S01.E01: Strange New Worlds

[Frozendiva]

Pike avoiding his future is a case of destiny vs free will. If the show goes that direction.

[paigow]

24 minutes ago, Frozendiva said:

Pike avoiding his future is a case of destiny vs free will. If the show goes that direction.

Another trip to the Infinity Stone will likely reveal that avoiding the accident kills Spock...

[ML89]

3 hours ago, benteen said:

into a very preventable life-altering accident is not heroic. If you know the details it can be avoided with ease. This isn't altering the past. The future isn't even set yet. 

As they said in Lawrence of Arabia, nothing is written…

Like the cast but it was, again, let’s over write the past. Also, wow did some people have some unfortunate hair (Chapel’s fried blonde and really, they can’t get straight hair for Spock. Plus that horrible mustache.) versus Pike’s lovely mane. I wanted his house - I wouldn’t leave that even if I didn’t have a premonition of my future. 
 

Spoiler

So Rios gets stuck in that nightmare?

So if the scientists saved the Earth species in pods (nice call to Silent Running) then why didn’t they stop Earth from blowing itself up? How did we come back in, what, less than 2 centuries? So many questions. 
 

Can we stop with the flashbacks? Please?

 

 

[Zonk]

6 hours ago, benteen said:

Question...I've never watched Discovery and from what I've read it sounds like I'm not missing much. But if Pike knows all the details about how he is going to be injured, then isn't it really easy for him to change what's going to happen? In TOS, we learn he was injured while doing a cadet review of an old Class-J training vessel. If he knows that detail, then he should be able to easily prevent that and have that damn ship repaired. Easy peasey!

Marching into a very preventable life-altering accident is not heroic. If you know the details it can be avoided with ease. This isn't altering the past. The future isn't even set yet. 

Something you do not know because you didn't watch Discovery, for which you should thank the gods: The writers are talentless hacks.

So yeah, that doesn't make sense, but pretty much nothing on Discovery makes sense. So par for the course. Sadly the Strange New World writers are now beholden to what Discovery established.

[rtms77]

Welp not a bad pilot ep. But really did Pike just set up the Enterprise as a new religion for that planet. At least it looked like it in that montage.

Pike is pretty much the best of the group. Mount still comes off as a tad wooden but it actually works with the show and character I think.

La an is interesting with the backstory but I just can't see her beating off people as security. But then the physical part doesn't seem to matter. If she is an ancestor of Khan , she could have the super genes in her.

Sorry but I'm not into the whole , women do it better with more than half the bridge crew/senior staff being female. They have changed it around. Number 1 was unique, now she's just part of the gang.OG Kirk and ST even seemed to say that female captains were a rarity in his time. It does make Kirk look bad when he replaces them all with males other than Urhura. And Nurse Chapel came off like a model , who had too much coke . Her whole look was , sexy me look sexy me but take me seriously Please?

I do hope they stick with self contained eps, but the season preview seems to suggest there is a a over all story arc coming, which after Picard I m not looking forward to.

So wait, Pike has never told command about what happened to him? Not even Spock knew? Sorry but the guy has major mental health issues and they just send him into space?

Sigh.. these writer just don't understand why Spock got so famous and a favourite. Trying to make him Randy Vulcan man and in touch with his human side, just ruins the character. Meanwhile Peck is playing him so serious even his flirting with T Pring was blah. I'm going on to the belief that time and events temper his human side and he chooses to suppress or at least not get emotional, and we eventually  get OG Spock.

Uhura, I like. Like Spock I think she grows into her work with experience. Right now she's a language prodigy who I believe develops the universal translator? Could be wrong on that . Shes a cadet or recent grad, and she gets the flag ship, that's going to impress anyone. A little raw but fun.

What rat died to give Sam (George Kirk) that fake looking moustache, hmmm? That was just bad, lol.

Laughing at the Prime Directive. By Picards time it's so ingrained it was a major event if they interfered. Of course we might see Garth show up and then Pike will understand why non interference was doubled  down on .

Edited May 8, 2022 by rtms77

[cambridgeguy]

8 hours ago, rtms77 said:

.OG Kirk and ST even seemed to say that female captains were a rarity in his time.

