Jessa, Ben and Their Brood: Making a (Diaper) Mountain out of a Mold House

[farmgal4]

Wow, so Jessa had no midwife? I wonder what was up with that. I long suspected she wasn't receiving any kind of real prenatal care. Her ultrasounds were done at one of those strip mall places, not a medical office. Although I don't wish a dangerous delivery on anyone, I'm not surprised Jessa's arrogance came back to bite her in the ass. Will these people ever learn?

Note to Bin and Jessa: use some of your People money to buy some freaking health insurance through the ACA so you don't have to do another Dark Ages birth. Or better yet, get an actual job with benefits.

If she actually went thru a home birth without a qualified midwife, she is dumber than dumb. She is a complete and utter moron.

ETA: If she went thru a home birth with an unqualified midwife aka Teresa, she is just as much of a moron IMO.

Edited November 17, 2015 by farmgal4

[kokapetl]

I think the "real" (minimally trained, sketchily licensed) midwife wants to keep a low profile. You know, gubermint, ACORN death panels, muslins etc.

[NikSac]

I feel genuinely bad for Jana if she was coerced into acting as midwife. She explicitly said in an episode that being in charge of a birth situation scared her. That is why she chose to train as a doula, not a midwife.

 

No kidding. I remember the episode where she kind of panicked with Josie's seizure.  This is no 'ding' to Jana, because she never should've been put in that situation with Josie (or Jessa, if true), but I just don't think she's cut out to handle intense medical situations. And that's okay, because different people are good at different things. If she was pushed into acting as a midwife I feel awful for her.

[NikSac]

The French even do scathing better than anyone...bravo.

 

And in English even so the Duggars - er - Seewalds could understand it. Nice!

[Defrauder]

Ben and the cult he follows just can't claim they have lack of freedom of religion because if they lacked freedom of religion they'd be in prison or arrested for posting about their lack of freedom of religion.  They post in freedom about their lack of freedom.   Ben has never lacked freedom but wants to feel persecuted for not being able to force everyone to follow his beliefs.  Fortunately we in this country have freedom to choose to not be religious, and unless I see Ben in prison for his religious beliefs he and his cult have no complaint about lack of freedom of religion.  They just want to feel persecuted to make themselves feel like holy victims and martyrs as part of God's army - as they like to call themselves.  Give me a break none of them have ever lacked any freedom to pursue their religion and they are spoiled little brats for claiming such.  They have no idea what lack of freedom really is and if they truly feel they are not free to follow their religion they are free to leave. 

[Guest]

I'm probably going to hell for sharing this, but it made me laugh. 

 

(Click on the image to enlarge it!)

http://duggarmemes.tumblr.com/image/133304166154

Edited November 17, 2015 by Guest

[BrianJ62]

I'm probably going to hell for sharing this, but it made me laugh.

http://duggarmemes.tumblr.com/image/133304166154

I'm a permanent resident of hell

[OhioMom]

For the love of God (no pun intended), they just had a healthy baby. Isn't this the time to praise God (if you're in to that) for the little miracle that is your baby rather than focus on sin and the evil world? Can't they ever celebrate the goodness of God instead of fear the wrath? Their version of religion is so depressing I wonder why they bother to reproduce at all. Try a little grace sometimes, it might be a refreshing change!

ETA: I'd like to think that Jesus would tell them to lighten up.

All of this from an atheist, mind you.

Up until the last  year or so, I attended a church like this.  It never sat right with me (all that darkness, doom and gloom).  Plus, being constantly told I was a dirty, rotten sinner and no good, also didn't help.  Now, I kind of feel like it was emotional abuse.   Like you, I'd like to think that Jesus would tell people like this to lighten up.  I'm not an atheist (at this point), but I have lost something...which is sad. 

 

Sorry for taking the discussion away from the new little family. Carry on!

[OhioMom]

People say weird shit after natural & man-made disasters. We had a natural disaster in my area a few years back, I was in line at a Dunkin and the Dunkin employees were commenting that not one church was damaged and that should send a message to the people whose homes were damaged. I was speechless.

I would add to that:  People who move in certain religious circles say weird sh*t after natural and man made disasters.  And then there are just weridos out there.

