Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[Saylii]

Unless the girl comes forward, there's no way that this will currently sink Josh's career. I have my doubts that the girl was named in the original investigation documents. If InTouch got the documents through the FOIA, the girl's name would have definitely been mentioned. I can't imagine RadarOnline & InTouch would keep that information to themselves even if they had to leak it, especially since it's the only thing that makes the story legitimate.

I do find this part of their website interesting now:

"Josh: As I became a teenage young man I was constantly tempted to have lots of wrong thoughts, and often battled to keep my heart right. One of the greatest things that helped me in my struggles was my parent’s commitment to accountability. They were faithful to talk with each one of their children – if we were willing to share honestly & openly with them – to maintain a clear conscience. I learned quickly that great freedom can be achieved by accountability, and great accountability requires humility & openness. I often had failures in my early teenage years, but found I had a clear conscience only when I was willing to confess my thoughts and temptations quickly to God & my parents."

I'm beginning to think that GEML's speculation is most on point and the labeling this as sexual abuse is a way to bring this family down through yellow journalism.

[Darknight]

I don't think Josh did anything wrong per say. He probably had hand sex or heck just frontal hugged a girl. JB thinks that's sinning. On the other hand in fundie land abuse often gets swept under the rug.

[becca3891]

 

On the other hand in fundie land abuse often gets swept under the rug

That's for sure. We know the Bill Gothard and Doug Phillips claims have been verified. If anyone is familiar with Joshua Harris, of "I Kissed Dating Goodbye" fame, he came forward in 2013 to say he was sexually abused by someone in his church when he was a boy.

 

As for Josh, I will not condemn him since all of this sounds very hard to validate. Hopefully the "failings" were nothing more than masturbation. In their world, that's a major moral failing and a big deal.

[GEML]

I wonder if they were campaigning. That would explain the state police. They might have been in a hotel. The girl might be Gothard, but she might also be a caimpaign volunteer, who was far more "worldly" than Josh and thought it was no big deal.

[Fuzzysox]

Unless the girl comes forward, there's no way that this will currently sink Josh's career. I have my doubts that the girl was named in the original investigation documents. If InTouch got the documents through the FOIA, the girl's name would have definitely been mentioned. I can't imagine RadarOnline & InTouch would keep that information to themselves even if they had to leak it, especially since it's the only thing that makes the story legitimate.

I do find this part of their website interesting now:

"Josh: As I became a teenage young man I was constantly tempted to have lots of wrong thoughts, and often battled to keep my heart right. One of the greatest things that helped me in my struggles was my parent’s commitment to accountability. They were faithful to talk with each one of their children – if we were willing to share honestly & openly with them – to maintain a clear conscience. I learned quickly that great freedom can be achieved by accountability, and great accountability requires humility & openness. I often had failures in my early teenage years, but found I had a clear conscience only when I was willing to confess my thoughts and temptations quickly to God & my parents."

I'm beginning to think that GEML's speculation is most on point and the labeling this as sexual abuse is a way to bring this family down through yellow journalism.

ITA without the girl involved the story is hard to believe. That is what I was trying to say about the girl last night that Radar could easily have her name via a FOID request unless she wasn't named because she was a minor?

 

I can NEVER see Boob turning his son in more of Boob sending Josh off to Alert is more his MO.

 

Yet another Radar story. Wow they are really scrambling to find someone to "talk" if they are asking Suzy Keller.

 

http://radaronline.com/celebrity-news/josh-duggar-sex-scandal-family-keeps-quiet/

Edited May 21, 2015 by Fuzzysox

[CofCinci]

I wonder if they were campaigning. That would explain the state police. They might have been in a hotel. The girl might be Gothard, but she might also be a caimpaign volunteer, who was far more "worldly" than Josh and thought it was no big deal.

Campaign volunteer... Interesting. Perhaps that's when they started shouting Nike.

[Saylii]

ITA without the girl involved the story is hard to believe. That is what I was tryig to say about the girl last night that Radar could easily have her name via a FOID request unless she wasn't named because she was a minor?

