S30.E07: The Line Will Be Drawn Tonight

[LizBug]

Wish the powers-that-be would "close caption" Rodney.  I can't understand what he's saying in his TH segments or when he's talking with other people.  

[pennben]

While closed captioning may help you see what Rodney is saying, I'm not sure it will help you understand him!

[kikaha]

 

Kelly said in a confessional that Carolyn didn't like the NC

 

I'm interested to know the reason for that. 

[JudyObscure]

What do you mean, Lady Mary always acts like she has a stick up her butt and looks down her nose at everyone else.  I don't see that in Jenn.

I think Jenn does look down her nose at everyone. Almost every interview is Jenn both looking down and talking through her nose (like Mary) about someone she considers beneath her; the feather head guy didn't smell good, Nina was too much trouble because she was deaf. There's a secret scene where she says she hates Shirrin because she talks about Survivor all the time, "Who knows so much about a game? Quit existing." True, Jenn doesn't act like an aristocrat but the same, Mary-like, superior, little digs at other people seem like her to me.

[sadiegirl1999]

I don't know what Jeff was smoking b/c this was CLEARLY the best episode so far (of a boring season, but still).

 

The editing monkeys got me b/c I thought for sure Tyler was going home since he spoke more in the 1st 5 minutes than we'd heard in a long while.

 

I'm no fan of Jenn but that was epic Survivor.

 

>>>>Don't forget peeps...supposedly there's some "brand new twist" this season that we haven't even gotten to yet!

[Wings]

Carolyn has or had  2 idols.  I must have missed her playing one of them.  Did she?  

[Asha124]

Jenn is such a mean girl. When she started laughting while the votes were still being read she lost any chance to redeem herself (IMO). I hate smug players. Was it smart to play the HII? Yes. Was it necessary to high five at everyy vote cast agains her? No. I don't understand why so many people like her and are rooting for her. Her comments about other people were sometimes more offensive than those supposedly sexist things that the BC men said yet no one is hating on her. I just don't get it...

[cooksdelight]

Carolyn has or had  2 idols.  I must have missed her playing one of them.  Did she?

How'd she get two, I only remember one? And she's not played one that I remember.

[truthaboutluv]

Will is looking like a sucker right now, yet I can at least understand his position.  He's been with Hali/Jenn since day one, so he knows they're as tight as can be....combined with Joe, they're an even tighter trio.  He knows that if he sticks with them, he's the clear #4 in their alliance, maybe even #5 with Shirin now in the picture.

 

 

That maybe so but to me, it goes back to the expression "better the devil you know than the one you don't". Yes, there is a lot we don't see that happens out there but I just really do not get the strategy of jumping from three people he's been with from day one, who by now he should know their weaknesses and therefore has a much better chance of exploiting some crack, changing something as the numbers go down versus going to a bunch of players he knows nothing at all and who are five strong.

 

What guarantee on any level could Will have that once he helped them get rid of Jenn and company that they wouldn't just dump him? Again they haven't played with him, so they don't know him as well and have even less reason to trust him. Not to mention his flipping on his old tribemates so easily just shows them how not trustworthy he is. That he'll jump somewhere else in a heartbeat. I mean he couldn't possibly be putting all this on Rodney's Final 4 promise because really? Some guy just pops up and says "Final 4 right there" and he takes that as golden? 

 

I'll be interested in the media after but I really think Will's decision came down to Tyler and Carolyn's going with the BC. I think he realized they'd definitely decided to vote with them and figured the NC's were done and didn't have the numbers so he could save himself for a few votes and curry favor by voting with the BC and showing them he was now fully loyal, dutiful soldier to them. But now the plan was foiled and while he showed he was willing to vote with them, he's shown Jenn, Hali and Joe how disloyal he is. 

 

Carolyn has or had  2 idols.  I must have missed her playing one of them.  Did she?

 

 

Carolyn has one idol and no, she hasn't played it. 

 

Jenn is such a mean girl. When she started laughting while the votes were still being read she lost any chance to redeem herself (IMO). I hate smug players. Was it smart to play the HII? Yes. Was it necessary to high five at everyy vote cast agains her? No. I don't understand why so many people like her and are rooting for her.

 

 

People are rooting for her because not everyone sees her as you do. As for the smug reaction to the votes being read, in my opinion, plenty of the players have been plenty smug out there. Rodney is smug and misogynistic, Mike has had his smug moments in expressing in his mind his great Survivor strategy, Dan is quite condescending, Carolyn has had multiple eyerolls at Max, when he was there and Shirin and she looked plenty smug and impressed with herself when Max was voted off. And best believe they would have all heartily enjoyed if the Jenn vote had gone the way they wanted. So why shouldn't she be happy that she foiled it even if it's only for three days.

Edited April 2, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[Way Wes Jr]

There was an idol left out there and now Jenn has played her idol, does that mean there are two out there now?

 

Roidney and Mike are idiots, why aren't they getting votes against them?

Over in the Speculation thread, I predicted that the merged tribe would end up on the old Blue beach, because of the presence of the currently still hidden HII near their water supply.  (That was the only thing I got right in that speculation post.)  Note that this gives a huge advantage to Carolyn, Jenn, and Tyler; Carolyn and Jenn found their tribes HII just by looking around, Tyler as he's actually seen the clue.  This early in the game, I'd almost guarantee that they re-seed Jenn's idol, putting two HII's into play to be found.  Scramble!

