S05.E13: Forget

[raven]

 

I hate the man I used to call Rick Grimes.

I'm willing to wait to see what happens.  His behavior I actually find the most believable, given the arc the show's been following with him.  I just don't think the show would have him go over the edge - assault Jessie or her husband for no reason - he could never be the face of the show again.  He's in this "grab all the goodies" kind of mode because he and his family (which I include everyone in the group, not just his kids) have been without for so long. 

 

 

Because from where I'm standing, Deanna's the only person who's even given a damn since Michonne's ham-handed attempt

This is exactly the problem I had with it, that no one from the group has reached out to Sasha.  We've seen her with Maggie for instance, but it could be anyone really.  The show has spent a few episodes showing how everyone has bonded, family, etc and now one of their own is in obvious pain but shiny new toys! distraction.  So it bugged me.

Edited March 9, 2015 by raven

[RedheadZombie]

Didn't they establish earlier in the series that the walkers don't attack animals, just humans?  Or am I remembering that from other zombie movies only?  At one point, I thought there was a dog that could walk freely around the walkers with no trouble.

 

You're thinking of Dawn of the Dead.  On TWD, we've seen walkers eat horses, chickens, and piglets.

 

I'm very disturbed by Carol in the gunroom with that little boy. Carol has proven that she can be ruthless when protecting those she loves. But we've never seen her do anything that malicious to a purely innocent person. It felt a bit out of character. 

 

I get what you're saying.  It will certainly fuel the Carol haters.  This is how I'm thinking about it.  Carol was following through on a plan made with her/Rick/Daryl.  Rick has already told her that he will take over this community if necessary.  If the kid told his mom and his mom told - shit's going down.  Rick would not allow Carol to be banished, and blood would probably be shed.  I hate that Carol had to do it, but she's protecting our group as well as the community as a whole.  In retrospect, they should have known that Carol would need a look out. 

[Ohwell]

Honestly, I never cared about shipping Rick/Michonne so Rick paying attention to another woman isn't upsetting.  It's the fact that she's married that bothers me more.  He hasn't even taken the time to get to know the rest of the people, among whom there probably are plenty of eligible women.  

[nodorothyparker]

Don't care at all about Jessie.  I did like that this episode attempted to address some of the issues so many commenters have had about their entire setup.

 

I am however officially Team Sasha at the cocktail party of the damned.  These people are yammering on about how the ZA gave them the opportunity to have new cultural experiences and whining about a lack of good tea and pasta makers and she's just looking at them like "Uh, guys.  My boyfriend was literally eaten by cannibals and the last meal we had before we got here was a pack of dogs I shot myself."  It was both hilarious and sad how out of place every member of our crew was.  The "A" stamping was just weird.

 

Rick and Carol were both riveting to watch in different ways.  Rick is clearly unbalanced and his quietly reaching for his gun after seeing Jessie and her husband walk by made me think he's channeling Shane in wanting to just take what he wants and everyone else be damned.  The final shot of him on one side of the wall and the walker on the other to me was showing just how thin the divide really is between the veneer of civilization on the inside and the monsters at the gate.  And Carol is now just so gloriously chilling that made it almost hard to breathe during her scene with the nosy little kid.  It reminded me a lot of the old German fairy tales where the moral of every story seemed to be to quietly do what you're told and stay out of woods lest you get eaten or otherwise die in some suitably horrible way.  I guess two years surviving post civilization and losing three kids will do that to you.  Her every other scene of bullshitting these people was entertaining as hell though.

 

Daryl is grosser slurping spaghetti than he is stomping on walker heads.

Edited March 9, 2015 by nodorothyparker

[BrokenRemote]

I didn't get him as totally unbalanced.  He was trying to make points about security to Deanna, about the lookout and a roaming watch along the perimeter.  And he seemed to be reacting to Jesse at the party with her little talk about how he's part of the community now, whatever that blather was, like he wished that was true.  And he seemed reluctant to take the gun when Carol was offering it to him, because his sleeve pulled up and he saw that A the kid had given him.  I didn't think he was contemplating pulling the gun to kill Jesse's husband.  I thought it was more a gesture to himself, reminding himself that his plan is to be ready to take over.  

 

Yeah, I don't get him as totally unbalanced, either.  He doesn't belong in a padded cell yet or anything.  But I feel that they're definitely trying to show us that he's dangerously close, yet again.  

Oh, I also meant to say, with regards to the "A" stamping, I got the idea that was something the kid came up with and they were all indulging him.  I thought that it was probably his idea of getting hand-stamped to get back into a party, something he's maybe heard about from the time before things went to hell.  I didn't see it as a brand that everyone had to wear or anything like that.  

