The Enola Holmes Series

[SeanC]

When Enola Holmes—Sherlock’s teen sister—discovers her mother missing, she sets off to find her, becoming a super-sleuth in her own right as she outwits her famous brother and unravels a dangerous conspiracy around a mysterious young Lord. Starring Millie Bobby Brown, Sam Claflin, with Henry Cavill and Helena Bonham-Carter. Directed by Harry Bradbeer (Fleabag). 

Henry Cavill has to be the most physically imposing Sherlock Holmes to date.

This is adapted from a series of children's books that I gather were well-received, though I was well past the target age range when they came out so I haven't read any of them.  Brown is a producer as well as the star, so she's evidently taking a very active hand in shaping her film career.  This was originally supposed to be released theatrically, but was sent to Netflix after the pandemic, which honestly I think probably makes the most sense for it anyway, given how a lot of family/youth entertainment genres have largely migrated to streaming.

[Morrigan2575]

I watched the trailer and thought it was a series. I wasn't planning to watch because the constant talking to the audience got old kn the trailer but, Henry Cavill had me at a maybe. Knowing it's a movie and not a series bumps this up to a probable watch

[Dandesun]

Henry Cavill is the first Sherlock I'd want to get filthy with, no question. This looks fun. I'm very interested.

[VCRTracking]

I'm guessing they're going to have to have Moriarty in it somehow. They always do.

[Ravenya003]

This looks like loads of fun; hopefully it'll do well enough to greenlight the next five books in the series. 

[VCRTracking]

 

 

 

 

Edited September 23, 2020 by VCRTracking

[Ravenya003]

That was cute, though definitely took its inspiration from the Guy Ritchie films (running down a narrow street while explosives go off - I almost expected to see Robert Downey Jr in there somewhere). I'm envious of Millie Bobby Brown's ability to seemingly have complete control over her life at such a young age, and she looked like she was having a great time throughout. Hopefully this means the rest of the books will be adapted in time.

So nice to have a Sherlock story without the specter of Moriarty (or Irene Adler, for that matter - two characters who barely figured into the canonical stories) and always fun to play "spot the British B-listers". Mr Collins from Pride and Prejudice! Madame Maxime from Harry Potter! Caroline from Killing Eve!

I haven't read the book, but the whole "every vote counts" plot-point seemed particularly pertinent in this day and age.  

[Optimist35]

I was surprised by how much I liked it.

Enola was adorable.  I liked how she was a savant but at the same time, she was clearly sheltered and in over head in a number of situations.   I was very impressed with MBB.   Enola's growth reflected in her revised interpretation of "Alone" made me smile.

Enola and Lord Tewskbury were both so likable and had a wonderful rapport.  I did not call the ultimate villain in the story, so was literally shocked when the mastermind was revealed.

I also really liked Henry Cavill as Sherlock.   The slow rapport he was forming with Enola was wonderful to watch.

All in all, I hope we get a sequel.

[Advance35]

I was surprised by how much I liked it.

Enola was adorable.  A genius detective but sheltered and in over head in a number of situations.   I was very impressed with MBB.   Enola's growth and how it was reflected in her revised interpretation of "Alone" made me smile.

Enola and Lord Tewskbury were both so likable and had a wonderful rapport.  I liked how he was shown to be intelligent and resourceful in his own right.   And in some ways, he was more worldly than she was.

I did not call the ultimate villain in the story, so was literally shocked when the mastermind was revealed.

I also really liked Henry Cavill as Sherlock.   The slow rapport he was forming with Enola was wonderful to watch.

All in all, I hope we get a sequel.

[Anela]

I thought this was a series. I was looking forward to something like ten episodes, although I've never read the books, and only heard about this last week.

[AnimeMania]

Spoiler

I thought they said The Viscount Tewskbury, Marquess of Basilwether (the father) was killed in a botched burglery. Only to find out he was killed because of the way he might vote, I am pretty sure that is what they said. Wouldn't that suggest he was killed recently, why wasn't his wife dressed in mourning clothes similar to the way Enola was when she visited the home.

Enola was very bad at fighting, the only person she seemed that she might be able to beat was her Martial Arts instructor.

