S07.E12: Gone Fishing

[Mkay]

Too many people use it as an easy out. That's one reason I just can't buy it. I could easily go be an absolute drug addict, alcoholic, husband beater, killer, and blame it on my childhood. No. We 3 knew it wasn't normal, it wasn't ok, and we didn't want to be that way. 

[Tatum]

I think though there's a difference between excusing someone's bad behavior due to their childhood and acknowledging that someone who's has a rough childhood is going to have to work much harder at becoming a functional, well adjusted adult. 

 

I'll use Kail vs Chelsea as an example. I think Chelsea is generally a sweet girl while Kail is a raging bitch. I don't excuse Kail for treating people poorly, but I think it's possible that she could have been as nice as Chelsea in an alternate universe where she had a decent upbringing. The onus is still on her to treat people better, but I also admit she's at a disadvantage. 

[Mkay]

That's cool. Agree to disagree. ??

[shelley1234]

I think you do owe the audience an explanation when you go on a reality show that pays you to owe the audience an answer or explanation.  It's hard to claim poor me or privacy when you welcome the audience and cameras into your home and life.  Can't have it both ways IMHO.  

[ChocolateAddict]

2 hours ago, Lm2162 said:

It's very easy to get hooked on pills, especially if you're not dealing with the underlying mental health issues. People do all the time and it's not some horrific druggie issue, just an everyday struggle. I feel for her on that count and don't think she owes it to the audience to be "honest" or not about that. If she wants to lie about it on camera, that's her right. And it's probably true that that's not *really* the issue deep down. But on a personal level I hope she is getting treatment and being open for her own sake, and I don't think she is, and that concerns me and it's irresponsible, but it happens every day. Leah's  had a high risk life for that sort of thing and lives in a high risk area. I hope she matures and gets help and gets off MTV to do it. I hope she surrounds herself with people more equipped to deal with mental health issues than anyone she's ever had around her. But that's pretty much a pipe dream. 

Maybe unpopular but I believe that to a certain degree, these girls owe it to the audience to present something that resembles the truth.  Like @Tatum said, it was spun as this poor, overworked single mom who was constantly attacked by her exes while she was struggling with mental illness.  She may certainly have been struggling with mental illness but she had her mother, Chastity, Victoria, Corey, Corey's parents, Jeremy (sometimes), Jeremy's mother and countless others who were taking care of the girls.  She wasn't a single mother trying to get buy on the minimum wage without much support, she was a very well paid *reality* star who had three different families (hers, Corey's, Jeremy's) who were all involved in looking after the kids.  Plus the twinses were in school!  If Corey was unable to get the girlses to school on time, was seen on camera nodding off while holding a baby, babbling about dye in babies heads and generally foisting the kids off with someone else, the "anxiety and stress" excuse wouldn't have cut it.  

Leah talks about how she needs to learn to focus on herself but in the whole of TM2 that is all we have seen her do.  She certainly wasn't putting the girlses or Corey first when she cheated with Robbie.  She wasn't putting the girlses first when she fought Corey tooth and nail for every hour of custody.  She wasn't putting the girlses first when she moved two guys in after only a few months (Jeremy and Dues).  She certainly puts herself first when she shuts herself in her room to FaceTime while the girls entertain themselves and when she allegedly dragged them out for late night drug runs.  Leah may very well have anxiety and depression but she is also inherently selfish and loves the victim card. 

[ReadMeLattice]

We all know the show is fake. It's entertainment. They don't owe me anything as an audience member/consumer. I'm choosing to watch and it's a narrative arc that is already inherently manufactured by MTV. Lives don't operate in narrative arcs. So it's my choice to watch and understand that it's not reality because reality is not linear. If someone has a personal issue, they can keep it to themselves, lie to me about it, just keep it between them and their doctor, whatever. I'm a viewer of a fictional show, essentially. And I understand that going in. Maybe they shouldn't lie, morally speaking, but I'm essentially watching to watch them or people around them be immoral, yes? That's what reality shows are.

@Tatum, definitely agree that Leah patches up her problems with men. Unfortunately she learned that from Mama Dawn, who learned it from her mother, and Leah's already passing it on to her children with the cheer BS. And yes, Jenelle should win a fucking award for how fucked up she is.

Edited June 10, 2016 by Lm2162

[GreatKazu]

A fictional show should not be claiming they are responsible for teen pregnancy rates going down.

