S01.E07: Sex and the Widow

[JeanJean]

51 minutes ago, gorgy said:

Oh look, Seema just so happened to have signed Carrie up for dating apps 

Which seems to me really inappropriate to do to someone who lost her beloved just a year ago - unless she says she wants to. I realize in viewer time it's only been a week or two that they've been friends while in show time it's been a year, but still, it was jarring.

I hope at some point Carrie reads from her book. 

Just now, JeanJean said:

 

whups

Edited January 15, 2022 by JeanJean

[Alice Mudgarden]

2 hours ago, Toodleoo said:

Zuritsky also wonders if the criticism of Steve’s story line is rooted in some “lopsided gender issue…you feel angry at her and more protective of him.” 

Oh, piss off.

[Ms Blue Jay]

People usually feel protective of the PERSON BEING CHEATED ON.

Who should we feel protective of?  MIRANDA?  WHAT DOES SHE NEED PROTECTION FROM?  BECOMING AN ASSHOLE?  TOO LATE.

Edited January 15, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[MBayGal]

12 hours ago, Toodleoo said:

That’s what I didn’t get—Miranda, Charlotte, and LTW were all annoyed with their overly bumbling/boring spouses in this episode. Yes, SOs can get annoying from time to time but why have an episode where nearly every male in a relationship is portrayed as a doofus, unless you have a bigger point to make (because if you do, then MAKE it already)?

Maybe the point they/CN is making is that being with another woman is better than being with a man. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Whiplash coming from SATC which totally celebrated men, sex with men, dating men, love of men, to this!  Think about Samantha's character, how she loved men so much and celebrated every facet of them (except for their hearts) LOL.

[ruby24]

I'm honestly wondering if they don't think Miranda is "cheating" on Steve or having an affair is because Che isn't a man? Is that why Miranda doesn't think it either? That's why it's something different or it doesn't count or something.

Edited January 15, 2022 by ruby24

[WendyCR72]

1 minute ago, ruby24 said:

I'm honestly wondering if they don't think Miranda is "cheating" on Steve or having an affair is because Che isn't a man? Is that why Miranda doesn't think it either? That's why it's something different or it doesn't count or something.

Or they justify it as Miranda "finding her true self" or some shit and make it so Steve doesn't have the right to be pissed if he finds out...

Which is garbage, but I'm sure it is what these hacks believe.

[Lethallyfab]

8 hours ago, Jillybean said:

 

Re Charlotte shrieking at Harry in the street: is this the first time we've ever heard Charlotte say "fucking" (at least, as an adjective

 

One of the best moments in the original series is when Charlotte gets drunk with her prim sorority friends in the ‘Frenemies’ episode and bemoans Trey’s impotence saying she just wants to get “really pounded” and “really fucked, you know.”

This episode had the mom fans stanning over Che after a Vulture article and Vulture has naturally struck back with an article asking all the important questions about Che and I feel vindicated:

“Are we supposed to like Che?
I guess? The show has all the characters talk about them as a “comedy prophet,” but the comedy on its face is like Nanette sent through Google Translate a few times, and their actions with Miranda imply they freely fuck around with whoever — especially privileged cis women, given the fan attention Che gets at the school fundraiser. That’s all well and good, but as a general rule, maybe don’t fuck around with your co-worker’s married friends?”

Their comedy DOES feel like it has been sent through Google Translate.  Or what aliens observing comedy would think what comedy is despite not having actual comedy on their home planet.

And ALSO:

”From there on, Miranda is pretty much simping for Che to the point that she spends months waiting on an unanswered text and fantasizes about getting fingered again in her dreams (which all occur in a strange, brightly lit white space, as if they are both elves in Lord of the Rings)”

Which, I hate the demographic that uses the term “simping” to the point of excess, but Miranda is 1000% a simp for Che and I’m dying at the LOTR elf imagery.

(please excuse my edits, I’ve yet to figure out how to properly juggle multiple quotes/links in a single post and am trying my best.)

Edited January 15, 2022 by Lethallyfab
To add more info

[Zonk]

2 hours ago, Lethallyfab said:

fantasizes about getting fingered again in her dreams (which all occur in a strange, brightly lit white space, as if they are both elves in Lord of the Rings)”

Well now I have a bunch of pictures of elves fingering each other in Rivendell in my head. Mainly male elves, because that's just my brain...

