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S03.E04: Phone Home

scarynikki12

By scarynikki12
in Legends Of Tomorrow

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kdm07

kdm07

It bears repeating: I love this show!

- Gumball shaking little Atom up and down like a baby with GI Joe doll? Hilarious!

- Amaya & Sara in their 80s getup were gorgeous.

- Mick handing the baby a cigar? Mick stealing candy? Hilarious x2!

- The agents singing & dancing to "Singing in the Rain" with kid!Ray and Gumball nodding along? Fantastic!

- It has to be Jax who left the note on the tree. He's always been a good lil bro to Sara so this would be something he would remember to do.

- That shot of kid!Ray and Zari cycling away with the moon as their back drop? Freaking awesome!

- Gumball going home with his mom? Even I felt a little alien goop in my eye.

  • Love 9
jhlipton

jhlipton

And his avarice!

On 10/31/2017 at 7:15 PM, benteen said:

I enjoyed the musical interlude as well.

"Singing In The Rain" isn't my favorite musical but it has some wonderful songs -- "Good Morning", "Be A Clown" and of course the title song.

21 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

At the end, the game was "two truths and a lie." I wonder which one was the lie. 

"One of these things is not like the others; one of these things just doesn't belong.."
Zari having the nickname "Big Z" and being a Zelda fanatic go together, but neither goes with a love of musicals.  (I know she could have been called Big Z because of her name, but the gameplay is more likely.)

13 hours ago, Gregg247 said:

It didn't dawn on me until the Halloween party at the end of the episode, but is Zari actually Isis, from the "Shazam/Isis Hour" on Saturday mornings back in the 70s?

Oh Mighty Ices:

ices.JPG.cefadfc65fa51bb5e168870fe3696ac0.JPG

54 minutes ago, kdm07 said:

That shot of kid!Ray and Zari cycling away with the moon as their back drop? Freaking awesome!

As soon as Zari got them airborne: "Are they going to?  They kind of have to, don't they... THERE IT IS!!!!  YAY!!!"

BkWurm1

BkWurm1

7 hours ago, Mellowyellow said:

He was perfectly lovely on Arrow! Don't let anyone tell you otherwise!!!!!!! I swooned and squealed like a banshee when I realised he was Felicity's LI in S3.

Haha I will get a lot of disagreement on that but seriously I loved him on Arrow. He was perhaps not as adorable as he is on LoT but I loved him all the same! 

By the time Ray ended his time on Arrow, I was back to liking him a lot but there was a real bumpy period before that.

Quote

Precisely, that was my exact thought when the scene came up where they took off with the Waverider. In fact, up until that point I was thinking "can it be? "Are they going to have a Legends episode where NOBODY is an idiot to make the plot work?" then that happened "oh, there it is." Worse, since they're in a time ship they could have gone there, witnessed the birth, and then warped back to 5 seconds after they had left 1988 so it was like they had never left, there was no reason the Waverider should have been gone at all

Ok, I have theories!

First, I think Stein shot himself in the foot when he created the device that allowed he and his daughter to communicate through time.  It forced him to operate in real time because Lilly was tracking him in real time even outside of when and where he was jumping. 

As for not warping back to 5 seconds after they left, they'd just broke time not so long ago by going back to a "when" that they'd already time traveled to so since they assumed an hour wouldn't make any difference to the mission (wrongly), they put a much more comfortable period of time between their absence and reappearance than just five seconds.  And it was too late to change things after they got back when they realized they should have immediately come back.     

  • Love 5
darkestboy

darkestboy

Loved this one. Great casting for the younger Ray and despite shamelessly ripping off both ET and Stranger Things, this was so much fun to watch.

The baby Dominator and his mother storyline, cheesy as it was really did work. Nice callbacks from the previous crossover too.

Zari works well for this show. Loved her reactions to everything this week and I thought she worked well with both Rays in this one.

