S12.E06: Episode 6

[OtterMommy]

UK Air date: February 5, 2023
US Air date: April 23, 2023

Trixie supports an underage mother through a difficult time, Monica Joan welcomes an unusual guest to Nonnatus House, and Sister Veronica spearheads a new council initiative.

[txhorns79]

I just thank God that nothing bad happened with the adorable dog. 

We also got a three way contest this week for worst parent possible.  You have the mom who thinks it's a fun joke to give her daughter the nickname "mistake."  You have the mom who just abandons her three kids to live in filth and squalor because of the dad's skin issues and then you have the dad with the skin issues who is seemingly okay with his young child working himself to near death because dad is embarrassed over his skin condition.   

[txhorns79]

7 hours ago, LtKelley said:

 

1. Children working was viewed MUCH differently even after the 1960s. I had a paper route in the mid 1980s and I suspect my parents would have cps called on them because I was VERY young - nine - and was technically not really employed but helping my brother and sister with their routes. I don't think they'd ever allow the things I had to do  - namely collecting money at private homes, now.  What this kid was doing wasn't that terrible, the poor thing was just also dying of leukemia.

The problem wasn't his paper route.  It was that he was acting as the sole support for his family.  They noted he was also missing school to try and make money.   

[Badger]

Scenes they cut out:

They cut a scene of Trixie on the phone talking to Nigel who is telling her about Heather being in labor.  She says Heather isn't on their books, but that she will be there right away.

They cut a scene right before Heather gives birth of Sr. Veronica at the Buckle's shop asking Violet if she can have her slot at the surgery Thursday night.  Violet says no because it's important for her constituents to speak to her.  Sr. Veronica says that they (the people taking part in the clinic) are also her constituents, and it's a council initiative.  Violet says they can have the slot after hers which belongs to the Spanish dancing teacher who is on holiday.  She also says she will see that Fred takes part with his paper boys.  Sr. Veronica says "paper boys?" and looks rather concerned.

They cut a scene right after Dr. Turner and Nurse Crane are telling Heather they have to notify her parents about the baby.  Violet is in Cyril and Lucille's flat and he tells her that his stitches have been removed, and the nurse says he is doing well.  He and Lucille have decided that it will be a good use of their savings for him to buy a ticket to Jamaica; he has holiday and sick leave so it will be two weeks. She asks when is he going.  He says Nurse Crane is driving him to the airport in the morning.

Violet says that she can't think of anything better than for him to be in the sun with the person he loves and for them to sort out any problems.

They cut out part of the scene with everyone having a meal at Nonnatus House. Right after Sr. Monica Joan says her heart always falls at the sight of sliced spam, Nancy says Colette loves it and that she tried spam fritters last week; she hands the plate to Matthew.  He says it's new for him too but you should try things once; he thanks Nancy.  Sr. Monica Joan sweetly admonishes him that gratitude should wait until after partaking. Sure enough, he takes a bite and it's clear he doesn't like it.  Trixie smiles as he drinks some water.

Phyllis then enters and says she has just taken Cyril to Heathrow.  Sr. Julienne says she hopes the trip is beneficial and that they see them both very soon.

They cut part of the scene at the clinic.  Dr. Turner is examining a young black boy who has a rash on his throat which he says he's had since halfway through the holidays. Dr. Turner weighs him and says he is very underweight.  He asks how often he eats.  He cheerfully answers he tries to eat at least once a day.  Dr. Turner gives him medicine for his rash and informs him Sr. Veronica can tell him about free school dinners.

They cut to the beginning of the scene where Patrick tells Shelagh that Joey has leukemia. 
Angela, May, and Teddy all have wet heads wrapped in towels as if they'd all had their hair washed.  Shelagh says in a very chirpy voice, "Less than a week back and you've all got nits.  That must be a record."  The children giggle.  Dr. Turner, who has been on the phone, asks her to turn off the television, and she sends the children upstairs with a warning not to touch their hair.  They all groan.

