S02.E03: Shogun

[scarynikki12]

Nate is shocked to learn that he has powers but then accidentally lands himself and Ray in Feudal Japan.

[Lantern7]

Well, that was fun. Aside from Rex still being dead, of course. And Amaya sneak-attacking the team, including the geezer. And Ray's suit going nova. But it was a fun hour.

Nice that "Haircut" is going to get competition in the goober department with Nate. The guy is sharp, but he's a putz even without "performance issues." Will his hero name be "Metapod"? "Nate used Harden! It was not effective!!"

So much fun to see Mick try to get into feudal Japan. He really wanted to see a ninja. And watching him grasp for his gun was hysterical.

ETA: I'm thinking Jax and Martin found Barry's memoirs. "Rip, I have fucked with the timestream so much. So much. If giraffes are running the world in the 24th Century, that's probably on me."

[Sakura12]

I enjoyed this episode for the great Sara fight scenes. And her bonding with Vixen. Who apparently doesn't think assassins are bad. But thieves are. I already like her more than Kendra though. Sara finally has a fighting buddy. 

I wonder what Ray's going do now without his suit. Maybe Vixen and Sara can hold martial arts classes for him and Nate. They should know how to fight with or without suits or powers. I still hope we get some Sara and Mick scenes, I like that he listens to her. They also seem to be setting up something with Mick and Vixen. 

I don't like secret keeping, I hope we find out what older deep voiced Barry said sooner rather than later. We don't need secrets and lies on this show too. 
 

I can't wait for a fun show with zombies, The Walking Dead depressed me. 

[KirkB]

The Waverider's tech should allow Ray to build a new Atom suit fairly easily I would think.

Sara was, as usual, the MVP. Never try to out ninja a League of Assassins member.

Mick was so excited to meet ninjas. Like a child. A pyromaniac child with anger management issues but still...

Barry's warning. It'll probably have something to do with the crossover.

[squidprincess]

I really enjoyed the Jax and Martin scenes, but I was a bit uncomfortable with the episode on a whole.  Particularly Nate's plot.  But next week ought to be fun.

[Sakura12]

I loved Vixen, I'm not sure about Nate. I don't find him necessary, he's like Ray 2.0. I just started liking Ray I don't need another more annoying version. 

I love seeing Sara use her assassin skills by having a hidden knife. 

[Lantern7]

Brandon/Ray did the opening narration. I'm guessing we'll be getting different characters filling Rip's shoes. Can't wait for Mick's turn. Just 25 seconds of growling, followed by "Legends."

[benteen]

Very fun episode.  Feudal Japan was a great setting for the show.  Sara kicked all kinds of ass and I liked the way she killed the guy at the end.  Mick in this setting was a lot of fun.

Vixen: "Who's Chuck Norris?"

Mick: "And you call me stupid?"

Strong episode for Ray and I like the additions of Nate and Vixen, even though Nate looks like he has Zach's hair style from Saved by the Bell.  I was hoping Ray would get to keep the armor.  Message from Future Barry...what did he screw up this time?

Jax and Stein play off of each other very well.  There scene with Sara at the end was funny.

[KirkB]

I agree with Sakura12. I like Vixen but I'm not sure why Nate exists. Supposedly for his historical knowledge, I guess, but they should be able to get most of that kind of information from Gideon.

[Hiveminder]

I just want to reach through the screen and shake Jack and Martin. Don't do what Barry says guys. You'll ruin everything. 

[Actionmage]

I, too, enjoyed the episode! IA about Sara getting to stretch her ninja-assassin muscles against a warlord and that Mick was like a kid hoping to catch Santa.

Others have touched on my minor gripes, so I won't duplicate here. I was curious if the trees we saw in the 'feudal Japanese forest' were anywhere close to what Japan could have; the group here is pretty knowledgeable, so ITYIA.

Next week looks to continue the fun and silliness! Anytime Martin gets uptight makes me smile.

