S04.E08: Wow

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Quote

That's it.

Series finale.

Original air date 2023.05.28

[Galileo908]

So, Hank was dumb enough to send Barry after himself and his men.

Loved the image of Barry being strapped walking out of that store and nobody paying attention to him. Even got into his car with everything on him.

I was NOT expecting Fuches to jump on John during that shootout and just give him back to Barry, then walk off into the night. That just seemed a little too clean. I did like that the show swerved away from another Monastery moment and had Hank and Fuches's men take each other out instead.

And then the movie is what we thought we'd see. Loved how over the top and stupid it was. Loved that Movie Gene was British because, of course he's the villain, he has to be. Also loved the brief glimpse of who they got to play Hank.

My jaw dropped the moment Gene picked up the prop gun, and didn't get back up. Barry's buried in Arlington?! Damn.

EDIT: They freaking pulled a Sopranos on us and it went black the moment Barry was shot in the head.

Gene's whole reputation coulda got saved if he let Barry turn himself in and confess to everything. But nope, just had to shoot him and now he's in prison for what's left of his life.

Edited May 29, 2023 by Galileo908

[shapeshifter]

Fuches thinks he has no blood on his hands and paid his debts to Barry by returning his son to him. 
That kind of parallels Barry being able to walk out of the store with an arsenal strapped to his body.

Can the long view of dead Hank's hand held by the hand of the life-size gold stature of Cristobel get some sort of cinematography award?

Doesn't Sally know that Barry killed Janice?  

 

[Galileo908]

10 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Can the long view of dead Hank's hand held by the hand of the life-size gold stature of Cristobel get some sort of cinematography award?

The long pan out with Gene and Barry was great, too. And I called it that Tom had a collection of ventriloquist dummies.

 

10 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Fuches thinks he has no blood on his hands and paid his debts to Barry by returning his son to him. 
That kind of parallels Barry being able to walk out of the store with an arsenal strapped to his body.

"I've been redeemed."

No you fucking weren't, Barry. Then again, the movie did that for him.

Edited May 29, 2023 by Galileo908

[juno]

Somehow I feel like Ted Lasso season 3 parallels Barry's season 4.

They both started in one place and ended up in a completely different place.

What started off as a dark comedy turned into a dark drama that had no joy or fun left at the end. Like Ted Lasso's season 2, I will end Barry at season 3.

[shapeshifter]

So Gene's agent never tells the cops that Barry intended to turn himself in for the murder of Janice?
I guess he just kept on truckin' out the door with his suitcase.

What does John think of his Mom's confession of killing a man?

Edited May 29, 2023 by shapeshifter

[PinkRibbons]

So in the end the only thing that matters is the story and how we want it to be, not how it is.

[Valerie]

Wow indeed. 
 

I enjoyed it a lot. I’m glad they got to close the series out on their own terms. 
 

Hank dying holding onto statue Cristobal’s hand was beautifully tragic. 

[heatherchandler]

I hated that!  Poor Gene.

[Galileo908]

19 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

So Gene's agent never tells the cops that Barry intended to turn himself in for the murder of Janice?
I guess he just kept on truckin' out the door with his suitcase.

I bet he tried, but nobody believed him.

[Dev F]

50 minutes ago, Galileo908 said:

And then the movie is what we thought we'd see. Loved how over the top and stupid it was. Loved that Movie Gene was British because, of course he's the villain, he has to be. Also loved the brief glimpse of who they got to play Hank.

Unfortunately, the movie didn't work for me. Though I've been iffy on this whole season, it's this final sequence that finally led me to conclude that, no, the series did not stick the landing.

My main issue is, the kind of production the final film is parodying has nothing to do with the sorts of productions the series has previously been satirizing. If Barry had imagined all along that he was some straightforward hero in an old-fashioned Hollywood potboiler, it would be ironic if that's the kind of role he ended up playing in death. But he didn't; he imagined that he was dark and damaged but might redeem himself through some trivial life change—in other words, he imagined that he was the star of a modern antihero drama. If that's the kind of movie the final sequence had imprisoned him in, I would've found it much more resonant.

