S05.E16: Amster-Damn

[film noire]

 

The Richards sisters' synchronized finger point made me laugh and inspired my creativity. :)

LOL  (I've been singing my own tribute to Kim off & on since the episode, using Blondie's "Heart of

Glass"   -- "Once I did drugs / and it was a blast / Soon turned out / Had glass in my pants".) 

 

 

As sad as Kim is over the thought her kids might walk away, she brought it on herself.

 

Addicts are exhausting -- they suck the life and joy and freedom  out of those closest to them -- I hope her children cut off all contact until the woman finally gets sober (which she isn't now; even if she isn't using, she's still a vicious, selfish, arrogant dry drunk.)

Edited March 6, 2015 by film noire

[AnnA]

LOL  (I've been singing my own tribute to Kim off & on since the episode, using Blondie's "Heart of

Glass"   -- "Once I did drugs / and it was a blast / Soon turned out / Had glass in my pants".) 

 

Good one!

Kim may be a mean, miserable individual but at least we're having fun.

She's such a liar. There's no way she managed to get glass in her pants. I'm not sure she even got a drop of wine on her. Either she has cat-like reflexes or she knew it was coming her way.

[BlackMamba]

I just saw Kyle on Extra and she said the reunion was 'intense' and that a few of them didn't leave their homes for days after it was filmed.

These women are so dramatic Edited March 6, 2015 by BlackMamba

[Giselle]

Good one!

Kim may be a mean, miserable individual but at least we're having fun.

She's such a liar. There's no way she managed to get glass in her pants. I'm not sure she even got a drop of wine on her. Either she has cat-like reflexes or she knew it was coming her way.

 

God protects fools, drunks and children. She is two out of three, well, all three if you count her stunted emotional growth.

[zoeysmom]

Another voice chimes in on Brandi Glanvillian's account of this episode:

 

http://tamaratattles.com/2015/03/05/brandi-glanville-is-profoundly-stupid/#more-14640

[zoeysmom]

Geez Harry stepped in to defend his wife:  http://www.enstarz.com/articles/71653/20150305/harry-hamlin-news-lisa-rinnas-husband-tweets-about-her-rhobh-feud-with-kim-richards-video.htm

[bosawks]

I just saw Kyle on Extra and she said the reunion was 'intense' and that a few of them didn't leave their homes for days after it was filmed.

Well, to be fair, there is a better than average chance that Kim couldn't find a door leading out....

[ryebread]

Your caption was much better than mine.  Thank you!

 

I think Kim's caption should be "I'm about to lose control and I think I like it."

 

Cleaning up the breakfast dishes this a.m., one of the Atlanta reunions was on in the background.  Lisa Wu told Kim Z that if she doesn't watch her mouth, "I'm gonna flip you over that couch."  Complete with pointy finger.  I LOL'd because back when Wu said that, I remember getting all verklempt because..."Oooo, a threat of physical violence".  After watching Rinna go for a throat grab and shatter a glass, that seems like such a kinder, gentler time. LOL 

[chlban]

Another voice chimes in on Brandi Glanvillian's account of this episode:

 

http://tamaratattles.com/2015/03/05/brandi-glanville-is-profoundly-stupid/#more-14640

Hilarious. I think Fucknut is my new favorite.

[rehoboth]

There have been lots of scenes like that over the years. I noticed it on Poker Night when Kim confided she had taken a pill, and Kyle didn't even seem cognizant that it meant Kim had relapsed. She talked about the positive of Kim not hiding that from her, but it was Brandi of all people who outed Kim's pain pill relapse in a TH, not Kyle. For someone who has had an addict sister her entire adult life, you would think she gets the drill and notices the behavioral changes, but instead she always seems surprised and asks "what's wrong with you?" She doesn't seem to have the awareness or resignation of a long-term sufferer that I've seen in others in her place. I think the reasons are this: 1) she's not that sharp; and 2) she doesn't want to know. She was raised to ignore it and not ask questions. Stay in denial. She needs Al-Anon so badly.

I have a different take on Kyle's reaction to Kim.  I think that Kyle has seen Kim on drugs for so much of her life that Kyle is asking not "What's wrong with you?" but "What's wrong with you (this time)?"  Kim is always on something and I do think they are (mostly) prescribed by her doctor(s) whether they are for anxiety or pain for cosmetic surgery.  Kyle stated after Poker Night that Kim was acting the same way that night as she did when Kyle knew she was using (abusing) Xanax.  And I think that is why she was really scared of Brandi's involvement with Kim.

 

I picture Kim as having a vanity table full of pill bottles that she sits at each day and figures out what she will 'need' to use.  I imagine that when she was drinking in combo with her pills, the family was in constant worry about finding her dead each and every day.  At least now she is presumably only using drugs that have been prescribed to her and a doctor is sharing in the responsibility that is Kim Richards.

 

 Kim is a habitual liar.  I think that affects her kids as much as anything she does to herself.  And the fact that she may have told the truth about taking Monty's medication is a small step forward in the grand scheme of things.

[ryebread]

ETA: Taking it to Lisa R's thread.

Edited March 6, 2015 by ryebread

[chlban]

 The main thing that gave me pause about a poster being a certain HW had to do with the similarity of the grammatical errors in comparison with the blogs. In no way do my suspicions come from it being impossible for me to believe that Brandi and/or Kim could have fans and supporters.

Charlie Manson has fans and supporters, so yeah I guess it's not that impossible to believe.

 

I did love the scenes of Holland, I had never really appreciated how beautiful it is and I would have loved to see inside one of those windmills. Too bad Yolanda's  old squeeze didn't invite us inside, sort of  a BRAVO  version of House Hunters International.   I would have preferred that to watching Brandi throw another fit because (surprise) all the other housewives wish she just wasn't there and do their best to pretend she isn't.  

[selhars]

 

You know what I want for this show?  I want seven Eileens!  I want seven women with decent manners and good upbringing who have lots of money and allow us to see how they spend it.  If they have their little sins, let us see them, but stop with the glass-throwing, the shouting, and the constant problems!  There are enough problems in life -- ENTERTAIN ME!!

 

^^Perfectly stated, thank you. Are you listening ANDY? Please.....

I've only been watching THIS HV for 2 1/2 seasons. I've likes Lisa VP, Yolanda, and the two new additions Lisa R. and Eileen.

They all (until now Lisa R.) seem to just want to enjoy being on a nice little reality show. They're mature enough to enjoy the ride -- and chill.

Lisa VP's talking heads are always very "really, darling?" Eileen and Yolanda seem to have no intention of acting stupid on the show. And I would have said the same about Lisa R, who does seem to be an "I'm game for anything" kind of person. I know her family is a touchy issue. But even so, I just don't know why she snapped violently like that. SOMEthing else must have been going on. Why couldn't she have said, "talk about my family and I'll cut you off at the knees. Now bring it if you want to. But heed my words. Now let's have dinner. Where's the menu?"

Edited March 6, 2015 by selhars

[ryebread]

The main thing that gave me pause about a poster being a certain HW had to do with the similarity of the grammatical errors in comparison with the blogs. In no way do my suspicions come from it being impossible for me to believe that Brandi and/or Kim could have fans and supporters.

 

Charlie Manson has fans and supporters, so yeah I guess it's not that impossible to believe.  

 

I'm no fan or Brandi or Kim's (and obviously that must be said lest I be accused of being one of them).  And I rarely post in their defense, but are you saying that the posters here who don't continually post their hatred and contempt of them for page after page, are as...um...'confused' as the supporters of Charles Manson? 

