S20.E07: Week 7: Eras

[COESpiral]

I thought the frantic scrambling of papers, prior to judging the last group was extremely suspicious.  Why was there a need to write down anything?  The judges spoke their own scores, and each was entitled to their own score.  My mom thought they had to be unanimous (obviously not true), but I assumed they were feverishly calculating who to give the two points to, without affecting who they wanted to go home.

Due to the rules set by network Standards and Practices the judges have to write down their scores. You notice when the dancers finish and are coming over to Tom that Carrie Ann is handing a piece of paper to a person just off camera. That PA is telling production what scores they each gave so the graphics person can get that ready when it's time to show paddles. It's also to have a hard copy in case there's a dispute about something (i.e. one judge showing an unusual amount of bias towards a celeb or professional either pro or con).

If you've never seen the movie "Quiz Show", I'd recommend it. Or Google the history behind the game show scandals of the 1950's.

[Alapaki]

I think with the advent of social media and social media voting, the demographic of the viewership is less important.  Fans of a star or a pro can get a tweet giving them the number to call or text, and register their votes without watching a second of the show.

 

I think Willow's problem may have been more that she simply didn't have that large of a following.  I have tween daughters who didn't know who she was, but they certainly know who Riker is).  They also know who Chris is, but I'm keeping that fact from the "Father of the Year" Selection Committee).

 

I do agree that Willow's "storyline" on the show was not compelling enough to draw the votes of those people who vote based upon that sort of thing.  

[Alapaki]

Not because they want to give Nastia an edge, but because her partner was injured. If she didn't have immunity and ended up going home next because her scores + viewer votes weren't enough, I could see the powers that be worrying about an outcry that she didn't get a fair shake because her partner was injured and she wasn't as used to dancing with Sasha and she wasn't prepared to do a dance-off with someone who's not her usual partner, etc.

 

 

I thought about whether Nastia was given Immunity to give Derek a break from having to dance twice.  But then that obviously wasn't an issue since Derek didn't have to dance the first dance anyway.

 

As far as perceived unfairness at eliminating a star the week their pro gets injured, I think they'd face less blowback over that with Nastia than they might ordinarily.  They've already acknowledged that the majority of her training is being done with someone other than Derek, and that Derek's primary role seems to be choreography (and, of course, showing up on Monday night).  

 

Due to the rules set by network Standards and Practices the judges have to write down their scores. . . . 

 

If you've never seen the movie "Quiz Show", I'd recommend it. Or Google the history behind the game show scandals of the 1950's.

 

 

The way the the "Quiz Show" laws are written they have no applicability whatsoever to a show like Dancing with the Stars.  There's absolutely no legal reason why TPTB can't dictate what scores the Judges give a team.  Of course they would take a PR hit if they were proven to be doing that.  But there's nothing illegal about it.  Hell, in shows like American Idol, the right TPTB to dictate the elimination is (or at least used to be) right there in the small print that scrolls at the end of the show.

[OakGoblinFly]

I think with the advent of social media and social media voting, the demographic of the viewership is less important.  Fans of a star or a pro can get a tweet giving them the number to call or text, and register their votes without watching a second of the show.

 

I think Willow's problem may have been more that she simply didn't have that large of a following.  I have tween daughters who didn't know who she was, but they certainly know who Riker is).  They also know who Chris is, but I'm keeping that fact from the "Father of the Year" Selection Committee).

 

I do agree that Willow's "storyline" on the show was not compelling enough to draw the votes of those people who vote based upon that sort of thing.  

 

 

Which really is a shame as I think a story line about a young lady stretching herself, learning to dance, and growing in confidence should be compelling (then again, I think lack of "drama" is what did Charlie White in - that and lousy choreography from Sharna).

[Saylii]

It's also possible that TPTB were trying to protect Nastia because Derek got injured and announced his injury on Instagram well before the online polls closed. If I were a Derek/Nastia fan and hadn't finished powervoting, I would have been completely turned off knowing that he was probably not going to dance the rest of the season. I may even think the producers would rig things for Nastia and Derek to be eliminated next. There would be no other reason for Derek and Mark to pull their posts since E!Online had already picked up the story. They were protecting Nastia's votes that she was losing from the hardcore fans.

Giving Nastia immunity shows the fan base that she's not eliminated, she's not going anywhere, and that the producers support her dancing with someone else other then Derek.

Edited April 28, 2015 by Saylii

[iMonrey]

 

I really need Noah to leave so I can stop feeling guilty about hating him.

 

Yeah, I don't hate him, but I kind of hate that he's on the show. It's sort of like Bristol Palin all over again, in that people are voting for him for reasons other than dancing. It just feels emotionally exploitative to me.

 

 

Also, what the hell is a "Modern Charleston"?

 

That was a real head scratcher. Charleston more than any other style is so tied to a specific era that doing a "modern Charleston" is as much of an oxymoron as doing an Edwardian Era Hip-Hop. And I didn't really see a lot of moves in that dance that sort of define the Charleston.

 

When Riker was facing the judges after his first dance he was doing that thing with his mouth that made me think he was on coke. Then later when Carrie Ann went all nutzo over Noah I figured that's where Riker got the coke from.

