S03.E08: Proposal in the City

[Evagirl]

2 minutes ago, Marigold said:

And Jeremy is surely no virgin even though he plays one on TV. 

Agree.  

I don't think he's implying so much that he's a virgin but rather implying that he's been celibate for a good while.  That's not so much a badge of honor (as I think he's trying to make it out to be) as it is a choice one chooses to make, male or female.   

[luvmylabs]

2 hours ago, Evagirl said:

I thought I saw that too!!!  I thought (with wicked gless), "Oh wow, I hope JimBob is watching this!"  JB does not like Jeremy.  It was pretty obvious when he visited his apartment and didn't have one nice thing to say.  Coming from a man who previous two sons-in-law didn't have a pot to pee in or a window to throw it out of, let alone a place to bring a bride.  JB hates Jeremy's independence.  He's hates Jeremy's "worldliness".  He hates the fact that Jinger doesn't give two whits about his "boundaries".  He hates the fact that Jinger will move away from home and not be under this control.  He knows he's losing Jinger.  When he looked at Jeremy at the airport and wouldn't leave them alone for 2 minutes to say goodbye, I knew he had hatred in his heart towards this young man.

I sure hope Jana is quietly seeing someone who's not a Duggar-clone.  

You hit the nail on the head.  Jim Bob can't control Jeremy.  Thank God!

[laurakaye]

JB must've been busy with some rando projects at home and sent Michelle in his place on the proposal trip?  I cannot imagine a scenario where JB wouldn't want to be there to stare Jeremy down with his beady eyes after Jinger officially became Jer's fiance.  If there was ever a time and place for JB to have a major pissing contest, that would be a top one, IMO.  Can't wait to see the measuring contest at the actual wedding.

Michelle's presence on that trip was completely unnecessary, as it could've been a fun trip for Jessa, Bin and the Spurge to hang out with Jinge and Babe as two grown-up couples (and a baby).  Michelle did not need to be there, as she has children to take care of at home (LOL) and she probably didn't do much in the way of taking care of Spurgeon anyway.

Edited October 12, 2016 by laurakaye

[Marigold]

Totally agree. Jim Bob does not like Jeremy, mainly because he will be very hard to control. 

[tenativelyyours]

50 minutes ago, Evagirl said:

Agree.  

I don't think he's implying so much that he's a virgin but rather implying that he's been celibate for a good while.  That's not so much a badge of honor (as I think he's trying to make it out to be) as it is a choice one chooses to make, male or female.   

Or a choice that is imposed on one.  Jeremy may well be horrible in the sack.  His antiquated and rather antipathetic views on sexual matters may well indicate that he has had horrible sexual experiences and is self-aware enough to know part of the problem is him.  Or all the problem is him but he is in denial and therefore "Sex" is the problem.

I'm with churchhoney.

What's more I think Jeremy's "experience" whatever it is works strongly against them.  Jinjer's libido is like the Running of the Bulls at Pamplona.  But she has been coupled with someone who already has "been there" and already defined it pretty much it seems by his own publicly offered ideas and beliefs on the matter in general.

Sex should be fun.  And I don't get that from Jeremy.  Sex should be shared and equal with a couple.  Note how Jeremy is the "star" in every one of his stories about himself.  I know that sounds odd because when you talk about yourself, you obviously are going to focus on you in a way.  But with Jeremy it reminds me of the joke my siblings had when we still attended church but were already disillusioned with organized religion.  There was the "How Christ Came into My Life" witnessing tales and the "How I was Born Again".  Note the difference.  Both are ego driven a little.  But the second is all about "me" and that is how I see Jeremy's Journey to Holiness.  That does not bode well for a healthy sex life with a partner.  Plus he has more than once let slip he has a patriarchal view on the genders and their roles.  Another minus, a big one, in what the boudoir might hold in store for Jinjer.

And I don't see Jeremy quite as independent as others do.  I do think he is biding his time and I think Boob is underestimating just how much like himself Jeremy is.  But right now, behind the scenes, Boob is still the one Nancy has on her contact list I'm betting.  The difference with Jeremy is that unlike Bin or the Dullard, he knows exactly what that means and I suspect is not content with that to remain.  But he also knows Boob is still his path to greatness, and Jinjer is just a brick in that path.  I have less hopes than all the "Derrick is so going change Jill and the Duggars" talk when he first appeared because I think the Dullard has no clue despite the more worldly life.  Jeremy does know because he is born famewhore imo.   He will work with Boob for as long as it gets him to where he is going.    And right now, I do think Boob is controlling Jermey just fine.  I see a dancing monkey doing the marriage waltz for ratings and money.  And while the monkey might not be the breed the Boob prefers and he might eventually rip the Boob's face off metaphorically speaking.  Right now Jeremy is smiling, putting on the little coat and tilting the hat with his attempt at "roguish" charm and dance dance dancing the camera time away.

 

The sad thing is that Jeremy's potential break could be well past any time Jinjer has to grow and mature that marriage and a life outside the confines of Duggardom allows.  What's more I don't see Jeremy so much as expanding Jinjer's life as simply redefining when and if Jeremy sees his chance and throws off the Duggar influence.  I see it merely changing and perhaps even becoming more confined.  Boob is controlling but in a very limited and unimaginative way.  He is dated.  Jeremy is new and as we see in this episode has lived and even loved in a "normal" family atmosphere and yet he has made many of the same choices or even more extreme ones going by his "preaching" than Jinjer has had imposed on her.   And it is worrisome to me that someone that thinks in such a linear fashion in terms of sin, forgiveness and simple human failings will be in "charge of Jinjer" if Jeremy truly is this strong and independent person because right now?  Jeremy is extremely dependent on the Duggar machine no matter how broken it was and how wobbly it is now patched together.  And for someone like Jeremy and this strong independent man who will flaunt Boob's dominance every chance he gets?  That could be a really bitter patch Jinjer has to mind.  Jeremy seems to see things that don't go his way as obstacles -- his college life, his soccer career.  So what and where does that leave Jinjer if he sees the Boob and the whole Duggar way as being some kind of obstacle after he sought them out for whatever (coughagendacough) reasons?  Jinjer Duggar.  What seems to me right now a pretty obvious means to and end.

