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S01.E01: A Normal Amount of Rage


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I liked it. I enjoy the tone even if Jen is too nonplussed about the whole thing. You're a Hulk, lady! It's ok to be a little amazed, dazzled, or especially freaked out by it. But I guess that's journey she's on getting comfortable with it.

Tatiana is fantastic in the role. Great casting. And nice to see Ruffalo here. Kinda sweet that Bruce is missing Tony. I think that's the unspoken thread with Bruce. Tony, Steve, and Nat are gone. He's lonely. I think he was quietly stoked that (he thought) he could bring his cousin in to the superhero club and just have her around more often. 

Love that post credit scene. 

Edited by vb68
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Like all these Marvel TV series, I wasn't blown away by the first episode, but also not disappointed. Just more eh. I think Marvel is lucky I'm invested in the MCU to keep watching because I know the path will be the episodes will improve each time resulting in me getting hooked enough to tolerate that one random weak episode before a rushed conclusion leaves me wanting more.

I had no idea She-Hulk was a character who spoke to the camera and was aware she is in a tv show. Thankfully it was kept to a minimum so I have time to process if I like it or not as a story telling tool for this series.

Also looks like this is a show that will be happily referencing the MCU but possibly not impacting the stories that much, similar to Ms Marvel.

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I liked it. Apparently, the show had some late rearranging -- Jessica Gao, the showrunner, said that originally the origin story was in episode 8 but they edited a lot of that into the pilot:

Quote

Did anything else change?

The episode order was slightly different — we changed things up a little bit in post. Most of the pilot that you see was actually Episode 8. We waited until the very end of the season to really reveal her origin story.

Gao also said that Marvel asked her to dial back on how often Jen breaks the fourth wall. I'm on the fence about that, in that I always liked it from the comics and wanted more of it than we got in the pilot.

Given how much time the origin story took, the rest of it was awfully thin or rushed for time, but that's okay. We got a sense of who Jen is, and that's the main thing to establish.

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Ten years ago I would have found that Cap bit hilarious, but my post-Endgame rage has left me utterly cold. Had the MCU writers done things differently, we could have had a Steve Rogers that fucked WAY MORE.

Happy to see Mark Ruffalo and find out the creation of Professor Hulk and why he’s in Banner mode now. And awww at him and Tony’s initials.

Edited by Spartan Girl
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Okay, okay. Good, but not great off the starting line. Had to set-up the origin so I’ll give it a pass that there wasn’t much happening in this episode. I’ll definitely stick with it, though. Interesting that this has more “adult” language than previous series (amongst Disney+ original ones at least).

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I liked it but I didn't love it. 

Tatiana always has huge presence and she and Ruffalo had great chemistry and were believable adult cousins but I didn't love the "great, I'm a hulk, I can do everything (physical) amazingly already, let me get back to my life" stuff.  Which was the basis of the entire episode. I guess they touched on it a little but this isn't the way Bruce expected his life to go either Jen! and he really didn't want to be a superhero at first and nor did he think he was capable of being one. Just because you're different doesn't mean you should ignore 90% of what he has to say. Even though obviously it wouldn't be a show if it was them getting along in Mexico for 30 minutes. 

Also the "as a woman...." didn't land for me and I'm not quite sure why, I agree with what she said and it's not wrong to verbalise it, but maybe it just felt like a writer thinking they were awesome lines than something anyone would say when dealing with becoming a Hulk? Or in general. Or maybe Hollywood wanting points for pointing out the problem whilst perpetuating it 95% of the time. Or maybe because she basically said the same thing 5 times in 5 minutes. We'll see how that goes. 

Bruce and Tony carved their names together, aww. Ultron has two daddies..... On a more serious note it's good to get some more information on how and why Bruce managed to integrate himself into Smart Hulk which Endgame completely left out. 

Bruce says Hulks can't get drunk/barf from alcohol but 1 minute later Jen has a hangover? 

The friend knowing and being supportive was nice, the few seconds we got of it, as was her encouraging Jen to remove her shoes. 

Jen doesn't seem like that great an attorney from the albeit brief speech, although other guy was terrible as well "it depends on your definition of knowing" so maybe it's just usual TV court room issues. 

Marvel D+ shows always feel either too long or too short with their episodes, it's frustrating. 

