S07.E07: Family Matters

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

I do think the boyfriend is a little skeevy but I agree with Dorinda, people need to stay out of her business. She is a grown woman and and she can date whomever she wishes to. Not to mention, Ramona is the last one to talk. 

 

Per what's been broadcast, Kristen's vendetta against Bethenny is really weird.

 

What vendetta? She was asked a question confession. I'll assume she didn't think anything of Bethenny's absence till she was asked about it since she didn't comment on it at the match. Only Carole did if I am remembering correctly. 

Heather must have done a hell of a job in negotiating her contract so as not to be paid at the rate of a "friend of". At this point, that is all she is. I don't think she said more than a dozen words in the whole episode. I wonder if the press I heard yesterday is true and that the other girls are upset with her because of her "lack of a storyline"?  I hate it because she is my favorite. 

 

I know what you mean but I think, the less a housewife is featured, the better off they are. What do they say about absence again? 

[JAYJAY1979]

I'd prefer only one or two big vacations where all the women hang out...but the rest of the time..the women hang out on their own..or in twos or threes.

Bethanny not gelling with the women that joined after she left is more organic to me...and its an organic conflict not manufactured too much.

[beaker73]

According to Brandi, Kristen and Beth will have a big issue because of a product that Kristen wants to develop/launch, and Beth has some harsh words for her. If Brandi is to be believed (a huge "if" I know), Beth is not at all nice to Kristen about this. 

 

It seems to me that the ladies (I am trying to break my habit of using the term "girls" as is per my usual because 50 is approaching for me later this summer and I don't want to pretend to be someone I am not) must have talked about Beth missing things. It was interesting that Lu had that conversation with Beth, when we've really seen nothing at this point that would indicate that there has been a problem with Beth not attending events. Carole was actually the one to make the comment at the Boxing Match, with Kristen following up in her TH. We never saw Kristen say anything to the other girls about Beth. This leads me to believe it has been a topic of conversation at other times and they are probably showing Kristen's words as a prelude to the upcoming issues between them. 

 

I think the whole thing is stupid. Unless Bravo is going to show us other times when Beth has failed to show and the ladies are upset, this part makes absolutely no sense at all. 

Pure speculation-- but I wonder if some of these ladies feel Bethenny is getting preferential treatment by Bravo and that’s fueling their “bitterness”?    For the AC trip they were told to be at Sonja’s at 10:30, right?  Heather & Kristen make arrangements for someone to take their kids to school so they can be there when production instructed.  Then they find that Bethenny decided to take her own to kid to school herself—schedule be damned!—and now they have to wait.  It’s possible that Beth was on the schedule to be at the boxing match and then decided not to go citing childcare.  Yes, yes, I get that Kristen is with her kids all the time and Beth is sharing custody, but I get a real sense that there is a whole different set of rules that apply to Beth and people are getting annoyed by it.

Just to be on topic—Carole’s hat was stupid.

[Wouldofshouldof]

Every woman on this show lately is quick to get irritated or annoyed.

As Brandi would say, MENOPAUSE!

[ghoulina]

I'd prefer only one or two big vacations where all the women hang out...but the rest of the time..the women hang out on their own..or in twos or threes.

Bethanny not gelling with the women that joined after she left is more organic to me...and its an organic conflict not manufactured too much.

 

Exactly. Bethenny said in therapy that she's having a really hard time letting people in right now. She'd rather hang out with people she already knows, even if they don't particularly get along, than invest in meeting new people. But yea, I really don't have a problem with - "I don't like this person, and I don't want to hang out with them". It just feels more natural. I find the women more enjoyable in smaller groups anyhow.

[archer1267]

Bethanny not gelling with the women that joined after she left is more organic to me...and its an organic conflict not manufactured too much.

 

 

It's funny because I'm re-watching S2 on Hulu and Kelly just got reamed at the Reunion by all the women, primarily for acting like she's above them. LuAnn and Jill were vocal, but Bethenny especially was offended by Kelly's attitude, saying "it makes you a piece of shit [when you don't engage with us or try to be friendlier, or act like you don't know us]." I see Bethenny doing a lot of the same stuff in this season - the "I'm better than this" routine, or making little digs instead of trying to engage. Ramona's friends were welcoming towards her and she had nothing but crap to say (yes, the Star Wars bar thing was funny, but cruel, too - these women didn't deserve to have the camera pan to their unfortunate hairstyles/outfits/plastic surgery when Bethenny said that).

 

Also ironic: the women getting on Kelly for not sharing more about her personal life, not sharing the nature of her relationship with Max, and saying "you're on a reality show with us!" when Kelly insists that it's nobody's business. I have to remind myself that Bethenny had a boyfriend during the season's filming, but apparently isn't being pushed to share that.

[Wouldofshouldof]

I have to say, you people are making me dread turning 50 this summer. I'm a live and let live person. Wear whatever the hell you want to wear, as long as you're happy with what you wear, I don't care. Doesn't affect my life at all.

I never knew there were so many people who thought people should only dress a certain way after turning 50. I'm a jeans, t-shirt and sneakers kind of woman (oh shit, I almost said girl!) now I wonder if I need to go and buy some "old lady" clothes after my birthday.

It's enough to give somebody a complex.

 

Maharincess, I think you and I participated in a similar discussion on the Unbreakable Kimmy thread.  I mentioned that I work with a woman who dresses like a 2-year old allowed to pick out her own clothes. I'm 50 in 2 weeks (holy shit!) and also wear jeans and T shirts when I can.  For me the issue is more of a personality thing.  Because I'm an introvert, I have an allergic reaction to people who are overtly attention-seeking, and bunny ears and a titty shirt fit that bill.  I'm more meh about the hat.  It wasn't flattering but didn't make me break out in hives, either. 

[izabella]

For the AC trip they were told to be at Sonja’s at 10:30, right?  Heather & Kristen make arrangements for someone to take their kids to school so they can be there when production instructed.  Then they find that Bethenny decided to take her own to kid to school herself—schedule be damned!—and now they have to wait.

 

I give side-eye to that whole "dropping the kids off at school" line.  What kind of schools are these kids going to that don't start at 8 or 9am?  Why wouldn't Kristen and Heather be able to drop their kids off at 9 and then be able to get to Sonja's 90 minutes later?  Why would Bethenny be dropping off her toddler at school at 11 or 11:30 thus making her so late she didn't get there until after noon? 

Edited May 20, 2015 by izabella

[charmed1]

I am sympathetic to Bethenny wanting to spend time with her kid. I was raised by a single mom. But as a single person with no children, I've often had to complain about co-workers and supervisors sticking me with work because "Sorry, my kid has a thing." And it makes me extremely angry. But I didn't get anger at all from Kristin's answer and I have a feeling the question was asked in such a way that she had to compare her child care situation to Bethenny's.

[imjagain]

The lack of growth really is shocking when it comes to her family matters. Dr. Imabore should be embarrassed at his lack of effectiveness. Big question when it comes to her stepdad, did she pay him to come on?

She didn't show up to Dorinda's cocktail party either. It seems that Bethenny goes where Bethenny likes. Maybe to the event of HWs that she knows and not the newbies. Meanwhile, others complain like Kristen - Heather complained for her. And Carole complained too. Dorinda was put out by her rsvp also.

I was wondering why they(editors) are showing the women complain about Beth not attending things, while we haven't seen a lot of this.

