S03.E05: Chapter Five: The Flayed

[archer1267]

Quote

Now, you may ask how the Russians managed to build a huge mall and a huge secret facility in the middle of Indiana in a single year.  For that, I have no answer.

I admit, I often have a problem with suspension of disbelief, but I don't get the long, subterranean cavern under the mall. Was the mall built as a legit business "front" to cover up what's going on underground? It seems unnecessary. Also, a large team of Russians descends on small town Indiana and no one working in local hotels, grocery stores etc. has seen any sign of them? Word would have gotten out immediately that there were foreigners in town, and this was at a time when it was very difficult for people from the USSR to enter the US. I know, I'm over-thinking this. Maybe they have a giant holodeck to go with their mall tunnel.

[tvisme]

On 7/5/2019 at 9:44 AM, Tipsymcstagger said:

I think she’s absolutely lovely. And a pretty damned good actress as far as I can tell. I’m usually annoyed when I read about a celebrity kid “modeling” or acting. But she seems to have the chops. JMO.

On 7/7/2019 at 11:26 AM, kokapetl said:

I’m not calling her ugly, but Uma Thurman is a goddess, and Ethan Hawke was super hot back in the day. 

She actually kind of reminds me (looks wise) of Dana Plato  -- who was obviously famous in the 80s.  Just me?!

[VCRTracking]

14 hours ago, archer1267 said:

Now, you may ask how the Russians managed to build a huge mall and a huge secret facility in the middle of Indiana in a single year.  For that, I have no answer.

14 hours ago, archer1267 said:

I admit, I often have a problem with suspension of disbelief, but I don't get the long, subterranean cavern under the mall. Was the mall built as a legit business "front" to cover up what's going on underground? It seems unnecessary. Also, a large team of Russians descends on small town Indiana and no one working in local hotels, grocery stores etc. has seen any sign of them? Word would have gotten out immediately that there were foreigners in town, and this was at a time when it was very difficult for people from the USSR to enter the US. I know, I'm over-thinking this. Maybe they have a giant holodeck to go with their mall tunnel.

Somehow both the implausibility of the Soviets building a huge secret facility staffed by at least a hundred Russian scientists and soldiers deep underground a midwestern mall AND 2 18 year olds, a 14 year old and a 10 year old sneaking around said facility for a significant amount of time before only 2 get captured, cancelled each other out for me!

[Clanstarling]

On 7/4/2019 at 11:50 PM, tennisgurl said:

What is it with governments trying to create portals to obvious hell dimensions, trying to harness horrifying doom monsters, and just cracking open holes in the universe and poking around to see whats there? And the Soviets seem to be particularly lax in their Upside down security and protocol, its like this is some bizarre Chernobyl prequel.

I think these Soviets want to create a Chernobyl on our soil - and aren't think past that in regards to consequences. (just like the American scientists - in terms of thinking of the consequences)

On 7/5/2019 at 4:41 AM, kokapetl said:

You’d think the daughter of Uma Thurman and Ethan Hawke, two strikingly attractive people, would be super attractive. I don’t get it. 

Mileage clearly varies. I don't think either of her parents are all that - but I think she is.

On 7/5/2019 at 5:46 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I totally cracked up at the fact that in the previous episode, the Dread Pirate Roberts referred to the guy Hopper was looking for as Arnold Schwarzenegger and in this episode we got to see his very Terminator-esque personality/abilities.

There were a few times when I tried to decide if he was doing a Russian accent, or Arnold's. But they couldn't have cast a guy who looked more like Arnold, could they?

On 7/5/2019 at 1:21 PM, MisterGlass said:

The gloopy humans are grosser than the exploding rats.  All the little shifting bones and viscera. Ick. 

What is weird is that I was disturbed by the rats (and I hate rats), but more curious when it came to the humans. I think with the rats it was the pained squeeking/squealing that really got to me, and with the humans it was that they were pretty disgusting in the first place.

On 7/5/2019 at 10:40 PM, ganesh said:

The Ice Cream Team is the best plot. I mean, a covert Soviet underground base in 1985 at a Midwestern town is just fucking bonkers. I like the show, but they're really pushing it. 

I don't know if you coined "Ice Cream Team" @ganesh, but I love it. It has pizzazz and is fun to say.

On 7/6/2019 at 5:00 PM, gooberfish said:

Where are the plants that were taking over everything?

Behind the wall the Russians are trying to break through.