[EllenB]

I have a question. In all the years (almost two decades) the Terrible Trio were married to Moe, Larry, and Curly, did they never socialize with anyone except each other? Did Moe not have some bajillionaire pals with spouses/SOs that Carrie might have made friends with at least one of them?  Same with Curly and law partners/high-roller clients, also Charlotte's museum connections? Well, maybe not Larry and Miranda, because apparently he's a doddering old fool and she's his reluctant live-in keeper 🙄. But in the whole silly insta-aging in which none of them have never met a person of color or LGBTQ+, I guess they've never met and befriended any other people, period. No wonder they're acting like such twits.

And I'm sorry, but Charlotte is not MOMA board rich. Those boards are made of seriously old, deep money and super high-powered CEOs or their spouses, and a few recent POCs who are dragged out at public functions. Charlotte MIGHT be in a Friends of MOMA fundraising group, but even that's a stretch. Even someone as rich as Carrie is now would not be too welcome since she married way up and certainly didn't attend the right schools.

I'm trying to wrap my head around a teacher dating someone in Carrie's financial bracket. Nope, not happening. 

[RedHawk]

When Miranda asked Carrie if Che ever mentioned her, Carrie said that Che had been to Los Angeles a couple of times recently and had ridden “all the rides”. She’s warning Miranda that Che’s a player. They have a whole conversation about how sex with Che has changed Miranda’s life.

But then when Carrie arranges for Che to do a stand-up routine at the school auction, Carrie doesn’t bother to tell Miranda that Che will be there. (“Oops, sorry Miranda, forgot to mention that the person you have a massive stupid crush on would be here. Don’t blame me, my husband died.”) Dumb plot contrivance. No internal logic at all.

Why was Miranda there? She had nothing better to do than attend a fundraiser for a school her kid doesn’t even attend? Ok, sure, supporting Charlotte, and Carrie because Carrie’s still so fragile. Whatever. Oh and Anthony tagged along, too, and got a hand job. How much did he bid for it? 

Edited January 15, 2022 by RedHawk
Grammar

[Jane Tuesday]

3 hours ago, Zonk said:

I think if you asked any 17 year old boy they would be comfortable banging on top of their parents if that was the only option.

Teenagers having sex in their parents homes is just normal in most of europe

Okay, but Brady is American, so...

It's been a few years, but I actually remember this coming up as a discussion in my Sexuality course in college. Our professor asked, if you took home your college BF/GF to meet your parents, would you have sex in your parents' house? The universal answer was between "hell, no" and "maybe, if they weren't home, but still maybe not". So I'm still not buying that Brady and his GF are both so laissez-faire about the whole thing. 

[SlovakPrincess]

It does seem odd that none of the ladies made “couple friends” with their spouses along the way, and shouldn’t Charlotte have already collected a bunch of mom friends over the years her kids were growing up?   Making friends as you age is hard, but with the money at least Carrie and Charlotte have, they would have a more expanded social circle by now.  They could get some mileage from Carrie feeling sad and awkward around the couples she befriended with Big, but it sounds like they rarely talk about the day to day of her married life.
 

The idea of Carrie moving back into her old apartment is so oddly depressing to me.  
 

I loved that scene where Charlotte got drunk at lunch and horrified her old sorority sisters by talking about Trey’s problems in bed.  Even when the show explored bad sex back in the day, it was fun.  

[Trillian]

3 hours ago, RedHawk said:

Why was Miranda there? She had nothing better to do than attend a fundraiser for a school her kid doesn’t even attend? Ok, sure, supporting Charlotte, and Carrie because Carrie’s still so fragile. Whatever. Oh and Anthony tagged along, too, and got a hand job. How much did he bid for it? 

Good point.  There was also the piano recital, which everyone was expected to attend. I have close friends whose children I’ve known since their birth, and I’ve never once gone to any of their kids’ school events.  Nor would it occur to me to subject my friends to any of my kids’ events.  I’d happily help any of them to the bathroom after she had surgery, but there are some lines you just don’t cross.

9 minutes ago, Jane Tuesday said:

Okay, but Brady is American, so...

It's been a few years, but I actually remember this coming up as a discussion in my Sexuality course in college. Our professor asked, if you took home your college BF/GF to meet your parents, would you have sex in your parents' house? The universal answer was between "hell, no" and "maybe, if they weren't home, but still maybe not". So I'm still not buying that Brady and his GF are both so laissez-faire about the whole thing. 

Oh for God’s sake, I found it awkward sharing a bed with my husband in my childhood home, let alone having sex.  

[luna1122]

4 hours ago, RedHawk said:

When Miranda asked Carrie if Che ever mentioned her, Carrie said that Che had been to Los Angeles a couple of times recently and had ridden “all the rides”. She’s warning Miranda that Che’s a player. They have a whole conversation about how sex with Che has changed Miranda’s life.