That's an artifact of the 60s that would never be kept today.  Pike even grumbles about having women on the bridge in The Cage and that bit was cut from the Menagerie. 

[paigow]

1 hour ago, cambridgeguy said:

Pike even grumbles about having women on the bridge in The Cage and that bit was cut from the Menagerie. 

The TOS series finale was all about this. Dr. Janice Lester - a former girlfriend of Kirk - did a Freaky Friday body switch and took command of the Enterprise. Her motivation was to protest that Starfleet had a Dudes Only policy for handing out Captain jobs.

[benteen]

Artifact from the 60s. Even Roddenberry, who was not the showrunner of the final season but was credited with the story, distanced himself from it. Though Roddenberry's own personal history with women and the way gender relationships were portrayed in his previous series The Lieutenant was not exactly an authority on gender equality and respect. Turnabout Intuder's plot was an outdated relic from the 60s that should stay in the 60s and considering that women in today's Navy can be and are commanding officers (for at least four or five decades) it would make no sense to have them barred from command in the 23rd century. That is one bit of "continuity" from TOS that I am happy to lose.

It doesn't diminish Kirk that he had mostly men on his command staff just like it doesn’t diminish Picard that most of his command staff were men.

 

Edited May 8, 2022 by benteen

[starri]

5 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

Pike even grumbles about having women on the bridge

Not even just that, he talks about wanting to quit Starfleet and become a slave trader.

[theschnauzers]

Couple of comments that I guess are continuity related. In TOS, the timeline of history has  all three wars mentioned in this episode. The Eugenics War was all Khan in the 1990s. It’s hard to square that with the timeline of Picard season 2, which postulates no second civil war, Eugenics War or World War III prior to the Q altered timeline of that just concluded sea.son. IIRC, there was some publicity introducing La’an as a descendant of Khan, whether direct or collateral isn’t clear. Khan had a son in TOS, but that was from his people held in statis, and not one who remained on post Eugenics War Earth. But the hyphenated last name was a clear indication of La’an being related in some way.

The use of images from the events of 1/6 was merely symbolic; I don’t take it as being canon in the SNW/TOS/TNG timeline.

If you didn’t watch season 2 of Discovery, I’d suggest you do so. It gives a much better feel of how Pike, Una, and younger Spockwere portrayed to begin which. It also gives a better insight about the internal conflict younger Spock had between his Vulcan and human halves  while reconciling the more emotional side of Spock we saw in The Cage, being the original TOS pilot.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Was that Sonequa Martin-Green doing the beginning voiceover or was it Rebecca Romijn? They have a similar sound to me.

Right off the bat Pike is shown to be in a FWB situation with one of his peers. Nah, he's not gonna be getting #metoo'ed, if that's even still a thing in the future. 😉

Next Spock is having sex, or about to until Pike cockblocked him, lol. Sure hope he didn't propose to T'Pring just so she'd  sleep with him because Spock as a wannabe player would blow my mind.

Did I miss the explanation of why Spock couldn't just put on a head covering to hide his ears?

Samuel Kirk. Of course. Homage must be paid, sorta. And they made a point of mentioning he had a wife and family so he's probably not going to be out there getting himself all kinds of outer space cooch.
 
"Hit it." Well, it beats "let's fly" I guess but is still a bit trying-too-hard IMO. Good Star Trek catchphrases are hard to create it seems.

Loved the premiere. SNW isn't taking itself too seriously and has the tongue-in-cheek humor of TOS. I can't believe I'm saying this but AFAIC this show is light years ahead of Picard and Discovery. It's as if the producers studied all the complaints about their predecessors (the live action, streaming era ones) and decided to avoid making the same mistakes. Yay.

Quote

This version of Chapel seems a bit bouncier than I remember.

In personality, anway. This one is 180° different in body type and seems way more athletic. Back in the 60s she probably would've been seen as a tomboy by the audience.

Quote

did Pike just set up the Enterprise as a new religion for that planet. At least it looked like it in that montage.

Yeah, I had good laugh at the communion wafer shaped like the Enterprise.

[Starchild]

52 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

In personality, anway. This one is 180° different in body type and seems way more athletic.