Edited March 9, 2015 by BrokenRemote

[Bad Example]

Everyone saying Deanna is rude or condescending to Sasha--I hope you're not the same folks that thought it was great when Michonne was nasty to Sasha, because it was what she needed to be broken out of her PTSD.  Because from where I'm standing, Deanna's the only person who's even given a damn since Michonne's ham-handed attempt, and that may be just what Sasha needs, someone who recognizes something is wrong and makes her angry enough to articulate it instead of holding it in.

 

The difference to me is that Michonne earned the right by knowing what she's gone through.  Right now, Deanna has known Sasha a few days and she and her clean house and comfy bed and "why worry about walkers?" can just go right to hell.

 

You may be right about Sasha needing an outsider to really see what's going on with her, but I don't think Deanna is that person.  

[kikismom]

Aaron had better NOT be fucking with Daryl.  We all know how much acceptance means to Daryl.  

 

I'm thinking Rick better remember that, too.

I'm a bit frightened that Aaron DID hear the conversation between Rick Carol and Daryl, and since he thought Daryl was out on the street possibly as a lookout that the spaghetti dinner with motorcycle was waiting to lure Daryl inside. I just think Aaron is better at sneaking around than anyone else at ASZ, and that shit about he and Eric being outsiders just like you Daryl was a little dubious.

I say this loving Ross Marquand's performance and wanting him to be a good guy...but I am still feeling I don't know for sure.

[peach]

I like Darrel and his new BFF but seriously, one killing walkers over a (soon to be dead) horse and a spaghetti dinner later and he's ready to not have secret guns?? What???

 

Seriously.  That was totally stupid.  I can get him crossing over and wanting to "try" at Alexandria, but what the hell does that have to do with having extra security plans around people who are too fucking stupid to have a lookout in a tower.  And as others have mentioned, they seem to have no plans to handle someone turning on the inside.  I guess Daryl forgot the time that killed half the prison group, or like, when a guy in an eye patch rolled up in a tank.  Spaghetti causes amnesia.

[Luckylyn]

Aaron is competent because as a recruiter he's not as sheltered as the other Alexandrians.  He knows how bad things are outside the walls  I wonder what horrible things he witnessed spying on potential candidates to join the community.  The other Alexandrians don't seem to see how precarious a situation they are in worrying about pasta makers instead of the very real threats outside the wall.

 

I can't believe how horribly protected their guns are.  Anyone could scale their walls and find their way into that gun room and destroy them.

[minamurray78]

And let us not forget Rick freaking reaching for his gun when he sees the husband (Tobin?). That's territorial and predator-like behavior. 

That was SO weird. This man was willing to look the other way (or however you want to call it) concerning his wife and best friend's affair while they thought he was dead ( and the implications to Judith's dna origins).

I get Rick and Jessie might feel attraction, but she seemed pretty vague when she was talking. I'll have to rewatch and pay more attention when she talks, 'cause I didn't notice any common ground, or a more specific experience or anything to make people feel like a connection happened, or did I miss something?

[Dodginblue]

Seriously.  That was totally stupid.  I can get him crossing over and wanting to "try" at Alexandria, but what the hell does that have to do with having extra security plans around people who are too fucking stupid to have a lookout in a tower.  And as others have mentioned, they seem to have no plans to handle someone turning on the inside.  I guess Daryl forgot the time that killed half the prison group, or like, when a guy in an eye patch rolled up in a tank.  Spaghetti causes amnesia.

 

I see Daryl as someone who doesn't get to decisions real quickly and so he's hesitant to just assume he knows what he's pretty sure he doesn't know.  i don't think he's easily bought with a walk through the woods and some dinner, I think he's just more let's take this as it comes, let's figure out what we're doing there.  And I like it that he took common human decency, offering him some dinner, at face value.   Sometimes spaghetti is just spaghetti, it's not a blood oath.

[Racj82]

 

Seems a bit premature, given that there hasn't been a hint of a person saying they'd quit over the horse.

Not talking about here. There are people that stopped watching the show because of the horse being eaten in Atlanta. People rage over animal violence all the time. Elsewhere in the world, you know it will happen.

[BrokenRemote]

Seriously.  That was totally stupid.  I can get him crossing over and wanting to "try" at Alexandria, but what the hell does that have to do with having extra security plans around people who are too fucking stupid to have a lookout in a tower.  And as others have mentioned, they seem to have no plans to handle someone turning on the inside.  I guess Daryl forgot the time that killed half the prison group, or like, when a guy in an eye patch rolled up in a tank.  Spaghetti causes amnesia.

