The Lonely Js Club: James, Jackson & Johannah

[flyingdi]

There was an episode where Jim Bob took the kids to what I think was the Creation Museum and Jana expressed slight doubt that everything happened the way it was written.

I think being the oldest girl, Jana probably got the royal what for when she expressed any opinion!  Remember Jill was probably assigned to be Jana's talking head buddy so she could tell us what Jana was really trying to say.

Personally, all in all, I think Jana has just given up!  And that's sad to me.

[ginger90]

Quote

That family's lucky that they haven't yet turned out an ax murderer, in my opinion. 

Some interviews of people who knew suspects in nasty crimes seem to include, “XYZ was always so quiet.”. 

Momma and daddy have set themselves up.

[zenme]

I think she's shy and hates being on camera. I can't even take a photo without  having a near panic attack.  

[BitterApple]

I agree it's hard to get a good read on Jana because these kids have never been allowed to express an authentic thought or emotion in their entire lives. Everything is amazing, wonderful and surreal ALL.THE.DAMN.TIME. The only one who comes close is Jessa and even she's still relatively shackled because of her dependence on Boob. 

[Scarlett45]

6 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

I'd be surprised if there wasn't some quite nasty, bitter, furious, rage-driven part of Jana's personality.

What else could you expect from a person who's been sent away to Gothardland numerous times to learn to keep sweet about the fact that she's spent most of her time since around age 7 caring for the house and raising the bajillion children of a couple of terminally stupid, emotionally and spiritually abusive assholes, at least one of whom thinks it's amusing to fake-fuck on a mini-golf course with offspring and people they're dating as witnesses and TeeVee cameras rolling? And now Jana apparently isn't considered good enough to go out to dinner with her married siblings but quite good enough to be chief babysitter when the new set of blessings is repeatedly dumped off at the tin house. Seems to me there'd be something seriously wrong with anybody who wasn't good and pissy under those circumstances.

The only way she wouldn't have some really sharp-edged part of her personality is if she'd been lobotomized, if you ask me. And they wouldn't have done that because then she wouldn't be as good at chores. 

If any Duggar kid is altogether sweet, happy and unruffled at this point, said kid must be brain damaged, if you ask me. 

That family's lucky that they haven't yet turned out an ax murderer, in my opinion. 

Basically this. Also, Jana was the only older girl that wasn’t molested by Josh, and probably feels a lot of guilt that she couldn’t protect the younger ones. I think Jana knows what a massive dirt bag her brother was and never bought the forgiveness angle. 

Like or dislike Jana I believe she loves the little kids more than their own parents, and is devoted to their well being. 

Edited January 3, 2018 by Scarlett45

[lascuba]

4 hours ago, flyingdi said:

There was an episode where Jim Bob took the kids to what I think was the Creation Museum and Jana expressed slight doubt that everything happened the way it was written.

I think being the oldest girl, Jana probably got the royal what for when she expressed any opinion!  Remember Jill was probably assigned to be Jana's talking head buddy so she could tell us what Jana was really trying to say.

Personally, all in all, I think Jana has just given up!  And that's sad to me.

I never thought that comment by Jana at the museum was an expression of doubt. What she said is a really common talking point among fundies..."I know what those heathens say sounds logical, but it's totally not." I think she was just repeating what she had heard multiple times in an attempt to minister to the audience.

[Arwen Evenstar]

1 hour ago, lascuba said:

I never thought that comment by Jana at the museum was an expression of doubt. What she said is a really common talking point among fundies..."I know what those heathens say sounds logical, but it's totally not." I think she was just repeating what she had heard multiple times in an attempt to minister to the audience.

THE CREATION MUSEUM IS NOT A SCIENCE CLASS! Repeat as many times as necessary.

[EarlGreyTea]

On 12/31/2017 at 5:08 PM, PikaScrewChu said:

Gotta get the older ones married off before the younger ones I suppose. JD is the self proclaimed Bachelor Until the Rapture(TM) so it was either Joe or Josiah next.

 

This concept has a large kernel of truth. It's essentially the plot of The Taming of the Shrew. The father in that play refuses to let the younger girl marry before the older one, so hijinks ensure. I think it's partly because then people will wonder what's wrong with the older one. I've heard that in some cultures it's still a widely practiced concept. I guess it made sense in older times, and in other cultures, where marriage is arranged or comes with an economical aspect. I wouldn't be all that surprised if it's an unspoken rule in fundieland too, in which case JB and Michelle have really, really screwed over Jana and JD, the former more so. Although the Bateses had kids who married out of order, they have by and large married off all the oldest ones. Even Michael at least had Brandon for a fiance while her younger sisters married. Look who Tabby Paine had to settle for!

