Jessa, Ben and Their Brood: Making a (Diaper) Mountain out of a Mold House

[Ijustwantsomechips]

No shade to anyone that homeschools; you do you.  I’m sure it is the better option for some families, and there are awesome homeschoolers out there. I’ve got to be honest though. I don’t understand what makes some people think they’re qualified to teach a K-12 curriculum based on their own limited education.  I don’t think a high school diploma necessarily qualifies you to do so because you may know the material, but you have no knowledge of pedagogy, child psychology, dealing with special needs/deficits, etc.  Apparently the board of regents or whatever it is in each respective state believes so too, hence higher education curricula and teacher certification in all 50 states.  

That isn’t to say you can’t do a good job with a high school diploma or a degree in various fields.  I would think a person of normal intelligence and confidence would recognize their shortcomings and join a co-op or supplement their instruction with appropriate activities to fill in the gap.  The problem is the Duggars don’t seem to do that.  I don’t think Michelle is dumb by a long shot, and with the right curriculum she could have done a much better job.  But she’s drank too much of the juice (for those who watch ‘“The Path”) to be effective.  She’s too far removed from reality and what skills and background are needed to function in society. 

We laugh at Ben for helping with the homeschooling, but he’s probably the most qualified. He doesn’t come off as such a dim bulb like the others, and he isn’t as aggravating as Derick.   Would I want him teaching my kids? Hell to the no!  I’m a strong proponent of public education because 1)I’m already paying for it, 2)I’m not afraid for my kids to be around children that are black/brown/non-Christian, raised by gay parents/single parents, raised by liberal parents, 3), the socialization and lessons in tolerance are priceless, and 4), everyone needs a break from everyone else, no matter how much you love each other.  

I have a Ph.D., and can teach college courses from Associate’s through doctoral, but even I wouldn’t feel qualified to teach my child his or her entire grade school education, let alone several ages at one time.  I get why they do the crap they do.  Fear of the outside world, indoctrination, yadda yadda yadda.  But at the same time, I just don’t get it.  How could Michelle and Jim Bob look at Josh, Jill, Jessa, and Josiah and not see a spark there?  They didn’t care that those kids craved something more than what they could give, and it didn’t make them a bad parent for not meeting those needs?  

How different could life have been if they’d allowed Josh (as disgusting as he is) to attend a co-op or a Christian school so he could become a lawyer, a businessman, or work in politics.  He’s creepy and smarmy, but he could have made it. He also would have been around other non-related girls his age, and perhaps would have kissed and looked at the boobs of a few girls he liked and got it out of his system like a normal teenage boy.  

Josiah could be in someone’s university studying accounting and living a normal life, and maybe would have met someone better suited to him.  Chances are he’d still be free though because he’d be too busy worrying about preparing for the CPA exam than making babies.  

Poor Jill may not be the brightest, but she had the desire to learn, and could have been a very capable midwife, or just a labor and delivery nurse.  I think she could have made a good doula too.  Hell I don’t care if she only got certification in phlebotomy, if she was fulfilled. Then she could have seen the value in education and chose differently for her children, whom she probably would have had a little later.  Poor Izzy is too bright to be stifled so soon.

As for Jessa, she’s no genius, but she didn’t have much to work with either.  Perhaps marketing, PR, mass comm, or business would have been the right field for her.  Of all the girls, she seems the most capable of working and motherhood simultaneously.  In an alternate universe, she’d work, Ben would stay home, or do his church thing or whatever Ben does, and the boys would go to a Montessori school with a nanny/mommy’s helper a couple nights a week.  

But JB and MOTY are selfish, narcissistic, ignorant bastards, and they’ve doomed at least two generations of Duggars to idiocy and indoctrination.  These people make me sick!

[BrianJ1962]

There's a difference between homeschooling and homefooling

[bigskygirl]

20 minutes ago, Ijustwantsomechips said:

No shade to anyone that homeschools; you do you.  I’m sure it is the better option for some families, and there are awesome homeschoolers out there. I’ve got to be honest though. I don’t understand what makes some people think they’re qualified to teach a K-12 curriculum based on their own limited education.  I don’t think a high school diploma necessarily qualifies you to do so because you may know the material, but you have no knowledge of pedagogy, child psychology, dealing with special needs/deficits, etc.  Apparently the board of regents or whatever it is in each respective state believes so too, hence higher education curricula and teacher certification in all 50 states.  