On 7/10/2019 at 12:05 PM, Rambler said:

Watching Steve and Robin sneaking around a secret Russian military base in cute sailor outfits has got to be one of the funniest visuals ever, especially since I think of them as wearing their very own dorky superhero costumes.

I saw a still shot of them walking down the corridor, and thought it was hysterical. Though I'm truly glad they didn't have them in uniforms from the corn dogs on a stick place (did they ever hire guys?)

Edited July 13, 2019 by Clanstarling

[Dobian]

I laughed hard when Dustin yelled, "Steve, you did it, you finally won a fight!"

[Heathrowe]

On 7/7/2019 at 2:26 PM, kokapetl said:

I’m not calling her ugly, but Uma Thurman is a goddess, and Ethan Hawke was super hot back in the day. 

I feel pretty certain that if this actress were out of character, with her hair and make up done differently, she could bring the genetic hotness if she chose to. But she's not supposed to be playing a hottie-she's supposed to be the dork who speaks 4 different languages girl?  That said-I'm not sure being smoking hot was great for either Uma Thurman or Ethan Hawke's career. There's a lot written about Ethan Hawke downplaying his looks, he waited years and years to be regarded as a real actor and not just eye candy. 

[Ilovepie]

Wow - came here to read the comments and no has mentioned my favorite thing this episode: Steve peeing down the side of the elevator! I laughed when Robin told him to change direction, and all you see is the stream on the wall moving sideways.....😂

I also feel if they wanted to keep it totally 80’s, Mike should have offered Eleven Reese’s Pieces instead of M&M’s......

[Clanstarling]

5 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Wow - came here to read the comments and no has mentioned my favorite thing this episode: Steve peeing down the side of the elevator! I laughed when Robin told him to change direction, and all you see is the stream on the wall moving sideways.....😂

I also feel if they wanted to keep it totally 80’s, Mike should have offered Eleven Reese’s Pieces instead of M&M’s......

The peeing was funny.

Yeah, Reece's Pieces would totally be appropriate for the 80's nostalgia.

[Taryn74]

8 hours ago, Ilovepie said:

Wow - came here to read the comments and no has mentioned my favorite thing this episode: Steve peeing down the side of the elevator! I laughed when Robin told him to change direction, and all you see is the stream on the wall moving sideways.....😂

Uggghhhh just thinking about that triggers my gag reflex, LMAO.  I think I blocked it out.

Didn't one of the Russians also ask why it smelled like piss when they came in?  Hee!

[Ilovepie]

2 hours ago, Taryn74 said:

Didn't one of the Russians also ask why it smelled like piss when they came in?  Hee!

Yes he did. I think the other one with him couldn't smell it because he was smoking........

[Tyro49]

I wonder if the Russian underground lab is at the same spot as the American company's lab - is it a "weak spot" between realities? As to why they're doing it, I have no idea.

[CeeBeeGee]

On 7/7/2019 at 4:32 PM, foxfreakinmulder said:

I did read online that if they renew for season 4 it will be smoke free because people are complaining. Come on, what's next, they complain because the kids are out after dark? Give me a forking break.

Utterly ridiculous. I despise--I mean despise--smoking but it's a fact that a lot more people smoked back then. Hell, high schools had smoking lounges, FFS.

The hospital chase scene had to have been a shoutout to Halloween II.

[Taryn74]

31 minutes ago, CeeBeeGee said:

Utterly ridiculous. I despise--I mean despise--smoking but it's a fact that a lot more people smoked back then. Hell, high schools had smoking lounges, FFS.

Yep.  Our high school had a smoker's block where the students could go smoke during lunch break.  (With a signed permission slip from their parents, of course.)

I can remember going to the bathroom during basketball games as a kid and the air in the lobby would literally be a blue haze from all the guys standing around smoking.

That is one thing I can say is definitely better about today, heh.  It's actually odd to me to see someone smoking because so few people smoke in public anymore.

[foxfreakinmulder]

I don't smoke. I did once upon a time starting at age 14 until I quit cold turkey at 28. That was 30+ years ago, now if I walk by someone smoking I'll hold my breath because I don't like the smell. I can't stand going to Casinos because of the smoke and I'm glad you can't smoke in restaurants anymore. But It doesn't bother me to see someone on tv smoke especially during a time when it was more socially accepted. It's not like everyone on the show smokes, the kids don't (I'm not including Billy as one of the group). It's only Hopper and Joyce. 

