Leah Remini: Scientology and the Aftermath Ending With 2-Hr Special Featuring Danny Masterson Accusers

[andromeda331]

2 hours ago, alexvillage said:

To be fair, there are far too many Christian institutions who have nothing to do with what they claim are their values. It is all "Jesus loves all, love the strangers, open your doors, share your food, be humble" then they turn around and are all full of shit, arrogant, demonizing immigrants - especially in these times - discriminating against whoever is not "like them".

I have a theory that the cross is a marketing strategy. A recognizable image that, for many, tends to soften anything else that might come from them. It is like a subliminal message.

That would make sense since there's nothing Christian about it except the Cross. You never hear any talk about Jesus, Bible, or anything else Christian. And its not that hard to look around and see how reluctant almost anyone is to investigate Christian institutions no matter what the crimes are. 

[Yeah No]

3 hours ago, alexvillage said:

To be fair, there are far too many Christian institutions who have nothing to do with what they claim are their values. It is all "Jesus loves all, love the strangers, open your doors, share your food, be humble" then they turn around and are all full of shit, arrogant, demonizing immigrants - especially in these times - discriminating against whoever is not "like them".

I think I need to point out right now that thankfully, most Christian institutions are not like this at all.  The ones that are are in the vast minority but get the most publicity, which IMO is not fair to the rest.  We're just not grabbing center stage and wearing the T shirt that says, "We're not like that".

[Yeah No]

On 8/16/2019 at 9:39 AM, DXD526 said:

Mike keeps referring throughout his blog post to the 'constraints' of working for 'sponsored' television, and I think that's all that's ending. 

I'm now wondering if his insertion of the word "sponsored" is a clue as to why they're ending the show.  Perhaps COS has put pressure on advertisers to pull out of the show claiming that it's slanderous, and knowing how powerful the "church" is the companies are leaving.  Maybe they even threatened the sponsors with lawsuits for supporting the spread of "unsubstantiated" claims about them that are potentially damaging to their image.  They may have similarly threatened the show and the network this way too.

[Diane Mars]

23 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

... I can't wait to see what happens next. I really hope we do get to see Scientology held accountable. 

Where is Teddi Mellencamp when we need her ?!?!? #accountabilityCoach

Edited August 30, 2019 by Diane Mars

[msrachelj]

9 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I'm now wondering if his insertion of the word "sponsored" is a clue as to why they're ending the show.  Perhaps COS has put pressure on advertisers to pull out of the show claiming that it's slanderous, and knowing how powerful the "church" is the companies are leaving.  Maybe they even threatened the sponsors with lawsuits for supporting the spread of "unsubstantiated" claims about them that are potentially damaging to their image.  They may have similarly threatened the show and the network this way too.

They need to move to HBO.

[libgirl2]

17 hours ago, alexvillage said:

To be fair, there are far too many Christian institutions who have nothing to do with what they claim are their values. It is all "Jesus loves all, love the strangers, open your doors, share your food, be humble" then they turn around and are all full of shit, arrogant, demonizing immigrants - especially in these times - discriminating against whoever is not "like them".

I have a theory that the cross is a marketing strategy. A recognizable image that, for many, tends to soften anything else that might come from them. It is like a subliminal message.

I always thought it was there to make them appear to be a religion. 

[Lady Iris]

I hope this isn't the last we hear from Leah and Mike. Its been such an education, albeit heartbreaking and horrible but oh so necessary.

[Scofflaw]

Watching the young woman talk about her molestation and the response to it by the CoS was so hard to watch. I wanted to hug her. And it really showed the priorities of the "church": first and foremost, protect the CoS, and then second, protect the attacker (because to admit he was at fault would be to admit that the church system is flawed). The victim is not on that list. At all. 

And the first guy who spoke? Wow. So articulate and intelligent. He blew me away.

What I want to know is when L.Ron started this whole thing, did he actually believe his own bullshit? Or did he knowingly start a cult? I remember in one of the earlier seasons, someone said it was Miscavage who really stepped up the abuses, but I'm not clear on L.Ron's initial motivations.

Also, are there any professionals who belong to the CoS? I'm wondering how they align their professional responsibilities and obligations with their CoS membership. I don't think a lawyer or doctor could do so: the church requires you to put it's bizarro version of the world above all else, and that does not work when you have professional responsibilities to your clients and patients. 

And finally, is it me or does so much of L.Ron's writing seem hilariously childish. I mean, a BILLION years? Oy. And when they show snippets of his texts, they are almost entirely  incomprehensible. Imagine studying that! And the church's letters are also somehow childish. Maybe that lack of formal education for CoS children is starting to show itself as those children grow up and run the church. And that might also contribute to its downfall.  