But then when Carrie arranges for Che to do a stand-up routine at the school auction, Carrie doesn’t bother to tell Miranda that Che will be there. (“Oops, sorry Miranda, forgot to mention that the person you have a massive stupid crush on would be here. Don’t blame me, my husband died.”) Dumb plot contrivance. No internal logic at all.

 

I've seen this sentiment over and over, but don't quite get why Carrie is such a bad friend for not mentioning it to Miranda. While it's more than likely that she's just too self absorbed to think of it, maybe she just didn't tell her because she doesn't want to encourage Miranda's weird Che obsession? She knew Miranda would see Che, wig out and go stalk her, but maybe she didn't want to actually be party to it, tell her beforehand and have to see/hear Miranda babbling like a schoolgirl about it. Carrie clearly doesn't think Che and Miranda are a good idea, for many reasons. Maybe she felt telling her beforehand would be enabling? 

 

Edited January 15, 2022 by luna1122

[RedHawk]

35 minutes ago, luna1122 said:

I've seen this sentiment over and over, but don't quite get why Carrie is such a bad friend for not mentioning it to Miranda. While it's more than likely that she's just too self absorbed to think of it, maybe she just didn't tell her because she doesn't want to encourage Miranda's weird Che obsession? She knew Miranda would see Che, wig out and go stalk her, but maybe she didn't want to actually be party to it, tell her beforehand and have to see/hear Miranda babbling like a schoolgirl about it. Carrie clearly doesn't think Che and Miranda are a good idea, for many reasons. Maybe she felt telling her beforehand would be enabling? 

 

Or maybe Carrie could have declined to ask Che to be part of the event? Charlotte would have understood.

Carrie is so mortified at unexpectedly seeing her date at the auction that she has to have Anthony assist her in sneaking out rather than simply saying or waving hello to the guy and re-joining her friends. Since it's possible that Miranda might feel similar embarrassment she should have been given the choice to attend or not. But yeah, another good reason is that Carrie is just that self-absorbed and immature.

Also, once again missing Samantha, who would have bid $5,000 for Carrie in a heartbeat. And another thing, why wasn't Seema there, if Carrie needed so much support? Heck, she would have bid faster than Charlotte. Let's assume Seema was somewhere on a bad date.

Edited January 15, 2022 by RedHawk

[luna1122]

23 minutes ago, RedHawk said:

Or maybe Carrie could have declined to ask Che to be part of the event? Charlotte would have understood.

 Since it's possible that Miranda might feel similar embarrassment she should have been given the choice to attend or not. 

I don't think it's Carrie’s responsibility to not even ask Che because of Miranda (and once again, it's creepy that Che has put their employee in the position to have to worry about her boss's sexual conquests with her friends), but good point about maybe Miranda should have been given the option of knowing Che would be there, and possibly avoiding them by not going. 

But we, and Carrie, know that was never going to happen. Miranda was gonna show up for whatever crumbs Che was going to give her. 

[EvergreenLove]

Late to the party, so apologies if any of my points are repeats!

Charlotte's anger over the apology to Harry seems more to do with her desire to keep tennis as her own solo hobby.  Nothing wrong with that, but just say that to your husband rather than curse him out on the street and childishly withhold apologies.

Same with Miranda. Compare her reaction to seeing Robert Leeds in their hallway (after the cheerleader incident) versus seeing Che.  I really liked that Che told her to ask for what she wants directly, but why should a side fling be the one to remind her of this character trait that she already mastered years ago?

These are just a few examples of what is really grating to me about this show - we're to believe that these characters have shown ZERO meaningful growth from their thirties?  It's become insulting to my intelligence.

Ironically, the only one who HAS evolved is...Samantha.

Edited January 15, 2022 by EvergreenLove

[RedHawk]

The reason these three gals don’t have other friends (besides the newbies) is that no other women will put up with their foolishness. Samantha moved to another country to get away from them. 

Edited January 15, 2022 by RedHawk

[Yeah No]

17 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

And the writers seem to get some kind of kick out of indiscriminate sex.  So Anthony chimes in that he was getting a hand job from a wait staff person?  Why do they think that’s impressive?  Is he crazy?  This is a school fund raiser.  The immaturity of the script is astounding.

17 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Those writers are sooooooooo out of touch.  With life, with women, with 2022, with adults, with reality.  But we already knew that.