And these are my thoughts, I agree Beth does and goes where she wants. I'm sure if the women are talking about it there are probably plenty we haven't seen. And yet Beth wins, because the other women look petty.

I understand why the others might be annoyed.

[motorcitymom65]

No kidding. Last season Ramona said "no one I know goes to the Berkshires!" I guess she forgot that one of her long-time friends does ;-) 

 

Apparently in the episode after next, they all go to Dorinda's house in the Berkshires for her birthday. I hope Dorinda has a/c.  I cannot wait to hear how Ramona tries to take back her original comment, because I feel sure Heather will remind her. As would I. 

[izabella]

I was wondering why they(editors) are showing the women complain about Beth not attending things, while we haven't seen a lot of this.

And these are my thoughts, I agree Beth does and goes where she wants. I'm sure if the women are talking about it there are probably plenty we haven't seen. And yet Beth wins, because the other women look petty.

I understand why the others might be annoyed.

 

At some point, they probably started to realize that the camera goes where Beth goes, even on a solo trip to Florida.  They are on this show to get their own camera time, so no doubt they'd resent the focus being on Bethenny.  And they'd be right - we haven't seen much of Heather and Kristen.  There weren't any scenes at LuAnn's Hampton's house after Bethenny left.  Bethenny's brunch took time away from Ramona's brunch.  Bethenny is filming seperately with Sonja, but not any of the newer Ho's.  Bethenny is taking over the first half of this show with all the time they give her, which means less camera time for everyone else.

[motorcitymom65]

I get what you're saying, but I don't think Bethenny is at Kim Z levels of not participating yet. She went out to the Hamptons. She went to Atlantic City. She went to singles night at that weird club. What else did she not show up to besides boxing? (I'm not being snarky, I just genuinely can't remember.) Dorinda and Sonja weren't at boxing as well. 

 

 

 

The problem is we can only judge based on what we have seen. They shoot 85 hours of film for every hour we see, so most of the stuff ends up on the cutting room floor. I think Beth must have missed more than just Dorinda's deal and the Boxing Match, because otherwise Lu's comment made zero sense. Beth didn't take issue with it. She didn't say that Lu was wrong or that the other girls were crazy in saying she hadn't been involved. There might have been other dinners or outings that Beth didn't attend but they didn't make it to the show. I would expect that this is why the girls would be irritated with her not participating. They know that the camera is going to follow her to an extent, and when it all goes to editing a lot of the stuff that doesn't include her might not get shown. This was the issue with LVP on the BH show last season. The girls weren't upset because they really wanted her around that much, they were upset because they were afraid their segments wouldn't make it to our TV's if she wasn't there. 

 

I always thought that Beth coming back was meant to be a redemption for her and I think this is the way that Andy pitched it to her.  The perception of her in the public had hit rock bottom. Why in the world would she come back if not to try and redeem herself in some way - if only to the people who might be involved in her on-going divorce/custody battle. How smart of her to constantly show herself putting her daughter first in every situation. How would it look if she was spending the little time she had with her daughter giving her over to care-givers to get her to school and tuck her in at night? She has had a rocky start, but no way do I believe she won't end the season on a high note and a fan favorite once again. Andy is simply not going to do that to her. 

 

Unfortunately for Heather, I think a lot of this will come at her expense. 

Edited May 20, 2015 by motorcitymom65

[MyAimIsTrue]

As per Wiki, Bethany is a native New Yorker but she did move around a lot. If her parents are New Yorkers too (which I bet they are...), she probably got her vocal affect from them. It is very common here in NY to talk fast. I'm a native New Yorker and I have to slow down for out of towners sometimes.

 

Yes and yes.  I've officially been out of New York longer than I lived there but I still speak a mile a minute.

[Higgins]

Okay - I don't usually post during the show, but WHAT THE FUCK is that thing on top of Carole's head??  Jesus - did she really think that looked good??  Or, is she trying to look like the hipster 20-somethings with those droopy wool hats?  

Yeah, I mean, she looks so stupid, WTF?

 

Why would Bethenny bring up Mario, the divorce and Avery moving out at Ramona's birthday party?  She must really have it out for Ramona this season, and I'm wondering if she's still secretly angry at her over that whole Brooklyn Bridge conversation.  She really was rude to Ramona's friends, too.  What a wet blanket.

 

Ding ding ding!

 

Carole can dish it out when it comes to judging others but can't take it.  It was nice of Luann to say, "I'm happy if you're happy," considering the position that she's in.  How bothered would Carole be if Luann's niece started dating Russ?  I guess as long as it's been at least 6-12 months, she'll be fine with it.

 

What's with Bethenny being kind-of a dick to the waiter?  "I'm familiar with how this process works."  He's just doing his job, geezus.  I think she was trying to be funny, but she has such an abrasive and cutting manner that she sounds like a bitch even when she isn't necessarily intending to.

 

Her stepfather attacked her and repeatedly beat her mother in front of her but she wants Bryn to have a relationship with him?  REALLY?  What the hell is wrong with her?  If your friends are really such great friends, they will be your daughter's family on your side.  I think Bethenny sees how the Hoppys are so close and feels like she isn't providing that from her end.  She needs to just accept that she got dealt a bad hand when it comes to parents: a distant, uninterested father, an abusive physcho stepfather and ...her mother, whatever the deal is there.

 

Victoria is a really talented artist.  I remember seeing something else of hers in another episode, not the horse show, but I admired it.

 

Kristen giving Bethenny a hard time for choosing her daughter over the boxing match is so ugh. The vibe that I always got from Kristen was that her kids threatened to cramp her style and she foists them off on others whenever she can.  She even said that she and Josh put the kids to bed and then eat dinner out most nights.  Bethenny is going through a hard divorce and unstable living situation with a very young child.  I would stay with Bryn also.  But then I ask myself, why is Bethenny on the show in the first place at this particular time?  She knows how it all works, the time that's involved.  Seems like an odd time to be on a reality show when your whole life is a mess.  And I don't believe what she told her therapist--that she doesn't feel the need to strive anymore.  Yeah right, that's why she schleps bottles of Skinnygirl around everywhere to set them up in front of  the cameras. 

 

The dick of a former stepfather telling Bethenny that her mother never wanted her... what the hell was the point of that?  That wasn't necessary at all.  This guy is a loser and doesn't need to be in Bryn's life. Come on.  How long before he expects her to support him?  How low is the bar, Bethenny?

I suspect he is an alcoholic and maybe he has changed his life.

 

Testosterone, sigh, oh Carol.....

That explains why she looks so hard to me.

[imjagain]

At some point, they probably started to realize that the camera goes where Beth goes, even on a solo trip to Florida. They are on this show to get their own camera time, so no doubt they'd resent the focus being on Bethenny. And they'd be right - we haven't seen much of Heather and Kristen. There weren't any scenes at LuAnn's Hampton's house after Bethenny left. Bethenny's brunch took time away from Ramona's brunch. Bethenny is filming seperately with Sonja, but not any of the newer Ho's. Bethenny is taking over the first half of this show with all the time they give her, which means less camera time for everyone else.

If the rumors are true, more Beth at the end of the season, more filming of her trying not to be as arrogant and self centered, good luck with that.

I know people keep saying Heather and Kristen have no story, but imo they haven't had a chance.

Beth doesn't seem to like either, so they haven't had much camera time.

