S02.E11: The Akeda

[thuganomics85]

Well, that was totally unsurprising.  As soon as the idea was brought up that maybe Frank couldn't be killed using the sword, since his soul was already claimed, I just knew that meant he would die before they get to Moloch, so we could get more suspense.  Now, do I think he's permanently gone?  Nah, I wouldn't be surprised if he comes back as another Horseman or an Andy-type role.  But, this was so lame.  Poor Orlando Jones.  He was so supportive of the show last season, but clearly that means squat to the the show-runner and the writers.  Sorry, Orlando!  You don't look as good in a corset as Katia Winter does, so no love for you!

 

Meanwhile, of course this means our gang is captured, due to Ichabod not being able to go through with killing Henry, but twist! Henry betrays Moloch because he was a big meanie!  Oh, yay.  I get it, show.  Katrina: Right!  Abbie: Wrong!  I know the score now.  Thanks.  This probably means we're going to be spending the rest of this season having him integrated in the group, and being "redeemed."  Between him and Hawley, Jenny might as well go hang with the current captain, for all she'll probably be used.

 

The action scenes were great though.  Especially Headless vs. Ichabod.  Man, do I love Headless.   Sorry, Neil Jackson; you're not bad or anything; but Abraham just doesn't bring what Headless does.  Really, even without his head, when his ax got shattered, the Headless actor still managed to convey a "Oh, shit!  I am screwed!" reaction, with body language alone.  Now, that's impressive.

 

Tom Mison, Nichole Beharie, and the rest, really deserve better then this.

Edited December 2, 2014 by thuganomics85

[blugirlami21]

Watching this episode and reading the interview with the show runners about this episode I've come to the conclusion that they don't care about the show we fell in love with last season.  There is way too much time spent on the CFD, on Henry, and partly on new character Hawley.  We didn't have any of these things last season and the show flourished.  I don't care about Katrina or her struggle to not be a liar or Henry and his neverending daddy and mommy issues. 

 

I feel awful for Orlando Jones who's character was sidelined the whole season only to be killed in the five minutes of screen time they finally allowed him to have.  I feel like the show is heading towards a crane family HEA and I am just not interested in that, never have been.

 

I'm trying to hold on for Ichabbie but I think I might be out.

Edited December 2, 2014 by blugirlami21

[Yolapukka]

I guess Henry is redeemed in that he did put a stop to Moloch for now and was influenced to do so by Ichabod's words. but those very words are problematic. Bear in mind what Ichabod said; there were promises of freedom and familial affection. in terms of redemption. Henry has been rewarded, after considerable acts of evil by which he profitted, he has now profitted again while cutting himself loose from Moloch. All others have had sacrifice forced upon them and been willing to sacrifice further and he has gained through evil and now gains by turning to the side of good. This is redemption via a conveniently self-serving act. 

 

The Cranes are only convincing as a couple when they are at each other's throats and KW does a much better job of selling the way Katrina is drawn to Headed Headless,  than her love for Ichabod. I wish TPTB would write towards the things that work. BTW Nice work failing at magic once again Katrina, maybe your strength is in lovecharms and flat-out lying. I guess there would have been too much "cost" if her magic had stopped Irving from bleeding to death.

 

Abbie was wonderful, though for once despite her being so proactive throughout the bulk of the episode she did strike me as more Ichabod's sidekick that his  fellow lead. I think it was mostly because of the way she was removed from the main action during the fight with the itty-bitty demon army and then, the Crane Family Drama ate the remainder of the show. It was great until that point and then the air got sucked out. Overall I was actually drawn into the CFD for a change rather than being left entirely cold by the whine-festival but it still made me think of a needle skidding across a record.

 

I will miss Irving and I hope he returns in another form. I also hope they will make better use of him if he does. Wow, Orlando Jones was amazing swinging about that sword. I wish I'd seen more of that sort of thing rather than putting up with a weepy old man whining about his parents and a damsel being menaced while bound. 

Edited December 2, 2014 by yuggapukka

[GinevradiBenci]

There's no way Irving is off the show, I just don't know how they'll bring him back from the dead. I thought we'd see it, actually. But he'll be back, as a horseman, or a spirit, or his soul will be stuffed back in his body by James Madison's best silver fish fork that is also a soul catcher.

 

I'm not entirely certain I'll be around to watch it, though. The show went from a great ride to boring and now to incoherent. I'm not sure the few moments of fun will bring me back when the show returns.

[Writing Wrongs]

What is up with Katrina's five-head?

 

I wish Henry and Katrina would go away.

 

Poor Irving.

[HalcyonDays]

What a fucking waste. Seriously. If Orlando is going to go down, it damn well better be epic and amazing. Him doing the sword fighting was in a sense, but we saw no connection and impact to his family after his arrest. No emotional connection for Frank and Macey and Cynthia. It's like the showrunners just picked the least used character to sacrifice for Sweeps Week. Fuckers.

 

Katrina....oh, you useless little witch whom Goffman adores..yet....seriously - your powers are weakening after the burning of the trees...WEAKENING. They are already bloody weak, you useless character. Dear god. Even Goffman writes about how her powers are useless. Are you seriously telling me that she couldn't have saved, or at least stabilized Frank. You bloody waste of space! I'm sorry, but she could have done something.....

 

I cannot even articulate how useless and irritating this character is.....it's beyond words.....

 

Consider this - Hawley's weapons and artifacts are more powerful than she is - yes, she boosted the power of some of them, but please, the spell could be boosted, but her own power is ineffectual against the demons. The weapons would have been slightly LESS effective than what that stupid redhead enhanced, but you know what, it would have been enough overall in volleys. You have NO idea how much this fucking angers me....

 

Ichabod...you motherfucker...you seriously chose your child, and were rewarded for choosing your evil useless child....yeah, I have a BIG issue with it. And yet I predicted it - knew the idiot would choose the wrong way. Thank you, show, for destroying my beloved Ichabod Crane. You put my Abbie and Jenny and yourself bound to trees, to almost be killed, just because you were too stupid to sacrifice your idiot son. Tom Mison must be livid.

