Josh & Anna Smuggar: A Series of Unfortunate Events

[GeeGolly]

8 hours ago, Darknight said:

Europe is too advanced for him. I don't know any European fundies.

Your post also asked if Josh's past would effect him because he wasn't charged with anything. Employers often check potential candidates' online profile or digital footprint. Typing Josh Duggar into Google would bring up his past. I doubt he would even get a phone interview from anyone who Googled him.

[Aja]

24 minutes ago, new jersey devil said:

 

And honest question, but the word "redemption" is thrown around these parts quite a bit, but don't most here WANT the man to continue to fail, in the worst way possible?

Seems like it, to me..

 

Personally, I do not want Josh to fail. I want him to get real help and re-devote himself to his wife and his children, since she was saintly/insane enough to stay with him. But from the looks of things, I doubt that will happen. He won't be allowed. He's a tool for the cult now, and the only hope he has is to extricate himself from the cult's grip and learn about who he is as a man and not a Duggar appendage. Unlikely. And sad.

Thank you for your service. My father served as an officer in the USAF for 35 years and I grew up on military bases. Defense of freedom is rhetoric I'm familiar with and also deeply passionate about, which my father instilled in me from the day I was born. Freedom to believe and live as you want without causing harm to others is one of the most sacred freedoms humans have, and so it makes me very angry when I see people like the Duggars trying to take away the rights of others in the name of religion. The FRC business, Michelle's robocall--those are the threats to that freedom, as far as I'm concerned. I'm a gay woman, but I would never lobby the Arkansas state government to change laws that would take rights away from the Duggars because they aren't gay like I am, and heterosexual sex does not seem natural to me personally. That's the opposite of that beautiful freedom. I hope I'm making sense. If Josh, or anyone in the IFB cult, wants to spend their days on an internet forum ripping Aja a new asshole for being a disgusting lesbian, hey--go for it. But trying to change laws or block laws so that I cannot get married, or business can refuse to serve me, doctors can refuse to treat me, police can refuse to help me if I'm in danger because of "religious differences"---unacceptable. And that's the passion of the Duggars' existence.

Edited May 12, 2016 by Aja

[bigskygirl]

Josh can get the help he needs. He should not blame his lack of getting the proper help on his parents or Anna. He has a brain and a conscious. It is about time he starts using both.

[Darknight]

35 minutes ago, bigskygirl said:

Josh can get the help he needs. He should not blame his lack of getting the proper help on his parents or Anna. He has a brain and a conscious. It is about time he starts using both.

I agree he's a grown ass man

47 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Your post also asked if Josh's past would effect him because he wasn't charged with anything. Employers often check potential candidates' online profile or digital footprint. Typing Josh Duggar into Google would bring up his past. I doubt he would even get a phone interview from anyone who Googled him.

Forgot about that. Well Josh can still somehow find work. I know convicted felons who find work. It's hard but not impossible 

[Marigold]

I would like Josh to be well and live an emotionally healthy life. I wish his family well (anna and kids). I really do. 

I DO NOT want Josh to fail because if he fails, that could mean harm to another person. I want everyone to be safe. 

I also wish that he would get better counseling for himself. From what we have read, it doesn't seem he has worked with a licensed counselor specializing in his issues. (I hope he has!). Josh is a grown man and he really needs to take care of himself which will, in turn, help his wife and children. 

Edited May 12, 2016 by Marigold

[FakeJoshDuggar]

51 minutes ago, bigskygirl said:

Josh can get the help he needs. He should not blame his lack of getting the proper help on his parents or Anna. He has a brain and a conscious. It is about time he starts using both.

He also had a job that paid $100k a year as the director of FRC Action. He had a choice to go get real, authentic counseling or to go to bible jail. He made his choices and as BigSkyGirl pointed out, it's long past due for him to be responsible and accountable for his own actions.