 

 

I remember her saying that.  I feel like these contestants got a completely different side of Kelly than we're seeing.  She looked like a clueless little follower of Mike's, but maybe she was actually active in the game and making decisions.  At any rate, I'm glad she got the boot.  Would have rather it been Mike or Rodney, and I'm wondering if those names even came up.  But for Carolyn to trust her, and Jenn to say that, she must have put on a convincing case.  Maybe it would have worked better for her if she played it up that she wasn't swinging right back to her old tribe.  With all the talk about numbers and power couples coming from Mike, you think he'd be the one to get a clue, pretend to separate from his tribe, and extend an olive branch.

I, too, thought that Mike would have been a "better" target for Jenn and Hali.  But, in addition to the players perceiving Kelly as "the glue" holding the former Blues together [and this seems legit, Rodney dislikes Dan, doesn't trust Mike, and has antagonized Sierra; Sierra "hates" Dan and Rodney,] remember that Jenn was on a tribe with Kelly for six days, and even though Kelly voted with Jenn to get rid of Max, Jenn flat out stated that she didn't trust Kelly at all.  This may have been a better play than it appears on the surface.  (When I do my rankings later, I will put the Blues on top and the Reds on the bottom, but I would not be surprised at all if the strong Blue-5 explode.)

[Primetimer]

It's merge week, and not only are the contestants all getting ready to stab each other in the back: the local fauna's gone on the attack as well.

Read the story

[Haleth]

This episode was so much fun!  We have Rodney, playing the Wile E. Coyote character, being foiled again. Meep!Meep!

Heh.  Joe does kinda look like the road runner.

Jenn is such a mean girl. When she started laughting while the votes were still being read she lost any chance to redeem herself (IMO). I hate smug players. Was it smart to play the HII? Yes. Was it necessary to high five at everyy vote cast agains her?

I interpreted her reaction as "Whew!  It was 50/50, Jenn/Hali, and we made the right choice!"  Not so much smug as relief.

 

I think Carolyn and Tyler were thinking it's better to lay low with the majority for now and let NC get eliminated, then use their relationship with Kelly to stay in the game.  If they knew Will was jumping early there was zero reason to ally with the minority NC.  The two of them could not help the three NCs.  But now that the BC plan has blown up it would make sense for Carolyn, Tyler, and Will to move back to the NCs, regardless of personal feelings, and take out the strong alliance of the BCs.  It's not smart play to let the BCs remain largely intact.  (But now of course any BC that ends up on the jury will feel betrayed by Carolyn and Tyler.)

[ghoulina]

The best moment of last night's show was after the tribes merged, the look on Joe's face when Jenn asked if Rodney was smart. Bahahaha, is that even a question????

 

I'm totally with Shirin. 'Merica for a new tribe name is so lame. Beyond lame. It's embarrassing. Mike isn't even poking fun, he was dead on serious. Wow. 

 

Joe is such a challenge beast! He's kind of a boring player socially, but he is a real physical competitor. And I think he just really enjoys it. He had this look of pure bliss on his face when it started pouring down rain as he clung to that post. I think he genuinely appreciates the game and the experience, so for that I respect him. 

 

I guess now Mike knows that Will is loyal, since Hali's name was written down at tribal....but did he ever stop to think of how Will is going to take that? "Hey, I was told Hali, but you all went for Jenn, what gives?" That would be a good way to get me to never work with you again. 

 

 

I still don't have anyone I'm really gung-ho rooting for. I kind of like Tyler and Carolyn, simply because I think they're playing a quiet, smart game. I really do enjoy Shirin, but I'm not sure I like her actual game play. I waffle on Mike. All the time. Joe isn't bad, but he's not reeling me in.

 

Having said all that, I'm still really enjoying this season and what I'm loving is just the game play itself. I don't necessarily like Jenn, but I loved the way things went down last night. No one had a clue she had the idol. She wasn't too cocky or confident to think HER plan was the one that was going down, and they knocked a person off of the biggest alliance. Well played. 

 

But next week I might really appreciate a great move from the other side. So I'm just kind of enjoying watching how things play out, the back and forth, without necessarily having a favorite group or even favorite person. 

[Lamb18]

I think Carolyn and Tyler are looking at who they could beat at the end and that they could beat a Blue person more easily than a No Collar person.  Also now that they voted with Blue, they may try to capitalize on Rodney's mistrust of Mike to take out Mike. If they include Will in the group, who probably is questioning why he went with Mike since Mike lied to him, the four of them could take out Mike.  They might ally with No Collars on a Mike vote. But they would probably want to see Joe out first, then take on Mike.

 

If Joe doesn't win immunity, then Jenn and Hali are OK.  The others will vote out Joe before they vote out either Jenn or Hali.

 

While I could appreciate Jenn and Hali's glee, I think it was unwise to show so much triumph as they did. It will look like gloating to the others and they all have to return to camp together.

[Whimsy]

As a reminder, there is NO preview talk in the episode threads.  There is a thread for that here (renamed to make it clear). 

 

I have edited out any mentions of the preview throughout this thread.  This may have resulted in disjointed sentences.  If you've mentioned the preview in your post, you may want to re-read and edit.  If I've inadvertently left a preview mention in your post, please do me a solid and remove it.

 

Thanks and happy posting!

[nutty1]

I am still surprised Blue Collar didn't do a split vote, but I guess not totally trusting Will was their reason.

