S09.E02: The Separation Oscillation

[barbedwire]

That was so great - Mandy is just a sleep around gal who couldn't care less about Leonard.  lol

 

Amy and Kripke?  Never thought about that but if he was a super gentleman to her, that would piss off Sheldon.  Wouldn't mind seeing that though I do like the idea of Amy and Stuart.

[amensisterfriend]

We're supposed to root for Leonard/Penny and Sheldon/Amy as "endgame" couples, right? Because I truly, honestly think they'd all be far happier and healthier apart---and that the show would be a lot more uplifting, enjoyable and entertaining without these relentlessly depressing, dysfunctional, character-assassinating "ships." It's come to the point where I think I'm just going to fast forward to the scenes that aren't in any way about any of these people's past or current romantic relationships. 

[backgroundnoise]

Anytime an attractive girl is near Leonard, he is interested, no matter the circumstances or whether it is appropriate or even cheating on his current relationship.

I think Leonard justifies it to himself that he's been so deprived his whole life, he's entitled to grab at anything he's always considered above him.  Sort of, "I can't believe she could want ME, what was I supposed to do?  I've been laughed at my whole life, blah, blah, blah."

 

The fact the Leonard is STILL so insecure re Penny is the major reason I see their marriage is doomed.  And how can she feel secure herself?  Either Leonard will succumb to any attractive female who comes on to him, or Penny will think she'll lose him when she loses her looks.

 

This is not what I watch a sitcom for.  May be time to bail.

 

Oh, and the only funny line was Mandy's "And your wife's worried about ME?" when Leonard told her about the dream of him nursing Sheldon.  Hee.  The hand joke might have been funny if I hadn't already seen it umpteen times in the previews.

[DarkRaichu]

 

The whole premise of the show is that they are smart and therefore, socially awkward. No, they're just horrible people. Horrible people with high IQs, but genuinely horrible people, none the less. All of them are rather horrible people who are entitled, mean, and sexist. 

 

 

Darn it, if the show becomes Seinfield with (perceived) higher IQ, I am out :P

[amensisterfriend]

Darn it, if the show becomes Seinfield with (perceived) higher IQ, I am out :P

 

Hee! Seinfeld was (IMO, of course!) roughly a million times more cleverly plotted than TBBT and with far sharper dialogue. And the Seinfeld writers at least KNEW that the main characters were pretty awful people and proceeded accordingly---that was part of the joke, though I totally get why the show didn't work for many people. My enjoyment of Seinfeld was never contingent on my liking or rooting for the characters. With TBBT, though, I liked it for the friendships, the geek/science/etc. angle, and the surprising heartwarming feel of many episodes. If I no longer like these people enough for them to warm my heart or care about their friendships, and if the show becomes a flat, depressing, insight-lacking look at dysfunctional romances among moderately awful human beings with maybe one or two science-y references sloppily inserted into the episode, then pretty much everything I once enjoyed about this show is out the proverbial window. 

Edited September 29, 2015 by amensisterfriend

[ari333]

Ok. I'll say it.

I don't really care where the story goes.... as long as it is funny.... (to me heh)

Edited September 29, 2015 by ari333

[Zoe]

Two notes:

 

1. Did Fun with Flags not have its series finale several episodes back last season?

2. For big organizations, counselling is usually included as part of medical or wellness benefit. It would not be really believable that a major and very reputable institution like Caltech did not offer those benefits to its staff.

1. He did make the final episode, but one single person commented that they would miss the show so he decided to continue it anyway.

2. Marriage counseling is a bit different from the services usually offered under wellness plans.

[ari333]

Agreed that the worst of this show is better than the best of most others (word on Two Broke Girls GACK)

[LADreamr]

think Sheldon is aware that it's a sexual reference, at least the right-hand thing.

Not the right hand thing, but he has said other things since the breakup that were clearly meant to be sexual references.

[Oldernowiser]

Well, make that three. I hated Seinfeld for the same reason I'm really not happy with BBT the last few seasons...as was stated much more eloquently earlier, they all now pretty much suck. Same thing happened with the last few seasons of Friends...I couldn't find any of them likeable except occasionally Phoebe and Joey.

Last night I once again completely forgot this show was on and it used to be appointment viewing for me.

I miss that.

[mstar1125]

Eh, as an actual scientist in academia, I have to disagree and say that we don't make all that much money. The same or similar research job in industry would pay 2 to 3 times as much, so it's not unrealistic for the show to portray the girls as making way more than the boys on the show.