[Primal Slayer]

What is Vixens infatuation with bears? She can go with any animal she wants yet she uses as her go to animal for some reason thus far. But thus far she is the best thing about this season.

Ew at them having Katanas whole being based off of Nate saving her great ancestor and jump starting her families legacy.

Them traveling to all these "big" eras just to place dress up is becoming rather boring. 

[johntfs]

17 hours ago, KirkB said:

I agree with Sakura12. I like Vixen but I'm not sure why Nate exists. Supposedly for his historical knowledge, I guess, but they should be able to get most of that kind of information from Gideon.

Maybe Ray's going to leave the team to rebuild his ATOM suit/be a hero on another show for awhile.  Theoretically, Nate is there to help the team blend in more effectively.  There's a difference between knowing about some place's history and understanding how that history impacts the culture which exists there.  Gideon: "Japan in the Edo period was run by warring lords with armies of samurai."  Nate: "These people will be deeply suspicious of foreigners and can cut you down for any reason or simple whim, even if only to test the edges on their swords."

Theoretically.  Still it was cool that we got a little background on Katana's katana.

One thing that no one seems to get right is that Kenjutsu (sword combat) greatly de-emphasizes parries.  No samurai wants to risk damaging his blade by hitting another blade with it.  So the whole Clang!Clash!Clang! thing didn't really happen a lot.

Edited October 28, 2016 by johntfs

[srpturtle80]

Seeing Snart on the Flash this week just reminded me how much I miss him. I really wish he was still part of all their shenanigans. 

[squidprincess]

I think the problem with Nate being the man to explain the history/culture is that this was his first chance to be useful in that capacity, and he failed royally.  He was by far the most conspicuous and disruptive person in the group after Ray, but where Ray's mishap was largely not his fault (he couldn't have predicted that he'd get caught and the suit stolen), Nate kept calling attention to himself.

I've liked Nate in the first two episodes, but this seemed like a step back.

[Lord Kira]

It was okay at best. Definitely one of the weakest episodes of the series. 

I hate Amaya. Not only is she a Mary Sue that can defeat the whole team single-handedly, she also ends up being apologized to for being locked up after trying to kill one of them. "I'm sorry for locking you up" Really? Don't be sorry for locking up the woman who just attacked all of you and tried to kill one of your team members. Vixen acts all high and mighty because "I'm a member of the JSA" (That line is gonna end up being as annoying as "I was a barista", I just know it). Her inviting herself along and constantly judging the team is annoying and just makes me hate her more. 

We wasted a lot of time on Steel, who is a bit less useless than the previous episodes. At least him having powers is a valid reason to keep him on the team. Sure beats the other reason of "I'm a time detective". Who needs a time detective/historian when you have Gideon? His story was ok this episode mainly because the Japanese girl and her father were interesting, but he still had too much screentime. 

In fact, the whole Shogun story with the Atom suit bored the heck out of me. I was more interested in whatever message Barry Allen had for Rip.

Mick, Sara, and Ray were as great as usual. I hope Mick sticks to his guns and doesn't suddenly start respecting Amaya (as she deserves none). I love ninjas too, Mick. Sara is just pure energy for this show. I thought they made her look weak in her first fight tonight (to have Amaya save the day to endear her to the audience), but her second fight was amazing. Ray was also good tonight. BR is very good at portraying anger. The show should explore that more.

All in all, a weak episode saved by the usual series MVP's. Can we ditch Amaya and Steel and bring back Rip and Snart? Please?

[kirinan]

11 hours ago, srpturtle80 said:

Seeing Snart on the Flash this week just reminded me how much I miss him. I really wish he was still part of all their shenanigans. 

I totally agree, srpturtle80. Tonight was better than the other episodes this season so far, but even so, this season is just not doing it for me. It's like most of the ingredients are there--I love Sara as captain, I've always had a soft spot for Ray, Mick--well, thank goodness he's still around, and have always enjoyed Stein and Jax together. But without Rip, and especially without Snart, it just doesn't interest me much this year. To me, they (minus the Hawks; I don't miss them) had a perfect ensemble feel and group chemistry last season that's missing for me now. And Vixen and Nate do nothing to bring it back. I like Nate well enough, but I don't care for Ms. Judgy Vixen at all.

