S01.E08: Fight Or Flight

[ams1001]

14 minutes ago, shouldbedancing said:

Pretty sure I find everyone on this show insufferable.

I dunno...Theo's pretty cute.

[HazelEyes4325]

23 minutes ago, shouldbedancing said:

Pretty sure I find everyone on this show insufferable.

I don't find Rome and Regina insufferable.  But I do find how the show uses them insufferable.  Also, Theo is cute, but I could do without the other kids.  I'd be more than happy for Delilah to take Sophie and Danny to France and never return.

Another random thing I noticed.  In the last episode, didn't Rome say that he couldn't drink because he was on anti-depressants? (I know you aren't supposed to drink while on anti-depressants, but everyone I know who is on SSRI's drinks.  Anyway...)  And wasn't he drinking wine this week?  So, is he off the meds or did the writers of this episode not see the previous episode?

Edited November 30, 2018 by HazelEyes4325

[Guest]

6 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

 

I guess on the good side is that I couldn't find a Friends did it better scene?

That episode where Monica has a tasting for Pheobe’s friend who is opening a restaurant (played by Jon Lovitz). 

 

6 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

Yeah, I'm the weird person who quotes myself.  

But I found the Friends moment.  Gary and Eddie are essentially Chandler and Joey.  The scene with Gary telling Eddie that he can stay on his couch as long as he wants does remind me of a scene I swear exists where Chandler asks Joey to move back in with him after Joey has the (first) rise and fall of his soap career.

There also was that time when Ross and Emily break up and he gets kicked out of his apartment so he moves in with Chandler and Joey. It ends with Chandler and Joey convincing Ross that they really do want him to stay. 

 

2 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

Also, his official psychologist would not be seeing him if he knew (and it sounds like he does) that Rome was unofficially seeing Maggie as a therapist.  My mother was a mental health professional and everything involving Rome/therapy/Maggie is so wildly unethical that she would be doing cartwheels in her urn.

I feel the same way. My mother was a therapist  and I know she would have had a lot to say about Maggie’s portrayal. 

[WhosThatGirl]

So with all the references people have found, this show is Friends but everyone is so terrible, everyones Ross?!?! 

Edited November 30, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[Brian Cronin]

"I thought that the next apartment I would rent...would be for us."

I so wanted her to respond with, "But I live in a house right now...with my two kids. So....huh?"

[WhosThatGirl]

16 minutes ago, Brian Cronin said:

"I thought that the next apartment I would rent...would be for us."

I so wanted her to respond with, "But I live in a house right now...with my two kids. So....huh?"

Yeah. I keep feeling like that Eddie has and always was more into Delilah than she is into him. Like I said in a previous episode topic, we only heard his side of the phone call in the pilot when he talked about leaving Katherine. We didn’t hear her side. And anytime we see them together, she’s always more off putting. Even now the whole thing is out in the open and she’s like “no, go away!”

[cardigirl]

9 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

ETA: At least one good thing has happened so far...we know it is has been 3 weeks since Jon's funeral (so 4-5 weeks from his death).

We do? How do we know that? I’m pretty sure it’s been longer. 

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

We do? How do we know that? I’m pretty sure it’s been longer. 

Eddie referred to Maggie and Gary as being a 3 week relationship and they began dating the day before the funeral. 

 

53 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Yeah. I keep feeling like that Eddie has and always was more into Delilah than she is into him. Like I said in a previous episode topic, we only heard his side of the phone call in the pilot when he talked about leaving Katherine. We didn’t hear her side. And anytime we see them together, she’s always more off putting. Even now the whole thing is out in the open and she’s like “no, go away!”

I have the same reaction but am not sure if that is deliberate or Delilah’s inability to portray any emotion. 

[HazelEyes4325]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

So with all the references people have found, this show is Friends but everyone is so terrible, everyones Ross?!?! 

I try not to go too far with the analogy.  If Gary and Eddie are Chandler and Joey, that would make Rome Ross and that doesn't work.   

But, yeah, there are a lot of things that are weirdly similar to Friends.   I knew this was a derivative show, I just didn't realize that a 90s sitcom would provide so much source material.

1 hour ago, Brian Cronin said:

"I thought that the next apartment I would rent...would be for us."

I so wanted her to respond with, "But I live in a house right now...with my two kids. So....huh?"

Yeah, I can totally see Delilah trading in her McMansion for a third floor rental with the guitar teacher.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

Ugh...this is exactly where I am.  This show is bad...and it is getting worse with each episode.  Yet, I still desperately want to like it!  I don't hate-watch, but I will put myself in the position of watching the show and being pissed off at it (and feeling frustrated afterward).  I agree that there is potential..and I also agree that a bit of that potential dies each week.

I don’t hate watch either. Half way through this episode I was certain I was done and than at the end I knew that I can’t give it up just yet. 

I keep trying to figure out why I keep coming back and I realized that there were a handful of moments that worked amazingly well for me. 

The Eddie and Theo scene managed to be poignant, sweet and funny. Then Regina and Rome’s playful teasing of Eddie made me genuinely laugh out loud. Buried amongst all the crap are these small moments that are as good as anything on TV. 

Eddie: That George is very curious.
Theo: I don't think so, because if he were he wouldn't call his friend the man in the yellow hat. He'd say, "Hey, what's your name? Just curious."