12 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

So Gene's agent never tells the cops that Barry intended to turn himself in for the murder of Janice?
I guess he just kept on truckin' out the door with his suitcase.

Maybe we're meant to assume that Tom believed Gene killed Barry because he was going to turn himself in, and thus decided that Moss must be right about him being the mastermind? I can't think of anything else that really makes sense.

[sistermagpie]

2 minutes ago, Dev F said:

My main issue is, the kind of production the final film is parodying has nothing to do with the sorts of productions the series has previously been satirizing. If Barry had imagined all along that he was some straightforward hero in an old-fashioned Hollywood potboiler, it would be ironic if that's the kind of role he ended up playing in death. But he didn't; he imagined that he was dark and damaged but might redeem himself through some trivial life change—in other words, he imagined that he was the star of a modern antihero drama. If that's the kind of movie the final sequence had imprisoned him in, I would've found it much more resonant.

26 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I hadn't thought of it that way but that's a great point. There was irony in Barry being about to finally own up to his past and turn himself in, only to get the "redemption" he dreamed of by being murdered, but not heroically. The movie was just getting it wrong, and it was hard to even see what exactly that would mean to John given that it seems his mother had been very straight with him in that hotel room. Sure, she wasn't giving him details, but she would have made it clear he wasn't a hero, so I wasn't sure if John was supposed to be fooled by the movie and see Barry as a hero with a tricky legacy.

[Starchild]

23 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

I hated that!  Poor Gene.

Gene was 1 part manipulation, 2 parts equivocation, 3 parts ego, and 4 parts bad choices. Hard to feel sorry for him.

[Demian]

1 hour ago, Galileo908 said:

Loved the image of Barry being strapped walking out of that store and nobody paying attention to him. Even got into his car with everything on him.

Agreed, and I also loved the music cues in that scene:  "Finally" and "More Than Words."  The last time I heard both pumped into a store as background Muzak was at a ShopRite on Staten Island (the one next to the mall, natch).  For some weird reason, they made perfect sense as background noise for a future Wal-Mart in Los Angeles where you can just walk out with an entire arms factory strapped to your back.

 

7 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

Sure, she wasn't giving him details, but she would have made it clear he wasn't a hero, so I wasn't sure if John was supposed to be fooled by the movie and see Barry as a hero with a tricky legacy.

Sally was still so blisteringly self-obsessed in that last sequence (and yet, so deeply distrustful of men), that I doubt she's spoken much to John about Barry after she sneaked out of the motel room.  I wonder how much Teen John remembers of that shoot-out, and Hank, and all of those others dying, and how much of his memory has been overwritten by his monstrously self-serving actress/director mother's version of those same events.

[DrSpaceman73]

So gene really pays the consequences for all that happens. 

Barry dies but his reputation is rewritten via the movie. 

Sally and the son escape. Fuchs escapes. 

Hank and cristobal....together again. 

Certainly tied up all the lose ends.  Pretty good finale even if it does seem unfair to Gene. 

[Irlandesa]

The casting for teen John was pretty good as Barry's son. 

The movie made me deeply uncomfortable and yet it somehow made all sorts of sense.  However, I think the show would have been better had it ended on Gene killing Barry. 

It's clear Gene spent his 8 years away learning how to shoot.  Barry's "oh wow" had a touch of admiration to it.

[sistermagpie]

9 minutes ago, Starchild said:

Gene was 1 part manipulation, 2 parts equivocation, 3 parts ego, and 4 parts bad choices. Hard to feel sorry for him.

 

2 minutes ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

Certainly tied up all the lose ends.  Pretty good finale even if it does seem unfair to Gene. 

It didn't have to be, though. Barry would have confessed all and saved him, but Gene chose to kill him and go to jail for both murders, one of which he actually did commit.

[Galileo908]

2 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

It's clear Gene spent his 8 years away learning how to shoot.  Barry's "oh wow" had a touch of admiration to it.