Even as simple and vapid as she is I feel sorry for her.  She is ready to crawl out from under the pile of crap her parents raised her in her whole life just to have the load of bricks that Judgey Jeremy land on her pimpled ass and she actually is being trained to not just accept but adore it.  How does she go forward to when there is any kind of disappointment or simple dissatisfaction in her marriage and she is basically on air being taught to simper, smile and gush over everything that is her husband?  It is a bit like watching a rescue animal being taught "crating

[Evagirl]

4 minutes ago, laurakaye said:

JB must've been busy with some rando projects at home and sent Michelle in his place on the proposal trip?  I cannot imagine a scenario where JB wouldn't want to be there to stare Jeremy down with his beady eyes after Jinger officially became Jer's fiance.  If there was ever a time and place for JB to have a major pissing contest, that would be a top one, IMO.  Can't wait to see the measuring contest at the actual wedding.

Michelle's presence on that trip was completely unnecessary, as it could've been a fun trip for Jessa, Bin and the Spurge to hang out with Jinge and Babe as two grown-up couples (and a baby).  Michelle did not need to be there, as she has children to take care of at home (LOL) and she probably didn't do much in the way of taking care of Spurgeon anyway.

I agree with you about Michelle.  It would have been nice had she been along to baby sit Spurg while the adult couples did their thing, but no, there she was right in the thick of it.  Somebody said earlier "with her fried mullet" - that cracked me completely up at my desk here at work.  I still laugh out loud thinking about how we rag on poor Michelle.  We have no pity for that poor sap of a woman.  I think she thinks she's one of the sisters.  It's a wonder she didn't go boating with them.  She probably was there, hiding behind some tree to make sure J & J didn't try to squeeze in the same boat, or cop a feel or something.

I know Jinger is sappy and is acting like a 14 year girl with a first crush, but I love her spunk when it comes to showing affection that the other young ladies were forbidden to do.

[Evagirl]

10 minutes ago, tenativelyyours said:

Or a choice that is imposed on one.  Jeremy may well be horrible in the sack.  His antiquated and rather antipathetic views on sexual matters may well indicate that he has had horrible sexual experiences and is self-aware enough to know part of the problem is him.  Or all the problem is him but he is in denial and therefore "Sex" is the problem.

I'm with churchhoney.

What's more I think Jeremy's "experience" whatever it is works strongly against them.  Jinjer's libido is like the Running of the Bulls at Pamplona.  But she has been coupled with someone who already has "been there" and already defined it pretty much it seems by his own publicly offered ideas and beliefs on the matter in general.

Sex should be fun.  And I don't get that from Jeremy.  Sex should be shared and equal with a couple.  Note how Jeremy is the "star" in every one of his stories about himself.  I know that sounds odd because when you talk about yourself, you obviously are going to focus on you in a way.  But with Jeremy it reminds me of the joke my siblings had when we still attended church but were already disillusioned with organized religion.  There was the "How Christ Came into My Life" witnessing tales and the "How I was Born Again".  Note the difference.  Both are ego driven a little.  But the second is all about "me" and that is how I see Jeremy's Journey to Holiness.  That does not bode well for a healthy sex life with a partner.  Plus he has more than once let slip he has a patriarchal view on the genders and their roles.  Another minus, a big one, in what the boudoir might hold in store for Jinjer.

And I don't see Jeremy quite as independent as others do.  I do think he is biding his time and I think Boob is underestimating just how much like himself Jeremy is.  But right now, behind the scenes, Boob is still the one Nancy has on her contact list I'm betting.  The difference with Jeremy is that unlike Bin or the Dullard, he knows exactly what that means and I suspect is not content with that to remain.  But he also knows Boob is still his path to greatness, and Jinjer is just a brick in that path.  I have less hopes than all the "Derrick is so going change Jill and the Duggars" talk when he first appeared because I think the Dullard has no clue despite the more worldly life.  Jeremy does know because he is born famewhore imo.   He will work with Boob for as long as it gets him to where he is going.    And right now, I do think Boob is controlling Jermey just fine.  I see a dancing monkey doing the marriage waltz for ratings and money.  And while the monkey might not be the breed the Boob prefers and he might eventually rip the Boob's face off metaphorically speaking.  Right now Jeremy is smiling, putting on the little coat and tilting the hat with his attempt at "roguish" charm and dance dance dancing the camera time away.

 

The sad thing is that Jeremy's potential break could be well past any time Jinjer has to grow and mature that marriage and a life outside the confines of Duggardom allows.  What's more I don't see Jeremy so much as expanding Jinjer's life as simply redefining when and if Jeremy sees his chance and throws off the Duggar influence.  I see it merely changing and perhaps even becoming more confined.  Boob is controlling but in a very limited and unimaginative way.  He is dated.  Jeremy is new and as we see in this episode has lived and even loved in a "normal" family atmosphere and yet he has made many of the same choices or even more extreme ones going by his "preaching" than Jinjer has had imposed on her.   And it is worrisome to me that someone that thinks in such a linear fashion in terms of sin, forgiveness and simple human failings will be in "charge of Jinjer" if Jeremy truly is this strong and independent person because right now?  Jeremy is extremely dependent on the Duggar machine no matter how broken it was and how wobbly it is now patched together.  And for someone like Jeremy and this strong independent man who will flaunt Boob's dominance every chance he gets?  That could be a really bitter patch Jinjer has to mind.  Jeremy seems to see things that don't go his way as obstacles -- his college life, his soccer career.  So what and where does that leave Jinjer if he sees the Boob and the whole Duggar way as being some kind of obstacle after he sought them out for whatever (coughagendacough) reasons?  Jinjer Duggar.  What seems to me right now a pretty obvious means to and end.

Even as simple and vapid as she is I feel sorry for her.  She is ready to crawl out from under the pile of crap her parents raised her in her whole life just to have the load of bricks that Judgey Jeremy land on her pimpled ass and she actually is being trained to not just accept but adore it.  How does she go forward to when there is any kind of disappointment or simple dissatisfaction in her marriage and she is basically on air being taught to simper, smile and gush over everything that is her husband?  It is a bit like watching a rescue animal being taught "crating

Okay, we have to agree to disagree on this.  I think Jeremy is for real.  I think he really loves Jinger and is excited about showing her a different world.  He knows she's been very sheltered and protected, and I think he's excited about exposing her to different things.  But I also think Jinger plays up the role of the "I don't know anything," girl.  She does that to make Jeremy feel empowered.  Jinger may be more shrewd than we think.

I don't know about the sex stuff.  I haven't listened to any of Jeremy's sermons or his spiel on self-denial.  For her sake, I hope he's just an average red-blooded male who will find great pleasure in pleasuring his wife.

[Absolom]

As expected trawling the proposal increased ratings:  1.343 M viewers and a .4 rating.

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, Marigold said:

I know where you're coming from with this...

I just think those two look like they are going to O at any moment just standing next to eachother.  Particularly Jinger.  Maybe she is TOO sexually aroused? I don't know enough about the horrible situations she has been through to even make an educated guess.