 

If so, I VEHEMENTLY disagree with that.  This episode has been derisive for sure. Andy planned it that way and many took the bait.  Fussing and discussing over it just like Bravo wanted.  If everyone was on the same page about every one of these Hos, we'd have about 8 pages of high fives and discussion on how to disfigure Kim. Fabulous.

 

But yeah, I would have preferred to see more of Holland and less of the bad behavior, too.

 

ETA:  Because 'bait' and 'bail' are not the same.

Edited March 6, 2015 by ryebread

[Sincerely Yours]

I dunno, this is just my experience with being around unstable people who curse at you, get in your face and make threats.  My arms get allllll up when that happens. 

 

Yes, her sitting down to dinner, was her performing at her job.  Her job, being a wash-up, coked-out child celeb on a reality tv show, which showcases her life and relationships.  Her life, as we've seen it, revolves around relationships with alcohol, turtles, chicken salad, pain pills, fancy blouses, a fleeing sister, fingers, a bitey dog, and one lipstick dildo.    

 

Again, her actions this season are not in a vacuum.  Every other interaction the other HW have had with her, also comes into play.  Her attitude towards "this pill" has actually had more to do with this season' storyline than the pill itself.  If she even gave the teeny tiniest fuck about how she behaves when high, and was actually apologetic for that, much of this would not have happened.  People are not going to drop a subject when someone acts a fool and then tries to hand wave it.  She controlled this season's storyline more than anyone. 

 

Kim is actually responsible for herself and her feelings and her actions.  If she isn't and everyone else is, then why get on everyone else's case for trying to manage her?  It can't be both ways.  It can't be "Kim has no autonomy or responsibility over her actions.  She's an addict.  She's a bee or a bear or cat." and then in the same breath say that "Everyone needs to leave Kim alone because her behavior is her business".  If she cannot manage herself, someone else will.  Now maybe she needs to be committed, I dunno, but whatever it is, it needs to be done away from the last HW show I watch.  lol 

The point that is being missed is that she hasn't stumbled in, event after event after event screaming and cursing on something just because. She hasn't created volatile situations by aggressive actions this whole season. Poker night was the only time she was rude, aggressive and making a scene from the BEGINNING. After poker night the only behavior that was annoying that was all her without being provoked was that scavenger hunt where she was being bitchy and she wasn't the only one and the airport where again she was being bitchy which I didn't find the need for anyone to have the vapors. Roll their eyes maybe, mumble "what a bitch" maybe but that's it. 

 

This is all about her past and the POTENTIAL for her to become a problem. This is all about trying to nip it in the but before it reaches the level of past seasons Kim. It's all about what everyone FEARS and doesn't want to happen not about what has happened. It's turned into a haze of blaming Kim this season but what they aren't doing is seeing EACH incident for what it really was, how it really went down, why what was said was said, the really bad timing the worst forums and approach, inappropriate players and the such.  It's all a series of ill timed, badly worded, lightly veiled animosity all rolled up in this ludicrous We're Scared for Kim burrito. It's not dealt with logically or sensibly it's handled with emotion and dealing with someone in Kim's position emotionally is the most ridiculous thing you can do. If you can't brace yourself and gather your resolve before tackling such and endeavor then you're the stupid one.

 

Also why can't people drop it? Do people really get held hostage like that? I mean aside from Kyle and even Brandi who are involved more than the average acquaintance.  Over another person they barely know? Work with on occasion? Can't move on unless every little detail adds up and is in place? Really? That's the other convenient reasoning that doesn't jive with me. Look I'm all about the angle that they care and no one wants anything bad to happen I just don't feel like these women are actually coming from that place. I'm sure they feel that way of course but that's not what's driving their interactions with Kim. Now it's all about attacking her, holding her accountable and becoming yet another bunch of obstacles she has to deal with during her ongoing struggle. Tell you what. If I'm fed up with an addict that is somewhat incorporated in my life then that's that but I sure as hell ain't going to LOOK for any extra confrontations if I can help it and for the ones that creep up? Nearest bathroom with the case of the "runs" if that's what it boils down to. Not that hard, not that serious Kim can "get away" with whatever. I'd be all, Oh well I ain't in it. This isn't rocket science there are ways to work around. I'm sure their "obligation" to Bravo gets in the way but come on it can't be that hard minimize the interaction. Geez louise! 

Edited March 6, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[rehoboth]

 

 

 

Kim does have 'dead shark eyes.'

 

Amazing to see these scenes again.  In the bottom scene, Kim has also told Kyle that she thinks that she may be pregnant.  I think I would have lost total control peed my pants right there.  Luckily Kyle knows not to believe a thing she says.

[janie2002]

I find it mind boggling that Kim and Brandi don't want to be discussed for being addicts or drunks, this is a job. Kim has shown up high as fawk to several tapings and she doesn't want her coworkers to address it.

If Susie in accounting showed up drunk to work as much as Kim has, I'm sure all the office would discuss, hell she wouldve been fired a long time ago.SMDH

Brandi's blog is crazy, she is losing it. 

[quinn]

Interesting that in her blog, Brandi says that LisaR threw ice water at Kim before she broke the wine glass. But, she also says that Lisa broke the glass in their faces. They were all standing and Lisa broke the glass on the edge of the table which is still dangerous and unacceptable, but it wasn't in or toward their faces. Is that more hyperbole?

 

I'm awful because as much as I hate that LisaR lost her shit like that. A part of me totally laughed and said to myself "Rinna will cut a bitch if she doesn't back up off her man." My husband and I rewound that several times and he kept saying "damn, that bitch is gangsta (because she broke the glass and was holding the stem like a shiv." Then he made the best joke ever (I love that he will watch this one reality show with me). He was like "Where's Harry Hamlin with Medusa's head to turn Kim into stone? That woman is a Kracken if ever there was one."

 

I was appalled and horrified by the attempted throat grab and glass smash, but on a later viewing after I became inured, I said to the TV, "see Brandi Glanville, those two [Lisa Rinna and Kim Richards] are gangstas.  You can cuss and threaten all day long, but yous a wanksta!"

 

My other thought was, "looks like going Medford, Oregon on someone's ass trumps going Oklahoma."

Edited March 6, 2015 by quinn

[zoeysmom]

I think the most shocking thing I have read in the past 24 hours is that Brandi not only expected Kyle to "defend" Kim during her tirade but thought she should throw her body in front of Kim's to prevent potential harm to Kim from the thrown liquid and glass shards from Lisa R. breaking the glass.  Funny thing is I didn't see Brandi defending Kim-I saw her at one point pulling at her to stop her verbal assaults on Lisar and Eileen.

[parisprincess]

I agree that these people should drop all the nonsense about past grievances but that's not likely to happen with any of them.  While KELLY should let go of their Kim obsession, Kim needs to stop constantly blaming Kyle for not being there for her, and always trying to lay guilt on her for never doing enough.  Kim really does treat Kyle horrendously with her forever telling Kyle that Kathy and Brandi care more than Kyle does.  The only thing Kyle could do that would make Kim happy is to be her biggest enabler and validate her endless maladies that give her an excuse to take one pill or another (or several).  Since Kyle won't do it, she's the worst sister imaginable.  Kyle needs to cut ties with Kim and let her continue her downward spiral, which is exactly what is going to happen unless Kim has a sudden burst of self awareness and decides to do what only she can do, and that is to seek help.         

[Sincerely Yours]

Then, Kim needs to leave the damn show. Period. No wiggle room here. If anyone is struggling with mental issues or addiction issues, is being on a tv reality show really the best place for them? It is not a case of whether Kim is an addict, she is an addict. She had a relapse on the show. Her constant whining about her kids finding out if she ever relapses, should have been her priority before she signed on for another season.

