S06.E10: Every Version of You

[watch2much]

oh, this show!  when I saw it on my DVR my first thought was obligatory...I guess I have to watch it.  yet once started it sucks you in.  Even though not my favorite of the big three (always a Kevin fan), it was touching.  I thought Mandy Moore's was the best.  One could really connect with how she was feeling about the past happy times.  have learned as the parent of a now adult son, I find myself looking back on incidents that at the time drove me nuts but now I think of fondly.

and the Cat Steven's son at the end was perfect.

[KaveDweller]

 

2 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I respect widows for sure, but when Jack died why was it that the kids had to hold Rebecca up for years?  They were still children.  She was the parent. Though painful, wouldn’t the adult be able to grieve and move forward?  Did Randall sense his mother couldn’t deal and so he jumps in as her rock?  I watched my grandfather lose the love of life at age 45 (yes, he was a young dad and young grandpa).  And, his wife, my grand mama, was a saint.  Yet, he moved on. 

I don't think that the kids did hold Rebecca up for years. Rebecca struggled a bit of course, but she got them a new house, she got a job, etc. Randall CHOSE to go to school near home because he thought she needed him, but I never got the impression that she did at all.

[chocolatine]

4 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

I don't think that the kids did hold Rebecca up for years. Rebecca struggled a bit of course, but she got them a new house, she got a job, etc. 

She let Randall go with her to the job interview and Pearson-speech the boss into hiring her.

[KaveDweller]

17 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

She let Randall go with her to the job interview and Pearson-speech the boss into hiring her.

Randall speechified the boss into hiring her, but I don't remember her asking Randall to do that or saying she needed his help. He just took it on himself to do it.

I'm sure if he hadn't, Rebecca could have gotten herself another job.

[cameron]

Thought that this whole episode was really contrived.  Mother deciding who is going to take care of her in case her husband died first.  Maybe they don't want to do that and the 17 year old hoofing it out in the middle of the night from a cabin in the woods to go to Boston was way beyond belief.

[Empress1]

3 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

 Did Randall sense his mother couldn’t deal and so he jumps in as her rock?

I think Randall did more than he needed to (or should have, to be honest) and Rebecca allowed it both because he is her favorite and because it made things easier for her.* Randall was coming over on weekends in college fixing things, butting into her job interview (only in TV-land would that work; most people would be like "Let me hire someone whose kids have senses of boundaries." Ditto a Black kid telling a white cop what to do), after college he and Beth were spending most of their free time with Rebecca, which got on Beth's nerves. As Rebecca said, often at some point kids have to take care of parents, but Randall took on too much too soon.

I think Randall saw Kate gaining weight and Kevin drinking in the immediate aftermath of Jack's death and saw that Rebecca wasn't really paying attention to that (I think he confronted her about it and after that confrontation he decided not to go to Howard) and he went into fix-it mode. It also might have been a way of channeling his anxiety.

*I think the same is true for Miguel to a certain extent, and Miguel saw that and broke the pattern by moving.

The new little Randall is so cute. The little swim gesture he did with his swimming teacher was adorable.

37 minutes ago, cameron said:

 Mother deciding who is going to take care of her in case her husband died first.  Maybe they don't want to do that

Rebecca didn't decide which kid would take care of her; she told them who she wanted to make decisions for her when she can't make decisions for herself in case Miguel isn't around to do it. This doesn't obligate Kate or anyone to provide care for her, although I'm sure Miguel will until he can't. Each of my parents informed me, with far less fanfare, that they had made me their proxy (and I did have to make decisions for my dad) and I'm the administrator of their wills.

 I loved, loved, loved the Scholastic book club and the book fair was like my favorite day when it came around. I've always been a big reader. That suits Randall to a T.

Edited March 31, 2022 by Empress1

[circumvent]

Liked this episode very much. Mandy Moore is totally convincing as old, young, younger Rebecca. She is excellent and has great chemistry with the other actors. I liked how the writers tied the three episodes together, little pieces of dialogues that seem disconnected in one episode, get explained in the next. Directing and editing were also good on all three episodes. 

The book Randall was reading, Homegoing, is one of the best books I have ever read. Couldn't put it down. Highly recommend it.

