S1.E16: Trevor’s Pants

[chaifan]

This bathroom talk makes me wonder...  if Trevor had died with his pants down vs. off, would he ever be able to pull them up as a ghost?  or would he have to walk around with pants at his ankles for eternity? 

[Katy M]

Just now, chaifan said:

This bathroom talk makes me wonder...  if Trevor had died with his pants down vs. off, would he ever be able to pull them up as a ghost?  or would he have to walk around with pants at his ankles for eternity? 

I think he could pull them up. As long as they stay attached, I think they can do whatever they want with their clothing and accessories. Since, I'm sure it will come up. I think Pete can't pull the arrow out because it's lodged in his neck, and plus, he'd have to either stick it in somewhere else or make sure he never set it down.

[nora1992]

It just occurred to me: Jay said that selling Elias’s watch could net enough money to erase their debt.  Since Ari paid twice the asking price, will this mean more renovations at Woodstone Manor?

[AnimeMania]

14 hours ago, basil said:

Thor says he's known Flower for "only 50 years", so Flower would have died in the early 70s.

Since Flower wasn't technically killed in the house, she could have wandered around the woods for several years before making her way into the house to meet Thor. 

[chaifan]

39 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

Since Flower wasn't technically killed in the house, she could have wandered around the woods for several years before making her way into the house to meet Thor. 

Also, when you've been hanging around for 1,000 years, I think you get free license to round up/down by a decade or so.  😁

[iMonrey]

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How would she explain knowing?  I wonder how many of his bones they could find after 30 years?  What kind of animals are in that lake?

They would have to drain the lake and "discover" his remains. The problem is that the authorities would probably re-open the investigation, which means Trevor's "bros" would be in trouble. He seemed more concerned about that then giving any of his family members some closure. Maybe Trevor had no family when he died?

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Trevor's money clip is on the table in the opening GHOSTS card, shown at the beginning on the pilot and every episode since. I think Trevor's pants story was planned from the beginning.

That's entirely possible, although there is still a contradiction between the story and the obituary Bela saw in "Jay's Sister." Presumably Trevor's family (or friends?) had some sort of memorial for him once he was legally declared dead, hence the obit. But if Bela had read it, surely it specified he had gone missing and had never been found so was only presumed dead. Wouldn't she then have wondered if maybe she really was communicating with the real Trevor? 

I'm probably giving this more thought than the writers did.

[LittleIggy]

Now that we know about Trevor’s pants, will we find out how Isaac died of dysentery yet is wearing a clean full uniform. Yeah, I know that the show’s PTB didn’t want him running around in a 💩 covered nightgown but still…

[Daff]

23 hours ago, Snow Apple said:

Maybe it washed up and the authorities just figured he took drugs, wondered into the lake while out of his mind, and drowned?

Nice to think for the fam’s sake, but that’s a no-go. There would be no water in his lungs. 

[Daff]

22 hours ago, Katy M said:

Would you want them touching your underwear?  As PInkus would you want to wear the underwear that some other guy's junk was touching?

 

21 hours ago, proserpina65 said:

The suit was expensive, the underwear probably wasn't.

You folks would really not wear the items again after laundering/dry cleaning? But then, I once had a friend refuse to lend his bar of soap to someone else…

[Daff]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

investigation, which means Trevor's "bros" would be in trouble.

There’s no statute of limitations on murder, but what about interfering with a dead body (failing to report a death) which is what they were actually guilty of. Ari caused his own grief all these years, they should have just gotten rid of all the drugs and called the authorities. 

[Driad]

If they had wanted a subtitle starting with T--- P---, they could have used Testosterone Poisoning, which is what Trevor actually died of, by way of the pills, booze, and other fratbro antics.

[Katy M]

59 minutes ago, Daff said:

You folks would really not wear the items again after laundering/dry cleaning? But then, I once had a friend refuse to lend his bar of soap to someone else…

No, I was talking about Pinkus who was going to take the underwear straight out of Trevor's hands and then put them on.  I maintain that's a little gross.