A fictional show should not stand back as children are put in harm's way.

I am still pissed at Kail and MTV for involving the kids in their fictional Facetime bullshit drama. Isaac expects Javi to be home. That poor child does not care about this shit show.

[WhosThatGirl]

My issue with Leah is that if she doesn't feel comfortable saying she has a problem on tv, it's fine. But I think Corey was owed an explanation of why she went away for treatment of some kind and he was the main parent of their two kids. He was owed an explanation, why was she getting treatment, etc. It seemed like he was given no information. I also hate that everyone else is a bad person to Leah and yet Leah refuses to take blame for her actions. 

The thing with Kail is that I think she's rude and insufferable, but I do think her big issue is that she feels like people are disposable and only made to fit her needs. I think this may have been something she was raised on her, with her mother. But yet, I do think she is a hundred times better than her mom to her kids. At least from what we have seen of her mom in the past and how we see Kail with her kids. Kail's mom never seemed bonded to her in a way a mother should and Kail seems very close to her kids. 

[shelley1234]

Leah lies to everyone and people trying to enable her horrific behavior by saying it is okay because of reason X Y or Z makes me laugh.  

And for a show that is fake....the participants sure benefit from it and treat it like it is the realest thing ever.  Leah's constant instagramming and what have you shows just how much she thinks the show is real and how much she is banking on the support.  And fake or not...we have eyes and can see what is going on.  When you can't have a complete sentence without nodding out, when you are texting while driving, when you are neglecting your children right in front of our faces....you don't have to explain, but can't sit there and say I WANT PRIVACY AND DON'T JUDGE ME.  If you want the twitter fam enabling supporters...you also have to take those who are gonna call you out on your shit.  Leah signed up for this and if she wants to cash the paychecks...this is part of it.  And she can try lying as much as she wants...but when the truth comes out...and it always does, she has to deal with the impact of her lies.  Sorry, not sorry.

Edited June 10, 2016 by shelley1005

[Pixiebomb]

14 hours ago, TwirlyGirly said:

BUT...in the summer, when you're already using the grill, it simply doesn't make sense to use it.

 

You mean it don't make no sense.  Right?

[configdotsys]

9 hours ago, Lm2162 said:

People do have different brain chemistry and responses to trauma, though. It's a nature v nurture thing, but not everybody can just "pull themselves up by their bootstraps."

Pulling oneself up by their bootstraps is a phrase typically thrown at people with zero options. These girls may have had a rough upbringing but for the past 7 years have had money and help at their disposal but choose not to avail themselves of that. It is that fact that makes my sympathy for any of them disappear. How long into adulthood is one able to play the "I can't be held responsible for anything I do because I had a rotten childhood" card? More so, how long into adulthood is one with more opportunities to get help than you can count, able to hold up the "I had it rough" card any time they act poorly?

[configdotsys]

9 hours ago, Tatum said:

I think though there's a difference between excusing someone's bad behavior due to their childhood and acknowledging that someone who's has a rough childhood is going to have to work much harder at becoming a functional, well adjusted adult. 

 

I'll use Kail vs Chelsea as an example. I think Chelsea is generally a sweet girl while Kail is a raging bitch. I don't excuse Kail for treating people poorly, but I think it's possible that she could have been as nice as Chelsea in an alternate universe where she had a decent upbringing. The onus is still on her to treat people better, but I also admit she's at a disadvantage. 

I can agree with this but it's about what people do with the knowledge that they are at a disadvantage. They can choose to say, "Well, eff you, disadvantage, you're not going to mess with me" or they can be a raging bitchy mcbitchface for life, treating everyone like shit and wallowing in a pot of "Oh well, what do you expect, my life was haaaard" attitude. The former helps you to find a way past your disadvantage while the latter ensures that you'll be nothing more than you are now, for life. 

[CofCinci]

The show is "fake" but these babies and kids are real. 

[Tatum]

1 hour ago, configdotsys said:

I can agree with this but it's about what people do with the knowledge that they are at a disadvantage. They can choose to say, "Well, eff you, disadvantage, you're not going to mess with me" or they can be a raging bitchy mcbitchface for life, treating everyone like shit and wallowing in a pot of "Oh well, what do you expect, my life was haaaard" attitude. The former helps you to find a way past your disadvantage while the latter ensures that you'll be nothing more than you are now, for life. 