[rho]

I like Bethenny generally, but I hate seeing therapy on reality TV and I hate when she uses the show to work through her shit.  I'd rather have shots of Ramona hitting a wine glass with a knife and then later licking frosting off that knife, or that delicious cut of Ramona saying life can be hard and cutting to Sonja like sitting on a table looking dejected.  NYC can be one of the funniest shows on TV.

 

^^THIS! I didn't know how to say it but you totally nailed how I feel. Call me apathetic but I don't watch this show to psychoanalyze rich people. I just want to see their fancy houses, be a voyeur on their luxurious vacations, and occasionally tune into a nothing fight because someone never returned a bikini to Ramona, even though I think it's gross when women share bikinis.

 

I really wish they would stop trying to Intervention everyone on camera. If Sonja wants to tell me she used to own a fleet of yachts and partied with Winston Churchill in the 1890's, by all means, party on Lady Morgan! I don't love watching her break down emotionally on screen in AC and I certainly didn't care for 30 minutes of rehashing Bethenny's life. Side note, does it still count as keeping things private when you tell the entire world on TV?

 

And as much as I didn't care for Bethenny's therapy session, I think Taekman can suck it. Just because she finds spending time with her children a chore, doesn't mean B needs to get a nanny so she can go sit in the splash zone at a fight. Brynn is only with her half the time and she has every right to spend time with her child. Since when are Kristen and Bethenny even friends?

[Sincerely Yours]

I give side-eye to that whole "dropping the kids off at school" line.  What kind of schools are these kids going to that don't start at 8 or 9am?  Why wouldn't Kristen and Heather be able to drop their kids off at 9 and then be able to get to Sonja's 90 minutes later?  Why would Bethenny be dropping off her toddler at school at 11 or 11:30 thus making her so late she didn't get there until after noon? 

I can believe that Heather and Kristen wouldn't have wanted to cut it close. Dropping off the kids and then making it to Sonja's. It really depends on where they go to school vs. where Sonja lives but morning traffic in Manhattan... I's safer to just arrange for someone else to take them instead of just barerly fitting it in the morning routine WHILE also going through the motions of leaving for a trip. Even if there would have been time to spare it would have probably been maybe half hour and I know that for me, that added detail would have made my morning feel more frantic so I get why they would delegated that particular job to someone else that morning. Now, is it something they would have been more willing to tackle had they known they had so much more time on their hands and it wouldn't have been a time crunch most likely but it wasn't something they wanted to risk knowing that time wasn't on their side.

 

Oh and during my post it just dawned on me. Maybe Brynn does get dropped off around the same time as Kristen and Heathers kids and they knew enough not to attempt it because.... well Bethenny is the perfect example of the result for stupidly thinking she had enough time to do both things in the time allotted. Bethenny gets into the limo saying there's just no way to gauge going down to Tribeca and back... etc.etc.etc. EXACTLY Bethenny most New Yorkers understand this which is why it would have been best to not even make the attempt.

 

Otherwise my other guess is that Brynn still isn't school age and is most likely going to preschool which can usually start later than regular school.

Edited May 20, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[Beden]

 

She is in such a different place than many of them. She is loaded with money. She launched a brand that is successful. She is already crazy busy with her "day" job, yet she is taking on this additional work, but then doesn't want to participate to the extent the others are.

Beth impresses me as someone who is running as fast as she can just to stay in place. Given, for the sake of argument, that her childhood was crap she would have good cause to be insecure--and has all the hallmarks. No one, nothing is ever quite enough, she seems to have a fear/horror of losing what she has (financially, emotionally, her daughter, professionally and so on). Okay, common enough but it's to an extreme.

 

If she's managing to turn at least her segments into the Bethenny Show, that's the producer's agreement since they would control the editing and allotment of screen time. It simply looks to me like she cut herself a hell of a deal/contract and is keeping herself relevant, her brand front and center and doesn't give a rat's ass about the faux friendships and plot twists of the current season.

 

On one hand she's incredibly annoying but I give her props for her business know how and, at the same time, feel almost sorry for anyone that desperate. I suspect that in 20 years she'll be the same but will have ramped up the desperation a few more notches and will have likely troubled relationships with a whole lot of people.

[Giselle]

An abundance candle is an alleged special candle you light to attract prosperity, increase success and obtain material possessions. So yeah, Sonja should have dozens of those going at a time to solve her money problems. LOL! It should be something you can get for a couple of bucks to about Yankee Candle prices but I wouldn't be surprised if Sonja was paying upwards of $60 per wick to some cross-legged con person for ones 'direct' from Asia & blessed by Tibetan or Buddhist monks or something. 

 

I imagine the $60 Tibetan blessed abundance candle is infused with sacred yak droppings so you can smell it working.

 

Maybe Asa from the Shah's of Sunset can work some mojo for her using her Diamond water after all she proclaims to be an "intergalactic Persian pop priestess."

[ScoobieDoobs]

I see this as a no win situation for her though, if she never mentions her childhood again then some people say she made it all up and embellish it, if she talks to the guy who was a big part of her childhood and he not only agrees to her version of the story but adds even more detail to explain the dysfunction that she lived then she somehow sha has managed to convince him to do it to clean her image. Some people are not going to believe her no matter what and that is fine.

 

Nah, it's not believability that's bothering me -- at all.  It's trotting this story out before the Bravo cameras every 6 seconds, which I find insanely annoying by now.  I know many people who have been thru far worse than Bethenny -- and are in far worse positions now too.  Bethenny is extremely rich & she has her health & a beautiful healthy daughter.  Enough with the fuckin' whining about this shit, Bethenny.  I.  Don't.  Care.  

 

Plus I think B is obsessed with her own psychology. I don't think people ever have to get over it per se but they do have to work through and past it in order to have some type of fulfilled joyful life.

 

She needs to get a real fucking therapist instead of this fake bullshit one who is having sessions with her on TV.  Is she really so stuck with this stuff that she has to throw it in our faces all the time?  Is she talking about this to everyone she sees in everyday life?  Does she talk to her limo driver about this, when she's in her limo driving around Manhattan all day stuck in traffic?  Does she talk about this stuff to her 2 poor beleaguered-looking assistants?  Oy, Bethenny seems like a ball of fun to be around, eh?

 

 

But there are folks who believe that writers all operate The Same Way. She was a news producer for a number of years. The turnaround in that kind of work is very different from what she's doing now, so it seems to me that she likes the less-harried approach at this stage of her career.

 

OK, fine & dandy -- not a difficult concept to comprehend, that creative people produce differently.  But taking 4 or 5 years to produce one piece of so-so work ain't good, no matter how you cut it.  To me, that stinks.  And her work ethic, as we've seen, really sucks.  I wouldn't wanna be her publisher.  Seriously, maybe she's really not all that talented as a writer & needs the help of a ghostwriter.  It's not a horrible thing.  Maybe she just can't admit or acknowledge this.

Edited May 21, 2015 by ScoobieDoobs

[Crikey]

I don't think Bethenny is a native New Yorker but she's lived in NYC for a long time.   She's not the only one who talks a mile a minute.  Ramona (and Sonja) do it too.  It's a New York thing.

 

While I'm at it.....    Please understand that I'm not trying to be Bethenny's champion but I'm a native New Yorker and it drives me crazy when I am out of state in a restaurant (especially in the South).  They're soooo slow.   I wouldn't want to have the waiter explain the "sections" of the menu to me either.   