 

I think Daryl's point was that they have knives, he has his bow, Michonne has her sword, it's not like they can't fight off a problem if they need to.  Rick's jumping the gun just a little (no pun intended) when he doesn't know what's going on here and when any person in his group could take out a walker or a human with a pointed stick.  It's a big risk that someone will notice the guns missing or catch them with them (especially with Rick carrying his in a holster practically not even covered).  If this place really is just a nice place with people who got lucky and are naive, he's risking his kids going back out to smashed acorns and sleeping on the dirt prematurely.  

[missy jo]

Why do y'all think, and do you think it was the right decision, for Michonne to be left out of the Rick/Carol/Daryl triumvirate of decision-makers? I feel like she's earned the right to be included.

[truelovekiss]

The other thing that bothers me with this is that to me Jessie looked somewhat uncomfortable when Rick got in her space and kissed her. Yes, she smiled a bit, but here is this authority figure kissing on her out of nowhere and staring at her like he's going to conduct a ceremony right there and then. If I didn't watch Talking Dead, I would have no idea that I was actually supposed to be cheering for this relationship. I would think this was a frightened woman, possibly already in one bad relationship, who knows how to put on a good face for men who treat her like cattle.

I felt uncomfortable, deeply uncomfortable, with that entire "connection" scene, and with his lips on her. I wanted her to run away.

I'm genuinely shocked if a scene like that is seen as a romantic bond by TPTB. And I don't know what it says about their view of women.

I totally agree, and I think it's pretty much an accepted fact that TPTB/writers have an effed up perception of women and romantic love. Maybe it was just the actress' reaction to the kiss, but that scene came across as creepy and gross. Also, if Carl is trying to fit in and make friends, Rick banging his new friend's mom and tearing up that family isn't going to help matters.

Other than her husband kind of calling Rick out on the porch last episode, and them agreeing he doesn't make the best first impression, do we have any reason to believe it's a bad marriage, or that he's a bad guy? Honestly wondering if I missed something there.

[BrokenRemote]

Jessie just came across as surprised by the kiss to me (and not unpleasantly surprised), not creeped out in the slightest. 

Edited March 9, 2015 by BrokenRemote

[Madding crowd]

Carol, WTF? I thought her threatening a child was horrible. She could have told him she was looking for baking supplies and if he told his parents, she could say the same thing. Telling a child she was going to have him kidnapped and killed was just awful. I think Sasha was reacting in an appropriate way considering what has been going down. Carol and Rick not so much.

 

I get the impression that Rick and Jessie have some immediate feelings for each other, but I find it a bit unbelievable on Rick's part. The group has been through a lot of trauma, so maybe he would be looking for a single woman to have sex with, but going after a married woman and even considering pulling a gun on her husband? Just doesn't make sense.

 

Sometimes Daryl is written as very child like and this was one of those times. Give him some spaghetti and a motorcycle and he is happy! I think these people are just trying too hard. I can imagine they would be giving jobs out to Ricks group and can even understand them to be happy getting some warriors types to join, but the over enthusiastic way Deanna talks and the cocktail party (and I want to know how they have so much beer after two years, I'd be drinking it every day), seems over the top.

 

I didn't understand the song choice at the end or Rick's oddball expression as he stroked the wall. If they were trying to signify something, it sailed right past me. I do want to know what is going on with the "W" though.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Madding crowd

[BrokenRemote]

Why do y'all think, and do you think it was the right decision, for Michonne to be left out of the Rick/Carol/Daryl triumvirate of decision-makers? I feel like she's earned the right to be included.

 

I think Michonne's earned the right less than Glenn, and he was left out.  Rick obviously wanted to keep it to his most trusted people.

[kikismom]

I'm a bit frightened that Aaron DID hear the conversation between Rick Carol and Daryl, and since he thought Daryl was out on the street possibly as a lookout that the spaghetti dinner with motorcycle was waiting to lure Daryl inside. I just think Aaron is better at sneaking around than anyone else at ASZ, and that shit about he and Eric being outsiders just like you Daryl was a little dubious.

I say this loving Ross Marquand's performance and wanting him to be a good guy...but I am still feeling I don't know for sure.

Just want to add that the encore is playing, and it is so creepy that Daryl is watching the party house from behind a tree in the dark, and when he steps forward and crosses the street to the sidewalk...Aaron's front porch light goes on and Aaron steps out immediately.

[Yolapukka]

I wish Jessie wasn't such a flat bland character.  Everything she said was so forgettable that I really had trouble recalling her last sentence while she was completing a current one. There is still something really off about Pete, even when he's not heavy-handedly referring to Jessie as My wife.