 

 

Being on a reality show means all bets are off? You shouldn't expect morality from fellow cast mates? You shouldn't expect them to behave the way they would if the cameras were not on? Meaning I know damn well these women wouldn't have been so inappropriately insertive if they had that Poker night off camera as a regular girls night barely knowing Kim and then afterwards deciding to lose her number. Done deal. If they were doing a TV show together same deal. Go to work, say your lines avoid the nut, go home share with the fam how Kim was cooing at non existent turtles with her number STILL lost and buried. Nah, it's because the cameras are following and they want to put on airs, factoring what the viewers are going to think. They can't behave as dismissive as they would if the cameras were off because how uncaring would THEY look and then the aggravation filters down to Kim and her behavior and the position SHE'S putting them in. Like woah, not my problem. You want to lose my number? Lose it. They would have if it was a closed set on a scripted show. And IMO this is why Kim gets the way she does wondering why oh why these women are hounding and harassing. She knows its cause the cameras are on.

 

I'm sure she's experience the blow off by many, many, many coworkers, acquaintances in the past due to her using and knows that its a decision that's available to them. Lose her number show up for work, get through filming and keep it moving. Just with any other gig. Also, if it wasn't for this topic coming up over and over again I haven't seen an episode (aside from poker night) where she put any addiction behavior on display where the others had to awkwardly trip around making their jobs Oh so hard. So I still don't get it the whole "the HW's shouldn't have to put up with XYZ" at their jobs.

 

Addict or not, she's made it clear what her position was on it being brought up over and over again. Lisa R taking it to a dinner with the other women just screams "this is something that we aren't going to let you forget live down get away from" etc. etc. I mean apology or no apology how long is a slight allowed to linger on for the other women to be subjected before it's allowed to die. I mean what about the poor other women who have to get dragged into the dramatics because Lisa R won't let it go. That's also rude I mean Brandi didn't want to hear it, you KNOW Lisa V didn't, and Kyle? Giiirrrlll she ran screaming from the table. I'm sure Yolanda didn't want the dinner to grow awkward with the varied level of judgements that the other women were having about the state of Kim's sobriety. Yolanda made it clear where she was in her support of whatever Kim needed and yet she has to sit through someone else's heightened level of emotion over it all. This can't be done one on one? That's a big problem for me as well. Causing the other women to be present in your inappropriate moments of "concern for Kim"

Edited March 6, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[zoeysmom]

Kyle has her credibility at stake in all of this.  For her to just defend Kim by saying she has been sober for the last three years when she knows it is not true and had filmed conversations with Kim admitting to taking "a pain pill".  Families know what creates a breach in sobriety.  Kim breached it.

 

If Kim had been a thief and blamed it on mental illness for the first two seasons and then got help for her kleptomania and the viewers saw Kim enter a room and later one of the items was missing from the room would we be expected to say-well we didn't see her take the object, the fact she has one just like it around her neck would be a false allegation.  To me, it is unfair to place Kyle in the position of defending Kim's very public breaches and then labeling her a bad sister.

[charmed1]

I think Kim is at the part where she's having the Jessie Spano "I'm so excited/I'm so scared" meltdown.

Bwahaha!! I think I just ruptured something. Please keep these ridiculous gifs and photoshop masterpieces coming.

[Sincerely Yours]

LOL  (I've been singing my own tribute to Kim off & on since the episode, using Blondie's "Heart of

Glass"   -- "Once I did drugs / and it was a blast / Soon turned out / Had glass in my pants".) 

 

 

Addicts are exhausting -- they suck the life and joy and freedom  out of those closest to them -- I hope her children cut off all contact until the woman finally gets sober (which she isn't now; even if she isn't using, she's still a vicious, selfish, arrogant dry drunk.)

Such a sad concept for children to cut off their mother.

 

Sometimes people can find a balance when dealing with addicts even if it means a lifetime of strain. Life is hard. You deal with the cards you were given you don't fold and ask for a new one. Although I guess no a days people do. My mother was and she was exhausting but what is life if you don't have unconditional support in your corner? Sad how our resolve gets smaller and smaller generation after generation and it's more acceptable for complete self preservation as opposed to way back in the day where family would endure anything and everything to make sure everyone gets through life as best as they can. It's like nah, if I stress over you I can't have my steak dinners so sorry you have to starve instead of the way it used to be where if I'm having steak and you're eating crumbs then even though Imma have to sacrifice the luxury, we BOTH will  have enough to eat. If I have to fight FOR you even when you don't then so be it. But then again I've lived a very strained life because I'm usually taken advantage of, drained and the such but I have to stay true to what I believe or else I would be even more miserable.

 

Can't look down on someone unless I'm there to help them up. Not my style. These women make me sad because this is what the world is coming to. Fake concern that lasts all of two seconds. Complaining about family to anyone who will listen. Wanted pats on the back for what should be done for family etc. etc. Of course the emotion is strong but the grandstanding is the part I don't get. Reassurance is necessary but dissolving into hysterics is what boggles my mind. These women have been through soooooo much and they can't figure out how to handle this situation with strength, dignity, decorum and restraint? I don't buy that and that's what really angers me. These women have no doubt exhibited strength thru trials in life. We've heard of so many over the seasons but for some reason they are all reduced to screeching sorority girls because Bravo is in tow. Despicable!

Edited March 6, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[MatildaMoody]

That's an awesome idea!  Thank you for the suggestion.

 

I just spent about 20 minutes looking through this thread so I could reply to whoever it was that watched the episode with her husband.  When they watched the scene with Kim making accusations about Harry, he made a joke about Clash of the Titans and Medusa (aka Harry and Kim).  I thought that was hilarious and I'd like to thank her and her husband, who obviously has a great sense of humor.   Unfortunately, I couldn't find it. 

 

Anyway, this one's for you!

 

 

That was me and I officially LOVE this! i am going to show it to my husband when we get home from work.

 

ETA: I should have kept reading before responding, but i still love it!

Edited March 6, 2015 by MatildaMoody

[charmed1]

I just spent about 20 minutes looking through this thread so I could reply to whoever it was that watched the episode with her husband.

Kudos to those of you who can watch your shows with your partners. I forced mine to watch the dinner fight scene. He was thoroughly amused by Kyle running out of the restaurant and then he went downstairs. I didn't mind because he asks too many questions and I can't hear anything. ("Who's that? Is she famous? Why doesn't she like her? Isn't the brown haired one on that other dumb show you watch? You really watch this shit, but you won't let me watch Love & Hip-Hop?") I end up having to rewind most of the show if he's around.

Edited March 6, 2015 by charmed1

[MatildaMoody]

Kudos to those of you who can watch your shows with your partners. I forced mine to watch the dinner fight scene. He was thoroughly amused by Kyle running out of the restaurant and then he went downstairs. I didn't mind because he asks too many questions and I can't hear anything. ("Who's that? Is she famous? Why doesn't she like her? Isn't the brown haired one on that other dumb show you watch? You really watch this shit, but you won't let me watch Love & Hip-Hop?") I end up having to rewind most of the show if he's around.

This is the only reality show my husband will watch with me. He thinks of it as an absurd comedy rather than a reality show, so he tends to get irritated when it goes to dark places. 

[GreatKazu]

Such a sad concept for children to cut off their mother.