That's not the part that bothers me.  It does make sense that working in industry would bring in more money, what doesn't make sense though is the way they act like the guys are earning a pittance.  Please. I should be so lucky to make what they make!  It's insulting to most of their viewers to act like single people making upwards of $80,000 a year, and probably more, are struggling financially.

 

 

Your point is taken. I think the "financial struggle" portrayed on the show has more to do with the feeling that the compensation is not commensurate with the education, experience, and time commitment necessary to be a successful PhD-level scientist in academia, a feeling that is common among our folk. In the end, we do it because we love what we do and are fully committed to the research (so much so that sometimes we "give up" salary to devote more funding to the experiments), but it would be nice for recognition of achievement to come in the form of a heftier pay day. Also, many of us are sitting on significant student loan debt. I imagine Howard and maybe Leonard are in the same boat; Raj's family is rich and Sheldon probably got scholarships. 

 

I think Leonard justifies it to himself that he's been so deprived his whole life, he's entitled to grab at anything he's always considered above him.  Sort of, "I can't believe she could want ME, what was I supposed to do?  I've been laughed at my whole life, blah, blah, blah."

 

I agree that this is Leonard's rationalization, but in show time it's been what? 8 years, roughly a quarter of his life? And he's had several attractive girlfriends/encounters in that time, so it's time for him to put this rationalization to rest. 

[ari333]

I think in the cafeteria exchange, Howard's crude comments bothered me the most of all of them....bc he is presumably married to someone who he loves a lot. Maybe I am naïve.

If Howard had said, "she's hot" that'd be one thing, but the, "I'd like to.... whatever her " is another  -- or maybe I misheard.

[CherryAmes]

I remember an episode from a few years back when Howard was bragging that his wife had fun bags and money bags.  That pretty much summed up Howard for me.  If he can talk about his own wife like that it doesn't surprise me at all that he talks about other women so crudely.  Every now and then the writers seem to want the viewers to think Howard has matured and changed but then they forget they want to go there I guess.

[terrymct]

Eh, as an actual scientist in academia, I have to disagree and say that we don't make all that much money. The same or similar research job in industry would pay 2 to 3 times as much, so it's not unrealistic for the show to portray the girls as making way more than the boys on the show. I suppose the boys still would be considered "wealthy" to most people in the sense that they are making a decent salary as single/married men with no children, no mortgage, etc., but they are also living in one of the most expensive parts of the country and have expensive hobbies (those comic books, toys, games don't come cheap!). 

 

You beat me to it.  It also varies greatly among fields of science, then whether they have tenure or if they've been able to bring in research grants.  In each grant, a scientist in academia would put some salary for his or herself in the budget to augment what they're getting from the University.  They need to do this since many universities pay for 9 months and expect the researcher to come up with the rest.   Some scientists will be paying off student loans, as well, but that also varies among disciplines and among universities.  At some schools, grad students in engineering, math, chemistry, physics, biology, etc, will have tuition reductions to at least in-state levels if not lower.  Other departments may not do that.

 

As for hobbies, don't forget their computers, video systems, and other electronics.

 

I've been a working scientist for a long time.  Like most of my colleagues, I'm comfortable after some lean years right after grad school.   Not rich, not poor, but have what I need.

[CherryAmes]

I don't mean to suggest the guys are rich and should be portrayed that way, but they are all in their mid-30s and have been working in academia for at least 10 years now.  They're doing ok and when they have an episode or two (at most!!) that suggest that Leonard is hard up that flies in the face of every episode of the show up to that point and they make it seem like they have no real idea how much a research scientist on the tenure track actually makes.

[Gummo]

Hello, all. I haven't commented on this particular board before, but as a fan who's watched the show since its beginnings, I do have a few comments to make on the current direction:

 

1. The money issue is distracting.  The show persists in portraying the guys more like struggling graduate students than established research professors.  As the female characters are allowed to grow and change -- at least professionally -- it's harder and harder to hide this discrepancy.

 

2. I think this season has finally clarified for me that Sheldon's emotional age is approximately 12 -- the age when boys are just starting to notice girls, but are still utterly confused by them, and by their own feelings towards them.  Thus, Sheldon oscillating uncontrollably between rage at Amy, then missing her, then stalking her, then being angry again -- it all makes a lot more sense if I think of him as a 12 year old in a grown man's body.  It also helps explain his misuse of sexual taunting and innuendo -- it's like a kid trying to tell a dirty joke they don't really understand.