All in all Jen is definitely an interesting character and Tatiana is as always extremely watchable so I'm. 

Edited by Featherhat
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I have to admit I rolled my eyes on the as a woman stuff. Its not that it's not a reality for a lot of women. The dialogue was just too on the nose. The "I'm a woman, I'm used to keeping down my emotions" was enough.

Other than that, good introduction. I don't need these shows to blow me away. I just want to be entertained and I was.

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1 hour ago, Featherhat said:

. . . All in all Jen is definitely an interesting character and Tatiana is as always extremely watchable so I'm. 

Yes, Tatiana Maslany was amazing in Orphan Black and brought a lot to her smaller role in the new Perry Mason, so I tuned in because I could, and I was not disappointed. 
I generally don't last more than a season or 2 with Marvel shows, because it starts feeling like I'm going to a weekly Bible study and haven't read the material, but I may stick it out with this one, because 1) Maslany, and 2) lawyer show with a twist, and 3) enough comic relief.

So that breaking-the-4th-wall stuff is part of the She-Hulk schtick? Good to know. It took me by surprise, but does seem like a cool comic-bookish thing. 

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How many people are in a jury, it seemed like they had way more than I was expecting?

It doesn't seem good that Disney decided to move stuff around and change things after the show was finished, no wonder we lost an entire episode.

I think the show would have been better if they aired a few episodes at the beginning, since they have so many and they are so short. I really wasn't seeing the courtroom comedy aspect.

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So far, Im not impressed.

The second I saw the fourth wall break, I was like... Oh no....

And also.....I don't know She-Hulk's comic book origin, but it actually find it annoying that for all intent and purposes she is somehow a hulk for a day and suddenly faster, stronger, smarter, and better at controlling hulk outs then someone how was a hulk for 20+ years.....I mean thats like a semester one freshmen College student coming to class and getting up and telling the teacher who is the foremost expert in their field their wrong and starts taking over and doing a better job...It just comes off as ridiculous.

I get that their trying to be better about representation and showcasing strong BAMF women, but having them be super better, super smarter, super more skilled from the word go over their male counterparts is not how you do it.

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29 minutes ago, LadyChaos said:

suddenly faster, stronger, smarter, and better at controlling hulk outs then someone how was a hulk for 20+ years.

I don't think that's what they showed at all. I think they implied Hulk is still faster and stronger, and smarter is really a matter of about a subject - Bruce is still a scientist, etc. They did show Jen as being better at controlling hulk, but they also belabored why that would be the case. In fact, if you think about it, it ties back to Hulk first getting control back in Avengers - "That's my secret, Cap, I'm always angry." Jen is always angry and always controlling it, so she had more Hulk-control from the jump.

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50 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

How many people are in a jury, it seemed like they had way more than I was expecting?

It doesn't seem good that Disney decided to move stuff around and change things after the show was finished, no wonder we lost an entire episode.

I think the show would have been better if they aired a few episodes at the beginning, since they have so many and they are so short. I really wasn't seeing the courtroom comedy aspect.

I guess they wanted not just the origin story at the beginning but Bruce/MR as soon as possible, especially him reminiscing about his friends, finishing his Endgame storyline and Hulk vs She Hulk fights to draw the most amount of people in? 

It may have been better if we'd had an episode with just Jen and friends and *then* the origin as ep 2 released all at the same time so we could still end on that cliffhanger if they wanted. Although I've no idea if it would have been feasible to do that. 

Forgot to add before: I didn't like the Steve stuff for a number of reasons (apart from anything else I'm always a little weirded out by how eager some productions are to make fan discussions and theories actual text these days) but I guess it's a tiny bit notable that it's unusual that movies or TV treat a male character's virginity or potential virginity as something to be coy about for so long. Although most female characters wouldn't get the "yeah she banged a USO guy in the 40s!!" punchline. 

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Yes, folks, long before Deadpool even existed,  there was the first several issues of "Sensational She-Hulk".

(Now available in a trade paperback, which is much easier to acquire and carry around).

She-Hulk would constantly "look" and talk to us,     complain about the silly plots, 

or yell and scream at the writers and editors,

and once she "ripped a hole" in the comic book,

and proceeded to walk through two whole "fake" pages of ads.

(Almost) everyone thought she was a little crazy.

