Artistic Gymnastics: Stick the Landing!

[CeeBeeGee]

11 hours ago, Scovies said:

Aly's parents get a bad rep around here, but honestly, I don't blame them for acting the way they do. I get like that - really physical with my reactions - with my favorite gymnasts and football teams, and I don't even know the competitors. If a family member or loved one of mine was competing I'm sure I'd look obnoxious to outsiders too. Aly's parents don't seem like famewhores in the slightest and I was charmed by her brother crying over her AA medal; I think NBC just realized that they'd struck gold with them in 2012 and have kept a camera trained on them since. All they're doing is sitting in the stands and reacting to their daughter in a really perilous sport.

I love her parents! They absolutely slay me. I love it when her dad leans back, eyes glued to Aly.

I am of course thrilled for Aly and Simone--what an amazing Olympics for both of them! So very proud of them--Simone for withstanding the incredible pressure with such grace, Aly for the hard work of clawing her way back to the top after so much time off.  And she's better than she was in '12! Also thrilled for Amy Tinkler--yet another non-Big 4 medalist! One in each event final!

 

2 hours ago, aquarian1 said:

I only have a minor quibble with this assumption. Yes, online viewership has gone up in general, but I know people who watch online because they have to in order to see shows they are interested in, not because they prefer watching online.  As for the Olympics, I have watched online, but also because I had to in  order to see full coverage of certain events like gymnastics.  I'd prefer it on my TV.  And to make matters worse, but this part is out of NBC's hands so not their fault, Chrome wouldn't play the livestream for some reason, so I couldn't even Chromecast to my TV since I had to view in MS Edge.  Of course, that didn't matter during the week because I was at work and if I wanted to watch live had to livestream on my iPad mini or my phone.  Which I'm really not supposed to do.  I should be working while at work. which I did.

I couldn't stream from Chrome either, I figured I had to shut down and reboot and I had too many windows open for that. So I downloaded the NBC sports app and then was able to Chromecast via my phone. For the rest of this week I'm going to watch the livestream versions of the team final and the EFs. I don't want it to end!

[HartofDixie]

Olympic Champions 1952-2016

Team:

 

All Around:

 

Vault:

 

Uneven Bars:

 

Balance Beam:

 

Floor Exercise: 

[Mumbles]

Quote

It's really nice to see women gymnasts that look healthy and well fed.  I hope the trend toward starved, dead-eyed twigs that were all the rage in the 90's never returns.

Agreed. I remember Kerri Strug's big moment and my thought at the time was how fragile she looked. Most of these gymnasts look, in addition to being incredibly fit, also healthy. (I *still* have my doubts about the age of the Chinese gymnasts.) I'm sure their diets are controlled as far as rationing fats, carbs etc - but they are not emaciated.

I thought the Costas interview was fine, but it is getting a fair amount of criticism (the AP called it cringe-worthy) for focusing on silly things rather than about their performances. I thought it made them look human, which doesn't come out when they're in competition mode.

[andromeda331]

3 hours ago, aquarian1 said:

I only have a minor quibble with this assumption. Yes, online viewership has gone up in general, but I know people who watch online because they have to in order to see shows they are interested in, not because they prefer watching online.  As for the Olympics, I have watched online, but also because I had to in  order to see full coverage of certain events like gymnastics.  I'd prefer it on my TV.  And to make matters worse, but this part is out of NBC's hands so not their fault, Chrome wouldn't play the livestream for some reason, so I couldn't even Chromecast to my TV since I had to view in MS Edge.  Of course, that didn't matter during the week because I was at work and if I wanted to watch live had to livestream on my iPad mini or my phone.  Which I'm really not supposed to do.  I should be working while at work. which I did.

This yes! That's the whole reason I went online in the first place too. I wanted to watch all of gymnastics on TV but they only showed the little bit they showed. I'd been happy if they showed all of gymnastics or even just more of it. The part that still annoys me is still the part where they wasted so much time on nothing. Had they been busy filling the time with swimming or another sport I wouldn't have been upset. I understand there's tons of different games going on each day and it would be hard to for them to show every single event and all of the matches in those events and it would be hard to try and fit everything or as much as everything they can on TV. But that's not what happened.  We got a small amount of gymnastics while they went back to show us Phelps sitting in a chair waiting for his next meet.  They had plenty of time to show more but chose not to forcing those who could to go online to watch gymnastics in its entirety.

Edited August 17, 2016 by andromeda331

[choclatechip45]

36 minutes ago, Mumbles said:

Agreed. I remember Kerri Strug's big moment and my thought at the time was how fragile she looked. Most of these gymnasts look, in addition to being incredibly fit, also healthy. (I *still* have my doubts about the age of the Chinese gymnasts.) I'm sure their diets are controlled as far as rationing fats, carbs etc - but they are not emaciated.

I thought the Costas interview was fine, but it is getting a fair amount of criticism (the AP called it cringe-worthy) for focusing on silly things rather than about their performances. I thought it made them look human, which doesn't come out when they're in competition mode.

I thought the Costas  was interview was funny. My dad who is a four year fan didn't like it. He thought it was nice that they were human. He  thinks Simone is the best interviewee of the five said he can't believe Simone and Katie Ledecky are the same age. Granted he also said he feels these girls act younger because they don't spend a lot of time out of the gym.  He thinks Aly is the most immature one out of the five and needs to start hanging out with people her age. 

Edited August 17, 2016 by choclatechip45

[Arynm]

I watched online until I figured out that my tv/cable box was smart enough to show the streaming on Tv. Since my TV is much larger than my laptop screen I prefer to watch there. I did at one point have the TV, plus 3 tabs open streaming to make sure I didn't miss any gymnastics. I like the streaming, and I much prefer the announcers. I love having the option to watch what I want, instead of being feed what NBC wants to show me. I have found all kinds of sports that I never would have watched otherwise.

[topanga]

13 hours ago, Daisy said:

Probably, but my thing is - for me, if you can't properly execute something that is basic - how are you truly supposed to master the more difficult stuff? (I may be channeling my personal trainer here LOL). 