Eddie: Regina, I am crazy for this caprese. And this truffle mac - totally wack.
Gina: It amazes me that you convinced two women to sleep with you.

Rome: Delicious, delicious! That man is delicious.
Eddie: That is not funny.
Rome: He's like a chocolate George Clooney with a caramel Gosling center.
Eddie: [Hunter]'s just some guy who works at [Katherine's] firm.
Rome: Yes, everything about him does seem firm.

Edited November 30, 2018 by Guest

[Winston Wolfe]

9 hours ago, sadie said:

It’s almost liked the creators thought it was a cool visual for episode 1 of him walking off the edge of his building and every promo we saw for two months was that but then, meh, what they really wanted was some Thirtysomething drama with a bunch of ridiculous storylines played by attractive people so maybe the viewers won’t notice. Ugh.  

This show really does have a Thirtysomething (ABC melodrama from the 90s) feel to it, doesn't it?  That had been bugging me for the longest time, what does this show remind me of?  That's it, pretty folks in their 30s with unrealistic problems, all set to the backdrop of pop music.  Except this show isn't as good as Thirtysomething.  Man, I really do miss Brothers and Sisters, that show really nailed how to do friend/family melodrama featuring this demographic.  The casting was superb (Sally Field, Rob Lowe and Emily Van Camp!) and it was almost always well-acted.

[debraran]

1 hour ago, Winston Wolfe said:

This show really does have a Thirtysomething (ABC melodrama from the 90s) feel to it, doesn't it?  That had been bugging me for the longest time, what does this show remind me of?  That's it, pretty folks in their 30s with unrealistic problems, all set to the backdrop of pop music.  Except this show isn't as good as Thirtysomething.  Man, I really do miss Brothers and Sisters, that show really nailed how to do friend/family melodrama featuring this demographic.  The casting was superb (Sally Field, Rob Lowe and Emily Van Camp!) and it was almost always well-acted.

I never watched Brothers and Sisters, just Thirtysomething but it's on Hulu so maybe I'll check it out one day.

I liked the Rome and Eddie exchange, only funny lines in show. You know there will be a romance with Katherine and Hunter, but not until next season and with this show it will happen suddenly or go on too long. ; ) I just hope they don't show her happy and then she finds out Eddie is a dad again and how that effects Theo. Ugh.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

19 hours ago, funandfitpt said:

I'm hoping with Gary sleeping with Ashley it leads him to find the secret envelope and then we will know what it's all about. Otherwise, blech.

When she followed him outside and said he looked like he needed a drink, I thought that she was hoping to get him drunk so she could ask him about the Barbara lady who's on the insurance policy with him, Eddie, and Rome. But I'd much prefer to see Gary do some Shawn Spencer-ing and find the secret envelope so we can be done with that particular mystery.

17 hours ago, snarkylady said:

When Maggie confronts Gary about sleeping with Ashley I truly hope he says "we were on a break". 

13 hours ago, nexxie said:

Eddie doesn’t seem to want to win back Katherine imo, he just wants to be kind.

I think if that were true, he would have just signed the lease so that he and Theo had their own place. Instead, he ran straight to Katherine (at her place of work in the middle of the day because that's totally professional and appropriate) and said he had to check with her first because he wanted to talk about where their relationship will be in a year aka "Will you forgive me and take me back in the next twelve months?"

Hunter is fine for now. He seems nice, he was funny when he was joking about Katherine's assistant's constant need for the latest ergonomic office furniture, he encourages her to sneak away from work for cheese fries, and he's made his interest clear (so he isn't just lurking around) but he isn't pushing her into dating him. The most offensive thing he's done so far is mispronounce bruschetta.

ITA that it was selfish, rude, and inappropriate for both Rome and Gina to push Maggie into continuing her sessions with him. She has already explained why it was not appropriate for him to see her in any sort of therapist/counselor kind of way. ACCEPT IT, PEOPLE. There are millions of other people in the world. If you can learn to trust Maggie with your feelings in the few weeks that you've known her, you can find someone else to trust with your feelings. Like, maybe your therapist? Or another friend? But it is not Maggie's responsibility to be that person for you. And that's all before you factor in her cancer and short time left on this earth (until she inevitably decides she has so much to live for and must start treatment immediately!).

[gibasi]

On 11/29/2018 at 5:55 AM, debraran said:

Please if it turns into a daytime soap opera at night, I"ll have to cross it off. It had so much promise.

This is exactly what the show is and has been from the beginning. It is what This Is Us is and what Thirty Something was and most of these other shows.  It doesn't make them bad.  And some shows do it better than others. 

Anyway I agree the timeline is kind of funky and the way Maggie is so in with the group but I am just going with it. In other words I like it.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I’m trying to figure out why the Maggie character/actress irks me so much. She seems soooo aware of the camera. “They’re filming me now- - time to act.” 

When Rome delivers humorous lines, it seems completely natural and spontaneous. When Gary delivers “humorous” lines, it seems extremely rehearsed and too “slick.” It comes across to me as if he polished up these jokes weeks earlier, and has been waiting for the chance to use them.  

[Clanstarling]

9 hours ago, Dani said:

I have the same reaction but am not sure if that is deliberate or Delilah’s inability to portray any emotion. 