 

2 hours ago, watch2much said:

and the Cat Steven's son at the end was perfect.

Yusuf Islam is his name now

[chocolatine]

36 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

Randall speechified the boss into hiring her, but I don't remember her asking Randall to do that or saying she needed his help. He just took it on himself to do it.

And she, as the parent, should have taken it upon herself to set boundaries with him. "No, you're not coming to the interview with me. End of discussion."

[Guest]

I was glad when Deja said early on that Randall wasn’t her parent. That always bothered me- the way the show handled their adoption of Deja. Her mom had lots of struggles but then decided just to relinquish rights to teenage Deja because the Pearsons had more money and wanted her? Of course at one point there is going to be a “you’re not my dad” moment.

[KaveDweller]

38 minutes ago, cameron said:

Thought that this whole episode was really contrived.  Mother deciding who is going to take care of her in case her husband died first.  Maybe they don't want to do that and the 17 year old hoofing it out in the middle of the night from a cabin in the woods to go to Boston was way beyond belief.

Well of course no one wants to have to make decisions for a dying parent because they have lost their mental capabilities. But I think most people do it for the parent because their parents gave them life and now need their help. And it is important to set up a power of attorney when you still have time, otherwise you won't get your wishes carried out.

7 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

And she, as the parent, should have taken it upon herself to set boundaries with him. "No, you're not coming to the interview with me. End of discussion."

Yes, she should have done that. However, not setting boundaries isn't the same as saying the kids needed to hold Rebecca up because she couldn't handle things. 

[Tango64]

Fell asleep on the first attempt at watching this episode. Saw some Deja storyline and that was it. 
Had to watch it again tonight. Felt like a Deja view. 

[peeayebee]

1 hour ago, circumvent said:

The book Randall was reading, Homegoing, is one of the best books I have ever read. Couldn't put it down. Highly recommend it.

I will be picking it up at my library tomorrow. I was surprised it was available.

[CarpeFelis]

7 hours ago, Empress1 said:

Rebecca was born in 1950. I think she looks her age (I actually think they dress her too dowdily) but her voice has always bugged me -Mandy Moore doesn’t really modify her voice when she plays present-day Rebecca.

Her neck and jawline still look a little too good for 70+.

5 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I respect widows for sure, but when Jack died why was it that the kids had to hold Rebecca up for years?  They were still children.  She was the parent. Though painful, wouldn’t the adult be able to grieve and move forward?  Did Randall sense his mother couldn’t deal and so he jumps in as her rock?  I watched my grandfather lose the love of life at age 45 (yes, he was a young dad and young grandpa).  And, his wife, my grand mama, was a saint.  Yet, he moved on.  

I think it was horribly self-indulgent that Rebecca allowed herself to lean on Randall that much after Jack died. What she really should have done was nip that in the bud, tell him to go to the college he actually wanted to go to, and start figuring things out for herself.

My MIL leaned too hard on my husband when FIL died in his mid-50s. Nowhere near as much as Rebecca leaned on Randall, especially since she lived in a different state, but definitely enough to be stepping on my toes (CONSTANT phone calls, visiting too frequently, playing hostess at a party at our house to which she hadn’t even been invited and was the only person of her generation present). It was a big relief when she remarried. Ironically, now she acts like her second husband’s family takes priority and rushes my husband off the phone whenever they talk.

Edited March 31, 2022 by CarpeFelis

[ams1001]

8 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

I will be picking it up at my library tomorrow. I was surprised it was available.

Mine has it available at some branches...just not either of the ones I'm willing to drive to. The ebook has an ~8 week waiting list. But I have one checked out already and my next one is one that belongs to a friend so I gotta read that. Added the ebook to my wishlist for later.

[Dowel Jones]

12 hours ago, BC4ME said:

And SO much wasted food on TV!

There's a legitimate reason for that, I think.  If scenes require multiple takes, you have to have the same amount of food on the plate, else sharp eyed viewers will notice.  And the actors can't really eat something for every take.

If I were Randall's age, I would probably react just as he did when Deja threw the gauntlet down with the 'You're not my dad' remark (same situation for me, by the way), and then taking off to Boston.  Now that I'm in the beginning stages of crusty old fart-hood, I would likely drive Deja back to the cabin and say "Monday morning we go to the courthouse and start the emancipation paperwork.  When it's complete, you're on the road.  Period."