[bigskygirl]

I may not agree with Josh's views, but I want him to be healthy emotionally and physically. When he is healthy, so will Anna and the children be healthy and happy. Imo, I do not think Josh and Anna (and possibly the children) are not in a happy, safe, or healthy place.

[Almost 3000]

2 hours ago, bigskygirl said:

Josh, on the other hand, can a flying leap at a rolling donut.

He'd probably like that. Eat it or screw it, Josh is obsessive about both.

[bigskygirl]

If a fellow poster is bothering you, the mods suggest using the Ignore Button Feature. Please remember not everyone will agree with your thoughts and opinions. Stating your personal views without attacking other posters is the way to go. We do appreciate your cooperation and patience. Thank you.

[Fallacy]

I have a question. If someone is charged with a sex crime as a juvenile offender (under the age of 18), they don't stay on the sex offender registry after their release, right? I ask because Josh was 14-15 when he offended but he basically will forever be a public sex offender thanks to the Internet. If he wasn't a celebrity, if he was just some random 14-15 year old, his record would be expunged and he wouldn't be on the registry, right? In my mind, that fact means that Josh is currently facing tougher consequences for his sex crime today than he would if he wasn't a celebrity. 

I really am not sympathizing with him at all here. I just disagree with the claim that Josh hasn't had to deal with any consequences for his actions. I would think the entire world knowing what he did and hating him for it forever and always is a pretty big consequence. 

[JoanArc]

Josh never went to trial or was convicted. He's not (technically) a sex offender.

[farmgal4]

On May 9, 2016 at 7:51 PM, Sew Sumi said:

I hate to be the bearer of bad news regarding the fake pigtails, but check out poor Meredith in THIS video probably made this past week: 

 

On May 9, 2016 at 7:51 PM, Sew Sumi said:

I hate to be the bearer of bad news regarding the fake pigtails, but check out poor Meredith in THIS video probably made this past week: 

[farmgal4]

1 hour ago, bigskygirl said:

I may not agree with Josh's views, but I want him to be healthy emotionally and physically. When he is healthy, so will Anna and the children be healthy and happy. Imo, I do not think Josh and Anna (and possibly the children) are not in a happy, safe, or healthy place.

If you meant that Josh and Anna are NOT in a good place, I agree.  I think Josh is just going thru the motions.  I think that, deep down, it will be a long, long time before Anna can really trust Josh again, if ever.  I know from experience how miserable it is being in a relationship with someone you can't really trust.  Trust is the cornerstone of a good relationship IMO.

[ariel]

1 hour ago, Fallacy said:

I have a question. If someone is charged with a sex crime as a juvenile offender (under the age of 18), they don't stay on the sex offender registry after their release, right? I ask because Josh was 14-15 when he offended but he basically will forever be a public sex offender thanks to the Internet. If he wasn't a celebrity, if he was just some random 14-15 year old, his record would be expunged and he wouldn't be on the registry, right? In my mind, that fact means that Josh is currently facing tougher consequences for his sex crime today than he would if he wasn't a celebrity. 

If Josh had been charged as a juvenile (and he wasn't) his records would have been sealed.  We wouldn't have know anything about what he did. You can't blame the internet for this.

Edited May 13, 2016 by ariel

[kassygreene]

One of the ironies of Josh's situation is that if his parents hadn't so successfully covered up, he would have been dealt with as a minor, it is possible the relevant Arkansas judiciary would have insisted on real-world (non-patriarchal) treatment, and the records would have been sealed or destroyed or whatever is the process when he came of age.  Instead the clock was run out, but then someone tipped the Oprah people, who reported it back to Arkansas, and at that time a new set of records came into being, records written after Josh turned 18, and therefore when he was no longer a juvenile to be protected.

He never received effective help, but in the terms of his own culture (having turned four of his sisters and two other young girls into broken bicycles), he did all the things he was supposed to do, and he was free.  

The thing that has always personally repelled me about any religion that basically gives you a get out of hell free card after performing the church-sanctioned processes of contrition and forgiveness, is that those processes (for some) prove to be so painless that it becomes the low cost of committing sin.  

