S34.E01: The Stakes Have Been Raised (Double Episode)

[Wings]

1 minute ago, KHenry14 said:

I've always wondered why some castaway hasn't tried to make salt. It's not hard to make it from seawater, it just takes a while. But time is something they have a lot of, so why not give it a whirl?

Or just use sea water after boiling it.  I hadn't thought of that until you mentioned it. 

[LadyChatts]

Well, this could be a good or bad thing,. It if Jeff has it his way they'd keep filming in Fiji until the end of Survivor.  So I would think eventually they'd run out of resources at the respective camps, as I'm assuming they are limited where exactly they can film.  So that'll either make things more cushier, or make it harder for them to get food (I'm going with the former).

[slowpoked]

2 hours ago, wings707 said:

I remember them being so excited to get salt on one season!  I get that.  

In Kaoh Rong, didn't Caleb almost die for salt & pepper?

[SlackerInc]

4 hours ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

How do you feel about torture scenes in movies?  There are some things that just feel ghoulish and bad to me, and watching survivors truly suffer, whether it's from illness or injury or lack of food, sleep, warmth, dryness, whatever, is definitely in that category.  It feels gratuitous and unnecessary.  

I know they sign up for it but it reminds me of the old Stephen King books like The Long Walk and The Running Man, where in dystopian futures desperate people are competing for their lives while a hardened public watches and revels in their suffering.  Or I guess actual atrocities from our past like people fed to lions in the Coliseum.  Not saying we're approaching that level here but I have a visceral reaction of distaste to watching others physically suffering.  

Hear, hear.  TBH, I would enjoy the show as much, probably more, if they were all at a Ponderosa equivalent while playing the game.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

In Kaoh Rong, didn't Caleb almost die for salt & pepper?

In his "defense", he seemed to think it was an immunity challenge.  

[Wings]

15 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

In Kaoh Rong, didn't Caleb almost die for salt & pepper?

No, it was a much earlier in history that I remember the glee over salt. 

50 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

Well, this could be a good or bad thing,. It if Jeff has it his way they'd keep filming in Fiji until the end of Survivor.  So I would think eventually they'd run out of resources at the respective camps, as I'm assuming they are limited where exactly they can film.  So that'll either make things more cushier, or make it harder for them to get food (I'm going with the former).

Production clearly LOVES Figi.  I would like to see their accommodations.  Wonder how long before we here Jeff is getting divorced.  :^) 

[Rachel RSL]

30 minutes ago, SlackerInc said:

TBH, I would enjoy the show as much, probably more, if they were all at a Ponderosa equivalent while playing the game.

That's literally Big Brother.

I do really miss the survival aspect of the game. That was huge in the first few seasons and now it's barely an afterthought. I mean, I don't want anyone to die or anything but, on a show called Survivor, I'm ok with a little suffering.

[slowpoked]

36 minutes ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

In his "defense", he seemed to think it was an immunity challenge.  

Really?! Wow, I don't remember that part. I thought it was a simple reward challenge.

[fishcakes]

3 hours ago, Winston9-DT3 said:

I watched a bonus clip of this ep and it showed Tai making something they called 'green beans' but they were passing one around and it was like a foot long, so I'm guessing it was some sea vegetable.  And passing around one coconut.  So I'm guessing the boat food supplies might not be all that much food if they're already eating seaweed, but they did seem to think it was delicious, too, so who knows. 

Chinese long beans, maybe? They look and taste like green beans but grow to be about two feet long.

[peachmangosteen]

4 hours ago, vb68 said:

On a rewatch last night, when they were naming the chickens, I loved when Culpepper overruled Debbie and said no, Monica is the black one. And then turned to her with a straight face. "She has black hair".

I loved that, too. NGL, and it really pains me to say this, I found Brad somewhat enjoyable in this ep. Now I feel dirty!

46 minutes ago, slowpoked said:

Really?! Wow, I don't remember that part. I thought it was a simple reward challenge.

It was a reward challenge, but for some reason (the reason is he's an idiot!) Caleb thought it was for immunity. Or at least that's what he claims. The boy likes to tell tall tales, so who knows!