 

I am instantly, irrationally shipping Sasha and Spencer, the anti-Aiden. Damn. So which one of the boys would mom love best? I felt for Sasha when she had what seemed to be an anxiety attack. The complacency of these people is more disturbing than the idea that they are up to something nefarious. I think Deanna needs to find a place for people because it makes them manageable and she believes, with some justification when it comes to her own people, that she knows best about what is good for them and much of that means being led by her. They need better security and  I am shocked that they don't seem to have any sort of full-time watch-tower schedule, given how organized everything else is. Maybe organized isn't the best word, perhaps controlled is a better word. 

 

Rick is creeping me out.

 

Noodle night with the boys was a much better call for Daryl than the cocktail party. I never need to see Daryl drunk again. Colour me shocked that he seems to have committed to settling in so quickly.

 

The cocktail party was hugely disturbing to me, this is a community that still sees themselves as safe enough to all gather in one place, and have multiple drinks after dark. I could go on a long time about all the grounds that make that foolish. Leaving their armoury unguarded, well honestly, it's not guarded, merely managed, seems like a terribly foolish thing to do when everyone is occupied. They have kids that feel safe enough to slip away and follow people they don't know. I understand why Carol did it, but for a character that has done a lot of ruthless, polarizing, disturbing things, threatening to kidnap that kid and leave him to the walkers was one of the most unsetting and upsetting things I've ever seen her do. In essence though, If CDB doesn't impose their vision on this Utopia, she would, in effect be leaving the boy to walkers or something nearly as bad. I still didn't like it.

Edited March 9, 2015 by yuggapukka

[Irishmaple]

I do believe I've been out there too long because that cocktail party made me twitchy.  The established population of Alexandria are way too comfortable.  So comfortable they can't even see how lucky they've been.  They have no clue.  I'm with Sasha all the way.  The fuck, people?  You're worried about dinner?  Sasha just ate feral dog because there was nothing else around.  I need Rick and the group to sit down with Deanna, and tell her exactly what the world is like.  There are Governors who will take everything you have.  There are Grady cops who keep women for sex.  There are cannibals who invite you to their sanctuary so they can take your stuff and then eat you.  This is the world, Deanna.  Alexandria is real, sure, but it isn't the world now.  Characters like Sasha who can't take the unsettling and complacent normality, Rick who doesn't believe in it, and Carol who is actively undermining it are my people here.

 

As a Richonne shipper, I have no problem with Jessie.  She seems like a nice person.  She's full of shit, but seems genuinely nice.  I hated her we got good stuff from that inconvenient Zombie Apocalypse speech.  She's talking to a man whose son shot his wife in the head moments after she gave birth on the filthy floor of a prison.  After watching everything Camp Dinner Bell went through, that speech made me ragey.  It just underlines how sheltered and lucky Alexandria is, yet I like that Rick is torn now.  He wants normality for Judith and Carl; but he doesn't believe in it.  He feels more himself outside the walls, dealing with the threats that have become familiar.  But normality is good for Judith and Carl, and Jessie is pretty and healthy and smells nice, and she's nice to him.  I can see why he would be drawn to her.  She represents everything he lost and the possibility he might get it back.  That there's a life that doesn't include zombies and Governors and cannibals and that he can be a guy who can come back from everything he did to survive.  But Rick's pretty far gone now and that rings true too.  He can come partway back, but he's not Rick Grimes, season one edition, anymore.  He is a scary guy who has been irrevocably changed by his experiences and that really stands out in Alexandria.  

 

I'd like to see more of that attitude from Carl.  He was worried about getting too soft, but he's settling in quickly.  I'd rather he stayed edgy like Carol, Rick and Sasha.  I enjoyed watching the rest of the group settle in though.  Maggie and Rosita looked lovely, Glenn seems happy, Abraham found beer and Judith was reunited with her Solo cup.  I loved watching Carol tonight; she was all sweet and kind of coy with Tobin and Olivia, and then dead-eyed and chilling with Sam who will probably never sleep again just in case.  She's the only one who seems fully committed to the takeover plan too; Daryl's willing to give Aaron's job a chance, Rick hesitated before taking the gun, but Carol looked ready.  I seriously would not cross Carol.  I don't ever want to be on her bad side.              

Edited March 9, 2015 by Irishmaple

[BrokenRemote]

Just want to add that the encore is playing, and it is so creepy that Daryl is watching the party house from behind a tree in the dark, and when he steps forward and crosses the street to the sidewalk...Aaron's front porch light goes on and Aaron steps out immediately.

 

Yeah, and I'm almost certain Aaron was listening to Rick, Carol and Daryl in the woods.  He's keeping things to himself for now, though, which tells me he understands how much they need Rick and his group, maybe moreso than Deanna.

[Enero]

I agree. If someone told my kid that, the first he would do is come and tell his father and I, because he'd believe we could keep him safe. And I think it would be much worse to say he saw in the guns than telling people she's threatening to leave him to the walkers.