That isn’t to say you can’t do a good job with a high school diploma or a degree in various fields.  I would think a person of normal intelligence and confidence would recognize their shortcomings and join a co-op or supplement their instruction with appropriate activities to fill in the gap.  The problem is the Duggars don’t seem to do that.  I don’t think Michelle is dumb by a long shot, and with the right curriculum she could have done a much better job.  But she’s drank too much of the juice (for those who watch ‘“The Path”) to be effective.  She’s too far removed from reality and what skills and background are needed to function in society. 

We laugh at Ben for helping with the homeschooling, but he’s probably the most qualified. He doesn’t come off as such a dim bulb like the others, and he isn’t as aggravating as Derick.   Would I want him teaching my kids? Hell to the no!  I’m a strong proponent of public education because 1)I’m already paying for it, 2)I’m not afraid for my kids to be around children that are black/brown/non-Christian, raised by gay parents/single parents, raised by liberal parents, 3), the socialization and lessons in tolerance are priceless, and 4), everyone needs a break from everyone else, no matter how much you love each other.  

I have a Ph.D., and can teach college courses from Associate’s through doctoral, but even I wouldn’t feel qualified to teach my child his or her entire grade school education, let alone several ages at one time.  I get why they do the crap they do.  Fear of the outside world, indoctrination, yadda yadda yadda.  But at the same time, I just don’t get it.  How could Michelle and Jim Bob look at Josh, Jill, Jessa, and Josiah and not see a spark there?  They didn’t care that those kids craved something more than what they could give, and it didn’t make them a bad parent for not meeting those needs?  

How different could life have been if they’d allowed Josh (as disgusting as he is) to attend a co-op or a Christian school so he could become a lawyer, a businessman, or work in politics.  He’s creepy and smarmy, but he could have made it. He also would have been around other non-related girls his age, and perhaps would have kissed and looked at the boobs of a few girls he liked and got it out of his system like a normal teenage boy.  

Josiah could be in someone’s university studying accounting and living a normal life, and maybe would have met someone better suited to him.  Chances are he’d still be free though because he’d be too busy worrying about preparing for the CPA exam than making babies.  

Poor Jill may not be the brightest, but she had the desire to learn, and could have been a very capable midwife, or just a labor and delivery nurse.  I think she could have made a good doula too.  Hell I don’t care if she only got certification in phlebotomy, if she was fulfilled. Then she could have seen the value in education and chose differently for her children, whom she probably would have had a little later.  Poor Izzy is too bright to be stifled so soon.

As for Jessa, she’s no genius, but she didn’t have much to work with either.  Perhaps marketing, PR, mass comm, or business would have been the right field for her.  Of all the girls, she seems the most capable of working and motherhood simultaneously.  In an alternate universe, she’d work, Ben would stay home, or do his church thing or whatever Ben does, and the boys would go to a Montessori school with a nanny/mommy’s helper a couple nights a week.  

But JB and MOTY are selfish, narcissistic, ignorant bastards, and they’ve doomed at least two generations of Duggars to idiocy and indoctrination.  These people make me sick!

I definitely agree with you, but I think the hard work to achieve is beyond the Duggar scope. It takes time and effect to be a lawyer, midwife, or an accounting. The person would need to put aside his or her own beliefs in order to work all type of people. None of the Duggars seem capable of that.

In the case of Smugs, I still think he would think he is a lady's man even if he went to public school and had a half way decent childhood. He probably would need to have a lawyer on standby because he might have ended up with women accusing him of sexual harassment in the work place.

[Churchhoney]

2 hours ago, bigskygirl said:

I definitely agree with you, but I think the hard work to achieve is beyond the Duggar scope. It takes time and effect to be a lawyer, midwife, or an accounting. The person would need to put aside his or her own beliefs in order to work all type of people. None of the Duggars seem capable of that.

This certainly is the way it's working out. 

The thing is, though, since everybody is shaped by their upbringing -- and it's always just one upbringing and is always skewed and limited toward certain things, no matter how wonderful it is -- I don't believe we can ever tell exactly what somebody's full capabilities are. 

