S13.E05: How Nude

[biakbiak]

I keep seeing Ramona isn’t a hypocrite but literally we never heard about their “Catholic education” when Ramona, Luann and Sonja were out there getting strange and talking about it.why does suddenly “education” come in to it?

[ladle]

Who does Victoria remind me of? A younger Elizabeth Reaser?

[hypnotoad]

Quote

I'm not a fan of Leah, but I don't hate her either.  It amazes me though that Bethenny was absolutely worshipped and she's vulgar.

By the end, I wanted Bethenny gone too. For me, I think the difference is Bethenny was pretty clever and quick witted ... and semi-adult (?). Leah is an immature idiotic child who seems to only be bringing up this sex talk to appear edgy. Or maybe just to irritate everyone. I don't know if that makes any sense but it's how I feel.

 

Quote

I keep seeing Ramona isn’t a hypocrite but literally we never heard about their “Catholic education” when Ramona, Luann and Sonja were out there getting strange and talking about it.why does suddenly “education” come in to it?

I'm not sure where the Catholic upbringing suddenly came up but I will stand by the idea there is a time and place. Like I don't think anyone necessarily minds general sex talk at dinner but that's not at all what Leah was doing. And honestly why is every single conversation about sex with her and how much sex Ramona is or isn't getting? It's just weird and gross.

I find Leah aggressively wrong for this show. She doesn't fit in at all. So far I am good with Eboni but Leah can leave any time.

[lamujerdecente]

15 hours ago, CouchTater said:

As much as it pained me to watch the argument between Eboni and Lu, it can also be a conversation starter, or at least a thought provoker.

As a Black woman living/working in a mostly white world I have often "let things slide," for a go-along-to-get-along approach.  And as I'm sure Eboni has experienced, many things are about race for me because I'm constantly having to assimilate and/or fit in.  To be fair to non-POC people, they haven't experienced what I have and maybe can't fully understand it.  But it would be helpful if my experience and perception weren't dismissed as being overreactive and inauthentic.

It's a little triggering for me to read some of the "if Eboni insists on making everything about race..." comments.  Kudos to those who have the energy to try to explain why everything is about race for some of us.

And kudos to anyone who doesn't have the experience but can acknowledge that just because they don't see/hear it doesn't mean it didn't happen.  Maybe they just don't recognize it.  Thus, conversation.

I try hard to always engage but it ages u. It really does. Also hugs and light your way. 

Edited June 3, 2021 by lamujerdecente

[ladle]

So... Luann says that she equates not using foul language with "education."  I guess she means Catholic education, but Eboni assumes she means level of education (which is how I took it too) and replies that she has the most education of anyone at the table.  Luann takes this to mean that Eboni is calling her uneducated and gets upset.  Eboni explains that she was simply making an objective statement about degree level, and Luann tries to explain that by "education" she meant Catholic school, but nobody's listening to anyone else.  Luann calls Eboni angry, and Eboni explains why that's a harmful statement, but instead of listening and maybe trying to understand Eboni's perspective, Luann doubles down (Whyyyyy?!) and calls her angry again.  It's all over from there.

I don’t particularly care for Heather but she’s right. So much of the conflict on this show could be avoided if the women would quit talking over each other and actually listen.  But then I guess we wouldn’t have a show. 

Edited June 3, 2021 by ladle

[Cosmocrush]

14 hours ago, njbchlover said:

And guess what??  Yelling at a group of woman "DON'T TELL ME I DON'T HAVE CLASS!!!  YOU'RE A FUCKING HO, AND YOU'RE A FUCKING HO, YOU'RE A HO AND YOU'RE A HO!!!!" just kind of proves that no, you really don't have any class.

Hahaha!  So true. 

[ladle]

On 6/2/2021 at 12:02 AM, Marley said:

Remove Leah and this show would be so much better. I would even take the wack job Kelly Bensimon over Leah at this point. Even Aviva! Anyone is better then Leah. I’m blanking on someone worse then Leah lol.

Satan?  Danielle Staub?  Those high school football coaches who forced a Jewish teen to eat pork as punishment? 