Nate was annoying and Sara could've done a little more but they're setting up the Stein departure well enough. Did love the scene with Lily and the baby.

Mick being a musicals fans, I loved that too, 9/10

  • Love 2
Lady Calypso

Lady Calypso

People weren't kidding when they said this was one of the best episodes so far. It truly was a lot of fun and super great.

Baby Dominator was so damn adorable. No wonder Kid Ray wanted to keep it. Although Ray had every right to doubt his kid self. I mean, that thing really could have attacked them at any time. I was recently yelling at another TV show last week for a kid doing the exact same thing, except that time, it didn't turn out so great. It's better to be safe than sorry, but at least Mominator was only interested in getting her kid back. I actually loved that conclusion.

Zari is great. Her and Ray, both adult and kid version, worked very well together. I loved Zari's incredulousness at the whole situation. I thought they integrated her really well into the team. 

Nate was annoying, as per usual. Can he find a way to not screw up and be a nuisance? I mean, Ray managed to jump from My Most Hated Arrowverse Character list to Loveable Goofball around the end of season 1 of Legends, so I'm still holding out hope for Nate. Though they could get rid of him and I would be thrilled. He serves no purpose at this point. 

So, Stein going to visit his daughter was nice. Obviously he's done with the whole time traveling adventure, so I like how Jax is willing to find a way to split them both up. I really, really hope he can find a way. They really should have done it, though, when they had the Spear of Destiny. That would have easily fixed their problem with no consequences. 

To end this off, Singin' in the Rain is most definitely in my top three of favourite musicals so I was bobbing my head right along with Gumball, and the Rays. I loved the burst into song by the agents.

  • Love 3
johntfs

johntfs

32 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I loved Zari's incredulousness at the whole situation. I thought they integrated her really well into the team. 

I loved her expression when the Ray and the Dominator were bobbing their heads to the agents' forced singing.  I have to admit that as fun as she was with Ray, I'd prefer that to not go into a full romance.  I figure at this point she'll always kind of see Ray as an overgrown eight year old.  While I don't exactly "'ship" Zari with anyone, I think her bet fit would likely be with Jax.  Mick cares about his team-mates but not much else.  Nate only has eyes for Amaya.  Ray cares about others but also quite a bit about "the rules."  Jax wants to do the right thing, and doesn't necessarily cares if it's in the "right" way.  He's the one who released all the meta-humans from the Argus prison instead of just opening one cell.

 

2 minutes ago, Delphi said:

Presumably the jump ship should have sufficed, yes?

Sure, if Mick hadn't broken it right before that when he and Jax thought Stein was betraying them.

  • Love 3
Unclejosh

Unclejosh

The way I took the whole time ship birth issue was as stated above that due to the communicator Stein developed they were linked in "real time" outside of any time travel ability.  So no matter what the Waverider did, his daughter would be tracking them in her own time simultaneously.  So they couldn't wait because then they risk an anachronism perhaps?

  • Love 3
Miss Dee

Miss Dee

@Unclejosh, that's as good an explanation as any. I'm going with that one.

1 hour ago, johntfs said:

I have to admit that as fun as she was with Ray, I'd prefer that to not go into a full romance.  I figure at this point she'll always kind of see Ray as an overgrown eight year old.  While I don't exactly "'ship" Zari with anyone, I think her bet fit would likely be with Jax.... Jax wants to do the right thing, and doesn't necessarily cares if it's in the "right" way.  He's the one who released all the meta-humans from the Argus prison instead of just opening one cell.

Obviously my own shipping prejudices make me biased, but I agree. I'd rather Zari be left alone and not end up with anyone (unless they bring in Black Adam at some point), but if they insist: ever since they described her character as someone passionate about righting injustice and not just righting time errors, I've thought she and Jax might bond over that. Jax has been vocal about the same thing since last season, and the writers called back to it in Episode 3 as you described.