Edited March 11, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[LadyChatts]

1 hour ago, Rachel RSL said:

That's literally Big Brother.

I do really miss the survival aspect of the game. That was huge in the first few seasons and now it's barely an afterthought. I mean, I don't want anyone to die or anything but, on a show called Survivor, I'm ok with a little suffering.

Me too.  Everything is all about game play, moves, blindsides, and idols.  We get it.  That's part of the show, too, but really, nothing overly exciting or original has happened without a twist being thrown in to help it.  Probably the most exciting thing was that advantage Stephen got during SC, only because he was an idiot and got himself voted off with it.  But those advantages have been a bust.  This new twist about no more re-votes maybe will work once, but I see people being more cautious to let it go to rocks after that.  Idol plays may or may not be exciting, depending.  Last season I thought it was, because all the idols were practically used on people other than the idol holder (and in Jessica's case, she didn't even know she was getting blindsided).  Parvati and Malcolm's idol plays were great during HvsV and Caramoan, and I always love the one in Fiji where the 4 horsemen incorrectly let Alex play the idol and it sent Edgardo packing.  And I'm not really a fan of the idols with a twist that they have in regards to the special idols.

[bikebrh]

I'm disappointed with all the Sandra hate. She's one of my favorites. She is the answer to "What would it be like if Michelle Rodriguez played Survivor?" She clearly is doing something behind the scenes that doesn't translate to the TV screen because she appears to be well-liked. I think part of it is that she is a hard worker at camp, which is boring TV. She is another one that age has caught up to though(and 13 years at a sedentary office job). She finally ditched that oversize shirt, but only after after she put on 30+ pounds. She was pretty hot the first two times around.

The ones I really have a problem with are Russell Hantz and Tony. Tbh, I kind of wonder about people who like them, even.

[Rachel RSL]

I don't put Tony in the same category as Russell though. Tony is like an annoying, hyperactive chihuahua that won't stop yapping. Russell, on the other hand, is a truly vile person.

[SlackerInc]

2 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

That's literally Big Brother.

Nah, I've watched Big Brother.  They can't go outside except a teensy yard, they aren't filmed by pros with good cinematography, they have different rules, they don't have Probst.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, SlackerInc said:

Nah, I've watched Big Brother.  They can't go outside except a teensy yard, they aren't filmed by pros with good cinematography, they have different rules, they don't have Probst.

I agree.  Big Brother is claustrophobic and weird and poorly done, for the most part.  I watch it because my teen likes it but I'm looking forward to her growing out of it because I think it's a low quality entry in the genre (though still possibly in the top 10%, given that the genre is full of garbage).  I think Survivor drives the narrative with casting and editing and heavy use of suggestion in confessionals.  But I think BB literally puts words in their mouths, complete with poorly hidden cue cards.  That might not even be bad if they were good words, but it's crap stories they write.  I feel like it's cast, written, filmed and edited by film school interns paid minimum wage, if that.

[millennium]

You know what?   It's Saturday and I still feel great that Tony's gone.

Oh my goodness!

[cooksdelight]

9 minutes ago, millennium said:

You know what?   It's Saturday and I still feel great that Tony's gone.

Oh my goodness!

Varner shared a photo (a still shot from this episode) of ALL of their expressions of glee once Tony left. I don't think he was too popular.

Edited March 12, 2017 by cooksdelight

[Wandering Snark]

2 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Caleb thought it was for immunity. Or at least that's what he claims. The boy likes to tell tall tales, so who knows!

Just like you expect to hear about Debbie's latest claimed profession you expect tall tales from Caleb. Did you notice that he said that snake was like 700 lbs?

[cooksdelight]

15 minutes ago, Wandering Snark said:

Did you notice that he said that snake was like 700 lbs?

HAHAHA!!!  Thanks for reminding me of that. Probst said it was around 400, didn't he? 

[Vyk]

32 minutes ago, cooksdelight said:

Varner shared a photo (a still shot from this episode) of ALL of their expressions of glee once Tony left. I don't think he was too popular.

