S20.E05: Week 5

[saber5055]

There were contestants as young as 22. That kind of thing can get into icky territory really quickly.

And god forbid this show should EVER go into any territory considered "icky"!

I don't think Ben wants complicated and deep.  I think he wants to make out with a bunch of 'hot' chicks, get free stuff, and become 'famous'.

 

This made me laugh. Because I think that's what everyone who appears on this show wants. It's THEIR version of a Kardashian show that they get to star in. Yeah, maybe one or two will get married, but getting to be part of The Bachelor Family is, I believe, the main draw.

 

We all spend a lot of time discussing how people look on this show. So I guess we're just as shallow as the contestants.

 

Not that there's anything wrong with that!

Edited February 4, 2016 by saber5055

[Trace]

If I was picked to be the Bachelor/Bachelorette, I would insist on one non-debatable thing: no kids, no baggage. I would want to start out fresh with someone and have my first child with someone who has no children.  That would be my deal breaker.  I have seen the struggle my siblings have gone through with bitter exes and it caused SO much drama and trouble in their marriages.  Broken them up even.  It's not worth it.

 

So glad someone finally called the wambulance for Jubliee.  Bye buzzkill! 

[ByTor]

I thought she was joking, too, but then ... she wasn't. It wasn't her snarky humor that was the problem, imo, but that she didn't laugh and immediately show she was into it and having fun.

Just my opinion, but I think there are one of two reasons for this, either she did laugh and it was edited out or (which I think is more likely) she delivered her sarcastic joke deadpan, like many sarcastic jokes are (and why I like that kind of humor).

[TiredMe]

Maybe I'm just not that into this show, but I barely blinked at the Ben Jubilee thing and yet everyone is buzzing about it. I thought she had major issues and needed to go. Plus I always try to remind myself, maybe there's more than what we've seen? I don't always succeed at that!

I liked the runway date. Different.

Edited February 4, 2016 by TiredMe

[WhoAmIReally]

Relatedly, I would love to see the show plump for a Bachelor in his 40s looking for a woman in her 30s, 40s, or 50s. Not like that would happen because the show is getting increasingly obsessed with eye candy (Ben, and most of the girls there, seem very young and non-marriage-minded).

 

Byron Velvick was 40 when he was the Bachelor.  He ended up with Mary Delgado, who was three years younger, I think.  I don't remember the age range for the rest of the cast. 

[KateeBar]

Ben is a friend of a friend. After his stint on The Bachelorette, he told my friend basically that Kaitlyn was fun, funny, outgoing, bawdy, etc. and seemed to like that about her. So I really don't believe at all that he sent Jubilee home because she wasn't a simpering, obedient little woman or some such. Of course there are editing monkeys in play here, but they managed to find plenty of footage that made Jubilee look shut down and unhappy. Do I think he shone in that moment? Maybe not. But people get rejected throughout the whole season; that's the premise of the show. It didn't seem particularly evil on his part.

As far as keeping Olivia, she's just good TV. That I believe is producer meddling.

[sasha206]

Regarding Amanda...the thing that bugs me most about her is her insistence that her going on The Bachelor is just as much for her kids as it is for her. Please.

 

 

Amen.  

 

Personally, I think it's disgusting to have children as young as she does and go on a reality show in general.  Those kids need her.  Grandma and the absentee father can't replace her.  

 

Secondly, she's telling the story about how her hubby was texting and online dating and how devastating that was. But hey, let's go on a reality show where my future husband is going to date 20 some women while dating me!  

 

And any man who would choose a mother who leaves her babies to participate on this clusterfuck is an idiot.  

[catrice2]

I find it strange that Jubilee is criticized for her lack of confidence and Olivia is called a villian because she has confidence. It is like no one can win.  I don't think anyone is suggesting that Ben should have kept Jubilee if he did not want her, I just think some people feel like it was seemingly such a departure from what he had said before, and he seemed to be willing to work more with others that he did not say he had a connection with.

 

 As I have said before, they knew what they signed up for, but these people are young. They probably thought they could handle it until they were in it. 

 

I have never said or thought Ben was extremely attractive. It seems like the Bachelor in the beginning was trying to sell a fantasy...a doctor, heir to a fortune, pilot, and it seems like they at least tried for attractive.  You could almost forgive a girl for going on there and trying to find her prince charming.....now it is some plain guy that sells software.  I'm not knocking an honest living, but we typically don't fantasize about marry the plain boy next door that sells software. I don't watch, so I don't know when it changed.   