[Raja]

9 hours ago, Anela said:

I thought this was a series. I was looking forward to something like ten episodes, although I've never read the books, and only heard about this last week.

I got to the end wondering how they got Henry Cavill to commit to a series of TV movies. maybe the production budget went to the cast? Given the cost of the period production it looked  more like The Librarians or Warehouse 13 than something for a pre COVID big screen.

6 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

  Hide contents

 

Enola was very bad at fighting, the only person she seemed that she might be able to beat was her Martial Arts instructor.

I actually liked the martial arts sequences considering who her opponent was and as a 16 year old she was giving up 100 lbs in her first real fights. 

Edited September 24, 2020 by Raja

[kieyra]

Millie Bobby Brown was excellent in this. 

Henry Cavill bored me. (I know, I know. I'm sorry!)

[Raja]

Sherlock being the beloved character had to be downplayed in order for Enola to shine.

[supposebly]

2 hours ago, kieyra said:

Henry Cavill bored me. (I know, I know. I'm sorry!)

I don't expect anything else from him. He's always boring. I'll watch it tonight. The trailer looked fun.

[festivus]

I've been waiting for this one and it did not disappoint. MBB was excellent as Enola. Good at some things, not so good at others, just like a sheltered teen girl would be. I liked the breaking of the fourth wall, she had just the right amount of cheekiness to pull that off.

 

3 hours ago, kieyra said:

Henry Cavill bored me. (I know, I know. I'm sorry!)

He was fine but I don't get the hype with this dude. He's nice looking but he's always just okay. OTOH, I've never been that impressed with Sam Claflin either but I thought he was very good as the rigid douchcanoe, Mycroft. He sucked! I lol'd hard at that sketch Enola did of him. Of course we had Burn Gorman as the hitman, does he ever play anyone that's decent? He's just got one of those faces, poor dude. 

 

1 hour ago, Raja said:

Sherlock being the beloved character had to be downplayed in order for Enola to shine.

I thought about that but I think Millie really carried this movie so I think maybe he could have had more personality. I haven't read the books though so maybe this is the way he is written there. All in all I decided I was okay with it because this isn't his story and I like the fact that Enola has one brother that seems to understand her and wants her to be herself.

 

I hope they make more of these.

[caracas1914]

I haven't read the books yet, but my the nagging question is why would Enola's mother have made 

21 hours ago, Raja said:

I got to the end wondering how they got Henry Cavill to commit to a series of TV movies. maybe the production budget went to the cast? Given the cost of the period production it looked  more like The Librarians or Warehouse 13 than something for a pre COVID big screen.

 

I think NETFLIX purchased the rights to the completed film, it's not an original movie financed by them.   From what I read, preCovid they were planning to release Enola  in movie theatres.

In any event, Cavill did "The Witcher" series for Netflix so he doesn't seem to have any qualms "doing TV".   I mean when you have Chris Evans, Will Smith, George Clooney, Meryl Streep, Cate Blanchett, etc,  doing streaming TV movies/series, is there any actual difference anymore?

 

Edited September 25, 2020 by caracas1914

[Irlandesa]

3 hours ago, caracas1914 said:

In any event, Cavill did "The Witcher" series for Netflix so he doesn't seem to have any qualms "doing TV".   I mean when you have Chris Evans, Will Smith, George Clooney, Meryl Streep, Cate Blanchett, etc,  doing streaming TV movies/series, is there any actual difference anymore?

Yes.  I believe the difference is that movie people don't say they're making a TV show.  They claim they made a "10 hour movie".*

*Or however many episodes their TV series is.

Edited September 25, 2020 by Irlandesa

[supposebly]

Well, that was nice. Nice fluff. I finally realised why I find Henry Cavill so very very boring. He never does anything new or unexpected with his characters. They are always exactly like I expect them to be. I remember thinking when he played that bad guy in Mission Impossible, I thought there was nothing really menacing about him other than his size. And even that wasn't really scary. Just kinda there. Same with his Sherlock Holmes. Just kinda there doing what we would expect from the character. Mycroft was more interesting. One could feel his frustration with the way things were in the family. I get why he never visited but Sherlock? That's where a better actor could have done something with writing that was a bit too opaque for his motivations.