 It's ridiculous to complain about that. I'm going to assume these complainers never watched an episode of Mad Men lol. Really, if they want to complain about something what about teenagers on tv shows having sex.

[Clanstarling]

Just now, foxfreakinmulder said:

I don't smoke. I did once upon a time starting at age 14 until I quit cold turkey at 28. That was 30+ years ago, now if I walk by someone smoking I'll hold my breath because I don't like the smell. I can't stand going to Casinos because of the smoke and I'm glad you can't smoke in restaurants anymore. But It doesn't bother me to see someone on tv smoke especially during a time when it was more socially accepted. It's not like everyone on the show smokes, the kids don't (I'm not including Billy as one of the group). It's only Hopper and Joyce. 

 It's ridiculous to complain about that. I'm going to assume these complainers never watched an episode of Mad Men lol. Really, if they want to complain about something what about teenagers on tv shows having sex.

It's not as if it's depicted as something cool and glamorous, as you pointed out it's just Joyce and Hop (and, I guess Billy), and they are a far distance from being either of those in the context of the show. If something is set in a specific era, it should reflect that era. Otherwise why bother, in my opinion. Leaving out the bad stuff just makes people nostalgic for a time that never really existed.

[Taryn74]

48 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

Leaving out the bad stuff just makes people nostalgic for a time that never really existed.

A LITTLE LOUDER FOR THE ONES IN THE BACK.

Such a true statement, and very socially relevant as well.

[Captain Carrot]

5 hours ago, Taryn74 said:

I can remember going to the bathroom during basketball games as a kid and the air in the lobby would literally be a blue haze from all the guys standing around smoking.

It wasn't that bad, but I remember a cigarette vending machine at Denny's. Smoking may have been on it's way out, but cigarette's were still EVERYWHERE back then. I have no problem with them in a period piece. (As long as they don't glamorize smoking).

[Dminches]

On 7/5/2019 at 5:25 PM, Enigma X said:

I think she is a really good actress.

she looks more like her dad to me. I always thought he looked like the average American boy next door. So...

And his Dad is an actuary to he is sort of regular.

On 7/6/2019 at 12:49 AM, LittleIggy said:

When I was watching this episode, there was a thunderstorm and the lights blinked! Freaky!

While we were watching the episode we lost power and everything went totally dark.  My wife was not happy.

[CeeBeeGee]

Oh, and I wonder if Hopper commandeering the car is a shout-out to Bill Maxwell, the FBI agent in The Greatest American Hero. Bill used to commandeer some random stranger's car every few episodes.

[Taryn74]

3 hours ago, Captain Carrot said:

It wasn't that bad, but I remember a cigarette vending machine at Denny's. 

Oh man, cigarette vending machines! I had forgotten about those. I went on a trip with the Yearbook Staff one year and there was one in the hallway of the hotel. Several of us walked past the machine one at a time putting a single coin (or dollar bill, I don't remember now how much they cost LOL) in and then the last person by cashed out for the pack of cigarettes and we snuck them into our room. (I was a dweeb though and didn't even know you were supposed to "inhale". Me and Bill Clinton I guess, heh.)

Good memories.

[Clanstarling]

13 hours ago, Captain Carrot said:

It wasn't that bad, but I remember a cigarette vending machine at Denny's. Smoking may have been on it's way out, but cigarette's were still EVERYWHERE back then. I have no problem with them in a period piece. (As long as they don't glamorize smoking).

I remember it as that bad. I worked in a small office where everyone but me smoked, and chain smoked. (Well, actually, there was another non-smoker, but when she complained she was let go.)

When restaurants grudgingly started having non-smoking areas (as opposed to no smoking, which was later), I remember one where the non-smoking section was on a raised platform in the center of the restaurant, so instead of getting some smoke, we got all the smoke.

Another time (and this was in 2000, in Kentucky), I couldn't figure out why I was smelling smoke at an airport when the smoking area was glass enclosed. I looked closer, and the glass "walls" were not floor to ceiling, but left about two feet open at the top and the bottom. 

Edited July 19, 2019 by Clanstarling

[springbarb]

On 7/17/2019 at 3:20 AM, Ilovepie said:

I also feel if they wanted to keep it totally 80’s, Mike should have offered Eleven Reese’s Pieces instead of M&M’s......

There were Reese's Pieces in the vending machine, at least.

[foxfreakinmulder]

This is probably my favorite episode of this season. We have most of our gang together and they are putting the pieces together and figuring out what is happening just like an episode of Nancy Drew lol.