I think what is becoming apparent to me is that the writers of this series, who I've read are all 40 or under (other than MPK) and are all or mostly male are writing this show from the perspective of young men of their own generation, which when it comes to sex has a different outlook from the core generations of women that watched SATC.  They are not in touch with what women 55+ are thinking and feeling and are writing this as if the characters are younger and more immature.  And even when they DO try to put themselves in our shoes in order to represent us, they come up woefully lacking and dependent on stereotypes and appearances that don't bear much resemblance to the reality, and so they end up insulting us to boot.

What's worse is that they seem to inject these "shocker" situations into the show as if to "show" our generation that we are sexually repressed and out of touch with ourselves and need to be jolted into a more progressive and open attitude toward sex.   Like Carrie acting all shocked at the podcast and told to step her pussy up.  And Miranda having the best orgasm of her life being fingered, LOL.  That to me is one of THE most insulting implications of all.  If they only knew how MY sex life was before they were even BORN it would probably shock most of them!  Not to mention how it is NOW!  It just goes to show all the negative assumptions and stereotypes they are working from while at the same time coming from some kind of high ground about being more progressive on issues of sex and sexuality.....NOT!  

[ivygirl]

15 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Whiplash coming from SATC which totally celebrated men, sex with men, dating men, love of men, to this!  Think about Samantha's character, how she loved men so much and celebrated every facet of them (except for their hearts) LOL.

Right? They may have had good points, bad points, but they somehow resembled real human men that someone, somewhere along the line would have been attracted to—rather than cardboard plot points. Men and women did rotten and hurtful things, but it was all (well, mostly all) acknowledged for what it was. Many of us had affection for the key players—I mean, I know Berger was kind of petulant, but I still found he had some appeal and humor; and someone here said they liked Richard (whom I never found appealing—but it shows there was something attractive about his character, to some women). 

9 hours ago, 27bored said:

 

LOL! Yes. We need a run-in with Skipper! [the quote got deleted!]

I mean, even HE could probably find a lid for his pot. (Sorry, Che… not THAT kind of pot. On that note, maybe pot is the lid for Che’s pot.)

Edited January 15, 2022 by ivygirl

[Ms Blue Jay]

4 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I think what is becoming apparent to me is that the writers of this series, who I've read are all 40 or under (other than MPK) and are all or mostly male are writing this show from the perspective of young men of their own generation, which when it comes to sex has a different outlook from the core generations of women that watched SATC.  They are not in touch with what women 55+ are thinking and feeling and are writing this as if the characters are younger and more immature.  And even when they DO try to put themselves in our shoes in order to represent us, they come up woefully lacking and dependent on stereotypes and appearances that don't bear much resemblance to the reality, and so they end up insulting us to boot.

It appears that all of the writers, aside from MPK, are women.  Names: Julie, Elisa, Keli, Samantha, and Rachna. However, I would agree with you that they are probably too young.  That's just my guess, I don't know their ages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_Just_Like_That...

Edited January 15, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[RedHawk]

3 minutes ago, ivygirl said:

Right? They may have had good points, bad points, but they somehow resembled real human men that someone, somewhere along the line would have been attracted to—rather than cardboard plot points. Men and women did rotten and hurtful things, but it was all (well, mostly all) acknowledged for what it was. Many of us had affection for the key players—I mean, I know Berger was kind of petulant, but I still found he had some appeal and humor; and someone here said they liked Richard (whom I never found appealing—but it shows there was something attractive about his character, to some women). 

LOL! Yes. We need a run-in with Skipper! [the quote got deleted!]

I mean, even HE could probably find a lid for his pot. (Sorry, Che… not THAT kind of pot. On that note, maybe pot is the lid for Che’s pot.)

Che probably smokes a lid of pot a day!

[Ms Blue Jay]

15 minutes ago, ivygirl said:

Right? They may have had good points, bad points, but they somehow resembled real human men that someone, somewhere along the line would have been attracted to—rather than cardboard plot points. Men and women did rotten and hurtful things, but it was all (well, mostly all) acknowledged for what it was. Many of us had affection for the key players—I mean, I know Berger was kind of petulant, but I still found he had some appeal and humor; and someone here said they liked Richard (whom I never found appealing—but it shows there was something attractive about his character, to some women). 

Exactly!  They were flawed human beings, but they were full human beings.  Their motivations were understandable.  Everyone could understand who Richard was, where he was coming from, because we knew men like that.  (Not saying his actions were forgivable) but we UNDERSTOOD who he was.  He was not a cartoon.  He was living, breathing, human character.  Berger was fascinating to me, extremely human, very neurotic, very understandable.  I didn't get the "appeal" of Aleks Petrovsky the character per se but I still found him fascinating and the relationship with Carrie was interesting and understandable.  And the list goes on.

