Episode Discussion II: The TFGH

[jacourt]

So genie is going on vacation. When she comes back nothing will have changed. 

[Daisy]

1 hour ago, ffwbe said:

Olivia comes off pretty dumb. When Carly wouldn’t let her buy the MC for her, why not buy it for herself? She’s the one who is most affected by this. Instead she sat on her hands while someone else was able to buy it and now she’s stuck with a partner she doesn’t like. I’m sure her plan to ice out Nina will be great for business btw. 

she was going to, but Nina beat her to it. I am figuring that Olivia didn't have that much money to her name either so she needed to ask  Ned (in terms of "you screwed the family and it cost Carly so you owe me).  either that or she's just a dipstick. [maybe it is both]. 

 

[Gam2]

I really can’t figure out who and what Olivia thinks she is. All I know is that she needs to shut up. Permanently.

[TVbitch]

Okay just for shits and giggles, I did some hotel googling. In 2019, the Ritz-Carlton, Lake Tahoe, sold for $120 million. I don't know if Port Chuck is equal to Lake Tahoe, but it's 2022 and real estate is more expensive, so let's just call it even. Just how rich is Nina that she can gift Carly $60 million, give or take? Nina is welcome to break up my family any time for that kind of money. : D

PS. Drew is so thirsty it is nauseating to witness.  

[Cobra]

5 hours ago, statsgirl said:

"I didn't have any delusions or hallucinations or problems thinking."  Okay, I'm seriously thinking that it was a misdiagnosis. Remember, 5x over-diagnosed. Between this conversation and Portia/Stella, it feels like the show was written by a Black writer.

Is it a bad thing if a black writer was involved in today’s show? The things that were talked about on today’s show with Curtis/Marshall and Portia/Stella are a realities for black people. As a black person, I was glad that it was brought up.

[statsgirl]

10 minutes ago, Cobra said:

Is it a bad thing if a black writer was involved in today’s show? The things that were talked about on today’s show with Curtis/Marshall and Portia/Stella are a realities for black people. As a black person, I was glad that it was brought up.

Not in the least bad, it's about time. The Portia/Stella convo sounded like lived experience, which is a good thing to finally have on TV.

Marshall's schizophrenia they're getting wrong (which is par for the show) but his experience rings true.

1 hour ago, Daisy said:

she was going to, but Nina beat her to it. I am figuring that Olivia didn't have that much money to her name either so she needed to ask  Ned (in terms of "you screwed the family and it cost Carly so you owe me).  either that or she's just a dipstick. [maybe it is both].

Dipstick. Olivia was going to buy it for Carly with Ned's blessing but Carly turned her down. By the time Olivia figured out that she could buy it for herself rather than only for Carly, Nina had snapped it up.

[DanaK]

13 minutes ago, Cobra said:

Is it a bad thing if a black writer was involved in today’s show? The things that were talked about on today’s show with Curtis/Marshall and Portia/Stella are a realities for black people. As a black person, I was glad that it was brought up.

I think the poster was saying it felt more authentic.

In regards to the apparent hinting that Marshall was misdiagnosed (or purposely diagnosed wrong?), I think that’s where things are heading as well. Unfortunately, they’ll probably take forever to get there like so many other storylines

[jacourt]

If they are going to say Marshall was misdiagnosed then all the mental illness talk from portia is wasted time. And Trina should not have a melt down in court 

[Cheyanne11]

As if the staff is going to miss Carly.  As fucking if.  Also, I’ll never buy the Olivia/Carly friendship.  Carly’s too much of a bully to have any true friends.

[Daisy]

1 minute ago, Cheyanne11 said:

As if the staff is going to miss Carly.  As fucking if.  Also, I’ll never buy the Olivia/Carly friendship.  Carly’s too much of a bully to have any true friends.

Olivia blows smoke up Carly's butt thus - friendship.

[Cheyanne11]

Are the writers friggin joking with that last scene of Carly remembering she’s keeping Nina’s daughter from her and smugly proclaiming she’s good because she’s got her family?  We’re supposed to root for Carly still getting one over on Nina?  Dear god, this woman is a nightmare.

