Jessa, Ben and Their Brood: Making a (Diaper) Mountain out of a Mold House

[Portia]

Something that just struck me while reading the Jill and Derick page.  Jessa and Ben left the church to the University of Arkansas school song.  URRGGHH, that just annoys the hell out of me! Neither went there, I'm not sure they know anyone who went there, they're not going to go there, I doubt anyones parents or grandparents went there....sigh.   It's one thing if you are totally obsessed with the school YOU ARE GOING TO (I know many Aggies like that), bu having no connection?  I hate it.

You may underestimate the power of football. Their loyalty probably lies with the team, not the school. I'm not a football fan myself, but I got used to it when I lived in Arkansas, and now that I live in Alabama, it's a foregone conclusion! Plenty of people who've never darkened the doorstep of a college or university have a university's fight song as their ringtone.

[Ljohnson1987]

How long before Jessa is carrying her own blessing? I say before their first anniversary. 

[cereality]

You may underestimate the power of football. Their loyalty probably lies with the team, not the school. I'm not a football fan myself, but I got used to it when I lived in Arkansas, and now that I live in Alabama, it's a foregone conclusion! Plenty of people who've never darkened the doorstep of a college or university have a university's fight song as their ringtone.

I understand what you're saying about college football. I grew up in an area where EVERYONE is a Penn State fan regardless of whether you went to Penn State or some other college or no college (and I honestly think SEC fans are even more supportive of their teams). But to me there is a difference between someone who is a fan of a college team and didn't go to college bc of money, lack of grades, interest in military/trades or something other reason vs. someone who is supposedly a fan of a college team but would never let any child of thiers go to the school no matter what because "they'd have to sit near green haired heathens" as I think the Duggars or some other fundie family has said before. There are plenty of people who didn't go to PSU but if their kid wanted to go, could afford it, and got in -- they'd jump at the chance. OTOH the Duggars look down on formal education but the school's sports team is ok? In that case why not just find a pro team to root for?

[dillpickles]

Even if the Duggars thought there was nothing wrong with the kids, they didn't,exactly, recreate it. Michelle's hair is not tousled, and their clothing is more modest. It's all in the details...

It's probably because Boob/MEchelle selfie was staged. Ben and Jessa probably just finished up some sweet fellowship and then took their selfie.

I kind of seeing them just messing around taking kissing pictures, then seeing one that came out decently and deciding to post it for the giggles.

[Portia]

But to me there is a difference between someone who is a fan of a college team and didn't go to college bc of money, lack of grades, interest in military/trades or something other reason vs. someone who is supposedly a fan of a college team but would never let any child of thiers go to the school no matter what because "they'd have to sit near green haired heathens" as I think the Duggars or some other fundie family has said before. There are plenty of people who didn't go to PSU but if their kid wanted to go, could afford it, and got in -- they'd jump at the chance. OTOH the Duggars look down on formal education but the school's sports team is ok? In that case why not just find a pro team to root for?

Ahhh, good point. I can't pretend to understand why college football trumps all else. All I know is that, with the exception of Super Bowl Sunday, the Arkansans and Alabamians I know act like pro football doesn't even exist. 

[floridamom]

I don't think the Duggars ever went to a college football game as it wouldn't be a Christian thing to do because of the alcohol, cheerleaders, and it's just too distracting for the boys. They most likely went to their first game with Derick. I don't know why Ben is a fan either. The Duggars don't believe in higher education, so why would they go for the sports team of a college? They still don't add up to me.

If Ben and Jessa "aren't doing anything to prevent conception", like Jill, she will be expecting very soon now. I say an announcement before Christmas,, way before. It's biology, folks, bound to happen.

[Mariva]

I think Ben at one point had plans of transferring to the University of Arkansas from community college. Though now that he has joined the Duggar's dog and pony show who knows whether that will ever happen. I also wonder if there isn't a bit of jealousy or competition going on with Derick considering HE actually did graduate from a 4 year university and was also his school's mascot, which is a pretty big deal to have on one's resume. Maybe Ben wants to be seen as a big shot college student too because I can't see Jessa caring much about higher education or football unless it's to support her man.

