S01.E08: The Lord of the Tides

[Meredith Quill]

Quote

Episode Synopsis:

Six years later. With the Driftmark succession suddenly critical, Rhaenyra attempts to strike a bargain with Rhaenys.

Reminder: 

This is for discussion of the TV show only, no book talk allowed - including saying "but it's different in the books". Any other spoilers (previews, media articles, etc) and HotD extras (After The Episode, Behind The Scenes, etc) should be in spoiler tags.

[steelyis]

Not gonna lie, as much as I dislike Viserys, that was grisly and I wouldn't wish it on anyone. RIP for real. The man can finally rest. Damn.

"Nephews! Come to train?" Aemond! That's my boy right there!

[AimingforYoko]

Damn, Viserys went full Cryptkeeper at the end there. I'd argue Vaemond had the better end, if shorter life.

If I didn't know any better, I'd think Daemon kinda admires his nephew. (The one with one eye, that is.)

[Constantinople]

Vaemond Velaryon: When Keeping It Real Goes Wrong

[Guest]

Dang, Vaemond. That is not the way to get a head.

[LanceM]

Atleast Vaemond got to keep his tongue

Edited October 10, 2022 by LanceM

[FormerMod-a1]

WTH does Visyris have that turns him into a walking skeleton.  I don't remember seeing that in GOT.  He's beginning to look like a wight.  

I do not like that this Rhaenyra is so soft-spoken and seems cowed most the time.  Where is the fire?

I am glad they could give Visyris one good family night before he passed. Darn his muttering at the end in front of Alicent.  

Who ordered the roast pig and then had them put it in front of Aemond?  That wasn't very nice.  Makes me thing it was Aegon.  

[mac123x]

Maybe it's just the wig and the prominent chin, but Aemon looks remarkably like his uncle Daemon.  He has a good Matt Smith-esque smirk too.

Having Alicent decide to push for Aegon based on a misunderstanding is pretty contrived.  She might have started to reconcile a little with Rhaenyra, but there are plenty of reasons (namely Otto and Ser Criston) that would push her that way anyway.  There was no need for this Three's Company mistaken plotline.

Edited October 10, 2022 by mac123x

[Constantinople]

I hope before he passed, Viserys had a chance to see eye to eye with his son Aemond

[steelyis]

2 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

I hope before he passed, Viserys had a chance to see eye to eye with his son Aemond

Yoooooo! Too soon! 😆🤣☠️

[Cristofle]

The wordless interactions between Aemond and Daemon were a highlight - Aemond seeming to enjoy Daemon relieving Vaemond of everything from the tongue up and then Daemon stepping up at the end and Aemond clearly realizing this was someone he could not easily mess with. It's not a ton of screentime but it highlights that these two are likely the most dangerous of their respective sides.

Watching the poor girl sob in front of Alicent after Aegon raped her was brutal. And clearly this is an ongoing habit. 

The "Aegon" "Aegon" is giving me GoT S8 flashbacks, lol. STOP NAMING ALL YOUR KIDS AEGON. 

No sympathy for Vaemond. Daemon basically told him what was about to happen and he went ahead and did it anyway. Bye.

I'm going to miss Paddy. Viserys showing up one last time for Rhaenyra was kind of heartbreaking, as was Daemon helping him to the throne and crowning him for a final time. 

[FormerMod-a1]

Did Rhaenyra and Daemon really name their first son Aegon?  It's bad enough having so many similar names, now we have 2 living characters with the exact same name.

[bluvelvet]

So I was trying to enjoy a glass of prosecco during this episode but couldn't due to looking at Viserys - UGH

So Alicent misinterprets what Viserys had to say who thought he was speaking to Rhaenyra

Daemon and Aemond look like father/son and I get the sense they are both as vicious.

Don't remember who but someone called Daemon and Rhaenyra's kids becoming bethrothed

Aegon is ...special - most definitely not good king material - looks like he and his sister got some children

BYE Vaemond, we hardly knew ye.

I did a little clap when Viserys walked into that throne room..I also noted he called Rhaenyra his "only child", although he was on milk of the poppy at the time. He really his ride of die for her and I think it has to do with his love for Aemma.  I also think that is who he was reaching for at the end, his true love.  At least he died with a good memory.

Jacerys and Lucerys need to just ignore Aegon and Aemond.  I also swore it looked like Aemond was eyeing Lucery's betrothed ( can't rememeber if that is Baela or Rhaena) - Lucerys is the second one correct??

Also BOOO..no dragon sitings

[Karen885]

How does Viserys look like he is 100 and Daemon has barely aged at all.  They didn't seem that far apart in age in the first episode.