 

[Blackie]

I liked this week better as far as the pacing and the amount of time spent on the main stories..... but they totally cut out Cyril!!!!!! They prob could have cut back on the SR MJ dog story so at least we would know what happeded to Cyril.

I guess the theme was minors had no say in their medical treatments or rights to their own children.

I liked the Grandpa, hope he was using unleaded paint on that crib......future episode of CTM.

[Jodithgrace]

I can’t believe they left out an entire sub plot about Cyrill going to Jamaica!
 

I knew that paper boy had leukemia as soon as I got a good look at him. Poor kid. The prognosis was pretty horrible back then. Was it a kindness to not tell him? I’m always of two minds about that. 
 

When Heather was in labor, I had no idea she was only a teen, though the father looked young. It was only later after she was in the hospital that she looked her age. 
 

I was sure Trixie and Matthew were going to elope after missing deadlines for this and that, though I guess he was able to get the order of service in on time, so it was only the bridesmaid crisis left to be sorted. Luckily Violet can do “Hauty Couture.” 
 

 

[MMEButterfly]

On 4/2/2023 at 11:02 PM, txhorns79 said:

I just thank God that nothing bad happened with the adorable dog. 

We also got a three way contest this week for worst parent possible.  You have the mom who thinks it's a fun joke to give her daughter the nickname "mistake."  You have the mom who just abandons her three kids to live in filth and squalor because of the dad's skin issues and then you have the dad with the skin issues who is seemingly okay with his young child working himself to near death because dad is embarrassed over his skin condition.   

I so enjoyed this week. I liked the stories. I’ve kind lost interest in Cyril because I’ve anticipated his departure.

[JustDucky]

I'm sorry... they cut Cyril out completely?!?  Fnarr...

I could see the paper boy's illness coming a mile away.  The absent mother was a bit of a twist, but seeing he was truly ill (and not just working himself to exhaustion) was obvious.  Another story I'd like for them to return to - will he beat the odds and survive and become a doctor, perhaps learning under Tim's wing in the future?  

I know I was supposed to buy into Heather's parents coming around and redeeming themselves and her forgiving them for calling her a "Mistake"... but nope.  I've seen people like Heather reach out for love/affection when they don't get it at home, with similar results, and I was kind of holding a grudge against them for that reason alone.  (Although Mom was worse than Dad.  Ugh.)

As much as I like Sister MJ when they give her something to do... adopting a stray while she was feeling lonely was not it.  Seeing how helpful she was during the dysentery episode, you'd think they'd hold her in higher regard.  I did like how clever she was in regards with Nothing's name, though.

And as much as I am on Team Just Elope Already when things go sideways in wedding planning (in real life as well as fiction), I want to see Trixie as a bride.  

[howiveaddict]

Childhood leukemia was still a death sentence in 1968.  I googled and actually 1968 was the year the first survivor would make it to adulthood years later.  I think the 3 year survival was 25 percent.  A doctor at St Jude's is the one who came up with the breakthrough treatment regimen that would bring about a cure.  The child would have to suffer a cocktail of chemotherapy drugs intravenous along with radiation to the head and spine and chemotherapy inserted into the head and spine.  

[Shermie]

As soon as I saw Joey’s pale face, dark circles and then he said he was tired, I knew he had leukaemia. And yeah, a death sentence in those days. 

As much as I sympathize with the father being ashamed of his skin condition, surely he could work at the docks or something. A job where you’re not around the public and there are other guys who are also rough around the edges. Can’t believe that mother would leave her kids behind when she walked out on her husband.

And yeah, calling your child “Mistake” as a nickname? Surprise pregnancies were pretty common back then; I hardly think women planned their pregnancies in the 40s and 50s (when that mother had her children). Most kids would qualify as “mistakes” at that time. 

59 minutes ago, JustDucky said:

And as much as I am on Team Just Elope Already when things go sideways in wedding planning (in real life as well as fiction), I want to see Trixie as a bride

Yes, this. I would like to see someone on tv plan a wedding where things just go as planned. I also want to see Trixie as a bride; I’m guessing that will be the season finale.