This is another one of those situations like Shane and Otis at the school. It just really pisses me off how little forethought went into it. She absolutely needed a lookout! Someone should have been hanging around outside to distract and divert anyone who came by. They knew it couldn't be Rick because he would be too missed, and they couldn't use Daryl because people are watching him. So you couldn't let ONE MORE person in the group in on your plan? You can trust your damn group. Use Abraham or Rosita. I guarantee they'd be down.

I completely agree. Whoever said that Carol and Rick are being overconfident was right. Carol was so sure she was invisible and that no one would follow her, only for someone to be following her and see what she was up to. I absolutely believe this conversation will not remain secret. That boy is going to tell and when he does there is going to be trouble for group.

Regarding the rest of the episode, I kinda liked the senator's husband and of course the Aaron/Darryl scenes. Rick is acting like he's out of his mind. I don't know if he's turned on by Jessie because it's been awhile since he's seen a clean "beautiful" woman, but his behavior is unnerving. I'm also not liking or understanding why he has not told any of the others about keeping a few weapons on hand or about how close the 'Wolves' are getting. I can understand him not telling the whole group but I think at the very least Glenn and even Michonne should be in the loop.

Speaking of Michonne, I really miss her relationship with Carl. After all they've been through, how he's confided in her and she in him they have not had two words to say to each other about this new place, adjusting to it etc. it's just strange. I feel as though they had one of the strongest bonds on the show only for it to now be ignored.

I feel terrible for Sasha. She's been through so much in such a short period of time. She lost Tyrese and Bob within weeks of each other. I think it's going to be a long time, if ever before she's feels some semblance of being okay.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Enero

[The Mighty Peanut]

The difference to me is that Michonne earned the right by knowing what she's gone through.  Right now, Deanna has known Sasha a few days and she and her clean house and comfy bed and "why worry about walkers?" can just go right to hell.

 

You may be right about Sasha needing an outsider to really see what's going on with her, but I don't think Deanna is that person.

Agreed. I don't know if Deanna is governor levels of bad -- I'm leaning towards well-meaning with a hefty splash of scruples -- but she is unhealthily invested in ASZ as a Utopian society. Maybe Sasha is equally as unhealthily invested in an irredeemable post-apocalyptic shithole. Michonne is in between.

[BrokenRemote]

I miss Michonne and Carl, too.  When Rick, Michonne and the kids were walking toward Terminus, I felt Michonne and Carl bonded so much.  I felt they bonded far more than Rick and Michonne ever did--he confided in her about his fears, about himself and his father, and it seems weird that they don't talk at all anymore.  

Agreed. I don't know if Deanna is governor levels of bad -- I'm leaning towards well-meaning with a hefty splash of scruples -- but she is unhealthily invested in ASZ as a Utopian society. Maybe Sasha is equally as unhealthily invested in an irredeemable post-apocalyptic shithole. Michonne is in between.

Yeah, but on the other hand, nobody in Sasha's "family" has even bothered to notice how much pain she's in. Deanna at least made an attempt.

[kikismom]

Why do y'all think, and do you think it was the right decision, for Michonne to be left out of the Rick/Carol/Daryl triumvirate of decision-makers? I feel like she's earned the right to be included.

 

 

I think Michonne's earned the right less than Glenn, and he was left out.  Rick obviously wanted to keep it to his most trusted people.

It was not about people he trusted or didn't trust; if you catch the dialogue he and the other 2 agree that the others seem to want to make it here (ASZ) more.

Obviously from Glenn and Michonne's statements about going there, those 2 definitely are more ready for this than Rick Carol and Daryl. He asked the other 2 to keep it quiet so that if it wasn't necessary, then the others could have a chance.

[BrokenRemote]

It was not about people he trusted or didn't trust; if you catch the dialogue he and the other 2 agree that the others seem to want to make it here (ASZ) more.

Obviously from Glenn and Michonne's statements about going there, those 2 definitely are more ready for this than Rick Carol and Daryl. He asked the other 2 to keep it quiet so that if it wasn't necessary, then the others could have a chance.

 

I suppose you're right.  I still feel that if push came to shove, Rick's "core" would be the people he's been with since the beginning: Carol, Daryl and Glenn.

[Portia]

Wow, Carol, way to take your cues from the Child Abuser's Handbook. Did you learn that messed-up shit from Ed?

CDB gang is going to feel really bad when they discover that Father Pee Pants has been trapped in a closet for days and they didn't even notice he was gone.

Please, please tell me Darryl's new gay friends will stage a makeover montage for him next week.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

When you create and produce an episode that depicts Daryl as the lone sane and compassionate person, you've done something (right, or wrong).