I do want to know what Jax and Stein found in that room. And I'm sure we'll find out...in the crossover.

And I HATE zombies. They scare me. So I'm definitely not looking forward to next week.

Edited October 28, 2016 by kirinan

[Sakura12]

Exactly I failed to see how him being a historian helped them. He just wanted to be a hero and get the girl. He wasn't at all hiding the fact that he was from the future, respecting the culture or even knowing that much about their culture. 

They have Gideon an AI that knows all of history and the future. What do they need another I'm a hero for the glory character for?

The going to different time periods and putting on costumes is half the fun of this show.

Edited October 28, 2016 by Sakura12

[MarkHB]

Dammit show!  I watch this show in hopes of seeing Ray do cool shrinking stuff as the Atom, not to slog through character development as he discovers "the hero within"!  Bring back the Atom suit! *pout*

I did love the battle royale at the end, though.

[Last Time Lord]

So, we got Nazi last week, Samurai and Ninja this week, and we're getting Zombies next week?

Oh, show, I love you, too!

[foreverevolving]

Did anyone else catch the fact that the Masako is Tatso (ie Katana) Ancestor? (or Maseo, not sure how last names go in Japan)

Edited October 28, 2016 by foreverevolving

[twoods]

I have a soft spot for Nick Zano so I like Nate. He brings something different to the team. I wish they didn't kill Rex off so soon- his character had potential.

Another fun episode. Love the interactions between the characters- they all have terrific chemistry.

[tarotx]

It was a bit slow during the Nate and Ray scenes. I liked Nate the first two episodes but he was just Ray Jr in this episode. I don't need two Rays >.< I know Ray will get his suit back. And I imagine that he will now make something that he wears at all time and builds up around him. Probably inspired by Vixen's wearable totem. And I don't need an origin story. which is supposedly the point of Nate.  People really adored Barry in Flash season one.

I loved Sara and Mick as usual. Ninja assassin Sara didn't let me down <3

Vixen was Ok. She was much better than Kendra. Lucky for her Sara was tired :p Vixen does have the potential to be a Too perfect Character and I don't want that at all. And I'm not sure if I'm going to like her voice or not Something is off about her speech. 

Jax and Stein are good together now. I think Barry's message has to be about Reverse Flash.

[CabotCove]

A Perfect Hour

The team was just so like a team

Nate > Rip & Cold. A+ trade off 

[TDT]

Mick must be a Cannon Films fan(mentions of Chuck Norris and Ninja 3 The Domination,which IMO was a good film lol)

and who knew Jax was  a fan of Lost(the whole opening secret hatches thing) I guess we'll find out what was in that hatch during the big cross-over episode

[scarynikki12]

I enjoyed Ray, Nate and Jax being goofballs as they testing the steel powers but I am beyond over Ray's desire to be A Hero.  It's your actions that make you a hero, not your suit, you dumb shirt.  If Ray would, for once, not wallow in one of these setbacks but get right back into the thick of things because lives are at stake, then he'd be a hero.  Be upset about losing your suit when the dust settles and you guys leave.  Every time he brings it up it just tells me that he's still more interested in the recognition than anything else. 

Moving on, my reservations about Nate taking up story and screen time are still in effect but I have none where Amaya is concerned.  I think she's already fit right in, from demonstrating her skill by taking everyone out one by one at the beginning, to working well with Sara, to snarking with Mick.  I enjoyed every scene and I'm looking forward to more.  My hope is the whoever was in charge of fitting her in gets to work on Nate because they've spent so much time on him that it's starting to feel like he was cast to be the show's main character.

Ideally, Barry would have learned a thing or two in forty years and his message will end up being a benefit but, until we know, I'm going to assume that he's still The Worst and will screw things up for the Legends.