  • Love 1
jhlipton

jhlipton

(edited)
10 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

They really should have done it, though, when they had the Spear of Destiny. That would have easily fixed their problem with no consequences.

The whole point of the Spear of Destiny was that any change, no matter how small it seemed, would have consequences. 

10 hours ago, Delphi said:

I don't understand why they took the entire waveguide.  Presumably the jump ship should have sufficed, yes?

10 hours ago, johntfs said:

Sure, if Mick hadn't broken it right before that when he and Jax thought Stein was betraying them.

Details, details, details.

Edited by jhlipton
  • Love 1
Al Herkimer

Al Herkimer

(edited)

I thought Ray started off the episode as a victim of some type of brain injury, or possessed, or something.  That overwhelming, "everything turns out for the best" optimism seemed weird coming from a guy who watched helplessly as two mutated freaks butchered his wife before his very eyes.  And he didn't feel at least tempted to warn his younger self about that?

Much of the plot made no sense... having a time-traveler worry about getting to the hospital on time in the first place, or having the Waverider and those three characters gone when their friends needed them, when they could have come back from that hospital visit the instant after they left.  I felt like my intelligence was being insulted, and believe me, I generally have a high tolerance for that with  show like this. 

Edited by Al Herkimer
Sakura12

Sakura12

(edited)

I wanted to hear Sara's 2 truths and a lie.

Sara: "I was dead for a year, I made out with King Arthur in Camelot, I was an assistant to a mad scientist."

Zari: "Two of those are the truth?" 

She probably couldn't get a read on Sara since Sara probably led a crazier life then she did even thought she grew up in a dystopian world. 

Edited by Sakura12
  • Love 4
johntfs

johntfs

20 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

She probably couldn't get a read on Sara since Sara probably led a crazier life then she did even thought she grew up in a dystopian world. 

Also, Sara was a non-cannon fodder member of the League of Assassins, so she's probably pretty hard to read normally.  Unless Zari did get a read on Sara and was maybe a little too spooked by what she read to want to say anything out loud.  It would have been cool if Zari had said "Jax is wondering if I'm single and so is Sara, which, okay..."

  • Love 2
Starfish35

Starfish35

5 hours ago, Al Herkimer said:

I thought Ray started off the episode as a victim of some type of brain injury, or possessed, or something.  That overwhelming, "everything turns out for the best" optimism seemed weird coming from a guy who watched helplessly as two mutated freaks butchered his wife before his very eyes.  And he didn't feel at least tempted to warn his younger self about that?

Taking to the Ray thread....

mac123x

mac123x

On 10/31/2017 at 9:24 PM, Lantern7 said:

sometimes the homages are just so blatant.

LoT looks at the fine line between "homage" and "ripoff" and says fuck that, we're going all the way. 

 

I'm really liking Zari so far.  Only her second episode but she seems well integrated without being "new character overwhelms the plotline of everyone else".  The only one who felt underutilized this episode was Sara, though she deserves an occasional break where she's not carrying all the fight scenes.

  • Love 4
wmdekooning

wmdekooning

On 11/1/2017 at 10:30 AM, Gregg247 said:

It didn't dawn on me until the Halloween party at the end of the episode, but is Zari actually Isis, from the "Shazam/Isis Hour" on Saturday mornings back in the 70s?  ...I remember Isis had the same white costume and the red orb necklace, and had some kind of Egyptian-themed powers. 

 

When I saw the red orb necklace last week, I thought it looked very much like the necklace the "Mighty Isis" wore back then. I kept thinking the same thing this week's episode. Who knows, maybe they will call her Isis.

Then decide it's not a good idea...

  • Love 1
MarkHB

MarkHB

In the "Crisis on Earth-X" poster, they left the little hooks off of Zari's totem so it doesn't really look like the original Isis amulet; I was thrilled that the actual totem DOES look like the one from my childhood.