I loved that Miss Harrison aka aunt Petunia was secretly in love with Mycroft. For all her teaching, she didn't secure a husband for herself now, did she?

I liked Lestrade's second question to Sherlock Holmes at the end, although I wasn't really clear on what his role over all was. He was working for Tewkesbury's family, then they kicked him out for no good reason. Then he worked for Mycroft to find Enola. Was it the money? Did he not have better things to do?

I was hoping that Eudoria would come see her at the end, so that was nice. Her "making noise" went quite bit beyond outbantering and outsmarting the men in her life at every turn. Were these women making bombs? Was she in hiding at the house all those years?

I didn't quite see the old woman being the main villain coming but she did give me vibes during that conversation about protecting England's future. I just wasn't quite engaged enough to actually pay attention. And I didn't really care all that much. It was fairly obvious that it had to be someone in his family after we saw the tree having been cut.

I am a bit tired of plucky Victorian heroines but it could have been worse. She did get her ass almost handed to her a few times and did need some help on the way. I could do without talking to the camera, though.

Edited September 25, 2020 by supposebly

[caracas1914]

The one thing I just didn't get, if Eudora had educated her daughter to standing on her own, being independent, why oh why did she throw her to the wolves by making her oldest stuffy son Mycroft her legal guardian.   

 

[Kromm]

I actually think this was brilliant.  It's light entertainment but hardly fluff. 

All of the acting is top shelf, but not enough can be said about Millie Bobby Brown. To say she's the center of this would be the understatement of the year. She's totally magnetic. Certainly in the normal bits, but even morso when she addresses the camera ("Do you have any ideas?" was the one, terribly awkward and overdone instance). And in those, the subset that's most amazing are the little touches when she VISUALLY addresses the camera but NOT verbally. This pushes it beyond typical fourth wall breaking into something far more charming and intimate. A single raised eyebrow to us when she discovers the hideout with the explosives.  An exasperated sigh towards us when she is frustrated Tewskbury does not know what to thank her for. Tons of other stuff like this. It's loads better than monologues to the camera or simple one liners, although those happen too. 

The plot is solid too, of course. Not super innovative or clever beyond all words, but well written and thought out. And the social commentary actually makes a lot of sense in the context. It's not shoehorned because this is the precise point in English history where these issues really percolated. 

Well done. 

Edited September 25, 2020 by Kromm

[Kromm]

10 hours ago, supposebly said:

I was hoping that Eudoria would come see her at the end, so that was nice. Her "making noise" went quite bit beyond outbantering and outsmarting the men in her life at every turn. Were these women making bombs? Was she in hiding at the house all those years?

The timeline is a LITTLE off, but not much. This links to the women's suffrage movement, which started in the UK around 1872, but didn't succeed until 1918.  It didn't get militant until 1906, which is later than this movie has it if that's the point of Eudoria's group. I'd say their actions match those suffrage groups most closely despite the years being off. In fact, in the warehouse scene Enola sees suffragette posters. 

However, even if the above explanation is most likely for Eudoria's group, the Tewkesbury plot likely linked to another law... the Married Women's Property Act of 1882. It was deliberately vaguely described as the "Reform Bill" in the film. In a nutshell, this was the law that let women retain personal property after marriage, whereas previously their husband acquired anything they owned. Eudoria's speech at the end strongly implied this was NOT the goal of her group, but clearly welcomed (or at least not the main purpose, which is why she was going away again). 

That's almost exactly the time period this seems to be set, other than the obvious fact that the UK didn't see it's first motorcar until 1892. So I think they've been creative one way or the other with the setting. It's VAGUELY set somewhere in the 1880s to 90s, with a vague reform Bill likely very similar to a real one around then, and an inaccurate motorcar. 

Edited September 25, 2020 by Kromm

[Kromm]

7 hours ago, caracas1914 said:

The one thing I just didn't get, if Eudora had educated her daughter to standing on her own, being independent, why oh why did she throw her to the wolves by making her oldest stuffy son Mycroft her legal guardian.   

