S08.E16: Second Guessing

[RealReality]

6 hours ago, Gobi said:

I think Mike is suffering from alienation of affection.

Or affection of aliens.  

sorry, I couldn't help it!

[RealReality]

10 hours ago, TeapotWakeen said:

multiple people asked variations of why Mike's friend didn't just use her credit card -- there were plenty of times in my life where I either didn't have a credit card, or didn't have room on it for any purchases. I remember coming back from a work trip (pay on my card, employer eventually reimburses, shitty shitty company policy!!!) and having to call to find out if I had enough credit left for a sandwich in the airport. Ugh. Am grateful those days are over, but I know they're not for everyone.

I was kind of a hold-out on Mike's assholeness, didn't see it as clearly as you guys did, but boy was I wrong!! I need y'all to guide me through re-entering the dating scene because clearly I miss red flags until the flagpole hits me in the face.

LOL, me too....I'll be one of those fools who ends up on an episode of Dateline.

I think we were bamboozled because Mike got a good edit last time. 

Which was easy because Natalie was particularly awful.  So it was easy to make Mike the hero to her villain.  

I think they are both awful people.  Natalie is still the person she was last time she was on the show and she is still the person who called someone fat, ugly and stupid because she didn't get her way.  

I also think Mike is very conscientious of his "image" as the good guy.  Just a good 'ol boy!  Making pancakes with Uncle Bo and livin' on the farm!  Just a big, good natured farm boy!  I wouldn't be surprised if this is a lot of the reason why he gave Natalie back the ring....because he didn't want to look like the "bad guy" for breaking up with her or not giving her back the ring.  He should have broken things off after that blowout fight, because I really think it was at that point that he KNEW he didn't want to marry her.  Like knew FOR SURE.  

I still feel like Tamara could have done something, but I'm totally with the poster above who said they would have waited at the airport.  I would have done that too before I went back to Mikes.  I know that Natalie didn't have a ton of money, but I do think for a fairly low amount you can get into one of those lounges, right?  I'm not a first class flier myself, but am first class flier adjacent and my dad and brother LIVE for the Delta lounge.  ALSO, why the hell would Mike rent a room for Natalie and not put her name on it, or call to the hotel and let them know what was going on?

On 3/29/2021 at 4:57 AM, Pepper Mostly said:

Every season I ask myself "how on earth are they going to find a bigger bunch of losers than last season?". Then I am presented with the likes of Brandon, Mike, and Andrew. WHERE do they find these horrible people? Mike is just a terrible, awful, no good, very bad person. He never intended to marry Natalie, but apparently he brought her here on a fiancee visa just so he could get his petty revenge on her for throwing the ring back in Ukraine. He is cruel. Worst thing? He thinks he's a "nice guy". 

Mike is a "nice guy"

The way Ed is a "nice guy"

The way Andrew is a "nice guy"

The way Ash is a "nice guy"

 

[bravofan27]

This lot of folks are really interesting. I really think Mike had no intention of marrying Natalie and was perfectly fine with her staying in the US illegally and was hoping she would. When she hightailed it out of there and was 100 percent committed to going back to the Ukraine, I think Mike realized he had no choice but to marry her.  He realized that he couldn't continue to half ass the relationship, and he had to just deal with the fact she might move on at some point.  I think that Mike might have panicked realizing she was seriously going to leave and called the hotel and told them not to take his credit card. Or something, because Natalie was trying to leave, Mike was really trying hard to get her to stay. 

So everyone but Yara thinks Jovi is dumb as rocks. No wonder he likes her.

My husband asked if Brandon was transgender.

That's all. 

[Pepper Mostly]

15 hours ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

I am not into physical violence but I got a little stabby when Neighbor Tamara dismissed Natalie and DEFENDED Mike:  "He just wanted to give you a hug!"  Geezaloo, lady.  Way to support.

You just know that Tamara has read "50 Shades of Gray" about a hundred times and thinks controlling, abusive monster Christian Gray is the ultimate dreamboat. She probably cries at that creepy scene in "Love, Actually" too, and thinks its adorably romantic. You know the one I mean. "To me you are perfect". God, I feel the waves of nausea washing over me just thinking about it. 

[Shelbie]

I keep thinking that the drive back was producer driven because I would have told Mike to come to the hotel rather than make the return trip of three hours. It was the very least he could do.

[watchingtvaddict]

23 minutes ago, Shelbie said:

I keep thinking that the drive back was producer driven because I would have told Mike to come to the hotel rather than make the return trip of three hours. It was the very least he could do.