That dog was so cute, and I’m not much of a dog person. I think Sister MJ should have a small dog or a cat as a companion. And to feed the Spam to. Ugh, how can people eat that garbage?

[BooksRule]

2 hours ago, Badger said:

They cut out part of the scene with everyone having a meal at Nonnatus House. Right after Sr. Monica Joan says her heart always falls at the sight of sliced spam, Nancy says Colette loves it and that she tried spam fritters last week; she hands the plate to Matthew.  He says it's new for him too but you should try things once; he thanks Nancy.  Sr. Monica Joan sweetly admonishes him that gratitude should wait until after partaking. Sure enough, he takes a bite and it's clear he doesn't like it.  Trixie smiles as he drinks some water.

Spam is pretty tasty if you fry up the slices. I enjoy a nice fried Spam sandwich (on white bread with mayo) on a rare occasion.  It's kind of gross if you just plunk it down on a plate right out of the can and slice it up. 

That poor little boy with leukemia.  Like others, I knew what he had as soon as his symptoms were revealed.  The actor did a good job--he looked like he was really sick and so tired.

[Quilt Fairy]

10 minutes ago, Shermie said:

And to feed the Spam to. Ugh, how can people eat that garbage?

I like Spam.  Lots of people do.  

[Sarah 103]

2 hours ago, Jodithgrace said:

I knew that paper boy had leukemia as soon as I got a good look at him.

I was pretty sure it was going to be leukemia when I saw what looked like bruises. 

43 minutes ago, Shermie said:

As much as I sympathize with the father being ashamed of his skin condition, surely he could work at the docks or something. A job where you’re not around the public and there are other guys who are also rough around the edges. Can’t believe that mother would leave her kids behind when she walked out on her husband.

I can understand a woman leaving her husband and children if he's drunk, or abusive, or constantly having affairs. Leaving him because he has a skin condition that isn't contagious makes her seem like an awful, selfish, petty, superficial person. I thought for certain there was more to the story that was a deleted scene, but apparently not. 

43 minutes ago, Shermie said:

And yeah, calling your child “Mistake” as a nickname? Surprise pregnancies were pretty common back then; I hardly think women planned their pregnancies in the 40s and 50s (when that mother had her children). Most kids would qualify as “mistakes” at that time. 

Agreed. However, while it may have been common, that didn't mean the mother had to like it or accept it. Clearly she didn't want more children and resented having to go through it all again, and deal with another child for 16-18 years. All I could think of was the lyric from West Side Story  (I think the lyric is slightly different between broadway version and 1961 movie, and I can't remember which version is used is the most recent movie version) "They didn't want to have me, but somehow I has had/Leapin' lizards that's why I'm so bad." 

[JustDucky]

We don't have "Mistakes" in our family.  We have "Surprises".

My youngest uncle was one (they were gonna stop at seven!).  My kid was one.  My mom's aunt (who is her age, so maybe she was one too) had one.

We may make Mistakes with what we do as/with adults, but kids are always a Surprise.  Not their fault.

[3 is enough]

That dog was adorable.

I figured Joey had leukemia.  Hard to believe they would not tell him.  He wasn’t stupid.  He knew it was serious given how he felt and his treatment.

[caitmcg]

1 hour ago, Shermie said:

As much as I sympathize with the father being ashamed of his skin condition

My sympathy only goes so far, given that he apparently hadn’t even tried to have it checked out. He told his son to go to the working children's clinic, but he won’t go to the doctor himself.

1 hour ago, Shermie said:

Surprise pregnancies were pretty common back then; I hardly think women planned their pregnancies in the 40s and 50s (when that mother had her children). Most kids would qualify as “mistakes” at that time. 

Except my own Catholic grandparents, who managed to have five evenly spaced over the course of around a dozen years. My mother told me she considered my father’s mother highly disciplined, and figured she must be, given that!

[Shermie]

8 hours ago, JustDucky said:

We don't have "Mistakes" in our family.  We have "Surprises".