Mick was so much fun.  I loved him snarking on his own and opposite Amaya.  Maybe they can be the new Sara/Snart?  Two characters who snark at one another in a really entertaining way and becoming close friends.  I can't see anything happening romantically between them because she's going to return to the 40s eventually so, unless Mick turns out to be modern Vixen's grandfather, there's no way it ends well.  I'll gladly take a friendship instead.

I loved Sara being sneaky with the knife and I will admit that a part of me expected to have a more direct League of Assassins connection than her ninja description.  I was sure we'd learn that Ra's was around during this time, had traveled to Japan to learn swordplay, and would cross paths with the Legends and get the idea to form the League.  I'm glad it didn't happen, as that would make this world way too small, but I was expecting it.

I'd rather Ray not figure out the Katana connection and let that reveal be for the audience but it was still pretty subtle so I can let it go.

[Xenith22]

3 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

Ew at them having Katanas whole being based off of Nate saving her great ancestor and jump starting her families legacy.

Eh, since I hate the whole predestination paradox stuff since we met Tatsu before Rip even recruited his team I am going to assume that Katana's ancestor (or someone else) would have killed that dude at some point before he could kill her.  So Nate really only may have just saved her from suffering some unpleasant experiences before that point...but she was going to survive regardless and continue the legacy.

On a different note...who else felt the urge to shout at the TV for them to just stab the guy in the face instead of blowing up the suit?

Edited October 28, 2016 by Xenith22

[CabotCove]

Quote

Dammit show!  I watch this show in hopes of seeing Ray do cool shrinking stuff as the Atom, not to slog through character development as he discovers "the hero within"!  Bring back the Atom suit! *pout*

Possibly this was done so he can upgrade to a better suit.

[thuganomics85]

As soon as I saw Kevin Tancharoen's name in the credits, I knew the fight scenes would be good at least.  I know Arrow is all gaga over James Bamford, but I think between Agents of Shield and these shows, no one can top Kevin in that department.

A bit of a filler episode, but I don't mind it since it had a lot of laughs and decent character moments.  Mick's obsession with ninjas was my favorite.  Dominic Purcell really is excelling with the comic relief parts, which, again, is something I never would have predicted during this time on Prison Break.  While I still miss him playing off of Snart, I like how he interacts with the rest of the characters like "Haircut" and even Vixen.  And I still like how you can tell in his own way that he respects Sara.  It's nothing major, but you can always tell that he does listen to her and follow her lead, compared to being snarky with the rest of the team.

Looks like Vixen is sticking around until they finally save Rex.  I'm cool with it; she continues to be way better then Hawkgirl ever was.

I like Nick Zano in this, but I do feel like Nate is almost becoming another Ray.  They both seem to have the same kind of attitudes and reactions to certain situations.  Hopefully they'll start bringing some new ideas to this character.

Ray looses his suit, but I'm guessing this will be used to give him some kind of upgrade, so maybe it won't look like an early Iron Man prototype, that Tony Stark tossed aside.

Martina and Jax find out that Rip had been in talks with Old Man Barry.  Ha!  I knew Barry, the world's worst time-traveler, would be responsible on some level!

Captain Sara might end up being my favorite Sara, which is saying something since any Sara tends to be awesome.

[Proteus]

I still miss Snart and Rip and wish they'd return but I still enjoy the show.

I love Sara as Captain. She was awesome through this whole episode.

I thought the episode was good all the way through.

I don't think Barry's message has anything to do with the cross over. I think the message will be important for LOTs ongoing story this season.

I thought it was hilarious that they ended up in feudal Japan because Ray, Nate, and Jax were fooling around.

Im already enjoying Vixens inclusion on the team. She was great with both Sara and Mick.

[cambridgeguy]

I guess having Ray zip around in the Atom suit was putting too much of a strain on the show's budget?  Oh well, maybe his next suit will have a kill switch in case it's stolen.