Plus it's my dream world. i know none of that will happen, and i always liked compulsories. Im a nerd. 

But I hear the commentators mentioning certain "required skills" that the gymnasts have to include in their routines: a turn, a lift, a tumbling pass, connecting two skills, etc.  I like the way the gymnasts include these skills in their own unique way. I wouldn't want to see the same routine over and over. 

11 hours ago, Daisy said:

i was just having a debate with someone and all of them were just like well they should just take the artistic side of gymnastics out completely. i nearly flipped out lol and it wasn't even like i was saying that oh yah we need more dance elements or whatever, but I do think and I think this came up during beam. Sanne Wevers routine was unique, beautiful, and difficult. I get that it might not be for everyone (just like I know Aly's routines aren't for everyone, just like way back when Dominque Dawes/Kerri Strug were different than Shannon Miller and Lila Pod.) but I feel they were respected more. and you saw more aspects of it now it just seems that being unique and dare-devil-esque is what everyone wants - but in my mind.. sure someone can do an incredibly tumbling pass, with a blind landing and stay on - and it's difficult..

but I would think doing a triple twist, arabesque turn, full turn, on a 4 inch 4 feet high beam - is equally dare-devil-esque in a different kind of way and i just feel that is dying in this sport :(

One reason  I've loved gymnastics since my childhood is that it's the perfect combination of artistry and athleticism.  I like gymnasts who are able to combine both, without relying on one more than the other. 

Which is why I love Simone's floor and beam routines. She is obviously a great tumbler and athlete, but she also incorporates elements of dance, flexibility, and spinning into those routines.  I feel the same way about Laurie. In fact, I think Laurie should have gotten the gold medal for the beam. Sanne Wevers did have some incredible spins and leaps--she was a joy to watch. But I can't remember one tumbling pass that she performed. I know she had some--they're required. But I just don't remember them. In contrast, Laurie had IMO a perfect combination of tumbling and artistry, and she had great balance throughout her routine--to me, it was more impressive--and difficult--than Sanne's routine. But the judges obviously thought Sanne's spins were more impressive than anything Laurie did.   

8 hours ago, Steph619 said:

I am interested to see if Aly will be able to come back for the 2020 Tokyo Olympics. I especially would like to see Laurie make it because I feel she has unfinished business to take care of with the all-around competition.

I sure hope Laurie comes back. She'll be 20 in 2020--and look at what Aly was able to do at 22.  I don't know if Aly will come back. If she's better than the young talent that emerges in 2020, then she certainly deserves to come back. But women's gymnastics is so talent-heavy in the US that I'm not holding my breath. 

[choclatechip45]

History works against Laurie coming back for 2020 hopefully she can stay healthy. Since she has had some major injuries already It makes me worried. That is the one thing that worked in Gabby and Aly's favor they had no major injuries. It will be interesting to see how the juniors do. A lot of juniors are becoming seniors in 2017. We will see how they do with upgrades . It will be interesting to see how Ragan does since all of Kim's gymnasts seem to be promising the first year and get injured as they get older.

Edited August 17, 2016 by choclatechip45

[windsprints]

I have some gymnastics free on demand through my cable.  I was browsing last night to see what they had. It looks like the NBC coverage just all at once. They also had individual routines that you can watch. Its Al commenting though so I'll probably use the combo of Roku/NBCOlympic app to rewatch or catch things I've missed.

[topanga]

25 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

History works against Laurie coming back for 2020 hopefully she can stay healthy. Since she has had some major injuries already It makes me worried. That is the one thing that worked in Gabby and Aly's favor they had no major injuries. It will be interesting to see how the juniors do. A lot of juniors are becoming seniors in 2017. We will see how they do with upgrades . It will be interesting to see how Ragan does since all of Kim's gymnasts seem to get injured when they become seniors.

Who are Kim's other gymnasts? (sorry--too lazy to Google). 

I don't know if Aly's just lucky, or it's if her solid, not-so-bendy body that has worked to her advantage.  Maybe her bone density and joint cartilage are higher than other gymnasts', which has kept her from major injuries. 

And Gabby--I still love her story and really like her as a person and a gymnast. I think these post-London years have been rough for her in many ways. Yes, she's made millions of dollars and was able to compete at her second Olympics. And helped the team win another Gold. But, she's also faced:

• Coaching challenges. Liang Chow was the coach who helped Gabby become an Olympian in 2012, and I think she would have done much better in these Olympics if he'd still been her coach. Too bad money issues (allegedly) caused them to split from one another
• Physical changes. Growing three inches -- along with whatever changes accompanied that -- bigger boobs, increased fatty tissue--had to be a big adjustment for her. 
• Emotionally, I disagree with people who state that Gabby didn't want to be in Rio. That's all she's talked about since London. I think Gabby has been disappointed with herself since Worlds. The pressure to do well has come from her own head as much as from anyone else. 
• Social Media: she's gotten a barrage of negative comments from Internet trolls and even her own teammates (an alternate, anyway). And people once again made insulting comments about her hair--and most of the comments came from black women.  The poor child can't get a break.
• Family pressure:  20-year old Gabby has become the primary breadwinner for her entire family, a family that's been quite open about its past financial struggles.  So the fate of her family rests on her success. That's a lot of pressure on a young woman. And even though her mother and sister work, they work for Gabby Douglas, Inc. (or whatever her brand is called). So if she doesn't make money, they don't make money. And her mother is a n idiot. On Gabby's reality show, Gabby's mother told her sister Ariel that she shouldn't get another job because the "entire family" needed to be there for Gabby. Excuse me? Gabby and her siblings are all adults.  There's no need to force Gabby's sister to ride her coattails .

Edited August 17, 2016 by topanga

[CeeBeeGee]

8 minutes ago, topanga said:

Who are Kim's other gymnasts? (sorry--too lazy to Google). 

I don't know if Aly's just lucky, or it's if her solid, not-so-bendy body that has worked to her advantage.  Maybe her bone density and joint cartilage are higher than other gymnasts', which has kept her from major injuries. 