When it comes to the Duggarlings, they clearly don't have the natural independence, rebelliousness, drive, energy or intelligence to veer or walk away from the very skewed and way-more-limited-than-many upbringing they got. And I'm convinced from my own experience that some kids born into that very family would have had the "stuff" by nature to go their own way regardless.  But I've got news -- a lot of people who weren't born into the Duggar household but into empowering and nurturing families likely would have been just as hamstrung now as the current Duggarlings are had they been born into the Duggar household. Everybody who 's out here in the world living like an independent person is taking credit for it -- but in many cases, in my opinion, these same people could not have fought to escape -- as the Duggarlings would have to....They were handed the ability to do it by THEIR empowering upbringings. 

What we don't know about the Duggarlings, in my opinion, is anything about what they'd be like had they had a very different kind of upbringing -- one that really encouraged independence, their individuality, their personal strengths. One that didn't hamstring them. 

Now, I agree that it's certainly possible that even with a very empowering upbringing, some or all of them may not have exhibited energy, discipline, ambition and all that. 

But I also think it's absolutely possible that at least some of them would have. And that if the Duggarlings had been born into a quite different family, we'd see many of them breaking away from their family traditions and making their own choices and that we'd see some of them become lawyers,  nurses and all sorts of things. 

Because in the case of a very different upbringing, they wouldn't have to fight tooth and nail to exert themselves at all. They'd be encouraged to show who they are as individuals. They wouldn't spend their childhoods doing their mother's housework. They'd have education that might be a bit inspiring instead of stultifyingly awful. The situation they faced from infancy would be entirely different! 

As with everyone, I think, the apparent Duggarling capabilities we see are shaped by both nature and nurture. And I really have no doubt that some people who are quite like the Duggars by nature have had their capabilities fostered rather than squelched by their nurture and have become lawyers and nurses and engineers, high-school teachers, ad-agency executives  and whatever else. 

They truly have had an extraordinarily damaging upbringing and  "education," in my opinion. And to me that means that, just by the odds, their true natural capabilities and tendencies -- the things they are capable of under extraordinary best-of circumstances -- are almost certainly far stronger and better than what we see now. 

Unfortunately, the lousy-beyond-belief-upbringing ship has sailed.

Edited May 8, 2019 by Churchhoney

[bythelake]

1 hour ago, Ijustwantsomechips said:

No shade to anyone that homeschools; you do you.  I’m sure it is the better option for some families, and there are awesome homeschoolers out there. I’ve got to be honest though. I don’t understand what makes some people think they’re qualified to teach a K-12 curriculum based on their own limited education.  I don’t think a high school diploma necessarily qualifies you to do so because you may know the material, but you have no knowledge of pedagogy, child psychology, dealing with special needs/deficits, etc.  Apparently the board of regents or whatever it is in each respective state believes so too, hence higher education curricula and teacher certification in all 50 states.  

That isn’t to say you can’t do a good job with a high school diploma or a degree in various fields.  I would think a person of normal intelligence and confidence would recognize their shortcomings and join a co-op or supplement their instruction with appropriate activities to fill in the gap.  The problem is the Duggars don’t seem to do that.  I don’t think Michelle is dumb by a long shot, and with the right curriculum she could have done a much better job.  But she’s drank too much of the juice (for those who watch ‘“The Path”) to be effective.  She’s too far removed from reality and what skills and background are needed to function in society. 

We laugh at Ben for helping with the homeschooling, but he’s probably the most qualified. He doesn’t come off as such a dim bulb like the others, and he isn’t as aggravating as Derick.   Would I want him teaching my kids? Hell to the no!  I’m a strong proponent of public education because 1)I’m already paying for it, 2)I’m not afraid for my kids to be around children that are black/brown/non-Christian, raised by gay parents/single parents, raised by liberal parents, 3), the socialization and lessons in tolerance are priceless, and 4), everyone needs a break from everyone else, no matter how much you love each other.  

I have a Ph.D., and can teach college courses from Associate’s through doctoral, but even I wouldn’t feel qualified to teach my child his or her entire grade school education, let alone several ages at one time.  I get why they do the crap they do.  Fear of the outside world, indoctrination, yadda yadda yadda.  But at the same time, I just don’t get it.  How could Michelle and Jim Bob look at Josh, Jill, Jessa, and Josiah and not see a spark there?  They didn’t care that those kids craved something more than what they could give, and it didn’t make them a bad parent for not meeting those needs?  

How different could life have been if they’d allowed Josh (as disgusting as he is) to attend a co-op or a Christian school so he could become a lawyer, a businessman, or work in politics.  He’s creepy and smarmy, but he could have made it. He also would have been around other non-related girls his age, and perhaps would have kissed and looked at the boobs of a few girls he liked and got it out of his system like a normal teenage boy.  