But she certainly looks ready to have some sex with No Jerk Off Jeremy.  Maybe they will have a lot of sexual dysfunction but from my TV screen, they look like they will get the job done and pretty darn quickly.   And Jeremy is surely no virgin even though he plays one on TV. 

Too sexually aroused is my guess. Not that I know either, of course. But I feel as if I do have some experience of her massively-aroused-after-years-of-nuthin-but-repression state. And my experience suggests frustrating "premature" climaxes that she doesn't even really feel, followed by episodes of vaginismus, accompanied by no empathy or attempts at truly satisfying her by paying adequate attention to the, you know, clitoris, from a super-horny male who is nevertheless deeply conflicted about actual sexual pleasure, especially as experienced by women. Because Madonna. Whore. This is a man who preaches that all masturbation is Satanic and must be resisted. No way in heck he's without serious internal conflicts regarding sex, seems to me.

Who knows, of course?  But I would bet fairly heavily that my most probably scenario is at least as likely as the idea that these two are going to instantly have sex that's highly satisfying to a woman with Jinger's history. ANd then of course they'll have potentially years of the Do-we-severely-displease-our-Lord-Jesus-by-using-hellish-birth-control-or-do-we-risk-a-new-baby-we-can't-possibly-afford-every-time-we-indulge? thing.

I think it'd be lovely if she's a person who quickly and easily becomes someone who gets major sexual satisfaction easily. But I can't really look at Jinger and say I see a person for whom that's likely. Yeah, she's horny as all get out. But as far as I know, degree of horniness doesn't necessarily correlate to degree of sexual pleasure taken, especially for women.  Does it?

[Churchhoney]

2 hours ago, Marigold said:

I know where you're coming from with this...

I just think those two look like they are going to O at any moment just standing next to eachother.  Particularly Jinger.  Maybe she is TOO sexually aroused? I don't know enough about the horrible situations she has been through to even make an educated guess.

But she certainly looks ready to have some sex with No Jerk Off Jeremy.  Maybe they will have a lot of sexual dysfunction but from my TV screen, they look like they will get the job done and pretty darn quickly.   And Jeremy is surely no virgin even though he plays one on TV. 

But is this really how most women have "the big O!!!" that people are so excited about JInger having, on her wedding night even, as has been suggested? I'm seriously asking. In my experience and that of other women that I talk to about this IRL, it's absolutely not the way. But I only know my own circle of friends and my own experience.

I'm sure Jeremy will get a lot of relief from their wedding-night quickies. But Jinger? Marigold, I guess you're saying that that is the way it happens, in your experience. So if Jinger's in your category and not mine, then good for her. And I do feel pretty jealous of the -- I'm now wondering -- majority? of women for whom all the pleasure happens easily and quickly.

Still ... Jinger. .... Her whole look and affect to me have been that of a person who's not very comfortable with her own body, not very sensual, not very open or free in her emotions either. Is this the sort of person who easily orgasms in her first attempts at sex? I gotta say that remains baffling to me.

Edited October 12, 2016 by Churchhoney

[Whyyouneedaname]

wow, love sure has done a number on the Jinge, "have you ever been to a soccer game?" I don't think I have, I'm not sure, I've been by a soccer field. Grandma ask, "have you ever made homemade meatballs?" I don't think I have made homemade meatballs. Color me dumb, I have cooked a lot of things and I know for a fact I have never cooked homemade meatballs, just like I know whether I have been to a soccer game or not, geez.....

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, tenativelyyours said:

Or a choice that is imposed on one.  Jeremy may well be horrible in the sack.  His antiquated and rather antipathetic views on sexual matters may well indicate that he has had horrible sexual experiences and is self-aware enough to know part of the problem is him.  Or all the problem is him but he is in denial and therefore "Sex" is the problem.

I'm with churchhoney.

What's more I think Jeremy's "experience" whatever it is works strongly against them.  Jinjer's libido is like the Running of the Bulls at Pamplona.  But she has been coupled with someone who already has "been there" and already defined it pretty much it seems by his own publicly offered ideas and beliefs on the matter in general.

Sex should be fun.  And I don't get that from Jeremy.  Sex should be shared and equal with a couple.  Note how Jeremy is the "star" in every one of his stories about himself.  I know that sounds odd because when you talk about yourself, you obviously are going to focus on you in a way.  But with Jeremy it reminds me of the joke my siblings had when we still attended church but were already disillusioned with organized religion.  There was the "How Christ Came into My Life" witnessing tales and the "How I was Born Again".  Note the difference.  Both are ego driven a little.  But the second is all about "me" and that is how I see Jeremy's Journey to Holiness.  That does not bode well for a healthy sex life with a partner.  Plus he has more than once let slip he has a patriarchal view on the genders and their roles.  Another minus, a big one, in what the boudoir might hold in store for Jinjer.

And I don't see Jeremy quite as independent as others do.  I do think he is biding his time and I think Boob is underestimating just how much like himself Jeremy is.  But right now, behind the scenes, Boob is still the one Nancy has on her contact list I'm betting.  The difference with Jeremy is that unlike Bin or the Dullard, he knows exactly what that means and I suspect is not content with that to remain.  But he also knows Boob is still his path to greatness, and Jinjer is just a brick in that path.  I have less hopes than all the "Derrick is so going change Jill and the Duggars" talk when he first appeared because I think the Dullard has no clue despite the more worldly life.  Jeremy does know because he is born famewhore imo.   He will work with Boob for as long as it gets him to where he is going.    And right now, I do think Boob is controlling Jermey just fine.  I see a dancing monkey doing the marriage waltz for ratings and money.  And while the monkey might not be the breed the Boob prefers and he might eventually rip the Boob's face off metaphorically speaking.  Right now Jeremy is smiling, putting on the little coat and tilting the hat with his attempt at "roguish" charm and dance dance dancing the camera time away.

 

The sad thing is that Jeremy's potential break could be well past any time Jinjer has to grow and mature that marriage and a life outside the confines of Duggardom allows.  What's more I don't see Jeremy so much as expanding Jinjer's life as simply redefining when and if Jeremy sees his chance and throws off the Duggar influence.  I see it merely changing and perhaps even becoming more confined.  Boob is controlling but in a very limited and unimaginative way.  He is dated.  Jeremy is new and as we see in this episode has lived and even loved in a "normal" family atmosphere and yet he has made many of the same choices or even more extreme ones going by his "preaching" than Jinjer has had imposed on her.   And it is worrisome to me that someone that thinks in such a linear fashion in terms of sin, forgiveness and simple human failings will be in "charge of Jinjer" if Jeremy truly is this strong and independent person because right now?  Jeremy is extremely dependent on the Duggar machine no matter how broken it was and how wobbly it is now patched together.  And for someone like Jeremy and this strong independent man who will flaunt Boob's dominance every chance he gets?  That could be a really bitter patch Jinjer has to mind.  Jeremy seems to see things that don't go his way as obstacles -- his college life, his soccer career.  So what and where does that leave Jinjer if he sees the Boob and the whole Duggar way as being some kind of obstacle after he sought them out for whatever (coughagendacough) reasons?  Jinjer Duggar.  What seems to me right now a pretty obvious means to and end.