[Kiddvideo]

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I'm probably giving this more thought than the writers did.

I’ve written and deleted several posts since Thursday that echo this. This episode introduced too many “huh?” plot details and scenarios that we have to fanwank away for me to enjoy it. I’ve let most of it go until this week, but Trevor’s body in the lake—now joined by Thor’s—tipped it for me. And now I’m guessing/excusing that the writers do this deliberately so they have the freedom to introduce whichever plots they want.

[basil]

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I’ve written and deleted several posts since Thursday that echo this. This episode introduced too many “huh?” plot details and scenarios that we have to fanwank away for me to enjoy it.

It's a show about ghosts. I suspended my disbelief at the remote control. I'm none too fussed that there are two bodies on a property that has been around forever.

Sas is probably there too. We don't yet know how he died, do we?

,,,and awww, Thor, willing to wait for Flower!

*sigh!*

Edited April 2, 2022 by basil

[shapeshifter]

On 4/1/2022 at 1:41 PM, Snow Apple said:

Maybe it washed up and the authorities just figured he took drugs, wondered into the lake while out of his mind, and drowned?

7 hours ago, Daff said:

Nice to think for the fam’s sake, but that’s a no-go. There would be no water in his lungs. 

There would be water in Trevor's body's lungs if his drunken so-called "bros" were wrong about him being dead when they tied weights to him and threw him in the lake. 🥺😦😟😦
But since this is my nice little feel-good show, I'm going to fanwank that even if Trevor could have survived that night, that something much more terrible would have befallen him, and he will eventually meet a nice ghost person (perhaps with Sam's help) to live happily ever after with.

 

[UsernameFatigue]

My favourite part of the episode was when Trevor looked at Sam when she asked why he has no pants and said "I thought you'd never ask". I felt it was a bit of a nod to the fans of the show who have been asking that question all season.

I really don't care if a lot of the plot points don't make sense, Lots of things don't make sense to me. Why do ghosts need to sleep? Why do they need bedrooms? Why can they go through walls but don't drop through floors? I accept all as is written, because I love this show, all of the characters, and love spending time at the inn with them every week. It may be my fav show, as they always manage to make me smile, laugh, and often tear up to boot. 

[lilabennet]

9 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Since Flower wasn't technically killed in the house, she could have wandered around the woods for several years before making her way into the house to meet Thor. 

I'm pretty sure that Thor witnessed Flower's death.  In this episode he said that her boyfriend Ira "[ran] away like Dane when you attacked by bear".  I guess he could have come up with that based on Flower's story about her death, but it felt more like an eyewitness statement.

[North of Eden]

"He run fast like Dane"

I don't know why but that line made me laugh the hardest. Best comedy on TV right now and I love all the characters (except Crash...I hope he doesn't have a larger role in season 2).

Like how Sas is the voice of reason (reminds me of the Professor's role on GILLIGAN'S ISLAND) but can still take part in the whacked out ghostworld around him.

Rooting for Thor and Flower...I like that idea of them together.

Sad there is so few episodes lest....need expanded order for season 2.

[AnimeMania]

1 hour ago, lilabennet said:

I'm pretty sure that Thor witnessed Flower's death.  In this episode he said that her boyfriend Ira "[ran] away like Dane when you attacked by bear".  I guess he could have come up with that based on Flower's story about her death, but it felt more like an eyewitness statement.

I don't think Ira was there since Flower left the concert to use the bathroom. In the Flower story episode did Ira even know where Flower went and where she was, did Ira know she was dead or just thought Flower was missing? Did the bear get high from consuming the Flower edibles?

[lilabennet]

8 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

I don't think Ira was there since Flower left the concert to use the bathroom. In the Flower story episode did Ira even know where Flower went and where she was, did Ira know she was dead or just thought Flower was missing? Did the bear get high from consuming the Flower edibles?