And made sure the gun worked this time. Considering the first time he tried it, the gun fell apart when he pulled the trigger.

[Dev F]

7 minutes ago, sistermagpie said:

The movie was just getting it wrong, and it was hard to even see what exactly that would mean to John given that it seems his mother had been very straight with him in that hotel room. Sure, she wasn't giving him details, but she would have made it clear he wasn't a hero, so I wasn't sure if John was supposed to be fooled by the movie and see Barry as a hero with a tricky legacy.

Yeah, there's also something sort of flat if Hollywood ends up embracing Barry because it's just factually mistaken about the kind of man he was. To me, what made the show's portrayal of L.A. positivity culture so interesting is that it characterized its misapprehension of men like Barry—and Gene, too, in a less extreme way—as a moral error as much as a factual error. It's not that no one suspected who Barry/Gene really was, it's that they saw his violence and entitlement as something interesting that was worth putting up with if only it could be harnessed for the benefit of their art. ("He yelled at us a few times, and, you know, he told us that he killed a few people in . . . some war, and that it really messed him up. But I don't think that makes him violent.") The final sequence reframes their willful blind eye as an ignorant blind eye, which to me is a much less interesting idea.

[Demian]

Just now, sistermagpie said:

Gene chose to kill him and go to jail for both murders, one of which he actually did commit.

Gene always has to be the main character in his own story -- and he needs to be in complete control of that story -- even if that means dying in prison for a murder he didn't commit.

When he was doom-scrolling through those items in The Hollywood Reporter and The Los Angeles Times, where other people were defining him and his story, I thought he was going to kill himself.  But then, Barry showed up and quite conveniently gave Gene an opportunity to reclaim his narrative -- which Gene did by shooting Barry in the head.  Gene's always been a monster, too.

[DrSpaceman73]

5 minutes ago, Dev F said:

Yeah, there's also something sort of flat if Hollywood ends up embracing Barry because it's just factually mistaken about the kind of man he was. To me, what made the show's portrayal of L.A. positivity culture so interesting is that it characterized its misapprehension of men like Barry—and Gene, too, in a less extreme way—as a moral error as much as a factual error. It's not that no one suspected who Barry/Gene really was, it's that they saw his violence and entitlement as something interesting that was worth putting up with if only it could be harnessed for the benefit of their art. ("He yelled at us a few times, and, you know, he told us that he killed a few people in . . . some war, and that it really messed him up. But I don't think that makes him violent.") The final sequence reframes their willful blind eye as an ignorant blind eye, which to me is a much less interesting idea.

It may he less intersting but it's truthful of Hollywood and how they create 'based on a true story' movies. They make the story people want and that makes money, not the truth in any way.  

[sistermagpie]

1 minute ago, DrSpaceman73 said:

It may he less intersting but it's truthful of Hollywood and how they create 'based on a true story' movies. They make the story people want and that makes money, not the truth in any way.  

Buy to be fair, the story DevF is talking about is also really popular. It's the antihero drama that the show's spoofing. It's especially popular on TV. Even Network TV--look at characters like House.

[shapeshifter]

8 minutes ago, Demian said:

Gene's always been a monster, too.

Were we supposed to see a kinder, gentler Gene when he was with Janice?

[Demian]

5 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Were we supposed to see a kinder, gentler Gene when he was with Janice?

I'd have to go back and watch those scenes, quite honestly, because it's been years since they aired.  The most recent scenes with Gene have been, in my opinion, all about him exploiting his supposed sorrow over her death.

[SHD]

It would’ve been really funny if Daniel Day Lewis really did show up in that movie.

[Demian]

Just now, SHD said:

It would’ve been really funny if Daniel Day Lewis really did show up in that movie.

I was totally expecting that, and was terribly disappointed when it didn't happen.

[Galileo908]

11 minutes ago, Demian said:

I'd have to go back and watch those scenes, quite honestly, because it's been years since they aired.  The most recent scenes with Gene have been, in my opinion, all about him exploiting his supposed sorrow over her death.