 

The only enjoyable part was Ichabod finally confronting the wife over her lies, but you know this won't last, because SHE is the one who said - let's not be married any more...

 

I WAS surprised by Henry taking out Moloch. At least that was useful. Other than that, I had no use for another Henry long-winded speech when others are bound to trees, and I just don't care. I care about Abraham - I do. He should have a chance at redemption. The rest? Can go to hell.

[Actionmage]

Where is The Kindred?!

[BigEasygirl]

I know the show's all too few bait and switch moments of fun won't lure me back. It seems like some of SH's audience is switching to Scorpion is which comes on at the same time as SH. It's no secret (and very telling now) that Kurtzman and Orci left SH in Goffman's incompetent hands and are focused on their new show to SH's detriment and to Scorpion's obvious benefit.

I wish FOX would resolve their differences with them and get them to return to fix the show.

 

Where is The Kindred?!

He's just hanging around out "there" like the other loose ends the show doesn't deem worthy of pursing because...you know...Katrina and CFD rock!

Edited December 2, 2014 by Reese

[Amethyst]

Where is The Kindred?!

 

Million dollar question, really.  The way they abandoned that poor bastard was cruel.  

He's probably in a cave somewhere, or hiding underground in the tunnels.  

[lucindabelle]

Oh cranes weren't rewarded for their faith, henry didn't kill moloch for them but because he didn't want to be sacrificed like Isaac on the mountain, he got the Alexa story a little backwards (and pronounced it wrong took as anybody who goes to shul on Rosh Hashanah knows. Her insult they were treating it like this rare weird story when Jewish people even if they only go to temple on the high holidays hear it).

No not my Irving!

Please out cranes hair back in a ponytail.

Show moved quickly which was good.

Can someone tell me why does anybody WANT to work for evil? I mean whats IN it for them? I just don't get it. When headless was talking about it i just felt like giggling. He even calls it evil, it's not as if he's convinced himself his side is good.

[GracieV]

I certainly hope we haven't seen the last of Frank Irving, he was the best I've seen him the entire series.. And I'm really glad I don't have a hate on for Katrina like many seem to do here because she didn't bother me at all tonight.  This was a wonderful episode of purpose and sacrifice to me. I enjoyed it a great deal and I know that I'm in the minority here on this board, but I wonder how the general viewing audience sees it.

[theatremouse]

Ugh. Least interesting/exciting fight sequence I've ever seen on television. Underwhelming. Also, unearned.

 

Look at me, reduced beyond complete sentences. Ugh. Waste.

[GracieV]

Orlando Jone's video tribute to Frank:

[TwistedandBored]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/01/sleepy-hollow-finale_n_6249652.html

 

 

 

I loved the person asking the questions in this article! 

Edited December 2, 2014 by TwistedandBored

[sinkwriter]

So... Henry killed Moloch with the special Sword. Does that mean he's going to die? Because one death for another, to restore balance? Or is he immune to that rule because his soul is already promised to Moloch? And if that's the case, then it doesn't matter if there's the tiniest inkling of regret and remorse within him, is there? Because his soul is doomed and he's likely to remain evil, even with Moloch gone? Or am I thinking about this in the wrong way?

 

I liked the argument between Katrina and Crane. I think it was long overdue. There is so much that she has hidden from him that it's amazing he took this long to get mad at her about it. She has deceived him again and again, all for whatever plans she and her coven had or were trying to prevent. She never gave him the chance to have all the information and make up his own mind what he wanted to do or if he even wanted to be part of it.

 

I know it's terrible, but I was hoping for Henry to kill Katrina, so Crane would realize his son really was a lost cause. I just find her character boring and want her to make an exit, somehow.

[fantique]

Did everybody in Sleepy Hollow get fencing lessons on the down low? These folks were working that sword like Yoda.

Irving mentioned the sword "does all the work for him".

 

What was her plan though?

I think she got inspired by the sword turned serpents and it was a fakeout so Henry could be taken by surprise. 

 

Does anybody have any straws I can grasp that Irving isn't truly gone from the show?

Here's one for you. Did you notice the manic way he was acting when threatening Abraham? I think that was a sign that the sword was havung a less than savoury effect on him and I think the fact that his soul was signed over to Henry will come into play.

 

I am so sick of As The Cranes Turn . . .like sand through the hour glass - these are the hours I've wasted

LOLS.

 

Overall thoughts:

• I liked the episode and the narrative opportunities it presents in the future. I am getting the impression the whole gang will be involved and kicking things into high gear.

 

• The Cranes' discussion leads me to believe they will focus on Katrina being more than a simpering DiD so that's good. I am just worried she wil take up too much screentime. Up to now I just laughed at her ineptitude. I really want to be able to ignore her.

 

• I really enjoyed the interpersonal exchanges within the team and showed how much they cared for Irving. I really think his loss affects both Abbie and Crane. I don't know where people get the idea that they don't both care about the captain equally from. They both met him at roughly the same time and Irving trusted Crane.

 

• I unfortunately felt little surprise with how this episode went and that's disappointing. I actually saw Henry killing Moloch as soon as he called his pulling him out of the trees their genesis. It was so obviously telegraphed to me that I thought when he said "I am immortal, I can wield the sword with impunity" that he was saying "let me do the honours of killing moloch".

 

• I liked that Henry was the one to slay moloch but when tied to the whole Cranes' situation it sours it a little. I would have rather they had lost hope and then get "rewarded" by Henry helping them. I also don't like that really those were not redemptive actions by Henry but self-preservating ones but the show will try to go the "see there's good in him still" route.  

[Amethyst]

Orlando Jone's video tribute to Frank:

 

Aww.  He's being cool about it.  Loved the little note at the end "Read the shit you sign." LOL.