It never went to trial, so her name wouldn't be sealed. Reputable journalism wouldn't mention the name, but it's not illegal especially since she's no longer a minor. I would expect if they knew her name, it'd be similar to how Anna/Chickadee's got released in the Honey Boo Boo scandal. Everyone suspected it was her, it got leaked by a couple of places who said they had read testimony, and finally she had to agree it was her.

I could easily see Jim Bob taking Josh to the police as an accountability stunt, but not giving the name of the girl at the time. Since it was never followed up, there was no investigation done to unearth the name.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Saylii

[NEGirl]

This is trending on facebook and all over social media. I do not think Josh did anything more than probably kissing the girl. Being alone in a room with a girl is enough to get him in trouble in fundy land. They can not do anything that is not considered offense by that crazy bunch. I think JB did it to scare him. If it was a true sexual assault type incident the case would have been referred to the local Prosecutor's Office for investigation.

 

I agree,  Josh has learned the hard way how lacking in education he is. He has a right to be angry and upset. His a**hole parents deprived him of a basic education even the poores kids get. If he really wants it, it is never too late to get an education. It's hard work and I am not sure if Josh has that in him.

[merylinkid]

ASbsolutely wild theory:    JimBoob turned in his son in 2005 for something the rest of us consider normal, kissing, hugging, whatever.   Why?  Because it was another form of control of his child.   You behaved in a way that I the head of household consider wrong, now you must be punished.   Nothing happened because the rest of the world is sane compared to the Duggars.   The fundies shunned JB because they saw was a moron he was and dangerous to the cause.   No one blaed Josh because his dad was an idiot.

 

Fast forward to 2015 and the story comes out.   Who did it?   Well, Josh has been acting more independent.   Even liking his FRC job and showing he is not coming back to Arkansas and living under JB's thumb anymore.   So JB leaks the story.    He hopes it will get more attention and cost Josh his job.   Thereby giving Josh no choice but to slink back to Arksansas so JB can show how right he is once again that leaving his authority only leads to woe.

 

Considering how competitive JB is and how much attentionJosh gets apart from being just 1 of 19, I can see JB's insecurities taking over.  "Oh my goodness, my son is going to overshadow me, must stop this now."   So he does something like this.

[Fuzzysox]

I'm sure as the kids grow they all realize what a great disservice was done to them by not having an education.

 

From what we saw on the interview show everyone didn't look happy and more fearful than anything else. You have to wonder if the Radar story has been sitting around someone's desk ready to be leaked and they asked the Duggars for a statement before it went to print? That would make sense as to the tension in that living room that night. Jill was just plain strange. IDK something was off.

 

There has to be a point were they walk away from Gothard and his krazy religion/cult. Maybe not now but down the road when the littles have no one to stop them. 

ASbsolutely wild theory:    JimBoob turned in his son in 2005 for something the rest of us consider normal, kissing, hugging, whatever.   Why?  Because it was another form of control of his child.   You behaved in a way that I the head of household consider wrong, now you must be punished.   Nothing happened because the rest of the world is sane compared to the Duggars.   The fundies shunned JB because they saw was a moron he was and dangerous to the cause.   No one blaed Josh because his dad was an idiot.

 

Fast forward to 2015 and the story comes out.   Who did it?   Well, Josh has been acting more independent.   Even liking his FRC job and showing he is not coming back to Arkansas and living under JB's thumb anymore.   So JB leaks the story.    He hopes it will get more attention and cost Josh his job.   Thereby giving Josh no choice but to slink back to Arksansas so JB can show how right he is once again that leaving his authority only leads to woe.

 

Considering how competitive JB is and how much attentionJosh gets apart from being just 1 of 19, I can see JB's insecurities taking over.  "Oh my goodness, my son is going to overshadow me, must stop this now."   So he does something like this.

Nah Boob would never ruin his "brand." Has to be someone that has a grudge against them or something that they did.