I am surprised the others didn't consider Mike instead of Kelly. I think he is a bigger threat. 

 

I may be in the minority, but I am rooting for Joe or Jenn. Carolyn is OK too.

[JudyObscure]

I still don't have anyone I'm really gung-ho rooting for. I kind of like Tyler and Carolyn, simply because I think they're playing a quiet, smart game. I really do enjoy Shirin, but I'm not sure I like her actual game play. I waffle on Mike. All the time. Joe isn't bad, but he's not reeling me in.

Right with you, Ghoulina. Last week my Dan hatred overfloweth, this week the focus was on Jenn and she irritated me, I find Rodney too stupid to hate (Wile E. Coyote is perfect, Haleth) but with all these choices of love-to-hate people I can't find any to love this year. Maybe Shirin, just because Jenn wants her to not exist.

[kikaha]

Jenn is such a mean girl. When she started laughting while the votes were still being read she lost any chance to redeem herself (IMO). I hate smug players. Was it smart to play the HII? Yes. Was it necessary to high five at everyy vote cast agains her? No. I don't understand why so many people like her and are rooting for her.

 

I found her laughter both hilarious and contagious.  The entire opposing alliance had targeted her.  THEY were the smug ones IMO; they practically were congratulating themselves for taking her out.  The looks on their faces when she pulled out the HII were priceless. 

 

It wasn't just Jenn, either.  Hali reacted the same way.  So did Shirin.  Even Joe joined in a bit. 

 

Why not?  They had just sidestepped a death sentence.  If Jenn had gotten booted, their alliance and everyone in it was dead in the water.  Now they have breathing room, and a few more days to try and exploit the cracks in the BC alliance. 

[Wouldofshouldof]

When Dan was coming up towards Jenn on the beach and warned her about the water, I thought for sure we were getting his underwear story again.  He almost seemed annoyed by Jenn's advice, and I expected some snide remark. 

But did you notice his response to Shirin?  He acted like the hot water was all his idea.  "No, I'm going to put hot water on it.  That works better."

[ProfCrash]

I understand why Tyler, Carolyn, and Will would align with the Blue Collars. There are clear divisions in the Blue Collar tribe that can easily be exploited. Sierra does not like Dan or Rodney and would happily vote with Tyler, Carolyn, and Will to vote out Dan and Rodney. Rodney is going to want revenge for the Joaquin vote and is going to target Mike and Dan. I doubt Rodney blames Sierra for that, she is after all a woman and we know how little Rodney thinks of women. The White Collar tribe, without Will, does not appear to have those divisions. Joe, Hali and Jenn seem to be pretty tight. So it would be harder for Tyler and Carolyn to work their way into that group.

 

I actually think that Tyler and Carolyn have a better chance at beating Mike, Dan, Rodney, and Sierra in challenges then they do Joe, Hali, and Jen. Mike and Rodney are more muscle types and that can help in some challenges but not too many. When individual immunity hits then tend to be more random ball/balance type things and events that are meant to be accessible to everyone, not just the strong. So anything weight related is based on a percentage of body weight which levels the playing field. If I am worried about balance events, I am targeting Joe, Hali, and Jenn who are smaller and appear to be in pretty good shape.

 

And then there is Shirin. Tyler and Carolyn might be able to play her as a swing vote. Get rid of the three No Color and Shirin becomes a lone wolf. She has more of a relationship with Tyler and Carolyn then she does anyone else. Tyler was not part of the group who voted out Max so he might be able to approach and work with Shirin.

 

Will knew he was the fourth in the No Collar tribe and probably was not in good enough shape to feel like he could beat the other three.

 

So Tyler, Carolyn, and Will joining with Blue Collar makes sense. There are more factions to work with and there is a better chance at winning individual immunity.

 

I loved how Jenn played the idol. That was perfect. I have no problem with her being giddy when it worked. She was going to be gone and now she is not and Kelly is gone. Kelly was a good target because it was pretty easy to see that she was the glue for the Blue Collar. She could talk to Rodney and Mike pretty easily and would be able to help that group together. Lose Kelly and use lose the voice of reason. That is going to cause all sorts of havoc.

 

I don't think the No Collars are in that bad of a place right now. I think that the factions in the BC are going to show and show fast. Carolyn, Taylor, and Will are still in a position to flip. If they see the Blue Collar folks implode, there would be good reason to move to the No Collars. Will knows that he was not trusted with the real plan and that Carolyn and Tyler were. That should tell Will he is at the bottom of the ladder. hmmmm Fourth or Eighth? Carolyn and Taylor could make a final three with Will and then there is two groups of three and Shirin in the large alliance so there is room for movement.

 

Next week should be fun.

[LadyChatts]

I know it's a YMMV, but I adore Jenn and don't want her to change.  I see nothing "mean girl" about her.  She's the real deal, genuine, speaks her mind, and I appreciate that breath of fresh air.  I just keep thinking back to the second episode, and the fact that she was so close to getting voted off, how many funny moments I would have missed.  From winning the RC for her tribe last week and cursing to celebrate her victory, to finding the idol while her tribe was back scarfing on chicken and didn't even miss her, to her funny confessionals and this week getting stung in her lady parts but pushing through, she's my kind of contestant in this game.  And she's playing the game.  She's got a good head on her shoulders.  I much prefer her and her tight quartet to the others in the game.  Thinking of a final 7 of Mike/Dan/Rodney/Will/Tyler/Carolyn/Sierra is enough to make me pack it in for the season.  I'll be glad when next week is over, because that will really be telling as to what direction the season is headed.  I know it probably wasn't the best idea to gloat about the idol, but frankly the girl deserved it.  She may very well get sent packing next week, so I say let her have this.  Especially seeing your name come up over and over again.  Jeff wouldn't have had to get very far into the votes before he said 'that's enough, no need to read more' to her.  I'm sure the others next week might have something to say about it, but they no doubt would have done the same thing.  At least there's an idol that's been used and used successfully.  Not a wasted idol or someone getting sent packing with it still in their pocket.  Which I keep thinking might be the case with Carolyn...