Ha, yes personality is what I meant. It wasn't until I reread it that I can see it could be taken a different way, my bad

[paigow]

Every good story with Kirk is going to be retconned... Is Chapel going to get engaged to Dr. Roger Korby? She should never have been on the Enterprise until Korby was declared MIA..

[Tyro49]

I loved the clip from the original The Day the Earth Stood Still at the beginning of the episode. I recommend it if you haven't seen it.

[marinw]

6 hours ago, Tyro49 said:

I loved the clip from the original The Day the Earth Stood Still at the beginning of the episode. I recommend it if you haven't seen it.

Seconded. A classic.

[Pallas]

On 5/5/2022 at 9:39 PM, Ottis said:

Did not like yet another "captain hanging out in the western wilderness" setting.

But that imagery does align with the fantasy that the Talosians created for Pike and Vina -- a country picnic with horses -- which came from Pike's imagination. It's also a nod to Roddenberry's original "Wagon Train to the Stars" pitch. And a lovely visual, with the windturbines, the shuttlecraft, and Anson's mount. 

ETA: or as @Frozendiva said, well before me...

Quote

I liked the juxtaposition of having real snow, the more wild west days of Pike riding Tango (I am assuming) amongst the huge wind turbines. A weird romanticism but likened it to outer space.

Tango!

[Pallas]

19 hours ago, starri said:

Not even just that, he talks about wanting to quit Starfleet and become a slave trader.

Lounging on cushions in men's dens and bedecked in Orientalist business casual. 

[Ottis]

On 5/7/2022 at 11:41 AM, benteen said:

Marching into a very preventable life-altering accident is not heroic. If you know the details it can be avoided with ease. This isn't altering the past. The future isn't even set yet. 

But it can't be. You can *try,* but all that happens is fate finds a way to make you need to be wherever it is you don't want to be. Or, in cases with less of a future visual, it finds a way to whack you that is different but the result is the same. You can hide in your house for 10 years, and it will still happen. So the interesting part is, what do you do with the 10 years you have?

There is also a bonus - you know it won't happen for 10 years. So now you can make edgy choices at will, and become a legend, because you know your fate. 

[paigow]

33 minutes ago, Ottis said:

But it can't be. You can *try,* but all that happens is fate finds a way to make you need to be wherever it is you don't want to be.

New Title- Star Trek: Final Destination

[sugarbaker design]

4 hours ago, Pallas said:

and Anson's mount.

Good one!

In the opening scenes, did anyone notice a shuttle raft referred to as the Stammetz?

One more question:. Is Number One, nka Una, not an android?

Edited May 9, 2022 by sugarbaker design

[starri]

5 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

One more question:. Is Number One, nka Una, not an android?

She is not.  

In fact, going back to the rampant sexism of "The Cage," the Talosians offer her up to Pike as a potential mate, specifically talking about her being good breeding stock.

I love TOS but, let's just say that when it comes to gender issues, it has some problems.

[marinw]

25 minutes ago, starri said:

I love TOS but, let's just say that when it comes to gender issues, it has some problems.

True, there is some crigworthiness in TOS in regards to the sexism.  Yet seen in context, it was still increadibly progressive. The Bridge crew had a Russian, an Asian and a Black Woman in a professional role. There were women doctors, lawyers, and scientists. 

CMIIW, but in "The Gamesters of Triskelion," Kirk fought a woman and it was actually a little challanging for Kirk. So all the women we see (on the Bridge and elsewhere) in SNW seems an approprate update to the ethos of TOS.

[WildPlum]

Watched an episode or two of Discovery - didn't care for it or for having a previously unmentioned human sister for Spock. I was enough of a fan to watch Next Gen for several seasons when it was on the air but haven't watched any of the series after (or read any of the books). I have seen a couple of the recent movies. Fortunately it has been a couple decades since I have seen any of TOS, so continuity issues in this show, as mentioned in this thread, don't bother me much.

I've read that the idea of this series was to get back to the optimistic or more upbeat vision for the show, which is why I watched the pilot. For the most part it was pretty light and glib - I'd like to see a little more depth with my optimism and an effort in proving that optimism isn't necessarily mindless. This episode was okay, but we aren't heading into "must watch" territory. It takes a lot to hook me on a TV show (The Expanse comes to mind). I would like to see well developed characters and plots - if it takes a couple episodes to tell a complete story that is fine, but I do want to see a completed story and not a theme that drags into season after season.