I think we were given a pretty good idea why. Eudoria was all about TESTING Enola.  She left her the tool to be independent... money... but had to include the challenge of overcoming Mycroft. She knew Enola would run and WANTED that. She also didn't hold out much hope that Sherlock would bother himself wanting to be the guardian. Him coming around on that near the end of the movie was not any part of her plan, but she also had no other choice other than Mycroft to start with because of Sherlock's indifference. If you think in those terms, this all makes sense. 

[SeanC]

5 hours ago, Kromm said:

However, even if the above explanation is most likely for Eudoria's group, the Tewkesbury plot likely linked to another law... the Married Women's Property Act of 1882. 

The street campaigner who Enola passes by when she first gets to London (circa the 35 minute mark) is saying they need to petition the Lords to pass the bill, which he says is for "the vote for all men".  So I think it's supposed to be the 1884 Representation of the People Act (though that did not in fact give the vote to all men, though it did significantly enlarge the franchise).

I liked the movie, on the whole.  Millie Bobby Brown is a tremendously charismatic actress and with a very fun personality, as evident from her interviews, social media, etc.; but her most famous role isn't generally a vehicle for her to show that off, since Eleven is a very serious character.  So this was a good vehicle for her to do that a bit more.

Minor annoyance for me that probably did not annoy most other viewers, but they keep referring to Enola's love interest as "Viscount Tewkesbury, the Marquess of Basilwether", which makes no sense.  If he's a Marquess, he would just be "the Marquess of Basilwether".  A viscountcy would be a subsidiary title (and presumably the one he used as a courtesy title while his father was alive).

[Spartan Girl]

Watched it with my mom tonight and it was fun. Millie Bobby Brown was great -- I miss Stranger Things and I can't wait for the next season. And Henry Cavill is a snack no matter what he's in, but I still prefer RDJ as Sherlock.

[toomuchtv]

19 hours ago, caracas1914 said:

The one thing I just didn't get, if Eudora had educated her daughter to standing on her own, being independent, why oh why did she throw her to the wolves by making her oldest stuffy son Mycroft her legal guardian.   

 

In the book it’s mentioned that since women can’t own property when the husband/dad died everything was given to Mycroft, including being the male in charge of Enola 

[Ravenya003]

14 hours ago, Kromm said:

And in those, the subset that's most amazing are the little touches when she VISUALLY addresses the camera but NOT verbally. This pushes it beyond typical fourth wall breaking into something far more charming and intimate. A single raised eyebrow to us when she discovers the hideout with the explosives.  An exasperated sigh towards us when she is frustrated Tewskbury does not know what to thank her for. Tons of other stuff like this.

I loved it on the train after she realized Tewskbury was in danger, heard her mother's voice telling her not to get involved, and then holds up her finger to the audience as if to say "just wait a second" before heading back to do what she knew she had to. Just brilliant timing and communication.

Also when Tewskbury gets to her lodging house and follows her up the stairs and she looks at us, like: "OMG, there's a boy in my room!" If we get a sequel, it will entirely be down to the charm of this performance.

Quote

The plot is solid too, of course. Not super innovative or clever beyond all words, but well written and thought out. 

This is the advantage of children/YA films being based on pre-existing books. It's not a complete failsafe obviously, but children's writers usually know what they're doing and deliver simple-but-strong stories which adaptations can elaborate/modernize as they see fit, with the underlying plot and characterization as a solid base upon which to build. Of course it's when the screenwriters start thinking that they know BETTER that the trouble starts (*cough*Artemis Fowl*cough*)

Edited September 26, 2020 by Ravenya003

[Kromm]

36 minutes ago, Ravenya003 said:

If we get a sequel, it will entirely be down to the charm of this performance

Millie and the Director have both stated in the past few days sequels are intended. Given that it was ONLY beaten by The Great British Baking Show premiere and was #2 on Netflix this week, I'd imagine Netflix will support more, even if this was originally intended as a theatrical. 

 

[Enigma X]

I liked this, but I am not a Cavill fan at all. Don't get any of the hype. I wish someone else played Sherlock.

[ursula]

On 9/25/2020 at 12:59 AM, caracas1914 said:

The one thing I just didn't get, if Eudora had educated her daughter to standing on her own, being independent, why oh why did she throw her to the wolves by making her oldest stuffy son Mycroft her legal guardian.   