[sinkwriter]

One thing that really amused me: how Crane kept asking where to buckle in with a seat belt on the motorcycle. He seemed so distraught that there was no belt. "But... where's my belt to buckle in?" Heee.

[Leia1979]

I have mixed feelings on this episode.

 

The good:
BAMF!Irving

The Cranes' separation

Moloch not giving a damn about his peons

A visit from the continuity fairy with Headless in the Mason cell

Abbie's motivational speeches and sensical plans

 

The bad:

People not following Abbie's sensical plans

Abbie getting sidelined 30 seconds into the fight

RIP Irving

Henry not killing Katrina (I was getting ready to cheer, but my husband accurately called it)

Katrina's wig

 

I'm hoping we get undead!Irving in 2B. I wish we could have dispensed with either Katrina or Henry (ideally both, but I'm trying not to be greedy). Is Moloch really gone, or did he just get sent back to hell? If it's the former, who's our big bad now?

Edited December 2, 2014 by Leia1979

[TV Juriste]

Orlando Jone's video tribute to Frank:

I was hoping Frank's death would mean Orlando would have a bigger role in the second half of the season as the new Big Bad or as a Horseman. But this video makes me think, at best, we'll get a few limited appearances from purgatory. Not happy.

[shanndee]

I broke my dvr rule for this?

 

Well. I seem to have posted in the positivity thread too soon. I don't see anything left of the show I fell in love with. What a shame. Is it petty of me to root for the showrunners to be fired?

 

#abbiemillsdeservesbetter

#frankirvingdeservesbetter

#brinbackfrankirving

#SleeyHollowwriterssuck

 

So, so disappointed.

[cynic]

Ugh, I'm so irritated that even as Irving goes out in a BAMF blaze of glory, the show manages to shortchange him. So, basically he sacrificed himself to kill Henry's avatar and then Crane freaking lets him live, endangering them all. If Moloch hadn't been such a jerk, the entire world would have ended, making Irving's dearth even more meaningless than it is now. (The fact that it ended up working out, doesn't even come close to excusing it for me.) To make matters worse, the show minimized the emotional resonance of his death by sidelining him all season and not even once showing the people he supposedly had sacrificed so much for - his family. Did Macey not care that her dad was in prison? Eff the writers for giving Jenny the line that there was no time for him to see his daughter for the last time. I would have been satisfied (and moved) if they had just driven past her school as she was getting out. But nooo! No time for that! We have to save all the time for Crane Family Drama, except for the few minutes we needed to shoehorn Hawley into this episode!

[kimberella]

I'm bringing this here from Tumblr, because it sums up the episode and the season so far perfectly:

A black woman’s voice has no place in this war. Despite how reasonable and patient she may be, despite how she’s a WITNESS and therefore her word should trump everything, her voice goes unheard while the white woman who’s only purpose is exist takes precedence over her.

 

The reaffirmation of white femininity was strong in this episode as well.

No, I didn't expect any better from this show, but it still hurts. No, I didn't expect any better from Crane, because that wouldn't have been true to character. Loyal to Abbie? Never crossed his mind! No, I didn't expect better from Goffman, but I'm still disappointed that John Noble, Mison and Winter take precedence over everything.

This is the kind of show that turns its main villain, Moloch, originally a white creature, into a black one, so that it can be killed without remorse, because only white villains deserve redemption.

A couple of months ago Nicole Beharie attended a convention in London. She was welcome by a full room, something she didn't expect, because she had been told again and again "this would not work without Tom Mison". She was told he was the real star and she counted next to nothing. There is no doubt in my mind it wasn't some random fans trying to demean her. That was Goffman's and his friends' work. They haven't been subtle about how they tried to push her to the background this season. The falling ratings don't seem to be a wake up call for them though.

[Helena Dax]

It was clear that Henry's motivation was not love for his parents but anger at Moloch. I wonder if the Cranes will realize this. Probably not.

Not love, but maybe some kind of faith, of respect? He mocked Ichabod when Ich was offering him a chance, but after Moloch said Henry was nothing, Henry understood (finally!) that Moloch was even a worse dad than his real parents were, (according to Henry himself). Not that I really  give a fuck about that part of the plot, tbh.

 

Loved the episode. I'm sorry Irving died, but I'm sure we'll see him again. I loved the fight between Ichabod and Katrina. To me, it's clear their marriage is falling apart and I've never had  the feeling the writers wanted me to think theirs was an epic love story.  Quite the opposite. 

It never happened in the original story and I see no reason to believe it's going to happen here.

 

I'm starting to ship Katrina and Abraham, if only because I want to see them living together as a family with Henry.  "Hi, I'm Katrina, this is my headless husband and this  is my twenty years older than me son,  Henry".  

 

I  didn't like  that Abbie got injured  so soon. Anyway, she's really the only one thinking clearly, isn't she? Even with Henry's change of heart, I don't think she was mistaken about that. If they had killed Henry first time they got the chance, Moloch wouldn't have been able to do anything. 

[Marie F.]

I was so bored watching this episode.  I kept fast-forwarding –I can't believe that I was even fast-forwarding through some of the Abbie and Ichabod scenes. :( I was so afraid Jenny was going to die, but I’m pissed that it was Irving.  I hope he’s not gone from the show. 

 

The only thing I like about this episode was when Abbie said that she had a bike as a teenager because it made my imagination run and all I could think about was her maybe being a part of Big Ash’s motorcycle club during her rebellious years.  Maybe they had a thing and he was a bad influence on her.  Maybe they broke up after she turned her life around and the reason why she ended things with Luke was because she was still in love with Big Ash but can’t be with him because he’s a bad boy criminal and that’s why the show won’t let her have a love life on screen and we’re just stuck watching Ichabod/Katrina’s boring love story instead and…..  