 

Sometimes people can find a balance when dealing with addicts even if it means a lifetime of strain. Life is hard. You deal with the cards you were given you don't fold and ask for a new one. Although I guess no a days people do. My mother was and she was exhausting but what is life if you don't have unconditional support in your corner? Sad how our resolve gets smaller and smaller generation after generation and it's more acceptable for complete self preservation as opposed to way back in the day where family would endure anything and everything to make sure everyone gets through life as best as they can.the such but I have to stay true to what I believe or else I would be even more miserable.

 

 

It is a sad concept for people in general to have to cut off the addict. Unlike other diseases, addiction is the one disease where family and friends have to do just that in many cases in order to get the message across that they have had enough and they won't tolerate the behavior the addict is dishing out. I have yet to meet an addict who has gotten clean and sober via enabling.  I remember during the 70s some people with addictions were sent to mental hospitals. Fortunately, things have changed and addiction is better understood. It is a disease. Unlike other diseases where there are several ways to deal with it, addiction has no short-cuts. One must admit and get treatment. Family and friends cannot enable.

 

There is a difference between support and enabling. Many of these relationships develop into co-dependency which further strains the relationship. Yes, children in many cases do have to sever ties with their addict parents in order to remove themselves from the toxicity. I personally know a teen girl who is going through this very thing right now. A couple of years ago she was crying for her father, wishing he were clean and sober, wanting to have her dad be a dad. Unfortunately, he isn't a father because he is an addict. When the father left the home, he tried to maintain a relationship with his daughter, but she soon realized it was filled with heartache, disappointment and pain. He would play those horrible mind games and use manipulation on her to get what he needed. So sad to watch a teen child making such adult decisions like cutting her dad out of her life, but I give that child props for doing what so many adult people cannot do.

 

Kim's children know better than anyone what life is like with Kim. I would never question their choice to cut Kim out of their life if she were to relapse. On the other hand, those were Kim's words. She might have been using her children to garner sympathy. It is not a stretch to watch an addict throwing out the "children" card, much like Brandi does whenever the need to deflect arises. I would be happy to know Kim's children have laid out boundaries to her. Good for them. It is what is necessary when dealing with an addict. Dealing with an addict is abusive in many ways.

Edited March 6, 2015 by GreatKazu

[SistaLadybug]

I consider myself a good and moral person, but I'll tell you right now - I am all for self-preservation.  I believe that you don't allow someone to keep hurting you or yours in order to make them feel better about their bullshit or to make it easier for them to continue to wallow in craziness.

 

I come from a family with several addicts.  These are people I love very much.  They have stolen from me, lied to my face, hurled nasty words at me.  Is that because they don't love me?  No.  It's because they're addicts and nothing in life is more important to them than their next fix and covering up for/excusing their addict behavior.  I will no longer be a party to it and I drew that line many years ago.  They are not welcome in my home because they have stolen from me.  They are not allowed to be alone with my daughter because I consider them dangerous.  I speak to them kindly and with compassion.  I offer hugs and kisses when I see them.  I love them.  I love myself and my child more.

 

There is no way in the world that it makes sense to stand back and allow someone to abuse you because they have a problem with substances.  As awful as it is (and I know how awful it is because I have witnessed it firsthand for years), it is their cross to bear.  You didn't force this person to become an addict and you can't force them to deal with their addiction.  What you can do, however, is set boundaries.  "You will not speak to me like that.  You will not be welcome in my home.  When we are forced to be together, if you are acting an ass, you will be told so, to your face."  If you have a problem with folks talking about you behind your back, then stand firm and hear what's being said - right to your face.

 

If you're acting the fool in front of me, I'm going to say so.  If you've ruined my night, I'm going to say so.  If you're being abusive, I'm calling it out.  You can't say, "Don't talk about me" when you're acting an ass in public.  You're going to be talked about because you're making a spectacle of yourself.  If you don't like it, sit your ass down somewhere.  Come back when you sober up and you can behave acceptably.

 

Kim is an adult.  No one should have to shush around her because her sensibilities might be offended.  She's offensive.  You reap what you sow.

[parisprincess]

SistaLadybug, AMEN to everything you said!  Good for you for setting boundaries with the addicts in your life and not letting them create strife in your family's life.  Kyle would be doing herself a favor if she were to have your attitude.     

[runforcover]

I don't see it that way. Brandi was pissed because she wasn't part of the group. Period. They weren't pretending to have no idea how to roll a joint, they were laughing and having fun. I'm pretty sure my friends and I would be doing the same thing reading that menu. And why not have some fun especially after that whole dinner scene! I enjoyed watching them joke around. Brandi has no sense of humor and is a buzzkill because she chose the wrong horse this season. I wish she would have just stayed at the hotel with her BFF.

 

 

Brandi and genuine seems like two things that don't go together at all. She's a lying liar that lies - I don't see anything genuine or real about her.

 

 

 

 

I agree with you. But I think she's an interesting "function" of how truth-telling works, or doesn't work, on an insincere media-platform.  I'm not saying she's a good person.  Ethical categories don't work here.  At least, they don't for me.

 

It was nice to see Brandi keep quiet for the first half of this episode.  The second half played out like she was following orders, which she is, which they all are.  

 

For the last while (maybe always), we've had drunken, belligerent Brandi.

when she originally showed up, and for the first half of this episode, Brandi pulled her mode of "underdog honesty" that I once found, if bullshit, kind of elegant.  It's this thing she does where she affects a lilt at the ends of sentences.  And she will suddenly get quiet and, like a child, present the Other Obvious thing nobody is saying - except in a passive sing-song-y voice.  It was bullshit then and it is bullshit now.  But, for whatever reason, it was a mode of authenticity that I found interesting.

 

These women are all phonies.  So is this show.  It's why I watch.  Andy Cohen is running a self-professed factory. And, once in awhile something bizarrely and unexpectedly honest is sort-of shaped, like the way trash freezes under a layer of ice, and it's amazing.  In the meantime, they are all just competing voices of narcissism and ideology on a medium that is totally indifferent as to whether they live or die.  

 

Brandi is grotesque and one-note but even at her most despicable, I think she gets the joke.  This does not make her a good person.  In fact, I bet she sucks.  But a bunch of women whose biggest fears are the carbs surrounding the pot, unfuckability, and irrelevance don't exactly strike me as a morally compelling group.

 

Actually, this episode, and I never know whether this is strategic, Lisa V's detached passivity against her pink-sadness, struck me as the most endearing.  LisaV has this amazing shyness I Love and Do Not Trust.   

Edited March 6, 2015 by runforcover

[GreatKazu]

 

If I'm fed up with an addict that is somewhat incorporated in my life then that's that but I sure as hell ain't going to LOOK for any extra confrontations if I can help it and for the ones that creep up? Nearest bathroom with the case of the "runs" if that's what it boils down to. Not that hard, not that serious Kim can "get away" with whatever. I'd be all, Oh well I ain't in it. This isn't rocket science there are ways to work around. I'm sure their "obligation" to Bravo gets in the way but come on it can't be that hard minimize the interaction. Geez louise!

As I read this, I couldn't help but think this could apply to Brandi. Why does she look for confrontations and behave like a child such as what she did in the pot shop? Why go out in the streets of Amsterdam and yell?  Why didn't she just run to the bathroom and take a shit, take a swig out of her liquor flask, or change her tampon? What is it with her at being so annoyed at her co-workers for every little thing? If LisaR should have just ignored Kim and let the limo matter go and forget ever receiving an apology, and if Eileen should just turn the other cheek about Poker Night and never mention it again to Kim, than certainly Brandi should be capable of just walking away whenever her annoyance meter runs high.

