Behind The Scenes: Trivia And Other Gossip

[AstaCharles]

I'm having a hard time picturing Kirk Cameron having enough power to demand rewrites and firing someone. Wasn't a big fan of Growing pains and Cameron seemed liked a combo of Michael J. Fox and Jason Bateman. Never thought he would be the next Fox. I checked Wikipedia to see when Disney bought ABC ( early '90's) and wondered if that had any effect.

I remember when the two supporting characters on CSI didn't show up for work (due to salary issues) and Les Moonves fired them.

[Irlandesa]

Not going to deny that there's probably an ego problem there, but I recall the original pitch for The West Wing and it was touted as Rob Lowe's show. Martin Sheen came in at the last five minutes of the show and blew it out of the park, after that his character was made a regular which was not the original concept. So at least in that I don't think things turned out the way he thought they were going to go.

I don't think the original concept was Sam Seaborn as the lead either, actually.  In fact, according to this, Sorkin initially didn't want to cast Lowe because he felt it'd become less of an ensemble if a movie star was cast.  I do think, though, that Lowe was probably told he'd be considered the lead which got him to sign on.

 

He probably could rationalize Sheen being his co-lead because he had known Martin a long time. Sheen was also a movie star and he was playing the president.  What was probably less easy to rationalize, and what likely caused some friction between Rob and Brad, was that Josh was the staffer getting the meatier material. To his credit, even though he left after four seasons, he did come back for the finale.

 

I do think he has an ego. And I think it's kind of funny that he keeps chasing projects looking to be the lead in them, but he's rarely more than a supporting player.  Even in the ads for his new show, I found Fred Savage had the funnier lines.

 

 

I'm having a hard time picturing Kirk Cameron having enough power to demand rewrites and firing someone. Wasn't a big fan of Growing pains and Cameron seemed liked a combo of Michael J. Fox and Jason Bateman. Never thought he would be the next Fox. I checked Wikipedia to see when Disney bought ABC ( early '90's) and wondered if that had any effect.

Oh he had the power. Maybe not to get rid of a regular on the show a recurring character?  He denies it but if you read the stuff others have said he did...stuff he admitted he did, then I think it's easy to see he was ultimately responsible.  He wanted sexual references scrubbed from scripts, he pissed off three producers enough that they quit.  It wasn't just about his personal beliefs, it was making sure those personal beliefs infiltrated the whole show.  So did he actually say "you must fire Julie McCullogh?"  Maybe.  Maybe not.  But he doesn't have to say "fire her" to get her fired.  All he has to do is refuse to play out the story. And that'd be the end for her.

[DittyDotDot]

I don't think the original concept was Sam Seaborn as the lead either, actually.  In fact, according to this, Sorkin initially didn't want to cast Lowe because he felt it'd become less of an ensemble if a movie star was cast.  I do think, though, that Lowe was probably told he'd be considered the lead which got him to sign on.

 

He probably could rationalize Sheen being his co-lead because he had known Martin a long time. Sheen was also a movie star and he was playing the president.  What was probably less easy to rationalize, and what likely caused some friction between Rob and Brad, was that Josh was the staffer getting the meatier material. To his credit, even though he left after four seasons, he did come back for the finale.

 

I believe they did cast Lowe as the lead. In the commentary for the first episode, if I remember right, it's Sorkin who says that the original concept of the show was the character of Sam would be the audience POV and after they cast everyone and saw what they had they shifted things. Originally the show was just about the West Wing staffers only and the President was supposed to be this mostly off-screen looming presence. But again, they cast Sheen to do the one bit they ever intended to do and they loved the dynamics he brought to the show that they realized they had to include the President regularly.

 

That's how I remember it anyway...it has been a few years since I listened to it, so I could be remembering some stuff wrong.

[Chaos Theory]

Since we're talking about Growing Pains, I remember Alan Thicke talking about how "someone" got Leonardo DiCaprio fired because "someone" wasn't happy he was starting to get a lot of the attention. Since Kirk was the teen heartthrob who had the most clout at the time, I can guess who that "someone" was. Whenever I remember that story, I laugh and laugh because we all know what happened to Leo.

I didn't know about Kirk Cameron and the religious thing until waaay later but I did hear the one about him getting the young DiCaprio fired (which ruined his career of course) who was stealing the heartthrob thunder. It's also possible that DiCaprio was well liked on set and Cameron wasn't by this time and well jealousy took flight.

Edited May 20, 2015 by Chaos Theory

[cpcathy]

Yeah, hey, what happened to that Leo kid anyway?

[Irlandesa]

I believe they did cast Lowe as the lead. In the commentary for the first episode, if I remember right, it's Sorkin who says that the original concept of the show was the character of Sam would be the audience POV and after they cast everyone and saw what they had they shifted things.