Edited January 15, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[Yeah No]

15 hours ago, MBayGal said:

Maybe the point they/CN is making is that being with another woman is better than being with a man. 

Oh yeah, that too.  I totally believe that's the implication.  Why they can't write the script without insulting people is beyond me.  We don't care if Miranda finds that she likes being with women better than men but don't imply it's because a man is inferior in some way.  One of my rants is how today in order to be the most progressive some people seem to think righting social wrongs is all about putting certain segments of society up at the expense of others and scapegoating people based on age, gender, sexuality, race, whatever.  In other words, reverse prejudice.  The apologetics of the interviewees is BS and covering for that aspect of this reboot.

Edited January 15, 2022 by Yeah No

[EvergreenLove]

13 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

It appears that all of the writers, aside from MPK, are women.  Names: Julie, Elisa, Keli, Samantha, and Rachna. However, I would agree with you that they are probably too young.  That's just my guess, I don't know their ages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_Just_Like_That...

Julie Rottenberg and Elisa Zuritsky were writers on SATC and seem to be in their fifties.

Keli Goff and Samantha Irby are in their early forties.  Both have previous work that embraces themes of social justice, diversity, etc.

Rachna Fruchbom is 29 years old, previous credits include Parks and Recreation.

 

[TakomaSnark]

23 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

It appears that all of the writers, aside from MPK, are women.  Names: Julie, Elisa, Keli, Samantha, and Rachna. However, I would agree with you that they are probably too young.  That's just my guess, I don't know their ages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_Just_Like_That...

Julie Rottenberg (age unknown) and Elisa Zuritsky (approximately 52) both were writers/producers on OG SATC, so it's not a youth issue with them. They also worked on Divorce post-Sharon Horgan.

Samantha Irby (40) worked on Shrill, which I ditched after three episodes. Utter cringe/crap.

Sounds to me like the iron hand of MPK is the overriding issue, same as it was in the latter SATC seasons and both issues. 

[SunnyBeBe]

36 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I think what is becoming apparent to me is that the writers of this series, who I've read are all 40 or under (other than MPK) and are all or mostly male are writing this show from the perspective of young men of their own generation, which when it comes to sex has a different outlook from the core generations of women that watched SATC.  They are not in touch with what women 55+ are thinking and feeling and are writing this as if the characters are younger and more immature.  And even when they DO try to put themselves in our shoes in order to represent us, they come up woefully lacking and dependent on stereotypes and appearances that don't bear much resemblance to the reality, and so they end up insulting us to boot.

What's worse is that they seem to inject these "shocker" situations into the show as if to "show" our generation that we are sexually repressed and out of touch with ourselves and need to be jolted into a more progressive and open attitude toward sex.   Like Carrie acting all shocked at the podcast and told to step her pussy up.  And Miranda having the best orgasm of her life being fingered, LOL.  That to me is one of THE most insulting implications of all.  If they only knew how MY sex life was before they were even BORN it would probably shock most of them!  Not to mention how it is NOW!  It just goes to show all the negative assumptions and stereotypes they are working from while at the same time coming from some kind of high ground about being more progressive on issues of sex and sexuality.....NOT!  

Good points.  I’m not sure who or why they are so clueless, but it’s inexcusable, imo.  

Edited January 15, 2022 by SunnyBeBe

[Yeah No]

1 minute ago, EvergreenLove said:

Julie Rottenberg and Elisa Zuritsky were writers on SATC and seem to be in their fifties.

Keli Goff and Samantha Irby are in their early forties.  Both have previous work that embraces themes of social justice, diversity, etc.

Rachna Fruchbom is 29 years old, previous credits include Parks and Recreation.

I just can't understand how former female writers of this series who are older themselves could have allowed all of this to happen.  They above anyone should have known better.  Perhaps the other writers got their way and they were voted down.  I could believe that, actually.

I think in their zeal to depict a more progressive attitude in the new series they're forgetting that it shouldn't come at the expense of the humanity and the essential character of the characters, nor should one character's new epiphany about themselves involve them hurting another character along the way and making them look completely insufficient in just about every way.  Not when we know that there could have been many other ways to handle it.  How could they show Miranda to be an asshole and then expect the audience to cheer her?  How stupid.  These writers should know better.