Edited November 18, 2015 by OhioMom

[Tunia]

MSNBC was just a little too late with this article:

http://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/lifestyle-general/12-baby-names-that-should-be-illegal/ss-BBn4MnW#image=3

 

A quote from a French judge (after encountering a couple who wanted to name their daughter Nutella), really says it all: 

Nutella
In January, a French couple's choice for their daughter got the axe. "It is contrary to the child's interest to have a name that can only lead to teasing or disparaging thoughts," the judge pronounced.

 

By the way - LOL - North West made the list!  I guess there wasn't enough time before publication to add Spurgeon.

[OhioMom]

The Spurge is actually cute. It looks like he wipes his mouth after yawning. LOL!

 

https://www.facebook.com/JessaSeewald/videos/769903609803497/

35,000+ likes

[cmr2014]

•  IT literally said a team of Midwives, Michelle, Guinn, Jana and Jinger arrived to help her [Jessa]. 

 

This is a punctuation issue. If it said a team of Midwives: a, b, c, d -- that would mean a team of midwives, namely a, b, c, d. But, if it was written as transcribed here: a team of Midwives, a, b, c, d -- then it means a team of midwives AND a, b, c, d.

 

Since I didn't read it, I don't doubt your interpretation of the article, but my gut feeling is that Jessa did have midwives and People didn't do a very good job of making that clear. I think that both Jill and Jessa had at least one midwife, and they also had a "birthing team" which consisted of family members who I think are supposed to coach and assist in some way, but seem more like honorary positions to me. IfI recall correctly, Jill's "team" consisted of her mother, Jana, and Derick's mom.

[NikSac]

This is a punctuation issue. If it said a team of Midwives: a, b, c, d -- that would mean a team of midwives, namely a, b, c, d. But, if it was written as transcribed here: a team of Midwives, a, b, c, d -- then it means a team of midwives AND a, b, c, d.

 

Since I didn't read it, I don't doubt your interpretation of the article, but my gut feeling is that Jessa did have midwives and People didn't do a very good job of making that clear. I think that both Jill and Jessa had at least one midwife, and they also had a "birthing team" which consisted of family members who I think are supposed to coach and assist in some way, but seem more like honorary positions to me. IfI recall correctly, Jill's "team" consisted of her mother, Jana, and Derick's mom.

 

I embarrassed myself tonight by reading this article in the grocery store line (no, didn't buy the magazine either lol). I had to read it kind of fast, so I didn't get to completely 'analyze' it, but I thought it was really vague how it was worded.

[JoanArc]

35,000+ likes

Minimal for reality TV.  I mean even Jill has 2 million followers.

[Oldernowiser]

You're probably right about People misrepresenting the circumstances and cast members...but if in fact there was anyone with any medical training or credentials present at Jessa's labor, why the hell weren't they on the call to 911 instead of Grandma Clueless Fuckwit?

A real medical professional gets on the phone because he/she speaks the language and knows which facts to communicate and in what order to facilitate both the triage that the dispatcher needs to do and to prepare the EMT team for what to expect and how best to treat the patient quickly once they arrive.

I wouldn't rely on Michelle to call AAA if I had a flat tire, so WTF with her phoning in a potentially life threatening delivery complication???

I call bullshit.

[Chicklet]

Oh well I don't know about 911 in rural places. A friend of mine was having a heart attack in my living room one summer and I called 911, who when I said "he's having an MI", said "what's that". I nearly hung up then and drove him to the hospital myself. And I swear to god, when the EMT's got there, the first guy up the steps was WEARING OXYGEN. His.own.oxygen. And a cannister for himself. It was like the twilight zone and I was honestly scared for my friend.

So telling them what the patient needs doesn't always get you what the patient needs.

And Michelle is the queen and she always has to get to perform so of course they had her phone in the problem.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Chicklet

[MarysWetBar]

Oh well I don't know about 911 in rural places. A friend of mine was having a heart attack in my living room one summer and I called 911, who when I said "he's having an MI", said "what's that". I nearly hung up then and drove him to the hospital myself. And I swear to god, when the EMT's got there, the first guy up the steps was WEARING OXYGEN. His.own.oxygen. And a cannister for himself. It was like the twilight zone and I was honestly scared for my friend.