That reminds me of a lovely conversation from the show, Roseanne. The youngest kid, DJ, was told by one of sisters that he was an accident. (Paraphrased below since it was 30 years ago)

DJ: Becky said I was an accident.

Roseanne: You weren’t an accident, you were a surprise.

DJ: What’s the difference?

Roseanne: An accident is something you don’t want and try to avoid, but a surprise is something you didn’t know you wanted until you received it.

9 hours ago, LtKelley said:

cut the Spam into chunks, fry it, then plop in the eggs to fry/scramble. Throw on some cheese and maybe onions and broccoli and its theoretically good for you!

That sounds delicious and healthy if the Spam wasn’t in there. Sorry, it’s processed meat in a can; nothing natural or healthy about it. It’s a make-do product for desperate situations, like war rations. Why buy a square of “meat” in a can when you can buy real meat?

[Straycat80]

I was surprised everyone wanted the 15 year, unmarried teen girl to keep her baby when at first she didn’t want to and stated she wasn’t ready to be a mother. I thought in 1968 the mindset was that you gave the baby up for adoption. I’m glad it worked out in the end.

I might be in the minority but I wanted Sister MJ to keep the little dog. 
Doesn’t Trixie have other friends who could be bridesmaids? I think it’s nice she asked Nancy and Colette to be in her wedding. 

[Orcinus orca]

6 minutes ago, Straycat80 said:

I might be in the minority but I wanted Sister MJ to keep the little dog. 
Doesn’t Trixie have other friends who could be bridesmaids? I think it’s nice she asked Nancy and Colette to be in her wedding. 

I thought the dog was adorable and I'm not quite sure why the "no animals allowed" rule.  Supposedly it's a medical establishment but the underside of that dusty, cobwebbed cabinet didn't look all that "hospital sterile" to me.  (Note to self:  check under the furniture pronto.)

I doubt Trixie has any other friends other than the midwives.  All of her time off is now spent with her fiance and she lives at Nonnatus so where would she meet anyone else?  Maybe she had friends from nursing school but she's been at Nonnatus for a lot of years now so probably lost touch.

[libgirl2]

First of all, Spam is a favorite in our house. I air fry it. 

I enjoyed the episode but WTF about cutting out Cyril? Is he just going to show up in a scene saying he was in Jamaica or is he just not coming back and no one will mention him again? 

I guess I was one of the few that didn't realize the kid had leukemia right away. The actor was very good. Fred choking up was very moving. 

And I'm so glad that dog did not get hurt or die! 

[dubbel zout]

9 hours ago, 3 is enough said:

I figured Joey had leukemia.  Hard to believe they would not tell him.  He wasn’t stupid.  He knew it was serious given how he felt and his treatment.

Especially since Dr. Turner made a point of saying to Shelagh that the side effects were brutal. I can't imagine Joey wouldn't figure something out.

Cutting out Cyril's departure was dumb. It would have drawn a line under that story.

[Daff]

9 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

can understand a woman leaving her husband and children if he's drunk, or abusive, or constantly having affairs. Leaving him because he has a skin condition that isn't contagious makes her seem like an awful, selfish, petty, superficial person. I thought for certain there was more to the story that was a deleted scene, but apparently not. 

That’s the way it came across, but for him to take to his bed, never rising, essentially helpless, points to much more than a skin condition..it was only the outward, visible excuse. I believe the mom left because she understood this as well, furthering his decline and adoption of helplessness. (Seemed like a “Mrs. Hall” type situation). At least he wasn’t exacerbating the problem with alcohol abuse. He undoubtedly was suffering from severe clinical depression, if not even worse mental disability (agoraphobia, perhaps). 

[Daff]

I think we’re all furious that our (probable) last view of Cyril was cut! Chances are, he’ll find a job to use that CE degree and license while he’s there and decide to stay. Hopefully, Lucille’s family got her over the depression.

Lots of people eat canned ham and think nothing of it. Spam is just spiced (chopped up and reformed) ham in a can. I’ve never had it as nothing that was fed to service members during the war ever made it into our kitchen. My dad had a special aversion to any type of breading/coating on meat-wouldn’t even eat fried chicken. 