All of them?  Wow!  To think I'd heard Caleb (in a confessional) and Malcolm (during Tony's final Tribal Council) say that they liked him!  Wonder what happened?  With Malcolm, I guess it was likely a cover to give him a false sense of security, but I wonder what happened with Caleb?

[cooksdelight]

I didn't see Caleb in the photo, but Malcolm was definitely smiling. 

[Vyk]

21 minutes ago, cooksdelight said:

I didn't see Caleb in the photo, but Malcolm was definitely smiling. 

Might I see, please?:)

[cooksdelight]

[Vyk]

1 minute ago, cooksdelight said:

Yeah.  That's definite happiness.  And well-earned on all of their parts.

[LadyChatts]

Everyone wanted Tony out in pre-show interviews, so I'm not surprised. 

Edited March 12, 2017 by LadyChatts

[Guest]

It wouldn't surprise me if they were happy but I think they could just be laughing at the exchange, too.  And if I was bummed Tony went, I would for sure hide it and laugh along with the others.  

[millennium]

1 hour ago, cooksdelight said:

HAHAHA!!!  Thanks for reminding me of that. Probst said it was around 400, didn't he? 

Don't forget, the camera adds 300 pounds. 

[Guest]

On 3/8/2017 at 10:08 PM, mojoween said:

Feeling like the only person in the world who has never liked Sandra bums me out because she made a fantastic argument why she'll be there to the end.  Seriously, how many times can you call yourself a damned queen in 45 minuted.

I have disliked her since she dumped out the fish that Rupert had caught. I think messing with the food in a situation like survivor is just unforgivable, so you are not alone.

[Katesus7]

I don't really care who are "good" players, I only care about who I like or don't like, because I'm extremely shallow when it comes to this show.

So the fact that Sandra, who will always and forever be my favorite Survivor winner ever, as bitchy as she may be, went head to head against Tony, one of my top 3 LEAST favorite winners ever, and took his ass down? And let him know about it? It was my everything. She won't win, but I'll enjoy the hell out of her until she gets the boot. 

Edited March 12, 2017 by Katesus7

[legaleagle53]

12 hours ago, wings707 said:

It certainly isn't Club Med but it is Motel 6 with a vending machine next to the ice. 

Funny you should say that, because the reason I'd never do the show is that I hate camping.  MY idea of "roughing it" IS a Motel 6 with a vending machine next to the ice.

[bikebrh]

I don't put Tony in the same category as Russell though. Tony is like an annoying, hyperactive chihuahua that won't stop yapping. Russell, on the other hand, is a truly vile person.

Tony is actually scarier in some ways... Imagine getting pulled over by him wherever he's a cop. This is a man who likes to lie, does it prolifically, and almost seems to be one of those guys that like to tell a lie even when the truth might be easier.

If I sat on a jury and he testified, I would never convict based on his testimony.

[KimberStormer]

3 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

Everyone wanted Tony out in pre-show interviews, so I'm not surprised. 

But it was clearly overplaying for Ciera to say so.....

Voting out Person A (who is a woman) for saying "let's vote out Person B", and then voting out Person B (who is a man) at the next tribal is something that I feel happens a lot, and there's nothing really wrong with it from a game perspective, but it does annoy me, I can't help it.

[SlackerInc]

I always suspect it's an excuse, masking some less easily justified motivation.

[Nashville]

16 hours ago, wings707 said:

I merely ask that they make it so they have to fish to fill out their rice diet.  This falls short of hobbling.

Hear, hear.  I hate and despise that TPTB have made the food situation so cushy, because it has removed what used to be a key strategic element for players to pursue - the role of Provider. 

Take a look back at the earlier seasons; it wasn't unusual to find a player spared from eviction at a critical juncture simply because of that player's skill at fishing - or some other food-gathering ability - anything which would supplement the rice-only diet provided by Production.  Why?  Because that player's skill supported their Tribe as a whole, by better enabling them to compete and win in challenges.  When the Production-supplied rations were just this side of the razor's edge of starvation, such additions to the food supply had a significantly greater impact upon the game in varied ways - and not just the physical aspect, because hunger can significantly impact people's reasoning and decision-making skills.