[Starlight925]

4 hours ago, Scofflaw said:

Also, are there any professionals who belong to the CoS? I'm wondering how they align their professional responsibilities and obligations with their CoS membership. I don't think a lawyer or doctor could do so: the church requires you to put it's bizarro version of the world above all else, and that does not work when you have professional responsibilities to your clients and patients. 

There are definitely professionals who belong to CoS.  Think about it:  it takes a lot of money to belong to CoS; people spend hundreds of thousands of dollars in it.  That money has to come from somewhere, so they prey upon professionals who have money, but who are searching for "answers" in life.

In fact, the first time I heard of CoS or LRH was from a guy I dated many years ago.  He had "Dianetics", which I asked him about, as I had never heard of any of this.  That guy was a highly educated aerospace engineer for NASA.  Yep, he bought into all this garbage.

Edited August 31, 2019 by Sterling

[Yeah No]

1 hour ago, Sterling said:

There are definitely professionals who belong to CoS.  Think about it:  it takes a lot of money to belong to CoS; people spend hundreds of thousands of dollars in it.  That money has to come from somewhere, so they prey upon professionals who have money, but who are searching for "answers" in life.

In fact, the first time I heard of CoS or LRH was from a guy I dated many years ago.  He had "Dianetics", which I asked him about, as I had never heard of any of this.  That guy was a highly educated aerospace engineer for NASA.  Yep, he bought into all this garbage.

You just reminded me - I briefly dated a Navy officer once who was reading "Dianetics" like it was a self-help book.  He kept referring to it like it was teaching him all this "life wisdom".  Being a grad. student in Psychology, I already knew about it and thought it was a bunch of new age garbage.  Is it any wonder I didn't see him for very long?  It's too bad, he was really good looking and sexy.....😉

[deirdra]

When "Dianetics" first came out, it was sold in regular bookstores like Dale Carnegie's "How to Win Friends and Influence People".  I was a teenaged babysitter back then and noticed both at some neighbours' houses, but I don't think any of them joined the CO$.  But it probably did make Dianetics seem more mainstream, which is why some pursued it further.

Edited August 31, 2019 by deirdra

[kieyra]

There used to be TV commercials for Dianetics.

I had a friend who worked high up at a Scientology-run real estate title company in FL. The stories he told me were bananas. But a lot of money moved through that company.

[FairyDusted]

I well remember those commercials and seeing the books in the mall. My mother freaked her Catholic ass out when I asked her about it. I'm STILL not clear where an actual religion comes in.

And damn  it. I missed the last show! 

[Yeah No]

11 hours ago, deirdra said:

When "Dianetics" first came out, it was sold in regular bookstores like Dale Carnegie's "How to Win Friends and Influence People".  I was a teenaged babysitter back then and noticed both at some neighbours' houses, but I don't think any of them joined the CO$.  But it probably did make Dianetics seem more mainstream, which is why some pursued it further.

I remember seeing it in bookstores.  Barnes and Noble still carries it in its New York stores and you can order it online.  The man I dated had it in 2000.  I remember thinking that it was something outdated that most people thought was BS by now, deserving of an eye-roll more than anything else.  I doubt if he ever joined the "church".  He was a nice guy but overly wowed by what I used to refer to as "pop-schlock psychology".

[Starlight925]

OMG, I remember those commercials!  And yes, the books were everywhere!

I was in my young 20's, and even then, I thought it was B.S. 

My mom got me to go to an EST weekend once (another stupid "life-changing" cult thing). I sat there the entire weekend, thinking about what garbage this was, and how people were dedicating their life to it, and what a waste.  My mom never went again either.  She had met some "EST people" somewhere, and they pulled her in, they were "so nice", blah blah....anyway, I couldn't believe people dedicated their lives to stuff like this....and yes, to CoS, back then.

[blondiek237]

10 hours ago, Sterling said:

OMG, I remember those commercials!  And yes, the books were everywhere!

I was in my young 20's, and even then, I thought it was B.S. 

My mom got me to go to an EST weekend once (another stupid "life-changing" cult thing). I sat there the entire weekend, thinking about what garbage this was, and how people were dedicating their life to it, and what a waste.  My mom never went again either.  She had met some "EST people" somewhere, and they pulled her in, they were "so nice", blah blah....anyway, I couldn't believe people dedicated their lives to stuff like this....and yes, to CoS, back then.

I almost went through the EST training. I had many friends that did it.  Such crap

[Sew Sumi]

I did EST when I was 16. It actually helped me some with my self-esteem, but I could have found that elsewhere. ESTies were pretty intense, but nowhere near what we see with the CO$ crowd.