And Gabby--I still love her story and really like her as a person and a gymnast. I think these post-London years have been rough for her in many ways. Yes, she's made millions of dollars and was able to compete at her second Olympics. And helped the team win another Gold. But, she's also faced:

• Coaching challenges. Liang Chow was the coach who helped Gabby become an Olympian in 2012, and I think she would have done much better in these Olympics if he'd still been her coach. Too bad money issues (allegedly) caused them to split from one another
• Physical changes. Growing three inches -- along with whatever changes accompanied that -- bigger boobs, increased fatty tissue--had to be a big adjustment for her. 
• Emotionally, I disagree with people who state that Gabby didn't want to be in Rio. That's all she's talked about since London. I think Gabby has been disappointed with herself since Worlds. The pressure to do well has come from her own head as much as from anyone else. 
• Social Media: she's gotten a barrage of negative comments from Internet trolls and even her own teammates (an alternate, anyway). And people once again made insulting comments about her hair--and most of the comments came from black women.  The poor child can't get a break.
• Family pressure:  20-year old Gabby has become the primary breadwinner for her entire family, a family that's been quite open about its past financial struggles.  So the fate of her family rests on her success. That's a lot of pressure on a young woman. And even though her mother and sister work, they work for Gabby Douglas, Inc. (or whatever her brand is called). So if she doesn't make money, they don't make money. And her mother is a n idiot. On Gabby's reality show, Gabby's mother told her sister Ariel that she shouldn't get another job because the "entire family" needed to be there for Gabby. Excuse me? Gabby and her siblings are all adults.  There's no need to force Gabby's sister to ride her coattails .

I am very concerned that Gabby is the sole breadwinner. I get that Natalie wants to protect and oversee her daughter, and I know they are very close, but that has the potential for disaster IMO. A close relative, no matter how well-meaning, simply doesn't have the ability to offer detached advice the way a typical manager/agent can--especially if said relative is actually dependent on the "client," that is a huge conflict of interest.  I'm very worried that they might run "the brand" into the ground. Like, the reality series--I don't think that's such a good idea and I can't imagine why Marta didn't talk Gabby out of it. Most reality series are cheesy, and the ones that try to show the stars in a good light come off as super-fake, with forced obvious conversations, etc. I watched a bit of one episode of Gabby's show and was bored to tears.  Gabby needs projects more worthy of who she is and what she represents--a world class athlete and an AA role model.

And I also don't think Gabby should have that kind of pressure on her shoulders. What if she loses her passion for gymnastics? She should be allowed to quit if she wants, to go to college and find her own path, without worrying that the family will be destitute without her. I know they sacrificed a lot for her to train when she was younger but I think buying a house for the family should cancel the debt.

[choclatechip45]

42 minutes ago, topanga said:

Who are Kim's other gymnasts? (sorry--too lazy to Google). 

I don't know if Aly's just lucky, or it's if her solid, not-so-bendy body that has worked to her advantage.  Maybe her bone density and joint cartilage are higher than other gymnasts', which has kept her from major injuries. 

And Gabby--I still love her story and really like her as a person and a gymnast. I think these post-London years have been rough for her in many ways. Yes, she's made millions of dollars and was able to compete at her second Olympics. And helped the team win another Gold. But, she's also faced:

• Coaching challenges. Liang Chow was the coach who helped Gabby become an Olympian in 2012, and I think she would have done much better in these Olympics if he'd still been her coach. Too bad money issues (allegedly) caused them to split from one another
• Physical changes. Growing three inches -- along with whatever changes accompanied that -- bigger boobs, increased fatty tissue--had to be a big adjustment for her. 
• Emotionally, I disagree with people who state that Gabby didn't want to be in Rio. That's all she's talked about since London. I think Gabby has been disappointed with herself since Worlds. The pressure to do well has come from her own head as much as from anyone else. 
• Social Media: she's gotten a barrage of negative comments from Internet trolls and even her own teammates (an alternate, anyway). And people once again made insulting comments about her hair--and most of the comments came from black women.  The poor child can't get a break.
• Family pressure:  20-year old Gabby has become the primary breadwinner for her entire family, a family that's been quite open about its past financial struggles.  So the fate of her family rests on her success. That's a lot of pressure on a young woman. And even though her mother and sister work, they work for Gabby Douglas, Inc. (or whatever her brand is called). So if she doesn't make money, they don't make money. And her mother is a n idiot. On Gabby's reality show, Gabby's mother told her sister Ariel that she shouldn't get another job because the "entire family" needed to be there for Gabby. Excuse me? Gabby and her siblings are all adults.  There's no need to force Gabby's sister to ride her coattails .

Bailie Key was her other gymnast who people thought should have been on the Worlds 2015 team she's been injured. Peyton Ernst and Nica Hults were hyped. Peyton Enrst was at Florida but left I think because they gave her a medical scholarship. No idea what ever happened to Nica Hults I don't think she is an elite gymnast anymore. 

I agree with you about Gabby. I've heard rumors that Natalie was the one who made Gabby leave Chow the second time because she didn't like the fact he had so many elites and wanted him to focus on Gabby. Of course Chow made a commitment to those girls and would not agree to that. I posted a rumor that Chow wanted a cut of Gabbys and all of her endorsement money recently the source of that rumor said it was Geddert who did that. I think Gabby peaked too early and she didn't improve as the year went on. She should have never left Chows. I do wonder if Martha didn't think Kittia was a good coach because she didn't seem that angry over Gabbys decision. She just said bad timing. Martha was pretty vocal how she didn't think Gabby should have left Chows in 2014 and 2015.  Either way if it's true that she left Chows because of his other elites they all have been injured at certain points since Gabby has left.

Edited August 17, 2016 by choclatechip45

[topanga]

2 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

I agree with you about Gabby. I've heard from rumors that Natalie was the one who made Gabby leave Chow the second time because she didn't like the fact he had so many elites and wanted him to focus on Gabby. Of course Chow made a commitment to those girls and would not agree to that.