[SwordQueen]

The point that is being missed is that she hasn't stumbled in, event after event after event screaming and cursing on something just because. She hasn't created volatile situations by aggressive actions this whole season. Poker night was the only time she was rude, aggressive and making a scene from the BEGINNING. After poker night the only behavior that was annoying that was all her without being provoked was that scavenger hunt where she was being bitchy and she wasn't the only one and the airport where again she was being bitchy which I didn't find the need for anyone to have the vapors. Roll their eyes maybe, mumble "what a bitch" maybe but that's it. 

 

This is all about her past and the POTENTIAL for her to become a problem. This is all about trying to nip it in the but before it reaches the level of past seasons Kim. It's all about what everyone FEARS and doesn't want to happen not about what has happened. It's turned into a haze of blaming Kim this season but what they aren't doing is seeing EACH incident for what it really was, how it really went down, why what was said was said, the really bad timing the worst forums and approach, inappropriate players and the such.  It's all a series of ill timed, badly worded, lightly veiled animosity all rolled up in this ludicrous We're Scared for Kim burrito. It's not dealt with logically or sensibly it's handled with emotion and dealing with someone in Kim's position emotionally is the most ridiculous thing you can do. If you can't brace yourself and gather your resolve before tackling such and endeavor then you're the stupid one.

 

Also why can't people drop it? Do people really get held hostage like that? I mean aside from Kyle and even Brandi who are involved more than the average acquaintance.  Over another person they barely know? Work with on occasion? Can't move on unless every little detail adds up and is in place? Really? That's the other convenient reasoning that doesn't jive with me. Look I'm all about the angle that they care and no one wants anything bad to happen I just don't feel like these women are actually coming from that place. I'm sure they feel that way of course but that's not what's driving their interactions with Kim. Now it's all about attacking her, holding her accountable and becoming yet another bunch of obstacles she has to deal with during her ongoing struggle. Tell you what. If I'm fed up with an addict that is somewhat incorporated in my life then that's that but I sure as hell ain't going to LOOK for any extra confrontations if I can help it and for the ones that creep up? Nearest bathroom with the case of the "runs" if that's what it boils down to. Not that hard, not that serious Kim can "get away" with whatever. I'd be all, Oh well I ain't in it. This isn't rocket science there are ways to work around. I'm sure their "obligation" to Bravo gets in the way but come on it can't be that hard minimize the interaction. Geez louise! 

 

Why does it have to get to the point where she's stumbling to event after event before enough is enough?  Why does Kim get to act that way continuously before she's called out?  Why is Kim so special? 

 

Kim made the choice to take drugs and verbally and emotionally abuse other people.  The people she abused do not want to just drop it, because, why?  Why does Kim get to act horrible and other people just have to stay silent?  They have a right to be angry at her.  Why is Kim so special?

 

They are all under contract to interact with each other and they all have to be the in same room in order to accomplish that.  So, yes, if Kim is in a room with them and is being drunk, high, and abusive, then they are being held hostage.  This is a TV show, which is a job.  They can't just leave every time Kim stumbles into the room pointing her fingers at them.  If Kim doesn't want people bringing up the fact that she's a relapsed junkie then she can stumble her way back home.  Why is up to the other ladies to make life OK for Kim?  Why is Kim so special?

 

People's actions are not isolated events.  People have reputations and complex histories with those they have relationships with.  So, yes, Kim is being judged on her past and also the probable future.  It's human nature and a societal norm.  Kim is not better than the rest of us.  She doesn't get to behave the way she does and have zero consequences.  One of the consequences of acting like an asshole is that people might not forgive and certainly will not forget.  So her past actions are held up as an indicator of future actions and people will act accordingly, which might mean that they are going to assume she will come at them viciously in some inebriated state.  This applies to all people.  Why is Kim so special? 

 

You might react a certain way, and you might not see what the big deal is with Kim's behavior, but that doesn't mean that it is wrong for anyone else to be bothered by it, just as it's not wrong for you to feel the way you do.  We all come at these situations differently.  I can only speak for myself, here, but as I've said before, I've have a good deal of exposure to people like Kim and the emotional/psychological effects of being around someone so toxic are real and often difficult to separate oneself from.  it can even cause a person to act in ways that they wouldn't normally because of the stress.  This is what Kim does.  She hurts people and then becomes angry when people express their feelings of hurt to her.  She doesn't want to take responsibility for herself and the real damage that she causes. 

 

Now since I've been around this stuff and far worse, Kim's behavior isn't very shocking to me, even though it angers me.  But think about it like this; some of the other HW may never have experienced someone behaving this way in their presence before.  It is a shock to the system, especially when it's unexpected.  I think most of them thought that Kim was sober before that night, or at least not back to habitual use.  It came out of left field and no one was prepared for Kim to relapse right in front of them. 

 

What really gets me is that the focus is all inverted.  It has become all about the other HW behavior and RE-actions to Kim, when Kim's actions are being excused and swept under the rug.  It is Kim who is responsible for Kim.  No one else, not anyone.  Her actions are harmful to herself and to others but the other HW are getting shit for not responding to her in just the right ways.  Kim is skating on her behavior by throwing out some of the most basic of addict tricks, projection, deflection, divide and concur. Bottom line is that no one can make a storyline out of Kim's sobriety without Kim's help.  She is not a victim here.  You can argue that none of the other ladies are either, okay, sure.  No one is innocent here.  But just because the other HW have made missteps in this SL, it doesn't make Kim less accountable for her own actions of getting high and being emotionally, verbally abusive. 

 

If Kim were actually working a program and getting therapy, then we wouldn't be seeing what we're seeing onscreen now.  Kim's behavior is not the result of successful sobriety.  She is not sober, she is not doing the work.  That is on Kim and she needs, absolutely needs, for her own wellbeing, to be held accountable for herself.  Everyone else is held accountable for their words and deeds.  Kim needs to be as well.  Kim is not so special, that the rules of society do not apply to her. 

 

 

I also wanted to add that all of this isn't me saying that I agree with the other HW reactions to Kim.  I don't.  I would have done differently and I definitely would not have put in so much effort with Kim.  But I do have to say, these ladies have been nicer to Kim than she deserves.  While I might not have kept at Kim as they did, I can tell you, I also wouldn't have been nearly, nearly as nice about it as they have been.  Just like with Brandi, the other HW have been far kinder than I'd have been.  Would my reactions have been better, or worse, I dunno.

Edited March 6, 2015 by SwordQueen

[b2H]

I usually try to read the day-after boards before I watch the DVR'd episode.

 

This is the first time in all my time watching this franchise that I deleted the episode before watching it.  From all reports, it wasn't worth the hour or so of my time.

 

For the record, I have been to the Netherlands, both Rotterdam and Amsterdam, for business and was able to take my daughter with me.  We had dinner in a nearby restaurant twice that was housed in a windmill - such a great place, after the first time there, we decided to have our final night's meal there as well.

 

I honestly don't want my memories of the beautiful location destroyed by these harridans.

[cooksdelight]

I don't think Brandi was amused at all - I think she was frustrated.

She was jonesing for a joint so bad, it was killing her. It put her in a foul mood and venom came out when they were outside later and she went after Kyle.

Maybe Brandi should have joined in and gotten mellow. I always say that I'd rather be around someone who's stoned than a mean drunk. And Brandi's definitely a mean drunk.

[jnymph]

  I love myself and my child more.

 

 

Nuff said right there.  Hugs to you, SistaLB . Sounds like it has not been an easy road for you.

 

 

Please put me firmly in the camp of being annoyed we didn't get to see more of Amsterdam.  Grrr.