I'm going to give the show more credit than it seems to deserve and think it's deliberate - because that makes better dramatic sense to me.

5 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

This show really does have a Thirtysomething (ABC melodrama from the 90s) feel to it, doesn't it?  That had been bugging me for the longest time, what does this show remind me of?  That's it, pretty folks in their 30s with unrealistic problems, all set to the backdrop of pop music.  Except this show isn't as good as Thirtysomething.  Man, I really do miss Brothers and Sisters, that show really nailed how to do friend/family melodrama featuring this demographic.  The casting was superb (Sally Field, Rob Lowe and Emily Van Camp!) and it was almost always well-acted.

I personally wouldn't include Emily Van Camp, unless she's improved since then, but I will add Ron Rifkin, Rachel Griffiths, Matthew Rhys, and Luke McFarlane to that list. All pretty stellar in their own ways.

[Gothish520]

1 hour ago, gibasi said:

This is exactly what the show is and has been from the beginning. It is what This Is Us is and what Thirty Something was and most of these other shows.  It doesn't make them bad.  And some shows do it better than others. 

Anyway I agree the timeline is kind of funky and the way Maggie is so in with the group but I am just going with it. In other words I like it.

Yup, totally agree.

It's quite obvious to me that this is a show about personal drama/melodrama and I'm perfectly ok with that. Some things ring true, but a lot of things don't and I'm ok with that too.

I don't need all that much realism from my television shows. How incredibly boring would that be? If I want to watch average people doing average things I'll spy on the neighbors, LOL 

[Suzn]

I totally see the the problems with this show that others see.  It is unrealistic, even ridiculous,  on so many levels.  That said, I still feel compelled to watch.  I am curious about what  Jon's assistant is hiding and hope that is not drawn out too much.  I like Rome and Regina, Gary somewhat.  Maggie - I want her to get it over with and decide to get treatment.  It is pointless to drag this out unless they really do want to kill her off soon.

It is funny to me to compare this show to Thirtysomething.  Am I the only one who thinks that David Giutoli resembles Ken Olin when on that show?

[Seelouis]

15 hours ago, ams1001 said:

And apparently doesn't care enough about her parents to at least try to not let them lose two kids... (my cousin's ex-mother-in-law has buried her husband and both of her (adult) kids; the second one just last year. 

And hey, did anyone else catch the throwaway line from Delilah confirming that she is, in fact, French? (Something about being French and not being allowed to have wine and soft cheese.) She also mentioned insurance money, so I guess she's dealt with some of the financial stuff off screen, at least. Maybe the writers have been reading the comments…

I am wondering if her being French is a retcon the writers threw in when it became apparent the actress can’t hide her accent.  Now, they just need to retcon why she can’t act. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

6 minutes ago, Seelouis said:

I am wondering if her being French is a retcon the writers threw in when it became apparent the actress can’t hide her accent.  Now, they just need to retcon why she can’t act. 

I don't think she ever tried to hide her accent. It was obvious to me in the first episode that she had a French accent and in the Friday night pizza episode, she had her dad tell the story about how he met her mom at the airport when she was on her way to France.

[chitowngirl]

11 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

 

Yeah, I can totally see Delilah trading in her McMansion for a third floor rental with the guitar teacher.

And her two kids and his son. Were they both planning on abandoning them? 

[Clanstarling]

59 minutes ago, Suzn said:

I totally see the the problems with this show that others see.  It is unrealistic, even ridiculous,  on so many levels.  That said, I still feel compelled to watch.  I am curious about what  Jon's assistant is hiding and hope that is not drawn out too much.  I like Rome and Regina, Gary somewhat.  Maggie - I want her to get it over with and decide to get treatment.  It is pointless to drag this out unless they really do want to kill her off soon.

It is funny to me to compare this show to Thirtysomething.  Am I the only one who thinks that David Giutoli resembles Ken Olin when on that show?

Maybe, though Giutoli is much better looking (imo).

[smartymarty]

16 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

When Maggie confronts Gary about sleeping with Ashley I truly hope he says "we were on a break". 

I actually said that out loud at the time.

 

Gary goes to Maggie's apartment to apologize/not apologize, and I say "if he know she doesn't want to talk with him, why isn't he just texting this speech?" But then he says he's called and texted multiple times and she hasn't replied. So then his going to her apartment door anyway is STALKING people. Seriously! This is not endearing behavior. I would never consider returning to dating someone like that who SO does not respect boundaries. And then he flies to Chicago to find her friend??! And wants that guy to come to Boston to convince Maggie to get treatment? I couldn't believe the friend didn't blow Gary off with a "dude, this is so not your business." Gary used to be my favorite character, but no more.

And I liked Maggie for sticking to her guns, until I realized that was premised on ridiculous teenage guilt that surely she would have recognized for such during her schooling.

Other quibbles:

- What was Maggie packing up for her parents? She never unpacked. [In response to those who say now her parents will have buried two children, I guess Maggie believes they'd be relieved that the daughter who was responsible for their son's death was finally dead herself. Yeah, really ridiculous.]

- Three weeks?! This all has happened in only three weeks? Jon committed suicide that nobody saw coming, and they're all okay now, including finding out about and getting over Delilah's affair?