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Folks,

• We are straying very far from the episode.  We can discuss broader issues in the Small Talk thread.  If you care to have these discussions please do so there. 
• If you find yourself going back and forth with one or two posters, it's time to stop.  No one wins an argument on the internet. No one wins.  These debates go far off topic and some responses violate the Be Civil rule.
• Discuss; don't lecture.  We are here to chat about a TV show.  This is not a university class. Take it to Small Talk where people can choose to engage in the discussion or not. 
• If someone's posts routinely annoy you, use the Ignore Feature.  Simply hover over their user name and select Ignore user on the pop-up box.  You will still see their posts if someone quotes them.

Many posts have been hidden.  Let's stay on track discussing the episode. Any posts going off-topic after this mod note will result in warnings as this is the second mod note in this thread reminding folks to stay on topic. 

[ladle]

On 6/2/2021 at 9:55 AM, RedDelicious said:

They should have just had a stripper because none of them have enough intellectual appreciation for an art lesson!

Wait, did you just call Luann uneducated??  Because uh oh!  

[BrownBear2012]

8 hours ago, Cosmocrush said:

Hahaha!  So true. 

Why is she on this show? She really has no storyline, it's apparent her family doesn't want to be on the show anymore and her Married to the Mob brand is less than exciting...and she's just a total a mess. If I was asked to describe her I would say she's combative , vulgar, rude, immature and a troll. She's about as interesting as Braunwyn on the OC.

Edited June 4, 2021 by BrownBear2012

[bosawks]

2 hours ago, 65mickey said:

Season 13 premier is the lowest rated premier in the RHOF NY history?  It was actually beat out by a show about 5 annoying kindergarteners. Way to go Bravo for putting on this crapfesst.

Wait, this isn’t a show about 5 annoying kindergartners?

[hoodooznoodooz]

8 minutes ago, bosawks said:

Wait, this isn’t a show about 5 annoying kindergartners?

Ha! You are funny.

[chewycandy]

PS when Ramona was going on about peenies and Ds and Vs and Cs...she should have said the only thing she abbreviates is “BI.” 

[Hiyo]

Not BJ?

[Kdawg82]

On 6/2/2021 at 2:06 AM, PrincessPurrsALot said:

Sonja is an artist, an entrepreneur, a designer of clothing and toaster ovens, a mentor to interns,

Hahaha oh yeah I forgot to mention this!!! "Running the bath....these are things that you can't learn at Wharton."  LMAO!!! Oh ok, Sonja. Well then why are you and why have you thrown away tens of thousands if not 100s of thousands of dollars sending your own daughter to exclusive schools?? You should've been having *her* run your bath and sharpie marker your vintage Chanel handbags? 🙄🙄

[Hangin Out]

4 hours ago, Cosmocrush said:

Hahaha!  So true. 

Excuse me everyone, but truthfully, what are Leah’s accomplishments.. I truly want to know since she’s calling everyone a Ho.  She had a child with an olderman who won’t marry her, she doesn’t get along with her parents and makes fun of them, and she makes ridiculous t-shirts “Married to the Mob”.  What is that supposed to mean?  Just being attractive doesn’t cut it.  Why was Bravo so enamored with her?  What was it about her that fired backwards and ruined the show?

[Chit Chat]

3 hours ago, bosawks said:

Wait, this isn’t a show about 5 annoying kindergartners?

Best comment of the day!!   I bet Heather is sorry that she came back to this shit show.  At least she didn't back down to Leah and actually owned everything she was accused of saying.  I always liked Heather.  She doesn't need this crap!  

[Cosmocrush]

13 hours ago, film noire said:

The Countess returned (farewell, Lu!) to share her definition of education; well rounded, well travelled, multi-tongued (yes, Countess, we're all impressed you can say "Please don't let it be about Tom" in French, English and Italian

This!!  Yes, The Countess was back in full force this episode.  I feel like she's never very far from the surface.  