Being sooo slow might be a southern thing.  Many places with warmer climates are considered to have a slower pace of life.  

I have enjoyed living in several different countries on three continents and I enjoyed each place because I didn't allow myself to be driven crazy by the different ways/paces of life there.

 

I believe most waiters are told  by the owner/manager what to mention to their customers. IMO  Bethy was just rude.  When I don't want to hear the specials or have the menu explained to me I politely say no, thank you.

[Crikey]

As per Wiki, Bethany is a native New Yorker but she did move around a lot. If her parents are New Yorkers too (which I bet they are...), she probably got her vocal affect from them. It is very common here in NY to talk fast. I'm a native New Yorker and I have to slow down for out of towners sometimes.

lol

That reminds me of a friend from NY.  She talks a mile a minute.  I once told her that if she didn't care if I understood what she was saying, just keep talking fast but, if she needed me to understand, she might want to slow down a tad because I listen slowly ;)

[WireWrap]

Heather must have done a hell of a job in negotiating her contract so as not to be paid at the rate of a "friend of". At this point, that is all she is. I don't think she said more than a dozen words in the whole episode. I wonder if the press I heard yesterday is true and that the other girls are upset with her because of her "lack of a storyline"?  I hate it because she is my favorite. 

I don't think it is an issue of Heather not having a storyline this season as much as it is the return of Bethenny. And for some reason, Andy/producers have put all their eggs in Bethenny's basket so far. That may change as the season goes on though.

 

When rules are applied unevenly to a group of people, I can see where anger, annoyance, and even jealousy can take over (been there, done that). But like you said, Beth was savvy enough to negotiate a contract that allows her to have more time with her kid and other special treatment. Kadooz to her. I think Andy was so desperate to get her back on the show he was willing to break his own rules.

 

Various HWs over the years have not attended every single event that the producers concoct during a season. Is Beth skipping more than the other ladies? Not sure, but it doesn't seem like it to me. In fact, I could do with a little less Beth on my screen.

 

As for your other point, I didn't see Beth's comment as a slight to SAHMs. (For the record, I don't have kids). I think she was talking about her particular situation. Maybe you are right and she intended that as a "dig" to the other ladies. But it didn't come across like that to me.

I don't think the other women would be privy to what is or isn't in Bethenny's contract. IMO, Bravo would not want any 1 HW to know what another's contract contains. I do suspect that Bethenny has missed more filming than we have seen though.  

[Leroux]

 

It would be so interesting to be able to see Brynn's take on Bethenny's mothering in 20 years. Will Bethenny hold herself to the same standard that she is holding her own parents?  Sometimes we have to be a parent ourselves before we can forgive our parents for the slights we feel we suffered in childhood. Parents are human after all.

 

If Bethenny as a mother does the same that Bernardette did, if she creates such chaos and tries to commit suicide in front of her daughter, if she had a screaming and physical match with a man where the police gets call and then within the same day they are having sex making wild sounds , then by all means Bryn should be entitle to tell her story. If that was the case I would hate for Bryn to have other people telling her that it really wasn't a big deal and she needs to let it go.

 

Parents are humans after all but there are some people who should never be parents, parents are humans and make mistakes, I forgot my daughter had an early soccer game and when we arrived the game was over, my daughter was upset with me but she will eventually get over it, but if I ever would try to kill myself in front of her or if the police visited my house frequently because of my physical brawls then absolutely that would be something that would be very difficult to overcome.

 

 Betheny gave some insight into her life as a child but the most remarkable revelations IMO came from Parisella himself , his non chalant attitude and the way he felt it was not a huge deal how the mafia was after him because he borrowed money and then gambled it away told me more than I need to know, the alcoholism, the drug addictions, etc. this coming from the one person in that trio was has ever admitted to give a damn about Bethenny

 

Parents are human and make mistakes but there is something called parenting, Bethenny had parents, she didn't have any good parenting.

Edited May 20, 2015 by Leroux

[biakbiak]

I get that it's tough to grow up with a parent who has mental health issues but Bethenny seems to gloss over that as a reason fir her messed up child and not have any empathy for what seem like severe issues. Who tries to commit suicide in front of their child, Bethenny? Someone who has a disease! Hell she even blamed her mother for going to a mental institution of it was a spa or a trip. I am not saying Bethenny needs to have a relationship with her mother or even forgive her but the lack of compassion about someone who was mentally ill (and abused) is also not healthy for her.

Edited May 20, 2015 by biakbiak

[Primetimer]

Bethenny makes up with her estranged stepfather and stuffs ice cream into a clown's mouth, not in that order.

Read the story

[poeticlicensed]

WRT Kristen ragging on B about missing the boxing (which is gross IMO anyway, who arranged that shit?) - I am by no means a B fan, but Kristen cannot possibly compare herself with B in terms of her kids. Kristen is essentially a SAHM, who has her kids 24/7. B has to split time, so she is much less willing to not be around, plus I'm sure Jason has his lawyers looking at every second at B's behavior. Wouldn't they just love to bring up in court that B went out instead of spending time with her kid. 

 

As far as B, I do feel bad she had a shitty childhood, but bringing some old guy who beat the crap out your mom and who you haven't spoken with in decades into your child's life so your ex's family won't outnumber you is batshit crazy. That guy gave me the creeps and I could tell he was only in it for the money. He specifically said B was rich and why didn't she contact me? Sounds like he only wanted contact after B got rich. She needs to stay far away. 

 

Speaking of needing help, I loved B's look when Sonja said that she was going to a high priestess instead of a therapist for help. Sonja is just ridic. Who works out surrounded by people. She's grasping at straws. 

 

I also am annoyed by Heather's "holla" and "mama". Glad to see someone actually snark on it on camera. 

 

Ramona's lunch looked like a plastic surgeon's office waiting room. 

 

The art show cracked me up. I loves it when people that don't frequent art shows go to something like that, expecting portraits and landscapes and you get performance art with ice cream eating clowns and  sparkly naked man parts. I liked Victoria's painting. I wouldn't hang it in my house, but she seems to be talented. I love how Lu takes everything in stride. 

 

As much as B annoys me with her I'm homeless talk (puleeze, you could have a home today if you chose), her THs crack me up. 

 

Carole is a cool girl wanna be but she is nice and kind. I feel bad that she and Lu are not in a good place, but Lu needs to get over it. Anyway, I doubt taht Carole and Adam are in it for the long haul. 

[Crikey]

So I did see the scene where Carole was working then got a phone call from Adam. I have to say--it does not bother me in the slightest when she shares that she's not the kind of writer who cranks out stuff in a matter of weeks or months. I just submitted a short story that I started work on maybe in 2013. I worked on it off and on, setting it aside and coming back to it with fresh eyes, and didn't officially finish it until February of this year. Then I had a couple friends (one who's an avid and well-read reader and another who's a poet) read the story, and did another round of edits based on some of their feedback.

There are, quite simply, writers who do crank out work (doesn't Jodi Picoult have a new book, like, every six weeks or something?) and there are writers who don't (while Toni Morrison publishes a book every few years). Carole isn't an anomaly and it doesn't mean she lacks work ethic. But there are folks who believe that writers all operate The Same Way. She was a news producer for a number of years. The turnaround in that kind of work is very different from what she's doing now, so it seems to me that she likes the less-harried approach at this stage of her career.