 

That's how I remember it anyway...it has been a few years since I listened to it, so I could be remembering some stuff wrong.

Pfft, what fun is acknowledging potentially poor memories?  (I'm in the same boat--what I remember and what may be true could very well be very different.)   I never listened to the commentaries but I can believe Sam was intended to be a POV character*.  But being a POV character doesn't necessarily make him a lead character.  On ER, Noah Wyle's John Carter was the POV character.  He was the new intern and we learned everything about the hospital through his eyes.  But he wasn't the show's lead character until later seasons once he was older and some other leads had departed.

 

*Although, I personally would argue that Leo was more of a POV character, especially in that pilot.  Leo was the one who set the stage for us as he walked through the WH.  Every single interaction he had with another character, no matter how small, ended up more or less telling us who that character was.  For what it achieved, it's one of the most impressive ten minutes of television ever which is why its my favorite drama pilot.

 

Anyway, whether he was meant to be a lead (for real) or a lead (in the sense that he was the most famous actor cast), Sorkin and Lowe clearly had different opinions on what that meant.

[WhitneyWhit]

I'm in desperate need of a True Hollywood Story, or some kind of tell all, about One Tree Hill. All those hook ups, marriages, divorces. I think Sophia Bush was either married to, or dated, every male lead on that show at some point.

[DearEvette]

Backstage feuds are so fun to speculate about even when you have no proof of anything.  Especially when you have no proof of anything.

 

My speculations re:

The Good Wife: Totally Juliana Margulies' fault, imo.  No way Archie has the power or clout to force the showrunners to write scripts & shoot scenes in such a way that these two women don't have to be in the same room together.  Honestly, this has the smell of some real higher up power.  The Kings come off as sounding somewhat insincere in their interviews like they are talking from a script themselves.  And JM has a long standing close personal relationship with both the two head honchos at CBS. 

 

Grey's Anatomy: Re: the  the Washington/Knight/Heigl stuff always made me think that all involved came off as a bunch of entitled & spoiled assholes.  Now, this is just my speculation of events at the time, but It always seemed to me like Shonda & ABC were trying to deal with the behind the scenes stuff with Washington in-house.  He made a homophobic remark, had a fight with a co-worker and by trying to keep it under wraps they were trying to avoid a PR nightmare.  But it got leaked and they still managed to do damage control.  But I got the impression that Knight & Heigl weren't happy that it seemed he was getting off lightly so they started talking to the press.  Knight came out as gay and then went on Ellen and said 'that everyone heard him say it' and Heigl backed him up in other interviews.  Which is also kinda interesting since according to later interviews by Washington, he was explicitly told he couldn't talk to the press about it.  So it feels like they forced ABCs & SR's  hand and Washington got fired.   Not only that but Knight was also going around saying that SR told him he shouldn't come out publicly, which she denied.  So Bad mojo all around.  Frankly I don't blame Shonda or ABC for firing all three.  Their various tantrums all detracted from the show.  Although, of the three, I missed Burke the most.  I loved that character and couldn't stand either George or Izzie. Oh Isaiah why did you have to be a bigot?

 

Sleepy Hollow: I myself have probably written a book about speculations in the Sleepy Hollow thread, but it feels so obvious that the showrunner wanted to use the show to highlight his own personal muse, Katia Winter who played the Katrina character at the expense of, well, everybody else.  Her rise reflected so badly on every other character.  To their credit the actors all seemed to get along real well and had no beef with each other.  But the writers room seemed like a mess.  I want to know how hard the network smacked Goffman down.  Orlando Jones throwing shade is a given.  But when John Noble throws glorious., glorious shade you know stuff is bad.  LOL.

 

The Fresh Prince of Bel Air:  So was Aunt Viv crazy or nah?  Was Will Smith a horrible person who did horrible things to Janet Huber and made her life hell on set?  Inquiring minds want to know.  I don't care if Original Recipe Aunt Viv was horrid, I liked her soooo much more than the replacement.

Edited May 20, 2015 by DearEvette

[galax-arena]

I'm in desperate need of a True Hollywood Story, or some kind of tell all, about One Tree Hill. All those hook ups, marriages, divorces.

Oh my god, yes. But I don't really care about Sophia's dating life, I'm more interested in Bethany Joy Lenz's relationship and eventual marriage to that Galeotti dude who was in that Enation band with Jonathan Jackson. For a while - until she divorced him - it seemed like she was subsumed into his creepy insular religious family group. I want to know if it ever affected the set. I know that Galeotti was happy to let his wife be the main breadwinner and have his band's music played on the show, but apparently he and his friends would make fun of the show behind her back. 

[HalcyonDays]

The Fresh Prince of Bel Air:  So was Aunt Viv crazy or nah?  Was Will Smith a horrible person who did horrible things to Janet Huber and made her life hell on set?  Inquiring minds want to know.  I don't care if Original Recipe Aunt Viv was horrid, I liked her soooo much more than the replacement.