Also, if you set this episode in our world, people would watch the projected scenes from the Enterprise and say " hey, man, nice cgi, when will it be in theaters?"

At least there is no Wesley Crusher.

[benteen]

3 hours ago, starri said:

She is not.  

In fact, going back to the rampant sexism of "The Cage," the Talosians offer her up to Pike as a potential mate, specifically talking about her being good breeding stock.

I love TOS but, let's just say that when it comes to gender issues, it has some problems.

I watched Roddenberry's previous show The Lieutenant from the Warner Archives. It's a good show but it's portrayal of gender is a complete embarrassment to say the least. Given what I've read about Roddenberry, it's nor a surprise. 

I would love to know what happened to the previous characters from The Cage. Yeoman Colt (the actress who played her died recently and she was the last surviving cast member], Dr. Boyce and Jose Tyler.

Seeing April was cool. In The Animated Series, his wife Sarah was the Enterprise's first Chief Medical Officer. Another character I would like to see. The Star Trek novel Best Destiny had George Kirk Sr. as April's friend/XO/Security Chief.

[wmdekooning]

13 hours ago, benteen said:

Seeing April was cool. In The Animated Series, his wife Sarah was the Enterprise's first Chief Medical Officer. Another character I would like to see. The Star Trek novel Best Destiny had George Kirk Sr. as April's friend/XO/Security Chief.

This may or may not be what you are looking for, but I found it interesting and would have wanted to see more of Captain April and have a story that delved more into his personal issues that seem to be plaguing him and the issues between him and his wife other than he did not seem to wish her put in danger...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAlGf5Wfe4g

 

[Llywela]

This was fun. Early days, of course. I hope they keep it up.

It also made me a bit sad because this is the kind of Trek I hoped we were getting when Star Trek: Picard was first announced, back when it wasn't called anything as specific as Star Trek: Picard, it was just 'a new Star Trek project including Patrick Stewart reprising his role as Jean Luc Picard alongside a brand new cast, including a couple of actors I already knew well and was excited about.' The characters over there deserved much, much better than the writing they got, in the end. I hope Strange New Worlds does better with its cast! The odds are good, since this show is structured more as a proper ensemble. I shall keep my fingers crossed.

[statsgirl]

The show opens ... there's a woman in bed ... Is this Pike's daughter? She looks like she's Pike's daughter. Oops she's his friend with benefits. (I know that Melanie Scorfano is only 12 years younger than Mount but she does look much younger than him.)

On 5/8/2022 at 11:28 PM, Tyro49 said:

I loved the clip from the original The Day the Earth Stood Still at the beginning of the episode. I recommend it if you haven't seen it.

I liked that best of the show.

Now we move to Pike riding a horse. Nice, but why is he whipping it with the reins as it races over the snow? Am I supposed to think that this is manly? Tormented? It just looks cruel to me.

I have absolutely no idea what that dinner conversation between Spock and T'Pring was about other than she changed her mind part way through and decided to propose to him. Shouldn't I have at least some idea what they were talking about?

I wasn't impressed. I know that Discovery and Picard have problems but I enjoyed them both much more than this show.

This feels very Old School Trek, a throwback to the Original series.  White man solves all the problems with a white man speech and the natives comply. This worked in the 60s when I was 9 but it feels wrong now. Pike's speech to the Kiley would not make sense to an alien race much less get them to resolve their issues, it wouldn't make sense to half of Earth's cultures. I know it always worked for Shatner's Kirk but TOS had other innovations. 

Pike's speech to La'an that she survived because she was the only one aware that it would all go wrong was even more eyerolling. Please, there are always a bunch of people who don't have their heads in the sand.

Shallow: I wish Anson Mount would get a better haircut or even go back to opening scene hair. This looks like he's auditioning for Grease. I liked Spock's hair better in Discovery too.

I very much liked Uhura but Chapel was too much manic pixie dream girl. La'an has possiibiities if they remove the chip from her should quickly. (I know it's justified but it's not entertaining.)

On 5/8/2022 at 4:17 PM, Joimiaroxeu said:

Was that Sonequa Martin-Green doing the beginning voiceover or was it Rebecca Romijn? They have a similar sound to me.