 

[Guest]

I think it was Jenn who said that Kelly was the glue keeping the blue collars together and that with her gone they will fall apart. We will see if that comes true in the next few weeks.

I wondered if part of it too was reeling in Shirin, who tossed out the idea of voting out Kelly initially.

 

I like Jenn but I don't watch extra scenes so maybe I wouldn't if I did.  She never struck me as 'mean girl', though, even when Nina was there.  

[ghoulina]

But did you notice his response to Shirin?  He acted like the hot water was all his idea.  "No, I'm going to put hot water on it.  That works better."

Poor Shirin. She probably practice peeing on jellyfish stings for weeks before coming on the show....only to be shut down in a snap.

[Way Wes Jr]

And then there is Shirin. Tyler and Carolyn might be able to play her as a swing vote. Get rid of the three No Color and Shirin becomes a lone wolf. She has more of a relationship with Tyler and Carolyn then she does anyone else. Tyler was not part of the group who voted out Max so he might be able to approach and work with Shirin.

 

I agree with your entire post, except this.  Last weeks scene of Carolyn telling Shirin that she had blown her chance, (by being a pair with Max, and weird in general,) was - regardless of the actual words used - dismissive, patronizing, and "sucks to be you."  I think the primary value of it as a scene was to establish how/when/why Shirin decided to go whole hog with the Red team; to show why she will staunchly not realign with her former Yellow tribemates.

[ProfCrash]

Agreed, which is why it has to be Tyler who reaches out to Shirin. I can't see Carolyn apologizing for what she said but I can see Tyler trying to find a way of making it work.

[dsteele]

I hadn't been a Shirin fan, but after the Palin crack I have to love her just a little. Maybe even let her pee on my foot. Maybe.

 

Also, gotta love this:

"Jen, where did you get stung?"
"Right where my hand is, Jeff."

[Haleth]

I think Carolyn and Tyler are looking at who they could beat at the end and that they could beat a Blue person more easily than a No Collar person.

 

No if all the other Blues are on the jury.  

 

The first jury member will be next week, right?

[vb68]

 

I interpreted her reaction as "Whew!  It was 50/50, Jenn/Hali, and we made the right choice!"  Not so much smug as relief.

 

This x 100.  I read it as pure relief.  It was basically like winning a challenge. And I agree she is contagious.  She had me this episode when she replied to Jeff's rather stupid question of where she was stung.   "Right where my hand is, Moron (i.e Jeff)."  

 

 

 

Joe is such a challenge beast! He's kind of a boring player socially, but he is a real physical competitor. And I think he just really enjoys it. He had this look of pure bliss on his face when it started pouring down rain as he clung to that post. I think he genuinely appreciates the game and the experience, so for that I respect him.

 

As a long-time viewer, he reminds me of Gabriel way back in season 4 if Gabriel had actually been interested in playing the game.  Gabriel was good at everything and basically the best tribemate ever to have around.

Edited April 2, 2015 by vb68

[peachmangosteen]

I can’t help but wonder if her hatred of Shirin might not have been a contributing factor, even if subconsciously.  I have yet to be convinced that she’s a good strategic player of this game.

 

This. I think that was a huge factor in both Carolyn's and Tyler's decision. They both really hate Shirin. I hope their emotional play will come back and bite them.

 

Initially I couldn't see any good reason for Will, Carolyn, and Tyler to switch so easily, but looking back on it and reading the posts here I actually see many reasons, so I'm not as angry at them for doing it now. I hope some of these people change things up after this week though because now it makes little sense for Will particularly to stick with Mike and co.

 

Man, Kelly was seriously shortchanged in the editing. She must have been a huge social threat out there and we really didn't get to see it at all. She was invisible for most of her time and then shown to be utterly stupid in that one IC. I feel a bit bad for her now.

 

I'd like to know why Jenn felt there was even a chance she and Hali might be able to get intel on who among them was getting votes and who exactly gave it to them. Obviously they were given a clue that Jenn was the boot. It definitely wasn't Will and I doubt it was Carloyn/Tyler since they seemed smug as hell about their decision. I hope whoever upthread that suggested it was Sierra was right. I'd love to see Sierra secretly join up with Hali/Jenn/Shirin/Joe since those 5 are the only ones I don't actively dislike.

 

I think we now have the true reason for Jeff loving this season; everyone is super dumb so he gets to feel smart and superior each week, which I'm sure he revels in.

Edited April 2, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[vb68]

 

I'd like to know why Jenn felt there was even a chance she and Hali might be able to get intel on who among them was getting votes and who exactly gave it to them. Obviously they were given a clue that Jenn was the boot.

 

I actually wonder if it was Shirin.   I don't see it as that unlikely that she knew how Carolyn and Tyler were voting or that somebody from the blue group told her the vote.   