[PrincessPurrsALot]

I find myself thinking about the way these women reacted to the male model.  That was flat out harassment.  He wasn't exactly professional with his I need someone to take off my towel BS, but they acted like a bunch of preteens that had never seen a naked man before.  So good to know he fluffed a bit before getting naked.  Then Ramona only draws his genitals.  I have been in classes with models, both male and female.  When you have one minute, you typically pick something to focus on.  I have drawings of hands, legs, shoulders, face shapes, etc.  Not once did I or anyone in class do cartoon drawing of a cock and balls or comment loudly about the person's body.  What do people normally say in these classes?  "That's a beautiful angle", "Can you lift your arm higher", "We would like to focus on <____> views", and finally "thank you".  

These women really are embarrassing. 

[Chit Chat]

21 minutes ago, PrincessPurrsALot said:

He wasn't exactly professional with his I need someone to take off my towel BS, but they acted like a bunch of preteens that had never seen a naked man before.

Hopefully he was in on the joke that this wouldn't be a serious art class and he would be modeling for a bunch of goobers.  I wonder if this is his usual kind of thing (let rich women ogle him and make juvenile comments), or if he does some modeling for serious students.  You can count on the HWs to embarrass themselves in these situations!  

[Cosmocrush]

So Victoria, Noel and The Niece are all artists?   What does that mean?  Do they have jobs on the side (like a gallery) or do they live on trust funds and paint?  Or do they actually make a living selling their art?   

Maybe they are self proclaimed artists like Sonja (what the heck was that?) or it's like Luann and her "music career" although to be fair, The Countess does sell tickets.  

 

[65mickey]

My daughter went to a performing and visual arts high school. She majored in visual arts. One of her classes was an AP studio arts class. This required  a class in drawing a nude male and female. These were 17 year old kids and I can say that none of them acted like these women. They were focused and serious. 

[Chit Chat]

5 minutes ago, Cosmocrush said:

So Victoria, Noel and The Niece are all artists?  

I knew that Victoria is an artist, but I hadn't heard about Noel or the Niece.  Some of Victoria's artwork is a little out there for my tastes! 

[chewycandy]

Luann didn’t mention Noel by name and he hasn’t made an appearance in awhile. I wonder if they have a strained relationship since that house debacle. 
 

[Cosmocrush]

2 minutes ago, chewycandy said:

Luann didn’t mention Noel by name and he hasn’t made an appearance in awhile.

My bad, I thought she said both Victoria and Noel were artists.  I know she mentioned Victoria and The Niece.  

Edited June 3, 2021 by Cosmocrush

[Feech]

Both Leah and Eboni are very poor fits for this show. I wonder where they are going to go from here? No Berkshires since Drunkrinda is out. No big trips because of Covid. No Cabaret performances. None of the other Housewives have a pot to piss in so they are not going to their house. We have already been to Ramona and Luanns Hamptons houses so there is no where else to go.

They should have thought about this before they brought on these two losers. 
 

I must say I am very impressed at how beautiful Luann’s Sag Harbor home is in this episode. The view into the bay were spectacular!

Edited June 4, 2021 by Feech

[Stats Queen]

20 minutes ago, 65mickey said:

My daughter went to a performing and visual arts high school. She majored in visual arts. One of her classes was an AP studio arts class. This required  a class in drawing a nude male and female. These were 17 year old kids and I can say that none of them acted like these women. They were focused and serious. 

I can’t draw a stick figure, but I do know that drawing and painting classes involving the human form (in all it’s glory) are important for serious artists and art students. I had a girlfriend in college who was a model for art students,
I was bothered by the fact that they male model/art subject said he couldn’t take the towel off himself. I am sure they were all playing for the camera, and the whole point of this was about admiring and drawing a picture of his most prominent feature. 
I just found the whole thing weird, which was entire point … - so thus I ramble

[Kiss my mutt]

2 hours ago, Hangin Out said:

Excuse me everyone, but truthfully, what are Leah’s accomplishments.. I truly want to know since she’s calling everyone a Ho.  She had a child with an olderman who won’t marry her, she doesn’t get along with her parents and makes fun of them, and she makes ridiculous t-shirts “Married to the Mob”.  What is that supposed to mean?  Just being attractive doesn’t cut it.  Why was Bravo so enamored with her?  What was it about her that fired backwards and ruined the show?

I’d argue that she isn’t even attractive even with her recent work. 