 

As dumb as it might be, watching horses get gang-eaten will never get easier.  "Not much good for Buttons now... but he's still good as Glue!"

 

Carol.  Hol-eeee sheee-it!  That scene was fucking intense.  For just a slight millisecond, I really thought she was gonna end that kid.  "Umm, as appealing as being tied to a tree and getting eaten alive sounds, I really like cookies."   or  "Bitch, you think that scares me?!  I just came from one of those GD dinner parties.  You're gonna have to try harder than that!"

 

Sasha.  Woman, pull it together just a bit.  I know normality sucks, but it beats dying.  I like you.  You are just asking to get it, like literally.  "My favorite meal is what you worry about!?  When Carol just threatened a kid over cookies?  Bitch, please."

 

Rick.  *sigh*  They are really going there.  TD had it right, he does seem to be going 'caveman'.  That reaching for the pistol as he watched J/P walk off?  Wondered if he was gonna pull it and the Python out, to give a demonstration to Jessie.  "This pistol = Pete.  This big Python = me.  Now get that sweet ass over here where it belongs, woman.".   Also, talk about Obvious Anvil being Obvious, them flashing the red "A" at each other, along with smiles?  Either they do it behind Pete's back or Pete's leaving soon (by way of Rick, if what shown tonight is anything to go by).

 

That scene at the end, where Rick is listening to the walker and caressing the wall?  Disturbing as fuck.  I don't care what the meaning was for.  And how the F did he hear that lone walker from the street?  Not so much. 

Edited March 9, 2015 by iRarelyWatchTV36

[Luckylyn]

Why do y'all think, and do you think it was the right decision, for Michonne to be left out of the Rick/Carol/Daryl triumvirate of decision-makers? I feel like she's earned the right to be included.

It's terrible that Rick didn't even confide in Michonne about the signs that the Unfair Wolves might be near.   It's like Rick has decided that since he and Michonne disagree about their approaches to Alexandria that he won't trust her anymore.  After all they've been through, Rick should know he can be honest with Michonne.   Maybe he's afraid she'd be able to talk him out of his take over and that's why he won't include her in his meetings with Rick/Carol/Daryl.  Lack of communication is going to end up leading to something horrible, I think.

 

I was kinda disappointed that no one in the group figured out Rick/Carol/Darryl plotting.  No one in CDB thought it odd that Rick was taking Carol out for "shooting lessons."   I totally thought Carol was going to be thwarted by Michonne catching her in the act of stealing the guns because I assumed Michonne would notice something was up.  They kept talking about Carol being invisible but that should only be to the Alexandrians.  CDB knows Carol and should have realized there was plotting going on.

[Bad Example]

 Rick is acting like he's out of his mind. I don't know if he's turned on by Jessie because it's been awhile since he's seen a clean "beautiful" woman, but his behavior is unnerving. 

 

The only thing I have to say in his defense is that he seems like he is being set up for this at every turn.  Last week it was the overly touch-feely haircut.  This week Jessie practically posed in the doorway with a ray of light around her head while she held Judith, looking like every dream Rick has to have for a normal family life.  

 

I don't hate Jessie.  I just don't trust her.  

[kikismom]

I did like when Abe does his live by sword, die by the sword, it's on your back and it's off and it's on again and Michonne looks at him and asks How much have you had to drink?

[tricknasty]

I'm confused

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Why do y'all think, and do you think it was the right decision, for Michonne to be left out of the Rick/Carol/Daryl triumvirate of decision-makers? I feel like she's earned the right to be included.

You would think so, unless Rick thought having both Constables go would arouse suspicion.

Really hope Aaron is what he seems, starting to like him and his BF Eric.

Plus he can handle himself pretty well.

[peach]

It was not about people he trusted or didn't trust; if you catch the dialogue he and the other 2 agree that the others seem to want to make it here (ASZ) more.

Obviously from Glenn and Michonne's statements about going there, those 2 definitely are more ready for this than Rick Carol and Daryl. He asked the other 2 to keep it quiet so that if it wasn't necessary, then the others could have a chance.

 

I was getting ready to type the same thing.  He's doing it as protection, not lack of trust.  I like the irony that he was the one who banished Carol from the prison, but now turns to her without hesitation with his own plans.

[vibeology]

Rick better be playing a game with the blonde chick because that pisses me off that Rick kissed Jesse.  Ew ew ew ew.  Rick you dumbass. Michonne is RIGHT THERE. 

 

She put on a dress and everything! 

 

I'm not really a shipper, but I want to watch interesting characters. Jesse isn't really all that interesting. There hasn't been much time to develop her and Rick is already clearly into her. It doesn't make much sense from Rick, who is closed off and slow to trust and there hasn't been anything special in her personality to explain his level of interest.