I'm thinking the hotel/flight/drive back was all a storyline because Mike and Natalie were always going to get married (because unless Natalie was okay with being out of status THEY DIDN'T HAVE A CHOICE). 

How was Natalie going to survive in Europe with no job and no money and no credit card after flying to France? She didn't have the funds for ONE NIGHT in the States. How was she going to fund multiple days trying to get back to the Ukraine with the borders closed?

If their storyline was just that... a story where they didn't get married and Natalie flew back home after the 90 Days, COVID really messed up their plans. 

90 Days is a TV show with crazy storylines but watching it gives me so much anxiety sometimes because it involves people playing around with the law and their legal status in the States. 

Edited March 31, 2021 by watchingtvaddict
I added an I somewhere for some reason...

[AZChristian]

1 hour ago, Shelbie said:

I keep thinking that the drive back was producer driven because I would have told Mike to come to the hotel rather than make the return trip of three hours. It was the very least he could do.

Tamara was said to be "Mike's neighbor."  She had to go back to Sequim anyway.

[Stuckathome]

OK, finally got to watch......

 

Rebecca/Zied: how did you not try on your dress before the day of the wedding?? Are you that much of a disaster? Depending on when exactly they were filming and the area, it is very possible that there were no tailors or dress shops open for her to run to and get another. Just go to the courthouse in your matching catfishing shirts (love that term BTW lol) and then after things open up, you can get a dress that fits, THEN do your fantasy ride in the carriage. Wearing the corset on the outside just looked horrible. And yeah, wedding dresses run way small. Back when I got married, I was in a size 8 or 10 and my dress was a 16.....Rebecca is not anything close to a size 10 or 12. I am not saying she is My 600 lb Life or Biggest Loser big, she is not----but she is a curvy woman who does not fit a 10 or 12. I think Zied was just so overwhelmed by the whole event, so different than anything he ever experienced back home that yes, he was super happy and excited by the carrriage and horse. I mean, think about it===when we see the foreign weddings, we assume they are classy affairs. Like Laura and Aladin. For all we know, anyone in Tunisia watching would snark the way we are on this wedding in GA. 

Tarik/Hazel: never thought I would like Tarik as one of the best this season, but I do. I still think he was a horndog, sex tourist (like DAvid from David and Annie), but I think along the way he grew up a bit, fell in love and realized he didn't want to be 50 plus still flying to Thailand paying for love. He treats Hazel like a queen and I do hope they last. However......based on how excited she was by that stripper, I think she truly is a lesbian, not bisexual. She wants to be married to Tarik because he treats her well and he offers a better life for her, and eventually her son, who I am sure she loves dearly. She vowed to be a good wife.....hopefully this is a marriage where each gets what they need from each other and can be happy. 

Nat/Mike: oh, what to say that hasn't been said. First, I do think Mike is serious alcoholic. They can run hot and cold, the long term damage from the drinking can dull their affect and emotions. He doesn't love her, but he doesn't hate having her around. I mean, he is gone like 18 hours a day and just wants to come home to a clean house, his beer and steak and some sex. I would like to think in her position, I would have done what someone else said on day 89---ask for the ticket and a ride to the airport or the cash for a hotel and say bye bye. It's the sunk cost fallacy and her biological clock messing with her head and heart. She really wants a family and up until a day ago, she thought she was getting that....to turn around and fly home, single and dumped at the alter WOULD BE HUMILIATING. She was absolutely right about that.....screw you Mike with your shrugs and non committal answers. He is lucky she hasn't bashed him over the head with a frying pan, grabbed some cash and made a run for the airport. 

Stephanie/Harris/Ryan: ON instagram 

Spoiler

Someone posted a screen shot of Stephanie's online dating profile on Bumble. In it she says she never married due to the time she devoted to building 2 businesses and earning 4 college degrees. Either it is a fake account and someone is mocking her, or this woman is truly delusional. In another AMA, she alluded to "many of you say you recognize me from Harvard." Um, I have an Ivy degree (Columbia) and never has anyone ever said "hey don't I know you from CU?" Apparently she earned a certificate from Harvard (like a weekend course).....wonder if that counts in her mind as a Harvard degree? 

 

[RealReality]

37 minutes ago, Stuckathome said:

OK, finally got to watch......