 

I hope that it is not true that she wants to be the next Bachelorette.  I personally hope all these women have had enough!  I agree with the poster that said most are on here for exposure, free items and an ego boost.  Sometimes when you lose you win, and this is one of them. 

 

As for as the race thing...I personally know very few Black people who care about the show and I don't think anyone was looking to it to solve racial equality or improve race relations.  No one expects or wants anyone to feel guilty or sorry for Jubilee.

 

If the previews are to be believed Ben can't express himself well enough to keep from stringing two people along,so I would say the women who left had a lucky escape.

So I read a blog that said she was mean to Lauren B during cooking.  What did she do?  I suspect that was her real crime. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I personally don't see any confidence in Olivia.   Not what I would call it.  More like desperation, definitely a lot of delusion.  Those raptor smiles never spelled out confidence to me but rather a sort of mania.  Also the way she addresses the other women is not confidence; she doesn't care about being polite to them but I don't think that comes from a place of confidence.

Edited February 5, 2016 by Ms Blue Jay

[ByTor]

I hope that it is not true that she wants to be the next Bachelorette. I personally hope all these women have had enough!

I'm calling it now (I have no idea if I'm right, no spoilers) Lauren H for Bachelorette. Edited February 5, 2016 by ByTor

[sasha206]

Me, too, although I do have a feeling she's one of those people who looks a lot better in person than (usually) on camera. I loved her laughing at herself and posing after-the-fact makeup free, with retainer, hair a mess, for the Bachelor cameras. A sense of humor--and not taking yourself too seriously--is very attractive, I always think, whether in a woman or a man.

 

Plus, if the runway had been part of a group date, she very well could have been a winner. She fit in beautifully with the other models (and I loved that coat!)

 

I like her as well.  Her face is cute; I personally don't think her face will age well. But holy cow, those legs!  They were so beautiful.  

[Mu Shu]

I'm calling it now (I have no idea if I'm right, no spoilers) Lauren H for Bachelorette.

Give her a flattering hair cut and I'm on board. She's not any less attractive than pre nose job Jillian, so why not.

Except that she makes me very conscious of my stubby fat legs. That bitch.

Edited February 5, 2016 by Mu Shu

[yorklee2]

 

I'm calling it now (I have no idea if I'm right, no spoilers) Lauren H for Bachelorette.

You may be right but I don't see it. I think it will be JoJo or Caila and to be honest I'm starting to think I would prefer Lauren H. Her accent is grating but her ability to laugh at herself was really refreshing. I'm not really sure who I would like best until we know the choices. I have to give it a few more episodes to form a opinion. We all know a lot can happen from week to week.

 

 

I personally don't see any confidence in Olivia.   Not what I would call it.  More like desperation, definitely a lot of delusion.  Those raptor smiles never spelled out confidence to me but rather a sort of mania.  Also the way she addresses the other women is not confidence; she doesn't care about being polite to them but I don't think that comes from a place of confidence.

I think she wears a facade of confidence when really it's just delusion and no self awareness. Funny part is unless he's being told to keep her around (which could be true in part) Ben's fell for every bit of it. At least up until Emily put doubt in his mind. We'll see how that goes next week.

Edited February 5, 2016 by yorklee2

[Bugs Meany]

I can't see Lauren H. as TBette. She hasn't registered with male viewers at all, and certainly fails the "limo test": imagining the guys on their way to the mansion, toasting to her, getting each other psyched up to meet her. Not that every past Bette passed the test, but I'm sure it's a factor.

[himela]

I'm pretty sure Jojo will be the Bachelorette judging from Kaitlyn. They want a fun Bachelorette who will create crazy dates rather than a serious (=boring) one who will TRULY look for love (how dare she!) and will choose dates in museums or the opera or something that will make people yawn.

[saber5055]

I can't cast a vote for next b-ette since I can't tell any of these people apart yet. Maybe next b-ette will be the invisible Leah?