True, like I said, the onus is on her to learn how to be a nicer person.

But I think there IS an alternate universe where Kail could have been as nice as Chelsea. Jenelle on the other hand...she could have had Jeff Simms and Sharon Bookout as parents (Sharon to me has always appeared to be fairly no nonsense with Maci, and up until Teen Mom fame went to her head, Maci was a pretty mature, hard working teenager), with Randy Houscha as the generous uncle, and I think she still would have turned out to be an evil bitch.

[teapot]

11 hours ago, Mkay said:

Too many people use it as an easy out. That's one reason I just can't buy it. I could easily go be an absolute drug addict, alcoholic, husband beater, killer, and blame it on my childhood. No. We 3 knew it wasn't normal, it wasn't ok, and we didn't want to be that way. 

good on you for rising above all of that!!!  not everyone can be that strong

[Tatum]

10 hours ago, ChocolateAddict said:

 

Leah talks about how she needs to learn to focus on herself but in the whole of TM2 that is all we have seen her do. 

Right?? When she was talking about how that analogy with the oxygen masks on the airplane really resonated with her, I was like, bitch, when haven't you slapped on your oxygen mask first? If we are using the oxygen mask in the airplane analogy, Leah has put on her mask, gotten a stiff drink, AND gotten a manicure- all before assisting her kids with their own oxygen masks.

[vmcd88]

Kail-I dont get why Javi needs Kailyn to have another baby the minute he gets back.  Even though he apologized, I'd have a hard time forgiving a man that blamed me for a miscarriage.  What a controlling ass Javi is, cant wait til Kail dishes out some of what she's been giving to Joe all these years.

Janelle is the worst.  Talk about manipulating poor Jace.  Why does Barb allow Janelle to even see Jace.  How do these boyfriends think they can step in and make demands to Barb when they are just the "boyfriend of the moment."

[Miss Chevious]

44 minutes ago, vmcd88 said:

 

Janelle is the worst.  Talk about manipulating poor Jace.  Why does Barb allow Janelle to even see Jace.  How do these boyfriends think they can step in and make demands to Barb when they are just the "boyfriend of the moment."

Because they don't think they are the boyfriend of the moment. They think it's gonna last for-evah! 

Also with Kail & Javi divorcing, wonder who's getting custody of that god-awful lingerie "vanity" pic Vee once called vulgar.

[charmed1]

I hope that the editors simply cut out footage of Germy saying hello to the twinses during Addie's drop off. I understand his obvious need to get the hell away from Leah as soon as possible, but I should hope he acknowledges his former stepdaughters. If not, that's pretty shitty. It's not even a Jo to Lincoln or Corey to Addie situation (although they've been shown being very sweet to their children's siblings). Jeremy lived with and helped raise the twins for much of their young lives. 

[Mkay]

5 hours ago, Pixiebomb said:

You mean it don't make no sense.  Right?

Hahahaha

[Mkay]

5 hours ago, configdotsys said:

Pulling oneself up by their bootstraps is a phrase typically thrown at people with zero options. These girls may have had a rough upbringing but for the past 7 years have had money and help at their disposal but choose not to avail themselves of that. It is that fact that makes my sympathy for any of them disappear. How long into adulthood is one able to play the "I can't be held responsible for anything I do because I had a rotten childhood" card? More so, how long into adulthood is one with more opportunities to get help than you can count, able to hold up the "I had it rough" card any time they act poorly?

Agreed. 

[lezlers]

17 hours ago, Mkay said:

My sisters and I grew up this way. Mom and dad drank every weekend and had parties which usually ended in a huge fight. I'm talking horrible fights. I almost witnessed my mom be shot two different times in my life from age 5 til 18. My family was also poor and struggling which is why we were never able to leave for very long.  My parents departed for good when I was 20 or so. Even through all of that I loved and still love my daddy. He stopped drinking 20 yr's ago. I say all that to say this. I witnessed stuff no child should see. I can't and refuse to blame any of my faults on that. I knew what I was seeing was wrong and I refused to live my life that way once I moved out. Out of all of my cousins my sisters and I are the only ones who almost the only ones who don't drink, never been to jail, have a family and stable home. It's very hard for me to excuse bad behavior because  of the way someone was raised. You can live a completely different life. 