Josiah could be in someone’s university studying accounting and living a normal life, and maybe would have met someone better suited to him.  Chances are he’d still be free though because he’d be too busy worrying about preparing for the CPA exam than making babies.  

Poor Jill may not be the brightest, but she had the desire to learn, and could have been a very capable midwife, or just a labor and delivery nurse.  I think she could have made a good doula too.  Hell I don’t care if she only got certification in phlebotomy, if she was fulfilled. Then she could have seen the value in education and chose differently for her children, whom she probably would have had a little later.  Poor Izzy is too bright to be stifled so soon.

As for Jessa, she’s no genius, but she didn’t have much to work with either.  Perhaps marketing, PR, mass comm, or business would have been the right field for her.  Of all the girls, she seems the most capable of working and motherhood simultaneously.  In an alternate universe, she’d work, Ben would stay home, or do his church thing or whatever Ben does, and the boys would go to a Montessori school with a nanny/mommy’s helper a couple nights a week.  

But JB and MOTY are selfish, narcissistic, ignorant bastards, and they’ve doomed at least two generations of Duggars to idiocy and indoctrination.  These people make me sick!

 I agree with most of what you said, but I do take exception to Jill ever becoming a midwife or “just” an L&D nurse. I was an RN (retired ) for over 40 years, and an L&D nurse. 

The courses for becoming an RN or CNM, are strenuous. Not only does one have to study all the systems of the human body and how they function, but how they react to illness. Nurses are taught pharmacology,( the list of medications, uses,and interactions, is in itself daunting),psychology, philosophy and many others. And then, they get to practice on humans!

Being a L&D nurse is more than holding someone’s hand. In 40 years I’ve seen many serious complications, some life threatening to both mother and child. I’ve seen mothers die, and babies die, but mostly the maternity dep’t. is a happy place, that’s why I chose it.

My grandson’s good friend is in college studying to be an RN. He is a bright kid with a great personality, and yet he is struggling with the course load. He laughs when I tell him how it was in the “old days”.

Don’t mean to come down hard on you, I love your posts, but over the years I’ve worked with many great nurses, compassionate,caring, smart people and it hurts when I hear “just” a nurse.

IMO, Jill wouldn’t last a week.

[Ijustwantsomechips]

1 hour ago, BrianJ1962 said:

There's a difference between homeschooling and homefooling

Truer words were never spoken.

[Ijustwantsomechips]

17 minutes ago, bythelake said:

 I agree with most of what you said, but I do take exception to Jill ever becoming a midwife or “just” an L&D nurse. I was an RN (retired ) for over 40 years, and an L&D nurse. 

The courses for becoming an RN or CNM, are strenuous. Not only does one have to study all the systems of the human body and how they function, but how they react to illness. Nurses are taught pharmacology,( the list of medications, uses,and interactions, is in itself daunting),psychology, philosophy and many others. And then, they get to practice on humans!

Being a L&D nurse is more than holding someone’s hand. In 40 years I’ve seen many serious complications, some life threatening to both mother and child. I’ve seen mothers die, and babies die, but mostly the maternity dep’t. is a happy place, that’s why I chose it.

My grandson’s good friend is in college studying to be an RN. He is a bright kid with a great personality, and yet he is struggling with the course load. He laughs when I tell him how it was in the “old days”.

Don’t mean to come down hard on you, I love your posts, but over the years I’ve worked with many great nurses, compassionate,caring, smart people and it hurts when I hear “just” a nurse.

IMO, Jill wouldn’t last a week.

I definitely don’t think of L&D nurses as less than midwives.  I meant if she wanted to pursue that path instead of midwifery, or as an alternative to it. As in she may have decided somewhere along the way that she wanted to “just” keep being an RN and not pursue anything further because she’s happy at that stage.  In all fairness, she may not have been smart enough to do either, but we’ll never know since she wasn’t given the right foundation for either, which is really messed up.  That’s the true issue here, IMHO. 