Even as simple and vapid as she is I feel sorry for her.  She is ready to crawl out from under the pile of crap her parents raised her in her whole life just to have the load of bricks that Judgey Jeremy land on her pimpled ass and she actually is being trained to not just accept but adore it.  How does she go forward to when there is any kind of disappointment or simple dissatisfaction in her marriage and she is basically on air being taught to simper, smile and gush over everything that is her husband?  It is a bit like watching a rescue animal being taught "crating

Wow, I agree with every word of this.

[SunnyBeBe]

I didn't see most of last night's episode.  I'll have to catch up, but, can someone tell me where Grandma Mary Duggar is? Does she still live with JB and Michelle?  I haven't noticed her around.  

[BitterApple]

4 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I didn't see most of last night's episode.  I'll have to catch up, but, can someone tell me where Grandma Mary Duggar is? Does she still live with JB and Michelle?  I haven't noticed her around.  

I think she's chained to one of those big front loaders in the laundry room. Hopefully someone remembers to bring her food and water.

[Natalie68]

20 hours ago, Adeejay said:

Once again, Jill gets a big beautiful mini mansion, while by comparison, Josh and Jessa have to make do with hovels.  What is that about?

When Jinger and Jeremy were at his grandmother’s house, there were several instances where they came close to kissing. It wouldn’t surprise me if they’ve already done so.  I noticed that Jeremy and Michelle side hugged for quite a while.  In the meantime, she won’t go within two feet of Derick.  Wonder why. 

BO and patchouli

[Natalie68]

18 hours ago, Sew Sumi said:

I don't know that Jill really understands the concept of girlfriends. All of her, um, friendly acquaintances have been people from their cult until she left for Danger America. Unlike Jessa, she didn't have anyone on her side of the wedding party who wasn't a sister or SIL, and I only think she asked Anna so she wouldn't feel excluded. Even now, Jill only reaches out to either the "spiritually dead" (TM) Derick, or ladies from the church who happen to be in the same bible class as she. We have never seen her with a real girl friend. 

Jessa is just as awkward, but at least she's trying. 

Jinger? Oh dear. 

I get why.  She most likely hasn't had any scintillating conversations with ANYONE, she cannot be trusted with a secret (family blabber), and is sanctimonious as hell.  I've never met her and she bugs the living shit out of me.  

I think she gets the big house because she KNOWS secrets that have not come out and as the family blabber she needed some incentive to keep it zipped.  That and she is Boobs favorite.  Or my personal fave, the stench coming off of them is so strong they needed a bigger house to waft the stench through.

[GeeGolly]

I'm not getting the same vibe as some of you. I see Jeremy stopping himself short of wanting to naturally kiss, hug and lovingly caress Jinger in a non-sexual way. And I see Jinger as teenager wanting to be snuggled and maybe, just maybe, wants to make-out (old term??) with her boyfriend. But I really think cuddling would do her just fine.

I'm not detecting any real sexual tension at all.

[riverblue22]

I don't much care about what kind of sex life Jinge ends up with.  My only opinion on the couple is that Babe, in the privacy of his one bedroom apartment, does not practice what he preaches.

[ariel]

21 hours ago, Evagirl said:

Lets be honest.  Don't you think J & J make an attractive couple?  

No, I think Jeremy is creepy &  I see a lot of red flags

[IndianPaintbrush]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

I'm not getting the same vibe as some of you. I see Jeremy stopping himself short of wanting to naturally kiss, hug and lovingly caress Jinger in a non-sexual way. And I see Jinger as teenager wanting to be snuggled and maybe, just maybe, wants to make-out (old term??) with her boyfriend. But I really think cuddling would do her just fine.

I'm not detecting any real sexual tension at all.

Yeah, I'm not seeing the horniness either.  That's not to say it won't happen after they marry. But she seems way too sheltered and he seems like someone who really needed a fundie wife.  Like right now.  

[Marigold]

5 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

I'm sure Jeremy will get a lot of relief from their wedding-night quickies. But Jinger? Marigold, I guess you're saying that that is the way it happens, in your experience. So if Jinger's in your category and not mine, then good for her. And I do feel pretty jealous of the -- I'm now wondering -- majority? of women for whom all the pleasure happens easily and quickly.

 

(we need a similing emoji)

Yep, definitely how it worked for me and my husband.  IFB but I never felt sexually repressed by it and as an adult, still don't feel that way.  We were both virgins and things worked out very well from the wedding night.  :) :) :)

Jinger looks so darn ready to just climb all over jeremy and get the party started! I bet things go well for her.  To me, she looks like she is halfway to an O on camera.  (hahaha) Jessa, Anna and Jill always looked for rather awkward and clumsy with the boyfriend/girlfriend.  Jinger does NOT look awkward or uncomfortable at all...the only thing that is uncomfortable for her is that she is not sitting on Jeremy's lap and doing some nasty.  

 

I agree with both posts about Jeremy being both independent and under Jim Bob.  I think he is currently complying nicely with Jim Bob but we all know that Jeremy can totally take a hike at any time and will be OK.  Josh and Ben cannot do that so they are completely stuck under Jim Bob.  Derick?  He is a mix...he floats around so he is hard to nail down exactly.  

Jim Bob hates that Jeremy has the potential to walk away any time he wants and take Jinge with him.  But Jeremy, for some insane reason, has chosen the Dug Life. Why?  That's what I would like to know.  There is IFB and then there is the Duggars....they are stupid fools by obsessive IFB standards.  Jeremy is chasing a Duggar for either fame or he is mentally unstable....I personally think Jeremy is very unstable. 

[Churchhoney]

59 minutes ago, Marigold said:

(we need a similing emoji)

Yep, definitely how it worked for me and my husband.  IFB but I never felt sexually repressed by it and as an adult, still don't feel that way.  We were both virgins and things worked out very well from the wedding night.  :) :) :)

Jinger looks so darn ready to just climb all over jeremy and get the party started! I bet things go well for her.  To me, she looks like she is halfway to an O on camera.  (hahaha) Jessa, Anna and Jill always looked for rather awkward and clumsy with the boyfriend/girlfriend.  Jinger does NOT look awkward or uncomfortable at all...the only thing that is uncomfortable for her is that she is not sitting on Jeremy's lap and doing some nasty.  