[ProfCrash]

A Sierra, Hali, Jen, Joe, and Shirin would be an awesome alliance. Very cool. But not the best idea for Sierra and Shirin because they would be four (Sierra) and five (Shirin). They would have to find one or two other people to work with and flip on Jen, Joe, and Shirin.

[fishcakes]

Such a good episode! I doubt the alliances are as set in stone as everyone was saying last night. I think that with things still so in flux, anyone can win, even stupid-ass Rodney. And while I would hate it if any of the BCs won and I'm hoping for either a Jenn or Shirin win, I love that it's not a foregone conclusion which original tribe the winner will be from.

 

I have no idea if voting out Kelly was a good move or not, but I found her irritating to watch so I'm glad she's gone. Her eyes are completely vacant, as if there is absolutely nothing going on in her head, and whenever someone talks to her, it looks like trying to formulate a response puts her in physical pain. I haven't seen anyone appear to be that slow-witted on this show since Zoe way back in Marquesas. Even Drew and Alec from last season seemed to have more on the ball than Kelly. And Sierra seems just a touch ahead of her in this regard. Every once in a while, it seems like Sierra is not just singing songs in her head, but I think that's because she's thinking about how Dan and Rodney were mean to her.

 

Shirin is playing this so smart. Both with dialing back her personality after the Max vote and last night stating very clearly that she was NOT a swing vote. She might be on the bottom of the NC alliance, but at least she's not out in the breeze and having to scramble with Carolyn and Tyler now. Tyler was a disappointment this episode. He showed classic swing-voter hubris in his talk with Mike about how he's going to talk to everyone and go with whoever makes him the best offer. That's a smart thing to do, but an idiotic thing to tell everyone you're doing.

 

Merica. Good Lord. At least whoever came up "Nobag" can breathe a sigh of relief.

Edited April 2, 2015 by fishcakes

[BigRedCheese]

I'm loving Jenn, definitely who I'm rooting for now, hope she can survive the next few votes. I'm not getting a mean girl vibe from her, she definitely has her snark on within the game, but whenever someone gets injured, she immediately drops her game face and shows real concern. Even for Max, who she definitely didn't like within the game, and it was kind of sweet last night, when she told Dan what to do about his bite, and said she would come find him later and make sure he did it, and he was on the opposing side. Really enjoying Jenn!

[peachmangosteen]

But not the best idea for Sierra and Shirin because they would be four (Sierra) and five (Shirin). They would have to find one or two other people to work with and flip on Jen, Joe, and Shirin.

 

Actually, I'm thinking Shirin, in particular, should stick with Hali/Joe/Jenn because I have to assume Jenn and Hali don't want to go to F3 with Joe and know that going to F3 with Shirin is the best plan for them. And for Sierra too, she could join up with them and then help the women vote out Joe and then have a great chance of winning challenges at the end and a great chance of beating any of them in the FTC with a bunch of BCs on the jury.

Edited April 2, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[Way Wes Jr]

Unlike normal, I’ve already made a few posts, so this’ll be shorter than usual.  Note that while Jiffy Pop only read eleven of the twelve votes, the one he left out was for Kelly.  Jenn, Hali, Joe, and Shirin know that Will defected.

 

Hmm, the tribe split was (by majority of factions,) Red vs. Blue, and they had Purple buffs ready to hand out.  Any chance they had prepared twelve Orange and Green buffs just in case?

 

Murica (I’m going to spell it correctly - Purple)

 

1. Mike (1E)  This really feels too high, as I think (hope?,) that chaos will pull the former Escamerans apart.  But he survived the hints of “first boot edit,” and has a redemption arc going that could be interpreted as a “winner’s,” edit.

 

2. Carolyn (3N)  Also feels high, but she’s got the HII, and I’m beginning to think she’s becoming the Dawn to Tyler’s Cochran.  (Not that she’s everyone’s friend, and folk will feel betrayed, but that the potential jury pool isn’t likely to like her personally, and be susceptible to a claim from Tyler that he was pulling the strings.)

 

3. Rodney (6E)  Big jump, but no one respects him, (or will by the end,) and he’s abrasive.  He’s got a great chance to make the final as a goat.  (I’m also going off of my supposition from earlier in the thread that he’ll end up in the larger suballiance of the existing - by the numbers - large alliance.)

 

4. Tyler (5E)  I’m not as strong on edits as I used to be, but he is getting a subtle, and increasing, behind the scenes mastermind play.  The “line in the sand,” talk cements my feeling that the large group of seven will stick together long enough to pick off at least two of Jenn/Joe/Hali.

 

5.  Dan (2E)
6. Sierra (3E)  Getting stung got Dan airtime, and he managed to be dismissive towards women in the process, bonus!, and Sierra was invisible.  Except for her hair - did the merge basket include product?

 

7. Will (4N)  I am going to rail against your decision, but I can understand some of the reasons you went the way you did.  You were fourth out of four, and depending upon how you perceived Shirin, maybe even fifth out of five.  The new alliance looks, and according to Rodney sounds, fractured, so you’re not necessarily eighth out of eight of the new group you’re joining.  (And again, according to Rodney, you’re final four.)  While Carolyn and Tyler are being presented as “swing votes,” you are being shown as a flip-flopper.  One of these is better than the other...