Same. But if I remember right, that relationship didn't last that long to begin with, right?

[aghst]

1 hour ago, juno said:

Somehow I feel like Ted Lasso season 3 parallels Barry's season 4.

They both started in one place and ended up in a completely different place.

What started off as a dark comedy turned into a dark drama that had no joy or fun left at the end. Like Ted Lasso's season 2, I will end Barry at season 3.

Yeah, they didn't stick the landing.

The tone is so starkly different from the pilot and the first season, where they deftly moved from comic to dramatic moments.

This season but especially this finale was devoid of humor.  If they attempted one joke or one comic moment in this finale, I didn't see it.  Maybe some of the soldiers writhing on the ground was meant to be comic?  I don't know.

Gene became grim, because he was screwed over, Hank became this monster in that one scene, his face changed from sorrow to this desire for vengeance -- great acting there.

Sarah Goldberg was interviewed by Slate's Working podcast, talked about her career a bit and said Barry was about morality.

That in the end is what this show became, kind of a morality play, almost as clumsy as the movie they showed, which didn't have any humor either.

Succession had its series finale and they reserved some moments of humor, even though for the most part, ugly emotions came to the fore among the main characters in that show.

I get the sense that they started with this humorous premise about a hitman becoming an actor and as the show received all kinds of acclaim, they worried about sticking the landing and not doing what shows like The Sopranos had done, where bad people weren't really punished.

So they kind of overcompensated and while Barry gets comeuppance, Gene undeservedly gets railroaded and ends up in prison probably for the rest of his life, with his son and probably his grandson believing that he was a murderer who tried to kill his own son to cover up his tracks.

Hate the way Cousineau's fate unfolded.

[aghst]

1 hour ago, Starchild said:

Gene was 1 part manipulation, 2 parts equivocation, 3 parts ego, and 4 parts bad choices. Hard to feel sorry for him.

 

He was an asshole.

But he didn't have Janice killed as he was going to be prosecuted for and put away.

He was victimized until he decided to take matters into his own hands, though why wouldn't his lawyer say he was scared of Barry, a professional killer, who had abducted him and threatened to kill him?

 

 

[PinkRibbons]

I found Hank's death so fascinating, because he looked so terrified at the end, like he was seeing the Angel of Death and it was not wearing its peaceful face.

Were they implying that Sally and John ended up in Canada? All those "Theatre"s made me wonder.

[Slade347]

I thought the season was overall a mixed bag, but the finale was damn near perfect, imo. I think I liked it more than the other big finale that aired tonight. I also laughed quite a bit during this episode and I can't quite understand the suggestions that it lacked humor.

[Pike Ludwell]

When Sally was telling her son, John, that she'd killed a man, why oh why didn't she say it was in self defense -- he would've killed her but she got lucky and defeated him. And it really seems kind of odd for her to be so tortured about it for so long. Would she rather that he killed her? I realize her tortured mind was a plot device and some really neurotic people might feel like her, but I view it as really odd.

[oldCJ]

3 minutes ago, Pike Ludwell said:

When Sally was telling her son, John, that she'd killed a man, why oh why didn't she say it was in self defense

It stops being self-defense when you continue to bash away at the person until blood and guts are flying everywhere. Then it is overkill. Sally knows rage was driving her actions, which were far beyond what was sufficient to protect herself. She wasn’t bashing him to pieces out of a fear for her safety. 

[Taget]

 Gonna miss this show.  Loved the ending with the fake movie.  One last skewering of Hollywood.  It got everything wrong and created a fake cliche narrative.  Whenever you hear the words "based on a true story" it means yeah a lot of it is just made up.

 

Edited May 29, 2023 by Taget

[Pike Ludwell]

23 minutes ago, oldCJ said:

It stops being self-defense when you continue to bash away at the person until blood and guts are flying everywhere. Then it is overkill. Sally knows rage was driving her actions, which were far beyond what was sufficient to protect herself. She wasn’t bashing him to pieces out of a fear for her safety. 

