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S06.E04: Our Time Is Up


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(edited)

This must've been Reg E. Cathey's last role before he died of lung cancer February 9th. He didn't seem sick, but didn't look quite as strong either. I wonder if the episode title was in part an homage? And Sherlock's line about how one of them would die and it wouldn't be himself…

 

So if Joan adopts will she stay in the brownstone? 

Edited by shapeshifter
tiny typo
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Well, that's one way to make me not figure out who the killer is: have almost everyone be a familiar face!  James Urbaniak, Douglas Hodge, Maulik Pancholy, and, RIP, Reg E. Cathey is certainly a talented group of suspects!  Still not surprised it was Urbaniak's doctor though, because he did seem pretty suspicious in the beginning.  St

I actually got the sense that Mr. Clay could have been a recurring foil depending on if he "fixes" other problems, but sadly Cathey's passing will make that null and void.  I will miss his talent badass voice.

Enjoyed Bell's crack about how there are time he wished he could just lock Sherlock in a box.

Lin has been much improved so far this season.

Not sure how I feel about this adoption storyline with Joan.

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6 hours ago, GaT said:

No, no, NO. Do not bring a kid onto this show, I have no interest in a "Watson is a mommy" plot.

And if they want a smaller character, they have Clyde.  Remember Clyde, TPTB?

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8 hours ago, GaT said:

No, no, NO. Do not bring a kid onto this show, I have no interest in a "Watson is a mommy" plot.

As Lin noted, Watson is already a mommy.  To Sherlock.

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Someone taking their life is certainly not funny..  I myself have experienced someone close who did.  But, I could not help but chuckle when Sherlock & Watson were looking at the screen away from the suspect dude while they were talking about Watson's psych file.. Then he  stepped over the balcony wall and jumped.

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I have zero interest in watching Joan become a mom because her dead therapist said she should in her notes. I mean, its fine if thats what she wants, but I have no clue what a kid could bring to the show. If she needs to get her maternal instinct on, she should just spend more time taking care of Clyde. Or maybe get a cat. I could see Joan with a act. Sherlock himself is basically a cat in human form anyway. In fact, as Lin said, she already has a child, and his name is Sherlock. 

The client jumping off the roof while Joan and Sherlock were chatting about her psych file was played a bit for dark laughs, but I liked how much Sherlock showed empathy for the guy. I thought this was a pretty good case, and one way to get me confused as to who the killer is is to make them all actors that I recognize from stuff! I did suspect the other therapist though, he seemed suspicious from the first interview. 

So the dead girl was an addict? Maybe the guy is killing addicts from their program in some twisted mercy kill, or they died of an OD, and he is just hiding the bodies, but has a compulsion to share this? 

I liked the scenes with Joan and Lin a lot, their banter was funny and sweet. And I chuckled at Bell saying he sometimes wanted to lock Sherlock in a box. And Sherlock insisting that the Victorians could build them a hell of a derivation chamber. 

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I thought it showed that both Sherlock and Joan were kind of off their games that

A) they spoke outloud about their crimes in the office before verifying it wasn't bugged (they've been bugged enough that that's not paranoid)

B) they didn't suspect or worry when dude went out to the balcony for air.

I did appreciate that LL as they were initially talking, did turn and look over JLM's shoulder a bit out to the balcony as if to check on him. The look on her face didn't seem to me like she was worried about him overhearing, but rather they turned away to give him privacy to compose himself...but she also didn't want to not look for too long, but after that first lookback they kept talking for too long and she missed it. Even if they knew nothing about the guy I'd be worried about him suddenly going on a balcony, probably because I watch too much TV, but still, the concern was automatic.

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4 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I have zero interest in watching Joan become a mom because her dead therapist said she should in her notes. I mean, its fine if thats what she wants, but I have no clue what a kid could bring to the show.

I thought it was really oddly set up. I assume (or hope) that in a future episode Joan will admit to Sherlock or someone that she had been thinking about adoption for awhile and the therapist's notes were what convinced her, but if that's not the case, then WTF? Lin's speech about Joan's life already being incredible was pretty kickass (and would have been a perfect opportunity for Joan to say she was already considering motherhood...), and I would expect a show that is so awesome in the way it portrays romantic relationships (as in, not every main character needs to be in one at all times, and they definitely don't need to be in them with each other) would be similarly awesome in letting its female lead be just fine with not being a mom. Not that there's anything wrong with Joan's decision, but I feel like we've seen this story line before on plenty of other shows (whether its having a biological kid or adopting), whereas having a forty-something woman being content without a romantic partner or kids is something that is not seen as much (and should be seen more).