 

She didn't. Her husband/the law did. Mycroft as the oldest son owned the house, estate, income, and responsibility of the underage and unmarried Enola. He gave Eudora an allowance to take care of all listed. When she left, he took more direct responsibility of all of the above.

 

A better question is why Eudora, knowing she was all that stood between her daughter and Mycroft's chauvinistic ideas of how a woman should be brought up, abandoned Enola to his care.

 

Mycroft was such an unpleasant character and Sherlock too in his own passive way, that I feel the story would have made more sense of they were Enola's half brothers.

[Kromm]

10 hours ago, ursula said:

She didn't. Her husband/the law did. Mycroft as the oldest son owned the house, estate, income, and responsibility of the underage and unmarried Enola. He gave Eudora an allowance to take care of all listed. When she left, he took more direct responsibility of all of the above.

 

A better question is why Eudora, knowing she was all that stood between her daughter and Mycroft's chauvinistic ideas of how a woman should be brought up, abandoned Enola to his care.

 

Mycroft was such an unpleasant character and Sherlock too in his own passive way, that I feel the story would have made more sense of they were Enola's half brothers.

I like the relationships as they were created. To me it actually comes off as LESS contrived than giving the excuse of them only being half siblings. 

Mycroft has always been a douchebag in most things based on Holmes. It's very easy to justify that based on not only the attitudes of the time but his position as the heir. And the gender roles of the time plus age difference plus their social strata/wealth very much support the notion of him barely knowing his sister (or caring about her). Most rich young ladies of the time would barely even know their own parents, muchless a significantly older sibling. Servants and ingrained habits kept them in little (figurative) boxes, and they'd only come out and interact with the adults on rare request. Eudoria being so close to her daughter is the outlier, not the other relationships. Mycroft himself supports this notion with his shock over the absence of the usual vast array of servants and the notion that Eudoria educated Enola herself. Both were virtually unheard of at that time for someone in their social class. Eudoria clearly did it at least in part to be able to divert large amounts of money, but of course it also plays into her wanting to craft Enola into something very nontraditional. 

And again it comes back to her insisting Enola being constantly tested. If Eudoria was stuck in the usual Victorian woman's position of having no power or money other than what she could beg or steal, and with no actual power to stop Mycroft eventually remembering his sister existed and simply selling her to someone in marriage, her plan makes a certain amount of sense. Yes, she could have run away WITH Enola, but I actually buy the idea that she felt Enola would better survive on her own, not saddled with being tied to a group that was going to likely soon be hunted down as dangerous criminals. 

To me Sherlock makes sense here too. Even if a Cavill Holmes is hunkier and younger than we're used to, his emotional distance, and a kind of low grade disdain for most women is built in to most versions of the character. I mean why does he come around on Enola?  Because of her sharp brain. But if she hadn't illustrated that, the traditional Sherlock definitely would have barely paid attention to her, full sister or not. 

 

Edited September 27, 2020 by Kromm

[Ms Lark]

I freakin' loved it! I figured it would be cute or fun or something, did not expect to like it as much as I did. Charmed my socks off and left me wanting more, so now I'm on a long list for the books at our library. I also thought it was a series and can hardly wait (which we will have to do during these times) for further adventures. I like her relationship with Tewksbury and hope that continues, with him pining away and her being, "I have stuff to do!"

Hmm, I think I'll go watch it again right now!

[Ohiopirate02]

One thing I appreciated about this movies was the filmmakers commitment to casting POC as supporting characters and extras.  From Lestrade to Edith to the various hues seen on the students at Miss Harrison's school, the movie choose to show a more diverse Britain than what we normally get.  So many historical films and novels want to pretend that no POC lived in Britain before the 20th century that I was glad to see it.  I think it also adds some depth to Mrs. Harrison that she was willing to take in any student who could afford the fees instead of only educating white Britons.

[Irlandesa]

Edith (Susie Wokoma) also stars in another period detective comedy that takes place in the Victorian era called Year of The Rabbit so I was happy to see her here. If there are sequels, I'd love to see her in any sequels even if she isn't in the books. (I don't know if she is or not.  I haven't read them.)