 

Carol is a terrifying badass. Once that kid showed up, I think she made the best of the situation. Its a horrible thing but how else does she maintain her place in the community?

[English Teacher]

The scary thing is, I think Daryl HAS taken a shower...his skin is not as grimy. But I don't know if he knows what shampoo is.

Just put my dog down, so my tolerance for watching animals killed is at a -2,090,000. That scene was impossible to watch and triggered another epic breakdown. Thanks, writers.

Carol? Damn. She is using what she knows. Abusers use fear to keep their victims quiet. I'm sure "love able" Ed used that on her and her daughter plenty. She goes with what she knows and she has proven over and over that she will do anything for the good off the group. Love the juxtaposition of Donna Reed Carol and Freddy Krueger Carol. Brilliant and chilling.

And Rick? He's a long burning fuse. This will prove interesting.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who feared drunk Abe would hit on Michonne. I grimaced all through that scene.

I can't remember...who saw the Avalanche of walker heads with W's on them....Rick or Daryl? I was surprised they didn't make a connection yet.

Edited March 9, 2015 by English Teacher

[peach]

I did like when Abe does his live by sword, die by the sword, it's on your back and it's off and it's on again and Michonne looks at him and asks How much have you had to drink?

 

Yes!  And I also liked her contemplating her plastic cocktail sword, that she could probably kill you with, or at least blind you in one eye, if it came down to it.

[Bad Example]

CDB gang is going to feel really bad when they discover that Father Pee Pants has been trapped in a closet for days and they didn't even notice he was gone.

Please, please tell me Darryl's new gay friends will stage a makeover montage for him next week.

 

Yes.

 

And YES, PLEASE!  

[Luckylyn]

I'm so conflicted about Aaron.  I like the character and enjoy his interactions with the characters.  Yet, I don't trust him.   His work as a recruiter means he's basically an experienced spy.   I want him to be one of the good guys, but I just can't make up my mind about him.  

[Pete Martell]

Noodle night with the boys was a much better call for Daryl than the cocktail party. I never need to see Daryl drunk again. Colour me shocked that he seems to have committed to settling in so quickly.

 

Daryl is a follower, and with Rick being distant and weird, it's easy for him to be brought in, especially since Aaron and Eric are also outsiders. 

 

I'm just going to feel sorry for him if this turns out to be a con. I imagine it will be like that gif where the man is weeping rivers and rivers of tears down his face.

 

I hope it's not a total con and it's not one of those friendships that is dropped - I like the idea of America's favorite hero/emo stud being BFF with a gay guy, and even better, a gay guy who is not 100% Butch Butcherson and whose partner seems to be president of the Quentin Crisp Fan Club.

[RedheadZombie]

I don't understand why Rick would rather the group look insane, rather than have a little sit down with Deanna.  You see it all started with these guys named Dave and Tony.  Then we met this guy calling himself Governor, running a town called Woodbury.  We stumbled upon a sanctuary named Terminus, where the cannibals almost killed us all.  Luckily we escaped, but they managed to eat Bob's leg.  And if that wasn't bad enough, Grady is now run by a rapey group of former cops, who run people over before bringing them in for treatment.  There is no reason that I can fathom that they're keeping these things secret.

 

I accept Jessie. Because I think it's likely she'll die for Rick's manpain. And I'd much rather that than lose Michonne.

 

I don't know if I believe Jessie's going to die.  I think her hubby is conveniently going to be an alcoholic wife beater.  Rick's going to righteously kill him, then they'll comfort each other.  Her husband has to die - he's a doctor.  Also, Rick is the aggressor.  She may be overly friendly, but she's clearly mentioning her husband.  She seemed surprised and a little uncomfortable about the kiss.  I'm not ready to hate her yet.   I think Rick surprised himself by kissing her, but he certainly didn't look embarrassed or apologetic after the fact.  At this point, I could see Rick's obvious interest being the cause of Jessie's abuse.

[Dusty]

 

the same way that Sasha doesn't see ASZ as real.

 

Honestly I'm having a hard time as seeing them as real.  Everytime they speak I just want to look around like "Is this for real?"  They have absolutely no clue.  I get that they've been mainly sheltered but has it been so long since the world has gone to hell that they forgot what it was like during the brief period of time they were out there in the chaos? Or have none of them been out in the chaos except for Aaron and his bf?  That I find hard to believe.  The military in the whole world couldn't contain this and they think they're safe because they have walls?  I can understand that they haven't experienced what CDB has because it's just been extreme.  Forget the Governor and cannibals.  ZOMBIES HAVE OVERTAKEN!  Let's not be so blasé. about it.  Rick practically rolled his eyes out of his head when all that was keeping the window locked from the gun store was a latch. That to me is just insane but hey. Maybe I've been out there too long like the rest of them.