- If I were one of these friends (thank the Flying Spaghetti Monster I'm not), finding out about "Jon's" baby, I would wonder "so Delilah was sleeping with her husband AND Eddie at the same time?" I understand her not wanting to tell the children yet (and maybe not for the first year), but none of the friends are like WTF?

- Others have said it, we all know it from TV watching, that Maggie can't be Rome's therapist. (And is it kind of funny that Regina is okay with Maggie dying, but not with her not being Rome's therapist? Because that second thing is important.)

- It's only been three weeks, but Katherine's already thinking about dating? 

- It's only been three weeks, but Hunter's already moving in on Katherine?

- When Eddie went to Katherine about the lease, I thought it was because he was going to ask her for money to pay the rent. Again, does he want to save his marriage or be with Delilah?

- Since when is Ashley a friend of the group? I am only watching this show to find our her/Jon's secret.

- If this had been on Thirty Something, the conversation about Katherine coming to the dinner would have started out with "I realize this could be very uncomfortable for you." If on Friends, after saying please come, Katherine would have answered "You realize this would be very uncomfortable for me, right?" On MLT, it's "please come," "oh okay!"

[HazelEyes4325]

2 hours ago, Suzn said:

I totally see the the problems with this show that others see.  It is unrealistic, even ridiculous,  on so many levels.  That said, I still feel compelled to watch.  

1

My thing with this show, I've realized, is a little complicated.  As I said, I'm not hate-watching.  But I sometimes hate myself for watching.  I want this show to succeed and I desperately hope that it improves.  I actually think that the basis for a really amazing show is there, even if it gets buried a bit more each with each episode.  I sort of feel angry *for* the actors (well, most of them.  Not Szostak or Ochoa) because they are really the ones who are making this all work.  The writing just isn't there to back them up and they deserve better.

My other thing is this: I find it a little fascinating how the show gets things so *wrong.*  I do some writing and stories have always fascinated me.  What makes a story work and what doesn't?  This show is frequently a good example of what doesn't work and, on an academic level, I'm enjoying seeing that and working out why things work and don't work.  I think this is also why I want to see it improve--because I feel like that I, personally, can learn from that.

2 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I don't think she ever tried to hide her accent. It was obvious to me in the first episode that she had a French accent and in the Friday night pizza episode, she had her dad tell the story about how he met her mom at the airport when she was on her way to France.

I actually think that her accent was much more subdued in the pilot and maybe the 2nd episode and it has gotten stronger as the show went on.  Honestly, I don't care if they retconned that in.   It just isn't a big deal to me. However, I have to agree with @Seelouis here:

2 hours ago, Seelouis said:

Now, they just need to retcon why she can’t act. 

 

THAT is a much bigger problem for me.

I have this weird thing where I always want to know why people stop watching TV shows.  If someone says they are no longer watching something, even if it is a show I've never heard of, I always want to know why.  As I said, I'm a story geek.  Anyway, I had a fair number of people in my life start watching this show and every single one of them has dropped it.  And, of course, I asked them why.

Every single one of them dropped it because of Delilah.  Some just hate the character.  Some think that she's just such an unbelievable character that it undermines the whole show.  Some are really disgusted with her pregnancy (rightly so, IMO).  There have been other shows where a number of people I know have dropped it at about this same time, but this is the first time I can recall that everyone I've talked to dropped a show for pretty much the same reason.

 

2 hours ago, Suzn said:

Am I the only one who thinks that David Giutoli resembles Ken Olin when on that show?

1 hour ago, Clanstarling said:

Maybe, though Giutoli is much better looking (imo).

 

True dat. 

[nexxie]

The way I’m reading Delilah is that she’d like to be with Eddie but is thinking of her children (the ones already born) - and that tender moment between them in the apt. Eddie wished was theirs happened in front of a window for a reason. Who saw them?

[ramble]

Was this supposed to be a deep dive into the Maggie character episode so we’ll connect? Nope, still can’t stand her, or almost anyone else. Rome and Theo. I like them. I have a big issue with the speed Maggie has become a bestest friend part of the inner circle who is loved and supported unquestioningly. Hasn’t Katherine been around for years? I guess since man-child Eddie has been whiny and unhappy she is not a bestest friend and she doesn't get the loving support. Well that plus the woman side of the mccheaterson sandwich just lost her husband so she gets a free pass for her infidelity. Ugh. That entire storyline is disgusting. Why would Regina invite Katherine to the tasting? The woman who broke up her marriage, her ex mooning over said woman, and the nonsupportive friend group were all the other invitees. For all the big emotions spilling out and sticking all over everyone like glitter you’d think one person would have a empathy moment and stop the invitation idea. It’s got such a cliquey feel to it at times it’s slimy. James Roday still has enough residual Shawn Spencer love from me that I’m hanging on, but barely. I would never want to be friends with these people in real life. 