[jschoolgirl]

1 hour ago, Orcinus orca said:

I doubt Trixie has any other friends other than the midwives.  All of her time off is now spent with her fiance and she lives at Nonnatus so where would she meet anyone else?  Maybe she had friends from nursing school but she's been at Nonnatus for a lot of years now so probably lost touch.

I wish they would bring back Jenny, Chummy, Val, and any I've missed back as bridesmaids. Cynthia, too. She left the religious community in real life at some point.

18 minutes ago, Daff said:

Seemed like a “Mrs. Hall” type situation

What is this?

[Daff]

Oh, and Nothing was adorable. I especially loved that he barked and circled, looking at Sr. MJ as if to say, “See, these are my people!  Thanks, Gotta go now.”

[Daff]

4 minutes ago, jschoolgirl said:

I wish they would bring back Jenny, Chummy, Val, and any I've missed back as bridesmaids. Cynthia, too. She left the religious community in real life at some point.

What is this?

Sorry, in All Creatures, Mrs. Hall left her PTSD affected husband, not because she didn’t love him anymore, but because continuing to live with him became untenable-she was unable to help him, and she was deteriorating as well, because of it.

[iMonrey]

If they had to cut something, they could have cut the scene where the doctor is extracting bone marrow from poor Joey. Yikes, I had to look away during that scene.

Quote

As much as I sympathize with the father being ashamed of his skin condition, surely he could work at the docks or something. A job where you’re not around the public and there are other guys who are also rough around the edges.

They have made a point of telling us there is no work to be had down at the docks anymore and that Poplar is "dead" because of it. It's why Matthew's father wanted to sell their properties there.

[MaryHedwig]

3 hours ago, Orcinus orca said:

I doubt Trixie has any other friends other than the midwives.  All of her time off is now spent with her fiance and she lives at Nonnatus so where would she meet anyone else?  Maybe she had friends from nursing school but she's been at Nonnatus for a lot of years now so probably lost touch

I bet she has friends from the 12-step program.

[kwnyc]

4 hours ago, Shermie said:

It’s a make-do product for desperate situations, like war rations. Why buy a square of “meat” in a can when you can buy real meat?

Because some people can't afford real meat. And some cultures include it in their cooking as a main ingredient.

Also, psoriasis is still an issue for a lot of people. There are now a lot of biologics to treat it, but so many people either don't have good insurance, or their insurance won't pay for it here in the US. (As a dedicated watcher of Dr. Pimple Popper, she sees a lot of people who can't afford treatment for their issues, or their doctor doesn't know what to do).

But yeah, the mom up and left the kids...never checked up on them? That's cold. Does that mean she'll leave her dying kid when the going gets rough?

I also don't see the teen mom returning home with her parents to be a tenable situation. The mother will get mad and start emotionally abusing her again. And the kid is 15! 

Both major plotlines were downers.

Edited April 24, 2023 by kwnyc

[JudyObscure]

4 hours ago, Straycat80 said:

I was surprised everyone wanted the 15 year, unmarried teen girl to keep her baby when at first she didn’t want to and stated she wasn’t ready to be a mother. I thought in 1968 the mindset was that you gave the baby up for adoption. I’m glad it worked out in the end.

 

My best friend had a baby in 1968,  while not married,  and "putting up for adoption," was so expected I don't remember any discussion at all over the possibility of keeping it.  She was 21 and starting her final year of college.  

[statsgirl]

I remember seeing Spam in grocery stores in Canada in the 60s.  It's pretty foul straight up like that but fried, it's yummy.

When I was in high school in 1970, two girls in my class had babies. Both were given up for adoption, of course. One of the girls later married her boyfriend after university and they had 3 more children, I don't know if they connected their first child or not though.

Nice continuity of Heather's story following on Shelagh's suspected pregnancy last episode. This is what can happen if it's a baby and not menopause.