[Jellybeans]

We still do not know what Ben and Jessa's plans are. I find the silence intriguing.

[starfire]

The silence may mean Ben is staying on as Boob's yard boy and he and Jessa are shackin' up in the Duggar shed.

 

If it's true that the daughter's father is responsible to provide housing for the couple, I hope for their sake that JB has a better plan for them than the shed.

[RazzleberryPie]

Ben's still a teenager and Jessa is in her early 20s. There's still plenty of time for them to end up at the University of Arkansas, especially Ben. Now I would like to be a fly on the wall to see how she socially interacts with people who think the Duggars are silly or full of crap. I think Jessa is one of the few who realizes everyone doesn't approve of their lifestyle or even give a rats arse as needing the Duggar's sanctimonious approval.

 

I think some of the Koolaid drinkers, like Jill, or even Jana, could attend a secular school and maybe not be 100% comfortable, but be able to sit through class and interact. Heck, Jill would be trying to convert everyone and be an example or whatever. I think Jessa knows that The Duggar Way isn't the only way, and is actually very weird, and she wouldn't be able to cope with explaining her beliefs/practices 24/7, especially when she knows a lot of things just don't hold water (AKA showing calves is not modest, but tongue kissing your spouse in public is, or how seeking help from fertility docs is allowing God to decide the number of kids). 

 

Jessa may act stupid and try to keep at Ben's pace with all the 'g' droppin' and gun shootin', but I think she's very intelligent, and knows her homefoolin' education is lacking, and that her parents/Gothard's way isn't the only way to live and please God.

[NausetGirl]

I've been watching the Duggars for years and have shaken my head in astonishment many times, but this takes the cake. I see this as a jealousy move on MEchelle's part, purely and simply: "See? We can be as 'in love' and sexual as our young, beautiful daughter and her husband." In all seriousness, this is one sick move. 

 

More evidence that Mechelle believes that the world revolves around her, that everyone loves everything she does or says, that she is perfect and wonderful. All typical last-born child behaviors. Another of these is that last-borns find it difficult to age. Unlike most first-borns and middles, last-borns are often depressed at birthdays and even traumatized at significant ones [30, 40 etc]. They can't accept that the world moves on, noticing them less with each new year. And that there are more and more people in it younger than they are.

Edited November 12, 2014 by NausetGirl

[anstar]

If it's true that the daughter's father is responsible to provide housing for the couple, I hope for their sake that JB has a better plan for them than the shed.

Where did this idea come from?  If it were true, Mr. Keller would have provided housing for Josh and Anna, but he didn't.  JB put them in that little house Grandma Duggar owns.  Jim Bob has "provided" jobs and or housing for each and every one of his married children.  Michelle's "leave and cleave" statement in that interview doesn't seem to have stuck. Son or daughter, he wants them where he can 'control' them.

[GEML]

Coming from WV, where you are either a WVU or (occasionally) Marshall University fan by culture and state pride, I don't find the loyalty to the University of Arkansas odd in the Duggars at all. I'm actually glad they are permitted something so ordinary.

And I don't think we can rule out Ben attending an actual college at some point, maybe even UofA. Again, he did not grow up Gothard, but another subculture that puts a higher value on education. With Derick now in the family, Jessa can say, "Going to college didn't corrupt Derick."

[Ripley68]

I have no problem with being a fan of a school you didn't go to (I've lived in both Alabama and Kentucky for goodness sakes), I do have a problem with the extremes people take when they have never been to the school. 

 

Hmm...no new Blessa pictures lately.

[WTFFF]

Where did this idea come from?  If it were true, Mr. Keller would have provided housing for Josh and Anna, but he didn't.  JB put them in that little house Grandma Duggar owns.  Jim Bob has "provided" jobs and or housing for each and every one of his married children.  Michelle's "leave and cleave" statement in that interview doesn't seem to have stuck. Son or daughter, he wants them where he can 'control' them.

JimBob mentioned in some episode this season that there was some Biblical stuff about providing housing for your children.  Then said something to the extent of "but 19 is a lot" and did that asshole chuckle he does.

 

But it may just be a Duggar thing, not a Gothard/QF/whatever thing.