Why am I not surprised? Natalie still wants her other three children (who in their mid-20s), her mother, and probably the family dog to continue focusing on Gabby's gymnastics career. 

[azshadowwalker]

As to the streaming conversation, I will stream things...if they have a smart TV app and I can stream them on the large TV I paid a lot of money for. I specifically paid that money to watch sports in HD on a large screen. Fuck computer apps and laptop screens for viewing sports. 

  As for watching highlights of something that was played in its entirety earlier in the day, hell yes I watch that kind of thing. Here in Arizona, when the Diamondbacks play an Eastern Time Zone game, it's shown in its entirety live. Later, during the regular MST prime time window, it's aired again, with a few edits for time. I have Arizona basketball games recorded from 20 years ago. The PAC-12 network re-airs games several times a week, or even years later. (I just watched Arizona football beat Washington in a game from 1998, ffs.) The re-airing of events is done by every professionally managed sports network out there, ESPN included. But we're talking about the train wreck that employs Trautwig, I guess. 

[choclatechip45]

11 minutes ago, topanga said:

Why am I not surprised? Natalie still wants her other three children (who in their mid-20s), her mother, and probably the family dog to continue focusing on Gabby's gymnastics career. 

Even if Gabby wanted to continue gymnastics Besides   Christian I don't think any coach would want to coach her because of Natalie. 

Edited August 17, 2016 by choclatechip45

[Shangrilala]

I have such mixed feelings on the issue of Gabby and the overall issue of "sportsmanship" and what we should expect from our Olympic athletes but I'll just make these three observations.  

1)  I do think her sitting in the stands, completely non-reactive to her teammates winning gold and silver in the all-around really just did reflect poorly on her.  I wish it didn't, but it did.  I saw an interview with Shawn Johnson and they asked her what she thought about the reaction and even she said "Look, I get it, in the Olympics there are disappointments, there are pressures nobody can imagine until you are in it, and they can wear you down, but you do also have to remember that at the end of the day you wear the uniform and you represent the sport and the country."  Was she allowed to be bummed?  Absolutely.  But sportsmanship matters.   At least it does to me.  Clapping wouldn't have killed her.  

2)  I think USAG (or maybe NBC?) wants us to believe that all of these women are giggly besties all of the time.  And that's just stupid.  For starters, if you know anything about the female dynamics of friendship, that's just not the way it goes.  Furthermore, these girls are serious athletes.  They aren't little girls on a playground.  I've always wondered if Gabby wasn't as close to the other girls.   It may just be her personality, she might be a little quieter and/or more guarded than the others (got that impression in London as well based on interactions with the team).  But the fact is, they are a team and they are competitors.  That doesn't necessarily make them best friends.  They train once a month together.  They compete together but also against each other.  Maybe for Gabby to keep her head in the game, keeping a bit of an emotional distance is what works for her.   We rarely see Gabby and Aly interact.  I kept thinking during the trials it was strange, they were the two who had been there before, wouldn't there be some kind of mutual encouragement between the two?  There was none until the press interviewed them together. 

3)  I think they said during trials that Kim Zmeskal had instituted some kind of bonus/reward system for Ragan when it came to not whining, supporting her teammates, etc.  Good for her.  As stupid as this sounds, I think it would be of benefit for USAG to have a bit of sportsmanship training at these camps, it's clearly lacking for some.  In other words, you don't throw shade at your fellow athletes, you don't throw a hissy fit on twitter when you don't get selected for the Olympic team, etc.  If you want to be an Olympic athlete and represent your country then accept that such an honor comes with other expectations beyond your degree of difficulty.  

[windsprints]

I watch competitions here and there, read some articles then watch every minute of the Olympics (if the televised more I'd watch more). I don't follow the gymnasts lives closely.  I'm really disappointed to read about Gabby's mother.  From the tidbits I'm reading (which means I obviously do not know the whole story) it sure appears she's putting way too much pressure on Gabby and too  concerned about the brand/money.  I wonder if Gabby is still in touch with the family she lived with when training for 2012.  It seems like when she left them and the gym is when her difficulties began.

[azshadowwalker]

14 minutes ago, topanga said:

Why am I not surprised? Natalie still wants her other three children (who in their mid-20s), her mother, and probably the family dog to continue focusing on Gabby's gymnastics career. 

The situation is so much like the lives of female tennis players, who have been used as cash cows forever. On one hand, I get being poor. I have been on public assistance. In many communities and parts of the world, the idea that the family helps each other, even if that means personal sacrifice, is strong. I have a hard time condemning the families. However, in many cases, it becomes abusive, emotionally and/or physically. It's horrible that so many young sportswomen have this experience. 

[Growsonwalls]

25 minutes ago, Shangrilala said:

2)  I think USAG (or maybe NBC?) wants us to believe that all of these women are giggly besties all of the time.  And that's just stupid.  For starters, if you know anything about the female dynamics of friendship, that's just not the way it goes.  Furthermore, these girls are serious athletes.  They aren't little girls on a playground.  I've always wondered if Gabby wasn't as close to the other girls.   It may just be her personality, she might be a little quieter and/or more guarded than the others (got that impression in London as well based on interactions with the team).  But the fact is, they are a team and they are competitors.  That doesn't necessarily make them best friends.  They train once a month together.  They compete together but also against each other.  Maybe for Gabby to keep her head in the game, keeping a bit of an emotional distance is what works for her.   We rarely see Gabby and Aly interact.  I kept thinking during the trials it was strange, they were the two who had been there before, wouldn't there be some kind of mutual encouragement between the two?  There was none until the press interviewed them together. 

I was thinking ... anyone who thinks the gymnasts should be buddy-buddy best friends all the time obviously hasn't ever hung out with girls in their late teens/early 20's. Especially girls who are also some of the fiercest toughest athletes and competitors. Do we expect Michael Phelps to be best buddies with Ryan Lochte? The girls have all been friendly and gracious towards each other in public and on social media. That's enough. 