 

Apparently both. I took much preferred Original Recipe Vivian, but other members of the cast did hint as problems with Huber. I guess she got a bit of an ego, but I am sure Will Smith is 50% to blame too - because it's well know that he got an ego also and started pushing his weight around. But apparently he mellowed later on (but still when he was young) but then became the Will Smith we are used to with the movie career, etc. I think both were at fault/clashed.

 

I cannot believe that NO ONE had mentioned the crazy Charlie Sheen vs. Chuck Lorre mess that happened two or three + years ago? I mean, half of it unfolded in public anyway, but I'd love to know what kicked started it all. Did Lorre finally grow tired of Sheen's antics and substance abuse and give him an ultimatum? Or was Lorre an ass anyway and Sheen got sick or it? Or was it just a clash of massive ego with  giant size porportions?

 

And for more Lorre - Rosanne Barr and Chuck Lorre clashing season 1 of Roseanne. Since Chuck Lorre's fingers are in every sitcom it seems, but he was a somewhat newbie sort of and they have a massive falling out season 1 (and part season 2 I believe). He quit (fired? I think he quit), and Roseanne took over the show and finally got the control she wanted. In this case though, IMO, I think it was a good move. The first few seasons of Roseanne were awesome and she really brought something wonderful to the show, I think. It wasn't until the lottery stuff that the show lost it's way. Chuck Lorre has influenced so many long running successful comedies, but in this case, I think it was a good think to have the fallout. The product improved.

[Princess Sparkle]

Backstage feuds are so fun to speculate about even when you have no proof of anything.  Especially when you have no proof of anything.

 

 

 

Grey's Anatomy: Re: the  the Washington/Knight/Heigl stuff always made me think that all involved came off as a bunch of entitled & spoiled assholes.  Now, this is just my speculation of events at the time, but It always seemed to me like Shonda & ABC were trying to deal with the behind the scenes stuff with Washington in-house.  He made a homophobic remark, had a fight with a co-worker and by trying to keep it under wraps they were trying to avoid a PR nightmare.  But it got leaked and they still managed to do damage control.  But I got the impression that Knight & Heigl weren't happy that it seemed he was getting off lightly so they started talking to the press.  Knight came out as gay and then went on Ellen and said 'that everyone heard him say it' and Heigl backed him up in other interviews.  Which is also kinda interesting since according to later interviews by Washington, he was explicitly told he couldn't talk to the press about it.  So it feels like they forced ABCs & SR's  hand and Washington got fired.   Not only that but Knight was also going around saying that SR told him he shouldn't come out publicly, which she denied.  So Bad mojo all around.  Frankly I don't blame Shonda or ABC for firing all three.  Their various tantrums all detracted from the show.  Although, of the three, I missed Burke the most.  I loved that character and couldn't stand either George or Izzie. Oh Isaiah why did you have to be a bigot?

 

I would LOVE to know what that set was like behind the scenes after Heigl said she didn't get good enough material to submit herself for an Emmy.  I'm not saying whether she was correct or incorrect about that(I'd stopped watching Grey's consistently by then), but my god, no one can burn a bridge quite like Katherine Heigl can.  For someone who's star was really on the rise, she completely shot herself in the foot.

 

I cannot believe that NO ONE had mentioned the crazy Charlie Sheen vs. Chuck Lorre mess that happened two or three + years ago? I mean, half of it unfolded in public anyway, but I'd love to know what kicked started it all. Did Lorre finally grow tired of Sheen's antics and substance abuse and give him an ultimatum? Or was Lorre an ass anyway and Sheen got sick or it? Or was it just a clash of massive ego with  giant size porportions?

 

Oh man, how could I forget about that?  Poor Jon Cryer; can you imagine showing up to set with that dynamic at play every day?

Edited May 20, 2015 by Princess Sparkle

[galax-arena]

What about Kevin Sorbo vs everyone on Andromeda? I feel like there's no love lost between him and the rest of the cast, haven't a few of them snarked about him on twitter? Don't have any details though, except the man seems to have an ego the size of the sun. 

 

Oh, and a thread about backstage spats is incomplete without talking about all the drama that went down on Buffy. What was up with Alyson and SMG? Was SMG really an asshole, or was she railroaded because she was there to do a job  and didn't give a crap about being BFFs and that got under people's skins? I know she was close to a few of her costars - David? Seth? - but it seemed like she was relatively isolated from the rest of the cast. Bet it didn't help that she didn't participate in the Shakespeare stuff at Whedon's house.

 

And then there was all that drama between SMG and the stunt coordinator Jeff Pruitt and his wife, who was SMG's main stunt person. Jeff went as far as writing this long-ass parable about how SMG took all the credit for his wife's stunts. More info, including Whedon's response, here.