[Barbie]

Someone that has a grudge?  Maybe a rejected suitor?

[Fuzzysox]

Someone that has a grudge?  Maybe a rejected suitor?

Or a bad business deal.

[Saylii]

I've been doing a little digging on the officers involved in the story to try and solidify a timeline.

 

Joseph Hutchens is the State Trooper reported to be the investigator on this case and later convicted of child pornography charges.  Hutchens retired from the Arkansas State Police in May 2004.  http://policecrime.proboards.com/thread/3973/officer-joe-hutchens-child.  If he took Jim Bob and Josh's statements as an active State Trooper, Josh would have been 15 or a young 16.  One scenario I could see is that Jim Bob and Hutchens were friends.  Jim Bob took Josh to see Hutchens after he had already retired, thinking this would be a good way to scare Josh into accountability while not actually involving the police.  Hutchens then opened an investigation, either through himself or through a proxy at the department which pissed off Jim Bob's political friends who wouldn't want something like that public.  This would also better fit the late 2004/2005/Josh was 17 narrative that's floating around.

 

Hutchens then worked as a bailiff "for almost a year" until sometime 2005, when he was arrested on child pornography charges.  He wasn't convicted until January 2007 of those charges.  http://www.nwaonline.com/news/2012/jun/01/retired-trooper-sentenced-56-years/?print.  If the case was actually reported back in early 2004, the statute of limitations was already almost expired by the time Hutchens' cases could have been seriously looked into.

 

Hutchens was arrested again in 2010 for violating the parole of his 2007 sentence.  He was convicted in 2012 of his 2010 arrest.  I suspect this is when his cases were really looked into, as there are a lot of quotes of him saying that he was sorry for disappointing the department - something that didn't happen back in 2007.

 

Darrel Hignite is the current officer assigned to the case through the Springdale Police Department.  According to his LinkedIn, he has worked for the department since 1998.  The case could have been assigned to him at any time.  https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=187296206&authType=name&authToken=54AX&goback=

 

I can't find anything that says when the Springdale Police got the case, only that it was years later.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Saylii

[Happyfatchick]

Recently, after the Willis family came on the scene, I posted that to get back in the ratings game the Duggars needed some DIRT to get people to reinvest in them. We all know we aren't the only ones reading the blogs. Did TLC leak accidentally on purpose?

[Fuzzysox]

Recently, after the Willis family came on the scene, I posted that to get back in the ratings game the Duggars needed some DIRT to get people to reinvest in them. We all know we aren't the only ones reading the blogs. Did TLC leak accidentally on purpose?

Could be just about anyone at this point. I think Radar has a send us a story button. It could even be anyone of the groups that FRC hates.

[Ljohnson1987]

Get ready for the Duggars to deny this.  If it's true, shame on them. They're more awful than anyone thought.

[Boton]

ASbsolutely wild theory:    JimBoob turned in his son in 2005 for something the rest of us consider normal, kissing, hugging, whatever.   Why?  Because it was another form of control of his child.   You behaved in a way that I the head of household consider wrong, now you must be punished.   Nothing happened because the rest of the world is sane compared to the Duggars.  

 

I don't know what to think about this particular news, and I hasten to say that, even for people as batshit crazy as the Duggars, I'm not going to make judgments until and unless something concrete comes out.  No one deserves that, especially someone who was legally a child at the time of the "crime."

 

But in general, what concerns me about this type of fundie is that calling the cops on your own child seems pretty in-character.  If you truly believe that any sexual experimentation is an immediate path to damnation, then it quickly follows that you have to do anything in your power to stop said experimentation.  I mean, these are people who believe that holding hands should be reserved for engaged couples, and that kissing belongs exclusively in a marriage.  And while I support anyone's decision to save some sexual acts for marriage, there's a difference between doing that and believing that any physical contact is literally the road to hell.  I can easily see someone like a family patriarch involving the law to stop his child from doing something sexual.