 

You know, I’m mad that I expected so much from this show and got disappointed.  I really liked it during the first half of the first season, but I think I’m done now.  I really enjoy this board, though, even though this is only my second SH post.  From reading the episode reactions here, I feel like the show is so much better in our imaginations than it is on tv and that's sad.

Edited December 2, 2014 by Aracely

[Shanna]

Hawley is much more tolerable in small doses. I think I would like the character 80% better if he hadn't been so shoved down our throat for his first 5ish episodes and if they hadn't totally sidelined Jenny to bring him on. This was much more the role he should be playing.!

Completely agree. I am ok with him being the guy they call to watch death while they are all busy.

Irving isn't dead dead, his soul is still owned and that needs to be resolved.

What an annoying finale. All the crane bullshit was not satisfying except the part where crane told Katrina he wanted to break it off because she sucks. But this Jeremy thing was bullshit. I think I would have liked it better if he had just gotten sick of mollocks bull and they hadn't tried to force this family drama on us. And if I didn't hate john noble in this role. And I really, really hate him in this role. I liked him on fringe and he was ok as a sin eater but he is terrible as a horseman and old man with abandonment issues.

Shit. Wtf were thinking when they plotted out season 2? They are sidelining the stuff I love about the show and focusing on a bunch of bullshit. Just kill Katrina. Kill Jeremy or make him major background. Make headless headless again because he's much scarier. What a disappointing half season.

Oh, and just in case by some miracle someone at fox reads this, I love Abbie. I love jenny. I love Irving. And I love Crane when you don't saddle him with his bullshit family and have him making dumb ass decisions and acting like a pod person. Fffs, to back to what made this show good and it wasn't Katia and john noble!

Edited December 2, 2014 by Shanna

[wayne67]

I actually liked this episode for about 70% but when Irving died ...

 

I felt nothing. I liked him swinging the sword around killing colonial zombies because it was funny but I kept wondering when he'd turn into a rage zombie and hoping Crane would pry the sword out of his hands before he turned.

 

He's barely been in the show this season and I have a short attention span and I have no idea what was endearing about him in season 1 since that feels like a lifetime ago.

 

And instead the Cranes talked excessively. Yawn.

 

The more Moloch talked the more I said out loud. "Are you serious?" You are the worst evil overlord ever. You do not tell your most powerful minion on the playing field that he's a pawn and he can be replaced easily enough."

 

I'm guessing Henry's betrayal of Moloch is less about redemption and more about realising that trusting a demon to follow through on promises is stupid. Moloch didn't care about Headless not being able to have his prize so why would he follow through with whatever promises he made Henry which I'm forced to presume was something about him being Moloch's right hand man/ son/ lynchpin of the apocalypse.

 

It also made me wonder how many times Moloch has tried this. "Horsemen can be replaced?" Is that the same for Witnesses?

 

At this point I'd rather ditch Ichabod and replace him as a witness with Jenny. Then we can have two sisters fighting the Apocalypse demon of the week ala Supernatural. We can skip all the boring period drama and family drama that the Cranes bring along to the party.

 

I'm hoping Katrina and Henry become the Big Bads of the tail end of season 2.

 

At this point I'm not sure what the cliff hanger was supposed to be or why I should tune in for the next installation but I might watch another couple of episodes before dumping this show on the scrap heap of convoluted plotting.

[chrisvee]

I'm guessing Henry's betrayal of Moloch is less about redemption and more about realising that trusting a demon to follow through on promises is stupid. Moloch didn't care about Headless not being able to have his prize so why would he follow through with whatever promises he made Henry which I'm forced to presume was something about him being Moloch's right hand man/ son/ lynchpin of the apocalypse.

This. There's no real redemption here or any glimmer of the 'good' in Henry that Katrina keeps bleating on about. Mentally!Ill!Manchild!Jenry picked his biological father over his adopted father because his biological father was willing to let him live while his adopted father was willing to toss him on the scrap heap. Jenry got a first hand taste of how empty Moloch's promises are. That's self-interest, not redemption.

What irks me is that in order to get to this 'twist' the writers had to create a situation where Abbie was wrong and Katrina was right. If Ichabod had followed Abbie's advice and struck Jenry down, they may have failed or at a minimum had to sacrifice someone's soul to defeat Moloch. But since Ichabod 'found another way' it opened the way for snatching victory from the jaws of defeat. Which is just galling given Katrina's general uselessness, the lack of actual redemption, and frankly the rift it puts between the Witnesses if they can't trust each other above all else.

Despite how tenderly Crane comforted Abbie, the writers are slowly sucking their chemistry out of the show with their horrendous writing choices.

With the rift in the Cranes' marriage, I guess that will be one of the main points going forward -- Ichabod being won over again by the awesomeness that is Katrina.

Can they please at least get her some clothing other than that ridiculous corset? Ichabod is wearing a coat for goodness sakes and she's prancing around like it's summer.

[DeLurker]

I originally watched the pilot of SH with the hopes of seeing some good bad tv. To my surprise, I got good tv - probably the most original retelling of a classic (?), awesome casting and surprises galore.

Goffman has now converted things to bad tv - and not even good bad. Because I have grown to really like Abbie, Ich* & Jenny, it is sad bad TV for me. RIP Frank.

*when he's not spewing CFD nonsense. I mean, the friggin' Apocalypse is happening this very moment - but let's stop and talk about Katrina and her lies and break up because the Apocalypse is the best time to have emotionally charged chats. And then just go back to calling her "my love".

Edited December 2, 2014 by DeLurker

[Iboatedhere]

I don't believe for a second that Irving is really dead. Maybe I'm being stupid and overly attached to the character and Orlando's live tweeting but I just don't believe it. He has to come back.  

 

Once Abbie was hurt and Jenny (and Katrina but she just stood around doing nothing like always) got her to safety and it was just Crane and Irving fighting I expected the Kindred to come back. That would've been awesome. I miss that guy. Where the hell is he?