[nlkm9]

<<have never said or thought Ben was extremely attractive. It seems like the Bachelor in the beginning was trying to sell a fantasy...a doctor, heir to a fortune, pilot, and it seems like they at least tried for attractive.  You could almost forgive a girl for going on there and trying to find her prince charming.....now it is some plain guy that sells software.  I'm not knocking an honest living, but we typically don't fantasize about marry the plain boy next door that sells software. I don't watch, so I don't know when it changed.>>>

 

this--I have been watching this show forever, and the whole premise was a guy that universally would be admired and wanted by most men, and same with bachlorette--the first season, Aarons season, Jessie Palmer(but he was a football player) (blech)'s season, esp Andrew firestone season--most of them were guys that most ladies would admire for looks and profession......I think it may been around the time that deanna dumped Jason, and he became the bachelor that they seemed to stop with semi-celebrities and just had the cast offs....In many cases it just didnt work....some of the bachlorettes were really week (ashley, jillian, etc) and some of the bachelors were not so exciting either.......Like the Real World before it and other shows, I think a lot of folks come on this show to "lose" and hopefully get selected as the next bachelor or bachlorette. Does anyone remmeber the season where they actually aired a special on bachelor contestants?? that was very interesting.(there was one guy on there, Russel, who thought he was gods gift lol.

[leighdear]

Serious professionals with successful careers and a substantial work ethic are simply NOT applying to be on the show.  Male or female.  In the beginning, when the show was a novel concept, they had those types applying.  But this many years down the road, the show is too well known for what it really is.  Pretty people going to pretty places and hooking up for the camera, because they really don't have anything better to do for the next few months and they want to be on TV.     

Edited February 5, 2016 by leighdear

[yorklee2]

Serious professionals with successful careers and a substantial work ethic are simply NOT applying to be on the show.  Male or female.  In the beginning, when the show was a novel concept, they had those types applying.  But this many years down the road, the show is too well known for what it really is.  Pretty people going to pretty places and hooking up for the camera, because they really don't have anything better to do for the next few months and they want to be on TV.     

So the show lost any credibility it had years ago. Do you think it's the beginning of the end for this show Leighdear? Of course it's a unrealistic dating situation but the show is getting pretty ridiculous with all the obvious editing and scripting. Viewers basically have to accept that it's not really reality tv but more like a prime time soap opera for the show to have much life left in it. I'm sure many people don't care and like to watch for the drama and train wrecks every season but then why not stop billing it as reality tv and call it what it is. I know you can't take this kind of premise and expect it to be 100% real but c'mon they need to call it what it is. Kinda sucks for us right reasons watchers. I saw where someone had posted that the Australian version was much more realistic. I think this show jumped the shark a long time ago.

[C76]

I agree with you 100% leighdear. Before appearing on this show I think an individual should ask her or himself,"Can I afford to lose my job, respect from my peers, etc.?" It's too much of a professional risk. 

 

I find it strange that Jubilee is criticized for her lack of confidence and Olivia is called a villian because she has confidence. It is like no one can win.  I don't think anyone is suggesting that Ben should have kept Jubilee if he did not want her, I just think some people feel like it was seemingly such a departure from what he had said before, and he seemed to be willing to work more with others that he did not say he had a connection with.

 

I don't think people refer to Olivia as a villain because she's confident. (Or at least, I don't.) I think people believe she's a villain because she's being given the inappropriate/unstable edit.

 

To tell you the truth, IRL, I think that in some ways she's like Jubilee--awkward. In that sense, I feel sorry that the candidates sign contracts. If I were in their shoes, I'd want to sue the producers if they depicted me dishonestly.

Edited February 5, 2016 by C76

[leighdear]

So the show lost any credibility it had years ago. Do you think it's the beginning of the end for this show Leighdear? 

Nope, it's a cash cow.  People watch no matter who is on or where they are.  Every variation of the show gets solid ratings and attracts top-dollar advertising.  It makes everybody lots of money and gets lots of media attention.  ABC will never pull the plug as long as it's profitable.  And it shows NO sign of losing a dime. 

 

And the concept of realism never has and never will be a true hallmark of the show.  That's just not entertaining enough.  

Edited February 5, 2016 by leighdear

[catrice2]

Serious professionals with successful careers and a substantial work ethic are simply NOT applying to be on the show.  Male or female.  In the beginning, when the show was a novel concept, they had those types applying.  But this many years down the road, the show is too well known for what it really is.  Pretty people going to pretty places and hooking up for the camera, because they really don't have anything better to do for the next few months and they want to be on TV.     