My closed captioning said "Una" so it's Romjn.

[Sandman]

On 5/5/2022 at 11:18 PM, Starchild said:

There's no way that La'an isn't related to Khan, right? That is too unique a surname to be using as a coincidence.

Thank you! That was in the back of my mind throughout the episode.

Maybe I’m sentimental, but I think I liked Cadet Uhura (“the prodigy”) best of all. Did not expect the bait-and-switch to Sam Kirk, but I’m enjoying the little nods to TOS canon. That makes me easy, I suppose.

Overall, I liked it. It seems more genuinely optimistic than any current Trek series, including the increasingly dire Picard, season 2. Mount has an appealing mixture of gravitas, warmth, and vulnerability, and Ethan Peck continues to grow on me. Don’t have a clear sense of Number One yet. And, let’s face it: the Prime Directive was always honoured more in the breach than abided by, anyway. 

Edited May 11, 2022 by Sandman

[paigow]

TOS!Kirk had issues with the Prime Directive; however, many times somebody else from the Federation had broken it before Enterprise showed up.

[paigow]

Pike clearly set the example for Kirk in selecting Away Team members.

[Sandman]

59 minutes ago, paigow said:

TOS!Kirk had issues with the Prime Directive; however, many times somebody else from the Federation had broken it before Enterprise showed up.

I was thinking of TOS in my comment about the Prime Directive ("That'll never stick!" was a little on the nose, there, Chris) but I think there may have been times where the TNG crew played a little fast and loose with it, too? (It occurs to me that a non-interference principle is arguably somewhat contrary to the premise of an adventure show. ("Wagon Train To The Stars, but, like, noble!")

[paigow]

3 minutes ago, Sandman said:

 but I think there may have been times where the TNG crew played a little fast and loose with it, too? 

Wesley was sentenced to death for walking on the grass... Picard argued against the AI lawmaker - contravening The P.D.

[Sandman]

5 hours ago, paigow said:

Wesley was sentenced to death for walking on the grass... Picard argued against the AI lawmaker - contravening The P.D.

Wesley!

An AI lawgiver always seemed like a mark of a pretty technologically advanced culture, to me. But I guess the planet was pre-warp, which was enough to invoke the Mind Your Knitting Directive. My memory of that episode is blessedly faint faulty.

Edited May 11, 2022 by Sandman
Advanced in technical means, not necessarily culture or philosophy.

[Starchild]

AI is fine as a supporting tool, but it should never be in charge. Life is nuance, and humans need to preside over final decisions that have significant consequences.

[KeithJ]

On 5/7/2022 at 11:07 PM, rtms77 said:

Sorry but I'm not into the whole , women do it better with more than half the bridge crew/senior staff being female.

More than half?  It's pretty much the entire bridge crew except Pike and Spock.  My wife even said to me "It's Pike and Spock and a bunch of women." I know the doctor and chief engineer (I think) are male but this just seemed in your face with the diversity.

[paigow]

34 minutes ago, KeithJ said:

More than half?  It's pretty much the entire bridge crew except Pike and Spock.  My wife even said to me "It's Pike and Spock and a bunch of women." I know the doctor and chief engineer (I think) are male but this just seemed in your face with the diversity.

Maybe the uniform meanings have been retconned again... but primary Helm & Navigation should be wearing Yellow / Gold. Red would sometimes relieve but were primarily Engineering / Security. Maybe Ortega already has one foot in the dead pool...

[sugarbaker design]

Just now, paigow said:

Maybe the uniform meanings have been retconned again... but primary Helm & Navigation should be wearing Yellow / Gold. Red would sometimes relieve but were primarily Engineering / Security. Maybe Ortega already has one foot in the dead pool...

I thought it was red equals command, gold equals ops including security and green equals science including medicine.  At least, that's what it was on TNG.

[paigow]

34 minutes ago, sugarbaker design said:

I thought it was red equals command, gold equals ops including security and green equals science including medicine.  At least, that's what it was on TNG.

You are correct about TNG... However, TOS and therefore anything pre-TOS used a different colour hierarchy. Kirk / Pike never wore Red. Even in Abramsverse Kelvin movies...