[GEML]

Under Gothard principles, it is common for the father of the daughter to provide a dowery on the home.  I'm not sure if I read this in the book A MATTER OF BASIC PRINCIPLES or in the book QUIVERFULL, but one of the books outlines the practice.  And while Anna's parents come from much more limited means than the Duggars, they do own some property in Florida that is nicely developed behind the trailers with the tennis court and volleyball courts, etc.  I also believe they paid for Anna to do at least some college education on-line, and the ATI conference isn't cheap.

I'm assuming that what might have taken place is that Anna's parents gave the couple a sum of money equal to, say, one year's rent in the home.  That would seem in keeping with their obligations, and be appropriate for a young couple starting out.  That might even explain why Jim Bob says things like Jill and Derrick are "staying in the house until it sells" because it is more about giving them a year in the home, or something like that, to get their marriage underway and their finances settled.  

The first year in these marriages is very important, since they are essentially arranged marriages.  I really do think there is an attempt to remove as many obstacles from the young couples as possible.  The assumption also is that this will be the only year of their lives where there will be no children (although one will almost certainly be on the way) so having a home that doesn't cost them money is a genuinely good thing to provide them with.

[Jellybeans]

The first year in these marriages is very important, since they are essentially arranged marriages.  I really do think there is an attempt to remove as many obstacles from the young couples as possible.  The assumption also is that this will be the only year of their lives where there will be no children (although one will almost certainly be on the way) so having a home that doesn't cost them money is a genuinely good thing to provide them with.

Very interesting GEML. Thanks for this insight.

[mimionthebeach]

Okay. Feel sorry for me. I have spent a lot of time identifying the bridesmaids in this photo. I have no life, clearly. There are 10 bridesmaids and one maid of honour. The invitation only lists 9 bridesmaids. The one second from the left looks like maybe Jennifer Hartono but she's never mentioned. Am I crazy as well as sad?  Aaaaannnnnddddd, who hates Jessica Seewald so much that they couldn't take another pic after she'd peed?

[Sew Sumi]

That's Danielle. Jessica is the super tall one to our right.

[leighroda]

Part of me feels bad for Jessa and all of the wedding night speculation.... But then I got to thinking about when other celebrity couples and their weddings and how nobody ever speculates about what happened that night, I guess partly because we all know at that point it's not their first rodeo per se.... But the thing is the Duggar's are the ones pointing it out every chance they get. Even when other celebrities (I'm using this word very loosely for this) get together not even married nobody is talking about the fact that they are now "doing it". For the most part nobody cares, sex is a normal part of a relationship that really doesn't need to be advertised, we know everybody does it. I have lots of friends that married as virgins, and of course there were a few quiet snickers about what was going to happen after the wedding, but it wasn't all but straight up announced at the ceremony. All of these kissing pictures are getting out of control, I guess at every family gathering now we can just expect to see the couples lip locked. It just bothers me because for all the times they have defined modesty on the show lest we forget what that word means, they are anything but with all of this flaunting. How does the fact that Jessa now has a ring on it mean that she is no capable of defrauding others as they say?

[mimionthebeach]

That's Danielle. Jessica is the super tall one to our right.

I stand corrected. Distracted by her unfortunate "pose". Thanks.

[joanofarch4]

No word on where Binessa will be living?? What are they trying to hide? Did Boob allow them to get married so they could what normal people do like a relationship where you can kiss and make out? The dead silence is very strange.

When Jessa threatened JB, with a sly smile, "You don't want us to ELOPE, do you?" she wasn't kidding...

More evidence that Mechelle believes that the world revolves around her, that everyone loves everything she does or says, that she is perfect and wonderful. All typical last-born child behaviors. Another of these is that last-borns find it difficult to age. Unlike most first-borns and middles, last-borns are often depressed at birthdays and even traumatized at significant ones [30, 40 etc]. They can't accept that the world moves on, noticing them less with each new year. And that there are more and more people in it younger than they are.

I may be mistaken, but doesn't Michelle have one sister who's close to her in age?  After all those much older mother-siblings, I mean.  So if she's indeed "the baby of the family," it's not by much...

[Almost 3000]

I stand corrected. Distracted by her unfortunate "pose". Thanks.