That said, if Joan does adopt, I'm cautiously optimistic that the show would set it up in a way that would be at least somewhat compelling. I admit I don't know how, but we shall see...

As for the rest of the episode, I'm hoping the deprivation chamber makes more appearances (shirtless JLM!). And I think this might have been the strongest episode of the season so far in terms of dark humor and amusing asides/ character interactions.

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2 hours ago, theatremouse said:

Even if they knew nothing about the guy I'd be worried about him suddenly going on a balcony, probably because I watch too much TV, but still, the concern was automatic.

It did seem like a rooky mistake, didn't it?

2 hours ago, theatremouse said:

Even if they knew nothing about the guy I'd be worried about him suddenly going on a balcony, probably because I watch too much TV, but still, the concern was automatic.

It did seem like a rookie mistake, didn't it?

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58 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

I thought it was really oddly set up. I assume (or hope) that in a future episode Joan will admit to Sherlock or someone that she had been thinking about adoption for awhile and the therapist's notes were what convinced her, but if that's not the case, then WTF? Lin's speech about Joan's life already being incredible was pretty kickass (and would have been a perfect opportunity for Joan to say she was already considering motherhood...), and I would expect a show that is so awesome in the way it portrays romantic relationships (as in, not every main character needs to be in one at all times, and they definitely don't need to be in them with each other) would be similarly awesome in letting its female lead be just fine with not being a mom. Not that there's anything wrong with Joan's decision, but I feel like we've seen this story line before on plenty of other shows (whether its having a biological kid or adopting), whereas having a forty-something woman being content without a romantic partner or kids is something that is not seen as much (and should be seen more).

That said, if Joan does adopt, I'm cautiously optimistic that the show would set it up in a way that would be at least somewhat compelling. I admit I don't know how, but we shall see...

As for the rest of the episode, I'm hoping the deprivation chamber makes more appearances (shirtless JLM!). And I think this might have been the strongest episode of the season so far in terms of dark humor and amusing asides/ character interactions.

So did I. Joan has never really said or acted like she wanted children has she? It really makes no sense and seems really out of the blue. I loved Lin's speech too about how awesome Joan's life is.  Plus we don't really know why her therapist wrote that done. Was it based off a conversation or something else? Maybe she thought Joan seemed to be taking care of someone?  Or maybe it was just a guess. Joan thought she wanted a conventional relationship until she dated Andrew and decided she didn't want it so maybe the therapist just assumed she wanted kids?  

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17 hours ago, GaT said:

No, no, NO. Do not bring a kid onto this show, I have no interest in a "Watson is a mommy" plot.

I respectfully disagree. One of things that makes this show intriguing is putting Joan and Sherlock in what I consider real life situations and what is more real than having kids and then balancing you work and your life.

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Ok, you've convinced me. If she adopts an older kid I'll accept it. But I really loved that the show gave Lin that speech about how irrelevant a kid would be, and I want the show to represent for that. This thing of her wanting a kid is completely random and out of character.

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(edited)
3 hours ago, johntfs said:

I kind of hope Joan gets an older kid who's in elementary school.  C'mon folks, who here doesn't want to see Sherlock in a parent-teacher conference?

Me, I really don't. This isn't Full House, this is supposed to be a show about Sherlock Holmes, the great detective & Watson, solving crimes. If the crimes are going to be "who stole little Tommy's pencil" I won't be watching, in fact, if there's a kid I won't be watching. And randomly giving Joan a kid just feels like another instance of thinking that you're not a real woman until you're a mother. I find it insulting.

Edited by GaT
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I don't necessarily expect realism, but it should take at least a year before any child would be placed with her. Can it happen faster? Sure. Do I expect that from TV? Also sure. But they could go the route of having it actually take a really long time, which is totally normal.

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Re Joan adopting a child: The show has usually done a good job of laying out a plotline. I recall that we all hated Kitty when she came on the show, and by the time she left, we all loved her.  I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt at this point.

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33 minutes ago, theatremouse said:

I don't necessarily expect realism, but it should take at least a year before any child would be placed with her....

The Thomas & Martha Wayne orphanage should be able to expedite the process...

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23 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

I wonder if the episode title was in part an homage? And Sherlock's line about how one of them would die and it wouldn't be himself…

Sherlock said that it would "lead to a murder, and not mine".  So that part, at least, wasn't an homage.

20 hours ago, GaT said:

No, no, NO. Do not bring a kid onto this show, I have no interest in a "Watson is a mommy" plot.

5 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

having a forty-something woman being content without a romantic partner or kids is something that is not seen as much (and should be seen more).

Ditto.