[Feech]

I wonder if Luann has access to that boat from last year? It would have been a lot of fun to see them out on the water. Luann’s dock looks perfect for a little runabout!

Edited June 4, 2021 by Feech

[chewycandy]

54 minutes ago, Cosmocrush said:

My bad, I thought she said both Victoria and Noel were artists.  I know she mentioned Victoria and The Niece.  

No, you were right, she mentioned “my son” and Noel is indeed an artist. Mine was just a separate thought!

[faraway]

I want to watch this episode again because I was multitasking while it was on and didn’t pay close attention.  But a few comments about what I remember:

I went to school for art (a long time ago) and didn’t think anything was weird or strange about having a life drawing session!  I anticipated that it might be interesting to see what the housewives would do to create an artwork observing a male body, especially since Victoria is an artist.  But the model, Victoria, and the ladies made a mockery of a traditional art activity. Victoria gave no direction before the activity. The male model allowed himself to be touched and did not carry himself in a professional manner. The ladies acted like this was a voyeur activity and then only drew his penis from what I saw. I agree with those who asked-what if the genders were switched? As it was, the session gave the wrong impression about those who do nude modeling for artists and artists who draw nude models.  
 

As a “white” woman, I have no problem with discussions of “race”.  I like to see different types of discussions on the show.  I want to hear how people feel in different situations. I want to see the women arguing a little bit. However, no one was listening to anyone else!  It was a great example of how not to talk about important matters. Everyone was guilty in the clip that was shown. 

I like Eboni so far. She isn’t perfect, but who is? I give her a pass, especially since she is new. 

Edited June 4, 2021 by Ms. Me

[Bluesky]

1 hour ago, Cosmocrush said:

So Victoria, Noel and The Niece are all artists?   What does that mean?  Do they have jobs on the side (like a gallery) or do they live on trust funds and paint?  Or do they actually make a living selling their art?   

Maybe they are self proclaimed artists like Sonja (what the heck was that?) or it's like Luann and her "music career" although to be fair, The Countess does sell tickets.  

 

Victoria is very talented and her paintings sell.  I wish they had shown her drawing 

[HunterHunted]

2 hours ago, Cosmocrush said:

So Victoria, Noel and The Niece are all artists?   What does that mean?  Do they have jobs on the side (like a gallery) or do they live on trust funds and paint?  Or do they actually make a living selling their art?   

Maybe they are self proclaimed artists like Sonja (what the heck was that?) or it's like Luann and her "music career" although to be fair, The Countess does sell tickets.  

Noel went to Maryland Institute College of Art.

Niece Nicole competed on season 1 of Work of Art, the art competition show on Bravo.

https://www.gq.com/story/this-week-on-work-of-1

[BrownBear2012]

3 hours ago, Hangin Out said:

Excuse me everyone, but truthfully, what are Leah’s accomplishments.. I truly want to know since she’s calling everyone a Ho.  She had a child with an olderman who won’t marry her, she doesn’t get along with her parents and makes fun of them, and she makes ridiculous t-shirts “Married to the Mob”.  What is that supposed to mean?  Just being attractive doesn’t cut it.  Why was Bravo so enamored with her?  What was it about her that fired backwards and ruined the show?

Good question…if I had to guess what the thinking was by the producers of the Real Housewives of NY it might be they were looking for another Bethenny   type but a little younger. She seems like an unhappy person and pretty miserable to be around. Fun for her is trolling Ramona with X rated sex talk and verbal porn.

[65mickey]

2 hours ago, Feech said:

Both Leah and Eboni are very poor fits for this show. I wonder where they are going to go from here? No Berkshires since Drunkrinda is out. No big trips because of Covid. No Cabaret performances. None of the other Housewives have a pot to piss in so they are not going to their house. We have already been to Ramona and Luanns Hamptons houses so there is no where else to go.

They should have thought about this before they brought on these two losers. 
 

I must say I am very impressed at how beautiful Luann’s Sag Harbor home is in this episode. The view into the bay were spectacular!

Heather has or at least she did have a home in the Berkshires. It was no Bue Stone manor but all of the housewives seemed to have a good time there except for Ramona.  Too bad they ran off Heather or they could have gone to her place. 