 

I agree with both posts about Jeremy being both independent and under Jim Bob.  I think he is currently complying nicely with Jim Bob but we all know that Jeremy can totally take a hike at any time and will be OK.  Josh and Ben cannot do that so they are completely stuck under Jim Bob.  Derick?  He is a mix...he floats around so he is hard to nail down exactly.  

Jim Bob hates that Jeremy has the potential to walk away any time he wants and take Jinge with him.  But Jeremy, for some insane reason, has chosen the Dug Life. Why?  That's what I would like to know.  There is IFB and then there is the Duggars....they are stupid fools by obsessive IFB standards.  Jeremy is chasing a Duggar for either fame or he is mentally unstable....I personally think Jeremy is very unstable. 

Well, we definitely continue to be on the same page on that one. For me, though, my feeling that he's unstable and that she's also unstable (albeit in probably a very different way) certainly plays into my feeling that they're not going to be great in bed together. Not that unstable people can't be massively orgasmic. But the ways in which I see these two as unstable make that really hard for me to imagine! .... Would like to be a fly on the wall, though.

[Marigold]

Church,

I wish we could joke about this in person! I just see those two as doing just fine! 

But seriously, yeah, they seem so unstable to me. Sex will probably be OK for a while or whatever.  But Jeremy is just such a wack...I see him as manically happy right now.  Wonder what he is like when the he is manically upset/depressed? Poor Jinge will find out and she is on a thin thread herself.  Could get messy.  

[Gemma Violet]

I thought it was funny at the end when Ben said something like, "I knew about it all day.  And I helped pick out the ring."  He reminded me of a 6-year old who wanted to make sure everyone was aware that he was in the know.

[kokapetl]

Jimbob via intercom:

Hey Michelle, come here real quick! come down stairs... real quick!

I figured out what's TLC gold! Inter-ethnic white marriages! Find Jana a Greek guy, Joseph a French girl, Josiah a Dutch guy. A west German for Jedidiah, and an East German for Jeremiah.

Bonus points for dwarves who can belt out a song! 

Edited October 13, 2016 by Kokapetl

[Spencer Hastings]

I'm shipping a show of just Ben and Jinger.  She affectionately called him "Benji" a couple of times and he seemed to really want everything to go well for her. He was more invested than her "best friend" Jessa was.  I need these two to be besties.

[becca3891]

17 hours ago, laurakaye said:

I'm really not getting why Jessa felt the need to bring it up at all...most of their loyal viewers are perfectly aware of their self-enforced dress code.  It is what it is, and while it's definitely not always logical (survival camp, firefighting, etc.), pointing out the change from skirt to shorts in order to go kayaking only draws more attention to something we already know about them.  Odd.

To be fair, I think it did need explanation because after years of claiming they could do anything in skirts, there they were in board shorts. This is not something Boob and Mechelle allow for the underage girls but now that Jinger is courting/engaged I think they decided to allow her to make that decision as her soon to be headship approves. So, it wasn't more of their same modesty talk; this is new. The new generation is slowly but surely abandoning Gothard.

16 hours ago, Marigold said:

OK, as an ex IFB, I'm lost with the board shorts.  The Bible verse strictly prohibits mens clothing, which is why you don't wear pants.  THEY WERE BEN'S BOARD SHORTS!!!  Not even womens board shorts.  They are MENS board shorts.    Duggar girls are wearing men's clothing that were bought in the men's department.  MIND BLOWN. 

Agreed! This is why I say it made sense that they felt the need to justify it. 

12 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

I just keep wondering why anybody thinks a frustrated horny ex-jock who's a "pastor" with extremely anti-sex views (any and all masturbation is inspired by the devil) and a seeker of "meek" women would ever ever ever be inclined or able to quickly assist to orgasm an incredibly sheltered super-Christian virgin who believed she was a miserable sinner from age five and was molested as a child, told to shut up about it, given no counseling, and, by some accounts, required to take on some of the blame and publicly forgive her abuser.  Plus, she has a mother who told Jessa of sex -- "Don't worry. It doesn't take long."

To me, that sounds like a surefire recipe for a couple with pretty long-term sexual dysfunction that'll last until they really work on changing things.  Or forever. Whichever comes first.

Or do I just know a lot of unusually sexually dysfunctional people? Because I and the vast majority of the non-Duggarish women I know didn't have earth-shaking orgasms early on in our first relationships. Most of the friends I've talked with about this didn't have any orgasms early on in their first relationships, in fact, let alone earth-shaking ones. And women who'd never consciously masturbated before those first sexual relationships? (as I pretty strongly suspect Jinger has not, since she's been molested and sleeps in a room with a multitude of baby sisters) I've never talked to anyone in that category who didn't take a very long time to learn to orgasm with a partner. And we're not talking former molestees who've had no counseling, either. And as far as Jinge's current horny high is concerned, I expect that's as likely to give her a frustrating female-premature-ejaculation-type experience as it is to give her an orgasm she'd fully experience and enjoy during intercourse. 

Do I just run in an exceptionally sexually dysfunctional crowd? Or are people being over-optimistic when they picture these great orgasms that Mr. Masturbation Is Deadly Sin! is supposedly going to quickly bestow on Miss I Am a Miserable Sinner, Look to Have Some Kind of Eating Disorder and Have a Mental/Emotional/Knowledgeableness Age of About 12! ?

This, this, this! As long as we're speaking frankly, aren't we going to acknowledge that even women with a healthy sex drive and attitude toward sex are unlikely to ever reach orgasm through intercourse? It's not how we're built, unfortunately. I guess it all depends on how much Babe knows how to use other body parts and whether he's willing, or considers that an abomination. To be fair to Boob and Mechelle, they do advocate that Intended for Pleasure book, which recommends that husbands massage the clitoris.

[GeeGolly]

I felt it was about time that Jessa, or someone explained why they weren't in skirts. Even though their explanation doesn't match the last ten years of them saying they can do anything in skirts. Michelle water-skied in a skirt and last week Jinger was in a paddle boat and go-cart in a skirt. We've seen them swimming in jean skirts. The girls did that wilderness adventure thing in skirts. And Jessa's explanation makes it like tossing on long shorts for certain activities is the norm for them. But at least she said something.