I hope this wasn't in response to my posts, since I specifically said "it's an explanation not an excuse" multiple times.  I'm so sorry for your childhood, no child should have to endure that.  You're a brave and very strong person to have overcome that and you have my respect. 

[lezlers]

16 hours ago, Tatum said:

I think though there's a difference between excusing someone's bad behavior due to their childhood and acknowledging that someone who's has a rough childhood is going to have to work much harder at becoming a functional, well adjusted adult. 

 

I'll use Kail vs Chelsea as an example. I think Chelsea is generally a sweet girl while Kail is a raging bitch. I don't excuse Kail for treating people poorly, but I think it's possible that she could have been as nice as Chelsea in an alternate universe where she had a decent upbringing. The onus is still on her to treat people better, but I also admit she's at a disadvantage. 

THIS.  Exactly this.  Everyone has their own struggles and some have much bigger struggles to overcome than others.  Us humans are extremely complex, complicated creatures.  There's no one size fits all.

And yes, Jenelle is still an AWFUL person.  It's just that, seeing how Barb is with Jace, hearing about her siblings and stories about her childhood, I can see how she got to be that way.  Doesn't make her any less awful tho. 

[configdotsys]

Kail could surely have turned out a different person if she had parents who cared and a better upbringing. I think that could be applied to everyone.  I just think dwelling on what should have been really does nothing except act as an excuse when one is too lazy to put in any real effort to change their attitude and treatment of people.

I read somewhere that they separated before he was deployed. So what was Isaac told at that time if Javi was not living there?

[ghoulina]

4 hours ago, vmcd88 said:

Kail-I dont get why Javi needs Kailyn to have another baby the minute he gets back.  Even though he apologized, I'd have a hard time forgiving a man that blamed me for a miscarriage.  

Not only that, but has he ever considered that her miscarriage might make her apprehensive to try again? She hasn't stated that as a reason, but it could very well be something she is worried about. 

[ReadMeLattice]

@GreatKazu, so true, they SERIOUSLY need to stop claiming that this show curbs teen pregnancy. Someone has to sit Dr. Drew down, apparently, and explain to him the difference between causation and correlation. I understand the girls not getting it, but seriously, you're a doctor, stop playing dumb.

@vmcd88, to be fair, I think Jenelle plays the victim to Barbara's villain (and the two of them are just codependent as fuck) with every guy, and the dolts feel like they are 'protecting' her by yelling at Barbara. That said, even if they truly feel Barbara is some evil witch, it doesn't give them the right in any way to treat her the way they have...especially Nathan and Dave. I have a verbally/psychologically abusive parent, and my husband finally stood up to that parent once I said it was OK to do so, but he only did it when I was directly being mistreated and it was calm and polite. Unless there is actual physical abuse going on that you need to protect your girlfriend from, you need to calm the fuck down around her older mom and stop physically intimidating and cursing at her. That's just insane. Shows how little breeding both Nathan and Dave have.

Javi's obsession with controlling Kail with even more babies just after a miscarriage he was a dick about is incredibly disgusting. 

[blubld43]

Quote

 

Jenelle on the other hand...she could have had Jeff Simms and Sharon Bookout as parents (Sharon to me has always appeared to be fairly no nonsense with Maci, and up until Teen Mom fame went to her head, Maci was a pretty mature, hard working teenager), with Randy Houscha as the generous uncle, and I think she still would have turned out to be an evil bitch.

 

I completely agree, Jenelle could have been raised by Ward and June Cleaver and she still would have her pathology, whatever that may be.  I'd watch that reality show; give this bitch a chance to re-live her childhood, with some super-couple like Ward and June.  Throw in several severely dysfunctional "contestants", I bet Janice Dickinson would sign up.

It's clear to me that the reason Kaiser screams like that is because that's  what he's used to hearing.  Nobody talks to him, so he just yells.  It breaks my heart.

[Tatum]

47 minutes ago, configdotsys said:

Kail could surely have turned out a different person if she had parents who cared and a better upbringing. I think that could be applied to everyone

I have my doubts that that is true for Jenelle. She's scary.

[ReadMeLattice]

1 hour ago, Tatum said:

I have my doubts that that is true for Jenelle. She's scary.

In a different setting, she could probably at least have gotten treatment earlier, etc. The fact that both her siblings are like that too makes me wonder if it's a product of a group of 'bad eggs' from mom & dad down to all three kids or if it's the way they were raised. Classic nature/nurture question, I know. No way to tell, really.