I think this is true. I saw an article by the man that is on the Doctors where he said that being on the show hurt him and that people did not take him seriously because of it. 

[atlanticslide]

I find it strange that Jubilee is criticized for her lack of confidence and Olivia is called a villian because she has confidence. It is like no one can win.  I don't think anyone is suggesting that Ben should have kept Jubilee if he did not want her, I just think some people feel like it was seemingly such a departure from what he had said before, and he seemed to be willing to work more with others that he did not say he had a connection with.

I don't think anyone is calling Olivia a villain because she has confidence, just that she has confidence and is a villain (or crazy, or a jerk, or behaves badly, take your pick). There are plenty of other women on the show who seem quite confident but don't come across as jerks the way that Olivia does.

 

As for Lauren H, I will be severely disappointed if she's the next Bachelorette. She seems pretty bland and uninteresting. More than that, though, I found her blather about how Ben doesn't want Jubilee because "he wants someone that the other soccer moms will get along with" so obnoxious and borderline offensive that I know I just wouldn't enjoy watching a whole season of her.

[Koala]

"How’s it been like back in the house, since like the day...is it like, stressed or relaxed? Did everybody, like in the house, like, you know, congratulate you and all that's good?" - Ben's conversation with Olivia towards the end of the episode.

 

This is an exact quote. That is all.

[saber5055]

So the show lost any credibility it had years ago. Do you think it's the beginning of the end for this show Leighdear? Of course it's a unrealistic dating situation but the show is getting pretty ridiculous with all the obvious editing and scripting. Viewers basically have to accept that it's not really reality tv but more like a prime time soap opera for the show to have much life left in it. I'm sure many people don't care and like to watch for the drama and train wrecks every season but then why not stop billing it as reality tv and call it what it is. I know you can't take this kind of premise and expect it to be 100% real but c'mon they need to call it what it is.

Pretty much all "reality tv" is scripted. Not much, if anything, is real about any reality show, from the Kardashians to the Bachelor. And yeah, TB is a Fleiss cash cow all right. Just look at all the posts here with people debating about this and that, discussing who will "win," who has the best hair extensions, who will be the next B-ette. Yeah, it's fakety fake, but that doesn't mean people don't enjoy going along for the ride. Some are duped by it, others know it's crafted by editing monkeys and watch for the snark. Still, people watch, which is all ABC asks.

 

Having Miss Piggy on the aftershow to comment on the romantic attachments should give one a clue whether this show takes itself seriously or not.

Edited February 6, 2016 by saber5055

[Mu Shu]

Lol. That sounds like Chris Soules but slightly more erudite.

There have been some Bachelors I liked-Brad, Andrew, the guy from the UK (Matt?), and Prince Machebelli. The only ones I truly loathed were Jake, Blob, and Flapjack. Missed most of Juan Pablo, but didn't mind what I saw.

The question is, whose weave was that? Also, is Ben a little slap eyed?

[kia112]

As for Lauren H, I will be severely disappointed if she's the next Bachelorette. She seems pretty bland and uninteresting. More than that, though, I found her blather about how Ben doesn't want Jubilee because "he wants someone that the other soccer moms will get along with" so obnoxious and borderline offensive that I know I just wouldn't enjoy watching a whole season of her.

I find it fascinating that her one-off line has drawn so much ire from so many people.  Not just here, but in a lot of the blogs I read / podcasts I listen to.  They're not even pro-Jubilee people but they thought that sentence was so insufferable that they immediately wrote her off.  I'd feel bad for her...but I hate her because of that one line! 

 

"How’s it been like back in the house, since like the day...is it like, stressed or relaxed? Did everybody, like in the house, like, you know, congratulate you and all that's good?" - Ben's conversation with Olivia towards the end of the episode.

 

This is an exact quote. That is all.

I love you guys for all of your reassurances that Ben ain't all that.  I feel like he was drawing me over to the "right reasons" side but I wasn't all the way there.  That inbetween place was so uncomfortable.  Now I'm firmly back where I belong.

[yorklee2]

 

And the concept of realism never has and never will be a true hallmark of the show.  That's just not entertaining enough.

I don't know, not entirely. Human nature being what it is if you put 25 or so women/men competing against each other for one of the opposite sex it will most certainly create some drama. Just let nature take it's course. Then if the show wants to tweak the editing a little bit I'm fine with that. But to think as they come in they're told something like, " ok your going to be the villian, victim, confident, dumb one this season", to me takes a lot of the enjoyment out of watching.