SMJ needs a dog. Or a cat, which is less work.

On 4/2/2023 at 11:02 PM, txhorns79 said:

We also got a three way contest this week for worst parent possible.  You have the mom who thinks it's a fun joke to give her daughter the nickname "mistake."  You have the mom who just abandons her three kids to live in filth and squalor because of the dad's skin issues and then you have the dad with the skin issues who is seemingly okay with his young child working himself to near death because dad is embarrassed over his skin condition.   

From my time at a child and family clinic, the parents who thought that calling their daughter "Mistake" was funny is all too common. For some people, children are just possessions, not people.

The father of the other family said that he couldn't get a job because of his skin condition, and he was afraid that if he sought treatment and social services was called, the children would be taken away and have to grow up in a home with the same awful experience that he had. Kudos to the makeup people, the boy really looked sick.

I don't understand the mother at all, nor the father being happy that she came back other than for the boys' sake. To completely abandon her children like that when she knows that the father can't work is beyond belief if she actually cares for them.

 

[mmecorday]

Quote

I just thank God that nothing bad happened with the adorable dog.

Adorable being the operative word here. I felt sorry for Sister Monica Joan when the real owners turned up, but seeing their joy in being reunited with Nothing was very sweet. I laughed out loud when Sister Julienne saw the dog's tail wagging behind SMJ's habit. 

Quote

A doctor at St Jude's is the one who came up with the breakthrough treatment regimen that would bring about a cure.

And that is why a big chunk of my tax return is always earmarked for St. Jude's. 

[libgirl2]

13 minutes ago, mmecorday said:

Adorable being the operative word here. I felt sorry for Sister Monica Joan when the real owners turned up, but seeing their joy in being reunited with Nothing was very sweet. I laughed out loud when Sister Julienne saw the dog's tail wagging behind SMJ's habit. 

 

I did laugh out loud at that! 

56 minutes ago, kwnyc said:

Because some people can't afford real meat. And some cultures include it in their cooking as a main ingredient.

Also, psoriasis is still an issue for a lot of people. There are now a lot of biologics to treat it, but so many people either don't have good insurance, or their insurance won't pay for it here in the US. (As a dedicated watcher of Dr. Pimple Popper, she sees a lot of people who can't afford treatment for their issues, or their doctor doesn't know what to do).

But yeah, the mom up and left the kids...never checked up on them? That's cold. Does that mean she'll leave her dying kid when the going gets rough?

I also don't see the teen mom returning home with her parents to be a tenable situation. The mother will get mad and start emotionally abusing her again. And the kid is 15! 

Both major plotlines were downers.

Spam is very popular in Asian food, especially Filipino and Hawaiian food. 

I have a coworker with psoriasis. They never wear short sleeves even in summer. Has to be hard. 

[eel21788]

14 hours ago, howiveaddict said:

Childhood leukemia was still a death sentence in 1968.  I googled and actually 1968 was the year the first survivor would make it to adulthood years later.  I think the 3 year survival was 25 percent.  A doctor at St Jude's is the one who came up with the breakthrough treatment regimen that would bring about a cure.  The child would have to suffer a cocktail of chemotherapy drugs intravenous along with radiation to the head and spine and chemotherapy inserted into the head and spine.  

They didn't tell us how old he was nor what kind of leukemia he had. Even today, being diagnosed with ALL passed the age of 10 makes it more difficult to treat. If he was over 10 and had AML or under 10 with ALL, it would have been a better prognosis.

If you're really interested in learning about how leukemia was treated in the early 1960s versus that late 1960s, read the book Eric by Doris Lund (you can also try to get your hands on the DVD with the same title).

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

If they had to cut something, they could have cut the scene where the doctor is extracting bone marrow from poor Joey. Yikes, I had to look away during that scene.

What they showed us is nowhere near as brutal as the real procedure. I'll spare you the vivid description.

[Sarah 103]

3 hours ago, Daff said:

Sorry, in All Creatures, Mrs. Hall left her PTSD affected husband, not because she didn’t love him anymore, but because continuing to live with him became untenable-she was unable to help him, and she was deteriorating as well, because of it.