[JennyMominFL]

35 minutes ago, aquarian1 said:

WTH does Visyris have that turns him into a walking skeleton.  I don't remember seeing that in GOT.  He's beginning to look like a wight.  

I do not like that this Rhaenyra is so soft-spoken and seems cowed most the time.  Where is the fire?

I am glad they could give Visyris one good family night before he passed. Darn his muttering at the end in front of Alicent.  

Who ordered the roast pig and then had them put it in front of Aemond?  That wasn't very nice.  Makes me thing it was Aegon.  

I read a great book about leprosy, which Paddy Considine says Viserys has, called the Island. It was fiction but was about the actual leper colony of Spinalonga in Greece. Its a great book but, i digress. Apparently, some people with leprosy get lesions in their nose and throat which make it very difficult to eat. They would often the. die of malnutrition or when their throats eventually closed off completely. So getting super skinny does make sense.

Edited October 10, 2022 by JennyMominFL

[LanceM]

So It looks like Mysaria has moved on up to the East side.

Edited October 10, 2022 by LanceM

[magdalene]

23 minutes ago, AimingforYoko said:

Damn, Viserys went full Cryptkeeper at the end there. I'd argue Vaemond had the better end, if shorter life.

If I didn't know any better, I'd think Daemon kinda admires his nephew. (The one with one eye, that is.)

Like recognizes like. they won't bore each other.

I usually watch these episodes multiple times, but I doubt I can bring myself to do that with this one.  I had a very hard time looking at Viserys through the episode.

Corliss' brother was a moron. As soon as he called Rhaenyra a whore I went "he dead".

I think Viserys is 44 at the time of his death.

Edited October 10, 2022 by magdalene

[dramachick]

Rest in peace, Ser Vaemond. You weren't wrong, but you should have known it was suicide to call them out like that.

So Viserys thought he was talking to Rhaenyra on his deathbed, Alicent misunderstands, and now it's on. The story practically writes itself.

[AimingforYoko]

Just now, dramachick said:

The story practically writes itself.

George wishes.

[scarynikki12]

The wild thing is this Westerosi Thanksgiving was not nearly as dramatic as many in America.

Ok Aegon still looks like a teenager while Aemond looks twenty something. This may be on purpose to demonstrate that Otto’s plan for the throne is forever a spoiled child in spirit. He snarks on Jace’s ability in bed but regularly rapes servants and his wife (my interpretation of her drunk remark). Egg, hon, I promise you’ll never be able to please a woman no matter the status of Jace’s love life. I know he was somehow behind the pig being placed in front of Aemond as well. 

[cambridgeguy]

I guess Vaemond decided to heck with it, there's no way I can come back from this so might as well go out shouting the truth.  A quick death probably beats the tongue removal and exile from Driftmark that likely would have been the alternative.

[Constantinople]

Is it me or did Alicent order a Big Gulp Moon Tea for Dyana?

That looked so much larger than Rhaenyra's moon tea at the end of Episode 4.

[FnkyChkn34]

Are Baby Aegon and Baby Viserys twins? Seems like it, but I don't know if they said something that I missed. 

[Cristofle]

3 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

Ok Aegon still looks like a teenager while Aemond looks twenty something.

This was getting me too. Why do Aegon and Helaena still look to be in their late teens while Aemond appears to be pushing 30?

I've changed my mind from previous episodes. Helaena is obviously the best of Alicent's children. A++++++ toast. 

[scarynikki12]

Just now, FnkyChkn34 said:

Are Baby Aegon and Baby Viserys twins? Seems like it, but I don't know if they said something that I missed. 

One baby looked slightly older so maybe they’re the Westerosi equivalent of Irish twins.

[Chicago Redshirt]

3 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

The wild thing is this Westerosi Thanksgiving was not nearly as dramatic as many in America.

Ok Aegon still looks like a teenager while Aemond looks twenty something. This may be on purpose to demonstrate that Otto’s plan for the throne is forever a spoiled child in spirit. He snarks on Jace’s ability in bed but regularly rapes servants and his wife (my interpretation of her drunk remark). Egg, hon, I promise you’ll never be able to please a woman no matter the status of Jace’s love life. I know he was somehow behind the pig being placed in front of Aemond as well. 

My interpretation of her remark is that Aegon does not try to have sex with her and focuses on those who he can lord over. I might be misinterpreting things, but it seems like they don't have any kids. Which because they are brother and sister, good. 

[SeanC]

1 minute ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

I might be misinterpreting things, but it seems like they don't have any kids. 

Helaena said that Dyana the maid was supposed to be helping with the children when she first entered that scene.