[Arwen Evenstar]

2 minutes ago, EarlGreyTea said:

. It's essentially the plot of The Taming of the Shrew. The father in that play refuses to let the younger girl marry before the older one, so hijinks ensure.

Unlike Katerina, Jana was forced to dance barefoot on the wedding days of four of her sisters.

[queenanne]

14 hours ago, flyingdi said:

Someone in another thread mentioned that Jana portrays herself as all sweetness and light.  I have to say I sort of disagree with this.  I don't think Jana portrays herself as anything other than a blank slate and wanting nothing to do with the show she's grown up on.  In fact, I think Jana tries very hard to make sure she's not seen as interesting at all!

It’s very hard to be raised in this sort of religious dynamic and maintain a spark of personality.  Maybe Jessa can be a snot because she’s not sensitive and cowed by this type of treatment, and maybe Jana is one of those for whom mere disapproving words are enough to make shrink into a little metaphorical ball.  Don’t underestimate how crushing it can be for a more sensitive person to be scolded and told they should keep their mouths shut whenever they say something with any spark of liveliness that might ‘embarrass ‘ the hive mind.

[Arwen Evenstar]

7 minutes ago, queenanne said:

Don’t underestimate how crushing it can be for a more sensitive person to be scolded and told they should keep their mouths shut whenever they say something with any spark of liveliness that might ‘embarrass ‘ the hive mind.

THIS! It’s Standard Operating Procedure in the Duggarverse.

[flyingdi]

37 minutes ago, queenanne said:

It’s very hard to be raised in this sort of religious dynamic and maintain a spark of personality.  Maybe Jessa can be a snot because she’s not sensitive and cowed by this type of treatment, and maybe Jana is one of those for whom mere disapproving words are enough to make shrink into a little metaphorical ball.  Don’t underestimate how crushing it can be for a more sensitive person to be scolded and told they should keep their mouths shut whenever they say something with any spark of liveliness that might ‘embarrass ‘ the hive mind.

I agree but I do wonder if Jessa ever got the same treatment as Jana.  Out of all her girls, Michelle seems to favor Jessa and Josie.  I think Michelle quite liked Jessa's spark and was willing to nurture it and let Jessa keep it. I think Jessa reminds Michelle the most of herself.

[RedheadZombie]

14 hours ago, lascuba said:

YES! The fact that she's a blank state is why so many project this sweetness image on her, but I don't think there's anything to back that up, and some evidence that the opposite is true. She's the one the kids are threatened with if they misbehave, for one thing. Yes, she's the family's workhorse and that's unfair, but being a hardworking doesn't automatically mean "sweet" or even "good."  She hates the spotlight so she'll likely  never have a social media presence, but if she did it's going to be funny when people turn on her. Because I suspect she's the most hardcore fundie of the kidults.

I hate that this has gotten started again.  If Joy has indeed threatened the kids with Jana, it's because Jana is the one the kids respect and obey as a mother, and Joy is a friend/babysitter.  These children run to Jana when they need things, just like the Bateses run to Michael.  Why Michael gets to be an angel while Jana is a closet sadist is beyond me.  This young woman's life sucks enough without being portrayed as a horrible person.  And if there's any truth to the persistent rumor that Jana chooses not to marry because she fears for her younger siblings' safety and survival, she gets mad props from me.

 

5 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Basically this. Also, Jana was the only older girl that wasn’t molested by Josh, and probably feels a lot of guilt that she couldn’t protect the younger ones. I think Jana knows what a massive dirt bag her brother was and never bought the forgiveness angle. 

Like or dislike Jana I believe she loves the little kids more than their own parents, and is devoted to their well being. 

I agree that Jana carries survivor's guilt for having evaded Josh.  I would not be surprised if Michelle, JB, and even Jessa laid the blame directly on her shoulders.  Jana keeps out of the limelight as much as possible because she's not the famewhore like her siblings.  You also have to remember that Michelle already held a grudge against Jana as a fetus, and I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Jana bore the brunt of the most severe blanket training.  Josh was the favorite, and JD probably didn't have enough curiosity or energy to leave the blanket.

[RedheadZombie]

21 minutes ago, flyingdi said:

I agree but I do wonder if Jessa ever got the same treatment as Jana.  Out of all her girls, Michelle seems to favor Jessa and Josie.  I think Michelle quite liked Jessa's spark and was willing to nurture it and let Jessa keep it. I think Jessa reminds Michelle the most of herself.