Another possibility, however unlikely:  Maybe little Jack finds the Big Green Egg before Toby has had time to start it up.  He crawls inside and hides until Toby opens it up, banging his head in the process.

Edited March 31, 2022 by Dowel Jones
Adding more stuff...

[UMAngela]

2 hours ago, circumvent said:

Yusuf Islam is his name now

I believe goes by Yusuf / Cat Stevens now (at least professionally... I'm on his email list).

Edited March 31, 2022 by UMAngela

[Violetgoblin6]

On 3/29/2022 at 9:35 PM, chitowngirl said:

Eat n Park cookies! So PA  😀 I was so sad when ours closed.

Yeah. My husband went to Penn State main campus in the mid 90s. I used to visit him and even lived there in spring 97. I loved the breakfast and then we'd get yellow and pink happy face cookies. So delicious and I'm not even a fan of those frosted sugar cookies. Miss it. I wonder if the whole chain disappeared like so many things do. 

 

My thoughts: lol with Malik's Boston setup and Randall's Philadelphia setup, they're exactly the same set. And it's the same set used for Sophie in NYC. It's rather hilarious, especially when they show it mere minutes later! 

[Violetgoblin6]

13 hours ago, Katie111 said:

My only issue with Mandy Moore is she just looks too young.  She must be at least 65 if the triplets are 40 and she looks about 55.  I almost felt like her and Randall looked more like a couple on that road trip than a mother and son.  Maybe it’s also the way she gazes at him.  
 

I think Randall helped her out while he was in college but he lived at school (right?) so Kate was actually her day to day companion, not Randall.  But he gets all the credit as always. And why would he ever be her POA when she lives in LA and he lives in PA.  If/when she moves to PA they should probably change it to Randall.  I just don’t think it’s that big of a deal in most families.  My dad called me one day and said you’re my POA.  I’m the youngest of 5 so not the obvious choice but I live close by and my husband is in finance so it makes sense.  None of my other siblings could really care less that I was “chosen”.   They’re probably relieved not to have to deal with it. 
 

Still can’t figure out how Deja made it from a remote cabin in PA to Boston.  Wasn’t there a Kate episode where her boyfriend dropped her off on the side of the road?  There seemed to be nothing around there.  And I love how Randall off handed my asks Miguel to take the girls back to Philly, as if it’s 20 minutes down the road.

Yeah, I watched with my dad and he said, "oh, they're husband and wife?" 

[kathyk24]

11 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

And that still leaves Kate as being the one who is sacrificing more.  She's the one who will be with the kids while Toby is working 70 hours a week.  She's the one who will be responsible for the laundry, the grocery shopping, the cooking, the cleaning, bath time, bedtime, etc.  Unless he is pulling in enough money to afford a nanny and housekeeper.  

Kate is also taking Jack to doctor's appointments and early intervention services. If they move to San Fransisco Jack would be on a waiting list for services.

[himela]

What annoys me is that they just create stories that were non-existant before. Had we ever seen Kevin playing the guitar as he said he was doing when he was nervous? Had we ever seen Randall saying he'd get into politics or even wanting to be president? Things, stories, people and even dogs used to create a dramatic story that just disappear or don't make sense or don't matter after their purpose is complete. The worst things were the out of nowhere appearance of Nicky and Randall's biological mom who was dead but not really.

AND WHERE IS AUDIO???

[debraran]

3 minutes ago, himela said:

What annoys me is that they just create stories that were non-existant before. Had we ever seen Kevin playing the guitar as he said he was doing when he was nervous? Had we ever seen Randall saying he'd get into politics or even wanting to be president? Things, stories, people and even dogs used to create a dramatic story that just disappear or don't make sense or don't matter after their purpose is complete. The worst things were the out of nowhere appearance of Nicky and Randall's biological mom who was dead but not really.

AND WHERE IS AUDIO???

I know, I think after Kate gave away the other dog after Jacks death, they could  have said something...but I guess early would sound too grim and giving yet another dog away because she couldn't handle it would anger some fans and be silly. But I honor dear Audio.