 

Where I'm trying to be careful is by not assuming that (if indeed this even happened), that something that horrifies them would horrify me.  For me, it would take an actual act of pedophilia to get me to involve the law on my own child.  For a fundie, it may be a single episode of rounding second base.  If it's something like the latter, I won't be changing my opinion of someone negatively for having a normal human urge and emotion.

 

ETA:  I feel constrained to point out that I wrote this post after it was released that Josh had underage interactions with a girl, but before I heard any news that it involved his sisters.  While I still don't actually know what happened, and while I'm still careful about any opinions I form about a "perpetrator" who was himself a child at the time, the new information changes my feelings.  Originally, I was assuming the event in question was more along the lines of experimentation between two young, non-related teens.

Edited May 22, 2015 by Boton

[VioletNevermind]

Recently, after the Willis family came on the scene, I posted that to get back in the ratings game the Duggars needed some DIRT to get people to reinvest in them. We all know we aren't the only ones reading the blogs. Did TLC leak accidentally on purpose?

 

I've had a weird feeling ever since the first episode of "The Willis Family."  It seemed obvious to me that they were being presented as the Duggar alternative.  The similarities are just crazy, even down to the J names.  I think the Willis family is a bit more likable and certainly less fundie.  The mom appears to have a vested interest in raising her own kids and I haven't seen any signs of buddy teams or jurisdictions.  I don't think the timing of their TLC debut was a coincidence.

[Adiba]

While I am no supporter of Josh and the FRC, I am of the camp that thinks something doesn't mesh with this story as is. Where is a copy of the report? Was an actual allegation made by the alleged victim, or did JB just take Josh to a state trooper to teach him a lesson?.. And so on.

It has also crossed my mind that digging up dirt could be a political move, and not necessarily from the left, but from a rival faction in Ark. that may be wanting to thwart any more campaigns by JB or and local aspirations that Josh might have? Not saying that Josh is some big political force (esp. In DC), but he may someday want to run in Ark for a local or state post (?)

[ChicksDigScars]

I'm certainly no fan of Smuggar, but in the judgmental and puritanical eyes of Jim Bob and MEE-chelle, what justifies hauling your underage, teen son to the cops for having (what just might be) a make out session with another teen? These people won't even allow their children to kiss their fiancees! Or hold hands until they're engaged. Or go on a date alone. Or Skype without lurking in the background like pervs, listening the whole time. 

 

Comments on all these gossip sites are calling for cancellation, similar to what happened with Honey Boo Boo's show. I don't think they're remotely the same. In that case, an adult man had molested a young child, served prison time for the crime, and June was allowing him access to another child (plus two teenage girls). THAT was completely justified.

 

I remember the talk and speculation years back on TWOP about the rumors of Josh being caught with a Holt girl. When did the Duggars work side by side campaigning for Jimmy Lee Holt? I remember one of the early TLC Duggar specials, which predated Anna, the two families were ice skating and the camera caught Josh chatting up a Holt girl (which in Gothardland is just as good as making out).  I think it may have been the first or second Duggar special. The girls were still wearing prairie dresses and Josh was skinny. 

 

Okay, this "feeling sorry for Josh" thing is weird. I never thought this would happen to me!

 

The only thing we know about that time frame is that the Duggars and the Holts had a falling out, and it appears that the Holts and Huckabees aren't completely ready to forgive and forget,

 

There was definitely a falling out. They went from having dinner and social gatherings together, campaigning for Holt and promoting this relationship on camera, to never mentioning or socializing with them again. I find Josh sneaking out with a Holt more plausible than Josh messing with Amy or a sister. Is Holt still in politics? That would also explain a lack of a victim coming forward. They don't want the negative publicity. Only in Gothadland would a girl be shamed for being named as a "victim" of a sex crime, or for even being caught simply making out with a boy. 

 

Have any of the Holts been seen as wedding guests at any of the three Duggar weddings? I know we spot some of the other Fundie families in background shots (or actually participating, like Erin Bates, physically assaulting piano keys during the ceremony). 