Finally saw the high bar competition. Wish Kohei had been in that competition :( 

Also, Catalina Ponor never became an AA gymnast because supposedly her bars was terrible. I actually found footage of it in 2004. It's not nearly as terrible as I thought it would be.

Edited August 17, 2016 by Growsonwalls

[choclatechip45]

30 minutes ago, Shangrilala said:

I have such mixed feelings on the issue of Gabby and the overall issue of "sportsmanship" and what we should expect from our Olympic athletes but I'll just make these three observations.  

1)  I do think her sitting in the stands, completely non-reactive to her teammates winning gold and silver in the all-around really just did reflect poorly on her.  I wish it didn't, but it did.  I saw an interview with Shawn Johnson and they asked her what she thought about the reaction and even she said "Look, I get it, in the Olympics there are disappointments, there are pressures nobody can imagine until you are in it, and they can wear you down, but you do also have to remember that at the end of the day you wear the uniform and you represent the sport and the country."  Was she allowed to be bummed?  Absolutely.  But sportsmanship matters.   At least it does to me.  Clapping wouldn't have killed her.  

2)  I think USAG (or maybe NBC?) wants us to believe that all of these women are giggly besties all of the time.  And that's just stupid.  For starters, if you know anything about the female dynamics of friendship, that's just not the way it goes.  Furthermore, these girls are serious athletes.  They aren't little girls on a playground.  I've always wondered if Gabby wasn't as close to the other girls.   It may just be her personality, she might be a little quieter and/or more guarded than the others (got that impression in London as well based on interactions with the team).  But the fact is, they are a team and they are competitors.  That doesn't necessarily make them best friends.  They train once a month together.  They compete together but also against each other.  Maybe for Gabby to keep her head in the game, keeping a bit of an emotional distance is what works for her.   We rarely see Gabby and Aly interact.  I kept thinking during the trials it was strange, they were the two who had been there before, wouldn't there be some kind of mutual encouragement between the two?  There was none until the press interviewed them together. 

3)  I think they said during trials that Kim Zmeskal had instituted some kind of bonus/reward system for Ragan when it came to not whining, supporting her teammates, etc.  Good for her.  As stupid as this sounds, I think it would be of benefit for USAG to have a bit of sportsmanship training at these camps, it's clearly lacking for some.  In other words, you don't throw shade at your fellow athletes, you don't throw a hissy fit on twitter when you don't get selected for the Olympic team, etc.  If you want to be an Olympic athlete and represent your country then accept that such an honor comes with other expectations beyond your degree of difficulty.  

Back when Gabby was running her own social media accounts which she did until around April. She would often interact with the other girls on Twitter. I remember Aly tweeting about Douglas Family Gold when it was announced. Simone and Gabby were interviewed by Savannah for an Olympic countdown segment she asked if they were rivals they both had a WTF face and said they weren't. Natalie said in her CNN piece the other day that Aly had texted her words of encouragement. I don't have any of my friends mothers cell phone numbers. I think Gabby was close with Aly and Simone and still might be close with  them. I don't think this is 2008 situation were it was obvious that certain girls did not like Shawn.

Edited August 17, 2016 by choclatechip45

[DawnDavenport]

41 minutes ago, topanga said:

Why am I not surprised? Natalie still wants her other three children (who in their mid-20s), her mother, and probably the family dog to continue focusing on Gabby's gymnastics career. 

I've always gotten the impression that Natalie is cashing in on her daughter's fame and wants to keep the gravy train rolling as long as possible. I don't remember all of the details, but Natalie's bad behavior started even before Gabby was done competing in London and may have contributed to her lackluster performances in event finals. Many were hoping that Gabby would find independence from her family when she turned 18 but obviously she is somewhat close or at least feels an obligation to support her family (which I can see). She's only 20 and I would hope that if she decides to retire she might consider going to college but I don't think her family would support her doing that. as #azshadowwalker said, Gabby is the family's cash machine. 

[topanga]

3 minutes ago, azshadowwalker said:

The situation is so much like the lives of female tennis players, who have been used as cash cows forever. On one hand, I get being poor. I have been on public assistance. In many communities and parts of the world, the idea that the family helps each other, even if that means personal sacrifice, is strong. I have a hard time condemning the families. However, in many cases, it becomes abusive, emotionally and/or physically. It's horrible that so many young sportswomen have this experience. 

It's similar to what happens to players in the NBA, NFL, MLB, etc.  But players in these other sports are usually older than gymnasts and have a longer career. Therefore, they have more money-making potential. 

5 minutes ago, Shangrilala said:

I have such mixed feelings on the issue of Gabby and the overall issue of "sportsmanship" and what we should expect from our Olympic athletes but I'll just make these three observations.  

1)  I do think her sitting in the stands, completely non-reactive to her teammates winning gold and silver in the all-around really just did reflect poorly on her.  I wish it didn't, but it did.  I saw an interview with Shawn Johnson and they asked her what she thought about the reaction and even she said "Look, I get it, in the Olympics there are disappointments, there are pressures nobody can imagine until you are in it, and they can wear you down, but you do also have to remember that at the end of the day you wear the uniform and you represent the sport and the country."  Was she allowed to be bummed?  Absolutely.  But sportsmanship matters.   At least it does to me.  Clapping wouldn't have killed her.  

2)  I think USAG (or maybe NBC?) wants us to believe that all of these women are giggly besties all of the time.  And that's just stupid.  For starters, if you know anything about the female dynamics of friendship, that's just not the way it goes.  Furthermore, these girls are serious athletes.  They aren't little girls on a playground.  I've always wondered if Gabby wasn't as close to the other girls.   It may just be her personality, she might be a little quieter and/or more guarded than the others (got that impression in London as well based on interactions with the team).  But the fact is, they are a team and they are competitors.  That doesn't necessarily make them best friends.  They train once a month together.  They compete together but also against each other.  Maybe for Gabby to keep her head in the game, keeping a bit of an emotional distance is what works for her.   We rarely see Gabby and Aly interact.  I kept thinking during the trials it was strange, they were the two who had been there before, wouldn't there be some kind of mutual encouragement between the two?  There was none until the press interviewed them together. 