 

ETA: More Buffy gossip, because I just can't stop - What was going on with James Marsters and Michelle Trachtenberg? I heard that she had a crush on him, but then he wrote this song about her, which makes him come off as a creep, even if she was the one flirting with him:

 

Edited May 20, 2015 by galax-arena

[topanga]

Grey's Anatomy: Re: the  the Washington/Knight/Heigl stuff always made me think that all involved came off as a bunch of entitled & spoiled assholes.  Now, this is just my speculation of events at the time, but It always seemed to me like Shonda & ABC were trying to deal with the behind the scenes stuff with Washington in-house.  He made a homophobic remark, had a fight with a co-worker and by trying to keep it under wraps they were trying to avoid a PR nightmare.  But it got leaked and they still managed to do damage control.  But I got the impression that Knight & Heigl weren't happy that it seemed he was getting off lightly so they started talking to the press.  Knight came out as gay and then went on Ellen and said 'that everyone heard him say it' and Heigl backed him up in other interviews.  Which is also kinda interesting since according to later interviews by Washington, he was explicitly told he couldn't talk to the press about it.  So it feels like they forced ABCs & SR's  hand and Washington got fired.   Not only that but Knight was also going around saying that SR told him he shouldn't come out publicly, which she denied.  So Bad mojo all around.

 

My understanding was that the issue became public when Washington said on the Golden Globes (or was it the Emmys), "I did not call T.R. Knight a f*****" At least, that's when I first heard about it. Shonda Rhimes was standing at the microphone when he said it and had a WTF? expression on her face, which she tried to smile away. But at that point, the issue had to be addressed head on. So Isaiah Washington was his own leak.

 

I tried to find some gossip or rumors about Scandal (even though I don't watch it anymore), but I couldn't find any stories or gossips about cast squabbling or money issues. Maybe everyone does get along the way they seem to, e.g. when one cast member makes an appearance on a talk show, half of the cast shows up, too.

 

--Oh, I did find an article about some parent groups being upset with Shonda Rhimes that a Scandal episode began with Olivia having alternating fantasies about having sex with Fitz and Jake, and this aired immediately after a showing of "It's the Great Pumpkin, Charlie Brown." So was this Shonda Rhimes' fault or ABC's fault?

[cpcathy]

I'm not sure if I like the age of "superstar show runner" like Shonda. Back in the day, you didn't know or care who created the show, just if you liked it. I suppose there were show runners who were dicks, like the guy who created Barney Miller (I've heard) but when did the show runner being as known as the actors become a thing? In keeping on topic, I surmise that Shonda likes the attention, and likes being known as someone who will fire her actors as soon as they do something they don't like. I don't remember it always being this way in TV, or maybe I'm misremembering.

[OptimisticCynic]

I think show runners have grown more famous as television fandoms have grown more interactive online. Now it's easy to find out who wrote what episode or who runs a show on imdb. The subsequent television entertainment reporters like Ausiello and the emergence of spoiler reporting and it puts a lot of emphasis on show runners.

I think the first two I remember getting to a level of fame and coverage are David Chase (Sopranos) and Aaron Sorkin (West Wing). I do think some very clearly love the attention.

At the same time, I think it's deserved for someone like Vince Gilligan and Mike Schur who truly upheld quality of their shows for years. Schur had a rocky first season of Parks and Rec but deserves a tone of credit for the rest of that show's run. Gilligan's work on BB was masterful. I also don't remember hearing any squabbles on either of those sets even if Rob Lowe has a huge ego. I did remember scratching my head when he submitted for lead in Parks. Come on, Lowe.

Edited May 20, 2015 by OptimisticCynic

[merylinkid]

Is anyone surprised that there are backstage problems related to ego?   These are actors we are talking about here.

[Chaos Theory]

I would LOVE to know what that set was like behind the scenes after Heigl said she didn't get good enough material to submit herself for an Emmy. I'm not saying whether she was correct or incorrect about that(I'd stopped watching Grey's consistently by then), but my god, no one can burn a bridge quite like Katherine Heigl can. For someone who's star was really on the rise, she completely shot herself in the foot.

Katherine Heigl doesn't shoot herself in the foot. She shoots herself in the head....twice.

[DearEvette]

My understanding was that the issue became public when Washington said on the Golden Globes (or was it the Emmys), "I did not call T.R. Knight a f*****" At least, that's when I first heard about it. Shonda Rhimes was standing at the microphone when he said it and had a WTF? expression on her face, which she tried to smile away. But at that point, the issue had to be addressed head on. So Isaiah Washington was his own leak.