Edited May 21, 2015 by ChicksDigScars

[Dawn16]

I'm not going on TV Duggars, I'm going on politics Duggars. The only thing that we KNOW is that there was a monumental break with the Republican political establishment and Jim Bob that continues to this day. This establishment crushed him when he tried to run for the Senate and there is SOME kind of story there, but I've never been able to figure it out, and it's not my state and its not my party, so I don't have any insider access.

The only rumor that ever circulated was the Josh and Holt daughter rumor, which might have a germ of truth to it despite all the nonsense about it with the internet stuff.

HOWEVER, as I've mentioned repeatedly, there seems to be no animosity shown to Josh by the Arkansas political establishment. If there was, there is no way he would have been hired by the FRC. Huckabee is too powerful. One call would have ended that. He was hired DESPITE his father, which I've always found rather interesting.

So if the reason the political establishment black balked Jim Bob had anything to do with Josh, no one there blames Josh. Except maybe Jim Bob. But again, those have only been internet rumors that it had anything to do with Josh at all.

But if Jim Bob were foolish enough to publicly denounce his son, even if he had been accused of something (first rule of politics, deny deny deny) that might have done it. And to your own child. Google Huckabee's son for comparison. You don't admit, preemptively, to ANYTHING. That shows you to be a rank amateur.

And what if THAT caused the break? Josh was caught sneaking into a girl's room, the father threatened to press charges, JB thought he was smarter than everyone else in the room and could handle it and give Josh a good scare. There's a (possibly not even serious) report written up, girl admits she gave as good as she got, no charges brought, Jim Bob is known as the idiot who turned in his own kid, Josh is shown to be normal kid from freak family, and political establishment cuts JB off.

There you go.

That theory makes a lot of sense to me.  A man who rambles on camera, while visiting his daughter, about whether there's a problem with his plumbing or his wife's is NOT a savvy person. He has done countless things that are bad for his image because he's basically a clueless adolescent, like humping his wife on a double date with his pure daughter.  It would be very in character for Jim Bob to contact the police, maybe an officer he knows personally or maybe not, as a method to scare his kids into behaving the way he wants them to.  And any politician who knew he was that clueless would want nothing to do with him, while sympathizing with his poor son. 

 

Didn't Jill and Derek's chaperone (James?) tell us that, if they broke the rules, he would call the police?  At the time, I assumed he was just a kid who knew that you call the police when someone does something bad, but maybe Jim Bob has used that as a warning and Josh as an example that he means it. 

[Literata]

The most heartbreaking thing about this, to me, is that Smuggar -- and all the rest of the kids -- should be able to count on unconditional love from their parents, and the fact that Boob allegedly took his son to the police station for something that's sounding increasingly minor and ridiculous is pretty much unforgivable.

[Bean421]

This story just hit another board that I frequent. NONE of these women have previously mentioned following the Duggar family. They are all congratulating Boob for being brave and turning in his son. Especially since the unhealthy attitudes about sex in fundamentalism often breed predatory behavior. I tried to say that we should exhibit some caution before leaping to the worst conclusion about someone who was a minor. Apparently I'm contributing to rape culture now.   I never thought I'd see the day when I felt bad for Smugger, but here we are.

[ChicksDigScars]

Again, this is from memory, but I recall Josh getting to second base with a girl that he was with when the Holts & Duggars were traveling together on a political tour around Arkansas with a few other families. There may have been a campground involved and everyone was in tents? Holt lost the election and basically blamed the Duggars (and Josh's wandering hands) for that loss. Then Josh went to ALERT and JB tried to hitch his wagon to the Huckabees.

 

THIS. I also remember it this way. And I can totally see MEE-chelle, the flaming hypocrite, who in high school, "famously" mowed the lawn in a bikini, participated in cheerleading and actually got to date normally, having a bug eyed, kewpie doll voiced, hissy fit over Joshie touching a boob. This is the same woman who nearly lost her shit over her daughter holding her almost-fiancee's hand IN PRAYER at the dinner table.  