I thought, in  a previous episode with Carole and her editor, that she had a contract with a deadline for this next book.  IIRC, when told about the deadline, she giggled and pretended to be unaware of any deadline.  Was there any mention of Carole having been given an advance for this book?

 

If she had a contract and/or a deadline, I think she needed to set ink to paper, fingers to keyboard or have started dictating sumthin' pretty fast.  She might want to get harried ;)

Edited May 20, 2015 by Crikey

[breezy424]

I give side-eye to that whole "dropping the kids off at school" line.  What kind of schools are these kids going to that don't start at 8 or 9am?  Why wouldn't Kristen and Heather be able to drop their kids off at 9 and then be able to get to Sonja's 90 minutes later?  Why would Bethenny be dropping off her toddler at school at 11 or 11:30 thus making her so late she didn't get there until after noon? 

 

This came up a few days ago and a poster (I don't remember who it was) brought up a point that probably most of us hadn't thought of.  When they arrived at Sonja's they also each had to have their mics put on.  Also, in her blog, Heather said 10 am.  I think this is the 'actual' time they had to be there to prepare for the scene.  The official time for filming to start was probably 10:30.

 

Add to that, getting uptown during that time of the day can be a nightmare.  Bryn is in preschool so it may start later.  I thought Beth actually got there around 11:30.  Probably a little earlier because she had to have her mic put on as well.

[Trooper York]

I remember when I was a kid Dean Martin, Frank Sinatra and Sammy Davis Jr. would put on Nehru jackets and peace symbols when they were doing a roast or something to try and look "groovy.."

 

That's Carole with her hipster hat. 

 

Next thing you know she is going to show up in the Berkshires with a skateboard. 

[ZaldamoWilder]

ptv frickin post-eater. 

 

I realize there's a lot of Bethenny criticism here but I like Bethenny.  After hearing more of her backstory, I understand her better.  She's tough because she had to be.

 

It makes me like her, and the relationship she wants to protect with Bryn, more actually. 

 

I also kinda understood why he told Bethenny that her mother never wanted to have a child.  Bethenny had started talking about how her mother was out there somewhere and maybe trying to contact her which even her therapist told her was a bad idea.  He gave her the unvarnished truth about her mother so she didn't need to waste time looking for her.  I don't know if he's right or not, but I think that's what he was trying to do for her, to help her put that behind her so she could move forward.

 

This.  I thought in some weird way he was trying to either squash it for her or defend Bernadette or both.  As though in his head his whole sentence was:  She never wanted children you know, so consider yourself lucky that you're even alive.

If I have a reservation about John, it is about the fact that after his fight with Bethenny when she was 19, he never reached out to her and they were estranged for years.  I don't like that he seems to think the onus was on Bethenny, a child, to get in touch with him. That shows some fairly inappropriate parent-child expectations.  I've hear of a lot worse though.  And obviously he still drinks. They were going to have drinks at the end of the scene.  I would be interested in knowing if alcohol was a problem for him then or now, because that would be a deal breaker for me.  Even though he seemed fairly innocuous in that scene, if he turns into an asshole when he drinks I would not want to see him in Bryn's life.  Even if he lives all the way in Florida and they would only see him occasionally.  I would not want Bryn to witness anything even approaching one scene like Bethenny described witnessing as a child.

 

And of course if the mob is still out to kill him, well. I'd have second thoughts about being around him then, too.

 

That was such a what the absolute fuck is wrong with you moment.  He still didn't understand after she said it to him, he was going on about how he was hurt and how he came up to the school and that's when I said you know what?  this girl deserves credit for even trying to stay in this conversation.  So you should get an award for acting like a parent and there's more, you put your hands on her and you're the injured party?   Maybe talking to Sonja helped prepare her for this line of logic. 

Bethenny does have friends that can play auntie to Bryn but they are friends not family.

It is terribly sad to me that out of a group of three people there was not one who could think about a little girl and put her above anything as you would do with a child you love. I guess this is the reason why Bethenny wears this on her sleeve and is trying to cope with this as opposed as 20 years ago.

20 years ago she was single, she was only responsible for herself and it is very easy to push things to the back of your mind, it is a survivor mechanism, all that changed when Bethenny had her own daughter because now she has a point of comparison, now that she has a daughter and loves her so much and would do anything for her, now is when she feels the pain of her parents not being able to do the same for her. It must still hurt her very deeply and I do remember her saying that she wanted Bryn to be soft and pure and not a warrior like she is.

I see this as a no win situation for her though, if she never mentions her childhood again then some people say she made it all up and embellish it, if she talks to the guy who was a big part of her childhood and he not only agrees to her version of the story but adds even more detail to explain the dysfunction that she lived then she somehow sha has managed to convince him to do it to clean her image. Some people are not going to believe her no matter what and that is fine.

Bashing her mother? Should a person never talk badly about her parents? What about when that mother sells stories about her own child to the press? How about when a mother is a shitty mother like Bernadette was? Are you telling me that in any of kim Richard kids would ever talk about what a nightmare their lives was with kim as a mother that they would be awful for doing that? How about Rob Kardashian? Would Brandi's kids ever be able to speak about their childhood as less than normal? reality of life is that not all parents are wonderful people, some of them should never be parents, we all grapple with our own demons in very different ways, Bethenny is in a reality show and this is her reality, now that she is going through divorce she wants to connect with her own lost family and unfortunately for her that means to make amends with the only person who seemed to care for her even if the guy was a mess, Bethenny needed a sincere apology and she got it, does this mean that they will spend every Christmas together? I doubt it, it just means that they can at least have a civil relationship and when Bethenny goes to Florida she can introduce Bryn to Parisella and start a relationship with him. The guy was a mess but IMO he was the only out of the three who really cared about Bethenny and that is why she wants to mend fences with him.

 

 

THIS.  The raised by wolves comment has been analyzed more often than each frame of the Zapruder film.  If you took it literally, she was a bold faced liar.  If you didn't, then ok her childhood wasn't great but {shrug} she's still exaggerating.  It almost makes me mad that she feels the need to validate it at all.  Who wants to have a fucked up childhood story?  Personally I'm okay with her wearing it because this is an opportunity to speak to the people involved, so the fact that it is 40 years old doesn't mitigate her right to tell it or ask about as often as the number of people willing to hear it.   We should all have such similar options.

 

Kristen may be salty because it seems as though B got a deal that differs from all her castmates.  Maybe, maybe not, but the perspective she was coming from was all wrong - I got my kids looked after to go to work, you can do the same.   The fact is, Kristen does work, but she doesn't go to work, so she has no idea what it is to have to make what would seem to be a really simple choice.  Meet your work obligation or spend a day that you don't have the luxury of taking for granted with your daughter. You've got a husband and a housekeeper (and still had to hire a sitter?) so yeah go fuck yourself Kristen.  Now because Josh is a dick, I will freely admit that, although this exact same thing about the kids and being home and priorities, was the primary source of his annoyance with her last season, I didn't get it then.  It doesn't make him less dickish, but I did say aha out loud last night.  