[sadie]

9 minutes ago, ramble said:

Was this supposed to be a deep dive into the Maggie character episode so we’ll connect? Nope, still can’t stand her, or almost anyone else. Rome and Theo. I like them. I have a big issue with the speed Maggie has become a bestest friend part of the inner circle who is loved and supported unquestioningly. Hasn’t Katherine been around for years? I guess since man-child Eddie has been whiny and unhappy she is not a bestest friend and she doesn't get the loving support. Well that plus the woman side of the mccheaterson sandwich just lost her husband so she gets a free pass for her infidelity. Ugh. That entire storyline is disgusting. Why would Regina invite Katherine to the tasting? The woman who broke up her marriage, her ex mooning over said woman, and the nonsupportive friend group were all the other invitees. For all the big emotions spilling out and sticking all over everyone like glitter you’d think one person would have a empathy moment and stop the invitation idea. It’s got such a cliquey feel to it at times it’s slimy. James Roday still has enough residual Shawn Spencer love from me that I’m hanging on, but barely. I would never want to be friends with these people in real life. 

Love this whole post times one million! 

[snarkylady]

23 minutes ago, ramble said:

 James Roday still has enough residual Shawn Spencer love from me that I’m hanging on, but barely. 

That's my feeling as well.

[Clanstarling]

1 hour ago, ramble said:

James Roday still has enough residual Shawn Spencer love from me that I’m hanging on, but barely. I would never want to be friends with these people in real life. 

The scene where he goes off on Maggie at the tasting has pretty much removed any residual at this point for me.

[OpalNightstream]

Sorry if this was mentioned earlier as I did not read all the comments yet, but why hasn’t Delilah even thought about how her kids will react to the baby that they will believe was fathered by their late dad? Is the plan to keep the paternity a secret to the grave? What’s the long term plan here? She doesn’t seem all the concerned with having a baby (a huge life choice for even the most stable of couples). 

Also, why does she speak with a constant Marilyn Monroe whisper? Use your big girl voice!

Don’t get me started on instant Bff Maggie...

[dargosmydaddy]

7 hours ago, smartymarty said:

- What was Maggie packing up for her parents? She never unpacked. [In response to those who say now her parents will have buried two children, I guess Maggie believes they'd be relieved that the daughter who was responsible for their son's death was finally dead herself. Yeah, really ridiculous.]

Right? And what exactly is she packing? She knew she was dying when she moved, didn't she? That was, like, the reason she left? So she could live her remaining time to the fullest while avoiding all loved ones. So shouldn't she have purged her belongings before she left, either by putting them in storage (which would conceivably be much more convenient for her parents to sort through if it was in Chicago-- assuming that's where her family lives-- as opposed to Boston) or donating them. So just bring the absolute essentials to Boston... but then she actually needs to be using them since she is, you know, still alive for the moment. Is she continually taking things in and out of boxes? If she had just taken the bare minimum to begin with, would it be that big of a deal for her parents to have to pack up anyway? Considering they're going to have to make the trip all the way to Boston anyway, might as well give them a little something to do... And is she going to tell her parents she's dying at some point?

The recurring nightmare was also hokey as hell and way too on-the-nose, including the immediate insertion of Rome. I mean, I know TV-dreams are meant to be symbolic and are always unrealistic, but these just seemed particularly bad. 

[Aryanna]

3 hours ago, OpalNightstream said:

why hasn’t Delilah even thought about how her kids will react to the baby that they will believe was fathered by their late dad? 

I guess it's a good thing she wasn't cheating with Rome. The cat would be out of the bag pretty quick with her children.

 

Quote

Also, why does she speak with a constant Marilyn Monroe whisper? Use your big girl voice!

Yes. Thank you. To me, it's not just her. Most of them talk in that overly dramatic whisper. And the whole show is shot with a blue hue to it. These people never laugh or have fun. I'm starting to see why Jon jumped. If these people were my friends, I might jump too.

Spoiler

It's a joke. I'm just trying to be funny in a sassy way. I wouldn't really jump. But I would find new friends.

[Dowel Jones]

You know, if I were given a reasonably accurate date for my own death, and I wanted to live my remaining life to the utmost, I sure as hell wouldn't spend my time hanging around a bunch of mopey friends who can't get their own lives in gear.  I would be maxing out my credit cards on skiing or sunbathing, touring someplace different every week, or, like the song says, "I went skydiving, I went Rocky Mountain climbing, I went 2.7 seconds on a bull named Fu Manchu...".

[debraran]

2 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

You know, if I were given a reasonably accurate date for my own death, and I wanted to live my remaining life to the utmost, I sure as hell wouldn't spend my time hanging around a bunch of mopey friends who can't get their own lives in gear.  I would be maxing out my credit cards on skiing or sunbathing, touring someplace different every week, or, like the song says, "I went skydiving, I went Rocky Mountain climbing, I went 2.7 seconds on a bull named Fu Manchu...".

She keeps running and staying away from family.  She runs and then collapses the next day. Will it be too late now?

I keep getting the feeling that Maggie got bigger than they originally wanted or she was supposed to get treatment and then maybe push Gary away or whatever, but this mess is so bad, I lost my 3 "Million Things" friends at work. No one to talk about hanging in except here.  One said the airplane dreams and the weeks of "no treatment,get treatment" killed it for her, having her favorite guy Rome act so stupid with begging for therapy, you aren't supposed to be friends with your therapist. After going on with a long list of bad writing, also bringing up "when is Delilah going to dump this on her kids?", I said "but the letter".  I just get blank stares.  You could see  a lot of the letter on this site that someone posted, it's not earth shattering on first page, but I am curious about page 2.