Edited March 6, 2015 by jnymph

[BusyOctober]

So, first Yolanda gave up writing Bravo blogs due to her health.  Now Kim seems to be skipping her blogs more often.  What's her excuse? Can't be her health because we all know how well she's doing for the past 3 years (snerk).  If Brandi can find a fan to blog for her from the Mean Girl Club at the local middle school, Kim should be able to find a ghostwriter too. And Kyle didn't post one this week either. I thought the blog thing was part of their job?

[QuinnM]

Lisa V did a blog.  She said she was there the night Brandi was smoking weed with Kyle and Kyle didn't partake then either.  So truth or friend backing friend with a lie?

[GreatKazu]

I consider myself a good and moral person, but I'll tell you right now - I am all for self-preservation.  I believe that you don't allow someone to keep hurting you or yours in order to make them feel better about their bullshit or to make it easier for them to continue to wallow in craziness.

 

I come from a family with several addicts.  These are people I love very much.  They have stolen from me, lied to my face, hurled nasty words at me.  Is that because they don't love me?  No.  It's because they're addicts and nothing in life is more important to them than their next fix and covering up for/excusing their addict behavior.  I will no longer be a party to it and I drew that line many years ago.  They are not welcome in my home because they have stolen from me.  They are not allowed to be alone with my daughter because I consider them dangerous.  I speak to them kindly and with compassion.  I offer hugs and kisses when I see them.  I love them.  I love myself and my child more.

 

There is no way in the world that it makes sense to stand back and allow someone to abuse you because they have a problem with substances.  As awful as it is (and I know how awful it is because I have witnessed it firsthand for years), it is their cross to bear.  You didn't force this person to become an addict and you can't force them to deal with their addiction.  What you can do, however, is set boundaries.  "You will not speak to me like that.  You will not be welcome in my home.  When we are forced to be together, if you are acting an ass, you will be told so, to your face."  If you have a problem with folks talking about you behind your back, then stand firm and hear what's being said - right to your face.

 

If you're acting the fool in front of me, I'm going to say so.  If you've ruined my night, I'm going to say so.  If you're being abusive, I'm calling it out.  You can't say, "Don't talk about me" when you're acting an ass in public.  You're going to be talked about because you're making a spectacle of yourself.  If you don't like it, sit your ass down somewhere.  Come back when you sober up and you can behave acceptably.

 

Kim is an adult.  No one should have to shush around her because her sensibilities might be offended.  She's offensive.  You reap what you sow.

THIS! I want to "like" this many times over.  This should be pinned at the top of the page. Anytime anyone questions why Kyle doesn't "support" Kim or anytime anyone feels Kim needs to have her family at this time of need or how sad that children would want to cut off their addict parent, THIS SHOULD BE POSTED in response each and every time. Thank you. This is addiction and this is how it should be dealt with. Reading this, reminded me of how far I have come with how I used to deal with the addicts in my life. Now, I do the above.

 

 

How I wish the inside of that windmill was shown. I was dying to see it.  That guy that said he once dated YoFo, looked younger than her. Perhaps because he is natural-looking, and the Amsterdam air, food and water does him good. Unlike YoFo who ingests 3,096,786 vitamins a day, has wonky lips, gets Botox, and ingests 29,735,376,548 lemons a week along with those cleanses.

[Avaleigh]

I'm sure she's experience the blow off by many, many, many coworkers, acquaintances in the past due to her using and knows that its a decision that's available to them. Lose her number show up for work, get through filming and keep it moving. Just with any other gig. Also, if it wasn't for this topic coming up over and over again I haven't seen an episode (aside from poker night) where she put any addiction behavior on display where the others had to awkwardly trip around making their jobs Oh so hard. So I still don't get it the whole "the HW's shouldn't have to put up with XYZ" at their jobs.

 

Addict or not, she's made it clear what her position was on it being brought up over and over again. Lisa R taking it to a dinner with the other women just screams "this is something that we aren't going to let you forget live down get away from" etc. etc. I mean apology or no apology how long is a slight allowed to linger on for the other women to be subjected before it's allowed to die. I mean what about the poor other women who have to get dragged into the dramatics because Lisa R won't let it go. That's also rude I mean Brandi didn't want to hear it, you KNOW Lisa V didn't, and Kyle? Giiirrrlll she ran screaming from the table. I'm sure Yolanda didn't want the dinner to grow awkward with the varied level of judgements that the other women were having about the state of Kim's sobriety. Yolanda made it clear where she was in her support of whatever Kim needed and yet she has to sit through someone else's heightened level of emotion over it all. This can't be done one on one? That's a big problem for me as well. Causing the other women to be present in your inappropriate moments of "concern for Kim"

One of the reasons I think it's hard for the women to work with Kim is that she's an unpleasant person to be around and has shown this to be the case over and over again. She was high and out of it at Kyle's mixer, she was a complaining, nonsensical pain in the ass during the scavenger hunt, she was rude during the blahblahblah conversation, etc. Then there are the hazards that come with Traveling with Kim. I put it in italics because every time Kim travels it's like some screwed up movie I'm just not sure what the genre is supposed to be. Kim has been hard to deal with during the vacations and so far has been true to form on this trip to Amsterdam (not to mention Calgary.) Kim made the plane ride uncomfortable for everyone, she was a loud and complaining pill at the airport, she picked a fight with Kyle for no reason, she was moody looking and acted dismissive during Yolanda's talk about Bella in sharp contrast to the other women, she insulted Eileen even though she essentially acknowledged that Eileen has done nothing to her, and this isn't even getting into her gross treatment of a man who had done absolutely nothing to her. 

 

Kim is a rude and unpleasant person to be around so it definitely makes their jobs more difficult when they are forced to interact with her. LisaR had no control over Kim's behavior where Kim exposed her addictions again to the world. When Kim is doing things like ignoring LisaR and refusing to hug her or acknowledge her then she's creating tension within the group. When Kim starts arguing with Kyle outside of the airport she's creating tension within the group. When Kim can't apologize for past unacceptable behavior it makes the women uneasy because it gives the impression that Kim can get away with doing whatever she wants even if she's routinely screaming at people and/or calling them names and insulting them.

 

Having a person around like Kim does not create for a happy work environment. If this were Celebrity Apprentice and I had to choose between having LisaR or for the sake of argument a "sober" Kim on my team, I can promise you that I'd choose LisaR in a heartbeat because she comes across as positive, energetic, honest, straightforward and ready to work on whatever it is that she's set her mind to at the moment. In no way could I use any of those words to describe Kim and this show certainly hasn't given me the impression that she can be helpful to any task. She'd just be a liability.

 

As far as the addict behavior not being in evidence anywhere apart from Poker Night, I disagree. She seemed like she was on something at Kyle's mixer and that's why she had no idea what day it was among other tell tale signs. She seemed high in the scenes filmed at her house and in this episode she seems like she might well high at the dinner table. It's when she's shouting "LYING ABOUT ME!!" that she's using her drunk/addict voice that she's used before. She sounds really scary there IMO like one of the addicts that are sometimes hanging around 3rd Street Promenade in Santa Monica. 

 

I mean apology or no apology how long is a slight allowed to linger on for the other women to be subjected before it's allowed to die.