[Artsda]

So Carly's "good" because she's lying about Willow and has her family. Well then Nina should just let Willow die. 

[nilyank]

Nothing on this show sound interesting and it has been months since I watched.

Call me when Ava catches a clue about dumb Nikolas and we find out how who are Esme's biological parents.

[Daisy]

13 minutes ago, Artsda said:

So Carly's "good" because she's lying about Willow and has her family. Well then Nina should just let Willow die. 

I keep saying. Go to France nina, get fat off bread and cheese. run the hotel remotely. you aren't missing anything w/Willow as a daughter

[Tenshinhan]

I'm glad to see the show at least acknowledge the idea of Trina being targeted because she is Black.  It would have been irresponsible for them not to.

[ciarra]

I didn't see any on-screen evidence that Esme chose Trina to frame because she is a person of color.  Trina was targeted because Esme perceived her as a threat to her relationship with Spencer.  Racism, however, will affect how she is treated as a defendant and I agree Esme does know that Trina would be treated worse in the court system. 

Show wants to be woke, but then they use Portia, daughter of two doctors, a doctor herself, and ex-wife of a police detective as an example of what it's like to be a person of color in the U.S.  

Meet Drew, ex Navy Seal, now Carly's lap dog.  He has to carry all of Carly's crap out of the Metro Court, including a huge flower arrangement, and juggle it to get the door for her royal SheBeast. 

[Suicidy]

9 hours ago, Daisy said:

Olivia: why are you grilling my staff for information?!
Nina: um... i just want to know how things work? LOL like. duh. shut up Olivia. 
Then Olivia goes all "you can stop lording it over Carly that you bought it." I guess Olivia is forgetting that Nina offered to give Carly the hotel . Nina rightly goes, no it's not for sale and Sonny wants to know "why not, Nina." The next answer should be. "because I bought it and I don't want to sell it. The end." Which - is what she says! She's taking over. Olivia's head explodes. I cackle with glee.

Olivia is now is all, "well it's between you and me and our lawyers because this isn't happening you can't fill Carly's shoes professionally or personally.". Sonny is all "'don't look at me, you got yourself in this mess." Again, I laugh how Olivia is more mad at Nina for buying the hotel than Carly for selling it. 

Nina decided that she will keep it because of Wiley. [i swear, if this kid can no longer exist i wouldn't complain about this show for a year]. Sonny wants to know if that's really true, or if this is a way to stick it to Carly. Nina. dump his butt.  but she snaps at him that she should lecture Carly vs. lecturing her. 

Olivia and Carly share a moment, and Carly goes even though i lost you the hotel, and Olivia, goes "no that was my husband." NO OLIVIA. IT WAS CARLY. #saveNed

Trina: I don't want to tell anyone.
Portia: What's the game changer.
Joss: OH ONLY THAT TRINA HAS NEW EVIDENCE. once an always #saveTrina. 
Trina asks Joss to be a good friend and not say anything. Joss says no. Trina. find a new best friend. 

Leslie's house burned down. Laura is leaving. (enjoy the vacation, Genie!)

Hatman: Son, calm down.
Curtis: How are you so calm?
Hatman: wry smile anti-psycotics? that made me laugh so hard
 

And the show ends. with Carly looking at Nina, flashing back on knowing that Willow is Nina's daughter, gives her a Carly glare and goes "I have my family" as she's with-holding  Nina's from her. And the music and everything presented is that we're supposed to feel sad for Carly. no. never. ever. 

Carly is an awful bitch that got screwed because of her own ego amd greeed.  I hate her even more now.

[Corvino]

Here's what I want to see Nina saying. "I'll get rid of my half of the hotel only on one condition. Carly has to accept it from me as a gift. And she has to thank me."

[nilyank]

1 hour ago, Corvino said:

Here's what I want to see Nina saying. "I'll get rid of my half of the hotel only on one condition. Carly has to accept it from me as a gift. And she has to thank me."

She could say it but Carly isn't going to listen to a word that she says. I find Nina to be completely insufferable but she isn't stupid and knows that Carly wouldn't ever agree to that.