And of course Steve wins his first fight :-)

[nodorothyparker]

Finally catching up now that my kids are done with their respective summer camps.  This show has gotten genuinely scary with all the bodies at the hospital and that legitimately terrifying chase sequence.  Busey Jr. methodically calling out Nancy was chilling.  It's almost like Harry Potter at this point where it's getting bigger and darker and dealing with harder stuff as the kids are getting older.  Johnathon had to stab whatever pod version of his former boss they're dealing with to death through the throat, but he never should have been able to get off the floor after that beatdown in the first place.  I'll give them both credit for being braver than I am though because if I saw something I'd just had to kill suddenly oozing along the floor like it had someplace to be, I'd be hightailing it the opposite direction instead of following it.

I did like two of the groups converging, and Will and Mike eyerolling at having to ride in the back of the station wagon like the runts of the litter was a hoot.  Yeah, that really did suck when you were stuck back there like a little kid.  The longest walk ever down the underground tunnel went on a little long for me, and those poor Scoops Ahoy uniforms are like the worst outfits to be doing surveillance or sneaking around in ever.  Robin's isn't quite as bad but Steve's is just tragic.  Good for him for finally winning a fight though and immediately being able to flip his hair back in place.  Of course the Soviets somehow knew about the experiments with the upside down in Hawkins and now have to have their own super secret lab under the local shopping mall to try to replicate them.  Nothing bad could possibly come of that.

The hardcore channeling of the Terminator that included a bit of mahem at the 7-11 totally worked for me and had me feeling like I had somehow switched over to one of those movies.  Hopper is walking a fine line in becoming almost downright unlikable with him constantly raging at the nearest target and snitting jealously at Joyce as if he has any right to be.  I get that he's really just kind of over it in realizing that they're now dealing with a third round of this nonsense, but it's becoming too much.

[LilJen]

On ‎7‎/‎6‎/‎2019 at 4:24 PM, Captain Carrot said:

What was interesting is that the flayed seemed to be focused on Nancy, and not Jonathan. Was that due to lingering dislike from the hosts, or did the Mind Flayer see her as more of a threat?

It doesn't like her perm?

<classical music nerd alert> I enjoyed the bits of Philip Glass's Satyagraha (an opera about the life of Gandhi) at the end.

[Dirtybubble]

Ok how awesome was it to see Murray back?!  He was one of my favs from Season 2 so I cheered when they reached his warehouse/home and was forced to look in the camera!  Yay for Steve and Dustin, yay to Smirnoff/Alexi, and boo to Erica!  She has gone from mildly annoying to down right irritating A.F.!! 

[festivus]

On 7/5/2019 at 1:59 PM, scottiB said:

A commenter at the A.V. club mentioned that she was a perfect 50/50 of each parent. There is an angle where I can see Uma and another where Ethan seems prominent.

She is, I can see both too but what's really weird is that she reminds me very much of a friend I had in high school whose name was Robin. I'm really liking her character so far, loved her trying to use what little Russian she knew. She seems pretty smart and capable so far. I'm actually loving this quartet of kids, somehow Steve has turned out to be my favorite. I'm only halfway through the season but he's been stuck in that awful outfit for all of it, poor thing. At least his hair is awesome.

[LeGrandElephant]

On 7/6/2019 at 6:20 AM, Lady Calypso said:

Yeah, I don't know how Jonathan was even standing up, let alone walking, by the end of this episode. His spine got seriously slammed into basically everything. 

When he had trouble pulling himself up I thought maybe he’d be paralyzed from the waist down. That would have been a way to up the stakes without killing a regular. But then he was fine. 

Edited August 8, 2019 by LeGrandElephant

[LeGrandElephant]

On 7/7/2019 at 1:32 PM, foxfreakinmulder said:

I did read online that if they renew for season 4 it will be smoke free because people are complaining. Come on, what's next, they complain because the kids are out after dark? Give me a forking break.

At first, my brain somehow interpreted this as the scenes not being so dark and hard to see, and I thought that was great! But now I see it means cigarette smoking. So what, people are ok with their kids seeing horrible monsters and gristly deaths, but not someone smoking a cigarette? 

Edited August 9, 2019 by LeGrandElephant

[LeGrandElephant]

Am I supposed to like Hopper? He's not appealing or attractive in any way this season. Wasn't he more likable and good looking in season 1?