 

Yeah, he was responding to a question, from Ted Casablanca from 'E'. And Washington grabbed the mike before Shonda could.  So I think while there had been rumors of a fight, ABC had kept a lid on the specific details.  But somehow Ted got some pretty deep intel and it was the first question the cast was asked after winning the Globes.  I think Isaiah actually saying "F****t' on screen in response to Ted's question was what got people so upset.  Curiously, no one quotes what Ted's actual question was.  But some  people maintain that Ted asked point blank 'Did you call TR a f****t' and Isaiah simply quotes him back denying it.   But most media reports just say "when asked about tensions on the set."  Whatever the case, it was clear that someone leaked specifics of what went on on set and they got blind-sided backstage and the rest blew up.

Edited May 20, 2015 by DearEvette

[windsprints]

The Grey's incident was in October of 2006 & was covered in depth. It was reported by all the tabloids, People, US, EW and even some news outlets. Statements were issued, the cast appeared on Oprah, etc and if IIRC, it had just started to die down prior to the Golden Globes, in January 2007.  IW grabbed the microphone and said the slur again and the whole think blew up.  Afterwards others, such as Heigl, spoke up.  IW issued an apology for using the slur again and was gone at the end of the season. 

 

(google was my friend in looking up the timeframes. Articles are easily accessible for anyone interesting in revisiting it).

Edited May 20, 2015 by windsprints

[giovannif7]

I'm not sure if I like the age of "superstar show runner" like Shonda. Back in the day, you didn't know or care who created the show, just if you liked it. I suppose there were show runners who were dicks, like the guy who created Barney Miller (I've heard) but when did the show runner being as known as the actors become a thing? In keeping on topic, I surmise that Shonda likes the attention, and likes being known as someone who will fire her actors as soon as they do something they don't like. I don't remember it always being this way in TV, or maybe I'm misremembering.

There have been superstar show runners for a long time - Sherwood Schwartz in the 60s, Norman Lear, Glen Larson, Aaron Spelling, Grant Tinker, Steven Bochco and Stephen Cannell in the 70s/80s, to name a few. I think those earlier honchos had an easier time controlling the information given to the public about their shows and casts/crews, in no small part due to the (waning but still viable) studio/PR publicity machine left over from the earlier film industry, as well as the lack of immediate outlets for unauthorized info leaks that the internet has fostered.

[cpcathy]

I'm wondering if they were well-known at the time, I mean, we know all of those people now, and furthermore, did we hear as much from them in the entertainment press as we do now?

[M.F. Luder]

David E. Kelley stands out in my memory as a showrunner who got a ton of press when The Practice and Ally McBeal were popular.

[Chaos Theory]

The internet being a thing doesn't help

But it does help in other ways. It literally kept shows like Fringe alive. Twitter is a over/under thing depending on how you view it. I've seen it keep shows i like alive (Fringe/Defiance) when they would have otherwise died an early and painful death because the stars/ show runners have a presences then there is always the other side of the coin where their presence does more harm then good.

[ABay]

Does X Files pre- or post-date the David E. Kelly shows because Chris Carter is the first showrunner I think I was really aware of.

[HalcyonDays]

Does X Files pre- or post-date the David E. Kelly shows because Chris Carter is the first showrunner I think I was really aware of.

 

According to IMDB, Kelley first popped up in 1986, with LA. Law, then Doogie Howser MD in 1989.

 

Carter started with The X-Files in 1993.

[BW Manilowe]

Katherine Heigl doesn't shoot herself in the foot. She shoots herself in the head....twice.

I agree. I've honestly thought she was a bitch since she gave her acceptance speech the year she actually won the Emmy for GA.

[ParadoxLost]

I agree. I've honestly thought she was a bitch since she gave her acceptance speech the year she actually won the Emmy for GA.

 

Talk to anyone that who watched Roswell, this was well known long before that acceptance speech.  

 

NCIS must have been interesting when Mark Harmon got Bellisario tossed off his own show and his stepson (McGee) remained on the show.

 

For sheer wall to wall rubbernecking, NBC vs. current, former, and hopeful hosts of the Tonight Show is unbeatable.  That should be a lesson in network executive school somewhere.  The talk show host celebrity is not your usual celebrity.  While your usual celebrity will hide behind their PR expert and protect their image, every talk show host is going to use this to fill the minutes on his / her show.  Leno being the exception who makes the rule.

[Chaos Theory]

NCIS must have been interesting when Mark Harmon got Bellisario tossed off his own show and his stepson (McGee) remained on the show.

 

 

Is that why Trojan Bellisario hasn't reappeared as McGee's sister?   Interesting.   I knew Trojan and the actor who plays McGee were related didn't know that they both were related to one to showrunners and that Harmon had him tossed    Not that I watch the show or anything. Well anymore anyway.  

[choclatechip45]

I know Katherine/TR are best friends in real life. With that being said, I don't think Heigl issues were with Shonda about Isiah. I say that because in TR's exit interview he said Katherine encouraged him to stay and didn't really understand why he was leaving. I think Ellen summed up Katherine's issue she wanted more money signed a big contract, but wanted the freedom to do movies.