He'd tried to kill her and as I recall he was still up and about and looking strong after she stuck that object through his head. She was justified in making sure he wasn't a threat. Plus heat of passion anger and going overboard after he nearly killed her is not something to obsess over and hate yourself for the rest of your life. And to not tell the son these extenuating circumstances was weird. Sorry, I don't buy that her feelings on this were normal.

Edited May 29, 2023 by Pike Ludwell

[Amarsir]

2 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

The movie was just getting it wrong, and it was hard to even see what exactly that would mean to John given that it seems his mother had been very straight with him in that hotel room. Sure, she wasn't giving him details, but she would have made it clear he wasn't a hero, so I wasn't sure if John was supposed to be fooled by the movie and see Barry as a hero with a tricky legacy.

Movie-Barry did murder people, but heroically. I think John has enough to believe what he wants to believe.

I mean, presumably the movie had to cover the 8 years of being a fugitive and why he came back. So it's all pretty much explained away, if Sally didn't give enough details to refute it.

[mrc12671]

For me, it was a finale of two halfs.

The first half was IN-CREDIBLE.

 

The second half was complete dog excrement.  I understood what they were going for but I just didn't think they landed it at all...and that really bums me out.

[thuganomics85]

Figured there was going to be some goners here but I did not predict that Fuches would actually not only make it our alive but seem to walk away from all of this.  That guy truly knows how to survive!  Stephen Root is always a treasure.

Figured NoHo was doomed though.  Sad about it, but it is a fitting end for him considering his line of work.  Underneath all of the charm, goofiness, and delightful attitude, he was still a criminal that did awful things and it was likely always going to either end in death or prison.  Not sure if he will actually see Cristobal again (even if an afterlife exists), but at least his final thoughts were about him.  Anthony Carrigan crushed it as always and I'm glad the show kept him around after NoHo was initially suppose to die in the pilot.

Sally gets a somewhat happy ending by taking John and fleeing somewhere (Canada?)  But I'm guessing that scene with her turning down the other teacher's offer for coffee was suppose to show she is a loner now: at least when it comes to any romance?  At least she seems to be happy teaching those kids.

But Barry Freaking Berkman, y'all!  Gets his brains blown out!!  By fucking Gene!!!  Even he clearly didn't see that coming.  And it was right after he was planning on turning himself in, so instead Gene is now in prison because everyone still thinks he was the true ringleader behind Janice's death.  Even has a low-rent film about it and everything!  I see that they couldn't get Daniel Day Lewis or Mark Wahlberg for this one, Jim Cummings was an interesting choice for Gene.

I can definitely see why some didn't care for how the show changed from where it initially started, but I enjoyed the hell out of the ride and can't wait to see what Bill Hader does next.  Always loved him in SNL and his film/television roles before, but this show has shown that he is multitalented and his mind is brimming with unique and interesting ideas.  Even when it doesn't quite hit the mark, it always impresses me and I think we could end up being one of the best creative minds out there going forward.  For that alone, this show is a major win, but I generally think it was a great dark comedy that wasn't afraid to take risks.  Gold star to Hader and company!

[Fake Jan Brady]

1 hour ago, thuganomics85 said:

Sally gets a somewhat happy ending by taking John and fleeing somewhere (Canada?) 

Maybe not so happy for John.

JOHN: Love you.

SALLY: Was it OK? It was good, wasn't it?

Never change, Sally, never change.

[Starchild]

8 hours ago, aghst said:

He was an asshole.

But he didn't have Janice killed as he was going to be prosecuted for and put away.

He was victimized until he decided to take matters into his own hands, though why wouldn't his lawyer say he was scared of Barry, a professional killer, who had abducted him and threatened to kill him?

Regardless, he did kill an unarmed man who was no threat to him at that moment, presuming Tom told the truth at trial that Barry was going to give himself up for Janice's murder in order to help Gene. And without Barry there was no one to confirm that Gene didn't have Janice killed. If he'd just taken a moment to speak to Barry it could have all been different. Clearly he couldn't come back from that last bad decision.