 

Loved the motorcycle and that Hawley was put in charge of babysitting. Katrina and Ichabod fighting had me reaching for the popcorn but when he was listing off that she's a spy and a witch I snorted. She sucks at both so what's your point?

 

Like I've said before, I only like Headless when he has no head and THE ONLY THING Katrina can do successfully is make sure we can all see his head. Damn. I mean. goddamn.

[benteen]

Ugh, I'm so irritated that even as Irving goes out in a BAMF blaze of glory, the show manages to shortchange him. So, basically he sacrificed himself to kill Henry's avatar and then Crane freaking lets him live, endangering them all. If Moloch hadn't been such a jerk, the entire world would have ended, making Irving's dearth even more meaningless than it is now. (The fact that it ended up working out, doesn't even come close to excusing it for me.) To make matters worse, the show minimized the emotional resonance of his death by sidelining him all season and not even once showing the people he supposedly had sacrificed so much for - his family. Did Macey not care that her dad was in prison? Eff the writers for giving Jenny the line that there was no time for him to see his daughter for the last time. I would have been satisfied (and moved) if they had just driven past her school as she was getting out. But nooo! No time for that! We have to save all the time for Crane Family Drama, except for the few minutes we needed to shoehorn Hawley into this episode!

 

I think that was the infuriating part.  By not killing Henry when he had the chance, Crane was willing to waste Irving's sacrifice. 

[LydiaMoon1]

Geez, that was a steaming pile of crap,   Where do I begin?  This episode was poorly written, poorly paced, poorly directed, and yeah, I'll say it, poorly acted as well. The fall finale didn't feel epic.  It felt cheap and small. 

 

• Irving is dead (for now), and that makes me mad.  I'm maddest though that his death lacked emotional resonance.  He's been sidelined all season with a throwaway line here and there about sacrificing for his family, but did we get to see his family?  Did we see the impact Macy's demon possession and kidnapping had on her and on Irving's family?  Did we the anguish they must be going through knowing that he was imprisoned protecting Macy? No, but we've seen a helluvalot of CFD. Hell, Team Witness diidn't even miss him until a week ago.  Now he reemerges just to be killed fighting a demon army of what? Ten?  Big Whoop.
• The moment when Abbie realized that Frank died should have been devastating. Instead, Abbie looked like she couldn't remember where she dropped her keys.  Her reaction was lame and weak.  I don't know if that was the result of direction or NB's acting choice, but it was much too muted and understated to have much emotional impact.  NB delivered a big ole bowl of MEH on that one. Still, at least she got to react.
• Jenny wasn't even allowed a reaction shot.
• Tom Mison was just as bad.  He still has no chemistry with Katia Winter's Katrina, and, for the first time, he really didn't have it with Abbie either.  Season 2 has really taken a toll on the Ichabbie dynamic, and their interactions seemed forced and false to me.  In fact, even his usual Crane quips (like his comment about wanting to get a motorcycle) felt forced.  Plus, the writers have turned him into a douche.
• Katia Winter graced us with her usual blank-faced "acting". Yeah, I get it show.  The sun rises and sets in tribute to her colossal blandness.  She's the show's leading lady and more important than a Witness and her half-assed contributions to Team Witness of witchcraft (even though witchcraft is strictly forbidden by the bible) and inept attempts at spying never work.
• John Noble, who usually never met a scene he couldn't chew, was unusually restrained last night when a few histrionics may have helped keep the boredom at bay. Henry and his whiny angst and Mommy/Daddy issues have grown more tiresome with each passing week.
• The endless CFD slows the show's pacing to a crawl, and did I mention that it's endless?

 

I could go on, but why bother.  This show effectively ended the moment they decided to make every aspect of the Apocolypse All About Katrina. Stick a forck in SH.  It's done.

Edited December 2, 2014 by LydiaMoon1

[Jipijapa]

They killed Frank?  Jeez, glad I stopped watching this show a few weeks ago.

[tv echo]

I must be watching a different show because I don't hate the Cranes (although I don't like Katrina and think she's the weak link on the show), so I'll join the minority here.

 

I saw Jenny come up with the idea that Frank should be the one to wield the sword since his soul was already claimed.  Abbie and Ichabod agreed, and then Frank agreed.  Yet only Ichabod is being condemned here for Frank's death.

 

I saw Ichabod telling Jenny to take an injured Abbie away to safety while he, Frank and Katrina continued to fight Moloch's army.  I saw Frank telling Ichabod "no, let me" and charging forward with the sword when the Horseman of War's 'avatar' galloped up.  I saw Frank being a badass swordsman before heroically triumphing even though he was mortally wounded.

 

I saw Ichabod arguing with Abbie about who should next wield the sword to kill Moloch.  Ichabod wanted to be the one, but Abbie insisted on being the one and she was holding the sword at the time.  Ichabod respected her decision and then listened to her plan.  I then saw Abbie, Ichabod, Katrina and Jenny each being willing to sacrifice their soul to use the sword to kill Moloch.  Then I saw that Abbie's plan apparently involved Abbie using a fake sword to provide a distraction, while Ichabod was the one to sacrifice his soul by using the real sword to kill Henry.

 

I saw Ichabod holding the sword to Henry's throat and making a last-ditch plea to save Henry's soul while being fully prepared to run him through.  Ichabod obviously miscalculated and was taken in by Henry's fake remorse.  I do have sympathy for Ichabod and Katrina as parents, though.  Having recently sat down to Thanksgiving dinner with loved ones, I know how difficult it must be to turn away from or give up on a family member - even a long lost one.  If Henry had been Abbie's biological son, perhaps a child she gave up for adoption when she was a teen and magically grown into an adult who became an evil Horseman, would we have more sympathy for Abbie's reluctance to kill her own child?