 

I do hope Alexandria works out.  I think there's only so much of just walking around but these people need a serious wake up call to the world they're living in.  There needs to be some sort of medium of CDB way of thinking and Alexandria.

 

 

Why do y'all think, and do you think it was the right decision, for Michonne to be left out of the Rick/Carol/Daryl triumvirate of decision-makers? I feel like she's earned the right to be included.

 

I so want Michonne to be part of group of decision makers but I understand why she's not.  She wants SO BAD for it to work out that I don't think she would even want to be part of it.  If she could be that voice a reason, a little like how Daryl was with the gun thing then yeah but she's on the total opposite ends of this right now.  Michonne, your katana is not a home decoration.  That sealed it for me as to why she's not part of the triumvirate.

[Persnickety1]

Didn't they establish earlier in the series that the walkers don't attack animals, just humans?  Or am I remembering that from other zombie movies only?  At one point, I thought there was a dog that could walk freely around the walkers with no trouble.

 

I recall them taking down Rick's horse and eating it in season 1.

 

I can't wait to watch this episode when I'm done working.

 

I love me some batshit crazy Carol.  

[mmecorday]

Did anyone else notice that the song playing while Rick kisses Jessie is a piano arrangement of "Away In A Manger?" Just caught that during the re-watch. Considering that Jessie was holding Judith right before the kiss, and the show's tendency for avoiding subtlety whenever possible, perhaps Judith is the light of the world.

[Luckylyn]

If Dr. Pete is an abuser, that could be an intriguing moral dilemma.  Would people turn a blind eye to abuse because he's the only doctor?   That could give him a position of power because you don't want to piss off the guy you might need to save your life later.

[HalcyonDays]

I literally yelled out 'OMG Carol" when she threatened that kid. Holy cow - Carol will not mess around.

 

Rick - what are you doing kissing Jessie, with her husband wandering around near by. C'mon dude. Also, him standing at the wall, just staring at it - he's losing his mind, as is Carol.

 

Michonne - don't put your katana on the wall. Carry it with you. I know it's symbolic, but still. Also, Abraham was hilarious, but I swear he was hitting on her.

 

Totally get where Sasha is coming from. She just lost Bob and Tyreese recently. She's PTSD and she's struggling with everything. A cute little cocktail party isn't going to heal her (or the others) anytime soon.

 

Daryl "bonding" with Aaron. I actaully like Aaron - he seems like a good guy. BUT NOT THE HORSE. WHY THE HORSE!! Poor baby survived for months on his/her own (the horse) . Daryl turning down the gun was out of character to me, though he rarely uses a gun, so...but still. Daryl being complacent before Rick and Carol. I don't know.

 

Where on earth is the liquor store because man, did they have lots of booze around. Beer has a shelf life, but the other alcohol doesn't, which is good.

 

I don't blame any of them for not wanting to socialize. I mean, Sasha yelling at the woman was dead on - these ASZ residents are naive and I don't think any of them really understand how rough it is out there. They have been living a mostly pampered existance - they have no clue at all.

 

What was that stupid stamp on their hands for though? I thought for sure it would be a W. It's a A (Adultery??) but what was the point?

 

I like the comment though, when Daryl is the sane one of the group...man. Oh, and that cheery song at the end just made me laugh.

[editorgrrl]

Please, please tell me Darryl's new gay friends will stage a makeover montage for him next week.

Well, Daryl got gussied up for the party—showered and wore sleeves. (On which he then wiped his spaghettied mouth. Baby steps.)

[truelovekiss]

CDB knows Carol and should have realized there was plotting going on.

Abso-frickin-lutely! For as much as they go on about being a family, (which they totally are, and it's my favorite part of the show) they don't seem to pick up on a lot of the more subtle things that you learn about a person only through spending a lot of time with them. Carol's Suzie Homemaker ruse should have sent up huge red flags for CDB, as they all know damn well what she's capable of, and it's obvious that they're trying to hide it.

[peach]

Daryl is a follower, and with Rick being distant and weird, it's easy for him to be brought in, especially since Aaron and Eric are also outsiders. 

 

Well, Daryl doesn't have much place to be bothered by distant and weird.  Iol  I don't think he's seemed bothered by Rick's doings at all until he did a sudden 180 over being accepted by some guy he just met.  Rick accepted him and has treated him as his trusted brother for a long, long time, and it's just totally unbelievable to me that he's now going to "follow" Aaron after 24 hours of "bonding," unless there's more to his feelings, and he's now inspired by a Jessie of his own.  TPTB did plenty of hinting over the season break that Daryl "could" be gay.  Or not. 

Edited March 9, 2015 by peach