So telling them what the patient needs doesn't always get you what the patient needs.

And Michelle is the queen and she always has to get to perform so of course they had her phone in the problem.

OMG...hahaha! His own oxygen!! I remember back in my hospice days we had to call in an agency nurse t to cover a sick call and she was about 123 years old. She sat down at the desk and promptly fell asleep beside me. One of the patient's family members gave me shit for not helping her to her room/bed. I didn't tell him she was the RN on duty...lol Edited November 18, 2015 by MarysWetBar

[Oldernowiser]

I get what you're saying but in defense of rural America, I've had far more attentive and expert care in one ambulance ride and two ER visits here in Nowhere, Maine, than I ever did in NYC, Seattle, or metro Detroit ERs.

Sometimes being in a low population area works for you instead of against you.

[Sew Sumi]

You're probably right about People misrepresenting the circumstances and cast members...but if in fact there was anyone with any medical training or credentials present at Jessa's labor, why the hell weren't they on the call to 911 instead of Grandma Clueless Fuckwit?

A real medical professional gets on the phone because he/she speaks the language and knows which facts to communicate and in what order to facilitate both the triage that the dispatcher needs to do and to prepare the EMT team for what to expect and how best to treat the patient quickly once they arrive.

I wouldn't rely on Michelle to call AAA if I had a flat tire, so WTF with her phoning in a potentially life threatening delivery complication???

I call bullshit.

This goes back to the possibility that Kokapetl raised about a possible "midwife" present having shady credentials, at best. I also bet that if Vanessa or the shack ladies were there that they beat a hasty retreat before the EMTs arrived. Not that they'd be missed; the Mold House appeared to be a veritable zoo of Duggars taking selfies with Spurgey Brown Towel. 

[NikSac]

You're probably right about People misrepresenting the circumstances and cast members...but if in fact there was anyone with any medical training or credentials present at Jessa's labor, why the hell weren't they on the call to 911 instead of Grandma Clueless Fuckwit?

 

That's a really good point. Not to defend any of this mess, but maybe the medically trained (??) person was caring for Jessa so it was better to have someone else call? 

[cmr2014]

This goes back to the possibility that Kokapetl raised about a possible "midwife" present having shady credentials, at best. I also bet that if Vanessa or the shack ladies were there that they beat a hasty retreat before the EMTs arrived. Not that they'd be missed; the Mold House appeared to be a veritable zoo of Duggars taking selfies with Spurgey Brown Towel. 

 

My take on this is that JB offered them the opportunity to be on TV and get free publicity in return for free care. The midwives said "No," and are, therefore, barely mentioned.

[drafan]

I get almost nauseous looking at those two but that baby is downright adorable. He's one of the cutest newborns I've seen.

 

I think all the grandsons look like JB. The two MGirls are clones of Anna. Or maybe it's just that JB looks like a waterlogged newborn.

[Sew Sumi]

Well, we have to remember that the Shack ladies allowed their 'office" to be filmed, but they were nowhere to be found in the Muffy Gives Birth, Badly episode. Did Muffy ditch them? Did they go gunshy? Lose their licenses? 

 

Inquiring minds...

[Chicklet]

One wonders exactly why the "Shack Ladies" even allowed that hovel to be filmed. It didn't exactly inspire confidence to see their offices housed in that so-called building. Can people be that thirsty for being seen on tv? It just didn't bode well.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Chicklet

[Sew Sumi]

I found it stranger that they were nowhere to be found when they were needed later on. IF Jessa had midwives, I would guess she used Duggar-approved people. But, given what we know, that's a big IF. 

[Chicklet]

Well clearly they had to beat feet out of there because Jill was in trouble and they knew they were in over their heads. Great humanitarians those guys. I hope they never deliver another baby.

[Sew Sumi]

There are holes you could drive a semi through in both birth stories. And both left Duggar girls behind in distress. Although I blame Jill for a lot, if not most, of her problems. Jessa actually relied on someone else (she had SOMEONE, didn't she?) to guide her through her pregnancy and delivery. 

[NikSac]

Ugh I can't even believe it took me so long to think of this, but if there were real midwives who didn't want to be on TV (understandable!), did they have Michelle call because she WOULD be filmed?