 

I don't think Henry is redeemed at all, so Katrina's faith in him was not rewarded - she was not right.  I think Ichabod had already lost much of his faith in Henry and only made that last-minute effort to save Henry for Katrina's sake.  Henry killed Moloch because Moloch betrayed him, not to save his parents.  I think Henry will die by season's end.  Moloch said to Henry that "there have been Horsemen before you, and there will be Horsemen after you."  Sounds like foreshadowing to me.

 

I think Moloch's gone, but I agree that we haven't seen the last of Frank.  I wouldn't be surprised if the back half of this season involved them trying to save Frank's soul. 

 

I've read some of the post-episode interviews with the show runner, and it sounds like they'll be going back to more episodes centered on the two Witnesses as a team, so I'm looking forward to that.

Edited December 2, 2014 by tv echo

[Kanner]

I just keep coming back to thinking the writers want me to feel a certain way about something but I either don't care, have the opposite opinion, or think they are just doing a bad job at showing it.

 

The Cranes' relationship - don't care.

Katrina is awesome - disagree

Henry's possible redemption - doing a bad job

In general I like a good redemption story but I don't want Henry redeemed for two big reasons 1) he killed Irving, 2) that would prove the Cranes right about him and they were so annoying with the "there is still good in him" that it would make me sick. If the show doesn't want to redeem Henry that is great but the whole "there is still good him" needs to stop. However, with his actions against Moloch I don't see an end to it.

[DearEvette]

So... what was that?

 

It took me a bit to process, but I finally figured out why I was underwhelmed by this episode. 

 

Where were the emotional stakes? 

 

Yes, I am sad Irving died, but I am not gutted like I was by, say, the way Person of Interest killed off Carter.  And this isn't just because this is Sleepy Hollow and there is a strong possibility that Irving will be back in some form.  But because by making Frank so invisible for so much of the season and by making him feel so expendable, it was no surprise and hence had no emotional reverberation when he was killed.

 

Which brings me to my big confusion.  So how is it that Abraham is the Horseman of Death and could be killed.  If Frank had killed Death both Abraham and Death would be dead.  But killing The Horseman of War does nothing to Henry?  Frank's death is even worse then because it is utterly pointless, since all he did was kill a Thing we never actually saw do anything.   Henry was the one doing all these awful things in Sleepy Hollow, not this fiery sword guy on a horse.  So in end all Frank did was kill an Avatar?

 

Which leaves Henry alive and kicking and able to monologue with his parents endlessly.  Until he kills Moloch.  Big Whoop.  Who gives a fuck about Moloch?  His death has no emotional resonance.

 

Gah!

 

Without emotional stakes, the whole thing feels like a frustrating exercise in futility.

Edited December 2, 2014 by DearEvette

[Sandman]

Judging by that interview, Goffman's hot for Katrina, and will find reasons to keep her in the show. He knows the character's not awesome, despite the show's insistence (and his own) to the contrary.

Edited December 2, 2014 by Sandman

[Mia Nina]

What a colossal waste of time this show has been. It amazes me, really, what it has become and how terrible the writing has been. It is unfathomable. I can't comment on the ending because I didn't make it that far. I simply fast forward until the episode ended and turned it off.

 

The mythology of this show is tremendously ineffective.  How can the personification of the Horseman of War be such a wimp? How can Death be such a wimp? How can this demon Moloch be destroyed in such a way? I understand that shows have limitations, but it's such a stupid concept anyway. I keep comparing this to Supernatural because I believe Supernatural botched its mythology halfway through, but at least they got their personification of the Horsemen somewhat OK and in line with the established tone of its universe.

 

What Sleepy Hollow did last night was preposterous in the most confounding way. We had "End Times" because it hailed blood and thunder rolled? What about humanity? People were still partying? What about the great earthquake, the confusion, etc. This show is a mess and and it is not even entertaining anymore. So the purpose of the "End Times" was so Henry could have a moment? For crying out loud, pick a different source next time.

 

Look, if you're going to give Abbie and Crane the title of Witnesses, please, at least honor that title one bit.

 

From Revelation 11: 5-6 about the Two Witnesses:

 

5 And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner. 6 These have power to shut heaven, so that no rain falls in the days of their prophecy; and they have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to strike the earth with all plagues, as often as they desire. 

 

This is how the season should have ended, Revelation 11: 7-8:

 

7 When they finish their testimony, the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit will make war against them, overcome them, and kill them. 8 And their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city...

 

And they could have started the next chapter with Abbie and Crane resurrected after three and a half days like it says in Scripture.

 

But then again, Henry having 'a moment' was just super important that derailing the entire show and killing Frank in the process made perfect sense just so we could have that wonderful, bombastic, unexpected cathartic moment. Shakespeare who?

Edited December 2, 2014 by Mia Nina

[lisaloopner]

This was a missed golden opportunity: they could have had Poochie try to pour a roofie down the Headless Horseman's neck and have it spray back up in his face, resulting in the most epic, "Whoa, dude!" moment yet.

Seeing Katrina's Terrible Wig pulled back to expose the lace front made me realize they missed another golden opportunity: When Katrina came to the present and they dressed her in modern clothes, there was no reason not to get her a modern hairstyle "to make you harder to find," and have her lose that Kanekalon eyesore in favor of whatever's under it. If they're sticking to the story that that's Katrina's natural color, they could add a dye job to the story, or color the actress's hair.

If Abbie's wound was mild enough that she was able to fight again so soon, I'm not sure why she and Jenny left the field in the first place, but I *guess* subsequent doeses of shock and adrenaline can do weird things to the body.

I still hold out hope that since Henry claimed Frank's soul for Moloch, that there's some kind of mumbo-jumbo clause to the contract that can bring Frank back to life now that Moloch's dead. Maybe I'm just grabbing at straws, but it wouldn't be the strangest thing that's happened on this show.

All in all, a better finale than I was expecting, given how the last few months have mostly gone.

[Tippi Blevins]

So... Henry killed Moloch with the special Sword. Does that mean he's going to die? Because one death for another, to restore balance? Or is he immune to that rule because his soul is already promised to Moloch?