 

2 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Figured there was going to be some goners here but I did not predict that Fuches would actually not only make it our alive but seem to walk away from all of this.  That guy truly knows how to survive!  Stephen Root is always a treasure.

Figured NoHo was doomed though.  Sad about it, but it is a fitting end for him considering his line of work.  Underneath all of the charm, goofiness, and delightful attitude, he was still a criminal that did awful things and it was likely always going to either end in death or prison.  Not sure if he will actually see Cristobal again (even if an afterlife exists), but at least his final thoughts were about him.  Anthony Carrigan crushed it as always and I'm glad the show kept him around after NoHo was initially suppose to die in the pilot.

Sally gets a somewhat happy ending by taking John and fleeing somewhere (Canada?)  But I'm guessing that scene with her turning down the other teacher's offer for coffee was suppose to show she is a loner now: at least when it comes to any romance?  At least she seems to be happy teaching those kids.

Re: Fuches getting away, I would have felt cheated about that, since he was so horrible, but at the end there he got that incredible epiphany about himself that was amazing to watch.

Re: Hank, I also wonder what he saw that gave him such a strong, seemingly negative, emotion. Perhaps an interview will let us know.

Re: Sally, that smile of hers in the car at the end seemed so desperate that I was expecting her to wrench the steering wheel and drive off a bridge or something.  

[BC4ME]

10 hours ago, Demian said:

Agreed, and I also loved the music cues in that scene:  "Finally" and "More Than Words."  The last time I heard both pumped into a store as background Muzak was at a ShopRite on Staten Island (the one next to the mall, natch).  For some weird reason, they made perfect sense as background noise for a future Wal-Mart in Los Angeles where you can just walk out with an entire arms factory strapped to your back.

And through the Kids' Toy section. The contrast, plus being actually plausible made that a great scene. 

[pasdetrois]

9 hours ago, Demian said:

The most recent scenes with Gene have been, in my opinion, all about him exploiting his supposed sorrow over her death.

Some of the funniest scenes have been when Gene, deep in self-righteousness, turns on a dime and abandons his stance when there's the possibility of a production.

[DrSpaceman73]

I think expecting this to be a dark comedy throught is something viewers forced on it in many ways. So the ending not having that is your fault not Bill haders or the writers. 

This topic bugs me in general and I've mentioned it on many threads and shows. The 'dark comedy' label gets thrown around now for any drama with a few jokes tosses in and often doesn't apply. Even emmy winning and nominated comedies. If the sopranos was on now it would be called such a show. 

This was a drama. Yes it had some funny moments but still a drama. The writers decided not to force in any funny moments that weren't there. 

White lotus and Atlanta are two others as well. They're dramas funny elements yes but at the core ....

Still dramas.  And the ending is pretty much what I expected except for Gene going down for the murder. 

Edited May 29, 2023 by DrSpaceman73

[SoMuchTV]

12 hours ago, Galileo908 said:

Loved the image of Barry being strapped walking out of that store and nobody paying attention to him. Even got into his car with everything on him.

 

11 hours ago, Demian said:

Agreed, and I also loved the music cues in that scene:  "Finally" and "More Than Words."  The last time I heard both pumped into a store as background Muzak was at a ShopRite on Staten Island (the one next to the mall, natch).  For some weird reason, they made perfect sense as background noise for a future Wal-Mart in Los Angeles where you can just walk out with an entire arms factory strapped to your back.

Yikes.  As a resident of one of the communities that have had recent mass shootings at a big box store where the employees wear blue vests, that scene (sorry for the pun) triggered me!

[WAnglais1]

First of all, I did not care for the finale or this season.

However, I believe Fuches got to walk away because he had the self-awareness of who he was, or wasn't, in his case. No one else who died did. Root is really a fantastic actor who can do anything.

Winkler was also stellar across the series. Gene was full of contradictions, ego, and the things that make us human. I can't think of anyone who could've done that better.