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Pretty fun start, but I think part of me wishes that the first episode was more about Jen's normal life and colleagues, and then maybe start diving into the origin story stuff and Bruce for the second episode.  I get that they probably wanted to get She-Hulk and Bruce/Hulk in here as early as possible, but I would have liked to have seen more of Jen before the "hulking" and whatnot.

No surprise that I thought Tatiana Maslany shined as Jen.  Her performance(s) in Orphan Black were some of the best I've seen on television ever, and I'm all for her finally getting an even bigger role (for years, it felt like she was on the shortlist for other big franchise roles, but kept falling short.)  I liked that Jen is more snarky and even (by Disney+ standards) more vulgar compared to some of the other heroes here, but I do like they show underneath all of that is someone who is a strong believer in justice and law, and has the makings of being a hero if she chooses to do so.

Great seeing Bruce again and explaining all of the Professor/Smart Hulk stuff and how he can be Banner as well.  Loved the references to both Tony and Natasha, and how much they both clearly meant to him.  As for all the stuff about Steve and his virginity, I just want to know how Bruce found out.  I don't see Steve casually talking about his sex life, so I'm thinking either Tony annoyed him to that point that he finally told them or maybe Steve and Thor were having a "never have I ever" game with some quality Asgardian mead and it slipped out.

Already prepared to hear a lot of complaints on the internet about Jen's speech about the hardships women face.  Too be fair, that was some CW-level on the nose dialogue there.  No one on television believes in subtlety when it comes to diving into social issues.

Titania got dropped pretty quickly here, but I'm guessing she'll factor in more going forward.  Jameela Jamil in that outfit still feels like she came straight out of the WWE in the 90s/early 2000s which is kind of awesome.

 Lets see where this goes next!  

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1 hour ago, LadyChaos said:

And also.....I don't know She-Hulk's comic book origin, but it actually find it annoying that for all intent and purposes she is somehow a hulk for a day and suddenly faster, stronger, smarter, and better at controlling hulk outs then someone how was a hulk for 20+ years.....I mean thats like a semester one freshmen College student coming to class and getting up and telling the teacher who is the foremost expert in their field their wrong and starts taking over and doing a better job...It just comes off as ridiculous.

I get that their trying to be better about representation and showcasing strong BAMF women, but having them be super better, super smarter, super more skilled from the word go over their male counterparts is not how you do it.

No, actually it would be like a parent play wrestling with their kid, losing, and suddenly declaring the kid is stronger.  Didn't you see him toss that second rock so hard it vanished over the horizon?  I know it's hard to believe, but maybe, just maybe, Bruce was holding back because he's a pretty genial guy who didn't want to crush his cousin because he's not insecure enough to need to dominate?  She's better at controlling the transformation and is a better lawyer.  The jury's still out but she might be more well adjusted too.  Bruce is still one of the top three scientific geniuses (along with Hank Pym and Shuri) in the world

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4 hours ago, Featherhat said:

Bruce says Hulks can't get drunk/barf from alcohol but 1 minute later Jen has a hangover? 

I buy it. Whatever alcohol Jen’s Hulk form didn’t metabolize would stick around, and once she changes back in her sleep, that amount of alcohol is left in a much smaller body. And Bruce and Jen drank a whole bar’s worth of booze. If anything, Jen shoulda woke up drunk. (Or suffer alcohol poisoning, but this is a superhero light comedy, not a depressing drama.)

2 hours ago, LadyChaos said:

better at controlling hulk outs then someone how was a hulk for 20+ years

Bruce’s defining thing is his dissociative identity disorder. He’s unlike virtually any other MU/MCU gamma powered superhuman in that respect. I think Leonard Samson predated She-Hulk by a few years in the comics and he has (a much lower level of) super strength and durability but also with absolutely no rage issues or other personalities. Come to think of it though, I bet this show won’t get into it much, both because it’s Jen’s show and because Marvel just did DID with Moon Knight a few months ago.

Bruce is lucky his new nickname is “Smart Hulk” and not “Smulk”.

Edited by arc
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1 hour ago, arc said:

I buy it. Whatever alcohol Jen’s Hulk form didn’t metabolize would stick around, and once she changes back in her sleep, that amount of alcohol is left in a much smaller body. And Bruce and Jen drank a whole bar’s worth of booze. If anything, Jen shoulda woke up drunk. (Or suffer alcohol poisoning, but this is a superhero light comedy, not a depressing drama.)