 

So to say there never has really been any realism then how do you explain the people who actually did form relationships and even married? I guess they were maybe exceptions to the rule? Maybe I'm late to the game and maybe the best way to take it is as just another scripted show and if sometimes relationships do actually form then they managed to buck the system.

 

I think this is true. I saw an article by the man that is on the Doctors where he said that being on the show hurt him and that people did not take him seriously because of it.

I can see this. I saw a poster on here that said she was a attorney who actually knew a former colleague who had come on the show and had essentially lost his position in the firm after his stint on the show. I think where it really hurts is when they come on and make absolute fools of themselves.

Edited February 6, 2016 by yorklee2

[C76]

I don't know, not entirely. Human nature being what it is if you put 25 or so women/men competing against each other for one of the opposite sex it will most certainly create some drama. Just let nature take it's course. Then if the show wants to tweak the editing a little bit I'm fine with that. But to think as they come in they're told something like, " ok your going to be the villian, victim, confident, dumb one this season", to me takes a lot of the enjoyment out of watching.

 

So to say there never has really been any realism then how do you explain the people who actually did form relationships and even married? I guess they were maybe exceptions to the rule? Maybe I'm late to the game and maybe the best way to take it is as just another scripted show and if sometimes relationships do actually form then they managed to buck the system.

 

1. As far as I know the contestants aren't told anything about how they'll be edited. The producers determine how each contestant will progress through the series. The next thing you know, they're working with the editors to ensure that their vision is what shows up on our screens.

 

2. Molly and Jason Mesnick from season [whatever] have a podcast. I listened to part of an episode ages ago. Although thankful for their relationship, Jason said that it was basically a fluke that they wound up together. As far as I'm concerned, the lasting couples are the exceptions to the rule. In the first place, the candidates and the bachelor(ette) don't spend enough time to truly get to know each other. (A lot of the so-called couples that we see at the end don't work out for this very reason.) On top of that, between the editing and producers' tactics, false matches are bound to happen.

Edited February 6, 2016 by C76

[OnceSane]

Stay on topic, please.

[chocolatine]

Edit: sorry, OnceSane, didn't see your reminder until after I posted.

Edited February 6, 2016 by chocolatine

[lavenderpenguin]

Umm, a minority woman did "win"--Catherine was Filipino.  Does it only count if she's black?  And there was a Hispanic Bachelor, as noted above, the horrifying Juan Pablo.  Ali chose a Hispanic male as her "winner"--Roberto Martinez.

 

Not to nitpick, but Catherine was half-Filipino, half White. And Juan Pablo was a White Hispanic (being hispanic is not a race in and of itself -- White, Black, and Native Americans exist in South America along with the stereotpyical 'mixed' latinos). Diversity is not all the same -- there are some types of diversity that are more commonly accepted because they fit into the mainstream better than others. A good example is when someone of obvious mixed heritage (Catherine, but also celebs like Halle Berry, etc.) are often considered examples of diversity. Yes, they are representative of diversity, but you can't ignore that they might be more acceptable to the mainstream because, in part, they are not as "other" as someone like Jubilee, who has no White heritage.

 

Seeing as how the whole point is to find a woman to marry, it makes sense that he would choose a woman who actually appears to be interested in him.  Jubilee may be verbally saying she likes him, but her body language does not.  He didn't grab her and try to make out with her in front of all of those women.  He simply wanted to hold her hand.  If she didn't even want to do that, then how else is he supposed to interpret that? The way she reacted to him is how I react when some creepy older guy is hitting on me.  She look repulsed by him.

 This isn't a normal dating situation where a man is dating one woman.  He has MANY options.  When someone has many options, they have zero reason to put up with a "difficult" person.  

The one thing anyone can do to make themselves irresistibly attractive is to smile and show that you are having fun.  Pouting doesn't look cute and is definitely a turn off.  At this stage, anyone who wants to marry the bachelor needs to give a good impression.  Being a sourpuss is not the way to anyone's heart.  

 

That said, I liked Jubilee, and since she was no longer a frontrunner I'm glad she could leave sooner rather than later.