Oh no doubt.  If Jessa had been allowed to go to real school, I'm sure she would have been a mean girl cheerleader, like I imagine Michelle was.  There's a reason Michelle has been repeating for decades that she has no recollection of meeting Jim Bob for the first time.

[Temperance]

1 hour ago, EarlGreyTea said:

This concept has a large kernel of truth. It's essentially the plot of The Taming of the Shrew. The father in that play refuses to let the younger girl marry before the older one, so hijinks ensure. I think it's partly because then people will wonder what's wrong with the older one. I've heard that in some cultures it's still a widely practiced concept. I guess it made sense in older times, and in other cultures, where marriage is arranged or comes with an economical aspect. I wouldn't be all that surprised if it's an unspoken rule in fundieland too, in which case JB and Michelle have really, really screwed over Jana and JD, the former more so. Although the Bateses had kids who married out of order, they have by and large married off all the oldest ones. Even Michael at least had Brandon for a fiance while her younger sisters married. Look who Tabby Paine had to settle for!

It's a real concept, but it's a dumb one. The dumbest example goes to the Brady Girls Get Married, where Jan and her boyfriend of two years have to wait for Marcia, who fortunately picks someone up at a cafeteria.

[kalamac]

Heh, when I hear about kids being married off in order of age, it always makes me think of The Pirate Movie, when Mabel paired her older virgin sisters off with random pirates, so she could marry Freddie.

I guess in a culture where everything is about staying a virgin until marriage, because somehow that's the most important thing about you, it a lot of cases marrying in age order would happen almost by accident, as they want to get them married off almost as soon as they're legal so they don't considering having sex without being married.

[queenanne]

47 minutes ago, flyingdi said:

I agree but I do wonder if Jessa ever got the same treatment as Jana.  Out of all her girls, Michelle seems to favor Jessa and Josie.  I think Michelle quite liked Jessa's spark and was willing to nurture it and let Jessa keep it. I think Jessa reminds Michelle the most of herself.

Possibly, but also possible that Jessa was so bullheaded that Michelle gave up trying to blanket train her into submission and instead caved to her, like the story of the jewelry box.

[lascuba]

8 hours ago, flyingdi said:

I agree but I do wonder if Jessa ever got the same treatment as Jana.  Out of all her girls, Michelle seems to favor Jessa and Josie.  I think Michelle quite liked Jessa's spark and was willing to nurture it and let Jessa keep it. I think Jessa reminds Michelle the most of herself.

She did. Michelle has spoken about how she thought Jessa was deaf as a child because she wouldn't listen, and Jim Bob has gone on about her "strong will" and how they had to tame it and use it to raise someone "strong in their faith." For whatever reason, those methods didn't totally break Jessa like people assume they broke Jana. If Michelle favors Jessa now, it's because "game recognizes game" and there's this dysfunctional respect because she couldn't break her like her other children.

[lascuba]

8 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

I hate that this has gotten started again.  If Joy has indeed threatened the kids with Jana, it's because Jana is the one the kids respect and obey as a mother, and Joy is a friend/babysitter.  These children run to Jana when they need things, just like the Bateses run to Michael.  Why Michael gets to be an angel while Jana is a closet sadist is beyond me.  This young woman's life sucks enough without being portrayed as a horrible person.  And if there's any truth to the persistent rumor that Jana chooses not to marry because she fears for her younger siblings' safety and survival, she gets mad props from me.

 

I agree that Jana carries survivor's guilt for having evaded Josh.  I would not be surprised if Michelle, JB, and even Jessa laid the blame directly on her shoulders.  Jana keeps out of the limelight as much as possible because she's not the famewhore like her siblings.  You also have to remember that Michelle already held a grudge against Jana as a fetus, and I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Jana bore the brunt of the most severe blanket training.  Josh was the favorite, and JD probably didn't have enough curiosity or energy to leave the blanket.

For me, the fact that Jana is close to Michael (and Priscilla) is another reason I find her suspect, because Michael is touted as one of the most devout Bates' children. I'm not here for the girls who most fall in line with their patriarchal upbringings.

I don't think Jana is a horrible person (well, not anymore horrible than everyone else with her beliefs), but I don't see any evidence that she's some sweet angle, either. Like that rumor about her being unmarried to protect her siblings came from thin air, because people project this martyr image onto her. We know nothing about her, and I tend to err on the side of cynicism. I KNOW what family's beliefs are, and I KNOW that she has never said or done anything to contradict them; she's refuse to show the tiniest hint of a personality that could allow for some speculation on what she really thinks...I draw my conclusions based on that.