I’m friends with a CNP, so I have seen up close and personally what goes into the different curricula, and how it affects those in pursuit.  It’s all hard as hell in different ways. I don’t value any nurse over the other because they’re all necessary and all doing a job I had no intentions of doing.  I don’t think it’s a career you should choose based on money, or prestige, but the desire to help and care for people.  I think nurses, like teachers, veterinarians, preachers (looking at you Jeremy) are born not made. It’s got to be in your heart, not just your head.  I guess that’s why I feel like maybe Jill could have found a niche.  She seemed like she had the desire to help and care for women.  I could be wrong though. 

I’ve had some awesome nurses along the way.  Sorry if it sounded like I was attacking nurses.  That’s not what I meant at all.  

Back on topic, I’d still like to see at least one of these kids pursue something on their own other than Instagram shilling. They all suck at that.  

Edited May 8, 2019 by Ijustwantsomechips

[bythelake]

1 hour ago, Ijustwantsomechips said:

I definitely don’t think of L&D nurses as less than midwives.  I meant if she wanted to pursue that path instead of midwifery, or as an alternative to it. As in she may have decided somewhere along the way that she wanted to “just” keep being an RN and not pursue anything further because she’s happy at that stage.  In all fairness, she may not have been smart enough to do either, but we’ll never know since she wasn’t given the right foundation for either, which is really messed up.  That’s the true issue here, IMHO. 

I’m friends with a CNP, so I have seen up close and personally what goes into the different curricula, and how it affects those in pursuit.  It’s all hard as hell in different ways. I don’t value any nurse over the other because they’re all necessary and all doing a job I had no intentions of doing.  I don’t think it’s a career you should choose based on money, or prestige, but the desire to help and care for people.  I think nurses, like teachers, veterinarians, preachers (looking at you Jeremy) are born not made. It’s got to be in your heart, not just your head.  I guess that’s why I feel like maybe Jill could have found a niche.  She seemed like she had the desire to help and care for women.  I could be wrong though. 

I’ve had some awesome nurses along the way.  Sorry if it sounded like I was attacking nurses.  That’s not what I meant at all.  

Back on topic, I’d still like to see at least one of these kids pursue something on their own other than Instagram shilling. They all suck at that.  

I wasn’t comparing myself to a midwife, just saying that the courses for nurses and nurse midwives are very demanding. Lots of science and math. Jill doesn’t have the background in either from her SODRT.education.

Even if she were permitted to try, she’d have to spend a long time taking the required courses for admission to a nursing program. At this point, I don’t think she’s had many of them, if any.

Nursing has gotten a bad rap for years. My family was very upset that I chose nursing because they didn’t think it was respectable..It was what I wanted and I never regretted it.( even in the beginning when my salary was less than the local garbage man)

So, wnen I hear “just” a nurse, it’s upsetting because nurses work extremely hard no matter what their field of nursing. In some fields it’s extremely physical as well as emotional. We serve in the military, we go into the slums, we do mission work in developing countries. 

So, back OT, I know we all wish that the Duggar children would do something, anything to get out into the world and pursue an education, but I doubt it will happen. The husbands of the Duggar girls won’t allow it, and the boys seem to have no initiative. Very sad .

Sorry for the rant. I do love your posts.❤️

[yogi2014L]

4 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

This certainly is the way it's working out. 

The thing is, though, since everybody is shaped by their upbringing -- and it's always just one upbringing and is always skewed and limited toward certain things, no matter how wonderful it is -- I don't believe we can ever tell exactly what somebody's full capabilities are. 

When it comes to the Duggarlings, they clearly don't have the natural independence, rebelliousness, drive, energy or intelligence to veer or walk away from the very skewed and way-more-limited-than-many upbringing they got. And I'm convinced from my own experience that some kids born into that very family would have had the "stuff" by nature to go their own way regardless.  But I've got news -- a lot of people who weren't born into the Duggar household but into empowering and nurturing families likely would have been just as hamstrung now as the current Duggarlings are had they been born into the Duggar household. Everybody who 's out here in the world living like an independent person is taking credit for it -- but in many cases, in my opinion, these same people could not have fought to escape -- as the Duggarlings would have to....They were handed the ability to do it by THEIR empowering upbringings. 

What we don't know about the Duggarlings, in my opinion, is anything about what they'd be like had they had a very different kind of upbringing -- one that really encouraged independence, their individuality, their personal strengths. One that didn't hamstring them. 

Now, I agree that it's certainly possible that even with a very empowering upbringing, some or all of them may not have exhibited energy, discipline, ambition and all that. 