 

3. I don't know that any of the male characters have ever been portrayed as nice guys.  Leonard's always been a needy, insecure, neurotic mess.  He WANTS to be the nice guy, in the worst way, but usually sabotages his own efforts (as we've seen so memorably with the wedding).  Raj has always been a shallow, selfish stinker.  Sheldon's utter self-absorption and humongous ego is too well-known to need comment. The one character with a big redemption arc has been Howard, who was the last character anyone would have chosen for a long-term successful marriage!

 

Luckily, eppy 2 was funnier that eppy 1.  That's pretty much all I ask, give me a few laughs and some nerdy references.  I still think Penny & Leonard getting married was a mistake, though, one that will be very difficult to write through.

[SmithW6079]

I did think the beginning with Sheldon volunteering to kiss Penny to even things out was hilarious. I'm almost disappointed that it was a dream.

Not for me. When I thought it was real, I was ready to turn it off immediately and delete all future episodes.

 

 

Piling on Amy's pain about Sheldon's immaturity served to deepen and reinforce the unpleasant atmosphere and themes of the show. Dissing Amy on the Internet was a terrible low for Sheldon's boyish behavior. I thought she would call his mother to report him.

As I said before: Sheldon = Douchebag

 

Must've been heavy-hearted for Kaley to act some of these scenes with her own marriage ending.

Well, these were filmed months in advance -- they haven't even changed her credits to revert to her maiden name.

 

I've enjoyed the past two shows more than just about all the episodes last season. Good start, hope it continues. The squicky part was the macho lunch crudeness, pure male-dominated office harassment. Howard's married now, time to stop publicly lusting after colleagues' bodies.

Just because you're on a diet, doesn't mean you can't look at the menu.

 

Agree that it was tasteless, but how is it harassment?

Because men talking among themselves and making crude jokes is not acceptable if a woman has ever passed by or sat at that table or thought about sitting at that table or was present in the room at some point past or present, even if she didn't hear them talking, or hasn't even been born yet.

 

 

I'm not sure where the lines are drawn with sexual harassment in the workplace, but to me it would only seem like harassment if they were saying this to her face. I thought the exchange was funny (I'm a female), because that's how some guys talk about women, especially when they aren't in mixed company. If the women were sitting around having the same exchange about an attractive man ("I'd let him free his willy around me any day", etc.) would we be similarly offended? 

No, because today, the same behavior that's unacceptable for a man is considered totally acceptable for a woman. 

[Homily]

As for Leonard's financial situation, I think, even with her better earning power, he is still funding some of Penny's wants.

 

Possible of course but I recall an episode last season where she offered to pay off his student loans so it's not like she isn't prepared to put her hand in her pocket for him.  I'm sorry they seem to making Penny and Leonard's relationship the same as Howard and Bernadette's where the wife has the Big Salary and the guy is just getting by.  Any bets on whether Leonard gets put on an allowance in a future episode?

 

Because men talking among themselves and making crude jokes is not acceptable if a woman has ever passed by or sat at that table or thought about sitting at that table or was present in the room at some point past or present, even if she didn't hear them talking, or hasn't even been born yet.

 

They were on university property sitting in the middle of a cafeteria.  In typical TV show fashion they could have been talking at the top of their lungs but no one would hear them unless that served the plot but IRL they certainly could have been heard and as grown, adult, professional men they were well out of line and they should have known it.

Edited September 29, 2015 by Homily

[WickedTuna]

That was a little better...especially the kiss. Our little Shelly is a hot kisser (even if it was just a dream). I'm hoping things with Amy are resolved soon because I'm not liking this Sheldon. Leonard needs to call Mrs. Cooper to fix things.

I don't know how much more of Penny and Leonard I can take. It's like a fricking soap opera. I want to laugh damn it.

[LADreamr]

Those awful and public comments are not made in a vacuum. They are made within the context of a society that is still very oppressive and shaming and often dangerous toward women. They are made as a way of continuing that societal mindset and making the target woman and any other woman who may overhear it, aware of their lower status. Whether or not that is consciously in the minds of the men saying these things, it's an agreement of some kind that it's ok to do.

So no, it is not OK to do to men, either, but it is not the same thing.

[Winston Wolfe]

 

And, none of Leonard's insecurities about his relationship with Penny are actually his fault, as they are the result of his mother having rejected him growing up.