3 hours ago, LadyChaos said:

Right, I ignored the fact that she changed back. I was just concentrating on the juxtaposition between "all buzz no barf" and Jen clearly about to spend hours head in the porcelain throne. It didn't register that this was a perk that came with (real world deadly) down sides. 

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I liked it. Tatiana was great like I figured she'd be. I thought her and Ruffalo had great cousin chemistry. We just met her but it felt like they are family that can insult each other and forgive. 

Bruce said he learned to control Hulk by always being angry. Jen was already always angry, so she skipped some steps. I also don't think she's stronger. Bruce was holding back, when he didn't he launched a rock into space and sent her flying with one hulk clap. She had to do a couple claps for him to even feel anything. 

A lot of reviews said the first ep was okay, and that it gets better so I can't wait. They also said every episode has an after credit scene. 

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Good origin episode. Bruce and Jen definitely sounded like cousins who care about each other and also get on each other’s nerves. Also nice to get some backstory on Smart Hulk and where Bruce was during the Blip. Tony and Bruce’s names carved into the bar was a nice touch. 

The mid credit scene made me lol. 

I imagine the season will be about Jen learning how to balance being a lawyer while also taking on the superhero responsibilities she’s not all that thrilled about. 

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3 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

As for all the stuff about Steve and his virginity, I just want to know how Bruce found out.  I don't see Steve casually talking about his sex life, so I'm thinking either Tony annoyed him to that point that he finally told them or maybe Steve and Thor were having a "never have I ever" game with some quality Asgardian mead and it slipped out.

I tend to agree that Steve wouldn't have casually talked about it. My fan theories:

1) He might have said something like "there was a special someone I met shortly after becoming Captain America" to Sam, and that got "telephone game'd" into Steve lost it to a girl on the USO tour. Or (more likely)

2) That girl on the USO tour would have been telling everyone about it as soon as Steve exploded as America's Greatest War Hero. Howard Stark heard it on the rumor mill, and told his son about it once when the two of them were having a rare bonding night when Tony was still young. From Tony's lips to Bruce's ears...

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16 minutes ago, Cthulhudrew said:

I tend to agree that Steve wouldn't have casually talked about it. My fan theories:

1) He might have said something like "there was a special someone I met shortly after becoming Captain America" to Sam,

Bucky... When he got all his memories back after Winter Soldier - he wrote it as graffiti on the Smithsonian exhibit...

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I enjoyed it! It was a lot of fun. I thought Tatiana and Ruffalo had good chemistry and I enjoyed their scenes together. I think it set the show up for an interest storyline; her having to juggle being a lawyer with having superpowers.

Does anyone else think(spoiler alert for those who haven’t seen Ms Marvel)

Spoiler

they just set up that Bruce and her are Mutants? He mentions they share a genetic marker that makes them react to the Gamma radiation by hulking out. It reminded me of Bruno telling Kamala she had a mutation which was why she got her abilities when putting on the bangle. Wasn’t Tony also saying in the first Avengers that that much Gamma radiation should have killed Bruce? I guess we have an answer why it didn’t…

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2 hours ago, Cthulhudrew said:

2) That girl on the USO tour would have been telling everyone about it as soon as Steve exploded as America's Greatest War Hero.

But then Jen woulda heard long before Bruce told her.

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10 hours ago, Featherhat said:

Jen doesn't seem like that great an attorney from the albeit brief speech, although other guy was terrible as well "it depends on your definition of knowing" so maybe it's just usual TV court room issues. 

To me, that argument seems like one you would make when you know you have a losing case and don't have any other argument.

7 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

How many people are in a jury, it seemed like they had way more than I was expecting?

Criminal case-12 jurors.  There were 14 jurors there, so if they are being accurate, 2 would be alternates who would be dismissed once deliberations start.

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Over the past few weeks a ton of fragile little snowflakes have been posting videos and tweets about how outrageous and "woke" they think the show is because Jennifer appeated to toss a rock further than Bruce.

I bet zero of them post follow ups admitting they were wrong, having seen the full unedited context.  

They likely switch to screaming its "woke" and man-hating because she gets control instantly and it took him 15 years. Completely ignoring that this probably wasn't actually because he was a man (although they do joke about that) and was more because he was... face it... mentally ill. 