[Sunhusky]

To be honest, it really didn't bother me that Derek inserted himself into Nastia and Sasha's dance until I started reading comments from other viewers. I was too busy being perplexed that if Derek was able to be on stage even in this limited fashion, why wasn't he in NYC trying to save his Broadway career by maybe doing some appearances before and after the show he was being paid good money to do that was most likely losing some money now that people who'd bought tix just because of Derek were asking for refunds. Maybe his lack of effort on that front means he's lost that job and is no longer being paid by them, hence DwTS is top priority for him now? Otherwise, why not put his efforts toward salvaging as much as he can by doing something to soothe upset ticket buyers, even if only being available at the stage door to greet fans and pose for pix. Just kinda makes me wonder what's going on.

[truthaboutluv]

And, if TPTB wanted to tilt the field in Derek's favor, as shown below, keeping Nastia out of the Dance-Off actually dragged her adjusted-score down.

 

 

I'm not sure how that would be possible. Nastia gained extra points along with her Immunity win. So her points at the end of the night was 41, with Noah and Sharna in second I believe, with a 38, after the extra two points was added to their score, for winning the dance-off. 

 

Otherwise, why not put his efforts toward salvaging as much as he can by doing something to soothe upset ticket buyers, even if only being available at the stage door to greet fans and pose for pix. Just kinda makes me wonder what's going on.

 

 

I imagined anyone who cared enough about Derek and is that big of a fan to specifically buy tickets to the show just to see him (versus just being fans of the Rockettes and wanting to see a show at Radio City Music Hall), would be well aware that he was told it was best to stay in LA for the week where he was getting treatment and physical therapy for his injuries. And frankly, getting on a plane, to go stand outside the door, would do little to change the fact that he couldn't perform. 

Edited April 28, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[smiley13]

Yeah, I don't hate him, but I kind of hate that he's on the show. It's sort of like Bristol Palin all over again, in that people are voting for him for reasons other than dancing. It just feels emotionally exploitative to me.

 

How on earth is he like Bristol?  If anything, it is like Amy Purdy.

[kitcloudkicker]

I imagined anyone who cared enough about Derek and is that big of a fan to specifically buy tickets to the show just to see him (versus just being fans of the Rockettes and wanting to see a show at Radio City Music Hall), would be well aware that he was told it was best to stay in LA for the week where he was getting treatment and physical therapy for his injuries. And frankly, getting on a plane, to go stand outside the door, would do little to change the fact that he couldn't perform. 

 

Yeah, the Radio City show has a million moving parts that are non-Derek, and while I'm sure that they aren't the happiest that he's hurt, well, that's why they have understudies ready to go. And I have to think that the producers of the show obviously knew that this was a potential risk of letting him do both shows, and they ultimately decided that the publicity boost of having him be on TV every week talking about the show outweighed the risk. 

 

Honestly, I think his highest priority is probably that tour this summer, which he kind of proved last night. I would guess they have investors, who would stand to lose if that was at risk, and that one definitely can't really go off without him. 

[WhitneyWhit]

How on earth is he like Bristol?  If anything, it is like Amy Purdy.

Uh, because they're both amputees? I wasn't a fan, but Amy could actually dance, unlike Noah, who doesn't dance.

[Snarklepuss]

If anything, I think giving immunity to Nastia and not Willow means that TPTB were okay with Willow going home instead of whoever came in second-to-last.

 

I don't for a minute believe anything Tom says about the timing of the double-elimination being canceled.  Rather, I think TPTB were unhappy with whomever finished next to last in voting (and was therefore saved by canceling the double-elimination).  Double-eliminations, IMO, are typically used by TPTB to get rid of someone whom they really don't want there but who never seems to end up dead-last.

 

Which brings us to last night's knollery:

 

Scores before Dance Off (not including Willow's scores, b/c I'm not sure if they count):

 

Nastia: 18.45%

Riker: 17.96%

Noah: 17.47%

Rumer: 16.99%

Chris: 15.05%

Robert: 15.05%

 

Scores after the Dance Off:

 

Noah: 17.92%

Nastia: 17.92%

Riker: 17.45%

Rumer: 17.45%

Chris: 14.62%

Robert 14.62%

 

That tells me TPTB want Chris and Robert gone before Noah and before Rumer (claiming Rumer was "in jeopardy" last night was also meant to goose her votes for next week, I believe).

 

I wouldn't be completely surprised if Noah didn't come in second-to-last, especially coming off a night with the intro-package that made him look bad.  

 

*Further evidence for scores being pre-determined: we get an intro package of Riker just longing for a "10 from Len".  He then proceeds to perform a flawed performance that probably doesn't crack his own top-3 of the season.  And yet, there's the 10 from Len.

 

I have a bad head cold and I admit I'm not up to processing all of this today, so forgive me if I ask a dumb question - Can you explain why you think Willow's scores wouldn't count in this breakdown?  Is it because she would have gone home anyway?  Was it that TPTB wanted her to go home or didn't care one way or the other what happened to her?  I would be interested in seeing where she fell in this lineup before and after.

 

BTW, I think you are spot on about why the double elimination was cancelled.  I wonder who would have gone home had they done it?  I have two pet theories:  I think it might have been Rumer and Bruce and Demi exerted their influence with TPTB behind the scenes to keep her there.  I can even hear the rationale behind it, "Oh it would be devastating for her, oh, this means more to her than anything in life right now, it's repairing her damaged self esteem, blah blah blah."  Their wish is TPTB's command.  They're Hollywood "royalty" after all.  The other theory is that it was Noah and the PC police thought everyone needed to learn to be inspired seeing a man with one arm and one leg dance yet another week.  Perhaps if it is once again force fed down our throats we'll be guilted and shamed into voting for him even if it isn't really good dancing.