As for the marital happiness, I don't think Anna ever knew there were other ways to be married (and I doubt she ever will), but Josh has been very clearly tired of his life as a sub-patriarch with his own growing brood for a long time.  The announcement of M4 was not made by a happy father-to-be.

[allonsyalice]

1 minute ago, ariel said:

If Josh had been charged as a juvenile, his records would have been sealed. 

Yup. (at least here in Canada, but I can't fathom why it would be different in Arkansas.) Not a lawyer, but did suffer through a law and ethics course this year. He and his victims were underaged, so records would be sealed and there'd be a pub ban (meaning media wouldn't be allowed to publish names.) But of course, that's if they are charged/taken to court, but he wasn't (as we know)

Anyway, I also agree that Josh is grown. He can get the help he needs for both himself and his family. Staying in the house isn't helping him and he can make his own decisions. 

[Arwen Evenstar]

3 hours ago, new jersey devil said:

I'll pass on the book recommandation, as I already know as much as I'm likely to be interested in, about the man. There was no need to go over all this as I've lurked for months and I've heard it quite alot as it is rehashed to a degree I find comical and sad at the same time.

I'd suggest some people should get a hobby, but Josh would appear to be the chosen hobby of many, these days.

And honest question, but the word "redemption" is thrown around these parts quite a bit, but don't most here WANT the man to continue to fail, in the worst way possible?

Seems like it, to me...

Jersey Devil,

you asked the question, so since I hadn't seen you on the forum before, I tried to give you the short story. You were asking what seemed a fair and innocent question.

Many of us who post here attended churches at one time or another (or close friends or family of people who did) that were similar though not as severe as the church/doctrine the Duggars adhere to when we were much younger and didn't get a say so but now attend more moderate churches  or not at all now and have found the views espoused by the Duggars and their ilk to be too harsh and sometimes too absurd for us.  Though most of us would defend their right to believe as they choose provided they do no harm to others.

i personally don't want Josh or any of those kids to fail, but as long as he doesn't get qualified help for himself, his chances aren't good for him to have a healthier perspective on life.  We are all concerned not just for Josh but the welfare of all children who are trapped in this cult who don't get a say so...they are deliberately kept undereducated and are often living in  unsanitary, crowded conditions, and many of the kids are physically and mentally abused and isolated...many do not attend any brick and mortar church or any type of brick and mortar school, aren't allowed to have friends or play sports.  Even Christian schools and counsellors are not to be sought out by the group the Duggars belong to.

Josh probably couldn't get very far on his limited education even if he could run away.  I wish no harm to Josh or his family or even his crazy parents who messed up their kids. Josh not being able to go anywhere without being recognized and everyone knowing what he'd done must be hard....that shame alone is more punishment than most would or could endure themselves. 

And, thank you for your service. My brother served in the Air Force and National Guard Reserves.

It's the cult and bad parenting we snark about....we would cheer any Duggar who wanted to break free!

Edited May 13, 2016 by Arwen Evenstar

[toodles]

The first statement he made stated that Satan built a fortress in his heart.  All the further statements were watered down.  Yeah, he said he was a hypocrite when the first statement bombed but the duggar machine tried to deflect the blame away from smuggar and lay it on another force.  I've said this before but his children will get ahold of this mess someday.  Hopefully the brainwashing will leave some room for independent thought.  Maybe, just maybe, one of his children will want the real truth from their parents and will demand some answers to hard questions.

 

But this is pretty far in the future.  Who knows what will happen between now and then.

[Arwen Evenstar]

23 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Sorry guys, but the person has declined my request to post details, as the person could be identified by their occupation and location. 

Shucks, Sumi!  But respect the wishes of your friend you must.

Not surprised TDFW is an asshat..he looks the type...like the kid who farts in school and blames someone else.  I hope he doesn't take his anger out on poor Prissy.  I'm gob smacked how much he and Prissy look alike without the matchy matchy clothes.