 

ETA: I thought Ben was angry and hurt at how she'd been acting all day (moody, cold, withdrawn, grumpy) and not even holding his hand was the final straw, especially since her attitude was still...confused, at best. In a dating show like this, there's no time for all those "difficulties", as someone already said. Unless there was incredible and completely unique chemistry--very unlikely in this show format --I think 99% of the bachelors or b-ette lead would have done the same. I would have, (and I didn't think it was rude or berating her. MMV, I guess).

 

I have a slightly different take on the Jubilee situation: I think she was pulling away and being difficult as a part of a defense mechanism. She could see Ben progressing and investing in his relationships with other women, and knew she wasn't a frontrunner anymore, so I think her behavior was very much of the "If you don't like me, I don't like you either" variety. It's a defense mechanism, and I could see why someone like Jubilee would go in that direction, as opposed to going the needy/clingy/overly affectionate route that other women might. 

 

Also, I think the fact that Ben couldn't tolerate her behavior anymore is, if anything, proof positive that she was right that he was no longer that interested in her and the chemistry wasn't there for him. For all those claiming that any Bachelor or Bachelorette would immediately eliminate someone difficult, moody, or insecure, I direct you to the hot mess that was Kaitlyn's season: Shawn was literally the most difficult, insecure, and often combative contestant around and Kaitlyn chose him in the end. But that's because she really, really liked him and was invested in that relationship. 

[Bugs Meany]

Wasn't Catherine half Filipino, half Chinese?

[MsPH]

Catherine is half Italian I think. Giudici is an italian name.

 

Jubilee may not have White heritage, but her adoptive family is all White.

[Cecily]

I find it fascinating that her one-off line has drawn so much ire from so many people.  Not just here, but in a lot of the blogs I read / podcasts I listen to.  They're not even pro-Jubilee people but they thought that sentence was so insufferable that they immediately wrote her off.  I'd feel bad for her...but I hate her because of that line.

I totally wrote her off, not that I liked her much to begin with. I simply loathe women like Lauren H, the giggly "happy" kind who laughes at men's jokes so hard you expect snot to come out of their ears. And that comment was just obnoxious on so many levels. Firstly to Jubilee, saying she's not cuddily and outgoing enough to deserve the attention of prince Ben or the friendship of others, and secondly it was such a backwardly thinking Stepword Wives thing to say, like "yes, let's all be fakety fake robots who bake perfect pink muffins and paint each other's toenails while smiling wide to compete over who is happiest and has the best husband and prettiest children - and damn you if you are not like us!"

It may just be pregnancy hormones gone crazy, but i REALLY dislike a lot of the women this year. Olivia an Jubilee are just fine by me, compared to the other bland, fake, boring women. JoJo? Please! Has she ever said anything except to express how much she worships Ben? I hate the way she leans in close to him while trying to find the words that has the best sucking up effect. Plus I get a mean girl vibe from her.

Amanda is .... yuck. I don't exactly hate her but just never really bought that sweet and fragile baby voice kind of persona. It seems fake and calculated to me. Caila is the same, just a slightly more life like version who seems even more fake happy.

Lauren B is fine, but incredibly bland and boring. And don't get me started on Becca ...

[catrice2]

I have nothing to compare it to, but I agree with your comments about the women this season  from the episodes I've seen.

 I know everyone has said this year is younger, but it is like they found the most annoying random women ( and I am tempted to say girls, not just because of their age) and put them together.  They have: 

 

- Sorority girl Lace, who clearly thought she was at a keg party

Stepford wife Lauren H. ( and I am just learning them individually because they are all looking alike-but I am from Michigan and ashamed)

Amanda- sweet as pie I want a man so bad I've left my children, but I am going to talk in a baby voice- does she have a job? 

JoJo- who seems like she has just hung out in too many bars and has no real personality - I can believe she is older than 30- 

Lauren B- the supposed "it girl" for Ben who only stands out to me because I cannot believe her hair is so terrible and she has no real shape 

Calia- I can only remember her hair is gorgeous and she was stupid enough to say she left her boyfriend for this show...after meeting him on the street 

Twins- who apparently still live with mommy in their high school rooms and just sit around mimicking and tattling 

Desperate girl- I can't even remember her name except she was old and had been on other shows--and her sidekick the one who apparently loves cats but was also forgettable - stand out because they also had terrible hair 

Becca- why would you do this show again, especially if you have a strong relationship with God?  Please, you are an attention seeker 

Olivia - I thought she was crazy, but now I'm thinking she is one of the smarter ones on the show- I think she knows exactly what she wanted from this 

Jubilee- is either a great actress, or clearly had never watched the show -if her family is White her issue was not that she can't get along with White people...it is just that she can't get along with THESE white people...in a house with no other outlet- nor was she good at ego inflating, maybe she wanted someone to do that for her?