 

Of course the smoking gun theory is that Nastia is the one they wanted to protect from going home and that's why she got the immunity.  All the possible reasons people have posted  here so far sound completely plausible to explain the chain of events starting from Derek's injury to the cancellation of the double elimination.  In other words, to make their desired outcome happen anyway, they had to engage in some creative jerry-rigging of the rules.

Edited April 28, 2015 by Snarklepuss

[tarotx]

Noah is working hard though. Bristol not so much. And people like his dances Even with his limited movement. His scores should be a lot lower though. Eventually they will have to call out his limited movement But that's on the judges. You can be truthful and still show respect.

I enjoy watching Derek and Nastia so I don't mind he was still in the dance. I'm never a fan of packages but at least it wasn't scripted even if it was exaggerated to benefit Derek.

[MsPH]

I may have missed it, but I didn't see Chris' fiancée front and center in the audience as usual. Has she bailed already?

 

Seems she went back home the night before to "catch up on work" and might be back in a couple of weeks if Chris is still there. I wouldn't be surprised if we never see her again.

 

I might be in the minority, but I dislike both Derek and Val. They both seem arrogant and aggressive to me and make me want to not root for their stars. Derek being front and centre in the dance last night wasn't cute at all, it was obnoxious. He could've participated to some extent, but not to THAT extent. He has a face you just want to punch, doesn't he?

 

Allison annoys me too and she really doesn't have a body for latin ballroom. It's like watching a young boy in a salsa dress. Maybe that's why she's trying too hard.

 

Noah bugged me again with the whole "I don't want them to make Sharna look bad". Newsflash: They didn't! He's just dim. Good for him for accomplishing so much despite being a double amputee, but that doesn't make him any more likeable to me. CAI was being ridiculous with the 10. In the intro package they said the dance is all about showing personality. Then he showed none and got rave reviews. Yeah, he moved surprisingly well, but he was lacking in the one thing he was supposed to focus on, so no reason to get excited.

[Padma]

I see the similarity between Noah and Bristol, too, in that they've lasted much longer than their talent would indicate, mainly from people voting for them for reasons unrelated to the show. (At least in Noah's case it's because of the obstacles he's overcome in life and on the show, not because they like his mother.)  And, yes, unlike Bristol, Noah's a hard worker. But it's a similar kind of thing to what it was with her when better dancers are being sent home and he's still there.

 

Last night I finally saw what bugs some people about Derek. I understand if he's disappointed. I understand if he's a very responsible person and doesn't want to have Nastia be shortchanged (either in dancing or in votes) because she's now working with someone who -doesn't- have his talent or fame.  And I thought the overall staging of the subway dance, with the passengers--even Derek bringing the couple together--was very clever.  (I didn't see much Charleston in it, but that's another matter.)

 

But I thought it was completely obnoxious for everyone in the back to keep moving, vigorously, acting their roles--standing, sitting, etc--in ways that completely distracted from what the couple was doing in front of them. I don't think Derek would have choreographed that kind of busy-ness behind him and Nastia because it made it hard to concentrate on the couple. I started thinking, "What's Derek doing back there now?" And it was always something.  After Sasha and Nastia began dancing, everyone should have stayed still. And, really, him singing at the end was just too much.

 

Also monopolizing everything with Erin's interview. Yes, people might not follow social media and may have been shocked he's out of it.  But it's not like people tune in just for him. He's not crucial to the show's success and could be there as support for Nastia and Sasha (and the choreography where Sasha is relegated to "body double", good-naturedly). But he went way beyond that, I thought.

[backformore]

The way the the "Quiz Show" laws are written they have no applicability whatsoever to a show like Dancing with the Stars.  There's absolutely no legal reason why TPTB can't dictate what scores the Judges give a team.  Of course they would take a PR hit if they were proven to be doing that.  But there's nothing illegal about it.  Hell, in shows like American Idol, the right TPTB to dictate the elimination is (or at least used to be) right there in the small print that scrolls at the end of the show.

 

right -  Quiz Show laws say that you can't give a contestant the answers to game show questions.   They can't apply to talent shows like AI, DWTS, cooking shows, because the eliminations and eventual winner is based on subjective opinions of judges.  Judges can be biased, can be influenced by someone else, can even be predisposed to like one person more than another before the contest begins.  There's no avoiding it, and there's no way to police it.  If the producers want a certain outcome, the judges can certainly take that into consideration when judging.  

[smiley13]

Uh, because they're both amputees? I wasn't a fan, but Amy could actually dance, unlike Noah, who doesn't dance.

Amy was coddled and vastly overscored the whole time she was IMO, due to her annoying partner.  I have seen the same treatment with Noah.

 

I was not as impressed by his dance last night as the judges were and wish he had a better partner so I could support him.

[Andiethewestie]

 

I'm fine with her getting immunity this week. She was at more of a disadvantage under the circumstances, so it didn't need to go to Rumer or Riker, and frankly it's time for Chris and Noah to go home so I wouldn't have wanted them to get it, and Robert I'm on the fence about. Willow's the only other one that I would have been cool about getting immunity; I'm so sorry she went home this soon. I was enjoying her performances.