[new jersey devil]

3 hours ago, Fallacy said:

I have a question. If someone is charged with a sex crime as a juvenile offender (under the age of 18), they don't stay on the sex offender registry after their release, right? I ask because Josh was 14-15 when he offended but he basically will forever be a public sex offender thanks to the Internet. If he wasn't a celebrity, if he was just some random 14-15 year old, his record would be expunged and he wouldn't be on the registry, right? In my mind, that fact means that Josh is currently facing tougher consequences for his sex crime today than he would if he wasn't a celebrity. 

I really am not sympathizing with him at all here. I just disagree with the claim that Josh hasn't had to deal with any consequences for his actions. I would think the entire world knowing what he did and hating him for it forever and always is a pretty big consequence. 

I agree. 

[Sew Sumi]

If Josh hadn't chosen to live his adult life in the public eye (both via the show and FRC Action), I might have more sympathy for him. But he CHOSE to be a public figure, and as such, is going to naturally be judged by the court of public opinion. It's the tradeoff all celebs make for all the money they make. 

But truth be told, if this all came out regarding a private person that I knew, I don't think I'd have much more sympathy unless they made REAL attempts at REAL therapy and recovery, whatever that entails. Jesus Jail just reminded Josh of the lessons of his youth; it's been apparent for some time that he hasn't been all-in on the fundie train, despite what he was saying and doing. The guy needs real counseling, not bible study five times a day. He can already recite chapter and verse by rote; I don't think he learned anything new there, other than how to bury himself even deeper in his "addictions." And no, I don't think he's an addict, just a cheating asshole with molestations in his past. That's plenty.

[BitterApple]

I respect all opinions, just throwing out some food for thought:

http://thinkprogress.org/culture/2015/05/21/3661984/9-times-josh-duggar-lectured-people-family-values-admitted-child-molester/

Edited May 13, 2016 by BitterApple

[Mollie]

11 hours ago, Fallacy said:

I have a question. If someone is charged with a sex crime as a juvenile offender (under the age of 18), they don't stay on the sex offender registry after their release, right? I ask because Josh was 14-15 when he offended but he basically will forever be a public sex offender thanks to the Internet. If he wasn't a celebrity, if he was just some random 14-15 year old, his record would be expunged and he wouldn't be on the registry, right? In my mind, that fact means that Josh is currently facing tougher consequences for his sex crime today than he would if he wasn't a celebrity. 

I really am not sympathizing with him at all here. I just disagree with the claim that Josh hasn't had to deal with any consequences for his actions. I would think the entire world knowing what he did and hating him for it forever and always is a pretty big consequence. 

Josh was NOT a "juvenile offender" and that was the same lie that Jim Bob tried to make people believe in the big Megyn Kelly interview.

Under Arkansas law, a 14-year-old who commits acts of sexual molesting is treated as an adult.  http://humanservices.arkansas.gov/dcfs/dcfsDocs/Master%20DCFS%20Policy.pdf

Not only that, but Michelle and Jim Bob could have been arrested for child abuse/neglect for allowing the abuse to continue once they knew it was happening.  (According to the police reports, the abuse continued and escalated for over a year.)

I believe Jim Bob knew exactly what he was doing when he failed to act before the Statute of Limitations expired over the crimes.  When the abuse occurred, Jim Bob was an Arkansas legislater and was running for the U.S. senate.  

In short, if the law had been obeyed, Josh would be on the State Sex Offenders list and Michelle and Jim Bob would be convicted of child abuse/neglect, and all minor children could have been removed from the home and put in foster care.

Jim Bob, Michelle and Josh all deserve what they are getting now in public humiliation and financial retaliation.   The first 14 Kids and Counting show would never have happened if Josh's conduct had been reported to authorities when the abuse occurred.  