 

I realize she grates on a lot of people's nerves but I love Bethenney's sense of humor.  The default New Yorker, sarcastic delivery isn't always appreciated but it's still hilarious to me most of the time.  I watched that scene with the waiter twice.  He said:  let me explain our menu.  Which he then did and finished.  Then she said:  Oh so it's like any other menu (while smiling), I read what's on here, I order it, then it comes.  I'm familiar with the process.   Camera pans back to him and he is not only smiling, he's giggling.  Not an OMG I can't believe she just crushed my self esteem nervous smile, the guy laughed.  Then she laughed.  I think it's like the Carole thing, if you already dislike her, anything that leaves her mouth sounds condescending so that's how you're prone to hear it.  I'm fine with that and I'm here to fly the treat your waitstaff kindly flag all day, but that specific answer was in response to him using the phrase explain the menu, not the fact that it's his job to do so.  Since my default is having the same unfortunate reaction to anyone who says Captain Obvious shit, I giggled too. 

 

Other stuff I giggled at:

1.  A cake that said Turtle Time
2.  The way B looked at Sonja when she announced that her Swami Priestess thinks she should get closer to Christ and go light candles next week.  
3.  Nakey. 

 

p.s. Luann's teary blurb about the young woman Victoria has become   -_-   Girl bye, ain't nothing wrong with our memory

 

p.p.s. Sonja, please stop with using the word projecting, a) nothing could be further and b) your similarities to Kelly Bensimon were already evident.

 

eta: correcting Luann's child's name.  Veronica is an Archie character.

Edited May 20, 2015 by ZaldamoWilder

[Mozelle]

I give side-eye to that whole "dropping the kids off at school" line. What kind of schools are these kids going to that don't start at 8 or 9am? Why wouldn't Kristen and Heather be able to drop their kids off at 9 and then be able to get to Sonja's 90 minutes later? Why would Bethenny be dropping off her toddler at school at 11 or 11:30 thus making her so late she didn't get there until after noon?

I can't remember who brought it up in the thread for last week's episode, but there's probably more that goes into simply "meet at Sonja's at 10:30." When that episode started, the time stamp on the screen was 10:38. But there was also that moment where there was commotion going on in Sonja's foyer/vestibule/whatever before that time. The women probably had a call time that was well before 10:30 (maybe 9 o'clock or 9:30) to get mic'd up and whatnot, which would have affected school drop-offs for Kristen and Heather.

 

I thought, in a previous episode with Carole and her editor, that she had a contract with a deadline for this next book. IIRC, when told about the deadline, she giggled and pretended to be unaware of any deadline. Was there any mention of Carole having been given an advance for this book?

If she had a contract and/or a deadline, I think she needed to set ink to paper, fingers to keyboard or have started dictating sumthin' pretty fast. She might want to get harried ;)

Yeah, there was that scene. I don't know if she got an advance (I'd assume so). Maybe it's just the way I view Carole's moments on these shows, but I have a hard time believing that she didn't know she had a deadline. I see her as playing this "devil may care" role when it comes to these kinds of filmed meetings (and very many of her THs) because as I see it, she's going for comedy.

Filming for this season started in late October. When the first episode aired, she wrote a blog saying that she wouldn't be writing too many blogs because of her deadline for this project. To my mind, six months is not a crazy time frame for what she's doing (am I right in saying that she's writing a collection of essays? I can't remember). If she had a regular column at a monthly magazine, I'd be all, "Yeah, you just have to write through it no matter what." It's not the kind of work that Carole does, so it's not one size fits all. 

 

Speaking of one-size-fits-all: I still haven't seen the full episode, but there's a brief clip on the Bravo site of Bethenny and Carole talking about Sonja's herbalist/psychopharmacologist/swami high priestess. I see what folks are talking about with the beanie. I didn't mind it too much when Carole was sitting at the table joking around with Dorinda, but the way the beanie was perched on Carole's head during her conversation with Bethenny was a big fail. 

Edited May 20, 2015 by Mozelle

[Ellee]

 

Whaaaat is she saying????   Hmmm.....I wonder if they cover this in an 'English as a Second Language' course.  I know.  I know.  I should just say 'Why don't we discuss this over at the bar.'

[Crikey]

I don't know about the publishing world.

 

When I made interiors for a yacht builder, I knew that if I did not meet a deadline, it was not just that the yacht would not be ready on time but that all the ripples caused by my action would upset a lot of other businesses/people.  The whole schedule of the yacht builder, the company who delivered the yacht, the builder who probably needed final payment, the owner who, many times, took time off in order to try out his/her new toy and on and on.

 

I would guess that similar things are somewhat prearranged in the publishing world.  Editors, printers, publicists, book shops, book tours, etc.

[quaintirene]

That waiter thing?  It's become kind of a cliche that any time you go into a restaurant in a big foodie city like NYC or London, the waiter comes over and either does what he did which is explain the perfectly self-explanatory menu or go into a long explanation of the 'concept' of the restaurant.  It's no longer good enough to be Italian or Thai or Persian or whatever.  Now there has to be a concept that you have to hear about at length instead of chatting with the people at your table or deciding what you would like to order.  I get that the waiter is required to do it.  But it is annoying and intrusive.  So I've bitten off a couple of innocent waiter heads myself on occasion.  And I was a waitress for a while in college so generally I'm sympathetic.  But you know what, I can read a menu thanks.  So go away and let me do it.  And if I order something wildly inappropriate then you can gently suggest a better alternative.

 

As for Kristen's childcare crack:  it turns out Pretty isn't Smart at all.  In fact it's quite stupid.

 

Edited to answer Crikey's post above.  I work in publishing.  If a book misses its deadline, and therefore its publishing slot, it is a Pain In The Ass for everyone.  And the editor who is responsible for bringing the book in could be in a mess of trouble.  Which is one reason why I loathe Carole so much.  If she is as well-connected in the literary world as she claims to be, then she knows this.  And doesn't give a shit.

Edited May 20, 2015 by quaintirene

[Sincerely Yours]

I get that it's tough to grow up with a parent who has mental health issues but Bethenny seems to gloss over that as a reason fir her messed up child and not have any empathy for what seem like severe issues. Who tries to commit suicide in front of their child, Bethenny? Someone who has a disease! Hell she even blamed her mother for going to a mental institution of it was a spa or a trip. I am not saying Bethenny needs to have a relationship with her mother or even forgive her but the lack of compassion about someone who was mentally ill (and abused) is also not healthy for her.

Yeah, this the thing about Bethenny that truly bugs me. I get it was rough as a person gets older, becomes an adult themselves, has children themselves and has life experience, their perspective in my opinion has no choice but to widen. It seems like Bethenny forces the keyhole view of her life and I just can't possibly believe that she is not able to widen the scope of her life to a size where she can at least see the bigger picture and apply intelligence as well as the basic understanding of life for her own benefit. No one is saying she needs to start skipping and singing in the street but she wields her past and her woes so callously and ridiculously.  She needs the hurt to stay at that constant level so that she can be the abrasive person she is. So she can claim these particulars whenever her sensibilities are challenged. She needs to be able to cut things down to size because she's decided that it isn't fair for her to have work harder than others in social and intimate situations considering "what she's been through". She's more resentful that there are even certain social "norms" to begin with. She seems to think that because she is emotionally stunted through no fault of her own that the rules should change as opposed to her having to make up for the shorthanded deck she was dealt. I don't appreciate her need to attack traditional behaviors, actions, social expectations because it's harder for poor old Bethenny to interact based on those built in givens during a day in the life. It's her resistance that pisses me off complete with condescention to anyone who holds these traits dear. I saw a lot of this during her spin off show and I already wasn't the biggest fan while she was on Housewives but watching how dysfunctional she was with Jason and how she tried so desperately to make dysfunction "happen" was just too much for me. Her sad story shouldn't mean that everyone she comes across needs to dial down the happy in their lives and that's a BIG vibe I get with this women and it's so distasteful.