[gotta watch]

I wish Supernanny would show up and do a special on each of the Moms. She could coach Jenelle and Babs into having civil, calm discussions. She could show Jenelle what true "sleep training" looks like. She would help Leah with the concept of getting ready the night before, about how handy it is to have outfits, school supplies, and, you know, FOOD ready to go the next day. I would say she could help Kail and Jo communicate better, but they seem to be doing much better lately. IMO Chelsea doesn't need as much help as the other moms, but maybe Supernanny could help her to see that talking bad about Adumb in Aubree's presence is ultimately hurting no one but Aubree.

ETA: b/c whether the show actually helps to curb the teen pregnancy rate...it should strive to at least teach some basic principles of parenting to the moms and all their fans/viewers.

Edited June 10, 2016 by gotta watch
add more stuff

[iheartla]

Leah "I don't want to disrespect her the way I disrespected Miranda" Is she referring to sleeping with Corey behind Miranda's back? haha. Good for you Leah, I'm glad you don't want to be "the other woman" with ex husband #2's new girl, too.
Why were there 4 kids in the back seat of her Escalade when she was dropping off Addy? She gained an extra. "Jazmin" Is that TR's kid or Leah's sister's?
 

[anarchyangel84]

On June 9, 2016 at 9:38 AM, lezlers said:

How do you explain her sitting in parking lots with her girlses until nearly midnight, dragging them in the house and literally forcing them in a tub and cooking them dinner at 11at night when they have school the next day?  Or not able to get them to school at all or on time more often than not?  Why do you think she lost primary custody of her girlses for a while? Judges don't do that for fun, especially where Leah is from. That's the behavior of a drug addict.  And you can ABSOLUTELY be addicted to drugs you're prescribed if you don't take them correctly.  

And opiates can absolutely make you tired and sleepy.  It's right there on the label of any opiate prescription bottle.  

Of COURSE Leah had/has a drug problem.  It couldn't be more obvious.

I think we saw her cook at 11 at night once & I don't think it was dinner- I think it was that the girls are hungry & I don't think that makes her an addict. I know a lot of people that have gotten their kids into the bathtub late- or cooked late for their kids- including my Mom. And it was on a school night. It didn't happen all the time- but it happened. 

You can get definitely get addicted to the drugs you're prescribed- that's how A LOT of addicts get started. I'm just saying that there are different ways to get addicted. Some people take anxiety meds (Xanax) to help them sleep. When they take them long enough- as prescribed- sometimes they can't sleep without them. Sometimes it doesn't have to do with the high. 

Opiates can definitely make you very drowsy- especially if you're not used to taking them. But with opiates and anxiety meds, the high is different as well as the way the person acts. Watching her, it seemed to me that it was anxiety meds. But I feel like she was taking what was prescribed to her. I don't know for sure what she was taking, why she was taking it, or if she was taking it as prescribed. 

I wish someone close 2 her would come out & tell us the truth. Not just about this either! It would probably take a full hour just for that!

[poopchute]

45 minutes ago, anarchyangel84 said:

I think we saw her cook at 11 at night once & I don't think it was dinner- I think it was that the girls are hungry & I don't think that makes her an addict. I know a lot of people that have gotten their kids into the bathtub late- or cooked late for their kids- including my Mom. And it was on a school night. It didn't happen all the time- but it happened. 

You can get definitely get addicted to the drugs you're prescribed- that's how A LOT of addicts get started. I'm just saying that there are different ways to get addicted. Some people take anxiety meds (Xanax) to help them sleep. When they take them long enough- as prescribed- sometimes they can't sleep without them. Sometimes it doesn't have to do with the high. 

Opiates can definitely make you very drowsy- especially if you're not used to taking them. But with opiates and anxiety meds, the high is different as well as the way the person acts. Watching her, it seemed to me that it was anxiety meds. But I feel like she was taking what was prescribed to her. I don't know for sure what she was taking, why she was taking it, or if she was taking it as prescribed. 

I wish someone close 2 her would come out & tell us the truth. Not just about this either! It would probably take a full hour just for that!

Cooking for them once at 11 at night is enough for me to know she is a terrible shitbag mother.  Why are her kids even awake at 11?  And out of the house coming home from wherever the fuck?  You mention that you know a lot of people bathing and cooking for their young children at 11...what is their reason for doing that?  Im genuinely curious because I'm having a hard time thinking of any legitimate reason besides having a selfish garbage mom.