Nowadays, though - when someone's been on the beach for 30 days, and on their post-eviction weigh-in has only dropped 10-12 pounds...?  Heck, I've done that sitting at home by cutting out bread for a month.  That's not taking it to any limits.  That's not "surviving".  That's being inconvenienced for a while.  That's padding the game because someone thinks keeping the mactors looking good for the cameras trumps removing a key element of Survivor's primary premise.  Feh on that.

[cooksdelight]

Totally agree, @Nashville. Back when someone was doing all the hunting/gathering, it raised them up in the eyes of their tribemates. You're not going to vote off someone who's working hard to keep you fed. It's one of the reasons Abi stayed around so long, she did all the cooking. It never showed her doing that so people wondered why they kept the crazy one around so long. Even during her seasons they had more food than in the past.

Hell, I'd vote off Tai just for feeding those chickens. Then eat the chickens.

[LizBug]

So many sharks in the water ... all sizes and types.  I don't recall there ever being so many shots of them in previous seasons.

The (over)abundance of fruits and veggies on the ship was really a waste.  There's no way all of that could fit into the two rafts, along with the people.  And, in camp, they'd have to be consumed fairly quickly or they'd rot and draw all sorts of flies, etc.  

[peachmangosteen]

10 hours ago, Katesus7 said:

I don't really care who are "good" players, I only care about who I like or don't like, because I'm extremely shallow when it comes to this show.

So the fact that Sandra, who will always and forever be my favorite Survivor winner ever, as bitchy as she may be, went head to head against Tony, one of my top 3 LEAST favorite winners ever, and took his ass down? And let him know about it? It was my everything. She won't win, but I'll enjoy the hell out of her until she gets the boot. 

+1

8 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

Voting out Person A (who is a woman) for saying "let's vote out Person B", and then voting out Person B (who is a man) at the next tribal is something that I feel happens a lot, and there's nothing really wrong with it from a game perspective, but it does annoy me, I can't help it.

This. So much this.

[Pazlovejoy]

I admit that I enjoy watching the castaways learn the skills needed to provide themselves with fire, food and shelter, but I hate watching them actually suffer. The seasons where it constantly rains and everyone freezes are difficult to watch. Everyone hated that young black woman (was that Naonka?) for quitting, but IIRC, she was truly suffering from the cold due to her anemia. I think they are trying to balance things between Club Med and the Bataan death march. They don't want the contestants to come to actual harm. Therefore I'm glad they start them out with some food and make sure they have water.

[slowpoked]

15 hours ago, cooksdelight said:

Varner shared a photo (a still shot from this episode) of ALL of their expressions of glee once Tony left. I don't think he was too popular.

I imagine that even if you feel indifferent about Tony, that it was just so exhausting to deal with him. And you don't need to suffer through all that when you can easily get rid of him. Good riddance.

[Drogo]

Khaleesi has returned to Survivor this season after taking off for Gen-X/Millennials AKA "The Season That Thought It Was Too Good For Any Nice Old People."

Scramble to get supplies off the boat... Ah, yes, let's hurry up and take these melons that will be rotten in 2 days, and let the other tribe grab the crate of egg-producing chickens and giant underwater pod of gear.

Sara claims to be able to read people and have great social skills:  Really, because I remember you getting blindsided and being real sore about it.

Discussing Cirie and Ozzy's FvF issues:  It's like the only words Tai knows are "You guys have history." He's not even listening to Ozzy.

Tony leaves to "get water" and immediately starts running and digging frantically:  Tony's the Captain of Operation Hear Me Coming A Mile Away.

Michaela is upset at being the Ciera lone-vote:  Michaela, listen. to. the. words. that. are. coming. out. of. their. mouths.

Voting booth looks a little different this season:  Where's the hut?!  That thing looks like a Best Western.

Debbie's distrust of Cirie:  Debbie's 28th job was BS Detector.