 

Her talking about her past just seems so self serving. I know I know it sounds terrible to say but its not like she ever takes any of this stuff in. In all of her seasons whenever these "deep" moments are shared publicly with us it just seems like she's just doing it to reiterate why she should be able to be the abrasive, self involved, woe is me, "no you can't enjoy or force upon me the happiness created for you by your family" bully she thinks she has every right to be because her mother tried to kill herself in front of her and she was raised by wolves. It's the way she seems to be trying to create these "hold on to your seats", "wait til ya hear this", "gasping, pearl clutching" "didn't I tell ya?" moments that I find so distasteful. I can sympathize if I didn't think she was just doing it so that she can excuse some of her unexcusable behavior and her non apologetic, in your face, demeanor. I'm not saying her step father was some prize but all in all I don't see what else he could have said. Her mother obviously had some severe issues and acknowledging that alone she help somewhat with regards to Bethenny's acceptance of certain things but I don't see her even acknowledging these realities because of course it's ONLY about her. I mean of course it's HER life so who else should it be about but if your talking about how others affected your life then at least acknowledge the circumstances surrounding THEM as well instead of just expressing everything in such a one dimensional way. I'd be more on her side if she were more mature about the process. Uggggh, She frustrates me.

 

I mean I look back at my history and revisit how matter of fact I used to be about the situations in my childhood and think wow! That was some kind of crazy and it's very sad that for the most part I took it in stride but as an adult really recognize that a child shouldn't have experienced those things. There's no going back, there's no changing it so why sit around and go back there? He obviously found no need to emotionally return to those memories. Recalling them is one thing but wanting to relive the emotional part of if? Only if there were some real words being had then yeah but from the looks of it Bethenny seemed to be going down memory road while trying to insert her emotional struggle over the whole thing here and there. It didn't seem like the visit with him was supposed to be about closure, they sounded like there were just talking about how unpleasant the past was. To me if it were meant to be some sort of intimate conversation about her feelings about her past, her experiences, his role and needing some sort healing that he might be able to partially provide then I wouldn't have expected the tone of the conversation to be so casual. It was intense sure but it didn't seem like a conversation that had a specific direction. It was like lets just bring some stuff up and see where it goes instead of a conversation designed for healing.

Edited May 20, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[ZoloftBlob]

I would guess that similar things are somewhat prearranged in the publishing world.  Editors, printers, publicists, book shops, book tours, etc.

 

It's a little more lucy-goosey than you might think. I just engaged an editor for my own book and there's a contract and all but also some language that allows for delays. The printers, publicists, book tour stuff doesn't even start until there's a marketable product.

[Trooper York]

I thought it was a little silly for Ramona to comment on John the way she did. Glass houses/stones there baby. 

 

Plus whats with this "he doesn't live in Manhattan" stuff?

 

The majority of people who work in Manhattan don't live there.

 

Plus Brooklyn is way cooler than Manhattan.

 

They issue us our own stocking caps now. Just sayn'

[lunastartron]

Carole herself has more or less contended that there are legitimate and illegitimate approaches to writing - or at least acceptable and unacceptable ways of describing the process - when it has been situationally convenient for her to do so. See: her indignation over Aviva's offhand remark that, in Aviva's experience, composing Leggy Blonde was "like writing an e-mail." I haven't read Mrs. Drescher's magnum opus, but I have indulged in comparable autobiographical treatises composed by politicians, and it's not at all difficult to believe that manufacturing one - for either the gw or the nominal author - is akin to churning out an extended virtual message. Studies of Sarah Palin started hitting bookstore shelves about a month after she was revealed as the vice-presidential candidate in 2008. And, in any case, Aviva was describing her own experience and no one else's, but Carole was determined to advance the notion that there is indeed a "right" way to produce a manuscript. I don't abstractly care whether or not Carole misses her deadlines, has to return her advance, and/or takes years to deliver her essay collection - there *isn't* one methodology of working creatively, after all. But I do find her scenes of tittering at her editor's distress and pretending that she didn't know she had a deadline to be rather rich when juxtaposed against her protests last year that she is a *writer*/this is who she *is*/this is her *profession.* Carole can miss all of the deadlines she wants, but then she should probably tone down the sanctimony about her professionalism. And just as an attendant note: the NY Post reported that the deal she signed was for WG also encompassed the non-fiction title, at an advance figure for both of 700k. So I would assume she has probably received around 117k for the book on which she's presently working.

[trimthatfat]

It's unfortunate that Bethenny had a shitty childhood. Some of what she described and what John confirmed sounds frightening. But I don't want to hear about it anymore. I really don't. At some point, you have to pick yourself up and move on. Bethenny should really consider getting a real therapist because her current one hasn't helped her accomplish shit.

    OK, fine & dandy -- not a difficult concept to comprehend, that creative people produce differently.  But taking 4 or 5 years to produce one piece of so-so work ain't good, no matter how you cut it.  To me, that stinks.  And her work ethic, as we've seen, really sucks.  I wouldn't wanna be her publisher.  Seriously. maybe she's really not all that talented as a writer & needs the help of a ghostwriter.  It's not a horrible thing.  Maybe she just can't admit or acknowledge this.

 

This. And honestly, if her publisher expected a draft six months prior to filming and Carole still hasn't delivered, it doesn't really reflect well on her. The impression I've been given is that Carole really isn't trying that hard to finish the product for her publisher. It's probably just a joke to her that a deadline has been set. My friend is an editor for a publisher and while she expect some delays with drafts, she really hates when people delay the draft by several months and aren't even apologetic about it.

Edited May 20, 2015 by trimthatfat

[Mozelle]

Carole herself has more or less contended that there are legitimate and illegitimate approaches to writing - or at least acceptable and unacceptable ways of describing the process - when it has been situationally convenient for her to do so. See: her indignation over Aviva's offhand remark that, in Aviva's experience, composing Leggy Blonde was "like writing an e-mail." I haven't read Mrs. Drescher's magnum opus, but I have indulged in comparable autobiographical treatises composed by politicians, and it's not at all difficult to believe that manufacturing one - for either the gw or the nominal author - is akin to churning out an extended virtual message. Studies of Sarah Palin started hitting bookstore shelves about a month after she was revealed as the vice-presidential candidate in 2008. And, in any case, Aviva was describing her own experience and no one else's, but Carole was determined to advance the notion that there is indeed a "right" way to produce a manuscript. I don't abstractly care whether or not Carole misses her deadlines, has to return her advance, and/or takes years to deliver her essay collection - there *isn't* one methodology of working creatively, after all. But I do find her scenes of tittering at her editor's distress and pretending that she didn't know she had a deadline to be rather rich when juxtaposed against her protests last year that she is a *writer*/this is who she *is*/this is her *profession.* Carole can miss all of the deadlines she wants, but then she should probably tone down the sanctimony about her professionalism. And just as an attendant note: the NY Post reported that the deal she signed was for WG also encompassed the non-fiction title, at an advance figure for both of 700k. So I would assume she has probably received around 117k for the book on which she's presently working.