I think they add things like the guitar because someone has an idea, "hey lets use Guitar Man song and do this theme" I would rather they stuck with painting. I can't help but think the political angle is for a spinoff but maybe to show the future in scenes toward the end if they FF their lives to show him in white house? Who knows but it's an awful lot to put in one season. I hope we have more of them in present time.

[cameron]

9 hours ago, deaja said:

I was glad when Deja said early on that Randall wasn’t her parent. That always bothered me- the way the show handled their adoption of Deja. Her mom had lots of struggles but then decided just to relinquish rights to teenage Deja because the Pearsons had more money and wanted her? Of course at one point there is going to be a “you’re not my dad” moment.

And I would have shone her the front door and told her to go and live with her natural mother.

[cameron]

2 hours ago, kathyk24 said:

Kate is also taking Jack to doctor's appointments and early intervention services. If they move to San Fransisco Jack would be on a waiting list for services.

I call that being a stay at home Mom.  

[Johnny Dollar]

Rebecca’s Box of Memories for Kate seemed to include a diner menu and a bad attitude.

I can definitely understand Randall being pissed at Rebecca’s decision of naming Kate her executor. Randall spends his whole life being her “rock” yet she ditches him when it comes to making the most important decision one could be faced with. When Rebecca moves full time to the cabin, Randall will be the closest to her geographically while Kate is still trying to find herself. Rebecca’s excuse essentially says that Kate has literally nothing going on in her life so that’s why she was chosen. Not surprisingly, Kate is the last family member to make it to the cabin when Rebecca is at death’s door.

I’m beginning to go along with the idea that they’ve been padding Chrissy Metz this year, with some kind of big reveal when she finally drags her ass out to the cabin. 

[Ohiopirate02]

4 hours ago, kathyk24 said:

Kate is also taking Jack to doctor's appointments and early intervention services. If they move to San Fransisco Jack would be on a waiting list for services.

I don't have any kids let alone one who needs early intervention, I forgot about those.  Hope Toby did not and his failure to bring up important issues like that were a failure on the writers' part.  I was just listing the tip of the emotional labor iceberg.  The list is long, and if Toby is not willing to pick up some of that, then I would be just like Kate and pause the move.  I know Toby and some posters here are glossing over the amount of work Kate has already put in with Jack.  They move to SF and all of that work is out the window and she gets to start at square one teaching Jack how to navigate a new house and a new city.  What's Toby's plan on addressing this?  The plan cannot be Kate is a SAHM and that's her job.  

[cameron]

2 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

Rebecca’s Box of Memories for Kate seemed to include a diner menu and a bad attitude.

I can definitely understand Randall being pissed at Rebecca’s decision of naming Kate her executor. Randall spends his whole life being her “rock” yet she ditches him when it comes to making the most important decision one could be faced with. When Rebecca moves full time to the cabin, Randall will be the closest to her geographically while Kate is still trying to find herself. Rebecca’s excuse essentially says that Kate has literally nothing going on in her life so that’s why she was chosen. Not surprisingly, Kate is the last family member to make it to the cabin when Rebecca is at death’s door.

I’m beginning to go along with the idea that they’ve been padding Chrissy Metz this year, with some kind of big reveal when she finally drags her ass out to the cabin. 

Just went back and watch the Big Hill where she is in a nightgown.  When they show her arms sideways, they are huge.

[CountryGirl]

I absolutely loved this episode. The road trip with Rebecca and Randall was exactly what they both needed.

It showcased their relationship and how even when Randall was a teen, he could relate so well to Rebecca and they could have the kinds of conversations she couldn’t with his siblings. It struck me that I am the Randall of my family. The youngest, but the most responsible and who accepts my mom for who she is, not who I want her to be.

Those scenes of Randall helping Rebecca with her meds and flashing back to her helping with his. Ohhhh, that got to me as I’m literally starting to play that out with my mom. Of parenting her a little bit and, admittedly, I did as a teen and young adult after she was widowed, and it has caused friction then and now. But just like Randall, I’m always gonna have my mom’s back.

I also loved Rebecca sharing more of Rebecca the person vs Rebecca the mom as I think it’s all too common for us to put our parents in that one-note box. They had and have lives completely separate from raising kids and those glimpses were precious to see.