[Ms Blue Jay]

Especially when they knew the audience reactions to original SATC characters being assholes.  The writers knew how we felt about Carrie badgering Charlotte into giving her her engagement ring,  (we're still angry over it decades later LOL) and that's way less worse than adultery.

Edited January 15, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[EvergreenLove]

11 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I just can't understand how former female writers of this series who are older themselves could have allowed all of this to happen.  They above anyone should have known better.  Perhaps the other writers got their way and they were voted down.  I could believe that, actually.

I think in their zeal to depict a more progressive attitude in the new series they're forgetting that it shouldn't come at the expense of the humanity and the essential character of the characters, nor should one character's new epiphany about themselves involve them hurting another character along the way and making them look completely insufficient in just about every way.  Not when we know that there could have been many other ways to handle it.  How could they show Miranda to be an asshole and then expect the audience to cheer her?  How stupid.  These writers should know better.

Agreed. The writers missed almost every opportunity for growth and character development in their blindness for progressive themes.  A talented writing cast should have been able to seamlessly incorporate these ideas, and their lack of talent is now on full display.

[TakomaSnark]

4 minutes ago, EvergreenLove said:

Agreed. The writers missed almost every opportunity for growth and character development in their blindness for progressive themes.  A talented writing cast should have been able to seamlessly incorporate these ideas, and their lack of talent is now on full display.

Their only agenda should have been 'continue the story in a manner that is true to the characters but reflective of how people can change as they age.' Instead it's clear there were bulletpoints to 'represent' in a misguided effort to right the wrongs of the original series. 

The dual vomiting incident could have been legitimately funny if we got much more of Carrie and Peter's conversation/interaction/drinking but we got a brief, awkward meeting, a suggestion that they drink and boom, cut to them leaving and suddenly puking. We got Charlotte randomly attacking Harry for thinking his wife should have said 'sorry' for knocking him over on a tennis court. Where did that come from? There can be a legitimate underlying cause (well better than 'mansplaining') but we certainly didn't get it.

And for what, so we could see Nya and her husband get screamed at by a rando pedestrian? That was wasted time that should have been put elsewhere.

 

[Yeah No]

16 minutes ago, EvergreenLove said:

Agreed. The writers missed almost every opportunity for growth and character development in their blindness for progressive themes.  A talented writing cast should have been able to seamlessly incorporate these ideas, and their lack of talent is now on full display.

Agreed as well.  I also think the poor result is probably a function of too many writers at cross purposes with each other.  Instead of a complementary fusion of old and new they created a grotesque frankenmonster of progressive themes that don't respect or fit well with the original characters or even make good entertainment.  And then now they're so arrogant they can't even see it or want to take responsibility for it when most of the audience hates it.

Some of them are probably saying to each other "The audience just isn't ready for what we are saying".  BS.  That would be yet another insult.

[mansonlamps]

I don't even like the word thirdly.

Surely you like the word thrice though.😁

Sorry, nothing to add,  thought we all needed a dose of comedy from a well written show.

Edited January 15, 2022 by mansonlamps
My quote didn't come across as a quote for some reason, please ignore.

[Ms Blue Jay]

if you guys want to laugh, just search "Che Diaz" on Twitter, you will be entertained for hours.

Edited January 15, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[T Summer]

2 hours ago, ivygirl said:

Right? They may have had good points, bad points, but they somehow resembled real human men that someone, somewhere along the line would have been attracted to—rather than cardboard plot points. Men and women did rotten and hurtful things, but it was all (well, mostly all) acknowledged for what it was. Many of us had affection for the key players—I mean, I know Berger was kind of petulant, but I still found he had some appeal and humor; and someone here said they liked Richard (whom I never found appealing—but it shows there was something attractive about his character, to some women). 

LOL! Yes. We need a run-in with Skipper! [the quote got deleted!]

I mean, even HE could probably find a lid for his pot. (Sorry, Che… not THAT kind of pot. On that note, maybe pot is the lid for Che’s pot.)

 Richard was  appealing, but he was a prick.

You forgot perfect in every way Jerry Jarod a.k.a. Smith! He was a Saint!

[ifionlyknew]

As I said before it seems like these particular writers had stories they wanted to tell.  But they aren't stories that work with these characters.   I think they thought fans would be so happy to see the characters again they would just accept whatever they gave us.  And from the interviews the writers are giving there does seem to be a theme of if the viewer doesn't like it then they are the problem.  

[luna1122]

I miss Smith. 

[txhorns79]

21 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

I get the show needs drama, but why does it have to be constant cheating with this couple?