[ursula]

6 minutes ago, Irlandesa said:

Edith (Susie Wokoma) also stars in another period detective comedy that takes place in the Victorian era called Year of The Rabbit so I was happy to see her here. If there are sequels, I'd love to see her in any sequels even if she isn't in the books. (I don't know if she is or not.  I haven't read them.)

Edith was definitely a scene-stealer. She and Cavill vibed off each other extremely well in their one scene. I'm not usually someone who spots chemistry - still not convinced it isn't partially subjective - but I picked up on their own. Not surprised that Tumblr is raving about it. 

On a meta note, I loved that the movie didn't fall into the over-used (and almost always at the expense of a POC) trap of Worfing her. It's what I thought happened the first time Enola took her down. But the latter scene where Edith effortlessly puts Enola down and keeps her there, showed that the first scuffle was Edith just testing her, to see how much she'd grown. It wasn't to establish that Enola really was better than a martial arts guru. I generally liked how difficult Enola's physical fights were. 

[AimingforYoko]

2 hours ago, ursula said:

I generally liked how difficult Enola's physical fights were. 

Yeah, it's not so easy when you can't throw people with your mind.

[Ravenya003]

Also, for anyone unaware, Edith Garrud was a real person who did indeed teach young women (specifically suffragettes) how to defend themselves with jujitsu. She lived all the way to 1971, dying at age 99.

So when the inevitable "it's political correctness gone mad!" moaning starts (though I'm sure it has already) here are the receipts...

[snarktini]

On 9/24/2020 at 11:59 PM, caracas1914 said:

The one thing I just didn't get, if Eudora had educated her daughter to standing on her own, being independent, why oh why did she throw her to the wolves by making her oldest stuffy son Mycroft her legal guardian.   

 

That bothered me, too. She said it had to be a secret, but it didn't make sense to me to just bail and leave her to Mycroft. Couldn't she have left a note that said: "Gotta go for now!  Time to build your own life. Don't tell your brothers. And here's a bunch of money for you and the housekeeper to keep things running." Then Enola could have planned her life and made her exit without being forced into a boarding school. It never had to be a mystery. (But then there would be no story.)

On 9/25/2020 at 7:55 AM, Kromm said:

I think we were given a pretty good idea why. Eudoria was all about TESTING Enola.  She left her the tool to be independent... money... but had to include the challenge of overcoming Mycroft. She knew Enola would run and WANTED that.

But this is an interesting explanation!

On 9/23/2020 at 7:57 PM, Raja said:

I actually liked the martial arts sequences considering who her opponent was and as a 16 year old she was giving up 100 lbs in her first real fights. 

I really liked this as well. She did okay but was outmatched and that's how it should have been. A small 16 year old with only sparring practice, up against an larger, stronger, well-trained assassin? Nope. I appreciate strong fighting women characters, but roll my eyes at their superhuman powers sometimes.

 

[Kromm]

On 9/28/2020 at 8:50 AM, Ohiopirate02 said:

One thing I appreciated about this movies was the filmmakers commitment to casting POC as supporting characters and extras.  From Lestrade to Edith to the various hues seen on the students at Miss Harrison's school, the movie choose to show a more diverse Britain than what we normally get.  So many historical films and novels want to pretend that no POC lived in Britain before the 20th century that I was glad to see it.  I think it also adds some depth to Mrs. Harrison that she was willing to take in any student who could afford the fees instead of only educating white Britons.

I very much appreciate the effort they made, but even as a fan of them doing it, I have to admit it means they reshaped history a bit.  POC was certainly in Britain before the 20th century, but if this was aiming for realism it would be in very subservient roles.  Factory and warehouse workers.  Scullery maids. Physical workers... occasionally with someone rising up to be a personal servant or groom.  Maybe some farmers, but only non-land owning ones. The occasional merchant or moneylender, but that would also be rare.  The police actually wouldn't be wellborn, but they wouldn't be POC either.  It would be mainly lower class white English, with some Irish thrown in, I think. 

The bit of fudging on this didn't bother me at all.  It wasn't in your face revisionist, just a moderate nod towards diversifying the cast a bit without creating a different problem with them all coming off as there just to serve whitey (although unfortunately that's kind of the truth of what it was like, it wouldn't have added to the particular story being told).  