I definitely agree that Nate is acting a lot like Ray 2.0.  I think they want to create their own version of Felicity/Cisco but it's not quite working yet.

[Sakura12]

I was really looking forward to seeing Sara in ninja mode. This episode did not disappoint. CL posted a slow mo vid of the practice fight. 

[KirkB]

7 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

I loved Sara being sneaky with the knife and I will admit that a part of me expected to have a more direct League of Assassins connection than her ninja description.  I was sure we'd learn that Ra's was around during this time, had traveled to Japan to learn swordplay, and would cross paths with the Legends and get the idea to form the League.  I'm glad it didn't happen, as that would make this world way too small, but I was expecting it.

I didn't expect Ra's himself to make an appearance (you're right, that would make the world way too small) but I kind of thought Sara might mention the League. I got the impression it has been around for a while.

Edited October 28, 2016 by KirkB

[Latverian Diplomat]

11 hours ago, KirkB said:

The Waverider's tech should allow Ray to build a new Atom suit fairly easily I would think.

 

Well, theoretically, dwarf star material is hard to come by. I noted that the atom suit disintegrated (really, from overheating?) instead of leaving a lot of salvageable parts. I think a new suit might be a while.

It was far fetched that Nate could place himself from one building, until he said Edo Japan was one of his main interests. How many of those is he allowed to have? It's like his incredibly comprehensive journal. I have a feeling Nate had a lot of false starts on his PhD dissertation. :-)

If this were a Doctor Who episode, that building probably would have turned out to be part of a 33rd century "Edo Japan Theme Park". :-)

For folks that are supposed to be protecting the integrity of the timeline, they sure didn't think twice about slaughtering a known "historical" figure and all his men. At least Rip would have scolded them, before caving and letting them do it anyway. :-)

[Lady Calypso]

I didn't like this episode nearly as much as the last two. It had some good moments, but I do think that there were aspects that brought it down for me. Particularly, Ray and Nate.

I liked Nate a lot the last two episodes. However, pairing him off with Ray didn't do either of them justice. Nate showed his Ray-lite qualities, and I can really only tolerate Ray in small doses, so the influx of Ray scenes with Nate just didn't do it for me. I wasn't interested in Nate's love interest either. I still think Nate has potential; I just don't see the potential in becoming Ray 2.0 very interesting. Plus, Nate looked like a total idiot and I know that he probably isn't smart and he's reckless, but he was on Ray levels this episode. If this is what we're getting for Nate, then I may have to retract my opinion about him. I won't yet, though; I give all characters on this show a "One Episode Idiot" Pass. They've all had the (except for maybe Sara; well, maybe the Damien Darhk killing is her free pass). I just didn't think I'd be giving Nate one this early. 

So, Ray's still bemoaning about not being a hero because of what Amaya said last episode. I really hope we don't have to see this side of Ray for the entire season. I did think that Nate/Ray would have found a way to get the guy out of the suit without having to destroy it, though, so the show got me there. I'm guessing we'll have Ray trying to replicate his suit for the next few episodes. I'm sure Gideon can help with that. I know where they're trying to go with Ray, but I much prefer not-mopey Ray. 

Besides Ray/Nate being the low points of the episode (and being in the majority of the episode, which is why I brought down the episode), the rest of it was pretty great. I like the idea of them being in Feudal Japan and it had the potential to be a lot more fun. It was still fun, though, especially with the ninjas.

Sara was great and all kinds of badass. I expect that they'd have to tone down her fighting skills to give the rest of the team a chance once in a while. She can't always be 100% badass all of the time! We got to see Amaya fight more, and I love the female friendship that's developing. So much better than the failed Sara/Kendra friendship. I also really loved the Mick/Amaya scenes. Now that Snart's gone, Mick needs a partner of sorts to bounce off of, and I see that Amaya will be that person. It'll be fun to see their dynamic grow. 

Mick was all sorts of great, with his obsession with ninjas and his snark. 