Except in the new version of All Creatures Great and Small Mrs. Hall's husband was drunk and abusive. The father/husband in this episode had a skin condition and possibly mental issues, but there was nothing that indicated he was mistreating her or the boys. 

[eel21788]

14 hours ago, Shermie said:

As much as I sympathize with the father being ashamed of his skin condition, surely he could work at the docks or something. A job where you’re not around the public and there are other guys who are also rough around the edges.

Psoriasis is an autoimmune disease. It isn't just the unsightliness of the skin that is a problem. It also causes a lot of pain and exhaustion. The father was probably just as exhausted as his son with leukemia which would have made it difficult for him to work a physically demanding job.

13 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

I can understand a woman leaving her husband and children if he's drunk, or abusive, or constantly having affairs. Leaving him because he has a skin condition that isn't contagious makes her seem like an awful, selfish, petty, superficial person. 

He said the psoriasis flare up happened when she started talking about abandoning the family which didn't occur until 2 months later. There was something else going on that prompted her to want to leave. 

[Sarah 103]

9 minutes ago, eel21788 said:

He said the psoriasis flare up happened when she started talking about abandoning the family which didn't occur until 2 months later. There was something else going on that prompted her to want to leave. 

That's my problem. There is more to the story than we were told and I'm dissapointed we didn't get the full story. Especially since the missing information would have the mother a more sympathetic character and her actions more understandable. 

[dubbel zout]

21 minutes ago, eel21788 said:

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

If they had to cut something, they could have cut the scene where the doctor is extracting bone marrow from poor Joey. Yikes, I had to look away during that scene.

What they showed us is nowhere near as brutal as the real procedure. I'll spare you the vivid description.

I liked that they had the grace to have a nurse with Joey so he could hold her hand during the procedure.

[Daff]

6 minutes ago, Sarah 103 said:

Except in the new version of All Creatures Great and Small Mrs. Hall's husband was drunk and abusive. The father/husband in this episode had a skin condition and possibly mental issues, but there was nothing that indicated he was mistreating her or the boys. 

I was responding to your questioning the motivation for the wife leaving. I’d say that checking out of your partnership so far as to taking exclusively to your bed, expecting to be waited on as well as the entire household to be maintained, AND refusing to accept help, is enough to make anyone flee (that, or commit murder). She left for her own sanity, but either way, it forced the issue and resulted in them getting the help they needed. I saw a parallel there, but if it’s not apparent, so be it. (shrug).

[proserpina65]

15 hours ago, Shermie said:

And yeah, calling your child “Mistake” as a nickname? Surprise pregnancies were pretty common back then; I hardly think women planned their pregnancies in the 40s and 50s (when that mother had her children). Most kids would qualify as “mistakes” at that time. 

To me there's a world of difference between "accident" and "mistake".  "Accident" implies not planned but not unwanted or at least, happy about it once they get here.  "Mistake" says to me "we didn't want you then and still don't".  That poor girl.  Although that storyline did result in something I dislike on this show: the teenager who doesn't want to be a mother being forced to be one and somehow that's a happy ending.  Ugh.

15 hours ago, Shermie said:

As much as I sympathize with the father being ashamed of his skin condition, surely he could work at the docks or something.

Jobs on the docks were few and far between.  That was a storyline for earlier in the season.

3 hours ago, LtKelley said:

Because you're usually buying spam because you can't afford "real meat". Or you have a parent raised in the East End of London in the 1940s and 50s who so rarely got meat on the plate as a child that he always kept a few cans of Spam in the pantry and taught his kids how to make it into a tasty meal as a hedge against harder times. 

My mom grew up eating Spam in the 40s and 50s here in the US.  She still likes it.  Me, I'd have to be starving.

 

[Daff]

53 minutes ago, LtKelley said:

I mean, three young kids, hardly any money, Poplar in general sucking.... My dad always said "England is a third world hellhole and I was glad to get out" and I can see why someone might want to run away. Shitty to the kids but at least she wasn't drowning them in the tub...