I'm distracted by the hobbit feet on the end. I've tried to get a good look to see if she's wearing shoes because I just can't imagine she's barefooted but can't figure out the footwear.

[JellyFishQueen]

Okay. Feel sorry for me. I have spent a lot of time identifying the bridesmaids in this photo. I have no life, clearly. There are 10 bridesmaids and one maid of honour. The invitation only lists 9 bridesmaids. The one second from the left looks like maybe Jennifer Hartono but she's never mentioned. Am I crazy as well as sad?  Aaaaannnnnddddd, who hates Jessica Seewald so much that they couldn't take another pic after she'd peed?

Those men have horrible posture.

[mbutterfly]

Those men have horrible posture.

Omigosh, it does look like hobbit feet. And why do all the men have their hands in their pockets?

Ok, I'm being very rude. 

[DangerousMinds]

Yes, if an unmarried young (or not so young man) gets aroused by Jessa's soft porn kissing photo, how is that not considered "defrauding?"

[Jellybeans]

Yes, if an unmarried young (or not so young man) gets aroused by Jessa's soft porn kissing photo, how is that not considered "defrauding?"

What if it is a woman that gets aroused by Jessa? :-) Just stirring the pot faster....

[DangerousMinds]

Exactly Jellybeans!

[dillpickles]

What if it is a woman that gets aroused by Jessa? :-) Just stirring the pot faster....

Don't be silly, women can't get aroused! Back to the prayer closet with you.

[Portia]

And why do all the men have their hands in their pockets? 

I think that must be a photographer "thing" right now. We have a family photo from my daughter's recent wedding where we women have our hands on the hips (all sassy-like) and the men have their hands in their pockets. I thought I'd hate it but I actually kind of like the photo, because we happen to all look really relaxed and happy, but those cutesy poses really can look sloppy if people aren't excercising good posture. 

 

I was really, really tempted to post a picture on the Duggar FB page of my husband and me enjoying a righteous marital kiss while he cups my breasts and I squeeze his butt. What? It's beautiful! We're married!

Edited November 14, 2014 by Portia

[cmr2014]

I wonder if the Benessa wedding will hurt them with the leghumpers.

 

If you watch them because you think they are a wonderful, Godly family, and you think they are a good influence on your children, what are you going to tell your daughters about Benessa? What are you going to say when your teenage daughter shows up with her unemployed boyfriend and wants to get married?

[Jynnan tonnix]

Omigosh, it does look like hobbit feet. And why do all the men have their hands in their pockets?

Ok, I'm being very rude. 

I don't know...my father (very old-country Polish circa 1931) has always had a really persnickety attitude toward seeing guys with their hands in their pockets. It always seemed such a random and meaningless sort of prejudice to me until finally, some 7 or 8 years ago he finally explained that it's because "when they have their hands in their pockets, you can't tell what they might be doing with them. Which, though it sort of explained the issue, still came across as more humorous than scandalous.

[NausetGirl]

I may be mistaken, but doesn't Michelle have one sister who's close to her in age?  After all those much older mother-siblings, I mean.  So if she's indeed "the baby of the family," it's not by much...

 

I'm not sure whether Mechelle has any sibs close in age, but as far as birth order psychology goes, it wouldn't really matter. The youngest is the youngest and tends to display the typical last-born behaviors. Mechelle certainly shows most of these.

[cereality]

Just checked out Jessa's instagram for the first time in a while -- from her veteran's day message, Ben's grandfather (or great grandfather?) was in the Navy. Interesting. Not suggesting that Ben is enlisting anytime soon, as I can't see Jessa handling being an enlisted soldier/sailor's wife stuck on some base, but it suggests to me that Ben's family may be more "progressive" re school and career planning. Lots of enlisted take classes via the GI bill and some even complete full degrees; maybe Ben and his family aren't affirmatively anti-education like the Duggars.

[Zahdii]

It would do Ben a world of good to enlist and spend then next four years traveling, learning a trade learning how to get along with all different kinds of people.

 

Do it Ben!  Enlist in the Navy and I'll put in my hopes that you get sent to San Diego and you don't spend too much time at sea.  I think Jessa would become almost unrecognizable after spending much time living so far from her family.  Ben would probably come home to find her sunbathing in a barely there bikini and some birth control pills in the bathroom cabinet (not to say she'd need the pills because she would be cheating, just that if she spent more time around non-Quiverfull people she might decide to delay having children for a few years).