[PaperTree]

4 hours ago, DallasGypsy said:

The (over)abundance of fruits and veggies on the ship was really a waste.  There's no way all of that could fit into the two rafts, along with the people.  And, in camp, they'd have to be consumed fairly quickly or they'd rot and draw all sorts of flies, etc.  

If people were involved in an actual shipwreck, there may be an opportunity to salvage lots of things from the ship.  Food would be a smart thing to grab even if it going to spoil, along with tools.  I think it adds a little to the "realism".

It certainly isn't "Naked & Afraid".  Those idiots lose some serious weight.

Somebody would probably have a lighter in their pocket too.  :)

Edited March 12, 2017 by PaperTree

[Eolivet]

21 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

It if Jeff has it his way they'd keep filming in Fiji until the end of Survivor.

I'm almost afraid to ask, but.......why? (other than Fiji is pretty! But so are a lot of other islands, right?)

Put me down on the side that is not there to see people starve. What do people not do when they're starving? Strategize. You can't make big moves if you're hungry. It's harder to think of flipping if you're hungry. I believe the inertia just drags everyone to stay safe for as long as possible and not shake anything up. With a something in your stomach, you can think, you can plan. Hungry Survivor = less entertaining Survivor, to me.

I've always considered Survivor a psychological experiment, first and foremost. They still sleep outside, they still have a restricted diet and they still have to compete in challenges (another reason it's not Big Brother: those are kiddie fun ride challenges compared to Survivor). I think feeding them (or providing them more access to food) has upped the level of game play, and that's what I'm here for.

[Giesela]

22 minutes ago, Eolivet said:

I'm almost afraid to ask, but.......why? (other than Fiji is pretty! But so are a lot of other islands, right?)

Put me down on the side that is not there to see people starve. What do people not do when they're starving? Strategize. You can't make big moves if you're hungry. It's harder to think of flipping if you're hungry. I believe the inertia just drags everyone to stay safe for as long as possible and not shake anything up. With a something in your stomach, you can think, you can plan. Hungry Survivor = less entertaining Survivor, to me.

I've always considered Survivor a psychological experiment, first and foremost. They still sleep outside, they still have a restricted diet and they still have to compete in challenges (another reason it's not Big Brother: those are kiddie fun ride challenges compared to Survivor). I think feeding them (or providing them more access to food) has upped the level of game play, and that's what I'm here for.

Yes, but no.  How well you can maintain your mental dominance while hungry is for me one of the things that makes Survivor what it is.  Its about being able to carry on in the face of adversity not just be a popularity contest.  Those that can either, or both, forage for food or just plain do better without it will get ahead. They that can push through the inertia and fatique of hunger to keep strategizing keep laying.  Part of doing better than others without food is not just feeding off fat stores but fortitude.  It is a balance for TPTB to walk that line between letting hunger stress the Survivors a little and letting them starve.  The seem to have see sawed quite a bit although I don't understand why, it doesn't seem that hard.  Nothing in the ocean biting?  Throw them a little rice and beans.  

[azshadowwalker]

Why be a provider when you can just find the 20 different idols out there? That has killed much of the game for me. I liked the ability to choose provider as part of your strategy  (although you definitely need more than that), but I am even more turned off by the reliance on idols. Even the vote against Tony was heavily influenced by idol potential. It's so played. 

[ghoulina]

21 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

That's literally Big Brother.

I do really miss the survival aspect of the game. That was huge in the first few seasons and now it's barely an afterthought. I mean, I don't want anyone to die or anything but, on a show called Survivor, I'm ok with a little suffering.

I'm with you. I liked seeing them have to work for fire and food. I will say, though, that places where it rains non-stop are a bit hard to watch. There's only so much miserable huddling under a tarp I can watch. But I really do miss the early years when there was a lot of focus on camp life and how the "survival" part of the show affected the group dynamics. 

 

1 hour ago, Drogo said:

Khaleesi has returned to Survivor this season

Thank Freaking God.

But I did like the voting booth - it reminded me of a lighthouse and had a very piratish theme to it.