[Tenshinhan]

2 hours ago, ciarra said:

I didn't see any on-screen evidence that Esme chose Trina to frame because she is a person of color.  Trina was targeted because Esme perceived her as a threat to her relationship with Spencer. 

Much like in real life, there doesn't have to be any on-screen or visible evidence of Trina being targeted because of race.  It can occur completely unseen.  Trina was a threat to Esmé and Spencer's relationship, yes, but she was also a Black woman who was a threat to Esmé and Spencer's relationship.  Naturally, that's going to raise the question of how racism may have factored into Esmé's actions, and I think that it was good for the show to acknowledge that question.

2 hours ago, ciarra said:

...but then they use Portia, daughter of two doctors, a doctor herself, and ex-wife of a police detective as an example of what it's like to be a person of color in the U.S. 

Not to mention being super light-skinned. 

(Which is not to say that light-skinned individuals of color should go ignored, but it is a glaring choice.)

[CeChase]

8 hours ago, Cheyanne11 said:

Are the writers friggin joking with that last scene of Carly remembering she’s keeping Nina’s daughter from her and smugly proclaiming she’s good because she’s got her family?  We’re supposed to root for Carly still getting one over on Nina?  Dear god, this woman is a nightmare.

omg right?  That was so bad.  Outright evil and this is their leading lady!

[CeChase]

4 hours ago, Tenshinhan said:

Much like in real life, there doesn't have to be any on-screen or visible evidence of Trina being targeted because of race.  It can occur completely unseen.  Trina was a threat to Esmé and Spencer's relationship, yes, but she was also a Black woman who was a threat to Esmé and Spencer's relationship.  Naturally, that's going to raise the question of how racism may have factored into Esmé's actions, and I think that it was good for the show to acknowledge that question.

Not to mention being super light-skinned. 

(Which is not to say that light-skinned individuals of color should go ignored, but it is a glaring choice.)

I actually thought it was incredibly nuanced.  Portia carefully stated that Joss and Cam were victims of Esme's, but Esme set Trina up to have to deal with the criminal justice system, and she had to know it would be more treacherous for Trina because she's black.   I absolutely appreciated the writing for Friday's show and was shocked how good it was.  

[Blackie]

8 hours ago, nilyank said:

Call me when Ava catches a clue about dumb Nikolas and we find out how who are Esme's biological parents.

Ok see ya in 2024

9 hours ago, Cheyanne11 said:

Also, I’ll never buy the Olivia/Carly friendship

When did they even become such great friends?? I'm sure at one time Olivia disliked Carly like everyone else. Does she know the story about Carly getting BL to seduce Dante?

[sas616]

9 hours ago, Tenshinhan said:

I'm glad to see the show at least acknowledge the idea of Trina being targeted because she is Black.  It would have been irresponsible for them not to.

I couldn't believe that about 1 or 2 scenes before Portia brought it up, I was wondering why the writers didn't have someone bring it up.

[DanaK]

25 minutes ago, sas616 said:

I couldn't believe that about 1 or 2 scenes before Portia brought it up, I was wondering why the writers didn't have someone bring it up.

Given that, it will be interesting to see what happens with Marshall and his diagnosis. They’ve already addressed Marshall being Black with a purported mental illness being arrested by the police decades ago and him feeling shame about his illness. They are now dropping hints that suggest he was misdiagnosed and if they end up doing that, I wonder if they’ll directly address how often people of color are treated worse and misdiagnosed by the medical world. Except for taking way too long to get to the point with Marshall’s story, it’s been an interesting story, once they got to the point of course and they all stopped yelling at each other

Edited July 16, 2022 by DanaK

[nilyank]

2 hours ago, Blackie said:

When did they even become such great friends?? I'm sure at one time Olivia disliked Carly like everyone else. Does she know the story about Carly getting BL to seduce Dante?

When Olivia showed up, she and Carly hit it off as they made snarky remarks about Kate/Connie.

[Kim0820]

On 7/15/2022 at 4:46 AM, Corvino said:

I didn't see that horrible scene of Nina trying to be magnanimous to Carly and Carly being shrewish and stupid as Carly "winning" in any way. She showed that she is full of hate, and completely oblivious to the fact that almost all of her troubles are her fault-- SHE burned down her marriage, and SHE lost her half of the hotel. Showing so clearly what an awful person you are, in contrast to a person trying to be generous and make peace like Nina, is losing, not winning. She will only win later if she faces reality and gets enough soul to forgive and be forgiven. But of course those may not be the values the show is based on. 