3 hours ago, CaptainCranky said:

what is more real than having kids and then balancing you work and your life.

That's on 1000 other shows.  No thanks.

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8 hours ago, AEMom said:

Re Joan adopting a child: The show has usually done a good job of laying out a plotline. I recall that we all hated Kitty when she came on the show, and by the time she left, we all loved her.  I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt at this point.

THANK YOU!

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(edited)
Quote

Re Joan adopting a child: The show has usually done a good job of laying out a plotline. I recall that we all hated Kitty when she came on the show, and by the time she left, we all loved her.  I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt at this point.

This is different than a new character coming in and upsetting the comfortable status quo.  Look at the title, referring to time.  This is adding yet one more plot to the pile of movie and television story lines that tell the women watching that all woman anywhere at anytime need is to be laid and/or have a baby before it is too late.   Maybe they will do a good job with the adoption plot.  Maybe Lucy Liu even inspired it because of the son she had (as a wealthy single woman in real life) by a surrogate.   It is still something that concerns me. 

Edited by Mermaid Under
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Why don't they adopt Moriarty's kid. How old would she be now? She's someone we've met and they also seemed to imply she was genius like her mother. Sherlock might like to take a kid that was like him under his wing. 

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(edited)
16 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

Why don't they adopt Moriarty's kid. How old would she be now? She's someone we've met and they also seemed to imply she was genius like her mother. Sherlock might like to take a kid that was like him under his wing. 

She seemed like she was in the 6-9 year old age range and that was 4-5 years ago in the show's timeline.  So, she'd be 10ish to 14ish now, which would be an interesting age.

Edited by johntfs
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Another NO vote for bringing a kid onto this show.   And as a childless woman (now well past menopause), I also resent how TV seems to have a problem portraying happy professional women living their lives without either having children or longing for them.   Yeez, look at what happened with Law & Order SVU when they gave Olivia an adopted kid.   As some said up thread, it was nice seeing Watson appearing happy with her life without either a man or kids.   Maybe that is considered too much of a freak show in our current version of America.  

Frankly, I think when shows that start out without kids start bringing them in, it's the Jump The Shark moment.  

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14 hours ago, AEMom said:

Re Joan adopting a child: The show has usually done a good job of laying out a plotline. I recall that we all hated Kitty when she came on the show, and by the time she left, we all loved her.  I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt at this point.

Okay. But in order to calm my TVK PTSD (TV kid post-traumatic stress disorder), I think I need at least one example of a drama that introduced a child character after a few seasons, and it worked well and added positively to the show. And I say this as someone way past menopause with 3 adult daughters and no grandchildren—FWIW.  And Breaking Bad  doesn't count because, IIRC, Skylar was pregnant when the show began, and the 5 seasons only covered less than 2 years BrBa time.

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11 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Okay. But in order to calm my TVK PTSD (TV kid post-traumatic stress disorder), I think I need at least one example of a drama that introduced a child character after a few seasons, and it worked well and added positively to the show. And I say this as someone way past menopause with 3 adult daughters and no grandchildren—FWIW.  And Breaking Bad  doesn't count because, IIRC, Skylar was pregnant when the show began, and the 5 seasons only covered less than 2 years BrBa time.

I'm thinking that the plot line may include her investigation of adopting a child, and the various paths that she takes -- perhaps she discovers a case while she's looking into one adoption agency, or whatever.  The show may never actually get to the point where she even adopts a child but there could be interesting stories that develop out of the search.

FWIW - I will also be disappointed if they actually bring a baby/child onto the show, because as many of you have commented, it tends to be the kiss of death for a show.  But I'm unconvinced at this point that an adoption is a done deal.

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Frankly, Sherlock is the one who seems more likely to enjoy the challenge, want the investment emotionally, and grow as a character from doing it. I just can't see Joan in the parenting role, I really can't. Sherlock is actually the one who gets invested in people and projects, he likes being a mentor, he is the one who needs an outlet for his energy and something to focus on that challenges him and keeps him from getting bored. He also doesn't need much sleep, usually. Let Sherlock take a foster. He needs a crusade, it might as well be this than another.

Watson is so detached and unemotional, I can't see her with a full time physical or emotional responsibility. She's reliable but she's never shown the slightest inclination towards this sort of thing at all, and the idea that the therapist's idea made her consider it is just bizarre. It implies she either always wanted it but never thought she could until the therapist validated it (which is ridiculous and makes her look way less independent or self-confident than she's always been) or that she never wanted it until the therapist gave her the idea, which is equally ridiculous.

The show doesn't need a child, though. I sort of hope the whole thing is some kind of misdirect. Maybe Joan is investigating a criminal enterprise underlying the adoption market, and is going to expose a trafficking ring or some other horror going on at the agency she's looking into.