[Temperance]

This is a punctuation issue. If it said a team of Midwives: a, b, c, d -- that would mean a team of midwives, namely a, b, c, d. But, if it was written as transcribed here: a team of Midwives, a, b, c, d -- then it means a team of midwives AND a, b, c, d.

 

Since I didn't read it, I don't doubt your interpretation of the article, but my gut feeling is that Jessa did have midwives and People didn't do a very good job of making that clear. I think that both Jill and Jessa had at least one midwife, and they also had a "birthing team" which consisted of family members who I think are supposed to coach and assist in some way, but seem more like honorary positions to me. IfI recall correctly, Jill's "team" consisted of her mother, Jana, and Derick's mom.

It's my punctuation that's wrong. They called the people her team of midwives. My use of the word literal is to imply they literally called these people midwives who I think have very little training to be midwives. The reason I went back is I agreed in my gut with your reasoning. I felt there should be a real midwife. However if there was People left the woman out. My memory is the exact punctuation was a team of midwives----Michelle, Guinn, and her two sisters Jana and Jinger---, but I'm not looking exactly at what it said and my memory on punctuation is limited.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Temperance

[Sew Sumi]

Ugh I can't even believe it took me so long to think of this, but if there were real midwives who didn't want to be on TV (understandable!), did they have Michelle call because she WOULD be filmed?

That is what was so odd about Jill's situation. First, they allowed themselves to be filmed at the shack, then...nothing for the birth episode, which portrayed Jill as acting as her own midwife, with Mechelle, Cathy, and Jana (?) as coaches. 

 

What happened in the interim? Did they come back to assist Jessa, but chose to stay off camera (and off the phone)?

 

I don't think we'll ever know the truth in either case. 

[cmr2014]

I agree that there is something very sketchy about the whole midwife situation and, knowing the Duggars, it's entirely possible that they referred to themselves as midwives because they've seen midwives work before.

 

I think it's likely that they gave conflicting or confusing information to the writer at People. This isn't wildly important news that needs to be rushed out the door, and People has competent writers on staff. It's possible that the writer just sucks, but I tend to think that the problem is in Arkansas. The Duggars have certainly provided unclear and conflicting information in the past about things that are not particularly controversial and don't really require evasion.

 

Maybe there's some sort of pride in Gothard-land about just dropping a baby in a field and returning to work. In the video where Priscilla shows off her newborn, we see her 30 minutes after the birth all dressed and made up, and there is no mid-wife in sight. Maybe they're trying to straddle two worlds and want to imply -- for the fundies -- that they gave birth with no assistance, while trying to assure everyone else that, of course, they had trained professionals on-hand.

 

ETA: Nothing. Just too many spelling and punctuation errors to let it go.

Edited November 18, 2015 by cmr2014

[leighroda]

I just wanted to weigh in on who called 911, I'm a nurse and if the situation warrants it normally i would have someone else call 911. It's all dependent on the situation, now someone could simply put 911 on speaker, or be in the room and repeat what I say...but ultimately the most trained professional (assuming if there is a professional in a room) is usually directly caring for the patient.

[GeeGolly]

I think that Jessa & Jill opted for home deliveries for the same reason they do most things - pride. Many people (not all) who deliver 'naturally' feel that they are better, and more caring of their newborn, if they deliver medication free, and even more so with no medical interventions at all. For J & J, I think it is another way for them to display a sacrifice made for another, and how they, as Duggar woman, are better than the average selfish woman thinking only of herself and not her child.

 

(Not my belief, I welcomed the modern medicine involved in my deliveries)

 

I find it odd that neither has explained their reasoning for wanting a home birth, because they tend to repeatedly explain their reasons for courting, modest dress, etc.

[SomePity1066]

I think that Jessa & Jill opted for home deliveries for the same reason they do most things - pride. Many people (not all) who deliver 'naturally' feel that they are better, and more caring of their newborn, if they deliver medication free, and even more so with no medical interventions at all. For J & J, I think it is another way for them to display a sacrifice made for another, and how they, as Duggar woman, are better than the average selfish woman thinking only of herself and not her child.

 

(Not my belief, I welcomed the modern medicine involved in my deliveries)

 

I find it odd that neither has explained their reasoning for wanting a home birth, because they tend to repeatedly explain their reasons for courting, modest dress, etc.