When I used to shop at Walmart, every now and then there would be an announcement of, "I need a manager to the gun room. I need a manager to the gunroom." Barry walking out with all the firearms he didn't use was funny and horrifying. And no one giving him a second look? The sign at WMT usually reads "Please refrain from openly carrying firearms." I guess it's a "Serving Suggestion."

Barry dying and then getting memorialized (incorrectly) in the movie was the most American thing ever in this show. And I did think Gene had offed himself close to the end. 

For a previous poster: "Theatre" is where you watch a play. That's how I've always spelled it, anyway. "Theater" is a movie place. 

[shelley1234]

11 hours ago, Starchild said:

Gene was 1 part manipulation, 2 parts equivocation, 3 parts ego, and 4 parts bad choices. Hard to feel sorry for him.

Gene's own hubris and intense need to be relevant and validated ended up being his undoing.   If he never came back and centered himself in Barry's story...Barry wouldn't have come back.   He put that all in motion and it ended with Barry dead, but the hero.  Oh Gene.  

I loved that Hader got the direct the final one and see this story out.  It was the cherry on the top of this violent glorious ride.  

[sjankis630]

1 hour ago, pasdetrois said:

Some of the funniest scenes have been when Gene, deep in self-righteousness, turns on a dime and abandons his stance when there's the possibility of a production.

The scene from a previous season (3)? when Gene was about to kick Barry out of the program.

As I remember it Gene was all "Barry this is not working out....."

Barry"Mr Couiseneau I am going to use you as an inspiration for this character.."

Gene. "Go on......"

I am misremembering it I am sure but I remember it being hilarious.

 

[carrps]

O.k. I loved it. I thought the other big finale of the night was flaccid and bloated...and interminable. It felt like hours. While Barry's finale packed so much in.

When Fuches walked John out after the massacre it reminded me of John Huston with Faye Dunaway's daughter/sister at the end of the Chinatown. But Fuches just walked John to safety. Phew. Stephen Root is a treasure. His face in the car driving to Noho's was such a contrast to Barry's.

Oh, wow, indeed. Gene's Rip Torn Chekhov's gun came out in the end after all.

 

[iMonrey]

11 hours ago, PinkRibbons said:

Were they implying that Sally and John ended up in Canada? All those "Theatre"s made me wonder.

I don't know, but that was the fakest looking fake snow on her car that I have ever seen on TV. It looked like dryer lint.

This ending really worked for me. I haven't been crazy about the darker tone these last two seasons took overall but I did find this ending satisfying, in a way that I did not with Succession. I got closure. I don't feel like there are dangling plot points left unresolved.

I really enjoyed the conceit of Barry's story getting the Hollywood treatment, and the glimpses we got of that movie. The cherry on top was the captions at the end telling us what really happened to Gene and Barry. That just made me smile. Not because they got what they deserved, but just that it felt right it ended that way.

Quote

This topic bugs me in general and I've mentioned it on many threads and shows. The 'dark comedy' label gets thrown around now for any drama with a few jokes tosses in and often doesn't apply. Even emmy winning and nominated comedies. If the sopranos was on now it would be called such a show. 

This was a drama. Yes it had some funny moments but still a drama. The writers decided not to force in any funny moments that weren't there. 

I agree with your first point about "dark comedy" and "dramedy" being thrown around a lot and over-used. However, I strongly disagree that this was always straight drama. The first two seasons are easily 50% comedy 50% drama. It's only these last two seasons that have gotten darker. There's a reason a lot of people have complained it's not as funny as it used to be. Now, maybe it's just the natural progression for a story like this to get darker and darker, but it sure didn't start out that way, no matter how many times Bill Hader insists it did. If it was always meant to be dark and brooding then maybe they shouldn't have made the first two seasons so funny.

Edited May 29, 2023 by iMonrey

[Starchild]

16 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I don't know, but that was the fakest looking fake snow on her car that I have ever seen on TV. It looked like dryer lint.

There's worse. You need to watch an episode of Bonanza set in winter. I swear they just used soap.