[Danny Franks]

Alright, so the fact that it's a month since I watched episode 4 says a lot about how I'm feeling about this season. 

It feels more like a parody of all the 80s movies tropes that the Duffer brothers could think of. In the opening few minutes we get Russians secretly living under Hawkins (in a base that looked more Austin Powers than James Bond), extended gun fights and a Terminator. Then we get Alien acid blood in a can. It's just a bit too silly for me.

David Harbour seems to have forgotten that Hopper was supposed to have a dissolute charm and affability to him. He's just shouting and bullying and passive aggressive, all the time. Can't imagine why Joyce isn't interested in him. 

It was cool seeing Murray again. He's obviously going to love all this Cold War conspiracy stuff. And of course he speaks Russian. Ain't that handy?

I like Max and El as friends. They have nice chemistry and it's good to see El having a normal, adolescent relationship (I don't count her relationship with Mike as normal). Their laughing at the boys' idiocy continues to be great.

And holy shit, Nancy and Jonathan actually had some scenes with the kids! I didn't think that was allowed until the season finale.

The visual of them all following Nancy, single file through Heather's house made me laugh. Like a bunch of baby ducks following their mother. And she is a pretty good investigative reporter, it turns out. She put together the pieces in the house pretty quickly.

Finally, we have a good reason to have the immensely creepy Jake Busey in the show. He's freaked me out ever since The Frighteners and while this wasn't as genuinely unnerving, it still worked.

Really good acting from Natalia Dyer as she was desperately trying to find an escape route in the hospital.

By the way the body horror stuff of the bodies dissolving is how The Expanse should have depicted the Protomolecule. This is almost exactly how I pictured from the descriptions in the books.

Also, I laughed at "Dude, you did it! You won a fight!" Poor Steve, gone from the school stud to the butt monkey in three short years.

[Bnlhockey]

On 7/18/2019 at 9:53 PM, CeeBeeGee said:

Oh, and I wonder if Hopper commandeering the car is a shout-out to Bill Maxwell, the FBI agent in The Greatest American Hero. Bill used to commandeer some random stranger's car every few episodes.

The music was straight out of Midnight Run - Hopper as DeNiro and Alexi as Grodin...great movie.

[azshadowwalker]

On 9/1/2019 at 7:00 AM, Bnlhockey said:

The music was straight out of Midnight Run - Hopper as DeNiro and Alexi as Grodin...great movie.

Partially filmed in my hometown. 

[Sarah 103]

On 7/6/2019 at 6:44 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

The show managed to keep Nancy and Jonathan around this season since it's summer but they're going to have to come up with some reason why the older kids are still around next season. I can buy Steve and Jonathan still being around since Steve didn't get into college and Jonathan can't afford to go, but there's no real reason why Nancy (who has the money and the grades to leave Hawkins and go to college) should stick around.

Since seasons tend to take place over a short amount of time, they could set it during a school break. Thanksgiving break is usually a little less than a week but some students can extend it based on class schedule (if Thanksgiving break starts on Tuesday, but a student doesn't have classes on Monday, they could leave the Saturday before Thanksgiving). There's also winter break which tends to be closer to 3-4 weeks, spring break is usually a week. 

[Perfect Xero]

I think a lot of us got confused by the internship, but Nancy and Jonathan were a year behind Steve in season one, so they don't actually need to explain her being around and not away at college until season 5.

[smartymarty]

On 1/16/2020 at 2:35 AM, Sarah 103 said:

Thanksgiving break is usually a little less than a week but some students can extend it based on class schedule (if Thanksgiving break starts on Tuesday, but a student doesn't have classes on Monday, they could leave the Saturday before Thanksgiving). There's also winter break which tends to be closer to 3-4 weeks, spring break is usually a week. 

I realize I'm responding years later... but my college Thanksgiving break started Wednesday after one's last class. As for winter break, as far north as southern New Jersey, high schools don't have winter break. Just saying.

Glad to come here to find out my thinking the newspaper guy's resemblance to Gary Busey wasn't a mere coincidence.

[roamyn]

Why would Nancy & Jonathan just stand there watching the flayed news perks merge to become a demigorgon?

And how are they going to explain away an entire ward of people - patients & personnel - being killed?

Hubby and I used to have a name for the big strong alien in X-Files, Schwarzenalien, we're going to call this one Russianager.

Do the Soviets know that's the Upside Down they're breaching?  And if so, WHY would they open the door again?