Spot on Bazinga.  I was just about to post that much of the four male leads' dysfunction could, theoretically, be traced back to their Mother issues (maybe its just the Freudian in me).  Leonard could never get Mommy's approval, so he sleeps with any female (or tries to) that looks his way.  Raj's mother was so overbearing he couldn't even speak to women for much of his adult life.  Howard's mother infantilized him to such a degree that his only realistic marriage prospect was to a woman that subtly does the same exact thing (and Bernadette has actually been known to sound like Mrs. Wolowitz).  Still trying to figure out the deal between Sheldon and his mom.  Maybe she showed him too much affection and caused that part of his psyche to shut down?

 

LADreamr

But it's strange that Sheldon keeps using sexual references in regards to all this apparent wonderfulness that Amy's missing.

Yeah, what the Hell was that about?  Sheldon made more sexual references in this one episode than he has in the past eight years.  Was the inference to Amy that he'll actually, ah, touch her if she comes back to him?

 

terrymct

It was time that Leonard and Penny talked about their insecurities regarding each other.

Except that it's beyond tired and gets more illogical with each passing season.  Both have gone through tons of relationships over the years (Leonard more than Penny now that I think of it).  They've both sampled what's out there and decided they were each other's best match.  Not sure where all the uncertainty is coming from.

 

Re: Raj - I get the feeling he and Emily are done, but the writers just haven't gotten around to telling us yet.  I'm still holding out hope that we get to see the Vet again.  She and Raj had a nice, easy chemistry and it's strange that the show chose not to pursue it.  Plus, she was cute and seemed pretty normal.  Not everyone in the cast has to be an oddball.  The best sitcoms always had at least one "straight" man (or woman) to amp up the comedic effect.  Maybe that's why Emily and Lucy haven't worked out; the audience is overdosing on "characters."

Edited September 29, 2015 by Winston Wolfe

[Homily]

Re: Raj - I get the feeling he and Emily are done, but the writers just haven't gotten around to telling us yet.

 

According to IMDB Emily shows up in the 4th episode for this season, although Emily is listed in the credits she isn't mentioned in the synopsis (which sounds like it could be fun).

 

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt4995126/?ref_=tt_ep_nx

[CherryAmes]

I checked that IMDB entry and noticed that a few episodes down the road there is one where Amy gets asked out by Kripke and by Stuart.  Someone upthread suggested Kripke as a possible candidate for dating Amy, I guess the writers agreed!  I hope even if she turns him down that she makes Sheldon squirm.

[Gummo]

 

I checked that IMDB entry and noticed that a few episodes down the road there is one where Amy gets asked out by Kripke and by Stuart.

 

I wonder if Kripke is going to insist on calling her "Woxanne."

[CherryAmes]

I wonder if Kripke is going to insist on calling her "Woxanne."

 

This was part of my all time favourite Howard and Penny exchange.  Howards says "Suddenly I'm looking pretty good huh." and the way Penny laughs always cracks me up, it was so natural.

Edited September 29, 2015 by CherryAmes

[ari333]

Looking at the menu and saying out loud in front of others that you'd like to ____ the menu are two different things imo.

I'd love Amy to have another date with Stuart (without Sheldon interrupting;) But I like the Stuart character, so there's that.

I was kind of bummed with Berny She was blaming Howard for telling her, but she was the one who chose not to tell her friend before the friend got married. Not that it was terrible to not tell either. IDK. Bad position to be in, but hardly Howard's fault for confiding in her with a fairly important secret.... confiding his wife, not some casual person.

[ari333]

Also, I'd have preferred Leonard just saying that he cant yet find a therapist with whom he feels comfortable rather than saying they are too expensive.

I didn't buy that Leonard and Penny together would not have money for counseling.

[AriAu]

Ok. I'll say it.

I don't really care where the story goes.... as long as it is funny.... (to me heh)

 

This!

The whole conversation is just a little too deep for me!  It is a sitcom and it is their job to be funny and therefore I will put up with some inappropriate things until it crosses the line of offensive and to me, it never got there.

Remember, this is a sitcom from the same team that brought us that bastion of propriety, Two and a Half Men.

I will put up with some character gaps and continuity breaks as long as it furthers the humor and is not patently absurd and we are not even close to that here.

Edited September 29, 2015 by AriAu

[ari333]

I know Howard said, " I'd like to cover three quarters of her surface area" but it sounded like "circus area." Just me?

[CherryAmes]

I didn't buy that Leonard and Penny together would not have money for counseling.