[scarynikki12]

1 minute ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

I might be misinterpreting things, but it seems like they don't have any kids.

I swear Alicent said something about Aegon having children but I may have misheard.

[Scarlett45]

I have to say, I want to give a big shout out to Eve Best for her portrayal as Princess Rhaenys. It’s a part without a lot of flashy dialogue but she’s done an excellent job. LOVE HER. 

[mac123x]

7 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

Is it me or did Alicent order a Big Gulp Moon Tea for Dyana?

That looked so much larger than Rhaenyra's moon tea at the end of Episode 4.

Later Helaena asks where Dyana is, so I assumed the "tea" was poison and Dyana is sleeping with the fishes.

Speaking of Helaena:  "Beware the beast below the floor".  Sounds like another "he'll have to close an eye" prophecy.  

[Scarlett45]

8 minutes ago, SeanC said:

Helaena said that Dyana the maid was supposed to be helping with the children when she first entered that scene.

7 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I swear Alicent said something about Aegon having children but I may have misheard.

Yes Aegon and his wife/sister  have children. Aegon is such a creep, seems like raping the servants is a habit. I was scared for the poor girl for a while (that Alicent might have her harmed) but she gave her some money and moon tea. At least give her another posting far away from your fucking rapist son. I wonder what Viserys would say if he knew Aegon was so awful (I can’t see Viserys allowing that behavior from a member of the royal family). 

[magdalene]

Did they imply that Aegon is raping his sister/wife? Or am I misunderstanding?

Daemon helping Viserys onto the throne and putting the crown on his head was a very touching moment considering their long time troubled and fraught relationship.

Edited October 10, 2022 by magdalene

[Constantinople]

24 minutes ago, Karen885 said:

How does Viserys look like he is 100 and Daemon has barely aged at all.  They didn't seem that far apart in age in the first episode.

It's the difference between chasing the dragon and riding it.

[thuganomics85]

Damn, it finally happened!  Viserys' time on this mortal realm has finally came to an end.  Frankly, I'm still surprised that he lasted as long as he did.  Dude was getting worse and worse each episode and I feel like another one would have just turned him into a full on zombie/mummy at the rate he was going!  Fare thee well, Viserys!  A lot of mixed emotions here.  On one hand, I think a lot of his decision making was flawed, he clearly did play favorites with his family, and at the end of the day,  I feel like a lot of the horror that will likely transpire in the future will be traced back to his actions (or lack there of.)  On the other hand, I really do think he wanted peace for his family and the realm, and despite his sins, wasn't a horrible man.  He just never should have been king.  I also think that losing Aemma (and his part in causing her more pain and suffering for her final moments) just broke him in ways even he never realized, and just went down a path he could never claw his way out of.  In another world/dimension, he probably would have lived a happy life as a noble with his true love, the daughter he truly did care for, and continuing to work on his impressive models.  Alas, that's not how things usually go in Westeros!  Gold star Paddy Considine who did wonders with a role that could have easily been trite or one note in lesser hands.

Anyway, so Corlys is apparently knocking on deaths door, which leads to Vaemond challenging the rite to inheriting Driftmark since he doesn't want one of the "bastards" to get it.  This understandably concerns Rhaenyra because if it goes his way, I guess it would have been open season on the rest of her family and her own claim to the throne.  And it almost looked like it went that way since Otto and Alicent were pretty much running the show for years and fully intended to back Vaemond.  But say what you will about his favoritism, Viserys went all out at preventing that from happening!  Vaemond did get a few last words in though and was the first to openly declare Rhaenyra's children bastards.  Good news is he still keeps his tongue.  Bad news is that Daemon separates pretty much the rest of his head from his body.  Ouch!

Did like seeing how Rhaenyra/Daemon's deceit from last week does have consequences, with Rhaenys resenting them for assuming they were the ones that killed Laenor.  Even if they told her the truth, I honestly don't think she will believe them at this point.  I wonder what is in store for her?  If Corlys dies, I really don't see her lasting much longer.  She already seems to be broken down after all of her losses.

More casting changes with the kids, I see.  Actors all seem to be good enough fits.  Aemond still scares me, but I think Aegon reclaims the spot of biggest douchebag with how he apparently likes to spend his free time raping servants and getting into pissing contests with Jace for no real reason.  Of course, it's becoming more and more clear that Helaena is probably the only one of Alicent's kids who isn't a complete monster.  She just wants to do her own thing, man!  Getting some Luna Lovegood from Harry Potter vibes, which I dig.

Another wedding arraignment between people who all share the same blood and family members, but since they all actually seem thrilled by it, that's pretty much a win for this show!  Oh, you crazy Targaryens!