Huh?  What concert?  Flower and Ira were running away from the commune together after they stole the bank heist money.

[meatball77]

On 4/1/2022 at 5:07 PM, Starchild said:

Maybe this is close?

Thorfinn - 11th century
Sassapis - 17th century
Isaac & Nigel - Revolutionary war 
Nancy & cholera victims - early 19th century cholera epidemic
Hetty - Victorian
Alberta - 1920s
Headless guy - 1950s
Flower - 1970s
Pete - 1980s
Trevor - 2000

Hetty is wearing a bustle so that puts her in the 1870's or 1880s

[eel21788]

15 hours ago, basil said:

I...don't know of anyone who takes their pants off while in the bathroom, unless they are bathing.

The radio program I listen to has discussed this extensively. There are people who do totally strip below the waist for bathroom duties. However, the explanation about why has been a bit vague.

[SonofaBiscuit]

OMG Alberta: “And are you sure Trevor didn’t like put hot sauce in the man’s pants to burn the guy’s wiener?”

I can’t believe she said that 😂

[eel21788]

On 4/1/2022 at 12:22 PM, iMonrey said:

I also think if his body was eventually discovered they would want to know what he was doing on the property and it would circle right back to Ari so I'm assuming his body is still missing to this day. Ari wouldn't have been so worried about being blackmailed if the case was closed.

When I watched initially, I thought that the bros hadn't gone with throwing Dead Trevor in the lake. Now that I've watched it a second time, I am wholly convinced that Dead Trevor is encased in cement at the bottom of the lake and has yet to be found.

That brings me to the question: how did Ghost Trevor not know what happened to Dead Trevor or that he has been missing for 20 years?

[LittleIggy]

35 minutes ago, meatball77 said:

Hetty is wearing a bustle so that puts her in the 1870's or 1880s

Which is Victorian.

[eel21788]

On 4/1/2022 at 6:43 PM, basil said:

Trevor's money clip is on the table in the opening GHOSTS card, shown at the beginning on the pilot and every episode since. 

Except Trevor gave his money clip to Pinkus who was heading for NYC. How did it get back to the house?

[basil]

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Huh?  What concert?  Flower and Ira were running away from the commune together after they stole the bank heist money.

It is literally in the first minute of the pilot:

"Hi, I'm Flower. I wandered onto your property after a music festival in the 60s and then I tried to befriend a bear. Drugs were involved"

 

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I...don't know of anyone who takes their pants off while in the bathroom, unless they are bathing.

Quote

The radio program I listen to has discussed this extensively. There are people who do totally strip below the waist for bathroom duties. However, the explanation about why has been a bit vague.

I can't imagine why anyone would discuss that extensively nor why anyone would strip entirely below the waist to relieve themselves, but ok.

 

Quote

Trevor's money clip is on the table in the opening GHOSTS card, shown at the beginning on the pilot and every episode since. 

Quote

Except Trevor gave his money clip to Pinkus who was heading for NYC. How did it get back to the house?

Thor's helmet doesn't exist any more, except in the GHOST's card. Thor himself was only bones, and the helmet was not found with him. Nor, likely, does Sas' feather. There's some serious overthinking going on here.

[eel21788]

8 minutes ago, basil said:

I can't imagine why anyone would discuss that extensively nor why anyone would strip entirely below the waist to relieve themselves, but ok.

Then you need to listen to Slacker and Steve on Alice105.9   https://www.audacy.com/alice1059 Monday through Friday 3pm-7pm MT. They will pick some obscure topic and beat it to death while you laugh until you wet yourself. 

[basil]

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I can't imagine why anyone would discuss that extensively nor why anyone would strip entirely below the waist to relieve themselves, but ok.

Quote

Then you need to listen to Slacker and Steve on Alice105.9   https://www.audacy.com/alice1059 Monday through Friday 3pm-7pm MT. They will pick some obscure topic and beat it to death while you laugh until you wet yourself. 

 

I really, really don't. I've no interest in further bathroom talk.