But I also think it's absolutely possible that at least some of them would have. And that if the Duggarlings had been born into a quite different family, we'd see many of them breaking away from their family traditions and making their own choices and that we'd see some of them become lawyers,  nurses and all sorts of things. 

Because in the case of a very different upbringing, they wouldn't have to fight tooth and nail to exert themselves at all. They'd be encouraged to show who they are as individuals. They wouldn't spend their childhoods doing their mother's housework. They'd have education that might be a bit inspiring instead of stultifyingly awful. The situation they faced from infancy would be entirely different! 

As with everyone, I think, the apparent Duggarling capabilities we see are shaped by both nature and nurture. And I really have no doubt that some people who are quite like the Duggars by nature have had their capabilities fostered rather than squelched by their nurture and have become lawyers and nurses and engineers, high-school teachers, ad-agency executives  and whatever else. 

They truly have had an extraordinarily damaging upbringing and  "education," in my opinion. And to me that means that, just by the odds, their true natural capabilities and tendencies -- the things they are capable of under extraordinary best-of circumstances -- are almost certainly far stronger and better than what we see now. 

Unfortunately, the lousy-beyond-belief-upbringing ship has sailed.

I agree ChuchHoney. It is hard for many snarkers who had mostly normal upbringings to really understand what these kids, even the married adults, are up against. it is hard for to fathom the chaos, lack of education and abuse that they all suffered. We see little tiny glimpses here and there on the show ( having to eat in the bathroom, molestation documents, lack of common sense/safety) but I would bet things were much much worse. 

I think the marrieds are about as 'free'  and developed as they ever will be. 

[Ijustwantsomechips]

Thanks @bythelake. I think we can all agree the Duggars are not equipped to handle anything academically challenging based on where they are now, but I wonder what could have been.  People have a right to raise their children how they see fit as long as it’s legal.  It’s just annoying that all the talent and potential was beaten out of them before they could sit unassisted. 

Perhaps Ben’s sisters will have children with less rigid upbringings and it will rub off on Spurge and Henry.  They could get a normal childhood by osmosis.  

[doodlebug]

4 hours ago, bythelake said:

 I agree with most of what you said, but I do take exception to Jill ever becoming a midwife or “just” an L&D nurse. I was an RN (retired ) for over 40 years, and an L&D nurse. 

The courses for becoming an RN or CNM, are strenuous. Not only does one have to study all the systems of the human body and how they function, but how they react to illness. Nurses are taught pharmacology,( the list of medications, uses,and interactions, is in itself daunting),psychology, philosophy and many others. And then, they get to practice on humans!

Being a L&D nurse is more than holding someone’s hand. In 40 years I’ve seen many serious complications, some life threatening to both mother and child. I’ve seen mothers die, and babies die, but mostly the maternity dep’t. is a happy place, that’s why I chose it.

My grandson’s good friend is in college studying to be an RN. He is a bright kid with a great personality, and yet he is struggling with the course load. He laughs when I tell him how it was in the “old days”.

Don’t mean to come down hard on you, I love your posts, but over the years I’ve worked with many great nurses, compassionate,caring, smart people and it hurts when I hear “just” a nurse.

IMO, Jill wouldn’t last a week.

I agree with you; I don't believe Jill has the intellectual curiosity, drive and determination to become an RN.  She surely doesn't have the empathy.  As for working L&D, that is a high acuity, intensive-care like setting.  Jill is not bright enough, intuitive enough, independent enough: she is just not ENOUGH.

[Dirndl]

People like the Duggars make me happy that homeschooling is forbidden in my country and that every child has to be taught the same curriculum. I actually work at a catholic school but we have to teach e.g. sex ed and evolution the same way as public schools, we use the same school books, write the same exams etc. I don't even want to imagine how different the Duggar's lives could have been if they had had the chance to get a good education, spend lots of time with "normal" people and so on. In my opinion it's wrong that parents can isolate and indoctrinate their children in such a way. It's nice to see Spurgeon, Henry and the other Duggar children act like regular kids but I get sad and angry when I think about their future.

[JoanArc]

1 hour ago, doodlebug said:

I agree with you; I don't believe Jill has the intellectual curiosity, drive and determination to become an RN.  She surely doesn't have the empathy.  As for working L&D, that is a high acuity, intensive-care like setting.  Jill is not bright enough, intuitive enough, independent enough: she is just not ENOUGH.