I enjoyed this, although I'm a bit worried that of the first four this is allegedly the best of them.    This was good, but not SO good that I want it to be the high point. 

Edited by SnarkShark
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I don't care about how the information came about Cap. The avengers were actual friends and spent time together we didn't see.

Also, let's be really. Tony could of gotten the info out of him easily by needling him and prodding him with questions until Cap broke. Talking about losing your virginity isn't locker room talk. It's not out of the realm of possibility for Cap. He just wouldn't of done it casually.

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There are a lot of improbable things I am willing to accept in a superhero show, but it really bugged me that Jen’s hair became longer and straighter when she hulked out. Why? Bruce’s didn’t seem to change.

This may be a part of the comics, but some things just don’t translate from page to screen.

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However the USO story came out, I think it’s legit. Just think, you’ve been scrawny little Steve Rogers all your life, suddenly you’re buff and surrounded by a chorus line. Remember, Natalie Dormer threw herself at him, so one or two chorus girls probably did too. And I think the tour was before he completely fell for Peggy.

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I had to rewind a couple of times to be sure, but when Jen finally drives off in the Jeep, it looked like it wasn’t moving at all, but rather the camera panning. Maybe the only model they could get was a manual, and Tatiana can’t drive one? You don’t want the Jeep bucking and lurching away.

Just an odd kind of motion that I’m wondering if anyone else noticed. 

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14 minutes ago, Athena5217 said:

Jen’s hair became longer and straighter when she hulked out.

Maybe they were trying to be true to the comic, but Tatiana didn’t want to deal with the wig in every scene, and/or thought the look didn’t match her lawyer persona?

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I think there’s more from episode 8 that we’re missing. Bruce didn’t go looking for her in the forest after the car accident? And she was unconscious from the time she beat up the bar guys, until she woke up in Bruce’s spare bedroom… in Mexico?

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10 hours ago, Athena5217 said:

There are a lot of improbable things I am willing to accept in a superhero show, but it really bugged me that Jen’s hair became longer and straighter when she hulked out. Why? Bruce’s didn’t seem to change.

I don’t like how it gets straighter and lumpy. Haven’t read any comics, but in the 80s and 90s cartoon, it got a whole lot more body and Curly.

And really? Jen gets her powers because her blood mixed with Bruce’s? I thought I read somewhere where they were going to stick with her getting her powers through a blood transfusion. And not a fan of her screaming like a Hulk when she’s always had control of morphing into She Hulk. It looked and sounded stupid.

As for Steve, I got the impression he’d had plenty of sex after he woke from the hospital ice. He and Natasha talked about his “dating” in Winter Soldier.

Overall, it was…okay.

Edited by GHScorpiosRule
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44 minutes ago, Racj82 said:

Also, let's be really. Tony could of gotten the info out of him easily by needling him and prodding him with questions until Cap broke. Talking about losing your virginity isn't locker room talk. It's not out of the realm of possibility for Cap. He just wouldn't of done it casually.

It wouldn't even need Tony to be particularly interested in getting the info out of Steve. You just know he'd be dying to brag about how he lost his with Cindy Crawford or when he was a 13-year-old freshman at MIT or whatever, and if even one other person volunteered their first experience the peer pressure would be on for Steve to share as well.

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22 hours ago, kay1864 said:

However the USO story came out, I think it’s legit. Just think, you’ve been scrawny little Steve Rogers all your life, suddenly you’re buff and surrounded by a chorus line. Remember, Natalie Dormer threw herself at him, so one or two chorus girls probably did too. And I think the tour was before he completely fell for Peggy.

Rogers did the national war bonds tour with a lot more hot dancers than 3 or 4 in Italy. Maybe that is what Banner meant by USO...image.png.daad88668be84d5724e2faa5878647e0.png

Edited by paigow
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53 minutes ago, Athena5217 said:

There are a lot of improbable things I am willing to accept in a superhero show, but it really bugged me that Jen’s hair became longer and straighter when she hulked out. Why? Bruce’s didn’t seem to change.

This may be a part of the comics, but some things just don’t translate from page to screen.

It's because they cast a curly haired actress, but the straight green/black hair makes it LOOK like the comic book character.