 Just when it looks like Rhaenyra and Alicent finally form something that resembles peace between them, Alicent misinterprets Viserys' dying words for him wanting her Aegon to assume the thrown, so that's all gone to hell already.  Seems a bit unnecessary since I suspect it would have never lasted thanks to the kids always being at each others' throats and no doubt Otto would have found some way to keep meddling, but I guess this is a way for Alicent to claim to herself (and others) that she will be "in the right" for going after the throne and usurping Rhaenyra.  Of course, I suspect a whole bunch of people; including a lot of innocents; will be caught in the crossfire when this is all said and done.

Edited October 10, 2022 by thuganomics85

[Lady Whistleup]

Well is Criston bionic? While everyone ages rapidly (Alicent's kids now look roughly the same age as their mother), Criston doesn't even get a silver hair on his curly mop. 

Alicent reacted with more compassion towards Dyana than I expected. At least Dyana got a good amount of money for her suffering.

Alicent's children are so lovely. She must be all sorts of proud.

Rhaenyra wants to marry her Strong children to Daemon's daughters? Just what Westeros needs, more incest!

RIP Viserys. He was the closest thing the series had to a good man. I admire how much he loved Rhaenyra. He didn't abandon her for the new shiny thing.

[ShannaB]

42 minutes ago, mac123x said:

Maybe it's just the wig and the prominent chin, but Aemon looks remarkably like his uncle Daemon.  He has a good Matt Smith-esque smirk too.

He walks like Matt Smith as well.

[AntFTW]

27 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

The wild thing is this Westerosi Thanksgiving was not nearly as dramatic as many in America.

No one mentioned politics 😂

[arachne]

Hey, the king asked for tongue, not headcheese! 

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Alicent reacted with more compassion towards Dyana than I expected. At least Dyana got a good amount of money for her suffering.

I don’t think she showed any compassion. She did a decent job faking it briefly, but then she just returned to being her miserable self.

[AntFTW]

2 minutes ago, deaja said:

I don’t think she showed any compassion. She did a decent job faking it briefly, but then she just returned to being her miserable self.

Agreed. It was fake compassion, just long enough for Dyana to take the hush money.

[Lady Whistleup]

4 minutes ago, deaja said:

I don’t think she showed any compassion. She did a decent job faking it briefly, but then she just returned to being her miserable self.

Well she did believe the poor girl. That’s more than I expected.

[Scarlett45]

17 minutes ago, magdalene said:

Did they imply that Aegon is raping his sister/wife? Or am I misunderstanding?

No that’s what they meant. 

[AntFTW]

I turned away for one second. Then, I hear doors open, they announced the King, and this regal music starts to play. I look back and see the scene of the open room with people bowing with the regal music still playing... and my first thought is "MUFASA?"

Edited October 10, 2022 by AntFTW

[Lady Whistleup]

I must say I really enjoyed watching the unbreakable father/daughter bond of Viserys/Rhaenyra. It's pretty rare in Westeros.

[paigow]

So many Pulp Fiction vibes....

Aemond: My nephews are so Strong

Jace: Say Strong again motherfucker, I dare you., I double dare you.

Was the full title of this episode supposed to be- Lord Of The Tides: The Tides Of Power ???

Edited October 10, 2022 by paigow

[sistermagpie]

11 minutes ago, deaja said:

I don’t think she showed any compassion. She did a decent job faking it briefly, but then she just returned to being her miserable self.

7 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Well she did believe the poor girl. That’s more than I expected.

Yes, I thought it was more that it was nice that she wasn't in denial about Aegon. She couldn't blame the girl because she knows her son's a rapist shit. But she wasn't feeling compassion for the girl so much as shame and fury at Aegon. But that isn't to say she didn't feel any. I thought when she hugged her that was Alicent allowing a bit of her former human self come out. She knows who's in the wrong here.

[jcin617]

23 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Rhaenyra wants to marry her Strong children to Daemon's daughters? Just what Westeros needs, more incest!

They are first cousins, once removed on the Targaryen side and are presumed to be first cousins on the Valeryon side… which seems pretty tame for this family.   

[bluvelvet]

Did anyone else think Alicent may have poisoned that girl??

[Lady Whistleup]

I've always thought Alicent was in love with Rhaenyra and the way she grabbed Rhaenyra's hand towards the end of the family dinner confirmed that. There's hatred there but it's also a sick, twisted love.

[The Kings Foot]

1 hour ago, aquarian1 said:

Did Rhaenyra and Daemon really name their first some Aegon?  It's bad enough having so many similar names, now we have 2 living characters with the exact same name.

Well one is a toddler so I doubt he'll be a major player