I'm more curious as whether it can really work out between a hippie and a Viking. 

I have hope for those crazy kids.

[The Crazed Spruce]

2 hours ago, eel21788 said:

Except Trevor gave his money clip to Pinkus who was heading for NYC. How did it get back to the house?

Maybe Pinkus went back to the house with it and left it there as some kind of memorial to him.

Or maybe the objects in the title card are only meant to represent the ghosts, and aren't necessarily there in the house in present day.

Just a thought.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 4/1/2022 at 1:43 PM, shapeshifter said:

I just rewatched.
I loved Pete saying he would watch a romantic comedy about a hippie and a Viking, and I agreed that would be fun. 
Then I realized I already was watching a romantic comedy about a hippie and a Viking, heh.

• [PETE] Man, picking something to watch is much more difficult than it was in the '80s. Too many choices.
• [SAM] Pete, just make up your mind.
• [PETE] Maybe go back through the romantic comedies, comb through those again?
• [THOR] No! Thor not watch romantic comedies. Thor hate love.
• [PETE] You okay, there, big guy?
• [SAM] Thor had a pretty emotional therapy session the other day.
• [THOR] A lot come up. Thor discuss feelings about Flower.
• Oh. And what did the therapist say?
• [THOR] ( exhales ) She thinks I should tell Flower how I truly feel.
• [SAM] And I agree with her. This is the new you, buddy. You talk about things.
• [THOR] Thor scared. Can it ever really work out between a hippie and a Viking?
• [PETE] Oh, now, that's a romantic comedy I would watch. ( chuckles ) Can you type in "hippie and Viking," see if anything comes up?
• [SAM] Oh, yeah, sure.

How, exactly is this therapy working? Sam is pretending to have Thor's issues, so I would think the advice the therapist would give Sam (who must sound really out there) would be different than advice that would actually help Thor.

[basil]

8 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

How, exactly is this therapy working? Sam is pretending to have Thor's issues, so I would think the advice the therapist would give Sam (who must sound really out there) would be different than advice that would actually help Thor.

It may not seem like it should be working, but it seems fairly clear that it is. Thor has progressed more than any other character in only one season. That may not be realistic - but it's a show about ghosts.

:)

[Starchild]

14 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

There would be water in Trevor's body's lungs if his drunken so-called "bros" were wrong about him being dead when they tied weights to him and threw him in the lake. 🥺😦😟😦
But since this is my nice little feel-good show, I'm going to fanwank that even if Trevor could have survived that night, that something much more terrible would have befallen him, and he will eventually meet a nice ghost person (perhaps with Sam's help) to live happily ever after with.

He was dead though. His ghost appeared while he was on the floor, so he was dead while still on the floor, and would have been dead when his body was thrown in the lake.

It's interesting that we're more forgiving of inconsistencies in a show where we like most of the characters. Compared to a show like "The Conners" where inconsistencies are criticized in minute detail, where it seems like most characters are unlikeable. I'm guessing that says something about us. :)

 

11 hours ago, eel21788 said:

That brings me to the question: how did Ghost Trevor not know what happened to Dead Trevor or that he has been missing for 20 years?

The ghosts must have kept him away from what was happening with his body. Perhaps to ease his passage. Must have kept him isolated until the living activity in the house related to his death was finished. Sass kept his eye on things though.

Edited April 3, 2022 by Starchild

[kathyk24]

3 hours ago, basil said:

It may not seem like it should be working, but it seems fairly clear that it is. Thor has progressed more than any other character in only one season. That may not be realistic - but it's a show about ghosts.

:)

I think Hetty deserves that honor. She didn't believe women should vote now she's fine with Isaac and Nigel being gay.

[The Crazed Spruce]

8 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

How, exactly is this therapy working? Sam is pretending to have Thor's issues, so I would think the advice the therapist would give Sam (who must sound really out there) would be different than advice that would actually help Thor.