 

8. Shirin (6N)  You’re not part of the core Red Three, and you have goat potential.

9. Hali (2N)
10. Jenn (1N)
11. Joe (4E)  As a group, you dodged a bullet with a very entertaining idol play, and a timely individual immunity win.  You can’t count on these two factors continuing on in the future.  And, as a group, you’re on the wrong side of a 8-4 vote, results be damned.

 

OUT  Kelly (5N)  I mentioned it in a previous post, but I think you were viewed as the one Blue player that all the other blues liked.  And you were probably also seen as Carolyn’s link to the five Escamerans, so while the ex-Nagarotes are in a bad place number-wise, getting rid of you was seen as the best way of fracturing the large alliance.

[Jersey Guy 87]

Of course Shirin volunteered to pee on the jellyfish sting.  Interesting that I thought I heard Dan say he already tried it but hot water would be better.

 

Joe winning II was huge, and Jenn was smart to play her idol.  I would have felt the same even if it didn't save her (say Carolyn, Tyler and Will voted with NC+Shirin).  It's much better to play an idol and know you're safe then to go home with an idol (or two) sitting in your bag.

 

I thought Carolyn and Tyler would have been better off going with NC, hoping to exploit the cracks in BC may be asking for too much.

 

Once again Rodney ends tribal with a completely dumbfounded look, they can probably put that on a loop until he finally gets booted himself.

[survivinmt]

Didn't Jenn straight up tell Carolyn what they were doing - voting for Kelly? I thought that was really stupid but it appeared not to make any difference. Also I thought I remembered someone telling Jenn that BC was going to vote for her. For the life of me I can't remember who it was now. I may have to watch again. It just seemed like everyone was spilling their guts to people's strongest allies about how the vote was going to go down. I mean Mike telling Will - who really should have been tight with NC - that they were voting for Hali (or Jenn) seemed like such a bad idea to me. But everyone seemed to think they were the only ones who knew what was really going on and just went for it. But anything that makes Rodney's head explode is good with me.

[kikaha]

 

Shirin is playing this so smart. Both with dialing back her personality after the Max vote and last night stating very clearly that she was NOT a swing vote. She might be on the bottom of the NC alliance, but at least she's not out in the breeze and having to scramble with Carolyn and Tyler now.

And Shirin dialed back her personality after... her talk with Hali.  btw, with Will flipping (I'm pretty sure they know he did), bottom of the NC alliance is now #4.  The other alliance has so many cracks in it, that #4 position could take Shirin deep into the game.  And if they make it to the end, anything can happen. 

 

A few episodes ago, Hali said Shirin couldn't win, or words to that effect. An example of the Survivor producers' ironic sense of humor? 

[survivinmt]

I just have to add that there seem to be a lot of folks - even here on this forum that seem to not like this show.  I LOVE this show. I found myself a little peeved last night after it was over because I'd have to wait another WHOLE week to see another episode.

 

I'm baffled why people don't like it. This IS the show. Whether the players are sheep or stupid or reckless or cautious - that's what this show is all about. When upexpected things happen some people here say, I'm not going to watch it any more because it's not _________. Wouldn't they be the same people who if the show was moving along predictably would say, this show is so boring they are not doing anything surprising.

 

I know Jeff is a gasbag and I love to point out when he's being a doofus. Like last night at the Immunity Challenge he said, "Losers will go to Tribal." They'll all go to Tribal, moron, they merged! But he's the host, on one of my favorite shows - so I love him.

 

Sorry just felt the need to stick up for this show. I've been watching since Hatch jumped off the boat. Totally addicted.

[blackwing]

I knew right away that Joe was going to win immunity.  He's lean and skinny and looks like he does yoga.  Plus there was all that talk telegraphed by the editing monkeys that Joe was going home.  So of course he wins immunity.  I have no doubt that next episode he will magically find a not-so-hidden idol.

 

I'm confused as to why Mike thought it was a good idea to get Will to vote for Hali.  To test him?  So if they see a vote for Hali they know it was Will's and that he is loyal?  If he didn't vote with them, it doesn't matter, he is lost anyways.  If he does vote Hali, then he sees that they lied to him and next round he goes back to No Collar.  Such a stupid, puzzling decision.  There were better ways to do that.  They could have split the vote.  Now, to Will it looks like everyone except him was in on it.  If they didn't trust him to not tell No Collar about the vote, they should have split the vote.  Then everyone in the alliance arrange to draw a picture on the right side of their slip, that way they could more easily identify which vote was Will's.

 

I despise Jen.  She's just so damn smug.  Have we seen players who successfully played an Idol and negated their votes actually laughing out loud at tribal before?  It just makes them hate her more and try to get her out next round.

[green]

Liked the Merica name.  First tribal name ever I could pronounce correctly.  Silly that Carolyn thought it was because a blue collar person couldn't spell America.  Instead it was a way to "sound" tribal and "allude" to the country at the same time.  White collars are so stupid at times usually due to their patronizing stereotyping of everyone else.

 

Sorry to see Kelly gone but her interviews early on in the episode made it clear she would be voted out.  At least Jenn had to burn her idol to be saved. 

 

Interesting the no collars couldn't even hang on to Will let alone pull in two of the white collars.  That was the untold story of this episode I feel.  How did they manage to lose Will??? 

 

The no collars are basically the typical Survivor cool kids club at this point with that third white collar insecure issues woman (Shirim, sp??) easily being pulled in and played cause she finally "gets to be" in the cool kids club thus validating her existence or whatever she thinks it does for her.  Is that not working with Will?  Is Will seeing through that bullc**p?  If so, he may be a player indeed.