With Sara getting to drive around in what we used to call "a fucking IROC, man!", I want to know who Ray's idiot neighbor was who didn't have that DeLorean in the garage.  ISTR that the stainless steel was actually a maintenance nightmare.  (I have a friend who has one, so I should ask him, now that I think about it.)

Oreo2234

Oreo2234

(edited)

This was my favourite episode of the season so far. I often find tv kids annoying but young Ray was  so likeable and well cast. Gumball was the cutest, I didn't expect a baby dominator to be so adorable.

I agree with those who said Zari was better in this episode than the last one. They did a good job of integrating her into the cast this episode. 

Edited by Oreo2234
  • Love 1
tessaray

tessaray

Late to the episode, so I don't think there's anything left to say that hasn't been said but just wanted to chime in on how much fun this one was. And add my kudos to the casting folks - the kid who played young Ray was very good. (I usually hate kids on television, so that's high praise.)  The scenes with Mick and both Ray/young Ray made me laugh.  

As annoying as Nate can be, I guess I've gotten used to him and he also made me laugh, so even that was fine. And I really like Zari.  I have no clue who Mighty Isis is or how her story fits in but am looking forward to seeing how it works out.

Spoiler

Oops - I'm not sure if this comment is spoiler-ish but better safe than sorry, I guess. 

The writers aren't doing that great a job with Stein/VG since it's too obvious that they are trying to craft an exit for him but this episode was so charming otherwise, I'll give it a pass. 

  • Love 1
kismet

kismet

I really loved this episode! But life got in the way, so I couldn't comment sooner and haven't been able to make it through all the posts. But just wanted to get my thoughts out first.

I just loved how nostalgic and genuine it felt. I don't watch Stranger Things, so can't comment on that. However it had ET all over it, and then the other 80s references were spot on!

Kid Atom was really a great actor. I enjoyed his performance. For a guest star he made a pretty big impact quickly, I was invested in his story from scene one. He had an expressive face and decent acting chops. If we went back to RP's childhood I would not be upset.

MVP of the episode was Gumball. Last week was the adorable Saber Tooth Tiger, this week was just as good. Can we just get a mascot Groot like addition to the waverider??

Enjoyed Zari making connections. The trick or treating was perfect. It felt good to understand more about Ray's upbringing. Once again, didn't need dudebro Nate, but at least he was tolerable. Rest of the team delivered fun performances and were good. Glad there were no Time Masters this week.

 

Spoiler

I enjoyed the Stein side mission. Knowing what's ahead for VG, glad this is how they are setting it up. It seems like they just might let him be a family man.

 

Who knew Mick liked musicals? Best random character reveal!

Singing in the Rain dance number was awesome! It's this type of cheeky fun that is a little heavy on the cheesy, but works perfectly on LoT. I love when they keep the perfect balance between fun, action, nostalgia and character development.

  • Love 1
kismet

kismet

On 10/31/2017 at 10:14 PM, Maverick said:

Stein, you can't miss the birth of your grandson.  You have a time ship.   I doesn't matter if he left right then or a week from now he'd show up at the same time.

I think Stein just wanted to be there in "real" time. It seems like a desire for it to be genuine and real, he wanted it to be in the moment, not using a time travel machine to catch up. In a way I respect that. It's a common thing in stories for people with powers to not want to use them. And with some professions, people miss out on events in their personal life, so sometimes people just want to put their families first. Somehow him making the effort to be present in real time, seemed like a loving thing to do. He missed out on so much of his life because of his work and now his time travel I can understand why it was important for him to be there in the exact moment she went into labor. I think it's showing Stein's character growth.

And in all honesty, the mission did not require everyone there. It was under control. They didn't leave immediately, but once it was delegated who and where people would go, it made sense that Stein would try to sneak off. I don't agree with the sneaking off, but its LoT sometimes they don't make the correct decision. I like that not every mission requires everyone to be there. The team is strong and has diverse skills, but I definitely don't think the writers have it in them to write weekly large scale missions that need everyone. For the most part, I like the subplots that separate a part of the group on another mission. It makes the BIG missions feel larger and more important. And the smaller missions or adventures are just as interesting, if not more than the main mission.