Ben- apparently a fan favorite on another show who liked the limelight and started believing his own hype..and the ego inflation that is given.  A very real young chap who sounds like a robot..you are amazing, impressive..I'm glad you all are here...this is hard, tough, I can see a future with you....we have a CONNECTION..until you don't play the game and worship me! 

 

So, I can surmise in this episode that Ben walked Jubilee out in front of everyone, when there was a back way and he could have given her some dignity, Haley/Emily turned on waterworks to try to make tattling look attractive.  Amanda whined to Ben, Jo Jo sucked up to Ben and Lauren H has cute legs.  

 

I have yet to watch this episode (Hey, Supergirl is on, so sue me!) , but I did watch the Bachelor Live on a DVR at my friend's house last night, and I read Ben's blog.  I saw it coming a few blogs ago, but all I can say is really?

 

I'll take my comments on the live show to that thread, but something was going on with Ben and Chris Harrison. The whole Olivia and Jubilee thing was handled strangely and what was with those looks at each other when commenting on Jubilee?  Then a song and montage?  Huh? If Olivia's breath is bad, it has not prevented him from being all in her face. 

 

Are they actually pretending Ben writes the blogs on his own? There was not a "like" to be found...and there have clearly been agendas in his blogs.  I can only speak for myself, but if I ever met one of the Bachelor contestants in real life as a single woman, I would reject him just for ever being on this show! 

 

Some of these people have made a career of it.  I admire the doctor man for owning his mistake and distancing himself from it.  It can't be contractually obligated because it does not sound like everyone attends every reunion, extra show, etc. Someone said these people even make personal appearances at bars, etc.  Lord!  In fact wasn't Chris Harrison making a joke about locating the first Bachelor? 

Edited February 7, 2016 by catrice2

[NikSac]

So, I can surmise in this episode that Ben walked Jubilee out in front of everyone, when there was a back way and he could have given her some dignity,

Just a minor correction, he did walk Jubilee out some sort of back way. It wasn't in front of everyone.

I think the comments about the back way were in regards to him walking through the room hand in hand with one woman in front of all the others when he didn't have to.

[Mu Shu]

Carly makes these "celebrity " bar appearances. She also appears to make money shilling stuff to her Instagram followers. So I guess you can parlay it into a career of sorts. I guess she's too lazy for YouTube? There's quite a bit of money some one on the D list can make there.

[Padma]

It would be very challenging to be on the show, have a one-on-one and some other time together, feel that you REALLY liked the Bachelor and he seemed to feel something too (as with Jubilee, among others)--and then not only doesn't he "call" but you are constantly seeing and hearing about his dates with the other women you live with--women who ALSO really like him and think they have something special developing.

 

I think Lauren B, maybe JoJo, maybe Olivia 2.0 or Caila... are kind of frontrunners at the moment, but I think Jubilee might have still be somewhere in that top group in his eyes (maybe not T1, but close) IF she could have kept from "cracking up" emotionally (in terms of the show. Not really cracking up.) I like snarky humor too, but in the Spanish class she wasn't just snarky, she was kind of rude and rejecting. I thought she went too far--and then continued with the same attitude when she wouldn't even hold his hand. He took it as rejection--and embarrassing at that, in front of the others.

 

Lauren B, on the other hand, seems to be keeping her composure and continuing to behave in a positive way, in spite of all the stress of "I really like him, but does he feel the same?" And its not just that we see he's -very- interested. For all she knows, he may be the same way with Olivia, JoJo, Caila etc., too.

 

This is a very mental game and it's extremely weird that you're supposed to be "open" and trying to build on attraction while still being realistic that the odds are you will NOT be F1.  In a way, if I were on it, I think I'd not worry about being F1 but worry about just having a good enough time together that if TB and F1 didn't work out, maybe we could date after they broke up.  The chances of F1 working out seem remote anyway, so it might be better to be thinking ahead. Personally, I think that's what Jubilee could have done--kept her composure, not been too invested in "winning", and just tried to have a good time whenever there was a new date to go on.  I liked her, but I hope she will just go for meeting men in Bachelor Nation --if anything-- rather than another part of this unpredictably edited show (or BiP)

[ByTor]

Lauren B, on the other hand, seems to be keeping her composure and continuing to behave in a positive way, in spite of all the stress of "I really like him, but does he feel the same?"