1) But Gabby did clap and cheer for her teammates. No, she didn't stand up and wave the way Laurie and Madison did, but she did celebrate them.  I'm going to give her the benefit the doubt -- maybe it's just her personality. Or maybe the disappointment of not being in the AA final overwhelmed her. I don't recall any footage of how Jordyn Wieber cheered on her teammates in 2012. I'm not being facetious--I just don't remember how she reacted. 

2) I agree that people overlook the fact that these girls have been competing against each other since they were 12 or 13 years old and aren't necessarily BFFs. And other gymnasts have said that even in 2012, Gabby was more introverted than her teammates and liked to spend time alone. She wasn't unfriendly, but she needed plenty of down-time away from other people. Hey, sounds like me. 

[choclatechip45]

I was watching some clips from 2012 Gabby had so much energy and was hyperactive.  I don't mean it in a bad way. I think in some ways it is natural that she is more reserved now. I think that is the reason why it is more noticeable.

4 minutes ago, topanga said:

It's similar to what happens to players in the NBA, NFL, MLB, etc.  But players in these other sports are usually older than gymnasts and have a longer career. Therefore, they have more money-making potential. 

1) But Gabby did clap and cheer for her teammates. No, she didn't stand up and wave the way Laurie and Madison did, but she did celebrate them.  I'm going to give her the benefit the doubt -- maybe it's just her personality. Or maybe the disappointment of not being in the AA final overwhelmed her. I don't recall any footage of how Jordyn Wieber cheered on her teammates in 2012. I'm not being facetious--I just don't remember how she reacted. 

2) I agree that people overlook the fact that these girls have been competing against each other since they were 12 or 13 years old and aren't necessarily BFFs. And other gymnasts have said that even in 2012, Gabby was more introverted than her teammates and liked to spend time alone. She wasn't unfriendly, but she needed plenty of down-time away from other people. Hey, sounds like me. 

Jordyn did clap and was happy for Gabby. I only remember because they didn't give us Kyla and McKayla or even Martha's  reactions it was all about Jordyn. It still pisses me off how they made the 2012 all around all about Jordyn. I know it was a big story and I don't blame Jordyn at all. It just pisses me off NBC kept making it about her. 

To be fair Jordyn has said in interviews after qualifications she didn't hang out with team that afternoon until Aly came up and invited her to hang out with everyone.

Edited August 17, 2016 by choclatechip45

[Minneapple]

The Gala, Part 2, is apparently live right now. I just got an alert from the app. I guess I missed Part 1 this morning? Apparently they're going to show it on MSNBC later, according to my TV.

[mightysparrow]

4 minutes ago, topanga said:

It's similar to what happens to players in the NBA, NFL, MLB, etc.  But players in these other sports are usually older than gymnasts and have a longer career. Therefore, they have more money-making potential. 

1) But Gabby did clap and cheer for her teammates. No, she didn't stand up and wave the way Laurie and Madison did, but she did celebrate them.  I'm going to give her the benefit the doubt -- maybe it's just her personality. Or maybe the disappointment of not being in the AA final overwhelmed her. I don't recall any footage of how Jordyn Wieber cheered on her teammates in 2012. I'm not being facetious--I just don't remember how she reacted. 

2) I agree that people overlook the fact that these girls have been competing against each other since they were 12 or 13 years old and aren't necessarily BFFs. And other gymnasts have said that even in 2012, Gabby was more introverted than her teammates and liked to spend time alone. She wasn't unfriendly, but she needed plenty of down-time away from other people. Hey, sounds like me. 

 

Thank you!

Gabby DID clap for her teammates.  Did she stand up and cheer?  No.  Was she required to?  No.  It seems that people are looking for excuses to justify the barbaric behaviour of people who were abusing Gabby waaaaaaaaay before the Olympics started.  If Gabby was disappointed because she didn't get a chance to compete in the all-around, who can blame her.  She was the returning champion.  Perhaps we should cast our minds back four years and recall how Miss Abby behaved.

Somebody mentioned that most of the women who were attacking Gabby for her hair were Black.  Unfortunately, racism is an ugly thing and and one of its effects is self-hatred which can lead many Black women to hate the hair that grows out of their own heads.  I hope and pray that Gabby loves herself enough to ignore such lost creatures.

Gabby Douglas is one of the most accomplished gymnasts in American history and a true ground-breaker.  She needs to shake off the losers, close her social media accounts and live the fabulous life she earned through her determination, sweat and TALENT.

[Frenzy]

Can women coaches or staff be on the ground with male gymnasts during the mens' competition? I don't recall seeing any ever, and maybe that's because there are no women coaches for men's gymnastics. I wondered if there is an unspoken rule about that or something.

[windsprints]

Quote

The Gala, Part 2, is apparently live right now. I just got an alert from the app. I guess I missed Part 1 this morning? Apparently they're going to show it on MSNBC later, according to my TV.

 I had no idea it was 2 parts either. I am dvring one that started at 2 so I missed the earlier one too.

Quote

It still pisses me off how they made the 2012 all around all about Jordyn. I know it was a big story and I don't blame Jordyn at all. It just pisses me off NBC kept making it about her.

 Well, much of the press has been making this Olympics at least half about Gabby's twitter trolls.  Its gotten as much/close to the media coverage that Simone has gotten and more than the other women winning medals. Its overshadowed so much of the competition. If you were pissed off that they made it about Jordyn what about now? Personally I find the media coverage as a whole (not just gymnastics) to get worse and worse with every Olympics. They are hyper-focused on every error, misfortune and loss. Of course that needs to be part of the coverage but it just seems like they sit there waiting for someone to fail/fall, etc. I wish any other network would take over.  I am old but I remember as a kid watching the Olympics and seeing profiles on athletes and there accomplishments. It may be just nostalgia but it felt more like a celebration of sport/determination/hard work and less of a "LOOK AL, OMFG HER FOOT MOVED 3 INCHES!! Let's show her tiny error 100x times and ignore all the good".