Really, when she accused Nina of wanting to take the hotel away from her, it was absurd!  The only one who "took the hotel away" from Carly was Carly and only Carly!  When she had been advised not to.  The shebeast will blame others even for what they could not possibly have done, in a quest to be the victim every time.  

Trina has just about everyone's support, including all white characters except Esme, who is the one everyone else thinks is guilty.  Why would Esme not do the same to any color friend in Trina's position in the pentagon of Trina, Cameron, Spencer, Joss and Esme?  Esme is evil no matter who it is.    

[jacourt]

I’m not really getting what spencer is trying to do but if he ran esmes dna then wouldn’t Ryan show up as her father if he was?  Surely he’s in the database. 

Edited July 16, 2022 by jacourt
Wanted to add more.

[YaddaYadda]

Just now, jacourt said:

I’m not really getting what spencer is trying to do but if he ran esmes dna then wouldn’t Ryan show up as her father if he was?  

He ran Joss's DNA against Carly's to trick Esme into believing that he knows who her mother is and where she is.

[jacourt]

Thanks. 

[Sake614]

Spencer didn’t run esme’s dna. He ran joss/Carly   The idea is to fake out esme so she confesses. 

[Tenshinhan]

49 minutes ago, Kim0820 said:

Why would Esme not do the same to any color friend in Trina's position in the pentagon of Trina, Cameron, Spencer, Joss and Esme?

Because Trina is Black.  So that means that Esme will potentially choose to do worse to her than to anyone else.

49 minutes ago, Kim0820 said:

Esme is evil no matter who it is.

But what motivates Esme's evil may vary from person to person, based upon their race.  

Edited July 16, 2022 by Tenshinhan

[Blackie]

25 minutes ago, jacourt said:

I’m not really getting what spencer is trying to do but if he ran esmes dna then wouldn’t Ryan show up as her father if he was?  Surely he’s in the database.

Ryan's DNA would be in a federal criminal DNA list which Spencer wouldn't have access too. Spencer sent 2 samples of DNA to a lab to test to see if they were linked.

[Mirabelle]

57 minutes ago, Kim0820 said:

Really, when she accused Nina of wanting to take the hotel away from her, it was absurd!  The only one who "took the hotel away" from Carly was Carly and only Carly!  When she had been advised not to.  The shebeast will blame others even for what they could not possibly have done, in a quest to be the victim every time.  

Nobody took away the hotel! Carly came up with an asinine plan to sell it and then buy it back when anyone with a bit of sense would have gone to the bank and gotten a loan.  The closest thing I've ever taken to a business course is a Econ in high school and that's what I'd have done. If Carly had done that, she'd still have the hotel and the Aurora shares. 

[nilyank]

36 minutes ago, Mirabelle said:

Nobody took away the hotel! Carly came up with an asinine plan to sell it and then buy it back when anyone with a bit of sense would have gone to the bank and gotten a loan.  The closest thing I've ever taken to a business course is a Econ in high school and that's what I'd have done. If Carly had done that, she'd still have the hotel and the Aurora shares. 

Why wouldn't Carly still have the Aurora shares? She bought them with the proceeds for the sale of the MC Hotel.

[Cheyanne11]

I think I finally realized why Robert Gossett's acting isn't my cup of tea and it's that it's very showy, a a la a stage performance.  Like, if this was a play, I could see being totally won over by him, but for TV it doesn't work for me.