I blame the whole Mommy Martyr thing on the popular, current social tidal wave that says if you don't have some kind of nauseatingly transcendent experience giving birth in a pool of dolphins while softly cooing as your partner rubs you with sage oil and chants your labor mantra then you've done it ALL WRONG !!!

 

If that's your thing then good on you, but in Jessa's (and Jill's !) case, their desire to go that route put themselves and their unborn children in peril because neither of them knew what they were doing, and they were surrounded by people who also didn't know what they were doing. I don't believe for one second that any of Jill's so-called midwifery "skills" were put into play as she stubbornly, pridefully, dangerously delayed going to the hospital, and Jessa followed suit by stubbornly, pridefully, dangerously remaining at home while attended by God knows who and, perhaps/perhaps not, an unlicensed midwife with a questionable background.

 

They were trying to one-up each other, certainly, with the whole "look how brave I am as a Warrior Mama !" thing, but I think there's an element of F.U. Michelle in there, too. After all, Michelle had only TWO home births out of 19, and those were well after she'd had so many that they were probably just popping out like a Jack in the Box.

 

I keep hearing the song in my head "Anything you can do I can do better, I can do anything better than you..."

[Guest]

Even the CPM hacks that "trained" Jill want everyone to know that they did not assist with Jessa's delivery. Or Jill's delivery, for that matter. 

 

Passive aggressive much? Clearly, they've had a parting of ways...

 

https://www.facebook.com/269181913180625/photos/a.269728809792602.55371.269181913180625/824967387602072/?type=3&theater

Edited November 18, 2015 by Guest

[louannems]

https://instagram.com/p/-J50s4gJqt/

Ben adores baby Spurgeon's hat. Like dressing a doll, Ben? Baby is back in prison attire, again.

[iwadrade]

That is what was so odd about Jill's situation. First, they allowed themselves to be filmed at the shack, then...nothing for the birth episode, which portrayed Jill as acting as her own midwife, with Mechelle, Cathy, and Jana (?) as coaches. 

 

What happened in the interim? Did they come back to assist Jessa, but chose to stay off camera (and off the phone)?

 

I don't think we'll ever know the truth in either case. 

 

 

My gut instinct is they had NO medical help with either birth until they went to the hospital. They are not being honest with the reason why. Remember when Anna had her baby at home bc she said she did not want a new doctor to deliver the baby. They had no plans of using these doctors or midwives at all until it's an emergency. I'm confused as always.

[JenCarroll]

I love when I get to see these things before they've had time to edit the comments. :-)

_____________________________

"Yeah, it would be great if you didn't teach him to hate Catholics like his namesake..."

"lol at "Spurgeon."

"Spurgeon??? What made u all pick that name? Well anyway he's a cutie...congratulations we all have been waiting a long time to see that little person"

"Why didn't they just leave his name as Quincy then if they were already calling him that? The nickname also has nothing to do with the actual name, so it seems a little pointless and weird if you ask me. Not trying to criticize, but I really do wonder what goes through people's minds sometimes"

"Horrible name precious baby"

"Poor baby has him as a father."

"If i was that baby I would hate my life"

"please be sure to move the chest clip up higher! Or your not protecting the babies vital organs!!!"

"Your wife just blocked me. And all I said was that it was a shame that you named your son after a man who preached hate against the Catholic Church. Jesus said, "A new commandment I give unto you: That you love one another, as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, if you have love one for another." I'm praying for you guys. You need the prayers."

"they don't like anyone stating the truth , so you aren't allowed to do that here or you get blocked."

"Yeah she likes to block people. She can block people but she can't reply to people? I wish she had more humility and was more humble."

[Churchhoney]

https://instagram.com/p/-J50s4gJqt/

Ben adores baby Spurgeon's hat. Like dressing a doll, Ben? Baby is back in prison attire, again.

 

I'm with you on not liking that hat, Baby Spurgeon. I wouldn't want to wear a hat that's bigger than I am, either . And isn't it still too danged warm for that hat? And it looks as if he's wearing it inside the house?