[Moose135]

Oh man, how could I forget about that?  Poor Jon Cryer; can you imagine showing up to set with that dynamic at play every day?

 

I know, it must have been hell cashing those checks every week...

[ParadoxLost]

Is that why Trojan Bellisario hasn't reappeared as McGee's sister?   Interesting.   I knew Trojan and the actor who plays McGee were related didn't know that they both were related to one to showrunners and that Harmon had him tossed    Not that I watch the show or anything. Well anymore anyway.  

 

Bellisario was famous for casting his relations on his TV shows.  My recollection is that Harmon's problem was with the rewriting of scripts and how long filming took as a result and in general..  This is one of those cases where I think the star made a fuss that was best for the cast and crew overall rather than acting like a diva.

[Minneapple]

I think Troian was out of acting for awhile because she went to college. And now of course she's on Pretty Little Liars.

 

Isn't Katherine Heigl's mom also a huge diva? What a waste of a career for Heigl. She had talent, but she was a big drama queen and couldn't pick a project to save her life (well, except Grey's, I guess, but she even ruined that).

 

ETA -- yes, ParadoxLost, there were reports that Belissario's rewrites would keep actors/crew on set for like 18 hours a day, and eventually Harmon had enough.

 

Gilmore Girls was another one where they had long hours. I think they reported 16 hours a day on set. Plus the scripts for that show were ridiculous, with 60 pages more per script than your average TV show. Also, Amy Sherman-Palladino was notorious for not allowing actors any leeway with improvising. Not one would could be different than what was in her scripts.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Minneapple

[Irlandesa]

I'm wondering if they were well-known at the time, I mean, we know all of those people now, and furthermore, did we hear as much from them in the entertainment press as we do now?

They were superstar showrunners...for their time. But there wasn't as much entertainment press for them to get into.  There wasn't "Inside the Episodes" so we could hear how they felt about what happened on the show and vehemently disagree with their interpretation (looking at you Weiner.)  There wasn't Twitter or blogs where a show runner could talk about how one of the main characters is someone she's in love with even though he's acting like a douchebag (looking at you Shonda.)  So there were recognized showrunners but we didn't get inside their minds as much.  We didn't get inside anyone's minds as much. 

 

 

My recollection is that Harmon's problem was with the rewriting of scripts and how long filming took as a result and in general..  This is one of those cases where I think the star made a fuss that was best for the cast and crew overall rather than acting like a diva.

Yep.  I heard it's why Sasha Alexander (Kate) left after the first season and CBS finally took action when Harmon started making noise about having had it with the 16-18 hour days.  Things improved after.

 

But I got the impression that Knight & Heigl weren't happy that it seemed he was getting off lightly so they started talking to the press.  Knight came out as gay and then went on Ellen and said 'that everyone heard him say it' and Heigl backed him up in other interviews.  Which is also kinda interesting since according to later interviews by Washington, he was explicitly told he couldn't talk to the press about it.  So it feels like they forced ABCs & SR's  hand and Washington got fired.   Not only that but Knight was also going around saying that SR told him he shouldn't come out publicly, which she denied.  So Bad mojo all around.  Frankly I don't blame Shonda or ABC for firing all three.  Their various tantrums all detracted from the show.

Only Isaiah was fired.  Both TR and Katherine wanted to leave.  I think TR was sort of a mutual decision. He didn't like his story, he came out (and claimed Shonda didn't want him to) and she was reducing his airtime. Katherine was more contentious since she had just signed a new contract and was a more prominent character.

[BW Manilowe]

I know Katherine/TR are best friends in real life. With that being said, I don't think Heigl issues were with Shonda about Isiah. I say that because in TR's exit interview he said Katherine encouraged him to stay and didn't really understand why he was leaving. I think Ellen summed up Katherine's issue she wanted more money signed a big contract, but wanted the freedom to do movies.

And then she never became the movie superstar I think she thought she would be--I think most/all her films have been major box office duds--nor has her country singer husband become that famous, I don't believe, in his line of work. They have 2 adopted daughters & who knows how many dogs to support. It's no wonder she probably had to do State of Affairs; her family may have needed the money.

[zxy556575]

The Big Bang Theory seems to have a fairly contented cast, but I've always wondered if there was tension on the set after Cuoco and Galecki broke up. I don't think their characters have ever had much onscreen chemistry even when they were dating, but it's still gotta be at least a little awkward for them.

[SnideAsides]

Does X Files pre- or post-date the David E. Kelly shows because Chris Carter is the first showrunner I think I was really aware of.

But James L. Brooks predates them both.

[zxy556575]

I especially remember Stephen Cannell because of that logo of him typing on his damned Selectric!