I guess I'll have a hate/love relationship with show until season ends and if they keep up the dribble, they might lose a lot of people. It was a cool concept, I don't get the writing lately, it's so bad. But I'm glad there is somewhere to discuss it. ; )

Edited December 1, 2018 by debraran

[Scarlett45]

12 hours ago, Aryanna said:

 

15 hours ago, OpalNightstream said:

why hasn’t Delilah even thought about how her kids will react to the baby that they will believe was fathered by their late dad? 

I guess it's a good thing she wasn't cheating with Rome. The cat would be out of the bag pretty quick with her children.

 

 

15 hours ago, OpalNightstream said:

Sorry if this was mentioned earlier as I did not read all the comments yet, but why hasn’t Delilah even thought about how her kids will react to the baby that they will believe was fathered by their late dad? Is the plan to keep the paternity a secret to the grave? What’s the long term plan here? She doesn’t seem all the concerned with having a baby (a huge life choice for even the most stable of couples). 

Also, why does she speak with a constant Marilyn Monroe whisper? Use your big girl voice!

Don’t get me started on instant Bff Maggie...

I think Delilah doesn’t want to be known as the woman who not only cheated on her husband but got pregnant by another man (the same way it’s one thing for a man to cheat on his spouse but to get his mistress pregnant is an entirely different thing).

I also think she wants the social support of being a pregnant widow rather than a pregnant side chick of her husband’s friend. Of course the adults will figure it out shortly, but it’s not a shocking idea that Delilah would be sleeping with both Eddie and Jon- Jon was her husband. Eddie was sleeping with both Delilah and Katherine. 

 

The way tv goes the kids will walk in on her discussing things with Eddie and there will be fall out from that. 

 

Eddie needs to get over Delilah. Jon is dead, Katherine kicked him out, and Delilah still doesn’t want him!!

[alexvillage]

Reading some of these comments I think I am in the minority here. I do like the show. I can pretend I don't see some inconsistencies (like Maggie packing what she never unpacked) but I like how they deal with depression and Maggie's decision to not have another round of chemo.

The depression theme is a difficult one to write, I think, and I like that they didn't went the overly dramatic way. Some people who have depression do manage to live day-to-day without letting anyone know. I see Rome as one of the people who can fake until he brakes.

As for Maggie, I think I would do the same thing, so I am sympathetic to her. I like that she is putting her own self care above the emotional appeals of the others. We still don't know much about it but it is her decision. The silly part was the friends showing up and dragging her to the party. That was inconsistent with the character, or at least the writers could have shown some more conflict on her part. She wants to be left alone, but she wants to be part of the circle of friends.

[debraran]

48 minutes ago, alexvillage said:

Reading some of these comments I think I am in the minority here. I do like the show. I can pretend I don't see some inconsistencies (like Maggie packing what she never unpacked) but I like how they deal with depression and Maggie's decision to not have another round of chemo.

The depression theme is a difficult one to write, I think, and I like that they didn't went the overly dramatic way. Some people who have depression do manage to live day-to-day without letting anyone know. I see Rome as one of the people who can fake until he brakes.

As for Maggie, I think I would do the same thing, so I am sympathetic to her. I like that she is putting her own self care above the emotional appeals of the others. We still don't know much about it but it is her decision. The silly part was the friends showing up and dragging her to the party. That was inconsistent with the character, or at least the writers could have shown some more conflict on her part. She wants to be left alone, but she wants to be part of the circle of friends.

But she probably will change her mind after her third dream of her brother (gag) but then it will be a miracle of sorts, since the cancer is spreading. I don't think she will stay the course.

[alexvillage]

41 minutes ago, debraran said:

But she probably will change her mind after her third dream of her brother (gag) but then it will be a miracle of sorts, since the cancer is spreading. I don't think she will stay the course.

Likely. The timeline in the show seems to be moving slower than most shows do, so maybe the writers will extend the seasons and just pick up where it was left the next season (assuming the show gets renewed). The year Maggie has could extend to three seasons easily if they go this direction. That would be interesting and very different from what I am used to, where each episode happens one week after the last, then there are the holiday episodes - which I find boring as fuck. I would like to see something different.

[dargosmydaddy]

2 hours ago, alexvillage said:

The year Maggie has could extend to three seasons easily if they go this direction.

Although presumably the growth of the Theo actor and the kid who plays Jon's son (blanking on the character's name...Mark?) would have to be ignored. Or they would have to be kidnapped/ sent away like Lost did....

Personally I don't see this show lasting three seasons, though. Or, if it does, I don't see my interest lasting three seasons.

Edited December 1, 2018 by dargosmydaddy

[debraran]

I think what bothers me also is the way he died, he literally planned (although this fact not widely known yet) and jumped from his balcony. He not only hurt himself but could have hurt others as well. His children and friends would have read about it in the paper, you would think journalists would be curious why a businessman would do that. He wasn't home or driving his car somewhere, this was planned. He in his convoluted thinking by the writers. planned his letter and will and life insurance but wanted his children to know their dad jumped off a high balcony to the street below. For someone who planned this, wrote "there is no other way" this was a bit much. Drama for TV maybe but cruel to his family. Any suicide is awful, painful but to do it in a way that would attract so much attention, I don't know, it just doesn't sit well with his other planning.

[ams1001]

4 minutes ago, debraran said:

For someone who planned this, wrote "there is no other way" this was a bit much. 