[Kromm]

22 hours ago, Ravenya003 said:

So when the inevitable "it's political correctness gone mad!" moaning starts (though I'm sure it has already)

They did change her race, but given that she was a tertiary character, it's hardly a big deal.  The story wasn't ABOUT her.

[ursula]

11 hours ago, Kromm said:

POC was certainly in Britain before the 20th century, but if this was aiming for realism it would be in very subservient roles.

That's a white supremacist myth based on modern day racism and not actual history.

[Kromm]

5 hours ago, ursula said:

That's a white supremacist myth based on modern day racism and not actual history.

No. It's not. Racism didn't just get invented. Ask the Jewish families broadly discriminated against in pretty much every category for about four or five centuries in Britain.  As for black people?  It wasn't random chance they were kidnapped from their homes and enslaved. The British considered them savages. The Brits were so intolerant and xenophobic they thought that about the Irish, muchless people with actual different appearances. There were real examples like the actual Pocahontas, who in the brief time she was in England before she died was treated as a curiosity, but even being treated as a curiosity was based on an assumption they'd been "civilised" and didn't really equate to any degree of real respect. As I said, look to the best documented long term case of outsiders in England, the Jews, to see long term evidence, or even the Irish. Heck, even their disgusting treatment of the Indians was over enough years to see as a permanent bias.  In fact, it was at its peak during this period, although of course most of it manifested in their actions in India itself. For the Indians who did migrate that early to England... tell me... do you really think they found Victorian England that welcoming? 

As for labeling the mere observation that POC were there, but subjugated, as "white supremacist"?  For shame. There's no endorsement of that status for POC implicit in talking about how shoddy they've ALWAYS been treated. It's not even saying people weren't capable of trying to better themselves and didn't try. But it was a closed, racist system. All of English society and laws were stacked severely to keeping not just the rule, but even mere so called "respectability", whatever that truly means, in the hands of the few. 

Edited September 30, 2020 by Kromm

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Kromm said:

No. It's not. Racism didn't just get invented. Ask the Jewish families broadly discriminated against in pretty much every category for about four or five centuries in Britain.  As for black people?  It wasn't random chance they were kidnapped from their homes and enslaved. The British considered them savages. The Brits were so intolerant and xenophobic they thought that about the Irish, muchless people with actual different appearances. There were real examples like the actual Pocahontas, who in the brief time she was in England before she died was treated as a curiosity, but even being treated as a curiosity was based on an assumption they'd been "civilised" and didn't really equate to any degree of real respect. As I said, look to the best documented long term case of outsiders in England, the Jews, to see long term evidence, or even the Irish. Heck, even their disgusting treatment of the Indians was over enough years to see as a permanent bias.  In fact, it was at its peak during this period, although of course most of it manifested in their actions in India itself. For the Indians who did migrate that early to England... tell me... do you really think they found Victorian England that welcoming? 

As for labeling the mere observation that POC were there, but subjugated, as "white supremacist"?  For shame. There's no endorsement of that status for POC implicit in talking about how shoddy they've ALWAYS been treated. It's not even saying people weren't capable of trying to better themselves and didn't try. But it was a closed, racist system. All of English society and laws were stacked severely to keeping not just the rule, but even mere so called "respectability", whatever that truly means, in the hands of the few. 

It’s not saying that racism didn’t exist but that history has been whitewashed to portray minorities in exclusively subservient roles. There were minorities in prominent roles even if it wasn’t the norm and they clearly faced a great deal of racism. The movie is set nearly 50 years after the first black cop in the UK. 

[Brookside]

 

On 9/25/2020 at 1:36 PM, SeanC said:

 

Minor annoyance for me that probably did not annoy most other viewers, but they keep referring to Enola's love interest as "Viscount Tewkesbury, the Marquess of Basilwether", which makes no sense.  If he's a Marquess, he would just be "the Marquess of Basilwether".  A viscountcy would be a subsidiary title (and presumably the one he used as a courtesy title while his father was alive).

Yes, he would have been a viscount when his father was alive, and would have ascended to Marquess on his father's death.  It bothers me when authors don't research properly, especially since I expect the author proudly touts the amount of research she did.  (The Potato Society book annoyed me tremendously for this reason and I didn't get far into it.)