In Rumer's thread I mused that either Nastia or Willow would get immunity. I sort of hoped it would be Willow, clearly she required a little protection from fanbases that just vote because they "think" the Bachelor or SharkTank are such wonderful people, the dancing not so much.  Unfortunately the great unwashed who watch this show don't want anything to do with good dancers.  If we remember why dance off and immunity were invented in the first place, it was precisely to ensure good dancers don't go early. 

Edited April 28, 2015 by Andiethewestie

[sinkwriter]

 

I was not as impressed by his dance last night as the judges were and wish he had a better partner so I could support him.

 

I didn't love some of the routines Sharna came up with for her partner Charlie White (so bummed he didn't last longer, he was adorable), but I think Sharna's been working her ass off this season to make Noah look as good as possible under the circumstances. Given his limited movement because of the lack of bendable knee, I really don't know that any other dancer could have done better or much more for him than she has.

I think it's just time for him to go.

[smiley13]

I didn't love some of the routines Sharna came up with for her partner Charlie White (so bummed he didn't last longer, he was adorable), but I think Sharna's been working her ass off this season to make Noah look as good as possible under the circumstances. Given his limited movement because of the lack of bendable knee, I really don't know that any other dancer could have done better or much more for him than she has.

I think it's just time for him to go.

Sharna just bugs me.  It is a shame that we have lost awesome teachers like Karina and Cheryl.  I think either of them could have worked wonders with Noah.  I also hated that Charlie was partnered with her.  

[tessaforever]

*Further evidence for scores being pre-determined: we get an intro package of Riker just longing for a "10 from Len". He then proceeds to perform a flawed performance that probably doesn't crack his own top-3 of the season. And yet, there's the 10 from Len.

Yeah, I didn't get that at all. His frame was off during hold, and when they "leapt" together, it was off. I remember Val and Danica's quickstep, and they nailed that leap - it's one of the few things I remember about their dances :) So the 10 from Len (and no one else) was totally bogus.

I am so glad for the dance off, because we got to see Rumer and Val nail that Foxtrot. I was a little underwhelmed by their jive, not because I can't see Rumer in a lighter role, but just because I didn't think the choreo was all that and there was too much else going on in the background.

I don't mind careful use of the troupe - Amber Riley's freestyle would be a good example - when the other dancers are there to compement the main couple and highlight them. But if you have couples in the background doing the exact same steps the main couple is doing, it adds nothing and actually detracts imho.

[jette]

Popping in to say that while I genuinely like Erin, she made me cringe hard last night after the Noah/Robert dance-off. As the group was trying to squeeze into the camera frame to get their scores Erin says,"come hug me hold me" while standing on Noah's left side. Really unfortunate choice of words.

[Victura]

I didn't love some of the routines Sharna came up with for her partner Charlie White (so bummed he didn't last longer, he was adorable), but I think Sharna's been working her ass off this season to make Noah look as good as possible under the circumstances. Given his limited movement because of the lack of bendable knee, I really don't know that any other dancer could have done better or much more for him than she has.

I think it's just time for him to go.

This is a small point, but I think his prosthetic knee does bend; it's just that he doesn't have much control over it. They made reference to it in one of the packages or rehearsals, where Noah said something to the effect that it's programmed to mimic his gait, so that it does bend when he's walking in a similar rhythm to his other leg. I actually wouldn't mind hearing more about this in the packages and what they've done or tried with the prosthetics...it would be fascinating and bring another dimension instead of some little spat they might've had.

That said, I think Sharna has improved with her choreography. That jazz number I almost forgot that he had a prosthetic leg because it was choreographed to one side, which I think Noah is using very well. Still, the dance off showed that Noah's limitations are in fact very limiting in dances that require certain movements and balance on both sides of the body.

Speaking of which, the dance off match ups were very strange. Probably the most evenly matched pairings would be Rumer and Nastia, Willow and Riker, Chris and Robert. Chris and Rumer has to be one of the most unevenly matched pairs in a long time, all the more so since Val said in the package that you go up against someone your own size, so to speak.

[Alapaki]

I'm not sure how that would be possible. Nastia gained extra points along with her Immunity win. So her points at the end of the night was 41, with Noah and Sharna in second I believe, with a 38, after the extra two points was added to their score, for winning the dance-off.

 

 

I wasn't aware that Nastia was awarded two extra points, because she didn't compete in the Dance-Off.  I didn't hear them say she was getting the bonus points.  And every recap I've checked has her at 38 points for the night.  Maybe I missed it.  If they did give her both immunity and 2 extra points, that would be "generous".

 

I have a bad head cold and I admit I'm not up to processing all of this today, so forgive me if I ask a dumb question - Can you explain why you think Willow's scores wouldn't count in this breakdown?  Is it because she would have gone home anyway?

 

 

Well, since they've gone to once-a-week shows, in which this week's judges' point count towards next week's elimination, I'm just not sure whether they include points awarded to the contestant eliminated this week in the "total points awarded" before calculating each remaining stars' percentages.  

 

I don't think there's a wrong or right there, and I'm not sure it would make a difference to the remaining stars' relative scores.  I had to choose one way to go before making the calculation.

[iMonrey]

 

How on earth is he like Bristol?  If anything, it is like Amy Purdy.