 

Also they are now married, whatever benefits Penny's company offers would probably be available to Leonard.  It's really unlikely that neither the university nor a major pharmaceutical company offer counselling as part of their benefit package. 

[QuelleC]

I just took it as it didn't occur to him it was something they should do and where to start. It was a little surprising H/B had counseling too.  Being the subject of Needy Baby Greedy Baby I don't think counseling is on his list of things to do. They probably get individual counseling but couples/relationship counseling benefits are rare if any in real life.  It's a sitcom folks. 

[Zoe]

Well, these were filmed months in advance -- they haven't even changed her credits to revert to her maiden name.

This episode was taped on August 18th.

[Jack Kerouac]

The sexual jokes about Mandy may or may not have been sexual harassment, but they showed the speakers to be horrible human beings. It's nothing different from what we have seen before, but this just seemed particularly mean spirited. The person was in the same room as them, and they were making filthy comments. 

 

And the Geek Chorus objectifying poor Mandy was horrible. Maybe it's just a conversation among friends, and not a workplace harassment issue, but it pretty much was a sty of pigs oinking. If she is happy sexually free, that's her choice, but the comments were sickening.  

 

And you don't think that's not over the top at all? Guys and girls talk about each other like that all the time, and have for generations. I've personally seen women talk about men like that (actually way worse than that) and I don't think it is 'sickening' or makes them horrible people. Then again, it is a sitcom and YMMV. But if you think a bunch of guys (or gals) sitting near a beautiful and/or sexy women/man, don't talk like that, well ... there's not much I can say.

[anna0852]

I really liked this episode. I'm glad we saw Leonard and Penny start to acknowledge and work through their issues. I'm not bother by the whole 'marriage counseling is expensive thing'. They've been married for 2 days at this point and I doubt they've had any discussions on how to co-mingle (or not) their finances. In my head, Leonard is having the thought process of "I screwed up, I have to fix this" which is why he's got the perspective of paying for the sessions himself.

 

I'm glad to see Amy is still hanging with the girls despite the break-up. And someone needs to sit Sheldon down and explain how this works. Most likely this person will have to be Penny, as she and Bernadette are probably the only ones with real relationships and break ups in their background.

[dungeonwriter]

I think the problem is context. 

 

There's joking, but every action we see on television is supposed to tell us about the characters. I felt like the writing here made them seem like jerks, instead of witty banter. Perhaps the writing just didn't work for me. 

[chocolatine]

It's one thing to make crude jokes among themselves when socializing outside of work; it's quite another to do so in the workplace, in a public space such as a cafeteria, where anyone could overhear, and with the subject of the jokes being in the same room. That just shows really poor judgement, especially since all of those guys have already had dealings with HR. And it would be just as bad (and just as actionable) if the genders were reversed.

[shapeshifter]

the most important thing that I need to know about it [the episode], is where Penny got her blue shirt. So pretty. I need it.

My thoughts too. Isn't there a website for this?

I don't think Sheldon is aware that it's a sexual reference, at least the right-hand thing.

I thought the little look JP gave was supposed to signify an afterthought that Sheldon had about the sexual implications of what he had just said rather than JP's feelings about the line.

ETA: But JP could still have decided to include that look because he thought the line was distasteful but figured he could subtly make a social commentary about that with the look without actually breaking the fourth wall. IDK.

Edited September 29, 2015 by shapeshifter

[TV Anonymous]

2. Marriage counseling is a bit different from the services usually offered under wellness plans.

 

As I suspected, it turned out that not only that marriage counselling is included as benefit, Caltech has its own in-house Consultation Center available for free for staff and their families. I do believe similar benefit is available for staff of other major universities as well.

 

Therefore, the premise of the plot that Leonard does not have money to afford counselling is an evidence of our good writers do not do their research.

[dungeonwriter]

I think that was the problem. Had the conversation happened in the living room, it would be a little less creepy but she's sitting right there, and it's at work. 

 

Also, Amy and Kripke might make a sweet couple. He can be a horrid person, but he can at least act charming. 

[Miss Dee]

I thought it was interesting that Sheldon took control of his OCD long enough to do one knock and sans name to boot. You could tell it was agony for him. He really wanted her to open that door VERY badly.

[MissLucas]

I thought it was interesting that Sheldon took control of his OCD long enough to do one knock and sans name to boot. You could tell it was agony for him. He really wanted her to open that door VERY badly.

That was probably the biggest proof of his "love" she ever got so far.