Edited May 21, 2015 by ChicksDigScars

[JoanArc]

I believe Josh campaigned for Holt while he owned the carlot. He had signs up supporting Holt anyway.

[Fuzzysox]

THIS. I also remember it this way. And I can totally see MEE-chelle, the flaming hypocrite, who in high school, "famously" mowed the lawn in a bikini, participated in cheerleading and actually got to date normally, having a bug eyed, kewpie doll voiced, hissy fit over Joshie touching a boob. This is the same woman who nearly lost her shit over her daughter holding her almost-fiancee's hand IN PRAYER at the dinner table.  

Believing anything Gothard says is just plain strange to me. The man makes shit up then people follow him? Maybe I'm too head strong, educated and question everything to ever be a part of his cult.

 

Seriously Boob and MEchelle were horny as hell for each other as teenagers and the only way they could be together was to get married so they could have sex.

 

How can they not understand what their kids went through/are going through when they hit their teenage years. All that suppression someone is bound to explode. 

Edited May 21, 2015 by Fuzzysox

[VioletNevermind]

This story just hit another board that I frequent. NONE of these women have previously mentioned following the Duggar family. They are all congratulating Boob for being brave and turning in his son. Especially since the unhealthy attitudes about sex in fundamentalism often breed predatory behavior. I tried to say that we should exhibit some caution before leaping to the worst conclusion about someone who was a minor. Apparently I'm contributing to rape culture now.   I never thought I'd see the day when I felt bad for Smugger, but here we are.

 

Sheesh.  This is going to be one of those stories that takes on a life of its own, regardless of the facts.  Either Jim Bob or Josh are going to HAVE to address this at some point if they want their show to remain on the air.  TLC will not hesitate for one moment to drop them like a bad habit if this makes them look bad, even after 10 years of ratings and revenue. 

Edited May 21, 2015 by SuzyLee

[Saylii]

Sheesh. This is going to be one of those stories that takes on a life of its own, regardless of the facts. Either Jim Bob or Josh are going to HAVE to address this at some point if they want their show to remain on the air. TLC will not hesitate for one moment to drop them like a bad habit if this makes them look bad, even after 10 years of ratings and revenue.

They won't make a statement unless the girl comes forward or is named. Saying he didn't do it would be false, saying it wasn't as bad as you think would undermine their beliefs, and saying he did it would cost them everything. I do think they'll rush Jessa's gender reveal to get something more positive in the spotlight.

[MMLEsq]

So, this story is not only trending on Facebook, but it's hit the "Wonderwall" on MSN.  I've got to believe some sort of statement will have to be made -- either by the Duggars or by TLC.

 

With nothing to go on other than gut instinct, my feelings are that IF the story is true, that Jim Bob wouldn't have taken Josh to the police station unless he was truly concerned that a crime had occurred.  Not just innocent kissing between two consenting teenagers, but an actual crime.  Prayers, discussions, sending a child off to some sort of camp -- yes, I can see them doing that.  But I don't see Jim Bob and Michelle involving the police unless (1) the victim was one of their daughters, a relative, or a family friend (which seems like it would almost have to be the case if Jim Bob was there when Josh left the girl's bedroom), (2) they were concerned that the victim was going to go to the police and wanted to get ahead of it, or (3) they are such upstanding citizens that they felt compelled to report the alleged crime.  I doubt it's #3, but I included it because I guess that could possibly be a reason why someone would voluntarily go to the police.    

Edited May 21, 2015 by MMLEsq

[OhioMom]

As far as dragging your kid to the cops: I dragged my 10 year old son to the cops when he and a friend thought they were engaging in harmless fun and threw rocks at a disabled (it was parked at a dealership, awaiting some type of body work) school bus, breaking several windows.   I don't feel like I'm a bad parent for it. That 10 year old is now a Captain in the Air Force, with a master's degree in criminal justice.  :)

[JenCarroll]

What did the cops do/say?