[blondiek237]

4 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

I did EST when I was 16. It actually helped me some with my self-esteem, but I could have found that elsewhere. ESTies were pretty intense, but nowhere near what we see with the CO$ crowd.

True, when I said thanks but no, they didn’t disown me

[funky-rat]

Several things I've seen/read about Heaven's Gate said that in the 70's, they picked up quite a few "Disenfranchised Scientologists".  How effed up does Scamatology have to be that Heaven's Gate and their UFO in the comet seem better in comparison?

[libgirl2]

16 minutes ago, funky-rat said:

Several things I've seen/read about Heaven's Gate said that in the 70's, they picked up quite a few "Disenfranchised Scientologists".  How effed up does Scamatology have to be that Heaven's Gate and their UFO in the comet seem better in comparison?

Well Xenu is an alien so why not? 

[funky-rat]

2 minutes ago, libgirl2 said:

Well Xenu is an alien so why not? 

True, but I guess that if Heaven's Gate seems sane compared to Scamatology, then how bad does Scamatology have to be (yes, I know it's bad - I'm being a smart ass).  😉

[libgirl2]

2 minutes ago, funky-rat said:

True, but I guess that if Heaven's Gate seems sane compared to Scamatology, then how bad does Scamatology have to be (yes, I know it's bad - I'm being a smart ass).  😉

I don't think it was that they found it saner, I think it was too sane for them. 

[galaxychaser]

It’s obvious that Tom Cruise is insane. I wonder how much $ he gave to the church and baby David. 

Stewie Griffin from family guy might grow up to be David Miscarriage.

[Lady Iris]

I finished watching this ep last night and it hit me for the very first time how many times Scientology, in their letters, deny deny deny absolutely everything. Everything is someone else's fault, everything is not their fault. I keep thinking where there's smoke, there's fire. Let's just say for argument's sake that Leah, Mike and all these people who have stepped forward with their stories are all fabricators and liars, what would they get from it, what do they stand to gain? I can only  hope someday we see some resolution.

[juicyfruit]

36 minutes ago, Lady Iris said:

I finished watching this ep last night and it hit me for the very first time how many times Scientology, in their letters, deny deny deny absolutely everything. Everything is someone else's fault, everything is not their fault. I keep thinking where there's smoke, there's fire. Let's just say for argument's sake that Leah, Mike and all these people who have stepped forward with their stories are all fabricators and liars, what would they get from it, what do they stand to gain? I can only  hope someday we see some resolution.

I have also noticed that in most letters, the C0$ starts out by saying that the situation they are addressing never actually happened at all, and then later in the letter it changes to 'it didn't happen the way the accuser says it happened...'  So, which is it?

[link417]

You can tell those CO$ letters are malarkey because they overuse certain words, like “absurd.” It plays like a game of mad libs. 

[MamaMax]

On 8/31/2019 at 11:58 PM, FairyDusted said:

I well remember those commercials and seeing the books in the mall. My mother freaked her Catholic ass out when I asked her about it. I'm STILL not clear where an actual religion comes in.

And damn  it. I missed the last show! 

In the tax code, that's where.

[charliesan]

On 8/30/2019 at 4:50 AM, Diane Mars said:

Where is Teddi Mellencamp when we need her ?!?!? #accountabilityCoach

Knowing her, she would side with the "church". 

I will most certainly miss the show but I'm glad Leah and Mike will continue on with their fight, hopefully it won't be too long to see some change. 

[italianguy626]

On 8/30/2019 at 4:40 PM, Scofflaw said:

What I want to know is when L.Ron started this whole thing, did he actually believe his own bullshit? Or did he knowingly start a cult? I remember in one of the earlier seasons, someone said it was Miscavage who really stepped up the abuses, but I'm not clear on L.Ron's initial motivations.

It's all about the Benjamins. L.Ron has been quoted as saying something along the lines of "If you really want to make money, start a religion". I think this was covered in the documentary Going Clear as well as the biography of L.Ron Bare Faced Messiah.

[alexvillage]

1 minute ago, italianguy626 said:

It's all about the Benjamins. L.Ron has been quoted as saying something along the lines of "If you really want to make money, start a religion". I think this was covered in the documentary Going Clear as well as the biography of L.Ron Bare Faced Messiah.

Yes. Cult people are either or both of the following: sociopaths or con-artists. They don't have to believe on what they preach, they just have to know how to preach and believe they can get rewarded for that. 

Note that sociopath is not someone who believes in their own bullshit. They have no moral compass, as opposed to someone who might be "delusional" due to a mental illness. Those don't plan to cause harm to others, or to use others to benefit from them, they don't usually cause harm to other at all. 