[callie lee 29]

I quite liked it even though,  like others, I thought it was a series as well.  This is the only thing I've ever seen Brown in and she was very enviable to watch.  My only annoyance (other than Eudora abandoning her daughter on her birthday) was Mycroft.  He was such a douche.  I know this is more canonical but I liked the more recent Mycroft of the BBC Sherlock. 

[Perfect Xero]

On 9/26/2020 at 11:41 AM, ursula said:

A better question is why Eudora, knowing she was all that stood between her daughter and Mycroft's chauvinistic ideas of how a woman should be brought up, abandoned Enola to his care.

I think it was her only option as she saw it. She needs to "make some noise" to try to change society for her daughter's benefit (and all the other women) and is planning something that is almost certainly dangerous and illegal. Bringing Enola with her involves her and it's possible that they are going to end up dead, even in they don't they will likely end up wanted criminals. She sees leaving Enola behind to deal with Mycroft as better than putting her life and future in danger.

 

[Mabinogia]

On 10/3/2020 at 7:48 PM, callie lee 29 said:

My only annoyance (other than Eudora abandoning her daughter on her birthday) was Mycroft.  He was such a douche.  I know this is more canonical but I liked the more recent Mycroft of the BBC Sherlock. 

Being that I have a huge crush on BBC Sherlock's Mycroft, I completely agree. This Mycroft sucked! I wasn't terribly impressed with this Sherlock either, but I was completely charmed by Enola. It was a fun movie that I wish was a series. I wouldn't have minded spending a bit more time in that world, I'd just have to revisit BBC's Sherlock to get my Mycroft fix. 

[GaT]

On 9/24/2020 at 9:50 PM, supposebly said:

I was hoping that Eudoria would come see her at the end, so that was nice. Her "making noise" went quite bit beyond outbantering and outsmarting the men in her life at every turn. Were these women making bombs? Was she in hiding at the house all those years?

 

On 9/24/2020 at 11:59 PM, caracas1914 said:

The one thing I just didn't get, if Eudora had educated her daughter to standing on her own, being independent, why oh why did she throw her to the wolves by making her oldest stuffy son Mycroft her legal guardian.   

I don't really understand why her mother left. If she was somehow putting her in danger, wasn't she in danger all those years? If she really felt she had to leave at some point, why wouldn't she have prepared Enola for that eventuality? 

On 9/25/2020 at 7:55 AM, Kromm said:

Eudoria was all about TESTING Enola.  

If that was why she left without saying anything, what if Enola failed the test? She could have ended up dead or worse. Just leaving her some money & teaching her code wasn't enough, especially if she was just going to leave. I really don't understand this.

[Mabinogia]

While I enjoyed the movie I think the plot was absolute dreck. One the one hand we have a young lord being murdered by his grandmother so he won't vote for change, fine, but she also murdered her son for the same reason knowing full well the grandson would then get the vote and she'd have to go and kill him too making the whole thing seem like they just wanted a "surprise" villain at the end and hadn't thought it through. 

Then Eudora who has been her teenage daughters only family and basically her whole world just up and leaves the girl on her birthday? So it was urgent enough that she had to leave on the kids birthday any yet NOTHING happened. All that time Enola was running around trying to track her down, heading to London, getting a room that she stayed in at least a few days, and Eudora's terrorist group (because even if their cause was just, that's what they were) didn't do anything. Why not just wait until after Enola's birthday if you love her so damned much. 

And how is the girl suddenly not in danger just because you're not in the house? Isn't she in MORE danger because 1) you know she's going to go chasing after you to find out what happened and 2) if your enemies are so powerful and old ladies are willing to end their bloodline to stop a vote, wouldn't they maybe kidnap your daughter to get her to tell them where you are and what you are planning? 

This was one of the worst plots I've seen in a long time (IDK if the plot is from the book, if so, I hope it was done better) and yet it was an enjoyable film. 

[ouinason]

I don't think that killing the boy was plan A.  His mom wasn't wearing mourning, so the dad had been gone at least a year, grandma had had some time to try and work on him.  By the time he was old enough to take his seat and responsibilities she realized he was like his dad, so they were trying to strong arm him into joining the army and being out of London and unable to vote his seat.  That didn't work, so then grandma hired the assassin.