[Mkay]

5 hours ago, lezlers said:

I hope this wasn't in response to my posts, since I specifically said "it's an explanation not an excuse" multiple times.  I'm so sorry for your childhood, no child should have to endure that.  You're a brave and very strong person to have overcome that and you have my respect. 

Just a reply in general, not specifically you.  Sorry 

 

Thank you. 

[ReadMeLattice]

Work schedules, custody arrangements, sickness, sleepless nights, a fussy baby, a tantrum, or just general crazy schedules could lead to a night or two of an 11 pm dinner or bath. I don't think a few late nights make you selfish garbage/a shit mom. Moms already get so scrutinized. That doesn't apply to Leah, though. She has consistent issues. The timing is the least of them though. By far the worst thing she does are the stuff with Ali, texting and driving, talking shit about their dad to them, ignoring them, and already starting Gracie on the path to obsessed-with-boys-land. 

Edited June 11, 2016 by Lm2162

[Katt]

.

Edited June 11, 2016 by Katt
Too much irrelevant personal information.

[poopchute]

39 minutes ago, Lm2162 said:

Work schedules, custody arrangements, sickness, sleepless nights, a fussy baby, a tantrum, or just general crazy schedules could lead to a night or two of an 11 pm dinner or bath. I don't think a few late nights make you selfish garbage/a shit mom. Moms already get so scrutinized. That doesn't apply to Leah, though. She has consistent issues. The timing is the least of them though. By far the worst thing she does are the stuff with Ali, texting and driving, talking shit about their dad to them, ignoring them, and already starting Gracie on the path to obsessed-with-boys-land. 

Well of course, a fussy or sick baby up in the night is a legitimate reason to be up with them at 11 pm.  I feel like that's a lot different from what we saw Leah doing.  They weren't babies. I know I asked for examples but I guess I should have been more specific.  I think if your work schedule requires you to feel your children at 11 pm then you need to do something about that, that's totally insane.  Thank god Leah doesn't work so she doesn't have to worry about her work schedule forcing her to feed her children at 11 pm!

[Christina]

When Jenelle was in rehab, there was a scene where the counselor was discussing with her bi-polar disorder, and said something about family history, specifically her brother being diagnosed with schizophrenia. I'm not sure if people realize his diagnosis, but unless Barb was dropping acid while she was pregnant, or something like that, she should not be to blame for his mental illness. 

There have been several comments about all three of Barb's kids having issues, and we've seen Janelle's played out on screen. I think she's a sociopath. Her brother has schizophrenia but I'm not aware of anything negative about her sister other than a comment on an article saying that Barb had Gabriel because she was in jail. 

I have no doubt that Barb's home was chaotic, and don't profess to be a mental health expert, but a chaotic childhood doesn't cause schizophrenia and it doesn't seem fair to lay Janelle's issues at the feet of Barb because "all three of her kids are screwed up" when at least one suffers from a severe mental illness. 

Also, Leah has admitted that she was abusing opiates and thought she had a problem. When she told her mom her mom downplayed it. There is no reason for me to believe that she stopped without help. I think she was treating her depression and anxiety with opiates because the meds the doctor prescribed her made her feel awful and the "opiates made her feel like Superwoman" (her words and I remember because I was jealous that they only made me feel like my skin was being covered by ants).

If my son came to me and said he thought he had a problem at a time when I didn't recognize there was one, I certainly wouldn't have ignored and excused his descent into abuse that resulted in his nodding out while holding his nephew. Leah's sister and her husband were reportedly the one who told Corey and Jeremy there was a serious problem because she was concerned about her nieces. There was that whole blow up on Facebook (I think) between her and her family over her husband, where Leah's family was claiming he hit her and his family said it was they spoke the truth about Leah. I realize that would require us to believe that any of them actually understand the definition of "truth" but we will probably learn it after the kids write a book. I don't follow any of them on Facebook, but was completely drawn in to the grandmother threatening to kick that boys ass, it very poor English. 

[Katt]

Leah's grandmother, in particular, makes me feel stabby. 