[funky-rat]

I thought the story went that he couldn't cut it as a SciFi writer, and he thought he had some good ideas about mental health treatment (after having gone through it himself) and mental health professionals laughed him out of the building, so he founded the Dianetics movent, which went belly-up after a few years since it was largely crap.  Then he got this idea to invent this religion crap, and one reason he's so against mental health treatment is because doctors told him his methods were essentially garbage.

But I could be remembering wrong.

[libgirl2]

On 8/30/2019 at 10:37 PM, Yeah No said:

You just reminded me - I briefly dated a Navy officer once who was reading "Dianetics" like it was a self-help book.  He kept referring to it like it was teaching him all this "life wisdom".  Being a grad. student in Psychology, I already knew about it and thought it was a bunch of new age garbage.  Is it any wonder I didn't see him for very long?  It's too bad, he was really good looking and sexy.....😉

I remember the commercials back in the day. I thought it was just a self help book. I even mused about taking a look at it. Never did.  It wasn't until years later I learned about it being a "religion". 

Edited September 11, 2019 by libgirl2

[albinerhawk]

Cord cutter here who just started watching the third and final season when it dropped on Hulu. I agree with some posters that it does feel like the major issues have been covered, and it's just more of the same. The question I have, and can't find the answer, is how has this show helped? I'm not trying to be glib. As someone who has been disgusted with Scientology from before this show, I'm genuinely curious.

[funky-rat]

51 minutes ago, albinerhawk said:

Cord cutter here who just started watching the third and final season when it dropped on Hulu. I agree with some posters that it does feel like the major issues have been covered, and it's just more of the same. The question I have, and can't find the answer, is how has this show helped? I'm not trying to be glib. As someone who has been disgusted with Scientology from before this show, I'm genuinely curious.

If nothing else, it's really brought a lot of it to the attention of people who had no clue.  I always wrote-off Scientologists as weird, but essentially harmless.  I had no clue how deep it ran, and just how low they'd go.

[SailorGirl]

On 10/15/2019 at 3:44 PM, funky-rat said:

If nothing else, it's really brought a lot of it to the attention of people who had no clue.  I always wrote-off Scientologists as weird, but essentially harmless.  I had no clue how deep it ran, and just how low they'd go.

Along these lines, it made it impossible for Scientology to sweep their dealings under the rug through intimidation and fair gaming. Someone is finally standing up to the bully, and now they have a lot more documentation, ammunition, etc., for the lawsuits. So even if the statute of limitations has run out on a lot of those who appeared on the show, its provides more documented evidence that can help support a legal argument of ongoing and consistent patterns of abuse and theft. 

Edited October 17, 2019 by SailorGirl

[Temperance]

This was not covered on the show, but Danny Masterson has been charged with three accounts of rape and faces up to 45 years in prison. The charges were revealed today June 17, 2020. 

This show has gotten some credit for this and Leah says it shows a weakening of the church. I wonder if they're just cutting him loose since he's more of a liability than an asset now. 

[Sew Sumi]

Leah is jubilant on social media.

[laurakaye]

On 9/11/2019 at 3:11 PM, libgirl2 said:

I remember the commercials back in the day. I thought it was just a self help book. I even mused about taking a look at it. Never did.  It wasn't until years later I learned about it being a "religion". 

I remember checking it out of the library when I was maybe 20 or so - I thought it was a diet book.  I may have skimmed a few pages and sent it right back to the drop slot.

 

11 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

Leah is jubilant on social media.

And I am so happy for her, and for Masterson's victims.  I hope he sits for years, waiting for a visit from Miscabbage or Tommy Boy, which will never happen.

[SailorGirl]

14 hours ago, Temperance said:

This show has gotten some credit for this and Leah says it shows a weakening of the church. 

I saw the article and the first thing I thought of was that the show was a factor. Way to go Leah and Mike!! 

[SunnyBeBe]

So, I'm curious if this will ALSO be an indictment (not literally) of the COS and not just Masterson.  Is this the start of the take down or will the church try to distance itself?

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8436023/Leah-Remini-says-Danny-Mastersons-rape-arrest-just-beginning-Scientology.html#newcomment

[CrystalBlue]

43 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

So, I'm curious if this will ALSO be an indictment (not literally) of the COS and not just Masterson.  Is this the start of the take down or will the church try to distance itself?

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8436023/Leah-Remini-says-Danny-Mastersons-rape-arrest-just-beginning-Scientology.html#newcomment

Yay! DM published my comment!  I'll post it here:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/reader-comments/p/comment/link/559997139

[purist]

This news is a few weeks old, but relevant to this thread: Judge declares mistrial in actor Danny Masterson’s rape trial.