I’m glad we had resolution to the Deja/Malik storyline and they both realized their plans were not realistic and certainly unfair to Deja. Sappy or not, Deja acknowledging Randall as her “dad” was so sweet to witness and I appreciated that Randall just sat there and soaked it in vs responding/Pearson-speechifying.

I can't believe these words are coming out of my mouth right now, but I wouldn’t mind so much if Malik is the father of Deja’s baby. He scored major points in the maturity column for me with letting Deja go and seeing what the future holds.

The Big 3 in the diner - we need more scenes of them together, which it looks like we’ll be getting in the next episode.

Randall contemplating a senate run is in keeping with the flash forward to Kate’s wedding and the “rising star” article we see. But I did appreciate him only moving forward if it will work for Beth and her career.

And who knew cookies could make me cry?

[CountryGirl]

On 3/29/2022 at 11:22 PM, Bumblebee84047 said:

I want to see what's in the Kevin, Kate, and Randall boxes, but I know it would unleash waves and waves of sobbing.

I think we will see more of them in a future episode. At least, I hope so. Even if it will bring on the tears.

[gibasi]

14 hours ago, circumvent said:

 

 

Yusuf Islam is his name now

Yes and I wondered why my closed captioning said the song was Cat Stevens song...

I just saw UMAngela's response. That makes sense then.

Edited March 31, 2022 by gibasi
added to response

[Dowel Jones]

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

The Big 3 in the diner - we need more scenes of them together, which it looks like we’ll be getting in the next episode.

I was just waiting for the cop to swing around on patrol and see the lights on in the diner, with the resulting confrontation with the teens again.  Awkward.  

[cameron]

3 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

I was just waiting for the cop to swing around on patrol and see the lights on in the diner, with the resulting confrontation with the teens again.  Awkward.  

They didn't have any right going into that restaurant after hours.  But I forgot, they're the Pearsons.

Edited March 31, 2022 by cameron

[Crs97]

4 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

I can definitely understand Randall being pissed at Rebecca’s decision of naming Kate her executor. Randall spends his whole life being her “rock” yet she ditches him when it comes to making the most important decision one could be faced with.

Maybe next time someone makes their position very clear to Randall about a personal matter, he will think twice before emotionally blackmailing them into choosing what he wants them to do.

[Ohiopirate02]

7 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

Maybe next time someone makes their position very clear to Randall about a personal matter, he will think twice before emotionally blackmailing them into choosing what he wants them to do.

Yeah, Randall has proven that he will center himself when making decisions and not what Rebecca would want.  

[ams1001]

10 minutes ago, cameron said:

They didn't have any right going into that restaurant after hours.

I guess the place didn't have any kind of monitored alarm system... When I worked retail (granted it was a big chain store and not an independent place) if the alarm was turned off outside of regular store hours (plus an hour or two before and after) the store manager would have gotten a phone call. (When they're there later for things like inventory or carpet cleaning they have to notify the alarm company ahead of time.) So even if it was another manager with keys, they would be asking questions if they went into the store when no one was supposed to be there. 

[Violetgoblin6]

15 hours ago, circumvent said:

Liked this episode very much. Mandy Moore is totally convincing as old, young, younger Rebecca. She is excellent and has great chemistry with the other actors. I liked how the writers tied the three episodes together, little pieces of dialogues that seem disconnected in one episode, get explained in the next. Directing and editing were also good on all three episodes. 

The book Randall was reading, Homegoing, is one of the best books I have ever read. Couldn't put it down. Highly recommend it.

 

Yusuf Islam is his name now

Yes, this was the first time that I saw Mandy as Rebecca who had aged and the young and middle aged woman she'd been. Before I saw Rebecca as Mandy Moore in prosthetics, more or less. I remember watching Saving Mr. Banks, I really love that movie. Tom Hanks came on as Walt Disney and I was like, um sure. However, about 1/4 through the movie, I completely believed Tom as Walt. My mom said that I "swallowed the pill". So, yeah, it took 6 years to buy old Rebecca! She did a great job last night and deserves an Emmy, but the field, now in days, is so stacked.

[Eureka]

9 hours ago, Violetgoblin6 said:

 

 

My thoughts: lol with Malik's Boston setup and Randall's Philadelphia setup, they're exactly the same set. And it's the same set used for Sophie in NYC. It's rather hilarious, especially when they show it mere minutes later! 