I figure the therapist thinks that Sam either has multiple personality disorder, or is an untreated schizophrenic who "hears voices" that are working through their emotional issues, and is currently working on a very juicy book about her.

[chaifan]

55 minutes ago, Starchild said:

It's interesting that we're more forgiving of inconsistencies in a show where we like most of the characters. Compared to a show like "The Conners" where inconsistencies are criticized in minute detail, where it seems like most characters are unlikeable. I'm guessing that says something about us. :)

I think that has something to do with it.  But also because it's a show about ghosts, so we're not expecting things to be 100% grounded in reality.  Unrealistic is the feature, not the bug.  As many have mentioned, a pretty hefty amount of handwaiving is required to just sit back and enjoy the show, so it's easy to just forgive/handwaive away other plot issues as they come up. 

Also, at least for me, the issues I'm criticizing just don't impact my enjoyment of the show.  OK, so there are a lot of loose ends with Trevor's death.  It's not like it impacts the plot at all, or creates plot hole ripples/snowballs.  It bugs me because I know these writers can do better, so I just sort of wonder what was going on in the writing room that no one else was asking these questions.  Of course, it's also very possible it was written well, but there are scenes on the cutting room floor that would have made this make perfect sense but we'll never see.

[iMonrey]

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I'm none too fussed that there are two bodies on a property that has been around forever.

Sas is probably there too. We don't yet know how he died, do we?

I've wondered about that. The idea of a spirit being "trapped" because their bodies were not given a proper burial is pretty common to ghost lore. We know that Trevor and Thor's bodies are/were on Woodstone property. Possibly the same with Sass. Maybe Flower too? And the same might apply to the cholera victims in the basement. Not so with Pete, though, and probably not Hetty or Alberta either.

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"He run fast like Dane"

I don't know why but that line made me laugh the hardest.

Thor's disdain for the Danes rivals Hetty's for the Irish.

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Hetty is wearing a bustle so that puts her in the 1870's or 1880s

She has said she died 130 years ago, that puts her at 1892. Were bustles still common in the 1890s?

Quote

It is literally in the first minute of the pilot:

"Hi, I'm Flower. I wandered onto your property after a music festival in the 60s and then I tried to befriend a bear. Drugs were involved"

Yeah but then in "Flower's Story" we learned she had been lying the whole time. She never wanted to admit she was absconding with the money from the robbery so apparently the music festival wandering was just a cover story.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

24 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Yeah but then in "Flower's Story" we learned she had been lying the whole time. She never wanted to admit she was absconding with the money from the robbery so apparently the music festival wandering was just a cover story.

Right.

This episode was the first time I noticed some scratch marks on the right side of Flower's face. Something she has in common with Thor, who has some mild cuts on his left side. It would probably be more realistic if the bear had really clawed her face, but that would require more makeup/prosthetics, and she also wouldn't be as easy to look at.

Of the main ghosts, Pete is the only one who displays an obvious reminder of his manner of death.  (Of the recurring ghosts, Crash is the clear winner.)

Edited April 3, 2022 by ItCouldBeWorse

[KarenX]

3 hours ago, kathyk24 said:

I think Hetty deserves that honor. She didn't believe women should vote now she's fine with Isaac and Nigel being gay.

Well… Hetty, when alive, maybe didn’t think Women (as a group) should get the vote but I am certain she never once thought that she didn’t deserve a voice in how things should run in the ghost community she is part of. Because there are Women, and there is Hetty and Flower and Alberta and Sam.

Isaac and Nigel are individuals that she knows and loves. She wishes for the happiness of her friends. They aren’t just Gays. (Cue speech about visibility and cultural expansion of rights here.) I think most growth Hetty has shown has been personal growth, and I think Thor has overcome much larger personal problems than she has. 

Edited April 3, 2022 by KarenX

[basil]

18 hours ago, lilabennet said:

Huh?  What concert?  Flower and Ira were running away from the commune together after they stole the bank heist money.