 

He is not like Bristol, the situation is. People are voting for him for reasons other than his dancing. Amy Purdy did a better job actually dancing, although to be fair she was less disadvantaged, physically, because she had both knees and both arms. Noah really can't do much in the way of actual dancing. I appreciate what he's done and what he stands for but his presence on this show seems unfair to the others. Of course, it's always a popularity contest and lesser dancers have always outlasted better dancers, but with Noah it's a whole other level. It's not like Bill Engvall where people just took a liking to his personality no matter how weak his dancing was. I think a lot of people feel compelled to vote for Noah simply because of his courage and situation, despite his inability to actually dance. And it's uncomfortable watching the judges fall all over themselves to praise him for what little he's doing and Carrie Ann really took it too far this week. 

[kitcloudkicker]

I wasn't aware that Nastia was awarded two extra points, because she didn't compete in the Dance-Off.  I didn't hear them say she was getting the bonus points.  And every recap I've checked has her at 38 points for the night.  Maybe I missed it.  If they did give her both immunity and 2 extra points, that would be "generous".

 

 

I wasn't really paying attention to the points last night, but this is definitely how it worked last season when Janel & Val won immunity, she got the extra points too. Which makes sense to me - otherwise it would be effectively punishing you for the next week because you were the best that night, by not giving you the chance to earn the bonus. Their bonus points systems are always a hot mess though. 

[MsPH]

The few things I liked about this episode:

 

Willow and Mark's jazz. It had actual jazz dance moves in it. Shocker! I haven't been able to recognize any of the other jazz routines this season as jazz, so this was a breath of fresh air to me. I also liked music and I'm into Japanese things, so this was a winner for me.

 

Chris and Witney's foxtrot. It was cute and while the choreography is always pretty simple for Chris, he did a great job with it this time. It was enjoyable to watch. And Witney looked beyond gorgeous in that outfit!

 

Rumer and Val's jive was cute too, but somehow forgettable. Her upper body is still too stiff for my liking. But at least their routine didn't annoy me.

 

I actually liked Riker and Allison's quickstep. The footwork was very very intricate, but it wasn't as frantic thanks to them having to dance in hold so much. Not worth a 10, but I gotta give props for almost nailing something that complicated. I suppose he has an advantage over the others, but still.

 

As for the dance-offs, I enjoyed Willow and Mark again and Chris surprised me, though I'm sure it helped that he had the same dance style for his main routine this week. Rumer was pretty great. Noah and Robert were both awful.

[Serendi]

I'm pretty sure someone said Nastia and partners got three extra points.

[skittl3862]

I imagined anyone who cared enough about Derek and is that big of a fan to specifically buy tickets to the show just to see him (versus just being fans of the Rockettes and wanting to see a show at Radio City Music Hall), would be well aware that he was told it was best to stay in LA for the week where he was getting treatment and physical therapy for his injuries. And frankly, getting on a plane, to go stand outside the door, would do little to change the fact that he couldn't perform. 

 

You overestimate the empathy of fangirls when it comes to live performances. Daniel Radcliffe once skipped his grandmother's funeral because it would have cost the play's production tens of thousands of dollars in refunds to put the understudy on for a few days. Radio City is now trying to sell out a final extension without a headliner (sorry Laura, love you). I don't think those producers are thrilled that Derek was injured on another show, but I guess that's what insurance is for.

 

Anyone who is a big enough fan to specifically buy tickets to the show just to see him would rather Derek shuffle along through the Radio City show since they paid hundreds of dollars to see him live in person, as opposed to him seeming to prioritize his DWTS duties. It's not necessarily right or fair, but it's true based on my years of experience with the NY theatre world.

[Shibori]

What was Derek trying to do when he kicked that light? He was sitting, then hopped right up and went right to it. I was on the phone with the volume off when it was live and thought he was throwing a tantrum. When I rewatched with volume and context I'm still not sure what was going on. It wasn't in the middle of a dance or anything. He didn't even seem to be doing any steps when it happened.

[truthaboutluv]

I don't think those producers are thrilled that Derek was injured on another show, but I guess that's what insurance is for.

 

 

I'm not saying the producers aren't upset, I'm sure they are and I'm sure there are some fans upset and disappointed. I'm just saying I don't think coming and stand at a door would have made that much difference to the people already upset and disappointed. Because seeing his face would not change the fact that they still didn't get to see him perform live which I imagine is the true appeal to them. But then again that's just me. I acknowledge that people aren't always rational in their feelings.

 

What was Derek trying to do when he kicked that light? He was sitting, then hopped right up and went right to it.

 

 

I actually think he was dancing. It looked like he and Amy were at the judges' table and my guess is they were going to do a side by side kick thing and he probably miscalculated and kicked too far, where his foot landed on the light. 

Edited April 29, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[anonymiss]

He is not like Bristol, the situation is. People are voting for him for reasons other than his dancing. Amy Purdy did a better job actually dancing, although to be fair she was less disadvantaged, physically, because she had both knees and both arms. Noah really can't do much in the way of actual dancing. I appreciate what he's done and what he stands for but his presence on this show seems unfair to the others. Of course, it's always a popularity contest and lesser dancers have always outlasted better dancers, but with Noah it's a whole other level. It's not like Bill Engvall where people just took a liking to his personality no matter how weak his dancing was. I think a lot of people feel compelled to vote for Noah simply because of his courage and situation, despite his inability to actually dance. And it's uncomfortable watching the judges fall all over themselves to praise him for what little he's doing and Carrie Ann really took it too far this week.