In fairness, the last time we know of that cheating was an issue for these two was 13 years ago.  While I don't care for the character of Che, I don't mind a storyline where Steve and Miranda fall apart again.  I've always thought their relationship felt a little forced.  I also wondered whether they would have eventually gotten married without having a kid to tie them together.  

[SFoster21]

7 hours ago, SlovakPrincess said:

It does seem odd that none of the ladies made “couple friends” with their spouses along the way, and shouldn’t Charlotte have already collected a bunch of mom friends over the years her kids were growing up?   Making friends as you age is hard, but with the money at least Carrie and Charlotte have, they would have a more expanded social circle by now.  They could get some mileage from Carrie feeling sad and awkward around the couples she befriended with Big, but it sounds like they rarely talk about the day to day of her married life.
 

The idea of Carrie moving back into her old apartment is so oddly depressing to me.  
 

I loved that scene where Charlotte got drunk at lunch and horrified her old sorority sisters by talking about Trey’s problems in bed.  Even when the show explored bad sex back in the day, it was fun.  

Never forgive this show for making Muad’dib impotent!

[Zonk]

9 hours ago, Jane Tuesday said:

Okay, but Brady is American, so...

... he should knock up his teenage girlfriend in the back of a pickup truck because that is tradition?

[27bored]

30 minutes ago, Zonk said:

... he should knock up his teenage girlfriend in the back of a pickup truck because that is tradition?

Well, between having sex while his parents are in the next room and smoking pot, in public, at a funeral, he seems headed in that direction. LOL.

But no. What we're saying is, that may be more the norm in Europe -- not that I would know for certain as I'm American -- but it's almost certainly not the norm here. At best, a teenager might sneak and have sex in their parents house when they're not there. But I think most teenagers would be embarrassed if their parents even knew they were having sex, like in general, so I'm sure they'd be mortified if their parents could hear them going at it in the next room. 

And the thing is, even if I were to suspend disbelief for Brady (since seventeen year old boys are horny all the time anyway), I have an even harder time believing he found a girl who's so chill with doing it in her boyfriend's parents' house...while they're there...in the next room. 

Edited January 16, 2022 by 27bored

[T Summer]

2 hours ago, TakomaSnark said:

Sounds to me like the iron hand of MPK is the overriding issue, same as it was in the latter SATC seasons and both issues. 

 

1 hour ago, ifionlyknew said:

As I said before it seems like these particular writers had stories they wanted to tell.  But they aren't stories that work with these characters.   I think they thought fans would be so happy to see the characters again they would just accept whatever they gave us.  And from the interviews the writers are giving there does seem to be a theme of if the viewer doesn't like it then they are the problem.  

I listened to a couple of those AJLT writer's room podcasts ep 5 and 6 particularly where MPK lead the discussions with  a few of the female writers and producers.  First off, it's so obvious this guy thinks every word he utters is pure genius.

He states Samantha Irby "crafted" and wrote  the Tragically Hip episode. Besides Carrie's hip surgery  and Miranda's sexual awakening it's the one where Rose discloses identifying as gender non binary and wishing to be called Rock.

MPK  mentioned "Kelly in the writing room had this weird congenital hip defect"

Samantha Irby states she has a wife who's youngest announced she was a lesbian on a Tik Tok and that's how  the family found out.

Julie Rottenberg, one of the producers  states "I wanted to show the real struggle and journey that parents can go through  as the parent of a kid who decided they were   gender non binary at a certain age". 

MPK added they always  check  in with the G.L.A.A.D. the LGBT+ media advisory board on these issues.

In the ep 6 podcast Rachna Fruchbom  who herself is Indian, spoke of wanting  to depict an Indian family living in Queens and  to highlight the  Diwali celebration.

 

So they did have a bunch of their own  stories they wanted to tell.  That, and they were going to address every lack of diversity criticism ever lobbed at the old series, right out of the gate. Kind of sounds like they didn't have time to do much real writing.

 

[ifionlyknew]

8 minutes ago, T Summer said:

 

I listened to a couple of those AJLT writer's room podcasts ep 5 and 6 particularly where MPK lead the discussions with  a few of the female writers and producers.  First off, it's so obvious this guy thinks every word he utters is pure genius.

He states Samantha Irby "crafted" and wrote  the Tragically Hip episode. Besides Carrie's hip surgery  and Miranda's sexual awakening it's the one where Rose discloses identifying as gender non binary and wishing to be called Rock.

MPK  mentioned "Kelly in the writing room had this weird congenital hip defect"

Samantha Irby states she has a wife who's youngest announced she was a lesbian on a Tik Tok and that's how  the family found out.