[BrownBear2012]

14 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

Noel went to Maryland Institute College of Art.

Niece Nicole competed on season 1 of Work of Art, the art competition show on Bravo.

https://www.gq.com/story/this-week-on-work-of-1

 

15 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

Noel went to Maryland Institute College of Art.

Niece Nicole competed on season 1 of Work of Art, the art competition show on Bravo.

https://www.gq.com/story/this-week-on-work-of-1

David Byrne of Talking Heads attended the Maryland Institute of Art. I think he left and went on to the Rhode Island School of Design but I could be wrong.

[Stats Queen]

48 minutes ago, 65mickey said:

Heather has or at least she did have a home in the Berkshires. It was no Bue Stone manor but all of the housewives seemed to have a good time there except for Ramona.  Too bad they ran off Heather or they could have gone to her place. 

Ramona needed to have air conditioning brought in. My hot flashes were beyond horrible for years, so I will give Ramona the benefit of the doubt for not being able to survive without subarctic weather. vThen she left anyway.

I thought Heather’s home was lovely. 
 

[BrownBear2012]

25 minutes ago, Stats Queen said:

Ramona needed to have air conditioning brought in. My hot flashes were beyond horrible for years, so I will give Ramona the benefit of the doubt for not being able to survive without subarctic weather. vThen she left anyway.

I thought Heather’s home was lovely. 
 

It wasn't fancy enough for the likes of Ramona and Sonja...it was truly a family vacation home. Ramona's Hampton's house is too Long Islandy for me. Some of the most stunning Hamptons homes are farmhouse style with big kitchens and open concept type of design. Large family rooms, big fireplaces, tall ceilings, cozy decks with large firepits. Ramona's home could be plunked down in Beverly Hills and fit in just fine. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

Noel went to Maryland Institute College of Art.

Niece Nicole competed on season 1 of Work of Art, the art competition show on Bravo.

https://www.gq.com/story/this-week-on-work-of-1

I used to love that show.

[eggplantparmfarm]

There's a lot to unpack with this episode.

• Leah is annoying and immature. If someone says a certain topic makes them uncomfortable, drop it. She has the maturity of an elementary school kid. 
• Eboni is a nice lady but a little too normal for this show, if that makes sense? I didn't appreciate her reference to "white fragility" when Ramona asked everyone to stop screaming. 
• LuAnn definitely knew what she was implying when she called Eboni an angry woman. And Eboni wasn't even angry! She was being very eloquent and measured, I thought. 
• LuAnn and Eboni were talking about two totally different things. Eboni was trying to say, "Just because a person is educated doesn't mean they don't use those words or get offended at them. I am highly educated and I use them/am okay with them." LuAnn was trying to say "Education is not just formal education, though. It also means the morals and value systems you are imparted with." They both completely missed each other's point. It might have been better for them both to say that yes, educated people can say those words, but only an educated person (in any sense of the word) has the class to know when not to say them.
• I'm disappointed in LuAnn. 

[TeeMo]

On 6/2/2021 at 8:47 PM, hypnotoad said:

If Leah is trying to be edgy she is failing badly. One shouldn't have to try quite so hard to be edgy. I think you kind of just are or you aren't. Like some people are funny and others aren't - trying to be funny never works out well.

 

Leah is quickly eroding my enjoyment of this show and I'm not sure how much longer this will remain in my dvr q.

I wish I could like this 500 times. I get so much second hand embarrassment watching Leah’s try hard antics. It is uncomfortable to watch. There have been plenty of fun to hate jerks to watch on this show but nothing about watching Leah is fun at all. 

[Hangin Out]

On 6/2/2021 at 1:00 AM, hoodooznoodooz said:

The lighting was very harsh during the interior scenes. I saw blotchy and rashy skin, more wrinkles, sun damage, cellulite. Lu looked haggard.

Yep.  Lu got very thin and it shows on her face.

[Hangin Out]

On 6/2/2021 at 9:02 AM, pasdetrois said:

Ramona presented an extremely sexualized persona during her first RHONY seasons, including around her young daughter and at her daughter's school activity - I think it was a dance? Mario and Avery were often embarrassed by those antics.