Quote

To be fair Jordyn has said in interviews after qualifications she didn't hang out with team that afternoon until Aly came up and invited her to hang out with everyone.

To be fair to what (not being snotty, just confused)? I don't see anything wrong with anyone taking a few hours to privately feel bad about a dream being shattered.

[azshadowwalker]

23 minutes ago, topanga said:

It's similar to what happens to players in the NBA, NFL, MLB, etc.  But players in these other sports are usually older than gymnasts and have a longer career. Therefore, they have more money-making potential. 

I think age is a big part of it. I also think socialization is a big part of it. Girls and women are raised to be more self-sacrificing, even today. So, doing things that make us miserable in order to serve the family is ingrained in most of us. I also think that it's made worse by the idea that female athletes should only compete when they are young, then move onto the "bigger prize," in the BBC's esteem--marriage and motherhood. This is especially the case in the traditionally acceptable women's sports, which are individual in nature instead of team-oriented. Families are going to have more control over teenagers than over adults. In gymnastics, tennis, and figure skating, the men are all much older than the women when they're at the height of their competitive life, traditionally speaking. (Although the change to a power-oriented game has improved this in tennis.) Even in team sports, this has often been the case, because the women have fewer professional opportunities. They move on to careers or motherhood by the time they're in their 20s, because they can't survive playing sports, let alone become rich.

I think in men's sports, the men may give money to families, but they aren't controlled in the same way. Going back to tennis, we've had cases where fathers were literally beating young female athletes. Since they are minors, those families don't have to ask for the money, either; they can just take it. In the major men's pro leagues, players can't play until they are legal adults, so they at least have the ability to say no to requests for money or gifts. The feelings of obligation are still there, but they do have a legal leg to stand on. This is one reason I absolutely support the move to impose age limits. I'd be quite happy if the women were required to be 18, in fact, because it would give them a stronger legal ability to control their money in most countries. Since the men rarely compete in their mid-teens, application to them would be only for the appearance of fairness.

[choclatechip45]

24 minutes ago, windsprints said:

 I had no idea it was 2 parts either. I am dvring one that started at 2 so I missed the earlier one too.

 Well, much of the press has been making this Olympics at least half about Gabby's twitter trolls.  Its gotten as much/close to the media coverage that Simone has gotten and more than the other women winning medals. Its overshadowed so much of the competition. If you were pissed off that they made it about Jordyn what about now? Personally I find the media coverage as a whole (not just gymnastics) to get worse and worse with every Olympics. They are hyper-focused on every error, misfortune and loss. Of course that needs to be part of the coverage but it just seems like they sit there waiting for someone to fail/fall, etc. I wish any other network would take over.  I am old but I remember as a kid watching the Olympics and seeing profiles on athletes and there accomplishments. It may be just nostalgia but it felt more like a celebration of sport/determination/hard work and less of a "LOOK AL, OMFG HER FOOT MOVED 3 INCHES!! Let's show her tiny error 100x times and ignore all the good".

To be fair to what (not being snotty, just confused)? I don't see anything wrong with anyone taking a few hours to privately feel bad about a dream being shattered.

I meant the actual all around competition they kept mentioning Jordyn and showing her in the stands. They didn't show Kyla or Mckayla or Martha I would have liked to see them cheering Gabby and Aly on. This year I was happy they didn't really focus on Gabby during the actual all around competition because the focus should be on the athletes competing. I think the focus on Gabby in general is ridiculous. I don't understand people on Twitter who attack someone they don't like since that brings more attention to the person you don't like. I do blame NBC during the Olympic trials they were negative towards Gabby pointing out all of her deductions while praising MyKayla Skinner for some of her routines that were filled with errors. If I were a casual viewer I would have been very confused why Gabby was selected to the team. I do agree with you that the media is waiting for people to fail. That is how I felt when kept repeating the fact Simone could win 5 gold medals. 

I probably should have worded the to be fair better. In general people kept pointing out how Jordyn was happy in the stands while Gabby was not. They both had the opposite reactions Jordyn was upset after the competition and pulled herself together and had a few days to process it. While Gabby seemed okay with not making the all around right after qualifications and it might not have hit her until she was at the all around competition. 

[Quilt Fairy]

 Danell Leyva's PB routine in the gala is not to be missed. 

[Indy]

50 minutes ago, Frenzy said:

Can women coaches or staff be on the ground with male gymnasts during the mens' competition? I don't recall seeing any ever, and maybe that's because there are no women coaches for men's gymnastics. I wondered if there is an unspoken rule about that or something.

I don't think there's a rule against it but at least at elite levels there probably aren't many female coaches (if anything just  because spotting would be difficult). For the women, at least one of the coaches on the floor must be female but I don't know of any specific rule for the men.

[Rinaldo]

I'm glad to see the return of the Gymnastics Gala/Exhibition idea, after its absence from several Olympics. I always enjoyed the more relaxed atmosphere.

[greyhorse]

I adore Laurie Hernandez.  Of the three of them - Laurie, Madison, and Gabby - she was the most enthusiastic when cheering in the stands.  Standing up, shouting encouragement, genuine happiness for her teammates, the imitation of Simone's undulating dance... it was so great to see.  I hope she comes back in Tokyo.

[scarynikki12]

I read the 2000 trials recap on my lunch break today and I couldn't breathe from laughing. So completely accurate too. 2000 was such a clusterfuck. 

[sab85]

The only Olympics I remember without a gala is 2012. Maybe 2004?

[Growsonwalls]

Simone and Aly went to McDonald's with some Russian gymnasts:

[galaxygirl76]

Epke Zonderland said on the tv that he must have lost consciousness for a little bit because he thought he got up right away after falling but after seeing the footage he obviously didn't.

[Rinaldo]

Huh. And after being educated online (on an earlier day) by Jon, I had oh-so-cleverly figured that this was his professional ploy, because the countdown to resume your routine doesn't begin till you sit up.