He is like Bristol in how they share the rah rah America vote.

[BW Manilowe]

I'm pretty sure someone said Nastia and partners got three extra points.

That's what I heard too; I think Tom said it. He said Nastia got 3 points plus immunity; everyone else got 2 points for winning their dance-off.

[GracieK]

It's possible that Erin mistakenly made the you have immunity comment because she legit forgot there was one more couple to dance.

 

I was sad to see Willow go too.. she was excellent, especially for her age, but I just don't think she has the natural fan base to keep her on a show like this. It was sad to see her crying.  I disagree, however, with a lot of posters comments about how she may be scarred and her self-esteem or whatever so damaged.  Yes, she's a kid, and it was disappointing for her.  But kids need to learn those things in life... the mentality of "everyone gets a trophy" or "let's not keep score.. some kids might get their feelings hurt".  Come on.. this is part of the reason why so much of that generation can't handle adversity and all think they are so special.  Sometimes losing is a good lesson and one that every kid should learn.  Especially one who is already part of the Hollywood machine that ends up actually damaging so many young people by coddling and exposing them to things beyond their age.  She lost a dance competition.. big deal.  She'll survive.  

[GracieK]

He is like Bristol in how they share the rah rah America vote.

 

I don't understand what is wrong with the rah rah America mentality.  Without getting into political parties and affliliations, Noah lost limbs for this country.  As an American I have an immense amount of respect for that and his willingness to put his disability on pretty much naked display.  That takes courage.  I don't necessarily think he should win for that.. it is still a dance competition afterall.  But I have zero problem with showing a man who has made tremendous sacrifice for our freedom the support that he is due.  Many vets are cast aside or treated like crap... I have a problem with that. 

[RedheadZombie]

Which really is a shame as I think a story line about a young lady stretching herself, learning to dance, and growing in confidence should be compelling (then again, I think lack of "drama" is what did Charlie White in - that and lousy choreography from Sharna).

 

I think what did Charlie White in, was having the same fan base as Meryl Davis, when it was Maks' "turn" to win. 

 

Allison annoys me too and she really doesn't have a body for latin ballroom. It's like watching a young boy in a salsa dress. Maybe that's why she's trying too hard.

 

I don't think Allison's body is any different from Julianne's, back in her prime dancing days.  I also find Karina, Peta, and Kym to have similar body types (minus the implants they're rumored to have).  I don't know that there's much that Allison can do about her body, and while I'm glad they now have dancers with some meat on their bones (Sharna, Witney), I don't think that should mean dancers like Allison need to get boob jobs.

[backformore]

I don't understand what is wrong with the rah rah America mentality.  Without getting into political parties and affliliations, Noah lost limbs for this country.  As an American I have an immense amount of respect for that and his willingness to put his disability on pretty much naked display.  That takes courage.  I don't necessarily think he should win for that.. it is still a dance competition afterall.  But I have zero problem with showing a man who has made tremendous sacrifice for our freedom the support that he is due.  Many vets are cast aside or treated like crap... I have a problem with that. 

I didn't interpret the "rah rah"  comment to mean there was anything WRONG with it- only that there's a segment of viewers who are trying to vote for patriotism, and ignoring the "dancing" .  I do think he's very brave.  But I don't think he deserves to win, because he's not the best dancer. 

[GracieK]

I didn't interpret the "rah rah"  comment to mean there was anything WRONG with it- only that there's a segment of viewers who are trying to vote for patriotism, and ignoring the "dancing" .  I do think he's very brave.  But I don't think he deserves to win, because he's not the best dancer. 

 

Maybe it wasn't.  But I've seen a lot of comments on this board in respect to it that paint patriotism in a negative light and decided to weigh in.  Just my opinion.  

[calipiano81]

Speaking of which, the dance off match ups were very strange. Probably the most evenly matched pairings would be Rumer and Nastia, Willow and Riker, Chris and Robert. Chris and Rumer has to be one of the most unevenly matched pairs in a long time, all the more so since Val said in the package that you go up against someone your own size, so to speak.

There is a Catch-22 with these dance-offs. One the one hand, you'll look bad and could lose votes if you choose someone obviously weaker (Aly Raisman got a lot of flack for picking Andy Dick even though it was all pre-arranged), but if you go up against "someone your own size," you put yourself at risk of losing out, not only against your direct challenger, but against the winners of the other dance-offs as well.

Because, for example, Noah's total judges' total for this week (38) is now actually higher than Riker's (37) because Noah won the 2 extra points for his dance-off and Riker did not. What if, because of that, Riker ends up going home?

Edited April 29, 2015 by calipiano81

[RedheadZombie]

Forgot to say that I saw Chloe and her mom Christi (formerly from Dance Moms) in the audience.  Chloe is a sweet girl, and was always my favorite.

[smiley13]

Because, for example, Noah's total judges' total for this week (38) is now actually higher than Riker's (37) because Noah won the 2 extra points for his dance-off and Riker did not. What if, because of that, Riker ends up going home?

I would stand and cheer if Riker got sent home.  He should not even be there with his competitive background that he lies about.