Just sayin'.

Yes, she did everything a husband would want .. dressing sexy, candles, wine, massages, playful .... yet he had an affair and left her.  For a very young girl no less.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[eleanorofaquitaine]

10 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

Noel went to Maryland Institute College of Art.

Niece Nicole competed on season 1 of Work of Art, the art competition show on Bravo.

https://www.gq.com/story/this-week-on-work-of-1

I was going to mention Work of Art - IIRC, she is pretty talented in her own right.

I think Ramona has alluded to her Catholic upbringing before. I think her daughter went to one of the fancier Catholic schools in NYC and if I remember correctly, one of her concerns about Alex and Simon was the impact it would have on that.  Lu has also mentioned being Catholic before (there was a scene I think of her and Dorinda last year at a church) though I also don't think Lu has mentioned it in terms of moral concerns.

So this is not the first time we've heard of Ramona not liking to talk about sex because of Catholic upbringing.  Granted, Ramona does seem to be selective about her outrage but I think she's been consistent over the years in saying that being Catholic informs her feelings about this stuff. 

[Chit Chat]

2 hours ago, eleanorofaquitaine said:

Granted, Ramona does seem to be selective about her outrage but I think she's been consistent over the years in saying that being Catholic informs her feelings about this stuff. 

So true!  Our Noodle would rather do the deed than talk about the deed!

[Lastwaltz]

On 6/2/2021 at 11:00 AM, charliesan said:

My point is, I understand that Eboni can get upset but this isn't a Diversity & Inclusion seminar on a multinational company, this is a HW show where the politically incorrect and absurd reign supreme. By HW standards I think being called "angry" isn't that big of a deal. 

Again, I really don't believe Lu was trying to make a racially insensitive comment and, to me, intent is everything. Frankly, I actually think the "white fragility" comment could be more triggering to Ramona, or at least she could be put on the defensive.  

Point taken about this being a HW show. But the purpose of those seminars are so that we can all carry what we learned, or at least operate with a keener awareness, of these kinds of situations in our lives. That doesn't end when the seminar is over -- its purpose is to educate us so that we can act with that knowledge later. Intent is indeed valuable to consider, but how do we actually know what Luann's intent was? 

[Feech]

Ramona has to disengage with Leah and stop trying to “educate “ her.

Similarly Luann needs to disengage with Eboni as attempting a relationship with her is a no win situation. The three OG’s should basically engage with each other and keep the interaction with the other two to a minimum. Or as much as they can with the demands of production.

I would led have enjoyed seeming more of their life in the Hamptons and Sag Harbor as opposed to nonsensical arguments about sex and race.

Thats not why you watch the Real Housewives.

[Jextella]

On 6/2/2021 at 1:11 PM, janiema said:

The career of the highly educated Eboni has consistently trended downward. After her good education she became a lawyer doing substantive work. However, she chose celebrity over substance to become a opinionated talking head. (I include all talking heads in this category). Now in a further slide down she has become a Real Housewife who will probably never be taken seriously again. No wonder she is angry.

I dunno.

I think/hope Eboni will use this new platform to do some good.

Thus far, she seems poised and rational. She doesn't get sloppy drunk or say crude things like Leah and insensitive things like Ramona. I think she'll naturally have a good reputation and people will listen to her.

 

 

 

Edited June 4, 2021 by Jextella

[Hangin Out]

52 minutes ago, Feech said:

I would led have enjoyed seeming more of their life in the Hamptons and Sag Harbor as opposed to nonsensical arguments about sex and race.

There’s not much more to see except the Montauk lighthouse, fishing villages and restaurants and traffic.

[Feech]

7 minutes ago, Hangin Out said:

There’s not much more to see except the Montauk lighthouse, fishing villages and restaurants and traffic.

All of which are preferable to inane arguments about sex and race.

For instance there is a cute consignment shop in Sag Harbor that sells formerly owned items of celebrities. Even the Real Housewives. The last time I was there they had Theresa’s prison jumpsuit.

Edited June 4, 2021 by Feech