[selkie]

20 minutes ago, galaxygirl76 said:

Epke Zonderland said on the tv that he must have lost consciousness for a little bit because he thought he got up right away after falling but after seeing the footage he obviously didn't.

Not surprising. He did take some time to get back up. I also hope medical checked him out thoroughly for a concussion. That kind of contact gets the ice hockey guys sent back to the quiet dark room for a time after the hit. 

[legaleagle53]

I just caught Danell Leyva's performance on parallel bars at the Gala.  Whoever said it was right -- the male gymnasts SHOULD be allowed to compete shirtless!

[AuntieDiane6]

Quote

Since they are minors, those families don't have to ask for the money, either; they can just take it.

Actually, I think the Jackie Coogan law applies to the athletes too.  (That law states that families must keep a large percentage of the child's money in trust for them)  It came about after a lot of child actors found out that they were broke when they turned 18.  Recently, Ariel Winter from Modern Family became legally emancipated after she accused her mother of stealing her money etc.  Any minor has to have his or her own lawyer to look out for his or her financial interests.  Of course, unless they are Olympic champions, most gymnasts don't earn money.  

Gabby's family may have tried to cash in now because they knew that after the Olympics there would be OTHER Olympic champions, especially since it has been no secret that Simone was targeted as a the Next Big MaryLou.

I would bet that Gabby will next be seen on Dancing with the Stars or Celebrity Family Feud etc. 

Edited August 17, 2016 by AuntieDiane6

[roamyn]

16 hours ago, voiceover said:

How much would I dig a podcast.  They could call it "Pizza with Us".  I could not stop laughing during their interview!

Wasn't that adorable?

Equally adorable was Bob Costas sitting watching them w/his hand on his chin.  He got a kick out of them, too.

[BlackberryJam]

I had forgotten, or blocked out, the shitshow that was the 2000 US team trials. I remember that I loathed Jamie D., got a giggle out of Morgan's epic bitchface, felt awful for Shannon and feared that Elise Ray was going to split the skin at her temples pulling her hair back that tight.

Then the total horrorshow in Sydney. I so wanted Khorkina to go freaking Svetzilla on them for the vault. 

[PepSinger]

2 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

I read the 2000 trials recap on my lunch break today and I couldn't breathe from laughing. So completely accurate too. 2000 was such a clusterfuck. 

Is there a link??

[BlackberryJam]

Go back to page 60 or 61 and search for Part 1 and take it from there. Sorry. On mobile.

[DawnDavenport]

7 minutes ago, BlackberryJam said:

Go back to page 60 or 61 and search for Part 1 and take it from there. Sorry. On mobile.

Part 1: https://balancebeamsituation.com/2015/06/24/2000-olympic-trials-special-victims-unit/

Part 2: https://balancebeamsituation.com/2015/07/04/2000-olympic-trials-part-2-shes-still-not-ok/

I was especially humored by the caption under one of the pictures.It's the one with  Jamie D. and the Rybacki's. It's Part 1, right before Chapter 5. 

[kalystia1983]

29 minutes ago, DawnDavenport said:

Part 1: https://balancebeamsituation.com/2015/06/24/2000-olympic-trials-special-victims-unit/

Part 2: https://balancebeamsituation.com/2015/07/04/2000-olympic-trials-part-2-shes-still-not-ok/

I was especially humored by the caption under one of the pictures.It's the one with  Jamie D. and the Rybacki's. It's Part 1, right before Chapter 5. 

That caption gets me every time...it never gets old!

[TigerLynx]

1 hour ago, AuntieDiane6 said:

Actually, I think the Jackie Coogan law applies to the athletes too.  (That law states that families must keep a large percentage of the child's money in trust for them)  It came about after a lot of child actors found out that they were broke when they turned 18.  Recently, Ariel Winter from Modern Family became legally emancipated after she accused her mother of stealing her money etc.  Any minor has to have his or her own lawyer to look out for his or her financial interests.  Of course, unless they are Olympic champions, most gymnasts don't earn money.  

Gabby's family may have tried to cash in now because they knew that after the Olympics there would be OTHER Olympic champions, especially since it has been no secret that Simone was targeted as a the Next Big MaryLou.

I would bet that Gabby will next be seen on Dancing with the Stars or Celebrity Family Feud etc. 

Unfortunately, there are still ways for parents to get around that.  If the parents are the child's manager, etc., they can claim a 10% earning of the child's income, and they can add on other relatives as "employees" so that they can get a salary to.  Gary Coleman's parents petitioned the courts to allow them to access his trust fund in order to make "investments" on his behalf.  Investments that never paid off.

I liked the shots of Laurie in the stands cheering for Simone, and Aly's parents being so worried/excited for her.  Gabby and Madison were cheering to, but they seemed more subdued than Laurie.

Simone and Aly's interview was great.  It's nice seeing them smile so much.

Edited August 17, 2016 by TigerLynx

[MostlyC]

Their interview was great- it was fun to see them so giggly and happy.

From all the talk about Vanessa Atler back in 2000, I recall that later it came out that she was struggling with a massive eating disorder along with all the other drama.

My spec is that Gabby is seriously injured.  Which is part of the reason she hasn't been standing a lot, and I think, that she didn't do more than one event in the team final.  It's not uncommon for gymnasts to hide the injury.

[azshadowwalker]

2 hours ago, AuntieDiane6 said:

Actually, I think the Jackie Coogan law applies to the athletes too.  (That law states that families must keep a large percentage of the child's money in trust for them)  It came about after a lot of child actors found out that they were broke when they turned 18.  Recently, Ariel Winter from Modern Family became legally emancipated after she accused her mother of stealing her money etc.  Any minor has to have his or her own lawyer to look out for his or her financial interests.  Of course, unless they are Olympic champions, most gymnasts don't earn money.  

Beyond the ways around that, most athletes are not from the US. US law has no effect on them. 

Epke Zonderland shouldn't have been allowed back up on that bar. It was obvious to me that his stillness was indicative of injury. Replays showed his head hitting the ground before his body and snapping back. There should be a concussion protocol, considering the likelihood of falls from high places.