So not sure if the Trina meltdown on the stand is a spoiler or a theory, but imagine if Portia immediately gets up and declares "leave her alone--she's schizophrenic," which, a. nice diagnostic skills there doctor--can't imagine why being accused in court of something you didn't do might make you lose it (/sarcasm)--and b. then Marshall is determined to have been misdiagnosed in the first close, leading to Portia had no reason to worry in the first place and now we've got another secret daddy story to play out for the next year, so...yay.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Cheyanne11

[dubbel zout]

18 hours ago, Daisy said:

19 hours ago, ciarra said:

So Trina will fall apart on the stand, causing Portia to reveal that Taggert isn't her bio dad, and it's schizophrenia, inherited from grandpa Hatman. 

that would be great and soapy

I have to disagree. It's such a tired trope for me at this point, especially because a) we have the Willow-Nina reveal in the wings, and b) I don't like how the show is using mental illness as a plot point. It hasn't done a good job with Sonny's BPD, and some of us are wondering if Hatman was accurately diagnosed in the first place.

[Auntie Velvet]

I'm assuming Valentine had Leslie's house burned down so that he could satisfy Victor's order to have Laura out of the way without actually killing her? 

(In real life without the Annual Genie Vacation SL this would not be a safe bet, because Laura could have helped in several other ways, but...OK.)  

[Cassiopeia]

I had to look up who Robert Gossett is, and (probably everyone but me already knew this) he is Louis Gossett Jr.'s cousin! I feel like the acting gene did not make it over to Hatman's branch of the family. 

Someone needs to point out to Olivia that if she's mad at Ned because he didn't discuss the ELQ vote with her in advance, maybe she should be just a little miffed that her business partner Carly didn't bother to mention that she was selling her half of the business. Nina might have bought her share with noble intentions, but after being treated like crap by everyone, I'm hopeful she'll make the staff love her, but make Olivia's life hell.

I'm speed watching the show at this point. It's a sad day when I stop ff-ing to watch scenes with Sasha and Brando.

[Cheyanne11]

32 minutes ago, Cassiopeia said:

Someone needs to point out to Olivia that if she's mad at Ned because he didn't discuss the ELQ vote with her in advance, maybe she should be just a little miffed that her business partner Carly didn't bother to mention that she was selling her half of the business.

The moron knows and basically said "honey, I don't blame YOU, it's my husband's fault" because she's loyal like that. /sarcasm

[dubbel zout]

4 hours ago, nilyank said:

When Olivia showed up, she and Carly hit it off as they made snarky remarks about Kate/Connie.

Because Jasus forbid a woman be well-educated and successful and do it on her own. Ugh, they were such mean girls to Kate for wanting to get out of Bensonhurst.

[YaddaYadda]

Worst part is that Kate was Olivia's cousin. 

Liv being a petty bitch, siding with Carly over her family is nothing new.

[Daisy]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

I have to disagree. It's such a tired trope for me at this point, especially because a) we have the Willow-Nina reveal in the wings, and b) I don't like how the show is using mental illness as a plot point. It hasn't done a good job with Sonny's BPD, and some of us are wondering if Hatman was accurately diagnosed in the first place.

Well i guess for me. because it's an illness, I'd rather Trina have it than not have it.  I mean they suck with everything to be fair, I'd give you that, but at the same time I do like medical issues on GH. I would very much rather a poorly done medical issue vs. mob issue #1337173749194572741  (I do get your points so i am not dismissing them) I'm just saying why i think it would be soapy that this would be what triggered Trina as clichey-tropey as it might be. 

Whatever Willow has is clear cut convientious - but i think it would be interesting (if Hatman wasn't misdiagnosed) to show another heredity disease that wasn't the go to of Cancer or Depression. and show Trina living with said diagnosis). 

[seasons]

18 hours ago, TVbitch said:

Okay just for shits and giggles, I did some hotel googling. In 2019, the Ritz-Carlton, Lake Tahoe, sold for $120 million. I don't know if Port Chuck is equal to Lake Tahoe, but it's 2022 and real estate is more expensive, so let's just call it even. Just how rich is Nina that she can gift Carly $60 million, give or take? Nina is welcome to break up my family any time for that kind of money. : D

PS. Drew is so thirsty it is nauseating to witness.  

Love your p.s. Most likely Drew's balls were in that box that he was schlepping out for his master. 🐕

Edited July 16, 2022 by seasons

[Ambrosefolly]

41 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

Worst part is that Kate was Olivia's cousin. 

Liv being a petty bitch, siding with Carly over her family is nothing new.