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(edited)
57 minutes ago, possibilities said:

The show doesn't need a child, though. I sort of hope the whole thing is some kind of misdirect. Maybe Joan is investigating a criminal enterprise underlying the adoption market, and is going to expose a trafficking ring or some other horror going on at the agency she's looking into.

This made me LOL!  I don't want a "Watson gets a kid" plot either; but bringing a baby/kid on a show like this is such a mistake, we'd rather it be a story with adoption agencies committing horrible crimes than Joan gets an actual kid.  

Edited by Magnumfangirl
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23 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

As for the rest of the episode, I'm hoping the deprivation chamber makes more appearances (shirtless JLM!). 

So much this!!! I'm not even sure what was going on from there. Love a man who doesn't feel the need to shave his chest. Thank you show and JLM! 

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On May 22, 2018 at 6:14 PM, dargosmydaddy said:

Whereas having a forty-something woman being content without a romantic partner or kids is something that is not seen as much (and should be seen more).

And it's what I am too. As much as I love shows like 30 Rock and Parks and Rec, shows seemingly can't bear to have a professional leading woman end up happily alone or childless. (I still have hope for how How To Get Away with Murder will someday end though!) Yes, I love a happy ending, but many of my divorced friends will tell you that single can be happier.

I might be OK with an older kid who hits it off with Sherlock. But please, no baby, no little kid.

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(edited)

Sheesh, Lin's speech was so great. Joan's a complete person the way she is and I may have applauded that bit of writing. And then comes the whole adoption thing crashing down on that beautiful moment where a woman on tv is allowed to be perfect without being a mommy *headdesk*

The sleep deprivation chamber has such a beautiful steampunk vibe and somehow JLM's tattoos are the perfect match - yep, we should see more of that combo.

I also thought that both Watson and Holmes were off their game when they did not keep an eye on the clearly very disturbed suspect. I liked the case - it was neither too obvious nor too convoluted. 

Edited by MissLucas
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I'm also leery of this sudden interest in adopting a child.  In past seasons Joan wrestled with the idea of having a personal life and attachments, and seemed to decide in the end that detective work is where she wanted to focus her time and search for meaning.  She has had trouble trying to connect with others since becoming a detective.  Her last major partner was poisoned in an attempt to kill her.  She tried to be a support to Shinwell last season with distinctly mixed results.

I tried to find examples where a young character added to a show was a benefit.  Most of the ones I find are characters that are young, but adult, like Kitty, or even Lin.  Shows like ER gave characters children, but it was in many ways an ensemble soap opera, and could do whatever with characters.  Children could disappear for episodes at a time because home lives were a supplement to the action.  It would be hard for a child to disappear for whole episodes on a show like this when there are two main characters, and we see most of their lives.  A child can't be said to be in hibernation, like Clyde.

As for Sherlock, he said that he doesn't personally want children because he doesn't want to pass on any of his troubles.  He didn't react negatively to Kitty's child, but he isn't living with that child.  Children are messy, loud, demanding, and chaotic.  Right now, it would be very hard for him to deal with a child in his condition. 

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6 hours ago, possibilities said:

The show doesn't need a child, though. I sort of hope the whole thing is some kind of misdirect. Maybe Joan is investigating a criminal enterprise underlying the adoption market, and is going to expose a trafficking ring or some other horror going on at the agency she's looking into.

Yes.  Or maybe Joan is looking for a child who was given up for adoption by a client.  Even possible that Joan gave up a child; if so, I hope s/he is an adult now.

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On 5/22/2018 at 3:14 PM, dargosmydaddy said:

As for the rest of the episode, I'm hoping the deprivation chamber makes more appearances (shirtless JLM!).

I was thinking that the deprivation chamber might be an opportunity to get more screen time for Clyde.  Have Clyde swim/hang out with Sherlock in the Deprivation Chamber.  Sort of like goat yoga-turtle sensory deprivation therapy... (just in case it is not obvious enough, i am kidding about this)

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19 minutes ago, possibilities said:

If they do bring in a child, maybe Ms. Hudson can be the nanny.

Would be fun to see her again for any reason. Not that I want them to add a child, but imagine Clyde and a child in matching knit outfits.

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I wonder if the adoption plot was set up with the show ending after this season in the writers mind and preparing Watson and Holmes parting ways. If so the unexpected renewal must have caused quite some headaches. 

Whatever the case I can't see any adoption agency looking at the Brownstone full of weird stuff for Holmes' various experiments (not to mention Holmes himself) and going: 'Yup, this is perfect for bringing up a kid.' And while certain genres can definitely deal with a kid added to the main cast and plot (some even demand it) I'd say crime shows don't belong to that category. 