[bichonblitz]

23 hours ago, becca3891 said:

Oh, I laughed out loud when Jinger simpered, "You're so smart, Babe," at the revelation that you can put milk in a coffee cup before the coffee. But to someone with a Duggar IQ, it really must have been a stunning concept for her to behold. And any new thought or concept must be mind blowing in their world.

That coffee scene convinced me that in his mind, "worldly" Jeremy is marrying a sheltered virgin and is going to take great joy in being the adored man of the house and teaching Jinge all about life. And sex. She is going to lap up every single second of it. They way he was showing her how to put the milk in the cup first, then the coffee so you don't have to stir it was a little creepy and controlling to me. See, this way you don't have to dirty a spoon! Omg, What is she, six years old? Let her pour her coffee any fucking way she wants to. I can just see him teaching her how he wants his house cleaned, his laundry done, what groceries to buy, what to wear, etc....and she won't know any better than to hang on every word he says. 

Edited October 13, 2016 by bichonblitz

[AnnieBeez]

2 hours ago, becca3891 said:

To be fair, I think it did need explanation because after years of claiming they could do anything in skirts, there they were in board shorts. This is not something Boob and Mechelle allow for the underage girls but now that Jinger is courting/engaged I think they decided to allow her to make that decision as her soon to be headship approves. So, it wasn't more of their same modesty talk; this is new. The new generation is slowly but surely abandoning Gothard.

Agreed! This is why I say it made sense that they felt the need to justify it. 

This, this, this! As long as we're speaking frankly, aren't we going to acknowledge that even women with a healthy sex drive and attitude toward sex are unlikely to ever reach orgasm through intercourse? It's not how we're built, unfortunately. I guess it all depends on how much Babe knows how to use other body parts and whether he's willing, or considers that an abomination. To be fair to Boob and Mechelle, they do advocate that Intended for Pleasure book, which recommends that husbands massage the clitoris.

What?! This is the first time I'm hearing about it. I'm glad no one told me that when I was young.

Jeremy grew on me this episode. I like him saying that the bread was the right amount of stale. And his grandmother was a cutie. It's very interesting how much Michelle is in the background now. I wonder how she feels about that.

[GeeGolly]

Regarding the no-spoon coffee making. There have plenty of times when I have not had access to a spoon, maybe camping, at an outdoor social function, or at work. But in the scheme of things, avoiding washing one singular spoon in the comforts of a home seems pretty ridiculous to me.

[becca3891]

43 minutes ago, MischaMouse said:

What?! This is the first time I'm hearing about it. I'm glad no one told me that when I was young.

Jeremy grew on me this episode. I like him saying that the bread was the right amount of stale. And his grandmother was a cutie. It's very interesting how much Michelle is in the background now. I wonder how she feels about that.

Really? Yes, because the clitoris contains almost all the pleasurable nerve endings (it and the penis start off the same in utero), and the clitoris doesn't get stimulated much during intercourse for most women (bodies and positions do vary, of course), the majority of women need additional clitoral stimulation to reach orgasm. Popular culture has perpetuated the myth of the simultaneous orgasm in heterosexual sex, which is really quite ridiculous! Maybe I'm just weird that I've done so much research about it. But in any case, just because Jinger totally wants to jump Babe's bones, does not mean she'll get much pleasure out of it. At the risk of sounding pervy, I kind of wish I could be a fly on the wall, just for curiosity's sake!

30 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Regarding the no-spoon coffee making. There have plenty of times when I have not had access to a spoon, maybe camping, at an outdoor social function, or at work. But in the scheme of things, avoiding washing one singular spoon in the comforts of a home seems pretty ridiculous to me.

True! I guess she doesn't add any sweetener either, because you'd still need a spoon for that. I was chuckling at the traditionally sized tiny coffee cups, since Jinger is a coffee addict and in that episode where they "worked" for a day at the coffeeshop, she chugged through many huge cups.

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

I felt it was about time that Jessa, or someone explained why they weren't in skirts. Even though their explanation doesn't match the last ten years of them saying they can do anything in skirts. Michelle water-skied in a skirt and last week Jinger was in a paddle boat and go-cart in a skirt. We've seen them swimming in jean skirts. The girls did that wilderness adventure thing in skirts. And Jessa's explanation makes it like tossing on long shorts for certain activities is the norm for them. But at least she said something.

It did warrant an explanation, although as I think about it, it was disingenuous, as they so often are. If they were being honest, they would have spelled out that because they are adults, this is a recent departure from their parents' modesty guidelines, and that even though they have said for years that you can do anything in a skirt, they have come to the recent realization that they no longer quite believe that. Instead, Jessa muttered something about "it's still a modest length," and they tried to pass it off like nothing new was going on when it quite clearly was. 

[Grits]

I wish Anna would not be on the show. I don't like seeing her. Is she continuing to film because she knows that she was the one that made it possible for them to have a show in the first place. I see her and wonder how and why are you still filming. 

Jinger has become a new person. She looks and acts happier. She was so animated in the scene with the grandmaw. She looks like she wants to participate in activities like rowing. She used to act like she was over it. Now she is showing some personality. Is it all fake to win over Babe? It's so weird with these Duggars.  They start courtingand a new person emerges.  Is this the real Jinge?

Derick looks ill. His looks have changed. In the episode when he proposed to Jill, he looked like a nice clean cut guy. Now- he looks ill and unkept. This look isn't working for him.

It is interesting to watch the Duggars. As one who majored in Sociology, I'm fascinated by the characters on TV. They are playing a part, keeping secrets, trying to keep their skeletons in the closet. 

I think Anna's appearance are reminders to the audience of what happened with Josh. I wonder if Anna is at the point where she thinks that this show would have never happened without her. She will write a tell all and I can't wait to read it. They must be trying their hardest to keep Anna happy.

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, bichonblitz said:

That coffee scene convinced me that in his mind, "worldly" Jeremy is marrying a sheltered virgin and is going to take great joy in being the adored man of the house and teaching Jinge all about life. And sex. She is going to lap up every single second of it. They way he was showing her how to put the milk in the cup first, then the coffee so you don't have to stir it was a little creepy and controlling to me. See, this way you don't have to dirty a spoon! Omg, What is she, six years old? Let her pour her coffee any fucking way she wants to. I can just see him teaching her how he wants his house cleaned, his laundry done, what groceries to buy, what to wear, etc....and she won't know any better than to hang on every word he says. 

She's meek. That's what he said he wanted. And all of this could be a big part of why, seems to me.

[lookeyloo]

Those girls seem helpless and clueless as far as any domestic goddess skills so at least she won't have to unlearn anything!!