[LadyChatts]

1 hour ago, Eolivet said:

I'm almost afraid to ask, but.......why? (other than Fiji is pretty! But so are a lot of other islands, right?)

Put me down on the side that is not there to see people starve. What do people not do when they're starving? Strategize. You can't make big moves if you're hungry. It's harder to think of flipping if you're hungry. I believe the inertia just drags everyone to stay safe for as long as possible and not shake anything up. With a something in your stomach, you can think, you can plan. Hungry Survivor = less entertaining Survivor, to me.

I've always considered Survivor a psychological experiment, first and foremost. They still sleep outside, they still have a restricted diet and they still have to compete in challenges (another reason it's not Big Brother: those are kiddie fun ride challenges compared to Survivor). I think feeding them (or providing them more access to food) has upped the level of game play, and that's what I'm here for.

Jeff loves Fiji.  Not exactly sure why, except he went on and on about how beautiful it was.  I know they've filmed in some tough locations (Cambodia, Africa, Guatemala), that maybe Fiji just makes the most sense in terms of comfortable island living, easy natural resources to find, and they have a better variety in terms of water and land challenges.  I like a variety of locations, because if people expect Fiji every season, you'll have the gamers that'll research it to death to see if they can somehow get a one up on everyone on how to prepare. 

It isn't so much that I want them to starve to the point where they refuse to get out of the shelter.  But this show doesn't need to give them so much.  It use to be one filet knife, two blankets, one piece of chocolate for 6 people, one  small basket of fruit.  Hell, in the first season there was a can of dog food that was a clue for the reward-and both camps fried it up and ate it.  They can find a happy medium.  The constant idols and "evolving the game" and making moves, I think is a lot of clever editing, and quite honestly, I'm kind of over the idols and advantages.  That's all any season is anymore.  Frantic hunts for the idols, someone finds it, sometimes people want to flush it, other times not.  Idols don't necessarily prevent Pagongings, either, and can really have no impact on the game.

[Wings]

7 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

Jeff loves Fiji.  Not exactly sure why, except he went on and on about how beautiful it was.  I know they've filmed in some tough locations (Cambodia, Africa, Guatemala), that maybe Fiji just makes the most sense in terms of comfortable island living, easy natural resources to find, and they have a better variety in terms of water and land challenges.  I like a variety of locations, because if people expect Fiji every season, you'll have the gamers that'll research it to death to see if they can somehow get a one up on everyone on how to prepare. 

The beauty is not why they continue to film there, pffffft.   I believe the production crew is the most comfortable/supported they have experienced to date.  The cooperation from the citizens and ease of operation right down to personal comfort in their private accommodations is my guess.  There is a budget consideration too.  They love it there so why not continue without having the expense of moving the staff and equipment, as well.  

I doubt there is any research that would help future castaways.  The challenges have the same context and your social game is not dependent on location.  

[Cutty]

Tony: “Sheep being led to the slaughter."

Sandra: “That’s what you get for plotting against me. That’s what you get and the queen stays queen.”

Tony: “You guys are suckers if you allow that to happen.”

Sandra: “That’s what you get. Take your ass home.”

[beat]

Sandra: “Byeeeee, Tony. Say hi to Ciera for me.”

 

I could relive this scene forever.

[LanceM]

19 hours ago, cooksdelight said:

From Jeff Varner's secret scene this week:

"He's one of the most paranoid people I have ever met. And I lived with Abi. He makes Abi look like Mother Teresa"

So yeah. I think they were happy.

[peachmangosteen]

2 hours ago, Giesela said:

 Its about being able to carry on in the face of adversity not just be a popularity contest.  

I've personally always seen this game as primarily a popularity contest. I think it's been that way since season 1, episode one and will be that way in season 40. That's probably a big part of why I don't give a shit that TPTB don't allow them to starve anymore.

35 minutes ago, LanceM said:

From Jeff Varner's secret scene this week:

"He's one of the most paranoid people I have ever met. And I lived with Abi. He makes Abi look like Mother Teresa"

Well, damn! I mean I figured Tony was hard to live with, but that is a strong statement!

Edited March 12, 2017 by peachmangosteen