[Arwen Evenstar]

57 minutes ago, lascuba said:

She did. Michelle has spoken about how she thought Jessa was deaf as a child because she wouldn't listen, and Jim Bob has gone on about her "strong will" and how they had to tame it and use it to raise someone "strong in their faith." For whatever reason, those methods didn't totally break Jessa like people assume they broke Jana. If Michelle favors Jessa now, it's because "game recognizes game" and there's this dysfunctional respect because she couldn't break her like her other children.

But how many thrashings did willfull, spoiled Jessa have to endure before her parents gave up?  I can only imagine in Fundy circles, the correct answer was A LOT. I see how Izzy’s little spirit has already been broken for being sooooooo manipulative!

[luvmylabs]

Who is this Caleb Williams who is rumored to be courting Jana?

[Sew Sumi]

Some Duggar suck-up. I assume he's friends with JD or Josiah. 

[floridamom]

Maybe Caleb is courting Josiah.

[Lunera]

2 hours ago, luvmylabs said:

Who is this Caleb Williams who is rumored to be courting Jana?

This guy. He's been hanging a lot with the boys, lately. Josh was even in the wedding party at his brothers wedding last year. 

He seems like an attention whore, constantly posting pictures with the Duggars on their compound. He has been lurking on the Pickles & Hairspray FB page for a while and actually responded to the page a few times.

[DangerousMinds]

What is going on with his hair??

[Mollie]

Remember when Josh used to have his picture taken next to famous politicians?  Now he hangs around with this guy at the used car lot.

[riverblue22]

5 hours ago, floridamom said:

Maybe Caleb is courting Josiah.

I love this!  If we talk it up maybe the gossip rags will pick up the story!!!

[awaken]

5 hours ago, Mollie said:

Remember when Josh used to have his picture taken next to famous politicians?  Now he hangs around with this guy at the used car lot.

Oh how the mighty have fallen. 

Wow, are these people full of themselves, with so little cause to be. Big fish in the small pond of NW Ark. 

[madpsych78]

Dang, Josiah looks like Smuggar here...

[Celia Rubenstein]

If he keeps eating like that he's going to weigh as much as Smuggar does, too.

[GeeGolly]

$200.00 North Face jacket and eating out. The Duggars are so frugal. 

[BitterApple]

54 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

If he keeps eating like that he's going to weigh as much as Smuggar does, too.

Lulz! I was just about to type that until I scrolled down and read your comment! Si might want to lay off the cheeseburgers. Duggar males aren't exactly blessed with fast metabolisms. 

[Celia Rubenstein]

4 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

 Si might want to lay off the cheeseburgers. 

.... lay off the double cheeseburgers.  Also the chicken fingers, the ranch dip, and (I think) vanilla milkshakes. 

On the up side, there is lettuce on the burger. That counts for his serving of green vegetables for the year. Baby steps ....

[EarlGreyTea]

I can't even hate. Josiah looks really good, particularly compared to Josh. Nice (expensive) jacket, hat covering any potential balding. He looks like any guy you'd meet on the street, with Jessa's eyes. Maybe now that he's a bit older, he's more ready for courtship. Although I still think Marjorie dodged a major bullet. A cursory look at her Insta shows her with hobbies, with friends, with her book. She might have made a nice addition to the Duggar family as she is now, but ironically she would never have been allowed to be that person had she married Josiah right away.

[Scarlett45]

Just now, EarlGreyTea said:

I can't even hate. Josiah looks really good, particularly compared to Josh. Nice (expensive) jacket, hat covering any potential balding. He looks like any guy you'd meet on the street, with Jessa's eyes. Maybe now that he's a bit older, he's more ready for courtship. Although I still think Marjorie dodged a major bullet. A cursory look at her Insta shows her with hobbies, with friends, with her book. She might have made a nice addition to the Duggar family as she is now, but ironically she would never have been allowed to be that person had she married Josiah right away.

I agree. Josiah looks nice here. I say let him enjoy his burger- not like he has much joy in his life!

 

Marjorie dodged a major bullet. There were hopes Joy-Anna and Josiah would jump ship together, but with her married and a honeymoon baby on the way that won’t happen. I see Josiah as the odd man out among the older boys. 

[Jynnan tonnix]

5 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I agree. Josiah looks nice here. I say let him enjoy his burger- not like he has much joy in his life!

 

Marjorie dodged a major bullet. There were hopes Joy-Anna and Josiah would jump ship together, but with her married and a honeymoon baby on the way that won’t happen. I see Josiah as the odd man out among the older boys. 