Julie Rottenberg, one of the producers  states "I wanted to show the real struggle and journey that parents can go through  as the parent of a kid who decided they were   gender non binary at a certain age". 

MPK added they always  check  in with the G.L.A.A.D. the LGBT+ media advisory board on these issues.

In the ep 6 podcast Rachna Fruchbom  who herself is Indian, spoke of wanting  to depict an Indian family living in Queens and  to highlight the  Diwali celebration.

 

So they did have a bunch of their own  stories they wanted to tell.  That, and they were going to address every lack of diversity criticism ever lobbed at the old series, right out of the gate. Kind of sounds like they didn't have time to do much real writing.

 

If they wanted to tell all those stories then they should have created a new show and wrote those stories. 

Maybe I'm taking this too personally but I loved SATC  and even though I knew this reboot was going to disappoint I was looking forward to spending more time with these characters. But it is now painfully obvious I care more about these characters than these writers do.  

Edited January 16, 2022 by ifionlyknew

[TakomaSnark]

11 minutes ago, T Summer said:

In the ep 6 podcast Rachna Fruchbom  who herself is Indian, spoke of wanting  to depict an Indian family living in Queens and  to highlight the  Diwali celebration.

I'd love to know how she felt about the finished product, because it seemed like the only real reason for that setpiece was to give Carrie another OTT getup (which was not a sari, despite all the discussion of one and a trip to sari shop that noticeably did not have saris) and hairdo. The Diwali celebration scene lasted two minutes - if that.

11 minutes ago, T Summer said:

First off, it's so obvious this guy thinks every word he utters is pure genius.

Was just reading about those elsewhere, he sounds positively insufferable.

Edited January 16, 2022 by TakomaSnark

[Ms Blue Jay]

No @ifionlyknew you are NOT taking it too personally.

What is the point of bringing back beloved characters if you are going to ignore who they are?  It's such a disservice to the fans.  I know I'm preaching to the choir but god it makes no damn sense to me.

Edited January 16, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[ifionlyknew]

1 minute ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

No @ifionlyknew you are NOT taking it too personally.

What is the point of bringing back beloved characters if you are going to ignore who they are?  It's such a disservice to the fans.  I know I'm preaching to the choir but god it makes no damn sense to me.

@Ms Blue Jay I remember you and I and our fellow SATC board  posters migrating to this board and speculating what would happen to the characters in the reboot and none of us had Carrie throws up on a date, Charlotte publicly berates Harry for rightfully expecting an I'm sorry after Charlotte knocked him down and Miranda starts an affair with an asshole in Carrie's kitchen on our bingo cards.

I will never understand why the writers have done this.

[T Summer]

6 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

If they wanted to tell all those stories then they should have created a new show and wrote those stories. 

Maybe I'm taking this too personally but I loved SATC  and even though I knew this reboot was going to disappoint I was looking forward to spending more time with these characters. But it is now painfully obvious I care more about these characters than these writers do.  

Well you know why they'd pick this vehicle, it was already wildly successful and a reboot  certain to be greenlighted. Now they can just fold in their pet issues and personal stories. A heck of a lot easier than being creative and writing new  stories!

 ... and they'd have to do it for a demographic that's more challenging to write for. There's  already a ton of TV shows and movies featuring 30somethings. 

[TakomaSnark]

6 minutes ago, T Summer said:

Well you know why they'd pick this vehicle, it was already wildly successful and a reboot  certain to be greenlighted. Now they can just fold in their pet issues and personal stories. A heck of a lot easier than being creative and writing new  stories!

 ... and they'd have to do it for a demographic that's more challenging to write for. There's  already a ton of TV shows and movies featuring 30somethings. 

Couldn't MPK reboot Two Broke Girls and stuff all this nonsense in there as his mea culpa for offensive stereotypes and be done with it? 

[TenaciousD]

49 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

If they wanted to tell all those stories then they should have created a new show and wrote those stories. 

EXACTLY this! It's like they couldn't care less who their audience is. I watched (and rewatch) SATC for escape. I like to laugh, enjoy the clothes, and remember a time when my biggest problem was analyzing what a guy did/said on a date.

Instead,  they've given us a poorly written drama and characters who've been rendered unrecognizable. I'm all for diversity and inclusiveness, but on a different show. I watch This is Us if I want to cry and be serious with an occasional joke...I hated having the rug pulled out from under me with this reboot.

The Miranda debacle just keeps getting worse and worse. I keep hearing her yelling at Steve "You broke us!" when he cheated...HOW is this the same character?!