And it looks nothing like the part of Cambridge around Harvard.

[Violetgoblin6]

https://www.eatnpark.com/

 

 

So, I was curious and kind of craving those Smiley cookies, so I googled Eat n Park. Yep, they actually still exist in Pennsylvania and Ohio. I'm on the other side of PA (heh, actually near the supposed and to me, comical cabin location...near Bethlehem, not Poconos, lol!) and it appears most are in western and west central Pennsylvania. Altoona, Butler, and of course several in the Pittsburgh area, including the Pearson hometown of Bethel Park. 

Above, a sad picture of the defunct State College location. It closed in 2015. 

Yeah, the cookies were indeed sugary (overly so), but they really hit the spot after a night of partying, booze, and a greasy "hangover breakfast", oh to be young again. 😉

 

About the wasted sandwiches, I totally noticed that too. Annoying, but happens all the time on tv. The Bachelor is the worst.

[watch2much]

17 hours ago, circumvent said:

 

 

Yusuf Islam is his name now

totally aware of that and not trying to dis him.  but he was Cat Stevens when that song came out and thus more associated with that name in the time period.

[watcher1006]

Entirely good for Randall and Deja that Rebecca chose to go on the road trip with her son. In addition to the time that Rebecca and Randall could spend together she slowed him down enough such that Randall, Deja, and Malik could think through their situations before the three came together. That which is said or done on impulse is all too often destructive.

[CdrJanny]

3 hours ago, Eureka said:

And it looks nothing like the part of Cambridge around Harvard.

And the scenes from the early years look nothing like any part of Pittsburgh and the hospital where they were born is nowhere near Bethel Park, where they supposedly lived.  As with everything relating the Pearson family, geography and scenery are fluid. 

[circumvent]

3 hours ago, watch2much said:

totally aware of that and not trying to dis him.  but he was Cat Stevens when that song came out and thus more associated with that name in the time period.

Some people replied here that he goes by Cat Stevens/Yusuf so that's fair. I wasn't aware of that

As for using the name that he was using at the time the music came out, that's not really a thing because we are referring to the artist and the artist changed their name - which in his case it could be either one but because he goes by both/either, not because of the date of his music.

 

 

[debraran]

Washington Post had nice article on him recently. He does use both names now and lessened his music rules and is touring again. I always like his music and Father & Son especially.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/magazine/2021/09/20/yusufcat-stevens-reemerges-public-stage-how-should-we-feel-about-his-music-his-legacy/

[madmax]

14 hours ago, Violetgoblin6 said:

Yeah. My husband went to Penn State main campus in the mid 90s. I used to visit him and even lived there in spring 97. I loved the breakfast and then we'd get yellow and pink happy face cookies. So delicious and I'm not even a fan of those frosted sugar cookies. Miss it. I wonder if the whole chain disappeared like so many things do. 

 

It's already been stated, but Eat n' Park is still around.  They just reopened their buffet!!!

5 hours ago, ams1001 said:

I guess the place didn't have any kind of monitored alarm system... When I worked retail (granted it was a big chain store and not an independent place) if the alarm was turned off outside of regular store hours (plus an hour or two before and after) the store manager would have gotten a phone call. (When they're there later for things like inventory or carpet cleaning they have to notify the alarm company ahead of time.) So even if it was another manager with keys, they would be asking questions if they went into the store when no one was supposed to be there. 

I don't think alarms were so prevalent back then, especially on smaller mom & pop type places.  Plus Bethel Park was a higher class neighborhood.

[watch2much]

59 minutes ago, circumvent said:

Some people replied here that he goes by Cat Stevens/Yusuf so that's fair. I wasn't aware of that

As for using the name that he was using at the time the music came out, that's not really a thing because we are referring to the artist and the artist changed their name - which in his case it could be either one but because he goes by both/either, not because of the date of his music.

 

 

again, no disrespect to him...gesh it was just a song I grew up with and liked a lot. unlike others, I had no reaction to his changing his name...and btw if you put the name of the song in google you get videos of the original song by Cat Stevens...later years uses both names.  gesh!  who can forget the time period when everyone had to say "the artist formerly known as Prince" when he changed his name to a symbol.