 

Rebecca/Zied: how did you not try on your dress before the day of the wedding?? Are you that much of a disaster? Depending on when exactly they were filming and the area, it is very possible that there were no tailors or dress shops open for her to run to and get another. Just go to the courthouse in your matching catfishing shirts (love that term BTW lol) and then after things open up, you can get a dress that fits, THEN do your fantasy ride in the carriage. Wearing the corset on the outside just looked horrible. And yeah, wedding dresses run way small. Back when I got married, I was in a size 8 or 10 and my dress was a 16.....Rebecca is not anything close to a size 10 or 12. I am not saying she is My 600 lb Life or Biggest Loser big, she is not----but she is a curvy woman who does not fit a 10 or 12. I think Zied was just so overwhelmed by the whole event, so different than anything he ever experienced back home that yes, he was super happy and excited by the carrriage and horse. I mean, think about it===when we see the foreign weddings, we assume they are classy affairs. Like Laura and Aladin. For all we know, anyone in Tunisia watching would snark the way we are on this wedding in GA. 

Tarik/Hazel: never thought I would like Tarik as one of the best this season, but I do. I still think he was a horndog, sex tourist (like DAvid from David and Annie), but I think along the way he grew up a bit, fell in love and realized he didn't want to be 50 plus still flying to Thailand paying for love. He treats Hazel like a queen and I do hope they last. However......based on how excited she was by that stripper, I think she truly is a lesbian, not bisexual. She wants to be married to Tarik because he treats her well and he offers a better life for her, and eventually her son, who I am sure she loves dearly. She vowed to be a good wife.....hopefully this is a marriage where each gets what they need from each other and can be happy. 

Nat/Mike: oh, what to say that hasn't been said. First, I do think Mike is serious alcoholic. They can run hot and cold, the long term damage from the drinking can dull their affect and emotions. He doesn't love her, but he doesn't hate having her around. I mean, he is gone like 18 hours a day and just wants to come home to a clean house, his beer and steak and some sex. I would like to think in her position, I would have done what someone else said on day 89---ask for the ticket and a ride to the airport or the cash for a hotel and say bye bye. It's the sunk cost fallacy and her biological clock messing with her head and heart. She really wants a family and up until a day ago, she thought she was getting that....to turn around and fly home, single and dumped at the alter WOULD BE HUMILIATING. She was absolutely right about that.....screw you Mike with your shrugs and non committal answers. He is lucky she hasn't bashed him over the head with a frying pan, grabbed some cash and made a run for the airport. 

Stephanie/Harris/Ryan: ON instagram 

  Hide contents

Someone posted a screen shot of Stephanie's online dating profile on Bumble. In it she says she never married due to the time she devoted to building 2 businesses and earning 4 college degrees. Either it is a fake account and someone is mocking her, or this woman is truly delusional. In another AMA, she alluded to "many of you say you recognize me from Harvard." Um, I have an Ivy degree (Columbia) and never has anyone ever said "hey don't I know you from CU?" Apparently she earned a certificate from Harvard (like a weekend course).....wonder if that counts in her mind as a Harvard degree? 

 

LOL

She probably trolls the bars around Harvard looking for 20 year olds with beer goggles.

[Colfrmb]

It occurs to me that I would really like to see the photos/videos from Rebecca’s previous 3 weddings.  I would not be surprised at all if at least one of them also included a Cinderella carriage.

[AZChristian]

1 minute ago, Colfrmb said:

It occurs to me that I would really like to see the photos/videos from Rebecca’s previous 3 weddings.  I would not be surprised at all if at least one of them also included a Cinderella carriage.

On the other hand, maybe NONE of them did, and she realizes that she's running out of time, money and willing men to keep trying for that darned carriage.  That's why it was so important to her.  She's not "princess" material.  More like "dowager fast-food manager."

[mamadrama]

12 hours ago, RealReality said:

.  I still feel like Tamara could have done something, but I'm totally with the poster above who said they would have waited at the airport.  I would have done that too before I went back to Mikes.  I know that Natalie didn't have a ton of money, but I do think for a fairly low amount you can get into one of those lounges, right?  I'm not a first class flier myself, but am first class flier adjacent and my dad and brother LIVE for the Delta lounge. 

 

The Seattle airport lounges were closed at that time. They were only letting us into the airport (not past security or to the gate but through the front door) if our flight was departing within 5 hours. This was last April, in WA, when everything was getting serious with the pandemic. 

I still think the real reason Natalie returned is because, off camera, she called him and said, "Look, asshole, you promised to marry me. You've fucked with me this whole time. My fucking country is shut down, I have no way of getting to or across my border from France, and you put the wrong fucking name on the hotel reservation.  Neither one of us are going to get a good edit. I'm going to come back, you're going to marry me, I'm going to apply for permanent residency, we're going to smile for the cameras, and then once filming has wrapped were going to go our separate ways."

 

[Pondlass1]

3 hours ago, Shelbie said:

I keep thinking that the drive back was producer driven

 

I think much of that hotel drive back and forth drama was producer driven, although I will admit Natalie was truly messed up. That wasn’t acting for the cameras, that was real snot and tears and fury.  I wish them well, but cannot see a long, happy marriage because no way they’re in love.