And Kate,  even kept Dante's paternity a secret from Sonny, even though she was in love with him. It really is a shame they didn't do more with Meghan Ward's Kate Howard once she stopped dating Sonny. 

[seasons]

23 hours ago, ffwbe said:

Nothing will ever convince me that the MC staff loves having Carly as a boss. She radiates way too much Karen energy for that to be true. 

I wish I could like this 1000 times. You've totally nailed it with the Karen reference. 

Carly even sort of looks like Kate Gosselin, Queen of the Karens. 👑

Edited July 16, 2022 by seasons
But in real life LW seems really nice!

[Kim0820]

3 hours ago, Tenshinhan said:

Because Trina is Black.  So that means that Esme will potentially choose to do worse to her than to anyone else.

But what motivates Esme's evil may vary from person to person, based upon their race.  

There's been nothing to indicate that Esme would have done differently to a white rival.  How could her actions in this plot be easier on the rival?  She's always been about Trina's relationship to Spencer.  Writing and or acting would have to give some indication.  

[ciarra]

Pretty sure it's coming, the anvils are falling.

Quote

Wednesday

Portia: Well, I-I-I called weeks ago to make an appointment with a genetic specialist, and, um, they keep calling to reschedule. And I wanted to see if I could get fit in as soon as you possibly can. Thank you. Um, the soonest date you have, please, because I-it’s urgent.

Thursday (Transcript is a bit fuzzy on who says what in the 2nd paragraph)

Diane: You focus on trina — keeping her focused. Keep her from falling apart.

But my daughter is fighting for her future here. I need to prepare. I need to prepare for every eventuality. Of course. Alright. So the pressures of a trial, with the possibility of being wrongfully incarcerated, that — that could break anybody. And especially when you factor in stressors which could bring psychological issues to the surface.

It doesn't necessarily mean that they are going with schizophrenia, just that something will happen at the trial, possibly requiring hospitalization, pushing Portia to reveal that Curtis is Trina's biodad.

Like they don't have enough wimmin in psych/rehab with Liz and Sasha. 

[Tenshinhan]

2 hours ago, Kim0820 said:

There's been nothing to indicate that Esme would have done differently to a white rival.  How could her actions in this plot be easier on the rival?  She's always been about Trina's relationship to Spencer.  Writing and or acting would have to give some indication.  

I don't think that the writing or acting would have to indicate anything.  Trina is Black.  That's the only evidence needed.  The idea that a white woman would be harder on a Black rival should be self-explanatory to the audience in my view.

Maybe Esme views Trina as a greater threat to her relationship with Spencer because she's a Black woman.  That's very believable to me.  Or maybe the reason she went as far as she did with Trina was because of some deep-rooted animosity towards Black people.  Criminalizing a Black woman and leaving her in the hands of the justice system may be just what Trina deserves in Esme's mind.

The point is that the possibilities are very real, and that it makes sense that the show would address them and have the characters consider it.

Edited July 16, 2022 by Tenshinhan

[Ambrosefolly]

6 minutes ago, Tenshinhan said:

I don't think that the writing or acting would have to indicate anything.  Trina is Black.  That's the only evidence needed.  The idea that a white woman would be harder on a Black rival should be self-explanatory to the audience in my view.

Maybe Esme views Trina as a greater threat to her relationship with Spencer because she's a Black woman.  That's very believable to me.  Or maybe the reason she went as far as she did with Trina was because of some deep-rooted animosity towards Black people.  Criminalizing a Black woman and leaving her in the hands of the justice system may be just what Trina deserves in Esme's mind.

The point is that the possibilities are very real, and that it makes sense that the show would address it and have the characters consider them.

I doubt that some 18-20 year old is thinking along about how the justice system would treat system Trina or that Esme is such a racist that is it is Trina's race is the primary problem for her. Trina is a threat because Spencer has some sort of affection for her (especially when play by Sydney). Esme might even dismiss Trina as a potential romantic rival because she is black and might have gone after like Emma Drake (who Spencer was romantically interest in even when they were both kids), who is white, even harder. Same as when Ryan switched plays with his brother Kevin, putting him at the mercy of a mental institution. It was for Ryan's own comfort, though in that case, there was a personal edge to it because they are twins.