[P3pp3rb1rd]

the show would be a lot more uplifting, enjoyable and entertaining without these relentlessly depressing, dysfunctional, character-assassinating "ships." It's come to the point where I think I'm just going to fast forward to the scenes that aren't in any way about any of these people's past or current romantic relationships.

 

Penny has always been a boring and unfunny character for me. Leonard is more interesting when he isn't being pulled into the black hole of her self-satisfied, vain personality. For example, he and his mother are like a riveting tennis match. The show has made Penny and Leonard into a predictable soap opera that's stale, pathetic, dull and a waste of time.

[photo fox]

I had no problem with the jokes, but I used to work with mostly men, and my humor was just as inappropriate as theirs.

Honestly, beyond the first couple of comments, I thought it was more about seeing how many double entendres they could come up with than anything about the actual woman. YMMV

I'd love it if Jane Lynch's psychiatrist from TAHM moved to Pasadena to do random guest spots as the Caltech on-site counselor. I grew to hate that show, but she was hilarious.

[CherryAmes]

I'd love it if Jane Lynch's psychiatrist from TAHM moved to Pasadena to do random guest spots as the Caltech on-site counselor. I grew to hate that show, but she was hilarious.

 

Not to hijack the thread but we reached a point with TAHM that we'd only tune into an episode if she was going to be on.  I'd definitely vote to have her do a crossover and end up on BBT.  I'd love to see her and Beverly meet up!

[Mom x 3]

This episode was taped on August 18th.

 

But wasn't she gushing about her marriage on some TV show in September?  Either way, I feel sorry for her.  No one plans for their marriage to fail.

 

I had no problem with the jokes, but I used to work with mostly men, and my humor was just as inappropriate as theirs.

Honestly, beyond the first couple of comments, I thought it was more about seeing how many double entendres they could come up with than anything about the actual woman. YMMV

 

I'm with you.  I thought it was hilarious.  If they were in a position of authority over her or even if they had said it to where she heard, then I can see it becoming a hostile work environment.  Otherwise if anyone overheard them then they'd just look like the douchbags they are.

I would LOVE to see Raj with Mandy.  I think they'd have more chemistry.

"If you think having one wife is hard, try having two."  I guffawed at this. 

Have we seen Kripke be mean to anyone but Sheldon and Leonard?  I think he would be great for Amy.  I'm hoping his Fun with Flags goes viral and Amy's dance card overflows!

[Bazinga]

 

Have we seen Kripke be mean to anyone but Sheldon and Leonard?

I can't even think of any occasion where he has done anything to Leonard.  He is a bit of a jerk in general but never mean to anyone but Sheldon, whose contempt for, and superiority over, everyone else probably initiated the "rivalry."

Edited September 30, 2015 by Bazinga

[needschocolate]

Possible of course but I recall an episode last season where she offered to pay off his student loans so it's not like she isn't prepared to put her hand in her pocket for him.  I'm sorry they seem to making Penny and Leonard's relationship the same as Howard and Bernadette's where the wife has the Big Salary and the guy is just getting by.  Any bets on whether Leonard gets put on an allowance in a future episode?

 

At least the "Penny makes more money than Leonard" angle keeps us from having to watch the "Leonard thinks Penny only married him for his money" storyline.

[mansonlamps]

 

At least the "Penny makes more money than Leonard" angle keeps us from having to watch the "Leonard thinks Penny only married him for his money" storyline.

 

Unfortunately it doesn't stop us from having to watch the "Leonard only married Penny for her looks" storyline.  Which is played over and over on Modern Family with Jay and Gloria, but it doesn't seem to bother anyone there for some reason.  Maybe because Gloria is totally on board with it?

 

I didn't find the guys conversation anywhere near the sexual harassment threshold, they were guys at a lunch table talking amongst themselves.   I imagine if women could overhear all the private conversations men have about women, every man on earth could be judged as "horrible."

[CherryAmes]

The content of the conversation was bad but what put it over the line into potential harassment territory was the content combined with the location.  I get that this is a sitcom but these guys are professional men in their 30s even Howard and Raj should know that a conversation like that in the middle of a university cafeteria is all kinds of inappropriate.  On the plus side had they been overheard we'd have gotten to see Regina King again and that's never a bad thing!

[LoneHaranguer]

 

I get that this is a sitcom but these guys are professional men in their 30s even Howard and Raj should know that a conversation like that in the middle of a university cafeteria is all kinds of inappropriate.

Maybe, but they know they can get away with it, although Raj should start being more careful; he's in "what have you done for us lately?" territory.