Does anyone think Natalie has had a boob job? I mean, I wish the weight went to my boobs and not my thighs when I overeat.

[Stuckathome]

Yeah, well, neighbor Tamara probably would have crashed at the hotel with Natalie, made sure she got on the flight (the hotel was downtown and not by the airport?At first I thought WTF but then again, if the restrictions around being inside the terminal were super tight then the airport hotels may have been at capacity) and THEN drove back home. I am guessing even if that were not the case, no way Mike would have made the drive because he was surely three sheets tothe wind drunk and passed out with Uncle Beau, not fit to drive 3 hours at night. ''

Interesting he did not let cameras back in when she got back to the house. I would say that is when they hatched their plan, but the next day Natalie still looked a wreck. I dont' think anyone is that good of an actress. 

[Meowwww]

So question.  Once Natalie would have gotten on the flight to France, wouldn’t she have had to quarantine in France for 2 weeks before going on (if she was even allowed to go on.)?
Who was going to pay for that?  
Interesting theory on the neighbor being a hoarder.  Probably why she didn’t have a credit card.   I worked in a bank for almost 30 years and hoarders generally aren't financially responsible.  They spend money they don’t have on their hoard.  

[Xebug67]

1 hour ago, Stuckathome said:

Yeah, well, neighbor Tamara probably would have crashed at the hotel with Natalie, made sure she got on the flight (the hotel was downtown and not by the airport?At first I thought WTF but then again, if the restrictions around being inside the terminal were super tight then the airport hotels may have been at capacity) and THEN drove back home. I am guessing even if that were not the case, no way Mike would have made the drive because he was surely three sheets tothe wind drunk and passed out with Uncle Beau, not fit to drive 3 hours at night. ''

Interesting he did not let cameras back in when she got back to the house. I would say that is when they hatched their plan, but the next day Natalie still looked a wreck. I dont' think anyone is that good of an actress. 

TLC should stipulate in the contracts of all these losers that they are not permitted to banish film crews whenever they feel like doing so during filming seasons.  We're probably missing out on some of the juciest dirt and shenanigans at these times.

 

That's one of the things that frustrated me most during Anfisa and Jorge's season, the constant banishment of the cameras by Anfisa.

 

They are after all under contract with TLC.  They need to do their jobs at all times, which includes being filmed during filming season.

 

If they are going to permit this to continue (banishment of the cameras) then there should be cash penalties against the cast members who are forbidding the cameras.

[Hotel Snarker]

Aside from Mike being an asshole this episode, if I could give awards to each of the three weddings we saw, they would be as follows:

The award for Most Touching Wedding goes to Tarik and Hazel. She looked beautiful, Tarik actually had a great tux, and that was the cutest flower girl to beat the band. I do believe on some level those two really love one another. I just hope the girlfriend part doesn't blow up in their faces.

The award for Cutest Wedding goes to Brandon and Julia. Kudos for Brandon to make her day as special as he could, under the circumstances. I loved that they got her family on the video. Julia's dress looked adorable for a very casual wedding. A nice touch for them to speak their vows in each other's native languages. I think Brandon is still a dweeb and a mama's boy, and there are major issues ahead, but for one day, well done.

And the award for Most Ridiculous Wedding goes to Rebecca and Zied. There are very few women who actually look good in a white halter dress, and the bar was set by Marilyn Monroe in the 1950s. The dress isn't flattering on Rebecca, to say the least. It looked extremely uncomfortable on her. Rebecca's son in law looked like he took time out from cleaning the garage for the wedding, and Zied went to the Jovi school of hairstyling and used enough product to knock out a moose.

[Opine]

2 hours ago, Hotel Snarker said:

Zied went to the Jovi school of hairstyling and used enough product to knock out a moose.

IKR?!?!?!?!?!  I have severe allergies.  No perfumes, special laundry detergent, only scent free products.  Even my dogs can't have scents at the groomers!  And I swear I almost went into anaphylactic shock watching that.  He said it took 30 minutes!!!!

[mamadrama]

I loved my thrift store halter dress (and my bridesmaids dresses that were $15 at a Macy's after prom special). But then, mine actually fit me. Rebecca would've been better off in something simple that she already had. Her dress just was not flattering. Did she not try it on before she left the house? Zied, on the other hand, was adorable. I'm loving him. Outside of the kids he's possibly the most wholesome person in the franchise.