[MsPH]

I don't think Allison's body is any different from Julianne's, back in her prime dancing days.  I also find Karina, Peta, and Kym to have similar body types (minus the implants they're rumored to have).  I don't know that there's much that Allison can do about her body, and while I'm glad they now have dancers with some meat on their bones (Sharna, Witney), I don't think that should mean dancers like Allison need to get boob jobs.

 

I wasn't talking about her boobs at all. Those aren't what make a body feminine to me and I don't think any one should be getting boob jobs ever. She's just straight up and down with ripped abs and no hips or waist. Maybe it's because she's had a kid, maybe she's just into fitness too much. I probably wouldn't even pay attention if her OTT personality didn't grate on me so much. 

[LadyMustang65]

So here are some thoughts about Monday night.  Better late than never, right?

Riker – enjoyed it but didn’t love it.  Costuming was weird and took me out of the dance.  If they were going to put Riker in a baseball outfit (why??), then Allison should have been in very different clothing.  Her evening gown and his uniform just did not mesh.  If you’re going to do a 1920s theme, it really just begs for a speakeasy.  Riker would have looked very nice in a fancy suit.  I honestly thought at times that Allison was the problem with this routine in that she did not look that good at times when they were dancing.  I had to laugh during the package when she talked about how Riker shouldn’t feel bad about not keeping up or something because she was the pro.  I actually yelled at my tv that um, Allison, kid’s had more formal ballroom training than you have.  Anyway, I enjoyed the dance, but that 10 from Len was bogus.

 

Chris – I thought this was probably his best dance, but he’s still just not good.  He seems nice enough when he’s relaxed, but his time  is past up for me even though I really enjoy Witney.

 

Rumer – this was one of my top two favorites for the night for the regular dances.  I agree with the judges that it seemed a bit ‘safe,’ but I figured it was because her neck was still sore.  She seemed to be careful about the way she held her head, and it looked like the dance had been slowed down and softened somewhat from the rehearsal footage.  It would make sense to tone it down so she doesn’t have to go out with an injury.  So while I don’t think it was a 10-worthy dance, that 8 from CA was just as bogus as Len’s 10 for Riker.  It may have been lacking somewhat in pizzazz, but she danced it well.

 

Noah – I enjoyed this one as well.  It was a fun number.  But Noah seemed more Huggy Bear from Starsky & Hutch than real pimp or gang leader or whatever he was supposed to be.  He did more dancing, I think, than he usually does, but it was still a lot of posing and walking.  CA was clearly drinking the same koolaid as Len with that 10.  No way does Noah score 2 points higher than Rumer for that dance.  I would have scored it all 8s – maybe a 9 – just because it was fun.

Willow – I don’t know what futuristic jazz is supposed to be so the Ninjazz worked as well as anything else, I guess.  I thought Willow did well with what she was given, and I actually liked the theme and choreography.  I thought it was one of Mark’s better ideas.  I wasn’t crazy about having someone so young on the show to begin with and at times I’ve felt that her young age showed in some of her dancing, but overall she was pretty good and had a lot of potential.  No way should she have gone home before Chris, Robert or Noah.

 

Robert – I like Robert.  I liked him from Shark Tank, and I like him on the show.  He always looks like he’s having a ball.  But this dance was just ok.  Good in parts; kind of awkward in others.  Just based on these performances, I think he should have been the one to leave and should go next week in the double elimination, although I’ll be okay if Chris and Noah leave first just because I like Robert.  But I’m thinking TPTB want Noah in the semifinals at least, so my guess is Chris and Robert next week.

Nastia – I really liked this dance, but I wanted to love it, and I would have loved it except for Derek.  I don’t mind that he wanted to be in the dance; I do mind terribly how he did it.  The package was ridiculous with all his mugging “I want to dance” over and over.  We get it, Derek.  You want to dance.  And it sounded like he was just planning to be on the train in the background, which would have been fine.  But then he ended up front and center.  He was between Nastia and Sasha.  Why?  Nastia should have been in the center.  And if he’d sat still while they were dancing, it still might have been okay, but he (and everyone else) kept moving in the background.  I found it very distracting and tended to pull my eyes away from Nastia and Sasha.  Pulled the camera away from them several times as well.  His ending up with a mic and singing was kind of the last straw for me.  Go away, Derek.  I don’t blame him for the package; he doesn’t control that, although he certainly had complete control over his mugging.  But I do blame him for the dance.  We know he’s very involved in staging and blocking, so he knew he was going to be featured heavily in that dance.  That’s on him.  And was Nastia even talked to after the dance?  All I remember is Derek talking about himself.  This could have been my favorite of the regular dances but ended up tied with Rumer because of Derek’s showboating.  I suspected Nastia would get immunity, and that kind of annoyed me as well.  They kept talking about her dancing with Sasha as if this was something new and not something she’d been doing for several weeks now.  Oh well.

 

The dance of the night for me was Rumer’s foxtrot.  Oh my goodness that was absolutely gorgeous.  Classy, elegant . . . that was everything I love in a foxtrot, and I wish it would have been longer.  That was just awesome. 

[jhlipton]

And for poor Willow - I tend to agree that 14 is too young to be on this show.  That poor girl is going to be scarred for life because of this.  I don't care what anyone says, she is too young to weather this like an adult even a few years older.  There have been young stars before but most of them have not had nasty eliminations like this, plus they were a few years older. Or an athlete who is used to winning and losing.  This show should be ashamed of itself on several counts.