Edited May 13, 2016 by Mollie

[Fallacy]

That's why I asked, Mollie. I'm shocked that he would have been tried as an adult. I assumed that a 14-15 year old would be tried as a juvenile.  Also, where in that 444 page document does it say that? I read through the entire index and skimmed through what I believed are the relevant sections, and I found nothing related to the penalties or laws about 14-15 year olds committing sexual abuse. I'm sure it's there, but could you help me find it?

And yes, I'm fully aware he was never charged and that Jim Bob and Michelle never got him real help. 

Edited May 13, 2016 by Fallacy
Asked a question

[Mollie]

2 hours ago, Fallacy said:

That's why I asked, Mollie. I'm shocked that he would have been tried as an adult. I assumed that a 14-15 year old would be tried as a juvenile.  Also, where in that 444 page document does it say that? I read through the entire index and skimmed through what I believed are the relevant sections, and I found nothing related to the penalties or laws about 14-15 year olds committing sexual abuse. I'm sure it's there, but could you help me find it?

And yes, I'm fully aware he was never charged and that Jim Bob and Michelle never got him real help. 

"Once required to register, juvenile sex offenders are subject to the same requirements and standards as adult offenders, pursuant to Ark. Code Ann. § 12-12-913."

Also see: Arkansas Code 5-14-103. Sexual Assault Third Degree

http://acasa.us/pdfs/Sexual-assault-laws.pdf

[kokapetl]

It's "once required" though. It seems to be up to the discretion of the sentencing judge in the case of juveniles. 

[Lemur]

I was under the impression, from the research I did at the time of Joshgate 1 into the relevant laws but also the legal analysis presented by several experts, that it was at the discretion of the prosecutor whether or not the alleged perpetrator would be tried as an adult, and if not, if the juvenile perpetrator was found guilty, whether or not they would be listed on sex offender registry.  It would also depend on what he was actually charged with.  

As for Josh failing ... I don't wish anyone ill will but the fact of the matter is that it's hard to estimate how many cheaters cheat again (because let's face it, people aren't exactly going to own up to it in the first place, much less the second).  And we have seen no evidence of recidivism in regards to the molestation.  I don't wish Josh or Anna or any of them ill.  I'm just really, really, really sick of seeing them and their type (meaning F-list reality "stars") continually cash-in on their own shit behavior and misdeeds.  And yes, the audience that buys into that crap is just as culpable as the people selling it.

[sometimesy]

Well, he has probably faced all the fellowshippers after the graduation tour. Phew, that's over. He's done this before and he became so comfortable he starred in a reality show. What's next Josh? Red pill? Blue pill?

Edited May 13, 2016 by sometimesy

[emma675]

Quote

And honest question, but the word "redemption" is thrown around these parts quite a bit, but don't most here WANT the man to continue to fail, in the worst way possible?

Seems like it, to me...

I don't want him to fail, I want him to go away.

[yogi2014L]

2 hours ago, emma675 said:

I don't want him to fail, I want him to go away.

I don't! I want him to one day wake up and say EFF IT I don't need to be dragged around by mommy and daddy.  I want him to flee the cult with or without anna or divorce her ( and pay alimony) and go live the life he wants full of consenting adult sex that isn't to fill a quiver! Then publish a tell all. And then he may disappear. 

[Sew Sumi]

After the mediocre success of JJ:CO,.Boob has to know that Smuggar is his next gambling chip. And who knows, maybe he's convinced Smuggar to stay close in order to orchestrate the Official Redemption Tour, sponsored by TLC. 

But of course, it's pretty clear that Smuggar is staying in the safe bosom of his ever-forgiving family for now. He's not yet ready to step out on his own, so getting a real job isn't even on the table at this point in time.

[kokapetl]

Given that advertisers had made it very clear beforehand that they didn't want anything to do with JJ:CO, I wonder what the TLC execs consider success or failure for the show. 

[Sew Sumi]

That doesn't seem to matter to Boob  Remember how he declared that they would never be cancelled? I don't think he understands how TV works. 

The problem is, TLC might see The Redemption Tour as ratings gold, mostly due to hate-watchers and go with it with the minimal advertising they had for JJ:CO.