DAMNIT, BARRY! I didn't think I'd ever have to say it on THIS show! Come on, man! 40 years in the future and you're still potentially screwing things up?! I think, at this point, Barry needs to be killed in order to save the world/universe. I suspected that Rip would have a secret compartment, though. He was sometimes visibly annoyed by his team, so I just thought he needed a secret place to hide out and bemoan about the team. I suspect the Old Barry message will be revealed in the major crossover. 

Edited October 28, 2016 by Lady Calypso

[Primetimer]

Someone new has powers, someone old doesn't, and someone else joins the team, at least for now.

View the full article

[darkestboy]

Nice history lesson this week and also a nice shout out to a certain character too, which was good.

Nate and Ray feel too similarly tonally that it makes me wonder why we even need the former though this episode did showcase Nate's powers fairly well. 

Sara, Mick and Amaya got all the highlights of this episode. Mick's joy at seeing ninjas was just brilliant to see though.

Why do Stein and Jax have to keep Barry's message a secret though? 7/10

[Sakura12]

I'm going to have to assume that Vixen became the spirit of a cat or something to be able to sneak up and take out the entire team. 

[kdm07]

Some really good lines in this episode:

"Sounds like you're having performance issues."

"League of Assassins, Class of '09. Don't take it easy on me."

"I designed it so that an idiot can use it."
"An idiot does."

"Tell that to Chuck Norris."
"Who's that?"
"And I'm the idiot!"

[Cekrypton1]

Okay, Ray is knocked out and divested of his suit on a weekly basis. It literally happens every week--we see it. And yet, the only way to stop the suit this time is to blow it up? Weak, writers, so weak.

I will say at least this week divesting Ray of his suit allowed for perhaps the greatest Heatwave one-liner of the entire series:
Ray: I designed it so an idiot could use it.
Mick: An idiot does.

Pardon the pun, but that is a quality burn.

[TwistedandBored]

This episode wasn't as good as the last two episode but it was still enjoyable.

I like Vixen's addition to the group but on the fence about Nate. Like the two first episodes he was okay and then in this episode I got Ray season 1 vibes off him and I didn't like that. 

The highlight of the episode was Mick. I was high amused by his obsession with Ninja's and just his attitude toward everyone except for Sara who he respects. I like that too. 

[Hiveminder]

This is my fun show, so I don't worry too much about whether or not they kill important historical figures or how they change history. I'm here mostly for the jokes and the cool fights, and this episode delivered. 

Nate and Ray were the worst part, but more because they were just kind of meh than because they were bad. 

Amaya's constantly telling people they're not heroes for whatever reason could get annoying if it keeps up, but so far I still like her. 

[Aeryn13]

Something that really bugged me? Apart from one scene, Nate, the historian, didn`t make any effort not to use modern day dude-bro-speak that should have been incomprehensible to these people, no matter the basic language. Couldn`t he at least try to put it into words that fit the time period? That`s usually what time-travellers at least attempt to do in movies/shows. The one scene where he did, calling Yoda a "sensei" instead of casually going "he was that little green muppet in Star Wars" was actually the best for the character. For most of the episode, he was way too goofy and Season 1-ish annoying levels of Ray. 

And of course the characters from feudal Japan totally had no problem with 21th century terminology. Urgh. The costume alone isn`t enough to blend. I have to try hard enough to ignore noone raising an eyebrow at a female samurai. Female fighters was totally something 17th century men of any country were familiar with. Sigh.

I loved Sara kicking ass and her second fight scene was awesome but there is only so much disbelief I can suspend.

Vixen was okay. She is kinda judgmental but I liked her bonding with Sara.

Mick`s Ninja-worship was adorable. He was so gleeful.

Ray`s suit doesn`t have a very secret disabling switch or panic button that only Ray knows about? It has to be totally destroyed or else? And it hasn`t been coded to only respond to his genetic print for example? That was such fabricated drama, all I could think was "wow, saving budget here by not using expensive Atom effects for a time being".