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Whatever the case I can't see any adoption agency looking at the Brownstone full of weird stuff for Holmes' various experiments (not to mention Holmes himself) and going: 'Yup, this is perfect for bringing up a kid.' And while certain genres can definitely deal with a kid added to the main cast and plot (some even demand it) I'd say crime shows don't belong to that category. 

Agreed. Plus, how many times has Watson been in serious danger? I would imagine her role as a detective consultant would be too dangerous for adoption agencies to accept. If anything happens to her, the kid is an orphan all over again. That's not healthy for the kid.

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(edited)

I'm imagining a case worker assuming that Joan and Sherlock are domestic partners in the typical sense of the word, and Joan and/or Sherlock choosing not to disabuse the social worker of that notion. Hilarity ensues. You know, low key, British hilarity, like double entendres.

Edited by shapeshifter
Decided to use a more versatile verb participle.
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The client jumping off the roof while Joan and Sherlock were chatting about her psych file was played a bit for dark laughs, but I liked how much Sherlock showed empathy for the guy.

Yes. The jumping off the balcony was darkly hilarious, but I loved Sherlock's response when the guy said from his hospital bed, [paraphrased]"You believe me now? That I didn't kill her?".  Sherlock: "I believed you before you jumped".

Quote

So the dead girl was an addict? Maybe the guy is killing addicts from their program in some twisted mercy kill, or they died of an OD, and he is just hiding the bodies, but has a compulsion to share this?

 I hate the "Sherlock is losing his mind" story line. Likewise the introduction of Michael, the suspected serial killer, but if they use him to highlight the issues with AA's 13th step, that I'll laud. I doubt it, though. This show seems to glorify AA.

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 I also resent how TV seems to have a problem portraying happy professional women living their lives without either having children or longing for them. 

Another strong NO KID! (of any age) from me. They did so well with Watson's sister's speech, then destroyed all the good they did with the show's coda of Watson seeking out adoption. I appreciate an actor getting involved with the show, as Lucy Liu has with directing - but this storyline of Watson wanting a child, if it is at Liu's behest, is a step too far.

RIP, Reg E Cathey. I didn't know. What a great actor, a huge loss. I loved the "Jane Austin on Ice" alibi. Such a ridiculous, albeit entirely probable, concept.

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And if they want a smaller character, they have Clyde.  Remember Clyde, TPTB?

This fun little fansite seems to show that Clyde (and his understudy, Bonnie) have not been forgotten. 

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On 5/23/2018 at 11:08 PM, grawlix said:

I was thinking that the deprivation chamber might be an opportunity to get more screen time for Clyde.  Have Clyde swim/hang out with Sherlock in the Deprivation Chamber.  Sort of like goat yoga-turtle sensory deprivation therapy... (just in case it is not obvious enough, i am kidding about this)

"Soup of the evening... beautiful soup!"

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(edited)

It's possible that Watson checked out adoption for her sister who had expressed concern about having kids in this episode due to their father's mental health problems.  Watson has had the same concerns but seemed to have moved on. No idea what Lin's situation in life is - is she married? I try to give the writers the benefit of the doubt here. 

Edited by MissLucas
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From the shallow end of the pool-Joan looked like she stepped out of the latest Men in Black movie at the crime scene. And I LOVED her black & white dress later in the episode.

Sometimes I think Lucy Liu's wardrobe should have third billing - before Aidan Quinn and Jon Michael Hill.   It certainly gets more screen time.

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4 hours ago, MissLucas said:

It's possible that Watson checked out adoption for her sister who had expressed concern about having kids in this episode due to their father's mental health problems. 

But not only did she have the website open, she was on the phone setting up appointments with a lawyer, which would be over-the-top boundary-stepping if she was doing it for Lin, who hasn't even expressed interest in adopting. And while yes, the phone call might have been unrelated, I don't see the writers going for a big (and ultimately pointless) misdirection like that.

4 hours ago, MissLucas said:

No idea what Lin's situation in life is - is she married? 

I don't think she is, based solely on her Instagram. She posts a lot of adorable pictures of her son, and herself alone/ with him/ with various co-stars, but no significant other.

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8 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

 

13 hours ago, MissLucas said:

No idea what Lin's situation in life is - is she married? 

I don't think she is, based solely on her Instagram. She posts a lot of adorable pictures of her son, and herself alone/ with him/ with various co-stars, but no significant other.

THe original poster was asking about Watson's sister Lin, the fictional character, not Lucy Liu, the actress.

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