[mamadrama]

2 hours ago, Xebug67 said:

TLC should stipulate in the contracts of all these losers that they are not permitted to banish film crews whenever they feel like doing so during filming seasons.  We're probably missing out on some of the juciest dirt and shenanigans at these times.

They are after all under contract with TLC.  They need to do their jobs at all times, which includes being filmed during filming season.

If they are going to permit this to continue (banishment of the cameras) then there should be cash penalties against the cast members who are forbidding the cameras.

The production crew wasn't with Mike and Natalie at ALL at that point. They didn't banish the crew-Sharp sent everyone home because of the pandemic. Instead, they set up several cameras inside their house and gave the cast phones to videotape with. When we're seeing Mike and Natalie inside his house in that last scene it's because there's a stationery camera pointed towards the couch. When Natalie was crying and packing she was filming herself. 

Sharp did this with all their cast members back in mid-April. On Love After Lockup they actually talked about it and showed the cameras.  

[magemaud]

5 minutes ago, mamadrama said:

Did she not try it on before she left the house?

She must have because she had already complained that it didn’t fit and brought along the corset to wear over it. 

[mamadrama]

1 minute ago, magemaud said:

She must have because she had already complained that it didn’t fit and brought along the corset to wear over it. 

Yeah, that's what I figured, too. There are surely other things she could've done or worn. Normally I'd say "as long as she liked it then whatever" but she didn't seem happy, either.  

[Mrs. Hanson]

6 hours ago, Stuckathome said:

Rebecca/Zied: how did you not try on your dress before the day of the wedding?? Are you that much of a disaster?

Yes she is.

 

38 minutes ago, mamadrama said:

I loved my thrift store halter dress (and my bridesmaids dresses that were $15 at a Macy's after prom special). But then, mine actually fit me. Rebecca would've been better off in something simple that she already had. Her dress just was not flattering. Did she not try it on before she left the house? Zied, on the other hand, was adorable. I'm loving him. Outside of the kids he's possibly the most wholesome person in the franchise.

A couple of things to unpack here:  First off, you look fabulous!!!  Further, you look, oh I don't know, age appropriate?  And it FITS!!!

 

9 hours ago, Pepper Mostly said:

You just know that Tamara has read "50 Shades of Gray" about a hundred times and thinks controlling, abusive monster Christian Gray is the ultimate dreamboat. She probably cries at that creepy scene in "Love, Actually" too, and thinks its adorably romantic. You know the one I mean. "To me you are perfect". God, I feel the waves of nausea washing over me just thinking about it. 

Oh I know the scene and I agree.  Another famous movie scene that made me hurl was "You complete me."  If some dude said that to me I would have said go complete yourself and get back to me.  I tried to read 50 Shades and it was.....bad.

[TzuShih]

On 3/29/2021 at 10:44 AM, jennyf said:

Why did Rebecca’s son-in-law and her other flannel-shirted escort turn around and leave after they walked her down the aisle? 
 

 

So they could slip into something comfortable.

[mamadrama]

49 minutes ago, TzuShih said:

So they could slip into something comfortable.

Okay, I snorted at this. That's funny. 

[Mrs. Hanson]

1 hour ago, TzuShih said:

So they could slip into something comfortable.

I snorted and laughed as I could hear Madeline Kahn saying it like she did in Blazing Saddles.

[Pepper Mostly]

1 hour ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

Oh I know the scene and I agree.  Another famous movie scene that made me hurl was "You complete me."  If some dude said that to me I would have said go complete yourself and get back to me.  I tried to read 50 Shades and it was.....bad.

I didn't read 50 Shades but I did read Jenny Trout's recaps and they were hysterically funny. Much better than actually trying to read the books. 

http://jennytrout.com/?page_id=5720

[Mrs. Hanson]

1 minute ago, Pepper Mostly said:

I didn't read 50 Shades but I did read Jenny Trout's recaps and they were hysterically funny. Much better than actually trying to read the books. 

http://jennytrout.com/?page_id=5720

Thank you!  I will take a listen!  I am not a prude by any stretch but it was just bad writing.  This website will make me laugh, I am sure!!!

 

[Gobi]

22 minutes ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

Thank you!  I will take a listen!  I am not a prude by any stretch but it was just bad writing.  This website will make me laugh, I am sure!!!

 

Fun fact: 50 Shades originally was fan fiction of Twilight.

[goofygirl]

Mamadrama, you are absolutely gorgeous and so was your wedding party!  Funny how a good fitting dress always works!

Poor Rebecca.  That dress. That corset.  Was there not ONE mirror in the place ANYWHERE??

[Pepper Mostly]

1 hour ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

Thank you!  I will take a listen!  I am not a prude by any stretch but it was just bad writing.  This website will make me laugh, I am sure!!!