 

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Yeah but then in "Flower's Story" we learned she had been lying the whole time. She never wanted to admit she was absconding with the money from the robbery so apparently the music festival wandering was just a cover story.

Whether Flower was lying about the music festival or not is a moot point in this context. Lilabennet was asking "what concert" animemania was talking about, and I pointed out that Flower had mentioned a music festival, and that's what animemania was referring to.

Besides, Flower and Ira still could have attended a festival. We've seen Flower get distracted by a butterfly mid-sentence and run after it. It's not beyond the realm of possibility that she and Ira could have attended a concert while on the run.

 

4 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

This episode was the first time I noticed some scratch marks on the right side of Flower's face

Her scars have been around from the beginning. She has some on her shoulder as well. They do come and go, though, and change slightly in location and severity.

 

[HurricaneVal]

17 hours ago, eel21788 said:

There are people who do totally strip below the waist for bathroom duties. However, the explanation about why has been a bit vague.

I can think of one explanation.  That was Trevor's snazzy and fancy new suit.  He might not want the perfect crease on the trousers to get ruined prematurely by being crumpled up by his feet on a dirty bathroom floor.

A long time ago I read the novel Tim by Colleen McCullough and the female protagonist was so incredibly buttoned up and OCD about precise neatness that she would undress completely and hang her suit on a hanger on the back of the bathroom door every time she needed to use the toilet.  Seemed like a lot of hassle to teenage and sloppier me.  

[enduringforce]

What really struck me and I felt was so wonderful was the scene when Trevor died and the other ghosts welcome him. They were so caring for him because I think they all knew how traumatic it really must be. How they all directed him out of the room where his body was to introduce him to his after life was so sweet and I thought added to the feeling that the ghosts are a family.

[greekmom]

I wonder if Sam and Jay are going to fish Trevor's body out of the lake and give it a proper burial. 

[Demian]

Wow. You people scare me.

[AnimeMania]

39 minutes ago, Demian said:

Wow. You people scare me.

Being a baby, you haven't faced many of life's horrors.

[LittleIggy]

Okay, I’ll throw something else out there (tell me if it has been discussed before): What are the boundaries for the ghosts since they cannot leave the property where they died? We saw that Hetty was knocked out of Jay’s body at the gate to the estate. But what about Thor and Sass who died there centuries before anyone claimed title to that property? 🤨

[basil]

I don't think it has much if anything to do with the house/property. More of an epicenter where they died. Different for every ghost.

[South]

Sorry, I can’t seem to find an earlier discussion of what was being referred to as a GHOSTS card.  I’m not sure what that actually is, but from the ponderings, it seems that the objects simply are representative of each ghosts final day/moments.  The helmet, feather and money clip were the only items I recall from the earlier post, so I’m curious what the others were.

[gatopretoNYC]

54 minutes ago, South said:

Sorry, I can’t seem to find an earlier discussion of what was being referred to as a GHOSTS card.  I’m not sure what that actually is, but from the ponderings, it seems that the objects simply are representative of each ghosts final day/moments.  The helmet, feather and money clip were the only items I recall from the earlier post, so I’m curious what the others were.

It's in the Small Talk thread.

[The Crazed Spruce]

13 hours ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

Of the main ghosts, Pete is the only one who displays an obvious reminder of his manner of death.  (Of the recurring ghosts, Crash is the clear winner.)

Yeah, he won by a head. (Sorry, not sorry.) :)

55 minutes ago, South said:

Sorry, I can’t seem to find an earlier discussion of what was being referred to as a GHOSTS card.  I’m not sure what that actually is, but from the ponderings, it seems that the objects simply are representative of each ghosts final day/moments.  The helmet, feather and money clip were the only items I recall from the earlier post, so I’m curious what the others were.

It's the show's title card, that appears near the start of every episode. It shows the show's title over a picture of a desk with a bookshelf behind it, with a picture of Sam and Jay surrounded by object that represent each of the regular ghosts. The discussion started over here in the Ghostly Chat thread.