[floridamom]

Who are the leghumpers, and the lost children? I'm not sure how the dynamics are split up here. I know the "older ones are Josh through now Josiah and Joy. What about from there on down? The "little ones" are Jackson through Josie, right? Thanks guys.

[skittle223]

I believe the younger boys are called the howlers, the little girls are the lost girls and I think the leg humpers are fans that are in love with the Duggars.

[GEML]

Ben's family is Vision Forum, and Calvinist - not anti- education at all. And may have not problem serving in the military, although I don't see Ben doing it, given that he seems to really want to go to college and be in something like sales or business.

[RollingCones]

Sorry this is totally random and may have been mentioned before but it just hit me-change the hair color to blond and Jessa is Reese Witherspoon.

Chin and all.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2835749/She-s-sensation-Reese-Witherspoon-catches-eye-strapless-red-two-tone-chiffon-number-arrives-Hollywood-Film-Awards.html

[wanderwoman]

MODS: can I start a q&a thread to answer questions about the Duggars for people coming in here for first time?

[RazzleberryPie]

Sorry this is totally random and may have been mentioned before but it just hit me-change the hair color to blond and Jessa is Reese Witherspoon.

Chin and all.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2835749/She-s-sensation-Reese-Witherspoon-catches-eye-strapless-red-two-tone-chiffon-number-arrives-Hollywood-Film-Awards.html

I don't see it, but don't think Reese is pretty, just charming. Jessa reminds me of Elizabeth Berkley/Jessie Spano. Not a spitting image, but they could play each other on TV.

[Joe Jitsu913]

Jessa has always resembled Kendra Wilkinson to me.

[Fuzzysox]

Jessa has always resembled Kendra Wilkinson to me.

She sure does!!! I was watching Kendra on Top last night and if Jessa colored her hair they could be twins!

[cereality]

It would do Ben a world of good to enlist and spend then next four years traveling, learning a trade learning how to get along with all different kinds of people.

 

Do it Ben!  Enlist in the Navy and I'll put in my hopes that you get sent to San Diego and you don't spend too much time at sea.  I think Jessa would become almost unrecognizable after spending much time living so far from her family.  Ben would probably come home to find her sunbathing in a barely there bikini and some birth control pills in the bathroom cabinet (not to say she'd need the pills because she would be cheating, just that if she spent more time around non-Quiverfull people she might decide to delay having children for a few years).

I could see the military being a good thing for Ben. First I think he could hack it -- he looks like he works out all the time; he wouldn't be like the Duggar boys huffing and puffing as they run a mile or 2. The military is pretty diverse, and it would do him a world of good to have intense interaction with people of different races, ethnicities, and religions. They are trained by being put in impossible situations that they can only work their way out of if they work together; through that comes an intense bond and it may lead Ben to think -- that black guy or Muslim guy or whoever is just like me; he's working just as hard as I am to put food on the table and he really saved my a$$ in that field exercise. It would open up his world a bit, while allowing him to continue college or learn a trade.

 

I can see Jessa being a complainer though esp if they land at some base in the middle of nowhere, but maybe not. Enlisted military wives tend to be young with a kid or 2, so maybe she'd make friends get so involved in that social circle that she wouldn't care if Ben were away on training for months. And if she landed someplace like San Diego, I can totally see her putting on a bikini and spending her days on the beach.

 

Regardless of the military, somehow I don't see Ben and Jessa having that many kids. I think they'll have 1 right away and I wouldn't be shocked if they're pregnant already, but after that once Jessa realizes that there's work involved -- even when you can dump some stuff on Jana and Joy -- she may not be super interested to having another kid every year. Ben is one of 6 or 7? I can see him wanting a similar sized family, but I can see Jessa wanting 2 or 3 max. I think just like Josh and Anna, they'll slow things down a lot and frankly with Jessa I wouldn't be surprised if she just went on BC at some point secretly to ensure there are no "accidents."