 

You'll love them. I laughed like a hyena. Its not a podcast though, just written recaps. Hilarious, well written recaps. I may go read them again, they're so funny!

[Mrs. Hanson]

2 minutes ago, goofygirl said:

Mamadrama, you are absolutely gorgeous and so was your wedding party!  Funny how a good fitting dress always works!

Poor Rebecca.  That dress. That corset.  Was there not ONE mirror in the place ANYWHERE??

She would not have cared.  She has goggles on.  

[Baltimore Betty]

1 hour ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

I snorted and laughed as I could hear Madeline Kahn saying it like she did in Blazing Saddles.

Oh how I loved Madeline Kahn in everything but Lily Von Shtup was classic!

[Teri313]

I wonder if Mike and Natalie ever apologized to Tamera for ruining her entire day and being so demanding of her because they're a couple of psychos. The lady deserves a paycheck for that ridiculous BS. That was at least 5 hours of driving time. And driving time having to listen to Natalie wail and talk to her phone.

[StatisticalOutlier]

On 3/30/2021 at 5:18 PM, monagatuna said:

Clearly that's not the case, it just seems strange to me to default to ministers performing the ritual whereas actually anyone can. But it may just be a function of ministers and religious leaders already being qualified to perform the ceremony with the state as part of their job function, and anyone else who isn't will need to be, so that's why non-clergy people are being called out.

In my original post about this, I said:

Quote

Virginia has a law that authorizes civilians (non-ministers) to officiate at weddings if they get an order (permission) from a judge.  There's a similar law for ministers to be able to officiate...

Ministers aren't qualified to perform the ceremony simply by virtue of their job function--they have to get an order authorizing them to do it, just like civilians do.  (And I pointed out that some jurisdictions in Virginia are reportedly buttheads about authorizing what some might consider "fringe" ministers--the statute says the court/judge/clerk "may" make an order authorizing the minister to perform the ceremony, and may rescind it, which means they can refuse to, as well.)

As far as I can tell, the only ones who don't have to be authorized by a court/judge/clerk, and can therefore perform the ceremony by virtue of their position, are judges.

[Chalby]

On 3/29/2021 at 3:30 AM, Alonzo Mosely FBI said:

OR emotional torture from Mike that is concretely abusive. She should've applied for a refugee status or something. I am being totally serious.

 

A year ago I would have argued with you, but I agree. I think Mike's indecisiveness would drive me crazy. He cannot commit to anything, not even an activity. I don't blame her for wanting to run away in a pandemic. I couldn't stay with someone who made me question whether I should stay or go. Having said that, he shouldn't have applied for a Visa for her in the first place. They do not communicate well and there's something "off" with natalies abusive mood swings. Meanwhile, Michael punishes Natalie by being emotionally distant, and neglectful.they both have a lot of baggage.

[mamadrama]

I

When I was a kid I had this "friend" that everyone loved-teachers, parents, etc. She made good grades, never got in trouble, etc. She was a sneaky little bitch, though. When nobody else could see or hear her she was saying and doing awful things to me. It would wind me up and I'd lose my shit and then I would get in trouble while she sat back all doe-eyed and innocent. I SWEAR she tried to kill me once, too. We were at a pool party. I was 6 and she attacked me. She pulled the floaties off my arms, wrapped her legs around me, and held me underwater. Nobody saw this. When I was finally able to fight her off she pretended to cry and I got in trouble. "She saved you, Mamadrama! Why are you acting like this?!" 

I got some hints of that in the Mike and Natalie story. Natalie's nuts, her YouTube videos alone are weird enough, but I'm really curious to know what HE was like offscreen. I know we made fun of her for wanting the ring back, but he dangled that invisible carrot in front of her the whole damn time. There's no excuse for some of the awful things she said, but this whole storyline made me very uncomfortable. 

[RealReality]

10 hours ago, Chalby said:

A year ago I would have argued with you, but I agree. I think Mike's indecisiveness would drive me crazy. He cannot commit to anything, not even an activity. I don't blame her for wanting to run away in a pandemic. I couldn't stay with someone who made me question whether I should stay or go. Having said that, he shouldn't have applied for a Visa for her in the first place. They do not communicate well and there's something "off" with natalies abusive mood swings. Meanwhile, Michael punishes Natalie by being emotionally distant, and neglectful.they both have a lot of baggage.

See, I think Mike knew the answer for a while now.  But he didn't want to look like the bad guy on TV.  

Id bet good money that towards the end he was low key trying to start fights so Natalie would impulsively call the whole thing off and he would get a victim/hero edit again. 