 

Anyway no collars are in the deep doo-doo now.  Guess the re-hidden idol will be a big deal as a result.  Because I can't see Tyler/Carolyn swinging over right away or they would manage to piss off both sides in the process and there goes jury votes for them as well as any trust they hope to build up.

 

Besides with Kelly out, that opens up higher positions in the blue collar faction for them.  Especially with Mike now that he lost his partner in his sub-alliance of two.  If he and Tyler make a deal for that position then Tyler moves up as a strong contender what with his pact with Carolyn as well.  And Tyler knows Carolyn has an idol (only one that does which gives him power too) so he could flip back to her or at least not risk being blindsided with it depending on which way he leans.

 

Dan I see as a goat that any of these three could live with and Sierra seems to have faded back into the background for now which means she will probably last a long time.  Rodney needs to be controlled until it is safe to take him out.  Like after either Joe or Jenn go.  Hopefully both.  But my hopes and the way Survivor goes rarely pan out.

[ElleryAnne]

But did you notice his response to Shirin?  He acted like the hot water was all his idea.  "No, I'm going to put hot water on it.  That works better."

 

I thought it sounded more like he was pouting about having to use the hot water.  Like he'd been scolded and was sulking about it, the way a toddler does when a grown-up tells him the right way to do something and he in turn tells another toddler, "No, it goes like this."  It made me laugh, because he was still sounding like that when he got back to camp and asked for hot water.  And then when Jenn got back, she really did check to make sure he did as he was told.

 

 

But next week I might really appreciate a great move from the other side. So I'm just kind of enjoying watching how things play out, the back and forth, without necessarily having a favorite group or even favorite person.

 

 

Same here.  I loved the way Jenn handled playing the idol, and the high-fiving, etc., even though I'm not terribly fond of her.  I thought it was pretty clear that she was reacting out of relief and pure joy that they played it successfully.  But this season I don't have any players I'm really attached to, and I don't have any players I hate-hate.  There are players I hate because they're idiots or douche-heads, but they don't generate the kind of visceral hate that makes me want them off my tv.  And there are players I don't hate and who are making interesting moves in the game, but I don't like them so much that it would make me sad to see them voted out.  So as long as the game delivers on the unpredictable moves and doesn't dissolve into a pagonging, I'm finding this to be a good season.  And it's not as if Rodney can win, so there's that in its favor.

 

 

Joaquin didn't realize just how unlikeable Rodney was until watching the show.  He said had he realized that he wouldn't have aligned with him, or would have at least made Joe and Sierra more options.

 

 

Was it Shirin who said at the merge feast that they all expected Joaquin would buddy up with Rodney?  It says nothing good about either Joaquin or Rodney that other people knew they'd be fast friends.

 

 

I'm confused as to why Mike thought it was a good idea to get Will to vote for Hali.  To test him?

 

 

Mike also said that Will is going to play Rodney like a fiddle.  I think Mike gives Will more credit for strategic game-play than he deserves. I do think it was reasonable to want to test Will with that vote, since they've got no idea where his loyalties lie. But the fact that Will stuck with them and voted for Hali probably won't do much to cement Mike's trust in him anyway.  

[ProfCrash]

Mike specifically told Rodney that they had not been with Will so they don't know him and they needed a test to determine if Will would be loyal to them. The test was to tell Will to vote for Hali while they all voted for Jenn. If Will told his old tribe mates, the word would get back to Mike because Tyler or Carolyn would likely tell him that Hali was campaigning to stay alive. They would know if Will was loyal because there should be one Hali vote, Will's.

 

Mike did not feel like he had to test Tyler because he had lived with Tyler for 6 days. I would bet that Mike knew that Tyler was not aligned with Shirin based on what Joaquin probably told Rodney. Mike knows that Tyler and Carolyn are two and don't have a chance at numbers. So there is no point in lying to them. In fact, lying to them would be bad. Had Mike told them to vote for Hali and they did while the Blue Collar voted for Jenn, Tyler would see that as a sign that Mike didn't trust him. Tyler flat out told Mike that if he went in with him, Mike had to include him in the planning. Lying about the vote would have caused Tyler and Carolyn to move into an alliance with the No Collars at the next tribal.

 

Mike is playing a good game. He has a good read on the folks he is working with. He knew he could test Will and not test Tyler. He knows htat Rodney is going to require a lot of maintenance. I don't think Mike will be able to pull it off. I think Will defects once he realizes that he is low person on the big alliance totem pool and I think Rodney is too much of a loose cannon to control. That said, Mike understands what he needs to do and is working his hardest to do it.

Edited April 2, 2015 by ProfCrash

[iMonrey]

Mathematically, it makes no sense for White Collar to team up with Blue. It makes them the bottom three of an eight person alliance, instead of the bottom three of a seven person alliance if they'd gone with White Collar. When it's 3 vs. 4 it's a lot easier to flip one person than it is to flip two in a 3 vs. 5 situation. Plus they will have to compete physically against Rodney, Dan and Mike for immunity, versus Hali, Jenn and Will. I just think they're idiots, frankly.

 

Targeting Kelly was also a dumb move. Why the hell is nobody targeting Rodney? Especially after the showing he made in the immunity challenge. He was one of the last four hanging there. Again, idiots. I'm afraid we're in for a Blue Collar final four. 