Jax and Stein got a bit sidelined and I don`t care for the bullshit secret-keeping. It will serve no purpose, no matter what Barry said. In fact, don`t ever listen to what Barry says, he is the guy who creates his own bad guys by fucking up the timeline.  

 Overall, I thought it was quite a good episode. Some nice scenes with Sara/Vixen and Ray/old Yamashiro. Little Arrow-tie-in that wasn`t too on the nose. I got to say the quality of the show overall has gone up considerably since Season 1. I still miss Snart and even Rip but the absence of the Hawks, their love triangle drama and Vandall Savage made the show 100 % more fun. 

Quote

Martina and Jax

Teehee. Sorry but Martina is a common German first name, it immediately created a hilarious, mental picture.

Edited October 28, 2016 by Aeryn13

[mrspidey]

Are we not going to talk about how royally these "Legends" screwed up the timeline by killing Tokugawa Iemitsu 10 years before the actual end of his rule?

[futurechemist]

I didn't get Ray's angst at not being a hero because his suit is gone. Mick doesn't have any powers. He just has a flamethrower. Sara doesn't have powers, she's a trained fighter. Just give Ray a laser gun or something from the armory.

I'm annoyed at the lack of communication between Martin/Jax and the rest of the team, but I can accept it since of all the legends, they were by far the closest to Barry before leaving, so they'd be the most likely to accept Barry's request at face value.

Maybe the answer is "timey-wimey", but how can Reverse Flash be a villain on this show or on the Flash when Eddie killed himself to prevent Reverse Flash from existing. There's also the massive contradiction where everyone on the Flash tells Barry he's an idiot for continuing to change history, while on Legends it's their job. It wasn't such a big deal last year, but it is now that Flash is beating us over the head with consequences from Flashpoint. Do the writers on each show talk to each other?

[Latverian Diplomat]

So, character-design-wise, they went full Colossus from the X Men with Citizen Steel. I can understand the impulse but it seems an expensive choice. Maybe this stuff is just a lot cheaper than it used to be.  

[Latverian Diplomat]

43 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

 

Teehee. Sorry but Martina is a common German first name, it immediately created a hilarious, mental picture.

I'm sure there's a parallel earth with a Martina Stein. They still have Big Belly Burger though.

[KirkB]

9 minutes ago, Latverian Diplomat said:

So, character-design-wise, they went full Colossus from the X Men with Citizen Steel. I can understand the impulse but it seems an expensive choice. Maybe this stuff is just a lot cheaper than it used to be.

I was thinking the same thing. The Colossus part. The silver metal thing is probably a fairly simple digital trick nowadays. Though I doubt Nate will be steeling up often or staying that way for any length of time.

[Hiveminder]

33 minutes ago, futurechemist said:

There's also the massive contradiction where everyone on the Flash tells Barry he's an idiot for continuing to change history, while on Legends it's their job. It wasn't such a big deal last year, but it is now that Flash is beating us over the head with consequences from Flashpoint. Do the writers on each show talk to each other?

Maybe because Barry's just so freaking bad at it. Or rather, he's really good at changing history in awful ways. 

Does anyone imagine Ray telling Oliver about how he trained Nate and Oliver nodding approvingly and then being like, "Next time you should stab him in the leg."?

[MarkHB]

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

Something that really bugged me? Apart from one scene, Nate, the historian, didn`t make any effort not to use modern day dude-bro-speak that should have been incomprehensible to these people, no matter the basic language. Couldn`t he at least try to put it into words that fit the time period? That`s usually what time-travellers at least attempt to do in movies/shows. The one scene where he did, calling Yoda a "sensei" instead of casually going "he was that little green muppet in Star Wars" was actually the best for the character.

I assumed that the babelfish tablet took care of the idioms in addition to the literal language.

So far as Barry's message to Rip goes, I think that older Barry has realized somewhere along the line what a complete hash he made of things by time traveling, and so he was calling in the professionals (Rip).