 

He had no intention of marrying Natalie, IMO.  Which is fine, totally fine.  In fact, the best decision for both of them. 

My biggest beef is with him stringing her along knowing damn well he isnt going to marry her. 

If for no other reason than Mike put his need to be a "nice guy" above the fact that Natalie's mother is old and if Natalie isn't married she would rather be with her mom, taking care of her mother and enjoying her mom fussing over her and loving on her.  

He is some sort of manager.  So he makes decisions all day.  Which is to say he isn't an indecisive person per se or by nature.  You can reasonably say "real reality, you are a natural born fool, just because he makes decisions at work doesn't mean he can do the same in his real life!" But, he was fine making the decision to marry Natalie the first time, he decided to propose to his first wife.  So I think he can make decisions in his personal life.  And internally, I think he knew, at least after the fat, ugly and stupid fight that he for sure wasn't marrying Natalie.  When he said there was nothing Natalie could say or do to change his mind, he was right about that.  

[Colfrmb]

@RealReality, I actually think that had Natalie not asserted herself to come to America with that first phone call of the season, Michael would have drifted away from her. The emotional damage she did when she threw the ring back at him and her persistent disbelief at him not hooking up with his best friend on the eve of the girl’s wedding is something he will carry, and hold onto, forever.  Damage done - forever.

[Opine]

4 hours ago, Colfrmb said:

@RealReality, I actually think that had Natalie not asserted herself to come to America with that first phone call of the season, Michael would have drifted away from her. The emotional damage she did when she threw the ring back at him and her persistent disbelief at him not hooking up with his best friend on the eve of the girl’s wedding is something he will carry, and hold onto, forever.  Damage done - forever.

I agree, totally.  I don't think he wanted her to come but she was being pushy and Sharp was flashing cash in front of him.  Then she came and Sharp encouraged both Nat and Mike to "make good TV" with her crazy act and his disdain.  I agree with the poster above that the plan was for her to leave at the last minute and COVID changed "the script".  Her tears were real.  She wasn't that good of an actress.  But I think they were tears of fear because of her status and her desire to get back home to momma.

[Xebug67]

23 hours ago, mamadrama said:

The production crew wasn't with Mike and Natalie at ALL at that point. They didn't banish the crew-Sharp sent everyone home because of the pandemic. Instead, they set up several cameras inside their house and gave the cast phones to videotape with. When we're seeing Mike and Natalie inside his house in that last scene it's because there's a stationery camera pointed towards the couch. When Natalie was crying and packing she was filming herself. 

Sharp did this with all their cast members back in mid-April. On Love After Lockup they actually talked about it and showed the cameras.  

I misspoke.  I was wrong.  It wasn't the crew that was banished.  Upon rewatching, what the message said that appeared onscreen at the start of the segment where Natalie returns to Mike's house was, "As soon as Natalie arrived, Mike requested that she stop recording.  They turned off all cameras." 

 

So this basically amounts to the same thing as dismissing the crew from being able to film.  My point being that deciding what and when to film should NOT be left in the control of the cast members.

[Gobi]

4 minutes ago, Xebug67 said:

 

So this basically amounts to the same thing as dismissing the crew from being able to film.  My point being that deciding what and when to film should NOT be left in the control of the cast members.

That’s probably unenforceable. TLC might have grounds for a damages claim, but probably cannot get strict compliance  of a contract requiring that their private lives be filmed.

[Maximadc]

 

Zied - I like his haircut, I like his smile, I like his family too.
Jovi - nothing to add
Brandon - are you sure this bath experience is for Yulia? Because you took the more comfortable side of the bathtub and looked very well relaxed while Yulia was trying to squeeze herself into the remaining space available.
Mike - yes, he does look like an alcoholic. His face is telling:( If I try to play Dr. Phil for a minute, I say that Natalie is not the crazy one in this couple. She is just over-emotional and tries too hard to be cute. When she called him names, she just wanted to get through his thick skin and get some real emotions out of his big body.
- I truly believe she does not have a credit card available. In Ukraine, people make most of their purchases with cash and take credit to buy a particular item such as a TV, Refrigerator, etc. She probably has money; therefore, if she does, she doesn't need a credit card. 
- I also believe that when she 'gave' back his engagement ring, she did not realize the level of emotional damage that act would cause for him. Engagement is a relatively new thing in Eastern Europe and not a big deal in reality. Yara tried to explain this fact to Jovi's parents a few episodes earlier. If Natalie could forgive Mike's decision not to marry her a few hours before the wedding, he could forgive her for throwing the ring into his suitcase while they both were inside a warm and welcoming house and he had his ticket to fly back home.
- I think that TLC recorded most of the 'Tomorrow is my last day - you have to make a decision' episodes much later than her meltdown episodes. Natali looked very differently during those episodes for whatever reasons(pregnancy, stress-induced eating disorder, or just COVID-19 weight gain); I also spotted new carpeting in the living room and a new recliner(with no crocheted throw).
 