And they included this but then it's like every few episodes that we see anything even remotely related to the actual reason he did it. And none of it has so far led to any actually useful clues. It's just frustrating as a viewer.

Edited December 1, 2018 by ams1001

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

Although presumably the growth of the Theo actor and the kid who plays Jon's son (blanking on the character's name...Mark?) would have to be ignored. Or they would have to be kidnapped/ sent away like Lost did....

Personally I don't see this show lasting three seasons, though. Or, if it does, I don't see my interest lasting three seasons.

Danny. 

Keeping the timeline slow to drag out the Maggie’s decline would also mean dragging out Delilah’s pregnancy. 

3 minutes ago, debraran said:

I think what bothers me also is the way he died, he literally planned (although this fact not widely known yet) and jumped from his balcony. He not only hurt himself but could have hurt others as well. His children and friends would have read about it in the paper, you would think journalists would be curious why a businessman would do that. He wasn't home or driving his car somewhere, this was planned. He in his convoluted thinking by the writers. planned his letter and will and life insurance but wanted his children to know their dad jumped off a high balcony to the street below. For someone who planned this, wrote "there is no other way" this was a bit much. Drama for TV maybe but cruel to his family. Any suicide is awful, painful but to do it in a way that would attract so much attention, I don't know, it just doesn't sit well with his other planning.

Not to mention how traumatizing it would be to anyone who saw is body. Even if he checked to make sure no one was on the street anyone who was unlucky enough to walk by would be having nightmares for years to come. You would think someone planning for years would have chosen a different method. 

Maybe that is why Ashley’s actions make no sense. She is suffering from PTSD from seeing her boss splattered on the sidewalk. 

[alexvillage]

28 minutes ago, Dani said:

Not to mention how traumatizing it would be to anyone who saw is body. Even if he checked to make sure no one was on the street anyone who was unlucky enough to walk by would be having nightmares for years to come. You would think someone planning for years would have chosen a different method. 

Maybe that is why Ashley’s actions make no sense. She is suffering from PTSD from seeing her boss splattered on the sidewalk. 

I choose to have compassion for people who commit suicide. The person is already empty of hope, probably believing they don't deserve anything and that no one will care if they die. I refuse to allow myself to think that they should have found a "better way" to end their own lives. The burden someone who is bout to end all might carry gives me pause to blame them for the feelings of people who are left. I do feel for those people but cannot fathom the loneliness of someone taking their own life. It is a lose-lose situation.

 

Can's stand Ashley. I think it is the actress I cannot stand but still. It is an unnecessary character, in my view. 

 

33 minutes ago, Dani said:

Keeping the timeline slow to drag out the Maggie’s decline would also mean dragging out Delilah’s pregnancy. 

True, I didn't think about that. I guess I will have to settle for the miracle recovery then. Ugh.

[HazelEyes4325]

I will say that there was something about this episode that either (very, very slightly) intrigues me or fills me with dread.

As we are now, Maggie and Gary are broken up, Gary is banging his dead best friend's secretary, and Maggie is very firmly part of the friend group.  I have no misconception that Gary's temper tantrum, or even the fact that he slept with Ashley, will kick him out of the friend group (I mean, not only is Eddie still there but apparently Katherine is now a part of the group?  Because that would work in any reality???).  So, what is it going to be:

1 - Maggie and Gary are truly broken up and now Maggie has a place in that group that is completely her own?  As I said, I'm slightly interested in seeing how Nash tries to make this work.  Not that I would believe it, of course, but how is he going to try to make it work?

-or-

2 - We have basically Ross and Rachel going on for the rest of this series.  So, so, so not here for that.

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, alexvillage said:

I choose to have compassion for people who commit suicide. The person is already empty of hope, probably believing they don't deserve anything and that no one will care if they die. I refuse to allow myself to think that they should have found a "better way" to end their own lives. The burden someone who is bout to end all might carry gives me pause to blame them for the feelings of people who are left. I do feel for those people but cannot fathom the loneliness of someone taking their own life. It is a lose-lose situation. 

I agree with you. I didn’t mean for that to be a statement about suicide in the real world but just pertaining to the way Jon has been written on the show. At the moment I find the method to be incongruent with Jon’s portrayal as a man who very carefully planned his own death for years. 

I want the show to bring the kind of depth you describe to Jon’s decision. Ideally this show could say something really beneficial about mental health and depression but unfortunately that is not the show we are getting at the moment. 

[HazelEyes4325]

13 minutes ago, Dani said:

I agree with you. I didn’t mean for that to be a statement about suicide in the real world but just pertaining to the way Jon has been written on the show. At the moment I find the method to be incongruent with Jon’s portrayal as a man who very carefully planned his own death for years. 

I want the show to bring the kind of depth you describe to Jon’s decision. Ideally this show could say something really beneficial about mental health and depression but unfortunately that is not the show we are getting at the moment. 

And we can have all the sympathy in the world for Jon.  That doesn't change the fact that his family and friends have suffered because of his death.  And, since his family and friends are the characters in the show (and not really Jon), that is actually where the focus is.

[Lady Calypso]

So...I finally got around to watching the actual episode. I guess this was a break in the one day an episode thing that the showrunner was talking about, since this episode took place over the course of two days. I guess it makes more sense than Gary flying to Chicago and back in a day.