Well, she probably thought about taking them, but she knew the help was there, if they’d only reach out. She probably figured she couldn’t even get a roof over their heads on her own. 

[proserpina65]

Just now, Daff said:

Well, she probably thought about taking them, but she knew the help was there, if they’d only reach out. She probably figured she couldn’t even get a roof over their heads on her own. 

As opposed to her reaching out for help before leaving?  Seems like the first step to take rather than abandoning her children.  Which is basically what she did.

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, proserpina65 said:

To me there's a world of difference between "accident" and "mistake".  "Accident" implies not planned but not unwanted or at least, happy about it once they get here.  "Mistake" says to me "we didn't want you then and still don't".  That poor girl.  Although that storyline did result in something I dislike on this show: the teenager who doesn't want to be a mother being forced to be one and somehow that's a happy ending.  Ugh.

Jobs on the docks were few and far between.  That was a storyline for earlier in the season.

My mom grew up eating Spam in the 40s and 50s here in the US.  She still likes it.  Me, I'd have to be starving.

 

My dad's brother had three daughters. There are quite a few years between the oldest two and the youngest. He always said she was the "hunting accident", as he was out hunting for a few days, came home and 9 months later she was born. He adored her and it wasn't said to be mean. So yes, an accident is different than a mistake. 

[Daff]

11 minutes ago, proserpina65 said:

As opposed to her reaching out for help before leaving? 

Which the husband adamantly, irrationally, specifically forbade. 

[proserpina65]

Just now, Daff said:

Which the husband adamantly, irrationally, specifically forbade. 

And somehow her abandoning her children was better than doing something her husband forbade?  Especially since he said the current outbreak started WHEN she was talking about leaving?

We'll have to agree to disagree on this, because I think she was a shit mother for leaving her children like that.

[Daff]

1 minute ago, proserpina65 said:

And somehow her abandoning her children was better than doing something her husband forbade?  Especially since he said the current outbreak started WHEN she was talking about leaving?

We'll have to agree to disagree on this, because I think she was a shit mother for leaving her children like that.

That’s perfectly alright, but I still believe she was thinking that it was better to leave them in an environment they knew and were functioning in than to uproot them into an unknown. Instability of surroundings takes an awful toll on kids.

[proserpina65]

6 minutes ago, LtKelley said:

The wife might have similar feelings.

Could be, but apparently they hadn't seen her at all since she left.  Which suggests she hadn't been back to check on them, not even at school where she wouldn't have to run into her husband.

Yeah, it was a rough situation, but she gets no more points from me than does her husband.  Possibly even fewer given that she wasn't the one with an actual medical issue.

And that's where I'm going to leave it for now.

Edited April 24, 2023 by proserpina65

[cinsays]

1 hour ago, eel21788 said:

Psoriasis is an autoimmune disease. It isn't just the unsightliness of the skin that is a problem. It also causes a lot of pain and exhaustion. The father was probably just as exhausted as his son with leukemia which would have made it difficult for him to work a physically demanding job.

He said the psoriasis flare up happened when she started talking about abandoning the family which didn't occur until 2 months later. There was something else going on that prompted her to want to leave. 

and, when she returned, i could have sworn she said she'd taken a place nearby, so she wasn't moving back home with them

[jschoolgirl]

6 hours ago, eel21788 said:

read the book Eric by Doris

I highly recommend it.

[MartyQui]

I worked at the Dana Farber Cancer Institute in Boston for a few years…Dr. Farber was the first physician to use combination chemotherapy against cancer, and the Jimmy Fund Clinic still is world class.  I worked down the hall from the clinic, and nothing makes you feel more grateful for your health than seeing those kids.  My cousin had ALL in 1985, and the treatment was still brutal.  He was treated at UMich Ann Arbor using protocols from Dana Farber.  The Jimmy Fund is the same as St. Jude’s…no family who cannot afford to pay has to pay.

Pretty much sobbed as soon as I saw those bruises.