[topanga]

Only Isaiah was fired.  Both TR and Katherine wanted to leave.  I think TR was sort of a mutual decision. He didn't like his story, he came out (and claimed Shonda didn't want him to) and she was reducing his airtime. Katherine was more contentious since she had just signed a new contract and was a more prominent character.

Why wouldn't Shonda didn't want TR to come out? Shonda has storylines with gay characters throughout her shows, and I know this came later, but Guillermo Diaz (Huck) is gay and out. Is TR implying that she only likes fictional gay people?

[funkopop]

I would really like to hear what Lisa Bonet has to say about Bill Cosby.  Their feud has always been gossip fodder and when the allegations surrounding Bill resurfaced, I know I  started to wonder if there was more to their tension than Bonet being too much of a wild child.

[HalcyonDays]

I know, it must have been hell cashing those checks every week...

 

You mean, "I know, it must have been hell cashing those LARGE checks every week..."

 

I would have no problem with any behind the scenes drama and spats if I could make the $620,000 an episode. Makes it easier to deal with, you know what I mean?

 

The Big Bang Theory seems to have a fairly contented cast, but I've always wondered if there was tension on the set after Cuoco and Galecki broke up. I don't think their characters have ever had much onscreen chemistry even when they were dating, but it's still gotta be at least a little awkward for them.

 

I sort of doubt it solely because of the fact that the writers put them together as a couple again. The show is so successful that I think they would have had the clout to say "no, write that we stay friends." Apparently they are good friends still in real life, so that's good.

[DkNNy79]

Oh, and a thread about backstage spats is incomplete without talking about all the drama that went down on Buffy. What was up with Alyson and SMG? Was SMG really an asshole, or was she railroaded because she was there to do a job  and didn't give a crap about being BFFs and that got under people's skins? I know she was close to a few of her costars - David? Seth? - but it seemed like she was relatively isolated from the rest of the cast. Bet it didn't help that she didn't participate in the Shakespeare stuff at Whedon's house.

 

ETA: More Buffy gossip, because I just can't stop - What was going on with James Marsters and Michelle Trachtenberg? I heard that she had a crush on him, but then he wrote this song about her, which makes him come off as a creep, even if she was the one flirting with him:

Yeah, I want to know what happened between Aly and SMG because they seemed tight toward the beginning.  I remember when SMG hosted SNL she gave Aly/Willow a shout out at the ending credits.  I heard that SMG wanted out towards the latter years and since she's the star, if she leaves the others are out of a job.  I hope that's not the reason for the beef as that is unfair to SMG.

 

Also, z100 (NYC - but its syndicated now), which I think is one of the biggest radio stations in the US.  They asked the morning show who their least favorite celebrity guests were and the girls of the morning show said SMG.  They said that she kinda ignored them and was nicer to the guys.   SMG might one of those girls who gets along better with guys than other girls.

 

I want more details on her relationship with David.  I think they had great chemistry so I want all the juicy details on their affair/hook up.

 

I didn't know about Michelle Trachtenberg and James Marsters.  That sounds a little creepy to me.

 

Also, I know Michelle had beef with Ashley Simpson over Pete Wentz.  Kathy Griffin alluded to it when Michelle was on her talk show (which no longer exists).  I would like to know more details about that.  Michelle wouldn't spill the beans, because Ashley and Pete have a kid together.

[topanga]

I would LOVE to know what that set was like behind the scenes after Heigl said she didn't get good enough material to submit herself for an Emmy. I'm not saying whether she was correct or incorrect about that(I'd stopped watching Grey's consistently by then), but my god, no one can burn a bridge quite like Katherine Heigl can.

That reminds me of Mandy Patinkin's negative comments about "Criminal Minds," although he had the good sense to wait until after he left the show to do his trash talking. I always wonder why actors bad mouth their shows or movies. In KH's case, she was basically spitting in Shonda Rhimes's face while still receiving pay check from her.

 

There's a way to say things, you know? I only heard one interview with Josh Charles after he left "The Good Wife," but in this interview at least, he said very politely that his character had gone as far as it could go, or something along those lines. He never said, "The writing for my character sucks. I'm not growing or changing. They have no idea what to do with me." Which would have been valid points, but there are nicer ways to convey the same ideas. And I don't remember George Clooney saying bad things about 'ER' after he left (he could have--I just don't remember). And Juliana Margulies never talked about being bored or wanting to move back to New York until years after she'd left the show.

 

ETA: Because "check" really does need that 'k' at the end.

Edited May 21, 2015 by topanga

[merylinkid]

 

I sort of doubt it solely because of the fact that the writers put them together as a couple again. The show is so successful that I think they would have had the clout to say "no, write that we stay friends." Apparently they are good friends still in real life, so that's good.

 

You mean they acted like professionals and did their fricking jobs?   They were grown up to recognize the difference between themselves and the charcters they played on tv?    That's no fun.   