Edited May 11, 2022 by paigow

[sugarbaker design]

1 hour ago, paigow said:

You are correct about TNG... However, TOS and therefore anything pre-TOS used a different colour hierarchy. Kirk / Pike never wore Red. Even in Abramsverse Kelvin movies...

Gotcha!

[Llywela]

On 5/11/2022 at 8:06 PM, KeithJ said:

More than half?  It's pretty much the entire bridge crew except Pike and Spock.  My wife even said to me "It's Pike and Spock and a bunch of women." I know the doctor and chief engineer (I think) are male but this just seemed in your face with the diversity.

Now, this take is hilarious considering how many decades (centuries, if we delve into the literary world) women have had to engage with media in which almost every character is male, always, and we were expected to just accept that as the default. Funny how including just a few women in prominent roles has the men clutching their pearls over how awful it is to not feel represented. 🙄 Guys, you still have plenty of strong male representation on this show, you can cope with a few female characters as well.

[JH Lipton]

On 5/9/2022 at 5:22 PM, WildPlum said:

At least there is no Wesley Crusher.

Hopefully, he can stay on ST:P!

On 5/13/2022 at 7:18 AM, Llywela said:

Now, this take is hilarious considering how many decades (centuries, if we delve into the literary world) women have had to engage with media in which almost every character is male, always, and we were expected to just accept that as the default. Funny how including just a few women in prominent roles has the men clutching their pearls over how awful it is to not feel represented. 🙄 Guys, you still have plenty of strong male representation on this show, you can cope with a few female characters as well.

So very much.  Any time these days that a show or movie has a diverse cast (or, horrors, a POC playing a historically white person), we get the cries of how "woke" the producers are (as if being asleep to injustice is a good thing).

[SmithW6079]

On 5/8/2022 at 1:57 PM, starri said:

Not even just that, he talks about wanting to quit Starfleet and become a slave trader.

 

On 5/9/2022 at 9:43 AM, Pallas said:

Lounging on cushions in men's dens and bedecked in Orientalist business casual. 

If I recall, the Talosians offered that scenario to Pike as an alternate to his life as a starship captain, to show that he could be anything he chose. He did not desire to be a slave trader, and he left that scenario as soon as he could.

On 5/8/2022 at 10:22 PM, paigow said:

Every good story with Kirk is going to be retconned... Is Chapel going to get engaged to Dr. Roger Korby? She should never have been on the Enterprise until Korby was declared MIA..

I know, right? Christine says she joins Starfleet after Korby goes missing, and I always got the impression McCoy joined Starfleet after his divorce (although that may be based on novels); neither of them seemed to have gone the Starfleet Academy route. (I realize they haven't introduced McCoy ... yet.)

I'm not a fan of having TOS characters on Pike's Enterprise. That means Uhura, M'Benga, and Chapel (and whichever other legacy characters they decide to introduce) served five years under Pike then stayed under Kirk. I don't know if that's all that believable. It seems just like fan service. Also, the introduction of a descendant of Khan ruins his appearance in TOS and Wrath of Khan.

I think it's sad that on the one side you have people whining that nuTrek is "woke" and shoving agendas and diversity in viewers' faces and on the other, you have people complaining that a white man has the audacity to be the hero of an episode. Why bother to watch something that is so upsetting? It's obvious that whichever direction the new Trek shows take people will complain about them and ruin the enjoyment of other viewers.

[Llywela]

4 hours ago, SmithW6079 said:

I know, right? Christine says she joins Starfleet after Korby goes missing, and I always got the impression McCoy joined Starfleet after his divorce (although that may be based on novels); neither of them seemed to have gone the Starfleet Academy route. (I realize they haven't introduced McCoy ... yet.)

Chapel isn't in Starfleet (yet). We were told in this episode that she's a civilian nurse on some kind of placement - the doctor did give more of an explanation than that, but I'd have to watch the episode again to check the details. He definitely said that she isn't Starfleet, though.

[eelpout]

On 5/11/2022 at 12:06 PM, KeithJ said:

On 5/7/2022 at 9:07 PM, rtms77 said:

Sorry but I'm not into the whole , women do it better with more than half the bridge crew/senior staff being female.