[Tabbygirl521]

2 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I felt it was about time that Jessa, or someone explained why they weren't in skirts. Even though their explanation doesn't match the last ten years of them saying they can do anything in skirts. Michelle water-skied in a skirt and last week Jinger was in a paddle boat and go-cart in a skirt. We've seen them swimming in jean skirts. The girls did that wilderness adventure thing in skirts. And Jessa's explanation makes it like tossing on long shorts for certain activities is the norm for them. But at least she said something.

Jinger pretty much flashed the audience when she climbed on that paddle boat. I flinched on her behalf. I am very glad they have decided to wear board shorts for active sports. Hey, a slogan! 

[Marigold]

2 hours ago, MischaMouse said:

What?! This is the first time I'm hearing about it. I'm glad no one told me that when I was young.

 

Hahaha! I'm with you on this one!  

Jinger looks so turned on  that at least she is half way there, even with TV cameras in her face.  If they are alone?  I think nature will totally run its course.  Sex might go well for the Vuolos...it's Jeremy's mental health that concerns me way more.  

Now Jill and Jessa looked a little more reserved and a little more awkward....like this was all very new and they had to navigate it a bit.  jinger looks like she is navigating things just fine.  ;)

Edited October 13, 2016 by Marigold

[becca3891]

3 minutes ago, Marigold said:

Hahaha! I'm with you on this one!  

Jinger looks so turned on  that at least she is half way there, even with TV cameras in her face.  If they are alone?  I think nature will totally run its course.  Sex might go well for the Vuolos...it's Jeremy's mental health that concerns me way more.  

Now Jill and Jessa looked a little more reserved and a little more awkward....like this was all very new and they had to navigate it a bit.  jinger looks like she is navigating things just fine.  ;)

But being turned on and wanting sex has nothing to do with how satisfied she will be from intercourse, is my point. Maybe it's not something you discuss with your sisters/friends, but trust me on this or look up statistics. It is the rare woman indeed who is able to reach orgasm from intercourse. It's kind of depressing to acknowledge. And this includes the many women who can effortlessly get there on their own with clitoral stimulation. So I still say there's a very good chance Jinger will be disappointed, no matter how much she's ready for sex. Obviously there are alternatives, but someone who vehemently preaches against masturbation may find them too worldly!

[truthtalk2014]

I really think Jinge is over the top happy.  First of all, she has a guy - but more importantly, she finally has someone paying attention to HER.  When you think about it, she has had no attention from her parents her whole life and no real friends outside of her siblings.  

Now, she gets a guy that is showing her lots of attention and a new family that thinks she is it on a stick.  Attention, attention, attention for Jinge.  She definitely deserves it after spending all these years organizing clothes and taking care of her siblings.  

[fuzzylollipop]

I am absolutely fascinated by this womanly orgasm topic. I hope Jessa or any female Duggar is reading this and blushing and Googling away.

Count me in as one completely surprised by a woman's difficulty to achieve an orgasm. I was a very sheltered (read: masturbation was bad in my household too and we weren't even religious) young girl and when I got into my first relationship at age 20, I decided to wait on sex. Take that Duggars, I was a 20 year old viginal alcohol drinking college attending atheist! Well needless to say that after a year and a half of nothing but making out in my life, I was exactly as revved up and ready to go as Jinger is. You could almost see the hormones emitting out of me too. Well to get to the point, I eventually gave up on my notions of saving myself for marriage and clumsily did the deed with that guy and there was no problem at all for me to...you know, get there.

I think Jinger will be fine the first couple of times at least. Once the novelty wears off and Jeremy boringly continues to climb on top of her missionary style for a full two minutes, then she'll be in trouble. 

I am now more fascinated in this topic than  the Duggars and I want the eventual tell all book to include hints about the average Duggar sex life, minus the helmet head couple! Not enough brain bleach in the world for that. 

[becca3891]

3 minutes ago, fuzzylollipop said:

I am absolutely fascinated by this womanly orgasm topic. I hope Jessa or any female Duggar is reading this and blushing and Googling away.

Count me in as one completely surprised by a woman's difficulty to achieve an orgasm. I was a very sheltered (read: masturbation was bad in my household too and we weren't even religious) young girl and when I got into my first relationship at age 20, I decided to wait on sex. Take that Duggars, I was a 20 year old viginal alcohol drinking college attending atheist! Well needless to say that after a year and a half of nothing but making out in my life, I was exactly as revved up and ready to go as Jinger is. You could almost see the hormones emitting out of me too. Well to get to the point, I eventually gave up on my notions of saving myself for marriage and clumsily did the deed with that guy and there was no problem at all for me to...you know, get there.

I think Jinger will be fine the first couple of times at least. Once the novelty wears off and Jeremy boringly continues to climb on top of her missionary style for a full two minutes, then she'll be in trouble. 

I am now more fascinated in this topic than  the Duggars and I want the eventual tell all book to include hints about the average Duggar sex life, minus the helmet head couple! Not enough brain bleach in the world for that. 

I'm going to PM you so no one gets too offended or thinks this conversation is over the top!

[Marigold]

35 minutes ago, becca3891 said:

But being turned on and wanting sex has nothing to do with how satisfied she will be from intercourse, is my point. 

i think she is, at least, on the right road. Being open to having sex, wanting sex etc is a good sign that things will be positive. 

Contrast Jinger with some of the other Dugs or real life Gothardites/religious extremsists of any group...they look so tense and awkward. They have issues at the starting gate.   I see Jinger's obvious lust as a good sign. ;)  Her mind is "going there" and so is her body.   

[becca3891]

Just now, Marigold said:

i think she is, at least, on the right road. Being open to having sex, wanting sex etc is a good sign that things will be positive. 

Contrast Jinger with some of the other Dugs or real life Gothardites/religious extremsists of any group...they look so tense and awkward. They have issues at the starting gate.   I see Jinger's obvious lust as a good sign. ;)  Her mind is "going there" and so is her body.   

Argh! My point is really getting lost here. Women with the healthiest sex drives imaginable still typically do not reach orgasm during intercourse. For 80 percent of us, the clitoris is placed too far to get the stimulation it needs. It has nothing to do with upbringing, lack of desire, awkwardness, etc. It is a source of great frustration, in fact, for many women. And it doesn't help that so many men are completely unaware of it. 

[bichonblitz]

3 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Regarding the no-spoon coffee making. There have plenty of times when I have not had access to a spoon, maybe camping, at an outdoor social function, or at work. But in the scheme of things, avoiding washing one singular spoon in the comforts of a home seems pretty ridiculous to me.

Oh, I totally agree, I never use a spoon and do the same thing as Jeremy. Creamer first, coffee next. My point in my post was that he was talking to her like a parent talks to a child.  She is really, really dim and he likes it that way. 