[anarchyangel84]

3 hours ago, poopchute said:

Cooking for them once at 11 at night is enough for me to know she is a terrible shitbag mother.  Why are her kids even awake at 11?  And out of the house coming home from wherever the fuck?  You mention that you know a lot of people bathing and cooking for their young children at 11...what is their reason for doing that?  Im genuinely curious because I'm having a hard time thinking of any legitimate reason besides having a selfish garbage mom.

My Mom has done that & in no way is she a terrible shitbag mother or a selfish garbage mom. Look, it's not like I wanna defend Leah here. I've said several times that she's not a good Mom. I understand why a lot of ppl would think certain things are bad. In the big picture, compared to the things Jenelle & Farrah have done, & compared to the things that I see on the news, I just don't think getting your kids food at 11:00pm on a school makes someone a bad mom. 

Like I said, it's not like the ppl I know have done it all the time, and neither has my mom. But no one is perfect. I don't have kids- but if/when I do, there may be a chance that I'd do the same thing at some point. I've only seen Leah do that one time. Reasons ppl I know have done this: My friend Jen is a single mom who has to work late a few nights a week. Sometimes her kids are with their Dad & sometimes her mom watches her kids, & usually has them bathed & fed, but there have been a few times that her back bothers her & she just couldn't. So Jen has had to hurry home & do it every once in a while. (Few times a year.) With my mom, it was the same kind of deal, she worked late. Or maybe we got caught up at my Grandmas place. Then there's the times my friend Casey who has been up till like 10 or 11 trying to help with homework (one of her kids have a hard time.) There are times that things just happen. Like my friend Sterling has gotten home late from picking his kid up from her mom. Sometimes people lose track of time. My friend usually lets her kids stay up late on their birthdays. There's times that we've been playing a game with my sister or watching a movie & it's late when she gets to bed. When my sister & brother were younger, I remember them saying they were hungry before bed (probably just to stay up longer). We never wanted them to go to bed hungry. Now someone is keeping their kids up all the time just for the hell of it, then that's a problem. But there are times that it happens. 

[Mkay]

56 minutes ago, Katt said:

Leah's grandmother, in particular, makes me feel stabby. 

Did anyone else see her in the background of the cookout? I did! Grandma Sandy!

[SneakyCentipede]

5 hours ago, anarchyangel84 said:

I think we saw her cook at 11 at night once & I don't think it was dinner- I think it was that the girls are hungry & I don't think that makes her an addict. I know a lot of people that have gotten their kids into the bathtub late- or cooked late for their kids- including my Mom. And it was on a school night. It didn't happen all the time- but it happened. 

You can get definitely get addicted to the drugs you're prescribed- that's how A LOT of addicts get started. I'm just saying that there are different ways to get addicted. Some people take anxiety meds (Xanax) to help them sleep. When they take them long enough- as prescribed- sometimes they can't sleep without them. Sometimes it doesn't have to do with the high. 

Opiates can definitely make you very drowsy- especially if you're not used to taking them. But with opiates and anxiety meds, the high is different as well as the way the person acts. Watching her, it seemed to me that it was anxiety meds. But I feel like she was taking what was prescribed to her. I don't know for sure what she was taking, why she was taking it, or if she was taking it as prescribed. 

I wish someone close 2 her would come out & tell us the truth. Not just about this either! It would probably take a full hour just for that!

[poopchute]

1 hour ago, anarchyangel84 said:

My Mom has done that & in no way is she a terrible shitbag mother or a selfish garbage mom. Look, it's not like I wanna defend Leah here. I've said several times that she's not a good Mom. I understand why a lot of ppl would think certain things are bad. In the big picture, compared to the things Jenelle & Farrah have done, & compared to the things that I see on the news, I just don't think getting your kids food at 11:00pm on a school makes someone a bad mom. 

Like I said, it's not like the ppl I know have done it all the time, and neither has my mom. But no one is perfect. I don't have kids- but if/when I do, there may be a chance that I'd do the same thing at some point. I've only seen Leah do that one time. Reasons ppl I know have done this: My friend Jen is a single mom who has to work late a few nights a week. Sometimes her kids are with their Dad & sometimes her mom watches her kids, & usually has them bathed & fed, but there have been a few times that her back bothers her & she just couldn't. So Jen has had to hurry home & do it every once in a while. (Few times a year.) With my mom, it was the same kind of deal, she worked late. Or maybe we got caught up at my Grandmas place. Then there's the times my friend Casey who has been up till like 10 or 11 trying to help with homework (one of her kids have a hard time.) There are times that things just happen. Like my friend Sterling has gotten home late from picking his kid up from her mom. Sometimes people lose track of time. My friend usually lets her kids stay up late on their birthdays. There's times that we've been playing a game with my sister or watching a movie & it's late when she gets to bed. When my sister & brother were younger, I remember them saying they were hungry before bed (probably just to stay up longer). We never wanted them to go to bed hungry. Now someone is keeping their kids up all the time just for the hell of it, then that's a problem. But there are times that it happens. 