 

And this is the second week in a row where Carolyn has struck me as kind of a bitch. After Joe won the challenge (back at camp) she said "You couldn't have let me win it for my kids, you son of a bitch?" Sure, she was probably being "sarcastic," but I also think she was partly serious. In the space of a few weeks she's gone from being someone I'd like to know to being someone I'm glad I don't. If you worked with her I can easily see her as being the office bitch that everyone hates. I think that immunity idol in her pocket is making her overly cocky. That and her perceived position of power.

 

Joe's a goner unless he can pull of an amazing immunity run.

 

 

[Neerbeena]

 

Sorry just felt the need to stick up for this show. I've been watching since Hatch jumped off the boat. Totally addicted.

 

Another Survivor addict here.  The only episode I missed was when Clarence was voted off in Africa.   For some reason the only season that I could not get into was One World; watched it but was kind of tuned out.  

 

I like this cast and next week looks good; I love a good scramble.

[BigRedCheese]

There was a lot of talk from Jeff about this being the best season ever, beyond amazing, I think it's just hard for it to live up to that kind of hype. It's good though, very good, I'm glad we have people that have at least watched the show before instead of people like the Christy brothers last year.

[ProfCrash]

Why would you target Rodney? He has the strategic ability of a slow moving slug, pisses people off with his mouth, and has yet to prove to be a challenge threat. Rodney forces the other people in his alliance to have to work harder and has no chance at winning the money because he is a huge pain in the ass. I can't wait to see Rodney try a puzzle on his own. He had to be coached through the freaking rope maze and is still trying to figure out who voted for Joaquin.

 

Dan has pissed off most of the people that he has been around. He annoys them with his stories and his behavior. He is less obnoxious then Rodney but that is not saying much.

 

Rodney, Dan, and Shirin are the current herd of goats. The only way one of them wins is if they all manage to make it to the finals and then it is probably a random choice by everyone left as to who is the least annoying.

 

We are not seeing as much of Shirin's annoying behavior so people are assuming that she has toned it down. I am not so sure that is the case. I imagine that she has toned it down a bit but Jen and Hali had a conversation about working with Shirin even though she is annoying. Mike knows that he has to handle Rodney and he has to coach Dan in every conversation that Dan has.

 

I totally get why Tyler and Carolyn would work with Blue Collar. No Collar, minus Will, is a solid threesome that gets along. Blue color was not a solid fivesome and they don't get along. Tyler knows that Sierra dislikes Rodney and Dan. Everyone knows that Rodney is a hot head. So there are two weak links in that five right there. Mike and Kelly were going to have to work to keep the five together. Removing Kelly makes Mike's job harder, Kelly was probably the best chance at keeping SIerra and Rodney in sync. Now Mike has to make sure that Sierra does not get pissed off with Dan and Rodney, good luck there, find a way to massage Rodney's ego, and try to keep Dan from putting his feet in his mouth all on his own. That gives Tyler and Carolyn a lot of options.

 

Carolyn reminds of Trish. Brash, loud and annoying. She is lacking a filter and passes it off as telling it like it is. She is an older, female version of Rodney. Just ugh

[CletusMusashi]

I enjoyed the episode, but TC was hardly an epic blind side. Idols are a thing now. Apparently they aren't even that hard to find. So, sure, there was a twist in the sense that everybody who's not in the Nina seat gets blindsided and calls it a twist, but I think Jeff was over selling it a little bit. "Chainsaw? Are you kidding me? That was way more dramatic than a chainsaw! That was a bomb!" Take it down a notch there, dude.

So what do you do, anyway, when you come down with a case of bee-jayjay? I'm guessing it's kind of hard to soak in the water pot...

Edited April 3, 2015 by CletusMusashi

[blackwing]

Mike specifically told Rodney that they had not been with Will so they don't know him and they needed a test to determine if Will would be loyal to them. The test was to tell Will to vote for Hali while they all voted for Jenn. If Will told his old tribe mates, the word would get back to Mike because Tyler or Carolyn would likely tell him that Hali was campaigning to stay alive. They would know if Will was loyal because there should be one Hali vote, Will's.

Oh, I fully understand what the thought process was.  But as I said, I don't get the point because either Will was or wasn't with them.  They all planned to vote for Jen.  If Will was playing Mike and ran to No Collar and told them everyone was voting for Hali, then what was supposed to happen?  Would Mike then vote out Will instead?  But if Will is loyal, he says nothing, and he sees that no one but him voted for Hali so now he's wondering why he's on the bottom and flips next time.

 

The part where Mike's plan failed is that they didn't have a contingency plan for 1) if Will told No Collar that Hali was getting voted out, and 2) what if someone had an Idol, and 3) who would it be played for.  In the end, the only thing on Mike's mind was "let's see if Will is loyal".  He didn't work out the steps far enough in advance.  He wouldn't be a good chess player.

 

I too am puzzled why No Collar wouldn't have sent their votes toward Rodney instead of Kelly.  The vote for Kelly seemed to be purely out of spite.  It was Mean Girl Jen deciding that she didn't like Kelly because Kelly wasn't nice to her.  Voting out Kelly when there are much stronger, harder players like Mike and Rodney made zero sense.

[Calamity Jane]

From here on out, I will be watching mostly in the hopes that we will get more of Rodney's reactions when his "kill-the-roadrunner" (thank you, whoever you were) plans fall apart.  Pure comedy gold and so much fun to watch.  I love those even more than watching the wildlife.