[Chaos Theory]

You mean they acted like professionals and did their fricking jobs? They were grown up to recognize the difference between themselves and the charcters they played on tv? That's no fun.

That's the one Chuck Lorre show where I think everyone acts fairly professionally. It's kinda boring.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Chaos Theory

[Minneapple]

Of course, Mandy Patinkin abruptly up and quit Criminal Minds with no notice. He had had a long-running feud with Thomas Gibson from their days on Chicago Hope, and fhere were rumors that they wouldn't do scenes with each other, just like The Good Wife.

[Chaos Theory]

But hasn't Mandy Patinkin walked away from like every show he has been on? I remember the same problem with Dead Like Me. I was actually surprised he stuck with Homeland.

Edited May 21, 2015 by Chaos Theory

[proserpina65]

I didn't know about Michelle Trachtenberg and James Marsters.  That sounds a little creepy to me.

 

I was going to ask why you thought this was creepy, but then I found out that James Marsters is older than me.  He looks damned good for his age (and, really, for ages a lot younger as well).

[galax-arena]

Even if James Marsters had been younger than he was, I still think it would have been creepy because Michelle Trachtenberg was 15 years old at the time. A grown man writing songs about how underage girls are such jailbait and how dangerous/seductive they are is gross. Did he have a countdown clock for the Olsen twins too? 

[Wax Lion]

 

Why wouldn't Shonda didn't want TR to come out? Shonda has storylines with gay characters throughout her shows, and I know this came later, but Guillermo Diaz (Huck) is gay and out. Is TR implying that she only likes fictional gay people?

 

That was a very different time. At the time of Washington's blow-up, Callie hadn't shown up (much less realize she's bisexual), if Grey's had any gay characters they were in one-off  tearjerker-of-the-week stories. Openly gay male actors were rare at the time and it was still common wisdom in Hollywood that audiences wouldn't buy an openly gay man playing a straight character in relationships. (This still applies to movies.) The only gay lead character on TV was Kevin on Brothers & Sisters, every other character was considered supporting or recurring. (ETA: For further context, reports of the incident was in October 2006. Neil Patrick Harris came out in November 2006 and NPH's coming out went far in changing the idea of what audiences would accept out of a gay male actor.)

 

A lot of gay blogs at the time (particularly ones aimed at gay men) looked at Rhimes with suspicion by then. There was the whole attempt to get her to do something after Washington reportedly used a slur on set in an altercation. Then Knight's character just got horrible stories, eventually leading to a season where he disappeared. It looked retaliatory to a lot of people.

 

Then came the whole incident with Brooke Smith. Again, remember, at the time the majority of queer women on TV were pretty bisexual women primarily in relationships with men. Female bisexuality was used as titillation and seen as a way of checking the diversity box without actually treating LGBT people equally. So when a character hyped as Callie's love interest was suddenly written out mysteriously, that encouraged the suspicion. As I recall, it took a while before AfterEllen relaxed enough to enjoy Callie and Arizona instead of worrying how it would go wrong.

 

Knight was written out of Grey's in 2009. Smith in 2008. Scandal didn't debut until 2012. In the meantime, if Private Practice or Off the Map had any great gay regular characters, it fell below the media radar.

 

At the time Knight came out, Rhimes didn't have much of a record on how she treated gay characters or gay people. There's also a good chance Rhimes spent the years after that incident educating herself on those issues, especially since she's had gay writers in the writer's rooms over various shows, so even with her current record there's still a good chance she might have given Knight that kind of advice. He was probably getting that kind of advice from a lot of corners (he probably expected he could focus on Broadway again if all those warnings came true, which he largely did).

Edited May 21, 2015 by Wax Lion

[Irlandesa]

Why wouldn't Shonda didn't want TR to come out? Shonda has storylines with gay characters throughout her shows, and I know this came later, but Guillermo Diaz (Huck) is gay and out. Is TR implying that she only likes fictional gay people?

Already covered.  Different time.  She probably would have seen it as a distraction.  It's not that she likely was totally opposed but opposed at that moment.  This was before Shonda took over ABC as well where she likely didn't want anything potentially hurting her show.  Now?  She's almost bulletproof. 

 

There's a way to say things, you know? I only heard one interview with Josh Charles after he left "The Good Wife," but in this interview at least, he said very politely that his character had gone as far as it could go, or something along those lines. He never said, "The writing for my character sucks. I'm not growing or changing. They have no idea what to do with me."

But Josh Charles also had the cover of only signing a four year contract because he didn't think he'd want to be stuck on a show for six or seven years.  So when he said he felt his character had nowhere to go, it wasn't a scandal because he left, they were always able to couch it as gratitude he signed on for a half a season more.  TR, Katherine and Patrick were scandalous because they left early.