  • Love 1
ItCouldBeWorse

ItCouldBeWorse

(edited)
On 10/31/2017 at 10:02 PM, scarynikki12 said:

Mick likes musicals!?!?!

Fiddler on the Roof!

On 10/31/2017 at 10:02 PM, scarynikki12 said:

Nate can still go away but I’ll admit to a chuckle that he was duped by the dominator.

Why didn't he steel up?

On 10/31/2017 at 10:06 PM, Jediknight said:

Baby Dominator Groot was adorable.  Here's hoping it's revealed that them reuniting Gumball and his mother leads to some Dominators being on humanity's side.

I expect that will happen.

On 10/31/2017 at 10:14 PM, Maverick said:

What happened to the time ship Gideon detected?   Where was Ray's brother?  Aren't they twins?  Sarah said the Dominator was an anachronism, but they didn't return it to whatever time period it belonged to, so now there are at least two Dominators stuck in 1988.  

I think the time ship belonged to the Dominator who returned to her time with her baby.

It did seem like Ray was an only child.

On 11/1/2017 at 2:43 AM, Starfish35 said:

At the end, the game was "two truths and a lie." I wonder which one was the lie.

 

On 11/1/2017 at 1:33 PM, Maelstrom said:

I believe Zari's lie was that she "loves" musicals.

 

On 11/1/2017 at 1:43 PM, Sakura12 said:

I think Zari's lie was the Zelda one. Since Ray called her Z and was going to watch Singing in the rain with her. 

Didn't she say that in her time, the only videogames were training exercises?

Edited by ItCouldBeWorse
Maelstrom

Maelstrom

^^ I think she did say video games were only training exercises, or something along those lines - I figure if she went to the trouble of finding Zelda on the black market she must have really wanted it. And with her enunciation about the musicals ("I looove musicals") I figured there might haven been just a touch of sarcasm in there, ;) Which is of course why Ray decided she had to watch Singing in the Rain with him.

  • Love 3
ItCouldBeWorse

ItCouldBeWorse

1 hour ago, Sakura12 said:

Ray mentioned his brother during the video game speech, he said his brother always wanted to play another game that wasn't Zelda. 

Since they are twins how do we know if the picture we saw was or Ray, it could've been Sidney. I also kind of got the impression Ray's parents are divorced, maybe Sidney lives with the father. 

That would be pretty sad if the twins were split up.  Like The Parent Trap, except they would know what they were missing.  That would explain why Ray was so lonely.

tennisgurl

tennisgurl

So something just hit me. It struck me as weird that Zari didn't know about aliens, considering her world was invaded not really so long ago (and you would think that would make it into some history books) but maybe in her universe, the ARGUS sponsored government removed all references to the alien invasion, because meta humans helped save the day and they wouldn't want people to think of meta humans as heroes!

  • Love 3
Lantern7

Lantern7

10 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

So something just hit me. It struck me as weird that Zari didn't know about aliens, considering her world was invaded not really so long ago (and you would think that would make it into some history books) but maybe in her universe, the ARGUS sponsored government removed all references to the alien invasion, because meta humans helped save the day and they wouldn't want people to think of meta humans as heroes!

She's from Earth-1, the "default" Earth, in the year 2042 (I believe).

  • Love 1
KirkB

KirkB

(edited)
2 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

She's from Earth-1, the "default" Earth, in the year 2042 (I believe).

The Dominator invasion happened on Earth-1 in 2016. That's only a 26 year difference. I don't know exactly how old Zari is supposed to be but Tennisgurl is right, an alien invasion where the president was killed and the new president publicly awarded and acknowledged metahumans as having helped stop it should not have been forgotten already. Covered up though is definitely possible.