 

He said he could use the sword with impunity because he's immortal. 

 

How did Methuselah manage to use the sword against all those demons, though? I mean, Methuselah was crazy old, but he wasn't immortal or, I reckon, soulless.

[DkNNy79]

We could all tell that Ichabod wasn't going to have the cojones to take Henry out.  Especially with Katrina there.  Fine, then he should be honest about that and let Abbie be the one to do it.

 

When the show resumes I need Abbie to be a little PO'd at Ichabod.

[DeLurker]

So let me get this straight - Abbie gets shot and Jenny takes care of her instead of the Quaker nurse*/witch who should have been able to heal her (but given Katrina's track record, Jenny was the way better choice).  And Jenny, who has been in some untold freaky situations and can handle herself in a fight, does not go with Ich.

 

Irving gets jabbed, still manages to kill the Horseman of Atari and then the ineffectual nurse/witch is "too weak" to be of any help.

 

They scurry back to the church with the sword, but when Henry comes to retrieve it the one he gets from Abbie is a decoy.  How did they magic up the decoy?  With Katrina's powers that couldn't save Frank?

 

So much hate.

 

ETA * Katrina's a freaking nurse!  I kind of glazed over that in my rage so in addition to being able to cure (not!) with magic, she should have been able to at least provide real medical assistance.  I need to go take my blood pressure medicine.  Mind roasting, completely utterly mind roasting.

Edited December 2, 2014 by DeLurker

[BrokenRemote]

I am 100% confident that Irving is not dead.  His soul will be reclaimed early in the next episode, and it will be put back into his body by the means of some exotic paranormal artifact that Hawley (not Jenny, of course, heaven forbid she does anything in her wheelhouse when a white guy can do it) obtains.  The soul re-entering his body will reignite his spark of life and he'll be free.

[Mrs OldManBalls]

I didn't realize that I was hugging myself during Frank's battle with War, and Frank dying until the commercial break.

I adore OJ and hope this isn't the end of his character. ( Can't he have an identical twin? Pretty please???) At least he died a shaft-esque BAMF hero. Rambro indeed.

 

Katrina is like that girl your friend dates that is a raging bitch, you don't know why he's with her, she ruins all the fun, is destroying the relationship, and you struggle to put up with her for your friends sake. She's a colonial Yoko Ono. 

 

One of the Mills sisters needs to put that sword up Ichabod's ass. He's not worth the trouble he's causing.

 

 

I hate that the Cranes get proven right about Henry - that shouldn't have happened.

I don't think they've been proven right......

 

 Second, it was clearly more than Moloch pushed his manipulations of Jeremy too far and they backfired.

....I think this is all it amounts to. We'll have to wait and see what the fallout is. 

 

 

What happens to Irving' daughter?

 

Team Witness promised Frank they'd take care of her. Suffice it to say she's not going to have the easiest of times. Especially if Katrina is involved. 

 

The only enjoyable part was Ichabod finally confronting the wife over her lies, but you know this won't last, because SHE is the one who said - let's not be married any more...

I hope this leads to some sort of "WE WERE ON A BREAK!" scenario when she hooks up with Abraham ( we all know she's going to). 

 

Orlando Jone's video tribute to Frank:

 

Orlando Jones has an absolutely beautiful smile. 

[BrokenRemote]

Geez, that was a steaming pile of crap,   Where do I begin?  This episode was poorly written, poorly paced, poorly directed, and yeah, I'll say it, poorly acted as well. The fall finale didn't feel epic.  It felt cheap and small. 

 

• Irving is dead (for now), and that makes me mad.  I'm maddest though that his death lacked emotional resonance.  He's been sidelined all season with a throwaway line here and there about sacrificing for his family, but did we get to see his family?  Did we see the impact Macy's demon possession and kidnapping had on her and on Irving's family?  Did we the anguish they must be going through knowing that he was imprisoned protecting Macy? No, but we've seen a helluvalot of CFD. Hell, Team Witness diidn't even miss him until a week ago.  Now he reemerges just to be killed fighting a demon army of what? Ten?  Big Whoop.
• The moment when Abbie realized that Frank died should have been devastating. Instead, Abbie looked like she couldn't remember where she dropped her keys.  Her reaction was lame and weak.  I don't know if that was the result of direction or NB's acting choice, but it was much too muted and understated to have much emotional impact.  NB delivered a big ole bowl of MEH on that one. Still, at least she got to react.
• Jenny wasn't even allowed a reaction shot.
• Tom Mison was just as bad.  He still has no chemistry with Katia Winter's Katrina, and, for the first time, he really didn't have it with Abbie either.  Season 2 has really taken a toll on the Ichabbie dynamic, and their interactions seemed forced and false to me.  In fact, even his usual Crane quips (like his comment about wanted to get a motorcycle) felt forced.  Plus, the writers have turned him into a douche.
• Katia Winter graced us with her usual blank-faced "acting". Yeah, I get it show.  The sun rises and sets in tribute to her colossal blandness.  She's the show's leading lady and more important than a Witness and her half-assed contributions to Team Witness of witchcraft (even though witchcraft is strictly forbidden by the bible) and inept attempts at spying never work.
• John Noble, who usually never met a scene he couldn't chew, was unusually restrained last night when a few histrionics may have helped keep the boredom at bay. Henry and his whiny angst and Mommy/Daddy issues have grown more tiresome with each passing week.
• The endless CFD slows the show's pacing to a crawl, and did I mention that it's endless?

 

I could go on, but why bother.  This show effectively ended the moment they decided to make every aspect of the Apocolypse All About Katrina. Stick a forck in SH.  It's done.

I didn't find her reaction lame and weak!  Ichabod had to hold her back from running out there to where Frank's body lay.  She was over-the-top wild with distress and fury.