 This mindset is just as toxic as the crap that Jim Bob and  Michelle promote. 

[bigskygirl]

3 hours ago, yogi2014L said:

I agree ChuchHoney. It is hard for many snarkers who had mostly normal upbringings to really understand what these kids, even the married adults, are up against. it is hard for to fathom the chaos, lack of education and abuse that they all suffered. We see little tiny glimpses here and there on the show ( having to eat in the bathroom, molestation documents, lack of common sense/safety) but I would bet things were much much worse. 

I think the marrieds are about as 'free'  and developed as they ever will be. 

The sad fact is the Duggar children are not the only one who have suffered at the hands of their parents or others who were suppose to take care of them.

[ginger90]

[BitterApple]

Cute kiddos and that house desperately needs a power wash.

[Oldernowiser]

And the yard mowed. 

[mynextmistake]

4 hours ago, JoanArc said:

 This mindset is just as toxic as the crap that Jim Bob and  Michelle promote. 

Which mindset? I’m not being argumentative, I want to understand what you mean.

Jessa’s boys are adorable and look happy and healthy. You can tell she genuinely loves being a mom and really enjoys her kids. That’s really nice to see.

[FizzyPuff]

7 hours ago, ginger90 said:

The third photo I thought Spurgeon was holding a dead chicken at first lol I need my eyes checked out. 

[Totally]

24 minutes ago, Puffin said:

The third photo I thought Spurgeon was holding a dead chicken at first lol I need my eyes checked out. 

So did I

[floridamom]

I also noticed that the TTH is in bad shape. It's used like a bus station on a daily basis, but still needs to be taken care of. The tracks on that door are filthy. There is green mold accumulating on the siding and that concrete slab has black  mold and stains on it. It's a perfect example of how JimBob and Michelle don't take care of anything they have. Nor do they take care of ANYONE in their family. They only take care of themselves. They are, IMO, poor examples of everything.

[Churchhoney]

14 hours ago, bigskygirl said:

The sad fact is the Duggar children are not the only one who have suffered at the hands of their parents or others who were suppose to take care of them.

Absolutely. 

This is part of why it pisses me off so much that JB and M were put and kept on television -- there are a lot of people who've been happy to look at them as role models. And having role models who commit the subtler and stealthier forms of child abuse is a really crappy and dangerous thing for society, in my opinion. Because it's already so easy for many people to behave this way and convince themselves -- or just simply believe without even needing to convince themselves -- that they're doing nothing damaging or wrong. 

Edited May 9, 2019 by Churchhoney

[FizzyPuff]

Ben & Jessa, Kiddos & JB at Big Sandy

[bigskygirl]

When is JB due?

[BitterApple]

Jessa's legs look really swollen.

[bigskygirl]

2 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Jessa's legs look really swollen.

And the shoes she is wearing do not help. I cannot imagine having long hair in the heat either. Ben looks like a geek.

Edited May 10, 2019 by bigskygirl

[Churchhoney]

10 minutes ago, bigskygirl said:

And the shoes she is wearing do not help. I cannot imagine having long hair in the heat either. Ben looks like a geek.

He looks more like Charles Spurgeon every day. 

Maybe he intends to use that as his lifeline to the ministry ... like Der has law school and Jer has John Macarthur. 

[NotthebadVictoria]

Blehssas new post about her kiddos reading before 2 is quite sad, such potential and we all know they will not grow up to be productive members of society. 

[Sew Sumi]

[leighdear]

11 hours ago, Puffin said:

Ben & Jessa, Kiddos & JB at Big Sandy

I think Jessa REALLY looks like Jill in this photo.  Poor thing.  And Ben is going full Neanderthal, an equally bad look.  

[awaken]

It’s really pathetic how everyone is giving her an absolute tongue bath over the reading program video. Clearly she lives on the adulation. “You are so amazing!  Such a role lifelong and incredible mom!  Your kids are brilliant!”  🤮

[Zella]

25 minutes ago, leighdear said:

And Ben is going full Neanderthal, an equally bad look.  

I was going to make a Geico "So easy a caveman could do it" joke for him, but I'm not sure even a caveman would want to live in Jessa's filthy house. 

[Sew Sumi]

@awaken, Don't forget, she deletes and blocks naysayers.

Edited May 11, 2019 by Sew Sumi

[louannems]

I still can't get over just how huge Jim Bob's head is!  I know they always joke about the Duggar head, but seeing him next to Jessa and Ben puts it in perspective!