 

The last of the Hunger Games movies will be out in November, and the tours, publicity, etc from that will knock any "scars" from DwTS right out of her head, especially dealing with the emotional fans. (If you've read the books, you know what I mean.)

 

While I raised an eyebrow at Erin's comment, which seemed to show the immunity for Nastia was pre-planned, the more I thought about it, the more I wouldn't be surprised if that were actually the case. Not because they want to give Nastia an edge, but because her partner was injured.

Even when Derek is injured, he gets special treatment. Any previous pro who has been injured went to the sidelines and stayed off until they were healed. Why should Derek being injured make any difference -- he is not her pro -- not until he is healed.

 

 

Due to the rules set by network Standards and Practices the judges have to write down their scores. You notice when the dancers finish and are coming over to Tom that Carrie Ann is handing a piece of paper to a person just off camera. That PA is telling production what scores they each gave so the graphics person can get that ready when it's time to show paddles. It's also to have a hard copy in case there's a dispute about something (i.e. one judge showing an unusual amount of bias towards a celeb or professional either pro or con).

If you've never seen the movie "Quiz Show", I'd recommend it. Or Google the history behind the game show scandals of the 1950's.

All "reality" shows, even judged ones, are exempt from these laws.

[Alapaki]

I re-ran the numbers based on the assumption that Nastia was awarded 3 points in addition to immunity:

 

Before the Dance-Off:

 

Nastia: 18.27

Riker:  17.88 

Noah: 17.31 

Rumer: 16.83

Chris: 14.90 

Robert: 14.90

 

After the Dance-Off (the number in () is their change in points relative to the bottom 2):

 

Nastia: 19.07 (+1.28)

Noah: 17.67 (+0.84)

Riker: 17.21 (-0.19)

Rumer: 17.21 (+0.86)

Robert: 14.42 (-0.76)

Chris: 14.42 (-0.76)

 

In other words, the bonus-points moved Nastia 1.28 points farther ahead of the bottom two, etc.  Conversely, the bonus-points pushed Robert and Chris .76 points further away from getting out of the bottom two.

 

The biggest changes there were obviously Nastia and Noah (who actually moved from 3rd to 2nd place. 

[luvthepros]

......... it would be funny (in a way) if F3 turned out to be Noah, Chris and Robert. At this rate, it seems possible.

 

I'd be checking out for the rest of the season if these guys were the Final 3.

[RemoteControl88]

I just realized that Nastia & Rumer are the only females left. I REALLY hope they make the finals. They deserve it.  I hope they can outlast some of the guys.

[Alapaki]

......... it would be funny (in a way) if F3 turned out to be Noah, Chris and Robert. At this rate, it seems possible.

 

 

I think they'll find a way to get Chris and Robert out, most likely with the double-elimination next week.

 

But Noah, I think, is another story, especially if Derek ends up more and more out of the picture for this season. (and, I suspect, that's a big reason why we may start seeing alot of Derek even though he's not dancing).

 

Regarding the "patriotic" vote for Noah (vis a vis Bristol), I think maybe that's the wrong word.  From my right-wing relatives on Facebook I see that Noah seems to be the favorite in that circle.  But I don't think that has anything to do with "patriotism", per se.  Rather, it's almost a tribal thing, as in "vote for him just to piss off the Hollywood libruls."  I think that was a big part of Bristol's vote-base and it got her to F3.

 

But, contrary to Bristol's situation, I think it will be much tougher for the Judges to change their tune in terms of their scoring for Noah at this point, without overtly looking like they're trying to get rid of him.  It would be quite strange for them to pull an out-of-the-blue 180-degree turn and say "hey, sorry, but without a leg you really can't dance."

 

This is especially the case since Carrie, who appears to have gone full "Xanax-and-Grey-Goose era Paula Abdul" at this point, is throwing 10s at him.

 

In either a Nastia/Riker/Noah or a Rumer/Riker/Noah F3, I wouldn't bet against Noah making F2.  And, barring one of those "extra dances" on Night Two that basically puts the final decision in the Judges' hands, I wouldn't rule out Noah actually winning.

 

And I don't say that to denigrate Noah winning.  My attitude is that this is a TV show, not the Olympics, and people can vote based on any criteria they like.  I bring it up because I suspect TPTB would prefer a Rumer, Riker or Nastia win, but may have created something they can no longer control.

[tarotx]

The so called right wingers are proud and respect Noah. Bristol was about the perceived abuse the Left placed on the whole Palin family but it wasn't about her really. Not even Sarah exactly. It was about what some consider abuse from the left wing media&arts.

Noah's support is rooted in respecting what he has done for the country and his courage. It's more in line with Candace and Sadie imo. Though there isn't really a religious component unlike with Candace Sadie and the Palins. Just a lot of respect.

[crowceilidh]

I am, in general, not in favour of inspiring dancers who lack body parts on DWTS.  And I am totally opposed to CAI - I mean totally.  Whatever it is that those people are doing on that "judging" panel, she is the most tedious.  And to be more tedious than Bruno is a tall order.  Back in the days when I listened to the judges, she was the first to be ffed through.  

 

However, I get the 10 for Noah. CAI has never made a secret of the fact that she tries to mark the stars against their own potential.  I thought Sharna's choreo was really interesting in the way it favoured his full arm and leg side without showing the other side's limitations.  I thought he did a very good job and I enjoyed the dance.