Edited by KirkB
  • Love 1
kismet

kismet

(edited)
On 11/9/2017 at 6:08 PM, KirkB said:

The Dominator invasion happened on Earth-1 in 2016. That's only a 26 year difference. I don't know exactly how old Zari is supposed to be but Tennisgurl is right, an alien invasion where the president was killed and the new president publicly awarded and acknowledged metahumans as having helped stop it should not have been forgotten already. Covered up though is definitely possible.

Could they have used the memory erasers on everyone? It's not impossible to think that they altered the memories of the society. It's a common thing in authoritarian/dystopian regimes to alter or change the group's memories, give people some versatile technology that aides that and it's highly logical that it happened.

Regimes try to do it now, with little to no technology.

Edited by kismet
  • Love 1
johntfs

johntfs

(edited)
7 hours ago, kismet said:

Could they have used the memory erasers on everyone? It's not impossible to think that they altered the memories of the society. It's a common thing in authoritarian/dystopian regimes to alter or change the group's memories, give people some versatile technology that aides that and it's highly logical that it happened.

Regimes try to do it now, with little to no technology.

When Bush invaded Iraq in 2003 quite a few people were convinced that Saddam Hussein was involved in 9/11.  He wasn't.  Of the hijackers, Two were from the United Arab Emerites, one was from Lebanon, one was from Egypt, zero were from Iraq and only 15 out of nineteen were from our friend and ally, Saudi Arabia.

After 26 years in a nation so screwed up there's no freedom of religion, who knows what people remember/believe about the alien invasion?  It's highly possible the whole thing was dismissed as a faked plot by metahumans and that there were no aliens.

Edited by johntfs
  • Love 2
KirkB

KirkB

(edited)

I actually just rewatched the Invasion episodes last night. Upon further reflection I'm not sure it actually is as public as I originally thought it was. Most of the ships were never in the view of the general populace, the metabomb was stopped way up high so one but our heroes would have had any idea it existed, the Dominators pretty much stayed out of sight, the big fight at the end took place on an empty rooftop, and the president's award ceremony took place in Barry's hangar with likely only military or other 'read-in' personnel. Even the news reports described the thing that crashed in Central City as an experimental craft. Add the government being good at covering stuff up coupled with the fact metahumans seem to create giant monsters and gorillas and speeding blurs on a daily basis and in a much more public way, and I can see how it would be pretty easy for people not to be aware there ever was an invasion and also how they could lay the blame on almost every bad thing that happens on metahumans.

Edited by KirkB
  • Love 3
legaleagle53

legaleagle53

5 hours ago, kismet said:

Truth confession, I barely remembered the Alien Invasion. Was it the crossover or on another show? In all honesty, it didn't make that much of an impression on me.

It was the four-way, three-night crossover event last year that started (nominally, at least) on Supergirl, continued on The Flash and Arrow (where it received the most treatment, since that episode of Arrow was also that show's 100th episode), and concluded on Legends.

kismet

kismet

8 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

It was the four-way, three-night crossover event last year that started (nominally, at least) on Supergirl, continued on The Flash and Arrow (where it received the most treatment, since that episode of Arrow was also that show's 100th episode), and concluded on Legends.

Thanks, I did actually watch all of that. It was some of the stupidest TV I've ever seen. Plus it was the worst way to celebrate Arrow's 100. Talk about disrespect to the show that started all of it.

No wonder I forgot it, it's probably my brain's way of protecting itself. Although it is why I think the crossovers have proven to be stupid when it's forced. Alien invasion is so cliche and the most predictable trope. First we got the Hawks and then the Aliens, it's just so dumb when they try to find a reason for all the shows to interact. I miss when the crossovers were organic and I looked forward to seeing the members of the Flarrowverse interact. Now I just dread how banal and pathetic the "extravaganza" is going to be.

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