More than half?  It's pretty much the entire bridge crew except Pike and Spock.  My wife even said to me "It's Pike and Spock and a bunch of women." I know the doctor and chief engineer (I think) are male but this just seemed in your face with the diversity.

Politically incorrect to say, but every time they cut back to a bridge scene all I could think of was paraphrasing Clevon Little in Blazing Saddles, "Hey! Where are the white men at?" 😏

 

Edited May 17, 2022 by eelpout

[Hiyo]

I liked it. I didn't love it, but I did like it. It's off to a good start, and hopefully will be as enjoyable as Star Trek: Picard has been so far.

Like Discovery, I'm treating it as an alternate universe, given all the continuity changes.

[Chicago Redshirt]

On 5/11/2022 at 8:10 AM, Sandman said:

I was thinking of TOS in my comment about the Prime Directive ("That'll never stick!" was a little on the nose, there, Chris) but I think there may have been times where the TNG crew played a little fast and loose with it, too? (It occurs to me that a non-interference principle is arguably somewhat contrary to the premise of an adventure show. ("Wagon Train To The Stars, but, like, noble!")

In the TNG episode "The Drumhead," the admiral doing the inquiry accused Picard of having violated the Prime Directive nine times. And that episode was in S4, which means that he had at least three more seasons of actions that could have violated it.).

I'd guess that of TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY, DIS and PIC, few of them have a perfect record with both components of the Prime Directive (in paraphrase never interfere with a pre-warp civilization's natural development and never interfere in the internal matters of a world).

[MissLucas]

'The Prime Directive is more what you'd call a guideline than an actual rule' has always been the franchise's unofficial motto. 'To boldly go etc.' is of course catchier.

[Chicago Redshirt]

On 5/16/2022 at 10:30 PM, SmithW6079 said:

I'm not a fan of having TOS characters on Pike's Enterprise. That means Uhura, M'Benga, and Chapel (and whichever other legacy characters they decide to introduce) served five years under Pike then stayed under Kirk. I don't know if that's all that believable. It seems just like fan service. Also, the introduction of a descendant of Khan ruins his appearance in TOS and Wrath of Khan.

I think it's sad that on the one side you have people whining that nuTrek is "woke" and shoving agendas and diversity in viewers' faces and on the other, you have people complaining that a white man has the audacity to be the hero of an episode. Why bother to watch something that is so upsetting? It's obvious that whichever direction the new Trek shows take people will complain about them and ruin the enjoyment of other viewers.

Well, it's possible that a given character spent five or fewer years with Pike, rotated to some other assignment, and then came back for a tour of duty under Kirk. It is also plausible that someone served consecutively 10 or more years on Enterprise, especially considering that the ship is the Federation flagship. I mean, it is also fan service. The show probably wouldn't change much if the characters were Aruhu, M'Jenga and Peach'L or whatever, but some fans of TOS will be curious as to what these younger versions of characters they have heard of were up to and/or want them developed.

I don't see why the descendant of Khan (assuming that's what she is as opposed to an admirer or any number of other possibilities) has any effect on his appearances in TOS. All that would have to happen is in the 1990s, Khan would have to have had a child (through traditional procreation or otherwise), and there to be additional generations that were aware of the lineage going to the time of SNW. It seems plausible to me that someone who had dreams of world conquest and a super-sized ego would a) reward himself with lots of sex b) make plans for one or more heirs.

Who is complaining that "a white man has the audacity to be the hero of an episode"?

[paigow]

14 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

'The Prime Directive is more what you'd call a guideline than an actual rule' has always been the franchise's unofficial motto. 'To boldly go etc.' is of course catchier.

The first Federation Captain...

[norcalgal]

On 5/13/2022 at 7:18 AM, Llywela said:

Now, this take is hilarious considering how many decades (centuries, if we delve into the literary world) women have had to engage with media in which almost every character is male, always, and we were expected to just accept that as the default. Funny how including just a few women in prominent roles has the men clutching their pearls over how awful it is to not feel represented. 🙄 Guys, you still have plenty of strong male representation on this show, you can cope with a few female characters as well.

I posted elsewhere that if the diversity we are seeing these days had been there from the very beginning of the advent of film and tv, today’s diversity would not be seen as “woke”. Rather, it wouldn’t even be remarked upon since it would have been the norm, from the beginning of visual mass media.