[Readalot]

Even the CPM hacks that "trained" Jill want everyone to know that they did not assist with Jessa's delivery. Or Jill's delivery, for that matter.

Passive aggressive much? Clearly, they've had a parting of ways...

https://www.facebook.com/269181913180625/photos/a.269728809792602.55371.269181913180625/824967387602072/?type=3&theater

wow and interesting. The plot thickens....now I'm thinking there was just family at both births? I don't remember if in Jill's special if there were non family members shown (I know there could of been but they didn't want to be filmed). This makes the outcomes not surprising and very scary. Thankfully they all came out of it healthy and safe. I hope they choose differently next time.

[Skittl1321]

I'm with you on not liking that hat, Baby Spurgeon. I wouldn't want to wear a hat that's bigger than I am, either . And isn't it still too danged warm for that hat? And it looks as if he's wearing it inside the house?

 

Babies are almost always dressed warmer than adults because they don't regulate their temperature as well. It is quite normal for a baby to wear a warm hat in a house, even in a warm climate. 

 

I think Little Spurg looks pretty cute in his hat though. 

[JoanArc]

Wow, they basically said Jill and Jessa are fools.

 

Also, apparently Vanessa's midwife business was located out of the Pool House before the Duggars bought it? Pickles said so. Did they buy it from Vanessa? Wha? The plot keeps thickening.

[SomePity1066]

Even the CPM hacks that "trained" Jill want everyone to know that they did not assist with Jessa's delivery. Or Jill's delivery, for that matter. 

 

Passive aggressive much? Clearly, they've had a parting of ways...

 

https://www.facebook.com/269181913180625/photos/a.269728809792602.55371.269181913180625/824967387602072/?type=3&theater

Wowie ! I got an immediate picture in my head when I read the hacks' (hackstresses ?) FB post of women in prairie dresses slowly backing out of the room while holding a finger to their lips...

 

When the leg-humpiest of the leg-humpers start to distance themselves from the Gothard Star Students then you KNOW something bad went down. Maybe they're mad (or embarrassed) that Jilly Muffin made such a colossal clusterfuck out of her delivery, and then Jessa just piled on for good measure ? It's like they own a driving school and we all just watched the students have car accidents. 

"please be sure to move the chest clip up higher! Or your not protecting the babies vital organs!!!"

This is my most favorite comment EVER, JennCarroll, and I don't even know why !!! Just strikes me as the ultimate thing a Duggar fan would say in that "we love you, but..." way that their kind of folk are so passive-aggressively good at. The ONLY thing that's missing is that "vital organs" isn't capitalized ! For whatever reason they LOVE to capitalize in the most random, hilarious way possible. 

Edited November 18, 2015 by SomePity1066

[BitterApple]

I have a feeling that Jill's midwife might have given her solid and appropriate advice and Jill chose to ignore it because she's God's special snowflake who knew better. The downside of appearing with the Duggars is that they made her look like an incompetent fool and her business likely took a hit.

I'm leaning towards Jessa having an unlicensed or dubiously credentialed midwife for her botched delivery with the Spurge.

[Joe Jitsu913]

I have a feeling that Jill's midwife might have given her solid and appropriate advice and Jill chose to ignore it because she's God's special snowflake who knew better.

Well she IS Dr. Jill, Medicine Woman, after all . She's practically a medical professional according to Michelle.

[barbedwire]

What about Jana?  Wasn't she training to be a mid-wife too?  Maybe they relied upon her.

[Guest]

What about Jana?  Wasn't she training to be a mid-wife too?  Maybe they relied upon her.

 

She trained to be a doula (labor coach), not a midwife, and she freely admitted that being in charge of a birth situation scared her. I hope poor Jana was not forced to act as Jessa's midwife and they're just omitting the attending CPM's name to cover for her. 

Edited November 18, 2015 by Guest

[barbedwire]

Oh, yes, I forgot about that.  Thanks!  And, geez, if being in charge of a birth scares her I sure hope no one forced her to do that!!

[JoanArc]

Well she IS Dr. Jill, Medicine Woman, after all . She's practically a medical professional according to Michelle.

More like according to Jill.

[Absolom]

At one point after Jana said she didn't want to be a midwife, she was on the state midwife apprentice list.  Either she willingly changed her mind or it was changed for her.