[BrianJ1962]

10 minutes ago, louannems said:

I still can't get over just how huge Jim Bob's head is!  I know they always joke about the Duggar head, but seeing him next to Jessa and Ben puts it in perspective!

[DangerousMinds]

59 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

@awaken, Don't forget, she deletes and blocks naysayers.

I love that someone still uses the word “naysayers!”

[Oldernowiser]

17 minutes ago, louannems said:

I still can't get over just how huge Jim Bob's head is!  I know they always joke about the Duggar head, but seeing him next to Jessa and Ben puts it in perspective!

Well, a lot of it is chins...

[leighdear]

6 hours ago, Zella said:

I was going to make a Geico "So easy a caveman could do it" joke for him, but I'm not sure even a caveman would want to live in Jessa's filthy house. 

A little stubble is ok, but I abhor full beards in general.  If he won't shave for me, I won't shave for him.  And he's got just ONE location to worry about, so pull out that razor, buddy!   *LOL*

[FizzyPuff]

6 hours ago, awaken said:

It’s really pathetic how everyone is giving her an absolute tongue bath over the reading program video. Clearly she lives on the adulation. “You are so amazing!  Such a role lifelong and incredible mom!  Your kids are brilliant!”  🤮

Ok maybe I’m easily impressed and I don’t have kids but I was amazed that a two year old can read (kinda) certain words he didn’t say properly but he’s two! If her fans wanna tell her how amazing she is for teaching him to read go for it, she could be teaching these kids worst things or nothing at all.

5 hours ago, BrianJ1962 said:

Uh this photo is creepy. 

Edited May 11, 2019 by Puffin

[GeeGolly]

The video of Spurge repeating sight words comes naturally to children who are read to. It's the same as an 18 month old knowing french fries come from the building with the giant yellow M. I don't understand the need to make it into a forced lesson when a kid is still in diapers.

Not that it matters anyway. The Seewald kids will still be forced to recite (not understand) the Bible and will still have Ben & Jessa as their lifelong teachers.

On the positive side the boys are getting attention from their parents and not wandering aimlessly getting their heads stuck in railings.

[ginger90]

The others laughing at Henry pisses me off.

[DangerousMinds]

So Bin is the only son in law who didn’t get his new family away from Gothard. Sad.

[bigskygirl]

32 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

So Bin is the only son in law who didn’t get his new family away from Gothard. Sad.

We all know who wears the pants in the house, and it is not Ben.

[Temperance]

1 hour ago, DangerousMinds said:

So Bin is the only son in law who didn’t get his new family away from Gothard. Sad.

Austin and Joy were at Big Sandy (the IBLP conference) as well. Which makes Ben one of two SILs who didn't get his family away from IBLP. Gothard wasn't there anyway.

[galaxychaser]

I think Ben grew a beard to look older. Jessa needs a haircut. 

[BrianJ1962]

Just now, galaxychaser said:

I think Ben grew a beard to look older. Jessa needs a haircut. 

Dear Benny you can put lipstick on a pig but It's still a pig

[Churchhoney]

28 minutes ago, Temperance said:

Austin and Joy were at Big Sandy (the IBLP conference) as well. Which makes Ben one of two SILs who didn't get his family away from IBLP. Gothard wasn't there anyway.

Of course Austin's family are Gothard too. So he'd have had to pull twice as hard to get loose....Especially since he's going to inherit the camp from his (I guess?) still full-on Gothardite dad?

[bigskygirl]

13 minutes ago, BrianJ1962 said:

Dear Benny you can put lipstick on a pig but It's still a pig

You are insulting pigs especially since pigs can be intelligent.

16 minutes ago, galaxychaser said:

I think Ben grew a beard to look older. Jessa needs a haircut. 

Jessa needs more like a complete glamour makeover, but I doubt she would get one.

[DangerousMinds]

49 minutes ago, Temperance said:

Austin and Joy were at Big Sandy (the IBLP conference) as well. Which makes Ben one of two SILs who didn't get his family away from IBLP. Gothard wasn't there anyway.

True, but Austin was raised in the cult. Bin was not.

Edited May 11, 2019 by DangerousMinds

[Temperance]

I forget Austin's family was IBLP since they only have 2 kids. 

Anyway Ben seems to have grown up more fundie than the other brother-in-laws (not including Austin).