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36 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

And really? Jen gets her powers because her blood mixed with Bruce’s? I thought I read somewhere where they were going to stick with her getting her powers through a blood transfusion. And not a fan of her screaming like a Hulk when she’s always had control of morphing into She Hulk. It looked and sounded stupid.

Well you read it, it must be true!  😁

I wouldn't put too much stock in the screaming.  I think they literally did it only so she seemed more like Hulk, while in a scene where she was "learning" to be like him.  I doubt they'll use it a lot in the show.

Edited by SnarkShark
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40 minutes ago, paigow said:

Rogers did the national war bonds tour with a lot more hot dancers than 3 or 4 in Italy. Maybe that is what Banner meant by USO.

Yep, the war bonds tour is the one with all the chorus girls. My guess is they changed it because ‘USO Tour’ is more familiar to today’s audience than ‘war bonds tour’. 

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48 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

And really? Jen gets her powers because her blood mixed with Bruce’s?

This way makes Bruce less irresponsible than him knowingly donating gamma-tainted blood.

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8 hours ago, Twilight Man said:

Yes, folks, long before Deadpool even existed,  there was the first several issues of "Sensational She-Hulk".

(Now available in a trade paperback, which is much easier to acquire and carry around).

She-Hulk would constantly "look" and talk to us,     complain about the silly plots, 

or yell and scream at the writers and editors,

and once she "ripped a hole" in the comic book,

and proceeded to walk through two whole "fake" pages of ads.

(Almost) everyone thought she was a little crazy.

I'm more familiar with the later Dan Slott run, also a madcap comedy. 

It was kind of what if She Hulk was Ally McBeal but with superpowers? A legal parody. There were courtroom hijinks with superhero flair. Like what if J. Jonah Jameson sued Spider-Man? Can they testify while maintaining secret identities?

It had notions like: In a superhero universe, then superhero comics would be admissible evidence.

A supporting character was the evil Awesome Android, who reformed his ways and became an intern at Jen's law firm called Awesome Andy.

I haven't read these in a long time, so I don't remember how much fourth wall breaking there was in this version. I seem to remember some but not as much as Sensational She-Hulk.

It looks like the series will draw from both of these. I'm expecting for Bruce to fade into the background now that we've got her origin established.

When she makes appearances outside of her own titles, she doesn't do the fourth wall breaking. She's sometimes an Avenger and sometimes in the Fantastic Four, a wisecracking fun loving gal who can throw cars around. Mostly a comic relief role player. 

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3 hours ago, arc said:

But then Jen woulda heard long before Bruce told her.

Maybe? I mean that woman is probably dead by now, and Captain America was missing for decades, so I'm not sure the rumor mill would necessarily still be going on that one. Maybe some gossip rag dug up that rumor and printed it and Jen knew about it... she did seem to be trying to get Bruce to confirm that Cap wasn't a virgin rather than that he was (based on the cut scene. "I knew it!!!")

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2 hours ago, kay1864 said:

I think there’s more from episode 8 that we’re missing. Bruce didn’t go looking for her in the forest after the car accident? And she was unconscious from the time she beat up the bar guys, until she woke up in Bruce’s spare bedroom… in Mexico?

I think he was looking for her, he just couldn't find her. She was able presumably to call him, and he came for her at the bar (tackling her to keep her from assaulting those catcalling punks). As for how she got to Mexico, Bruce can jump really, really far (though I'm actually not sure what city She-Hulk is supposed to be set in. Is it New York, because that is a different story than if it were California. So, some suspension of disbelief required for sure.)

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2 hours ago, dwmarch said:

When she is leaving, she tells Bruce she's going back to LA.

Which makes her office too aggressively LA. (I know, it’s TV, you need shorthands.) There’s UCLA memorabilia and even a framed photo of Griffith Observatory, which seems a little silly for someone who lives and works in and for LA.

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7 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

As for Steve, I got the impression he’d had plenty of sex after he woke from the hospital ice. He and Natalie talked about his “dating” in Winter Soldier.

I think you mean Natasha 😉 

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I liked it but Titania’s introduction seemed a bit weird.  She just breaks into the courtroom, starts attacking random people, and then She Hulk knocks her out.  It was a bit random, especially since she didn’t even know who She Hulk was.  I hope they at least give a little explanation why she did it.

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