 

I feel like Kim is the one who needs to be asked that question. Kim is the epic grudge holder here in this line up of women and that's quite an accomplishment. Just last episode she was throwing her own bad behavior in Kyle's face wrt Hawaii. Kim doesn't have to apologize for Hawaii but she's sure as hell going to let Kyle have it over making them wait at the airport in Amsterdam in addition to complaining about how Kyle left her in Hawaii. Or how about when Kim a full season later used the Adrienne surrogacy drama to lay into Kyle about how much she'd been hurt by Brandi and how Kyle wasn't recognizing that enough for Kim? The list of Kim hanging on to a subject and not letting it die goes on and on.

 

I mean what about the poor other women who have to get dragged into the dramatics because Lisa R won't let it go. That's also rude I mean Brandi didn't want to hear it, you KNOW Lisa V didn't, and Kyle? Giiirrrlll she ran screaming from the table. I'm sure Yolanda didn't want the dinner to grow awkward with the varied level of judgements that the other women were having about the state of Kim's sobriety.

Not one of the women at the table agreed with how Kim handled herself at the table that evening. Even Brandi tried to caution Kim three separate times so Brandi can say what she wants in her blog now but as it was happening it was obvious to me that she thought Kim was out of line. Yolanda definitely thought Kim was out of line and told her that she didn't agree with how she was saying what she was saying. To me this says that Yolanda thought that Kim was being inappropriate with LisaR. Yolanda also probably knew that there wasn't much point in talking to Kim about it for too long once she realized that Kim didn't even know how many people she was arguing with at the table.

 

Kim is the one who wouldn't let it go by simply accepting LisaR's apology. Instead, Kim decided to talk about her sobriety issues including her relapse-that-wasn't-a-relapse from Poker Night.

[CTO]

I don't see it that way. Brandi was pissed because she wasn't part of the group. Period. They weren't pretending to have no idea how to roll a joint, they were laughing and having fun. I'm pretty sure my friends and I would be doing the same thing reading that menu. And why not have some fun especially after that whole dinner scene! I enjoyed watching them joke around. Brandi has no sense of humor and is a buzzkill because she chose the wrong horse this season. I wish she would have just stayed at the hotel with her BFF.

 

 

Brandi and genuine seems like two things that don't go together at all. She's a lying liar that lies - I don't see anything genuine or real about her.

 

Brandi is jealous because Lisa V has effectively cut her out of her life. She's jealous because Lisa V and Kyle are quite chummy again. She's jealous because Lisa R and Eileen have fit right in with Lisa V and Kyle. She's jealous because she only has this show. She has no money, no class and no talent of any kind. Stirring up shit might be about it and if her latest salvo is the best she can do these days (Kyle smoked pot!!!) then even that 'talent' is gone.

 

Kim is jealous too. She's angry because her sister ended up with the rich hubby and solid home life. She's jealous because Kyle has friends. She's jealous because Eileen has been a working actress since her early 20s. She jealous because Eileen looks about 20 years younger than her. She jealous that Lisa R and Eileen have good home lives too. She's jealous because Lisa V is Lisa V.

 

Kim and Brandi don't fit on this show - they don't belong. Make it happen Andy ... just make it happen.

 

 

I'm curious, when has she show this? I sure haven't noticed it.

 

You're not curious :-) If I tried to explain you would not get it so I'm sparing myself the wasted effort :-) No disrespect I just know it's pointless. We mostly see things differently. I'm okay with that.  I do agree Kim and Brandi don't fit on this show. But that seems to have been the point of their inclusion from their respective day one appearances when I look back and think on it. It bears considering they were chosen, accepted (initially) and signed specifically because they would be easy pawns. 

 

I feel for both Kim and Brandi on different days at different times. On other days and times they are each very hard for me to take and sometimes I wish they'd get off this show. Most of that comes from feeling like they are in a lot of pain and I want them to feel better, have happier lives. This show is only good for Kim and Brandi financially. Just my opinion but at this point I can't see any other good reason for them to still be there. We all need a break, them most of all.

Edited March 6, 2015 by CTO

[WireWrap]

Lisa V did a blog.  She said she was there the night Brandi was smoking weed with Kyle and Kyle didn't partake then either.  So truth or friend backing friend with a lie?

Ummm, Lisa did not say that she was present when Brandi claimed Kyle smoked pot, she only said she has never seen Kyle smoke (pot) in all the years she has known her.

 

Kyle's blog is up and she wrote this little tid bit in her section about the "coffeehouse" LOL.  "I don't know why Brandi thought it was hypocritical of us not to have a space cake. SHE wasn't having any because her lawyer told her she couldn't."  1 of the things that make us go HMMMMMMMMMMM! LOL 

[SwordQueen]

I consider myself a good and moral person, but I'll tell you right now - I am all for self-preservation.  I believe that you don't allow someone to keep hurting you or yours in order to make them feel better about their bullshit or to make it easier for them to continue to wallow in craziness.

 

I come from a family with several addicts.  These are people I love very much.  They have stolen from me, lied to my face, hurled nasty words at me.  Is that because they don't love me?  No.  It's because they're addicts and nothing in life is more important to them than their next fix and covering up for/excusing their addict behavior.  I will no longer be a party to it and I drew that line many years ago.  They are not welcome in my home because they have stolen from me.  They are not allowed to be alone with my daughter because I consider them dangerous.  I speak to them kindly and with compassion.  I offer hugs and kisses when I see them.  I love them.  I love myself and my child more.

 

There is no way in the world that it makes sense to stand back and allow someone to abuse you because they have a problem with substances.  As awful as it is (and I know how awful it is because I have witnessed it firsthand for years), it is their cross to bear.  You didn't force this person to become an addict and you can't force them to deal with their addiction.  What you can do, however, is set boundaries.  "You will not speak to me like that.  You will not be welcome in my home.  When we are forced to be together, if you are acting an ass, you will be told so, to your face."  If you have a problem with folks talking about you behind your back, then stand firm and hear what's being said - right to your face.

 

If you're acting the fool in front of me, I'm going to say so.  If you've ruined my night, I'm going to say so.  If you're being abusive, I'm calling it out.  You can't say, "Don't talk about me" when you're acting an ass in public.  You're going to be talked about because you're making a spectacle of yourself.  If you don't like it, sit your ass down somewhere.  Come back when you sober up and you can behave acceptably.

 

Kim is an adult.  No one should have to shush around her because her sensibilities might be offended.  She's offensive.  You reap what you sow.

 

Ahhh, I should have read this before my own reply because your post is perfect. 

 

I'm sorry you have had to go through these issues within your own family.  I think one of the hardest things is having someone in your life whom you feel both love and hate for, at the same time.  Such strong opposing emotions and it makes having a relationship with them and creating boundaries just that much harder. 

 

This is what I wish I could hear Kyle say:  I love myself and my husband and children more.  It might sound cruel to some, but generally a person's immediate (spouse/kids) family should be their priority.  Kyle should be Kyle's priority.  As long as she believes otherwise (Kim's insistence that Kyle put her first), Kyle is never going to be able to release the guilt and anger she has. 

[CatMomma]

Why does it have to get to the point where she's stumbling to event after event before enough is enough?  Why does Kim get to act that way continuously before she's called out?  Why is Kim so special? 

 

Kim made the choice to take drugs and verbally and emotionally abuse other people.  The people she abused do not want to just drop it, because, why?  Why does Kim get to act horrible and other people just have to stay silent?  They have a right to be angry at her.  Why is Kim so special?

 

They are all under contract to interact with each other and they all have to be the in same room in order to accomplish that.  So, yes, if Kim is in a room with them and is being drunk, high, and abusive, then they are being held hostage.  This is a TV show, which is a job.  They can't just leave every time Kim stumbles into the room pointing her fingers at them.  If Kim doesn't want people bringing up the fact that she's a relapsed junkie then she can stumble her way back home.  Why is up to the other ladies to make life OK for Kim?  Why is Kim so special?