[OhioMom]

What did the cops do/say?

Well, I live in a very small town (think, "Mayberry, RFD"). They put the fear of God in him (or whatever you choose to believe in).  They finger printed him, although I'm pretty sure those fingerprints went in the trash after we left, and told him to stay on the straight and narrow from now on; they had their eye on him.  The other kid's mom didn't do anything to him.  That boy is not doing well today, I'm sorry to say, due to some bad choices he made later in life.

[GEML]

The Holts are still in politics.

I honestly can't see this costing Josh his job. There is no report, no young woman. Just some anonymous person in the tabloids claiming he saw the police report. C'mon, people. We're talking about DC here! Bill Clinton. Newt Gingrich! This is Nothing.

And if you think that because Josh works for the FRC they will hold him to a higher standard, then I have a bridge to sell you across the Potomac. This is, after all, a group formed claiming they are a persecuted minority, after all. Josh is in good hands professionally.

MY wild theory is that Rick Santorum leaked the memo when the Duggars backed Huckabee over him. He was perhaps the only politician who welcomed their support and they ignored him this time around.

I don't think this was released by an Arkansas political person to keep Josh from running, because it's too soon. You'd want to hang on to it until he actually WAS running. Releasing it now will make it old news when he does run. (But there is no reason to release it at all if he is planning to run. The Duggars aren't releasing this.)

And a Dem didnt release it because it's not being tied back to a political candidate. Seriously, this is how you can tell. If Dem were releasing it all of the reports would mention the Duggars were supporters of Mike Huckabee, because that would be in the press release. And media sources wouldn't have any reason to take that out, and indeed, would expand on it.

[CofCinci]

Like others, I'm feeling empathy for Josh, which is an new, odd feeling. Hopefully TMZ will get the documents and post them, allowing for the truth to come to light. I wholeheartedly believe his father reported consentual heavy petting between two curious teenagers in order to exert his control over his son. While I do not like positions and statements Josh has made in his career at FRC, I do feel for him because his career will soon be over, just as he was starting to become more independent from his father/family. I also feel for Anna and the kids as the paparazzi are not as kind and respectful as the cameramen who have followed the family for years.

[JoanArc]

http://www.salon.com/2015/05/21/hate_watching_the_duggar_sex_scandal_feeding_bottomless_appetites_for_hypocrisy_schadenfreude_and_shame/

 

 

While there’s maybe a small measure of satisfaction in imagining a self-righteous family being exposed as hypocrites, there’s ultimately nothing gratifying to be found in the borderline gleeful, gotcha-style excitement now swirling over the In Touch report. Either Josh Duggar actually did something wrong over a decade ago and got away with it, or a trivial incident has been blown wildly out of proportion. Either way, it’s a story with nothing in it to feel good about. Nothing at all.

 

This is probably the wisest commentary on the whole kerfuffle.

 

Tomorrow is Friday - I wish they'd just put out a press release with the truth (read: whatever the public will buy), then flood social media with cute pictures of Josiah & Marge, Jessa's belly, etc. All would quickly be forgotten.

 

Tangent - but who allegedly said the 'Sin in the camp' line - Jim Bob, a Holt, someone else? It would indicate how far the rumors had spread back then.

[MMLEsq]

Right now this is filed under the "Things That Make You Go Hmmmm." file in my brain.  (Anyone else old enough to remember that song from the late 80s/early 90s?)

 

I don't know whether the story is true or not.  I don't believe it just because some news outlets are running with the story.  However, the fact that the Duggars are not vociferously denying the allegations in this story makes me go hmmm.....If the Duggars come out with a statement that all of this is completely made up, well then someone would have to offer some sort of proof (the victim coming forward, a copy of the police statement, etc.), otherwise the story would probably die pretty quickly.  Not denying it -- which again, is not proof that the story is true -- is just adding momentum to the story spreading among the news outlets.  I think it's just human nature to believe that, if someone is accused of something that's despicable and they don't deny it at all, that maybe there might be some truth to it.   

