex said that Jacqueline (or however it's spelled) would vote how Jon told her to, I realized that Alex has probably never had a girlfriend.  

[ProfCrash]

Or the only women who would date Alec are the type who do whatever they are told.

[cooksdelight]

It's hard to believe we thought Drew was bad and Alec not so bad. Funny how those things turn around. :)

[fishcakes]

My soft spot for Keith turned to stone when he spit for the third time within the first ten minutes of the show. Unless you're brushing your teeth or a moth just flew in your mouth, there's really no need to ever spit. However, he did make me laugh with his obvious pride in Wes not having been in jail yet. It's good for a dad to have standards.

 

I hate the way Alec treats Baylor, but I also detest the way she reacts to it. I don't think she's biting her tongue because it's smart gameplay; it looks like ingrained behavior with her. When he handed her his bowl of fish guts, she didn't get genuinely offended, she got mock offended and and, "oh look how my boyfriend is teasing me" as she walked down to the water and did his bidding. She's just such a doormat, and it's gross that Missy seems to be encouraging her to be that way. I mean, yes, GAME, but still. Have some self-respect.

[peachmangosteen]

Ugh, I can not deal with these people thinking women are some fragile species that need to be shielded from the basic realities of life.  Seems like Missy and Baylor should have been a lot more concerned that the men were treating them like second class citizens rather than worry so much that they were *gasp* farting.  jfc.

 

Thank you! Dammit, Missy, it's not about burping and farting! Although even Missy brought up how they're chauvinistic pigs so I'm gonna give her the benefit of the doubt and think she brought the burping and farting up in a long list and the show decided to edit out everything else.

 

As for Jeremy, to me Jeremy himself has shown some sexist/chauvinistic behavior, so it doesn't surprise me he thinks women are so fucking fragile that they can't take a fart. Oh, Jeremy, thanks SO much for only acting like a gross, sexist douchebag when you're around all your male friends, whatta hero you are! I hate that he's totally gonna win. Although, I hate it a little less now after the hilarious faces he was pulling during TC.

 

I already loved Jaclyn before but now I'm actually rooting for her to win. I also have grown so fond of Baylor, which continues to surprise me.

 

I am not a fan of Missy, but I gotta give her props for refraining from punching Keith in the face when he told her if Baylor were his kid he'd whoop her. Speaking of, I'm super over Keith.

 

I agree with you on Baylor's reactions, fishcakes, but it actually just makes me sad for her. When she said Alec treats her like a little sister I was like damn, your mother (and society) has failed you, Baylor.

 

ETA: Oh, I forgot to mention how badly Josh and Reed were playing in this ep. Josh's pitch to Baylor was so embarrassing. Then you have the two of them just sitting there while the men in their alliance treat the women like shit. Idiots. Also, I'm pretty sure Reed legit rolled his eyes after the two of them terribly tried to fake being happy for Jeremy. Awful socials games from those two.

Edited November 13, 2014 by peachmangosteen

[bluebonnet]

 

 

Do we know for sure that it was a schoolyard pick?  I found it odd that Jon and Jaclyn ended up on separate teams.  Perhaps Jeff pulled names out of a hat.  I wish they would have at least told us how the teams were decided.

Jon and Jaclyn were on the same team.  The only couple separated was Josh and Reed.  Unless you count Missy and Baylor, but that's only because Missy didn't get picked.