[GeeGolly]

7 hours ago, Lemur said:

I was under the impression, from the research I did at the time of Joshgate 1 into the relevant laws but also the legal analysis presented by several experts, that it was at the discretion of the prosecutor whether or not the alleged perpetrator would be tried as an adult, and if not, if the juvenile perpetrator was found guilty, whether or not they would be listed on sex offender registry.  It would also depend on what he was actually charged with.  

As for Josh failing ... I don't wish anyone ill will but the fact of the matter is that it's hard to estimate how many cheaters cheat again (because let's face it, people aren't exactly going to own up to it in the first place, much less the second).  And we have seen no evidence of recidivism in regards to the molestation.  I don't wish Josh or Anna or any of them ill.  I'm just really, really, really sick of seeing them and their type (meaning F-list reality "stars") continually cash-in on their own shit behavior and misdeeds.  And yes, the audience that buys into that crap is just as culpable as the people selling it.

In all likelihood the molestations would have been handled by DCF. Josh would have been removed form the home for a period of time, and both he and JB & M would have had to complete a service plan. The service plan probably would have included therapy for the girls, the parents and Josh, parenting classes for JB & M, and a residential program for Josh. 

Most likely the police never would have been involved. However considering the age difference between Josh and the then 5 year old, if DCF had the case they might have involved the police. And still yet, there would be no guarantee that he would have been charged with anything.

[kokapetl]

There's evidence that CPS did intervene in the family after Oprah notified them. Josh appealed an administrative ruling against him. We aren't privy to the details, and we shouldn't be. I think it's in accurate to say Josh continued to get away with it after CPS arrived. There's no record of further deviant offenses. 

Edited May 13, 2016 by ingenting

[GeeGolly]

1 hour ago, ingenting said:

There's evidence that CPS did intervene in the family after Oprah notified them. Josh appealed an administrative ruling against him. We aren't privy to the details, and we shouldn't be. I think it's in accurate to say Josh continued to get away with it after CPS arrived. There's no record of further deviant offenses. 

Oh, I thought the documents that were made public pertained to the investigation prompted by Oprah's team reporting the allegations to the police. Prior to that I thought the Duggars handled it through their "church elders" and a state cop that was a casual friend. It's all confusing to me. But I thought CPS/DCF were never involved.

[Absolom]

I think CPS was involved after the police couldn't go any further due to the statute of limitations.

On second thought I'm not firmly sure on that, but there was some documentation that at some point CPS was involved.  In the TV interviews with Megan Kelley I think it was Jill talked a bit about it and made a claim something like CPS was impressed with how well her parents did.

Edited May 13, 2016 by Absolom

[JoanArc]

Quote

In the TV interviews with Megan Kelley I think it was Jill talked a bit about it and made a claim something like CPS was impressed with how well her parents did.

I remember Jill saying that. What was the recent CPS visit about, giving Michelle a MOTY award?

[kokapetl]

13 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

Oh, I thought the documents that were made public pertained to the investigation prompted by Oprah's team reporting the allegations to the police. Prior to that I thought the Duggars handled it through their "church elders" and a state cop that was a casual friend. It's all confusing to me. But I thought CPS/DCF were never involved.

A local journalist saw a folder marked Josh Duggar v Arkansas CPS, or something similar, and it had a 2007 case number.

[Churchhoney]

13 hours ago, Absolom said:

 I think it was Jill talked a bit about it and made a claim something like CPS was impressed with how well her parents did.

This is something that Jill said for the same reason the Rodriguez children say that both public and Christian schools are seething hotbeds of constant deadly sin. Her parents told her that this was true and she's a little robot -- albeit, now, a young adult robot -- who parrots and believes every damned thing JB and M tell her. They're rotten idiots, but they've still been able to successfully program a houseful of people to believe that they're both infallible and fabulous.

I get how they did that. What I don't get though, I must say, is how they also seem to have programmed the leghumpers to believe it. Wishful thinking and gullibility are strong strong forces, I guess.