Edited April 1, 2021 by Maximadc

[RealReality]

6 hours ago, Colfrmb said:

@RealReality, I actually think that had Natalie not asserted herself to come to America with that first phone call of the season, Michael would have drifted away from her. The emotional damage she did when she threw the ring back at him and her persistent disbelief at him not hooking up with his best friend on the eve of the girl’s wedding is something he will carry, and hold onto, forever.  Damage done - forever.

I don't disagree.  I think the door was like 90-95% closed when she came here.  

And I dont fault Mike for that at all.  I dont fault Mike for not marrying her.  Thats a smart decision.

I just think that whatever sliver of a door was open was slammed shut, locked and barricaded when she called him fat, ugly, dumb and lucky to have her.  

Had he just kept it real and broken up with her at that point, I wouldn't have faulted him.

Especially if he made it a point to really help her find her way home. 

From as best as I can tell, he just kinda got her a flight to france and a night in a hotel.  Id like to think that if I were in Mike's position I'd try to make sure my foreign significant other got all the way home.  

If he had told that he wasn't going to marry her when I think he knew for sure....he could have researched, planned, reached out to embassies and sought more specific legal advice.  

I get that Mike has debt, but he also has Google.  If he did some research up front and come with solutions he may not have needed to pay very much for legal advice.  

[mamadrama]

19 hours ago, Gobi said:

That’s probably unenforceable. TLC might have grounds for a damages claim, but probably cannot get strict compliance  of a contract requiring that their private lives be filmed.

Especially since reality contracts generally stipulate X numbers of hours per week. If this were a true documentary series dependent upon observation then they'd have those cameras running 24/7. It's basically an 'unscripted' dramady, though, with storylines and blocking. 

In cases like Whitney Thore, though, I'd totally fine her ass for the stunts she pulls. When the talent disrupts actual filming by inappropriately disrobing and throwing recording equipment then that should be comparable to walking off the job. 

Edited April 2, 2021 by mamadrama

[Adeejay]

On 3/30/2021 at 8:30 PM, Scout Finch said:

And I always think, "Oh, Lacey lives there, too. I wonder if they know each other," and then remember that they're not castmates because she's on Love After Lockup, and it's a different production company and network. 

Love After Lockup and the 90 Day franchise are produced by Sharp Entertainment. So, it wouldn’t be surprising if Tarik and Lacey were to attend the same Upfront event. 

[Back Atcha]

9 hours ago, mamadrama said:

In cases like Whitney Thore, though, I'd totally fine her ass for the stunts she pulls. When the talent disrupts actual filming by inappropriately disproving and throwing recording equipment then that should be comparable to walking off the job. 

I had to look up Whitney Thore.  That show is still on?  I never saw it, but guess she's SOMETHIN' if she can throw around recording equipment.

[Back Atcha]

9 hours ago, Maximadc said:

Mike - yes, he does look like an alcoholic. His face is telling: If I try to play Dr. Phil for a minute, I say that Natalie is not the crazy one in this couple. She is just over-emotional and tries too hard to be cute. When she called him names, she just wanted to get through his thick skin and get some real emotions out of his big body.

Hear, hear!!

16 hours ago, RealReality said:

My biggest beef is with him stringing her along knowing damn well he isnt going to marry her. 

AND...

16 hours ago, RealReality said:

When he said there was nothing Natalie could say or do to change his mind, he was right about that. 

Mike in a nutshell.

[Twopper]

19 hours ago, Opine said:

Her tears were real.  She wasn't that good of an actress.  But I think they were tears of fear because of her status and her desire to get back home to momma.

Maybe yes, maybe no.

Spoiler

https://www.tvshowsace.com/2021/03/05/90-day-fiance-natalie-movies/

 

[Mrs. Hanson]

21 hours ago, mamadrama said:

In cases like Whitney Thore, though, I'd totally fine her ass for the stunts she pulls. When the talent disrupts actual filming by inappropriately disrobing and throwing recording equipment then that should be comparable to walking off the job.

I give you so much credit for being able to watch her.  She reminds me of the girl in high school who thinks she is really funny but is not.  When her show appears in in promos, my husband is like, "Is she crying AGAIN?"

Edited April 2, 2021 by Mrs. Hanson
mu is not my