Edited March 31, 2022 by watch2much

[gonzosgirrl]

3 hours ago, circumvent said:

Some people replied here that he goes by Cat Stevens/Yusuf so that's fair. I wasn't aware of that

As for using the name that he was using at the time the music came out, that's not really a thing because we are referring to the artist and the artist changed their name - which in his case it could be either one but because he goes by both/either, not because of the date of his music.

 

My 45 says Cat Stevens ;)

[Johnny Dollar]

Jack coddled young Kate so much that she was never able to develop a sense of self and led a mostly aimless life.

Jack raised young Kevin with his so much toxic masculinity that he hasn’t been able to form a meaningful relationship with a woman into his 40s.

Jack ignored young Randall so much that he grew up with a hero complex and a giant bag of neuroses.

Jack was an alcoholic who didn’t allow Rebecca to have a say in how their kids were raised.

Jack abandoned his PTSD suffering brother to such an extreme extent that he told his family that he was dead, leaving the man alone and in despair for decades.

Jack effectively tossed aside his mother once she got up enough courage to leave her abusive husband.

Jack was an awful father, husband, brother and son. 

[CdrJanny]

43 minutes ago, Johnny Dollar said:

Jack was an awful father, husband, brother and son. 

Sing it, brother!

[maggiemae]

Don't forget Rebecca called Randall SO WONDERFUL and Jack said he would be a GREAT MAN.

Never even close terms for Kevin and Kate.

 

 

 

Edited April 1, 2022 by maggiemae

[chocolatine]

32 minutes ago, maggiemae said:

Don't forget Rebecca called Randall SO WONDERFUL and Jack said he would be a GREAT MAN.

Never even close terms for Kevin and Kate.

He did tell Kate that she's a better singer than Alanis Morissette. 

[debraran]

7 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

Jack coddled young Kate so much that she was never able to develop a sense of self and led a mostly aimless life.

Jack raised young Kevin with his so much toxic masculinity that he hasn’t been able to form a meaningful relationship with a woman into his 40s.

Jack ignored young Randall so much that he grew up with a hero complex and a giant bag of neuroses.

Jack was an alcoholic who didn’t allow Rebecca to have a say in how their kids were raised.

Jack abandoned his PTSD suffering brother to such an extreme extent that he told his family that he was dead, leaving the man alone and in despair for decades.

Jack effectively tossed aside his mother once she got up enough courage to leave her abusive husband.

Jack was an awful father, husband, brother and son. 

I wasn't so extreme but agree with much of what you said. I guess it was always in contrast to his big and romantic type of gestures. I never thought that overrode the other things. My dad was a 60's dad for my life, mom was home a lot but always had her 50/50 in decisions, she handled the bills, wrote out what she paid for him but he rarely looked at it. He didn't tell my mom she needed to make me costumes or feed me ice cream but asked her. She helped decide where to go on vacation, he didn't tell her. He never would have dumped his brother like that or lied about his death (still makes me shake my head) No one is perfect but that type of man is not "ideal" to me.  When someone said my brother was a "sissy" for not liking sports as much as other boys, he said he didnt have to play baseball, they still enjoyed watching it together. I can't even imagine my dad saying "he's going to be a man one day" while being much more aggressive than with his daughter in the pool. Sure my dad was "boring" in some ways, no big speeches or grand gestures but I appreciate the respect he had for my mom, for her brains, for seeing her as his equal and when he passed, she mourned a lot but didn't need my brother taking her on dates with him (Randall did that!) or babysitting because she didn't know how to do things.

I don't understand how she yelled at Kevin's counseling how no one was there for her, Randall stayed but Kevin left and I guess Kate was too damaged to help. Really this was not a strong family. And in Kevin's group session you saw how you couldn't break the bubble, say anything was wrong or not perfect or you'd be shut down.

We are all imperfect, I personally don't like grand gestures all the time or long speeches and I really don't like anyone making decisions for me, whether where we live, jobs or bringing home another child while I was mourning the one I lost.

Jack had good traits but his faults, were always overlooked. Even Milo thought some of the writing was "off" for his character, especially the Nicky part. He had hoped if Jack lived, that would be corrected.