 

People's actions are not isolated events.  People have reputations and complex histories with those they have relationships with.  So, yes, Kim is being judged on her past and also the probable future.  It's human nature and a societal norm.  Kim is not better than the rest of us.  She doesn't get to behave the way she does and have zero consequences.  One of the consequences of acting like an asshole is that people might not forgive and certainly will not forget.  So her past actions are held up as an indicator of future actions and people will act accordingly, which might mean that they are going to assume she will come at them viciously in some inebriated state.  This applies to all people.  Why is Kim so special? 

 

You might react a certain way, and you might not see what the big deal is with Kim's behavior, but that doesn't mean that it is wrong for anyone else to be bothered by it, just as it's not wrong for you to feel the way you do.  We all come at these situations differently.  I can only speak for myself, here, but as I've said before, I've have a good deal of exposure to people like Kim and the emotional/psychological effects of being around someone so toxic are real and often difficult to separate oneself from.  it can even cause a person to act in ways that they wouldn't normally because of the stress.  This is what Kim does.  She hurts people and then becomes angry when people express their feelings of hurt to her.  She doesn't want to take responsibility for herself and the real damage that she causes. 

 

Now since I've been around this stuff and far worse, Kim's behavior isn't very shocking to me, even though it angers me.  But think about it like this; some of the other HW may never have experienced someone behaving this way in their presence before.  It is a shock to the system, especially when it's unexpected.  I think most of them thought that Kim was sober before that night, or at least not back to habitual use.  It came out of left field and no one was prepared for Kim to relapse right in front of them. 

 

What really gets me is that the focus is all inverted.  It has become all about the other HW behavior and RE-actions to Kim, when Kim's actions are being excused and swept under the rug.  It is Kim who is responsible for Kim.  No one else, not anyone.  Her actions are harmful to herself and to others but the other HW are getting shit for not responding to her in just the right ways.  Kim is skating on her behavior by throwing out some of the most basic of addict tricks, projection, deflection, divide and concur. Bottom line is that no one can make a storyline out of Kim's sobriety without Kim's help.  She is not a victim here.  You can argue that none of the other ladies are either, okay, sure.  No one is innocent here.  But just because the other HW have made missteps in this SL, it doesn't make Kim less accountable for her own actions of getting high and being emotionally, verbally abusive. 

 

If Kim were actually working a program and getting therapy, then we wouldn't be seeing what we're seeing onscreen now.  Kim's behavior is not the result of successful sobriety.  She is not sober, she is not doing the work.  That is on Kim and she needs, absolutely needs, for her own wellbeing, to be held accountable for herself.  Everyone else is held accountable for their words and deeds.  Kim needs to be as well.  Kim is not so special, that the rules of society do not apply to her. 

 

 

I also wanted to add that all of this isn't me saying that I agree with the other HW reactions to Kim.  I don't.  I would have done differently and I definitely would not have put in so much effort with Kim.  But I do have to say, these ladies have been nicer to Kim than she deserves.  While I might not have kept at Kim as they did, I can tell you, I also wouldn't have been nearly, nearly as nice about it as they have been.  Just like with Brandi, the other HW have been far kinder than I'd have been.  Would my reactions have been better, or worse, I dunno.

 

This. This right here *points up*.

 

This is everything.  I want to marry this post. 

[CatMomma]

Kyle's blog is up and she wrote this little tid bit in her section about the "coffeehouse" LOL.  "I don't know why Brandi thought it was hypocritical of us not to have a space cake. SHE wasn't having any because her lawyer told her she couldn't."  1 of the things that make us go HMMMMMMMMMMM! LOL 

 

I assume he told her this because she is dealing with some legal ramblings with Eddie and it wasn't a good idea to smoke on camera, part of which has to do with her children and how it might look.

 

I guess Kyle wouldn't be a hypocrite had she consulted an attorney first.

 

Hmmmmm, indeed.

[SFoster21]

I assume he told her this because she is dealing with some legal ramblings with Eddie and it wasn't a good idea to smoke on camera, part of which has to do with her children and how it might look.

I guess Kyle wouldn't be a hypocrite had she consulted an attorney first.

Hmmmmm, indeed.

She didn't smoke then, but made the point that she did use illegally? A lawyer advised her to do that?

If a lawyer advised her, it was about her behavior when she becomes intoxicated.

Edited March 6, 2015 by SFoster21

[Umbelina]

Or Kyle is lying.

[MatildaMoody]

Ummm, Lisa did not say that she was present when Brandi claimed Kyle smoked pot, she only said she has never seen Kyle smoke (pot) in all the years she has known her.

 

Kyle's blog is up and she wrote this little tid bit in her section about the "coffeehouse" LOL.  "I don't know why Brandi thought it was hypocritical of us not to have a space cake. SHE wasn't having any because her lawyer told her she couldn't."  1 of the things that make us go HMMMMMMMMMMM! LOL 

Where is Kyle's blog? I've been looking for it on Bravo's site for several days and haven't seen it posted yet. Can you provide a link?

[CatMomma]

She didn't smoke then, but made the point that she did use illegally? A lawyer advised her to do that?

If a lawyer advised her, it was about her behavior when she becomes intoxicated.

 

Then he should definitely advise her to stop drinking.  Wonder why he hasn't?

 

I think it's one thing to admit to doing it in the past. It's quite another to be seen doing it on camera. 

Where is Kyle's blog? I've been looking for it on Bravo's site for several days and haven't seen it posted yet. Can you provide a link?

 

Here ya go:

 

http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-beverly-hills/season-5/blogs/kyle-richards/kyle-how-could-i-defend-kim

[CTO]

Such a sad concept for children to cut off their mother.

 

Sometimes people can find a balance when dealing with addicts even if it means a lifetime of strain. Life is hard. You deal with the cards you were given you don't fold and ask for a new one. Although I guess no a days people do. My mother was and she was exhausting but what is life if you don't have unconditional support in your corner? Sad how our resolve gets smaller and smaller generation after generation and it's more acceptable for complete self preservation as opposed to way back in the day where family would endure anything and everything to make sure everyone gets through life as best as they can. It's like nah, if I stress over you I can't have my steak dinners so sorry you have to starve instead of the way it used to be where if I'm having steak and you're eating crumbs then even though Imma have to sacrifice the luxury, we BOTH will  have enough to eat. If I have to fight FOR you even when you don't then so be it. But then again I've lived a very strained life because I'm usually taken advantage of, drained and the such but I have to stay true to what I believe or else I would be even more miserable.

 

Can't look down on someone unless I'm there to help them up. Not my style. These women make me sad because this is what the world is coming to. Fake concern that lasts all of two seconds. Complaining about family to anyone who will listen. Wanted pats on the back for what should be done for family etc. etc. Of course the emotion is strong but the grandstanding is the part I don't get. Reassurance is necessary but dissolving into hysterics is what boggles my mind. These women have been through soooooo much and they can't figure out how to handle this situation with strength, dignity, decorum and restraint? I don't buy that and that's what really angers me. These women have no doubt exhibited strength thru trials in life. We've heard of so many over the seasons but for some reason they are all reduced to screeching sorority girls because Bravo is in tow. Despicable!

 

I need to say this - Thank you so very much for this one. I agree. This show has been tough to understand for me and I waver between walking away from it and sticking with it. For this season, i'm holding until the reunion is done but then i'm finished. I'll put that kind of attention and care into those I love but for a tv show, I've been feeling this isn't entertainment for a long while.