I guess we will have to agree to disagree re: garbage shitbag moms because I just don't think losing track of time or playing a game or watching a movie are valid reasons to feed your kids dinner at 11 pm.  For all the moms who work late, who is watching the kids and why can't that person feed them?  I don't know, all these scenarios are outrageous to me.  

[lilmarysunshine]

3 hours ago, poopchute said:

Well of course, a fussy or sick baby up in the night is a legitimate reason to be up with them at 11 pm.  I feel like that's a lot different from what we saw Leah doing.  They weren't babies. I know I asked for examples but I guess I should have been more specific.  I think if your work schedule requires you to feel your children at 11 pm then you need to do something about that, that's totally insane.  Thank god Leah doesn't work so she doesn't have to worry about her work schedule forcing her to feed her children at 11 pm!

I agree with you and I was that mom whose baby was up "late."  However, I was a SAHM and we slept late. My husband got off work late and if our baby went to bed at 7, he'd never see her.  So we kept late hours and I'm sure people thought "WTF" but she got the right amount of sleep, etc.  Because of that, I really don't judge when I see young kids at Walmart at 10 pm.  For all I know, the parents homeschool and the kids are in bed by 11 and up at 10.

However, once my kid started preschool even and we had to be somewhere early, she was in bed early. And for us "early" was 8:30 a.m. for preschool. We know Leah doesn't homeschool and her kids have to be up very early. With Leah's kids getting up at that ungodly hour (which also supports her being a crappy mom - my God you move all the time - move closer to Corey and their school) means they really do need to be in bed EARLY. If that doesn't work with her schedule or lifestyle, she can either change the school arrangements or change her schedule. You just don't have any other choice or your kids will be constantly sleep deprived.

And Leah has so much help that she does not need to get the kids up to run to the pharmacy for baby Tylenol. She has a bunch of people who will either get it for her or watch her kids while she goes.

[Katt]

2 hours ago, Mkay said:

Did anyone else see her in the background of the cookout? I did! Grandma Sandy!

LOL. No. My only observation of her is reading her incoherent shit on Facebook before she realised her posts were public. 

[lidarose9]

Part of it is context with Leah. It's never just one thing or two. If it was just the occasional late dinner and nothing else, I would think no big deal, shit happens. But when you add that in with all the other irresponsible and dangerous things we've seen, then it's more of a concern.

[Mya Stone]

Cmon guys...don't make it personal. If you disagree, you disagree. But argumentatively posting replies is going to get us all nowhere faster than Jenelle gets answers for her medical "symptoms." 

[DangerousMinds]

9 hours ago, poopchute said:

I guess we will have to agree to disagree re: garbage shitbag moms because I just don't think losing track of time or playing a game or watching a movie are valid reasons to feed your kids dinner at 11 pm.  For all the moms who work late, who is watching the kids and why can't that person feed them?  I don't know, all these scenarios are outrageous to me.  

You are lucky to have had such a relatively uncomplicated life. 

[Firebird]

20 hours ago, ghoulina said:

Not only that, but has he ever considered that her miscarriage might make her apprehensive to try again? She hasn't stated that as a reason, but it could very well be something she is worried about. 

THIS. I had an early miscarriage about 6 years ago, and this was my immediate thought about Kail. That shit is tough, yo, physically and emotionally. It took me a long while before even the thought of getting physical with my partner didn't send me into a panic, and the toll it took eventually ruined that relationship.

I'm not a fan of Kail, but I can empathize with this notion.

[jacksgirl]

Late to the party. I know the time line is wonky, but when did Javi and Kail decide to divorce. Where are the tears? Divorce is devastating, neither could give two rats tails about the whole misadventure. Isaac is the one who is going to suffer the most. Also, so damn sick of Kail bitching about being a single parent. One of your children's dad's lives in  same town and  you have in-laws that take care of your house and provide free child care.  You are NOT a single parent.