I'd imagine that it was like writing an email for Aviva since she has two ghost writers for Leggy Blonde. I'd imagine that she shot off an email with an outline of things that happened her life. I think what set Carole's teeth on edge was Aviva trying to diminish the work of writing.

 

I can hem a pair of pants. I can take in the waist of jeans. If I were having a conversation with a tailor, I imagine they'd be as annoyed with me as Carole was with Aviva if I was like, "Oh, it was nothing. I just threaded the needle and was done in a matter of moments."

Edited May 20, 2015 by Mozelle

[pawsodoom]

I don't know about the publishing world.

 

When I made interiors for a yacht builder, I knew that if I did not meet a deadline, it was not just that the yacht would not be ready on time but that all the ripples caused by my action would upset a lot of other businesses/people.  The whole schedule of the yacht builder, the company who delivered the yacht, the builder who probably needed final payment, the owner who, many times, took time off in order to try out his/her new toy and on and on.

 

I would guess that similar things are somewhat prearranged in the publishing world.  Editors, printers, publicists, book shops, book tours, etc.

 

I work in publishing (not trade, but scholarly publishing) and when an author is late with their submission it makes my job (as an editor) more difficult. In Carole's case, she was given a monetary advance, which the publisher looks to recoup ASAP. So her dilly-dallying has an effect on her publisher's bottom line.

Edited May 20, 2015 by pawsodoom

[FaithsMum]

I get that it's tough to grow up with a parent who has mental health issues but Bethenny seems to gloss over that as a reason fir her messed up child and not have any empathy for what seem like severe issues. Who tries to commit suicide in front of their child, Bethenny? Someone who has a disease! Hell she even blamed her mother for going to a mental institution of it was a spa or a trip. I am not saying Bethenny needs to have a relationship with her mother or even forgive her but the lack of compassion about someone who was mentally ill (and abused) is also not healthy for her.

I have anorexia; I'm currently hospitalised and have been for the last seven months. I also have three daughters and have struggled with my ED throughout their lives since this isn't my first hospitalisation... So I'm not going to win any awards for Mother of the Year - my husband and my parents are currently parenting my children.

I have this overwhelming fear and guilt that I'm ruining my children's childhood and I hope they will grow up and have empathy for my struggles. I hope they will forgive my absences throughout their formative years. But if they don't, if they're damaged and angry at me, well then, I would understand that too and while I can't help having a mental illness, they didn't choose to be my kids or have a crazy mum. My kids and my husband are the victims of my anorexia, not me.

It's much easier to say Bethenny should have compassion for her mother when you're removed from the situation. A mental illness does not give one a free pass from the damage we cause, it merely helps explain it and from what I can tell Bethenny's mother has never tried to make it right. She's never attempted to heal the havoc she wreaked on her child and so for that reason I don't think she deserves Bethenny's sympathy.

[WireWrap]

WRT Kristen ragging on B about missing the boxing (which is gross IMO anyway, who arranged that shit?) - I am by no means a B fan, but Kristen cannot possibly compare herself with B in terms of her kids. Kristen is essentially a SAHM, who has her kids 24/7. B has to split time, so she is much less willing to not be around, plus I'm sure Jason has his lawyers looking at every second at B's behavior. Wouldn't they just love to bring up in court that B went out instead of spending time with her kid. 

IMO, Kristen was not ragging on Bethenny missing the boxing match, she did not even bring it up, Carole did. I suspect that Bethenny has missed a number of things and Kristen's comment reflected that, as did LuAnn's talk with Bethenny in Florida.

 

I understand Bethenny wanting to spend all her free time with her daughter when she has her but then, why be on a show that films both day and night? And if you are so fearful that a soon to be ex could use being on this show against you in a custody issue, why risk it when you do not need the money?  JMO

[Trooper York]

Maybe that stocking cap is too tight and it is inhibiting her creative "process?"

 

She can change to a fedora or a pork pie hat. Just as hipster douchey but not as tight.

[trimthatfat]

One thing that I found interesting is that when Lu talked to Bethenny about missing events, Bethenny basically conceded that should make more of an effort to attend them. She didn't argue, she didn't pretend to snore, and she didn't tell Lu to stop talking. So I am guessing she's not held to the same attendance standards as the other ladies and she is very aware of that.

[biakbiak]

I have anorexia; I'm currently hospitalised and have been for the last seven months. I also have three daughters and have struggled with my ED throughout their lives since this isn't my first hospitalisation... So I'm not going to win any awards for Mother of the Year - my husband and my parents are currently parenting my children.

I have this overwhelming fear and guilt that I'm ruining my children's childhood and I hope they will grow up and have empathy for my struggles. I hope they will forgive my absences throughout their formative years. But if they don't, if they're damaged and angry at me, well then, I would understand that too and while I can't help having a mental illness, they didn't choose to be my kids or have a crazy mum. My kids and my husband are the victims of my anorexia, not me.

It's much easier to say Bethenny should have compassion for her mother when you're removed from the situation. A mental illness does not give one a free pass from the damage we cause, it merely helps explain it and from what I can tell Bethenny's mother has never tried to make it right. She's never attempted to heal the havoc she wreaked on her child and so for that reason I don't think she deserves Bethenny's sympathy.

I didn't say it was easy and I have experience being very close to a similar situation, I said that Bethenny accepting that a lot of the issues in her childhood were because of mental illness helps provide a context for those events. I don't know where B' s mother is in dealing with her issues and I wasn't dismissing her responsibility but at a certain point you do have agency to heal yourself and realize some of the struggles that the other person had even if they are not in a place to help you.

To me Bethenney doesn't want to heal and is denying where she is in the process. She told John she wasn't angry and understood that people do the best the can but than went on to illustrate that she was still extremely angry and also didn't understand that maybe her mother was doing the best she could which included checking herself into an institution which Bethenny made about herself being "forced" to go to boarding school. Being institutionalized was probably a last resort and boarding school a safer option than moving from track to track with an alcoholic stepfather with gambling issues who frequently had issues with the mob.

[lunastartron]

Why would a tailor care if someone who could use a needle and thread accurately described their own stitching job as quick and simple? The second individual is not describing the process of the first or situating themselves as a professional tailor, and the products are distinct. It requires a huge transposition of meaning, in my opinion, for Carole to contend that Aviva's (again, seemingly blithe and offhand) comment about her first-person experience somehow encompasses or applies to any- and/or everyone else. But mileage varies.

[quaintirene]

 

And just as an attendant note: the NY Post reported that the deal she signed was for WG also encompassed the non-fiction title, at an advance figure for both of 700k. So I would assume she has probably received around 117k for the book on which she's presently working.

I've heard 2 accounts of that advance.  $750k was bandied around at the time of the acquisition--which was ludicrous given that I believe there was no one else remotely interested.  I've since heard $500-550k.  It's likely that the lower amount is correct and there were pie-in-the-sky bonuses to bring it up to the $750k.  These are academic.  The Widow's Guide didn't come anywhere close to earning out.  But the advance would have been split like this:  each book would have had 4 tranches of payable advance.  On signature; on delivery and acceptance of the manuscript; on 1st pub; on paperback release or 12 months after 1st pub whichever comes first. The sig money is paid for both books.  So on an advance of $550k she would have gotten $137.5k up front on sig and $68,750 of that would have been the essays.  

 

Actually, silly me!  She would lose 15% of the above to her agent.

Edited May 20, 2015 by quaintirene