Here's the thing about Gary as a character: he is actually a pretty damn good friend. He's been supportive, even when he shouldn't be, he's been there when he needs to be, and yes, he definitely is pushy but it's because he cares. Meanwhile, his so called friends treat him like dirt. Even despite knowing him longer, they chose Maggie over him about their break-up, even before they found out about Maggie's cancer returning. What kind of shitty friends choose a woman they met four weeks ago over their supposed best friend? Even if he's being a jackass, his friends should still give him the benefit of the doubt over Maggie. It does go to show that Gary wasn't wrong in the pilot about them not really being friends. We've had a lot of inconsistencies about the pilot, but they kind of brought it back. 

I may get super pissed at Gary, especially when it comes to Maggie, but he has been a great friend and he's been a good secret keeper. Actually, Regina and Rome are the worst secret keepers thus far. 

Although, with Gary sleeping with Ashley, none of them have ANY room to judge. But these so called friends get over things instantly so this issue should be a minor blip in an episode. 

Eddie just needs to only have scenes with Theo and then I could like him. His flip flopping between Katherine and Delilah is pathetic, at best. Although it does seem like the showrunner doesn't even know which woman is endgame for Eddie, so that's better than Eddie/Delilah being endgame for sure. Having him go from pining over Delilah to looking at Hunter as a jealous ex gives me a little hope on that front. Not much, of course, but a little. I'd hope that DJ Nash realizes that Eddie/Delilah is a sinking ship and that the show will tank even further if he continues that route.

[debraran]

48 minutes ago, Dani said:

I agree with you. I didn’t mean for that to be a statement about suicide in the real world but just pertaining to the way Jon has been written on the show. At the moment I find the method to be incongruent with Jon’s portrayal as a man who very carefully planned his own death for years. 

I want the show to bring the kind of depth you describe to Jon’s decision. Ideally this show could say something really beneficial about mental health and depression but unfortunately that is not the show we are getting at the moment. 

I agree with that too, but this seemed less clinical depression than he just didn't want to deal with the repercussions of his actions, the money loss and probably criminal charges. He was in a very calculating state of mind to plan it this way, he made meticulous plans and calls and felt this was how he wanted to go vs the repercussions. I've known suicide and don't judge but this wasn't a spiral per se not the way they wrote it. It was a very dramatic and messy way to end his life with a lot of publicity not from the suicide but the way he did it.

I don't judge people who are depressed, Jon was written differently. His note was very lucid and he chose (to me) to not live with what was to come but if he didn't get in trouble and lose his money and maybe other peoples money, he would have been fine.

[Gothish520]

8 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

So...I finally got around to watching the actual episode. I guess this was a break in the one day an episode thing that the showrunner was talking about, since this episode took place over the course of two days. I guess it makes more sense than Gary flying to Chicago and back in a day.

Here's the thing about Gary as a character: he is actually a pretty damn good friend. He's been supportive, even when he shouldn't be, he's been there when he needs to be, and yes, he definitely is pushy but it's because he cares. Meanwhile, his so called friends treat him like dirt. Even despite knowing him longer, they chose Maggie over him about their break-up, even before they found out about Maggie's cancer returning. What kind of shitty friends choose a woman they met four weeks ago over their supposed best friend? Even if he's being a jackass, his friends should still give him the benefit of the doubt over Maggie. It does go to show that Gary wasn't wrong in the pilot about them not really being friends. We've had a lot of inconsistencies about the pilot, but they kind of brought it back. 

I may get super pissed at Gary, especially when it comes to Maggie, but he has been a great friend and he's been a good secret keeper. Actually, Regina and Rome are the worst secret keepers thus far. 

Although, with Gary sleeping with Ashley, none of them have ANY room to judge. But these so called friends get over things instantly so this issue should be a minor blip in an episode. 

Eddie just needs to only have scenes with Theo and then I could like him. His flip flopping between Katherine and Delilah is pathetic, at best. Although it does seem like the showrunner doesn't even know which woman is endgame for Eddie, so that's better than Eddie/Delilah being endgame for sure. Having him go from pining over Delilah to looking at Hunter as a jealous ex gives me a little hope on that front. Not much, of course, but a little. I'd hope that DJ Nash realizes that Eddie/Delilah is a sinking ship and that the show will tank even further if he continues that route.

I think it's realistic for Eddie to give Hunter the side-eye. It's not like he went into a jealous rage, but I can see him having a moment over the situation. Human emotions can be complicated, and Eddie probably has some regrets, even though he was so unhappy with Katherine. Just as I'm sure Delilah has plenty of regrets as well.

ETA: Gary has plenty of faults, but I agree that when the chips are down, he's a great friend.

Edited December 2, 2018 by Gothish520

[Gothish520]

21 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

You know, if I were given a reasonably accurate date for my own death, and I wanted to live my remaining life to the utmost, I sure as hell wouldn't spend my time hanging around a bunch of mopey friends who can't get their own lives in gear.  I would be maxing out my credit cards on skiing or sunbathing, touring someplace different every week, or, like the song says, "I went skydiving, I went Rocky Mountain climbing, I went 2.7 seconds on a bull named Fu Manchu...".

I would be dining at fancy restaurants, drinking fine wines, buying my family and friends nice gifts, buying myself nice gifts!