[Joe Jitsu913]

19 hours ago, JoanArc said:

I remember Jill saying that. What was the recent CPS visit about, giving Michelle a MOTY award?

The Duggars are incessant liars.  Whatever Jill Michelle Duggar Dillard says; always believe the opposite  because you know she's full of shit.

[kokapetl]

CPS records don't appear to be public records (thank god). 

[questionfear]

So I was at my dry cleaner today, and they always have random pamplets and business cards for local services...and there was a whole stack of pamphlets for Reformers Unanimous. It caught my eye because it said RU and rehab, and this is central NJ, so for us RU is Rutgers University. But apparently there's also a fundie rehab facility nearby...maybe they will send Josh Duggar here if his first round didn't take. 

Though it might be a bad idea to let him be a short train ride away from NYC.

[Muffyn]

If Josh does a second stint at RU, he'll go back to the mothership in Illinois.  The RU folks really like it when people become "lifers" and move to Rockford to stay under their thumb protection and guidance.  Of course when Josh was there they had to limit the live streaming of some of their activities.  We didn't get to see them hand out their multitudinous awards which include both "fruit" and "branches." 

In the spirit of RU, I award you all the snark fruit and perseverance branch. 

[Arwen Evenstar]

10 hours ago, Muffyn said:

If Josh does a second stint at RU, he'll go back to the mothership in Illinois.  The RU folks really like it when people become "lifers" and move to Rockford to stay under their thumb protection and guidance.  Of course when Josh was there they had to limit the live streaming of some of their activities.  We didn't get to see them hand out their multitudinous awards which include both "fruit" and "branches." 

In the spirit of RU, I award you all the snark fruit and perseverance branch. 

That could be a viable employment opportunity for Smuggs...Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand, it will get him away from the mother ship, aka the TTH.

[toodles]

10 hours ago, Muffyn said:

If Josh does a second stint at RU, he'll go back to the mothership in Illinois.  The RU folks really like it when people become "lifers" and move to Rockford to stay under their thumb protection and guidance.  Of course when Josh was there they had to limit the live streaming of some of their activities.  We didn't get to see them hand out their multitudinous awards which include both "fruit" and "branches." 

In the spirit of RU, I award you all the snark fruit and perseverance branch. 

He is already under jimboob' s thumb, er, protection and guidance.  Maybe the ru and boob can take turns grinding him in to the ground

[Henri205]

Mods, I'm not sure if it's okay to post this so please remove if it's not appropriate or outside site guidelines.  

My parents used to take us to a lovely resort in Vermont called Smuggler's Notch.  Not a pitch for them in any way but Google it and look at the site's address.  I've been giggling about it since I heard a commercial on the radio yesterday. 

[Henri205]

Maybe this was covered someplace else in this site, but Reformers Unanimous?  I wondered if they meant Reformers Anonymous but were too stupid to know the difference.  Once again, I'll find the door and let myself out.  Have a nice bottle of Merlot to share.  Stop by the Prayer Closet. 

[JoanArc]

31 minutes ago, Henri205 said:

Maybe this was covered someplace else in this site, but Reformers Unanimous?  I wondered if they meant Reformers Anonymous but were too stupid to know the difference.  Once again, I'll find the door and let myself out.  Have a nice bottle of Merlot to share.  Stop by the Prayer Closet. 

It's just so they can seem somewhat legitimate, because the name resembles AA. Much like how the Duggars will occasionally go to a mainstream church, to hide that they are their own church.

[Lemur]

On 5/14/2016 at 8:02 AM, ingenting said:

A local journalist saw a folder marked Josh Duggar v Arkansas CPS, or something similar, and it had a 2007 case number.

Here's a detailed and thorough timeline of the scandal, based on public records and statements right up until 19&C got canceled.  

(And no, I don't have this bookmarked for easy reference ... I do searches for it often enough that it's the top suggestion though.)