 

ETA:  Now that I've seen the redacted report -- thanks Isthisok -- it looks pretty bad.  I still think it's generally better for the family to make some sort of statement than to just let the story take on a life of its own.

Edited May 21, 2015 by MMLEsq

[Isthisok]

The actual police report was posted by InTouch. It doesn't look good. It sure sounds like the most likely victims were his sisters. Why else would the victims all tell "James" (Dim Bulb) first? This is getting more fucked up by the hour.

http://www.intouchweekly.com/posts/bombshell-duggar-police-report-jim-bob-duggar-didn-t-report-son-josh-s-alleged-sex-offenses-for-more-than-a-year-58906

Edited May 21, 2015 by Isthisok

[Dawn16]

As far as dragging your kid to the cops: I dragged my 10 year old son to the cops when he and a friend thought they were engaging in harmless fun and threw rocks at a disabled (it was parked at a dealership, awaiting some type of body work) school bus, breaking several windows.   I don't feel like I'm a bad parent for it. That 10 year old is now a Captain in the Air Force, with a master's degree in criminal justice.  :)

I think this was a pretty common threat that was occasionally carried through ten or twenty years ago to the child's benefit, but today parents are less trusting of the police and protective services and are afraid of unintended consequences.  And savvy politicians would never create a record that could be used against them. 

 

Edited because there are additional allegations in the In Touch article that may put a different spin on things IF true. 

Edited May 21, 2015 by Dawn16

[Hpmec]

Isthisok, you just beat me to it. Names are blacked out, but the report strongly suggests that incest was at play here. This will do more than tarnish the Duggars squeaky clean image. It will destroy it.

[CarolMK]

Go to the Free Jinger thread for more information about this new development. I'm going to work and will catch up later tonight. With this police report, it does NOT look good for Josh. Appears this was going on for 2-3 years prior to Jim Bob calling the police and also appears that some of his sisters were victims. OMG. Wow, I'm just shocked.

I now think that TLC will have no choice but to either cancel their show or put it in hiatus for a long time. 

[autumnh]

Hopefully this will bring the Duggar train to an end....

 

Smuggar always well, seemed...creepy...like his father.

[JoanArc]

Oh dear, Isthisok's post is pretty damning. There goes the show.

[Andrews m]

My husband met one of the Prosecutors from Arkansas and she said that he molested his brothers. I have no more info than this for now, and if hubby knew I leaked this he would send me to the prayer closet.

[Bean421]

I really feel for Anna and the kids right now. That's some rough stuff to read.

[Andrews m]

My grammar was misleading. My hubby didn't molest his brothers. You know who did.

[Isthisok]

Five different minors... It makes me sick to think that this might have been the oldest five girls. I'm not saying he didn't possibly molest the brothers, but the report mentions fondling breasts.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Isthisok

[SoSueMe]

The actual police report was posted by InTouch. It doesn't look good. It sure sounds like the most likely victims were his sisters. Why else would the victims all tell "James" (Dim Bulb) first? This is getting more fucked up by the hour.

http://www.intouchweekly.com/posts/bombshell-duggar-police-report-jim-bob-duggar-didn-t-report-son-josh-s-alleged-sex-offenses-for-more-than-a-year-58906

Oh oh.

[JoanArc]

 

I really feel for Anna and the kids right now. That's some rough stuff to read.

I really hope she knew before she got married. You'd think someone would've pulled her aside.

[GEML]

Oh, this looks bad.

[Isthisok]

I really feel for Anna and the kids right now. That's some rough stuff to read.

I think Anna was from a different state far away and made an easy target to try to get Josh into a marriage and away from the temptations and defrauding behavior the devil was trying to lay at his feet, or however the fuck they word this stuff. I seriously doubt she knew. Her parents seem like genuinely good people. I really can't imagine they would have agreed to this marriage if this was a scandal that was talked about out in the open. Anna seems like a very compassionate person and a good mother, and I am as sad for her as I am for the victims.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Isthisok