Edited October 13, 2016 by bichonblitz

[Marigold]

13 minutes ago, becca3891 said:

Argh! My point is really getting lost here. Women with the healthiest sex drives imaginable still typically do not reach orgasm during intercourse. For 80 percent of us, the clitoris is placed too far to get the stimulation it needs. It has nothing to do with upbringing, lack of desire, awkwardness, etc. It is a source of great frustration, in fact, for many women. And it doesn't help that so many men are completely unaware of it. 

Oh, I totally understand you!  Your point is clear.  

I'm just hoping that at least she has lust going for her. She is showing a healthy interest in sex and that will work to her advantage in things being good for her OR she will encourage Jeremy to get things good for her.  Jinger looks highly motivated! (hahahaha)

We all know people who look like they have issues at Step 1.  Jinge is, at least, past Step 1. 

[Whyyouneedaname]

I had the 'Proposal in the City" episode playing while getting ready for work this morning, you know just background noise. Jinge has definitely been watching TV, when Jeremy asked if she had been to a soccer game, and I know I've commented on this earlier but it just baffles me at the stupidity, "I've drove by a soccer field" is she doing a pitch for the Holiday Inn Express? Wow, just wow.

[Absolom]

2 hours ago, Grits said:

I wish Anna would not be on the show. I don't like seeing her. Is she continuing to film because she knows that she was the one that made it possible for them to have a show in the first place. I see her and wonder how and why are you still filming. 

I think the easy answer is money.  Josh can't be on the show to get a share of the episode payment so Anna has to do the duty. 

[Churchhoney]

1 hour ago, becca3891 said:

Argh! My point is really getting lost here. Women with the healthiest sex drives imaginable still typically do not reach orgasm during intercourse. For 80 percent of us, the clitoris is placed too far to get the stimulation it needs. It has nothing to do with upbringing, lack of desire, awkwardness, etc. It is a source of great frustration, in fact, for many women. And it doesn't help that so many men are completely unaware of it. 

Exactly. And my point is that I would place a fairly big bet on Jeremy either being one of those men who's unaware of it, or, worse, one of those men who's decided that the whole thing is sinful so he's going to have his own quickies and ignore the whole issue beyond that -- which would include ignoring Jinger's desires and issues.

Given that absolutely nutso masturbation sermon and his whole crap about "meekness" and his probably fairly prolonged recent period of deliberate celibacy because -- I'm guessing -- something occurred to him about Satan, there's no way he doesn't have some major sexual hangups, it seems to me.

And for a super-Christian male, one very obvious place for those hangups to hang out is in a big old Madonna-Whore complex that makes them, shall we say, not very receptive to the idea that a wife may want some encouragement and assistance in getting her quickie or slow-ie. He married a Madonna, not a damn whore like those ones he knew in college and when he played sports.

I mean, ask yourself: Why the heck did he pick a quasi-12-year-old absurdly innocent Duggar virgin who's so much younger than himself and who knows literally nothing and who, it seems, can barely summon even teenage levels of speech or thought, when, as we seem generally to agree, he's almost certainly had a decent dollop of experience with modern non-Gothardy women who aren't like that at all? Because they were Whores, perhaps, and now, for some sick or at least inchoate reason, he must have an absolutely unquestioned Virgin/Madonna? Why should that be? And does that suggest anything like a healthy sexual atittude? I'd suggest NO.

And she pleases him by being "meek." Is somebody as ignorant and seemingly self-hating as Jinger going to protest if he generally ignores her pleasure-capacities in bed. (Because only Whores have those. Because Satan. And Jeremy just had to have the most virginy virginest of all possible virgins. For some reason.)

Plus, lest we forget, Jinger was almost certainly a molestation victim -- and an awake and aware one, most likely -- at a very early age. And then, most likely, was prevented from talking about it, dealing with it, etc.

And -- around the very same time as molestations were happening to her and all around her, in her tiny overcrowded bedroom, the laundry room, the living room, eventually between her legs -- she became aware that she was a miserable unredeemable sinner. At age 5.

And the whole, huge molestation event was never ever ever really talked about or dealt with because these are the rug-sweeping Gothard-y Duggars, who were trying to get into the Senate and then onto TeeVee as the New Waltons. .... So this unredeemable little-kid sinner most likely buried the whole ugly world-shaking intra-family molestation event deep deep deep, where it's just lying there, in silence, after all these years, waiting to be triggered. as such events do lie in wait in everybody I've ever known who's experienced anything similar. They're unexploded bombs. And, as far as I've ever heard, they will explode and hurt you or at least totally freeze you when the right moment presents itself.

So how is it remotely possible that a woman with that history -- and coming from a family where she was never allowed for one instant to express or even have her own thoughts and feelings -- isn't going to have some major sexual hangups and issues when she marries her very first boyfriend and first handhold and first hug and first crush and first even casual boy friend or boy acquaintance at the ripe old, but utterly and completely innocent and incredibly (up to now) repressed age of 22? And then is massively suffused with wild lust (which, in fact, she may well have felt a bit of back when she was little and you-know-what happened, and she was already Satan's plaything in need of redemption by the blood of Christ.) How will this not trigger some utterly unresolved issues related to physical sexuality?

Seriously, with all this stuff going on, if Jinger quickly settles into the easy, happy, orgasmic, mutually joyful sex life that you guys are predicting for her, then I think we'll have to conclude that she is, in fact, the very luckiest person on earth. Because the odds are stacked miles high against that, the way it looks to me!

Edited October 13, 2016 by Churchhoney

[Marigold]

Maybe my own life experiences color my opinions but some of those IFB women are pretty enthusiastic about sex and so are their husbands.  I was a married IFB woman and no one sounded very frustrated.  They could be lying but I doubt that because they were truthful about other things.   I truly believed that most couples were pretty darn happy in a physical relationship. I myself was always happy.  ;)  I was always taught that anything in the confines of marriage was acceptable.  Oral sex, etc was acceptable.  A good sexual relationship with your husband was considered an ideal to attain.  

Now, the molestation is another story. There's a lot going on in that situation.  Not sure how Jinger processes and deals. 

Jeremy?  Yeah...I don't know about him. His anti masturbation talk is typical for the religious....I don't think it necessarily means that you won't pleasure your wife. I think Jeremy is a nutcase for other reasons.  But he might really love meek Jinger and wants to make her happy.  

I guess I really believe that love goes a long way in this area.  ;)

[DangerousMinds]

But I don't think they know what real "love" is. It is not lust or infatuation. They truly don't know each other, and in Jinger's case, she doesn't know even herself.