[VillaVillekulla]

This idea of Ben joining the Navy is intriguing...Jessa wouldn't even necessarily have to live on base, I don't think. Usually the person in the Navy has to live on base until either he/she reaches a certain rank, or gets married. At that point I think the married couple can choose to either live on base in a house or apartment type situation rather than barracks, or they can move off the base. My boyfriend is Navy and his former roommate was a 19-year-old idiot who got married primarily so he wouldn't have to live in the barracks anymore.

 

Plus there are plenty of jobs that wouldn't involve Ben going to sea or deploying anywhere. Look into it, Ben!

[RazzleberryPie]

Jessa has always resembled Kendra Wilkinson to me.

She does!

[NausetGirl]

I could see the military being a good thing for Ben. First I think he could hack it -- he looks like he works out all the time; he wouldn't be like the Duggar boys huffing and puffing as they run a mile or 2. The military is pretty diverse, and it would do him a world of good to have intense interaction with people of different races, ethnicities, and religions. They are trained by being put in impossible situations that they can only work their way out of if they work together; through that comes an intense bond and it may lead Ben to think -- that black guy or Muslim guy or whoever is just like me; he's working just as hard as I am to put food on the table and he really saved my a$$ in that field exercise. It would open up his world a bit, while allowing him to continue college or learn a trade.

 

I can see Jessa being a complainer though esp if they land at some base in the middle of nowhere, but maybe not. Enlisted military wives tend to be young with a kid or 2, so maybe she'd make friends get so involved in that social circle that she wouldn't care if Ben were away on training for months. And if she landed someplace like San Diego, I can totally see her putting on a bikini and spending her days on the beach.

 

Regardless of the military, somehow I don't see Ben and Jessa having that many kids. I think they'll have 1 right away and I wouldn't be shocked if they're pregnant already, but after that once Jessa realizes that there's work involved -- even when you can dump some stuff on Jana and Joy -- she may not be super interested to having another kid every year. Ben is one of 6 or 7? I can see him wanting a similar sized family, but I can see Jessa wanting 2 or 3 max. I think just like Josh and Anna, they'll slow things down a lot and frankly with Jessa I wouldn't be surprised if she just went on BC at some point secretly to ensure there are no "accidents."

 

Agree. The military would be great for Ben and Jessa. I think it's a good experience for most who go in with the right attitude and are willing to work. There are benefits galore as well. Also I just want to go on record again as saying - NONE of the Duggar children will have anywhere near 19 kids. I think the biggest family will be no larger than 10, with the average being 4-6. 

[cereality]

Agree with you re kids. I feel like Jill will have the biggest family; she seems to be the most into the kool aid and it seems like Derick is trying to be like the Duggars a bit. I can honestly see her having like 8 or 10; maybe after that Derick may back off a bit as he realizes an accountant can only provide so much and if the TLC interest has died off by then.

 

I think the ones like Josh, Jessa, Joy, and Jinger have really gotten used to the "good life," and they don't even want to go back to the possibility of having a family of 12 in a 3 bedroom home with 2 bathrooms. I don't particularly think any of them are into kids, so they won't feel compelled to have one year after year, but even if they start of that way -- they'll soon realize that money becomes much tighter with every new kid and lay off at around 2-5 kids per family. As for Jana, I think by the time she gets to that phase she'll be so sick of child rearing that 1-3 is all she'll even want. No idea about the older boys -- I can see them doing whatever their wives want, and it's a rare wife that wants to go through labor 19 times.

[roamyn]

Single military persons live on base, unless there is no room in the barracks. Married persons get a housing subsidy.

Regarding Ben & the military, I don't see it. While I think it would be good for him, I can't see him in that role. He's too spoiled by the cameras - loves them, he probably couldn't pass the psychological testing with all his preaching & narrow mindedness, he'd have to cut his hair, which means he might not be the hot guy anymore.

And Daddy Seawald won't be able to influence Ben's superiors with a blog, when his precious commodity isn't being treated with respect & hand holding (like he did w/JB).

[GEML]

I really don't see what would be great about going from one life where every bit of his life was controlled by someone to where his life is controlled by someone else.

I'd much rather see Jessa and Ben break off and take whatever jobs they could find and let Ben finish school and make their own way.