I think he looks nice as well. Maybe there's something about the angle of the photo that visually skews his features into better balance or something, but I had to go back and double check that I was on the right forum when I saw this nice looking guy whom I couldn't immediately place. And the burger does look good, too!

Edited January 6, 2018 by Jynnan tonnix

[EarlGreyTea]

1 minute ago, Jynnan tonnix said:

I think he looks nice as well. Maybe there's something about the angle of the photo that visually skews his features into better balance or something, but I had to go back and double check that I was on the right forum when I saw this nice looking guy whom I couldn't immediately place. And the burger does look good, too!

It's the classic Myspace pose. Always hold the camera above your face and at an angle, so everything rolls back and is automatically flattering. Incidentally, it looks like a photo someone would choose for a dating app, complete with nice-looking burger. Can you imagine any of these guys on a dating app? What would their bios say? Remember how gross Josh's profile was on Ashley Madison? Some of it is burned into my brain.

[SMama]

Is he going for the tough, truck driver look?

[xwordfanatik]

2 hours ago, EarlGreyTea said:

It's the classic Myspace pose. Always hold the camera above your face and at an angle, so everything rolls back and is automatically flattering. Incidentally, it looks like a photo someone would choose for a dating app, complete with nice-looking burger. Can you imagine any of these guys on a dating app? What would their bios say? Remember how gross Josh's profile was on Ashley Madison? Some of it is burned into my brain.

Oooh, I'm curious.  What did that asswipe say?

[madpsych78]

3 hours ago, EarlGreyTea said:

I can't even hate. Josiah looks really good, particularly compared to Josh. Nice (expensive) jacket, hat covering any potential balding. He looks like any guy you'd meet on the street, with Jessa's eyes. Maybe now that he's a bit older, he's more ready for courtship. Although I still think Marjorie dodged a major bullet. A cursory look at her Insta shows her with hobbies, with friends, with her book. She might have made a nice addition to the Duggar family as she is now, but ironically she would never have been allowed to be that person had she married Josiah right away.

I'm not saying Josiah doesn't look good, but imagine a thin Josh, and Josiah looks like that.

[DangerousMinds]

And Spurgeon looks like a tiny Josh.

[kokapetl]

4 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

Dang, Josiah looks like Smuggar here...

His skin looks good. 

[ginger90]

He does look good. If it was a video and he spoke, my opinion wouldn’t be the same. He makes me cringe.

[floridamom]

I think it's touched up...the lighting and shading is too good.

[Vaysh]

His cheeks look a bit photoshopped or filtered, especially since we know how he usually looks. Though his skin could have cleared up lately, I suppose. I do wish he would ditch the beard, it makes him look like a douchey dudebro.

[RedheadZombie]

On January 4, 2018 at 9:40 PM, riverblue22 said:

I love this!  If we talk it up maybe the gossip rags will pick up the story!!!

I hope not.  Michelle and JB would do something drastic, and even if he were gay, it's nobody's business but his  

13 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

Dang, Josiah looks like Smuggar here...

And this is why America has such an obesity issue.   I'm surprised all of the first half of 19 don't have food issues from the deprivation before TV. 

[EarlGreyTea]

9 hours ago, xwordfanatik said:

Oooh, I'm curious.  What did that asswipe say?

Some details here, but what I remember most is his answer to the question: "Do you think there are circumstances when a person is obligated to have sex with you?" And he answered yes. He also specified a petite figure, someone he could teach sexually (yeah, right), and experimenting with sex toys. All quite common desires, but coming from Mr. Sanctimonious himself, it was gross.

[Arwen Evenstar]

9 minutes ago, EarlGreyTea said:

Some details here, but what I remember most is his answer to the question: "Do you think there are circumstances when a person is obligated to have sex with you?" And he answered yes. He also specified a petite figure, someone he could teach sexually (yeah, right), and experimenting with sex toys. All quite common desires, but coming from Mr. Sanctimonious himself, it was gross.

Using sex and Smuggar in the same sentence is enough to gross most people out.

[Churchhoney]

19 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

I'm not saying Josiah doesn't look good, but imagine a thin Josh, and Josiah looks like that.

And Hannie looks like a female Josh. 

[Fostersmom]

I'm beginning to think this entire family has an iron deficiency or something along those lines. Josiah's been in the restaurant long enough to order and get his meal, and he's got his jacket zipped up like he just walked in from the Arctic and there were many comments on all the winter coats in the Christmas pics. You'd just the body heat alone from all in people in the TTH at Christmas would have made coats uncomfortable. Most of their restaurant pics include coats. Most restaurants I go to are comfortable enough that coats are either taken off or at the very least unzipped.