 

I don't understand what her injury was.  It was bad enough that she had to leave the battle, but in the church Jenny had Abbie,s shirt pulled over to reveal a shoulder with no wound I could see.  And then she was able to struggle with Crane quite violently, wield the magic sword (I can buy that it did a lot of the work, but she still had to move around a lot), struggle against the vines--I felt like her injury couldn't be that bad, so why did she leave the field?  As someone said, maybe the actress was ill, or maybe it can be waved away as adrenaline, but it seems like this was the fight of her life, the battle that all of this hard work and pain has been for, and I can't see Abbie letting herself be sidelined by anything less than a crippling or mortal wound.  

 

All in all I liked the episode.  I dislike what's happened in some of the episodes this season, but if I want to keep watching I have to let go of the bad writing and just move forward with Abbie and Ichabod.  For me it's about the two of them and their partnership, and that's what I want to see.   I can't with the battle of who's suffered more, or the idea that Crane has to pay for his recent perceived slights of Abbie.  I'm happy to see Crane ready to consider dropping his epic love for Katrina, and the hinting that she will wind up with Abraham, and I see that as a step in the right direction.

Edited December 2, 2014 by BrokenRemote

[Neurochick]

The episode sucked.

 

If Irving's dead and we're stuck with Katrina, then I'm done.  This is almost as bad as when POI killed its only POC, Carter.  Not as bad but damn close.

 

Typical bullshit episode, let the white man save the day.  

 

I hope I don't have to say, "bye Felecia" to this show, but it's getting pretty close.

[DearEvette]

He said he could use the sword with impunity because he's immortal.

 

 

But ...see... this is why I have a headache with this show.  Immortal doesn't mean you can't die, it just means you can't die by natural causes.  Unnatural one, yes.  Or even just plain old murder.   In the show's mythology, Witches are immortal unless otherwise killed which is why Henry and Katrina are still alive.  But Katrina's coven, Reverend Knapp, Serilda of Abbadon etc. were all killed.  So his immortality should have not shielded him from death in wielding the sword.

 

Which brings me to the soul thing.   I assume the fact that he had no soul allowed him to wield the sword?  But didn't Katrina say that killing Moloch would release Henry's soul?  How?  Either you give up your soul or you don't.  Frank made a point of saying although Henry owned his soul he hadn't given it up completely.  Henry went all in.  How does he merit a backsie?

[BestestAuntEver]

One of the Mills sisters needs to put that sword up Ichabod's ass. He's not worth the trouble he's causing.

I haven't watched last week or this week's episodes. Take away my distrust based of the writers and showrunners based upon multiple interviews and I'm still stuck with a horribly written show that lacks world building, mythology and urgency. This season has made me hate John Noble, CFD and Ichabod. My hatred of Katrina simply multiplied 10 fold.

Multiple times I've wanted to reach through the screen and punch or stab Ichabod. I don't buy the lies he tells Abie about being a witness or team. I've wanted Abbie to tell him to FOAD.

The awful horrible plot point agenda writing has done this.

I was going to watch the last 2 episodes yet I'm considering deleting them and leaving Mama as my last perception of this show.

FYI, I wanted to stab Ichabod during that episode as well.

When this show is canceled and it will be sooner rather than later, I want NB to be signed by ABC. They aren't afraid to use POC or WOC as leads.

[el perro fumando]

I'll add my voice to the small minority of folks who enjoyed the show last night and who liked the direction it took with the Cranes. I like that they had it out, and I'll be interested to see where it goes from here. As long as the show doesn't drop it and have them all fine again now that Henry killed Moloch (and I agree that it wasn't some huge redemptive moment; I saw it as Henry throwing yet another tantrum about yet another parent's betrayal - with this one being an actual betrayal, whereas Katrina was trying to protect him and Crane didn't even know he existed). I thought it was a great moment, and I really am intrigued to see where things pick up when the show returns. Will Henry release our foursome from the trees? Will he team with them? Pretend to team with them? Walk away as the new Big Bad? No idea. But I'm intrigued. While my preference going in last night was for Crane to kill Henry (as I would have enjoyed the show going that dark with his character), I'm good with the Cranes separating and Henry killing Moloch.

 

I'm not thrilled with poor Irving's death, since he was sidelined for most of the season and brought back to die, but I guess I used up my wrath earlier in the season when "Bones" killed a character off pointlessly (IMO) and I stopped watching. At least Irving was a badass MFing hero! He not only fought back but he took out a freakin' Horseman! Now THAT'S the way to send off a beloved character. And all of his friends were around him and filled with anger/grief. Abbie, of course, was broken up and on fire. But I really also loved Crane with the Captain there at the end. His attempts to encourage Irving, his panic, Katrina's panic, trying to save him. That really was heartbreakingly written. Of course, it also helps that this is a supernatural show, so I have faith that Irving will return somehow. That's my story and I'm sticking with it for as long as possible!

 

This season has definitely been a little slow at moving forward, but I guess I'm used to shows with big mytharcs that have to drag out over a longer season, so I can live with it. It doesn't have the breakneck pace that season 1 had (probably due to the 5 extra episodes), but now that we'll be headed to the back half of the season, I'm hoping it will just continue picking up momentum and rolling toward ... something! Now that Moloch is dead, I really am perplexed as to where the show is going to go next with our ragtag team of heroes, but I can't wait to find out.

[DeLurker]

 

I'll add my voice to the small minority of folks who enjoyed the show last night and who liked the direction it took with the Cranes.

I so envy you because all I've got is so much hate.  Said in all sincerity.

 

Another thing that pissed me off is Irving dies with 20 or so minutes left to go in the show.  Ending with his death would have been a great stopping point for the break and would have ended the ep and first half of the season on a truly dramatic note.  They could have shown Ich's anger at Katrina, Abbie's grief, Jenny's grief, and even Katrina's distress over the failing.  The balance of the ep did not take advantage of the impact that Irving's death and build on it so it whimpered out the rest of the ep and the first half of the season.