Keep in mind I'm not spoiled and have no clue who wins, but this makes me wonder if she was somehow tipped off that she's got it in the bag.

[kingshearte]

Yes, the show tells us that HIS job is to decide which one of the women WIN the chance to marry him.  The assumption underlying that is that every woman there wants to marry him.   All he has to do is select the one he wants.  Ben showed that he didn't quite buy that.  He wants the women to also decide whether they want to pursue the relationship or not. 

It's a crazy set-up, if you think about it.  all of the women are supposed to be ready to commit to a man whom they are all dating. 

This is the part that's always been extra crazy to me. I'm always a little surprised that a good half of the contestants don't immediately just see themselves out after the first cocktail party or two. And not because there's necessarily anything inherently wrong about the Bachelor/ette, but because not everyone is going to be into the same people, even if, on paper, it seemed like a good match. The fact that all 25 contestants, with perhaps the occasional exception, all happen to find this one person to be a perfect match for them just underscores how not-of-the-real-world this show and its premise are.

 

Are they actually pretending Ben writes the blogs on his own? There was not a "like" to be found...and there have clearly been agendas in his blogs.  I can only speak for myself, but if I ever met one of the Bachelor contestants in real life as a single woman, I would reject him just for ever being on this show! 

Although I have no doubt that you're right, and he doesn't write those things himself, I don't think the lack of "like"s is much of a giveaway. Out loud, "like" is effectively the same as "um," "uh," or any other similar things that people say while formulating the rest of what they're trying to say. And just as very few people who overuse "um" produce um-laden writing, people who overuse "like" when speaking don't use it very often in their writing. Most of them don't even know they say it.

 

As for this actual episode, I was not pleased to see the return of "tune in next week for the rose ceremony." Ugh. That sort of thing was a big part of why I stopped watching it some time ago. I was kind of stoked not to see it throughout the season so far. I'm also going to say that Olivia keeps her rose. The "will he take it back" cliffhanger paired with all the dismayed reactions in the preview (although I would also bet that most or all of those will turn out to actually be in reference to something else entirely) definitely say she stays.

[Mu Shu]

If he doesn't revoke Olivia's rose, I will be madder than that time I found out what rosebudding is. It's time for some drama.

[Mabinogia]

I just had to go and look that up! Thanks Mu Shu lol But I do agree. Ugh! I am going to be madder than that time I couldn't help myself and googled rosebudding.

[bosawks]

If he doesn't revoke Olivia's rose, I will be madder than that time I found out what rosebudding is. It's time for some drama.

 

He's going to take her sledding?  Make her watch Citizen Kane?  Drink Gallo wine?

[backformore]

If he doesn't revoke Olivia's rose, I will be madder than that time I found out what rosebudding is. It's time for some drama.

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  

Why did you make me look that up??

[Vicky8675309]

Didn't Amanda say the problem with her ex was that he was not family oriented and preferred to be out partying with friends. What is she doing? She isn't with her family and out partying with reality tv wannabe celebs. Sure she thinks she will "win" <sarcasm>

[Vicky8675309]

I'm calling it now (I have no idea if I'm right, no spoilers) Lauren H for Bachelorette.

 

As long as it is not Emily, Amanda, or Becca then I am on board!

 

Scratch that---I just read she made the soccer mom comment:-(

 

They need to pick a new Bachelorette---none of these except maybe Lauren B but she really isn't that pretty so I don't think the guys would be impressed. Plus she seems to have this in the bag but I don't know. Maybe Jennifer or Leah but I don't know anything about them.

Edited February 9, 2016 by Vicky8675309

[Mu Shu]

NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why did you make me look that up??

I warned you not to! You need to read between the lines!

I'll go curl back up in a ball now.

[Vicky8675309]

OMG, I hope I don't think of that term* whenever I hear the word rose on this show!

*I'm not going to type it since reading it made me end up at places where I now want to bleach my eyes and erase my memory....lol

[kingshearte]

Aw man, now I'm going to have to look up whatever this horror is, but I think I'll wait until I'm not at work...