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S04.E03: O, Ye of Little Faith, Father

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An ex-gang member's murder may mask an even darker crime. Lucifer catches Chloe in a lie. Dan and Maze go rogue. Linda braces for looming motherhood.

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Couldn't the other possible first love have been a man? I'm disappoint' by you show. You are on Netflix now. Have some balls.

Edited by Miles
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Oh, I'm glad the story with the priest finished quickly and Chloe stopped lying to Luci.

Amenadiel was hilarious, lol

The Catholic Chruch in the USA has to be pretty different from the CC in my country, because no way they wouldn't cover for the killer priest here.

I've never liked Ella and I'm not enjoying her religious crisis: on a show about angels and demons, atheism can't go anywhere.

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4 minutes ago, Helena Dax said:

The Catholic Chruch in the USA has to be pretty different from the CC in my country, because no way they wouldn't cover for the killer priest here.

What country are you in? Maybe you mean that the Catholic Church wouldn't cover for a killer priest now? Because they've absolutely covered for abusive and murderous members of the clergy in many countries. The Sisters of Mercy let a ton of kids die.

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37 minutes ago, HunterHunted said:

What country are you in? Maybe you mean that the Catholic Church wouldn't cover for a killer priest now? Because they've absolutely covered for abusive and murderous members of the clergy in many countries. The Sisters of Mercy let a ton of kids die.

Oh, I meant that they would cover for him even today. I'm pretty sure of it, since they're still protecting pedophile scum and nuns who stole babies. (I'm Spanish btw)

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Still wish they brought in Lilith instead of Eve. While Maze being the devil on Dan's shoulder should be interesting. I would've liked seeing her family issues too. Luci and Chloe being in another triangle is not interesting after we just had one. 

Lilith being Maze's mother could've even tied into the Linda pregnancy storyline. Chloe dealing or not dealing with Lucifer is it's own storyline without adding another love interest. 

They had such a good first episode. I hope they don't fall back into what made almost give up on the show last season. 

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3 hours ago, Sakura12 said:

Still wish they brought in Lilith instead of Eve.

I like Eve. And Netflix already had Lilith in Shadowhunters, Sabrina and Chambers. They probably felt that it would be too much to also have her on Lucifer.

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Heh, even though they don't say her name, having Eve ordering an appletini is about as on the nose as they could get!  Still, I'm looking forward towards more Inbar Lavi here.

They certainly aren't wasting time at least, with everything pretty much being out in the open, now.  Even though it ends with Lucifer not trusting Chloe, because she only revealed things after Father Kinley already spilled the beans to him (granted, he twisted it in a way to make himself look more innocent.)  I guess they'll still be partners going forward, but this is clearly going to be a major issue for them.

Dan is now letting loose and kicking ass with Maze.  Fun, but I have a feeling Dan is going to spiral unless he really addresses his feelings.

Amenadiel trying to be supportive to Linda was great.

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Unicorn knives,  something I didn't think I needed but now want entirely irrationally.   I'm loving Maze this season thus far. 

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On 5/8/2019 at 3:30 PM, Helena Dax said:

I've never liked Ella and I'm not enjoying her religious crisis: on a show about angels and demons, atheism can't go anywhere.

What caused Ella to abandon her religion, I have forgotten.

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25 minutes ago, AnimeMania said:

What caused Ella to abandon her religion, I have forgotten.

Charlotte's death, if I'm correct.

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6 hours ago, Delphi said:

Unicorn knives,  something I didn't think I needed but now want entirely irrationally.   I'm loving Maze this season thus far. 

Why's that irrational? One can do many things w/ unicorn knives. I expect to see one of those half-hour commercials any day now.

With the ten-episode season, there really isn't time for much filler. I have a feeling that last year, the evil priest arc would have lasted seven or eight episodes.

Awww, Amenidude proposed to Dr. Linda. Awwww, she turned him down. Awwwww, he still is there to sit by her and hold her hand. 

While I loved seeing Maze and Dan going to town on the bad guys, and I can't believe I'm about to say it, but I'm concerned about what this means going forward for Det. Douche.

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29 minutes ago, Helena Dax said:

Charlotte's death, if I'm correct.

Especially since it was a murder committed by someone she'd started out worshipping (though God knows why).

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I guess Wallmart doesn't carry a "sorry I tried to send you to Hell" card. Chloe did come around to realizing that Lucifer probably isnt evil incarnate, and they will probably keep solving cases together, but its going to take a hot minute for him trust her again.

I cracked up that the priest specifically created a case to perfectly mirror Lucifer's issues because Chloe told him that he "makes the cases all about himself" because, yeah that is totally true. I mean, the show does it so much that I didnt even realize that this was super on the nose, even by this shows standards, and that it was a set up.

Dan and Maze teaming up was fun, but I think this could lead Dan down a really dark path, he is clearly not dealing with Charlotte's death at all, and is lashing out all over the place.

Amenadiel was so adorable with his enthusiasm for the baby, even though Linda is clearly freaking out. Even beyond Amenadiel being the baby's father and Linda's ex as well as her friend, she is certainly going to want him around because, well, we dont really know what this kids deal is yet. Have angels ever had kids with humans in this universe? Will the baby have powers? Linda might want some cosmic babysitting if her kid comes out with glowing eyes or angel wings or something!

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20 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Have angels ever had kids with humans in this universe? Will the baby have powers? Linda might want some cosmic babysitting if her kid comes out with glowing eyes or angel wings or something!

Nope. It has never happened as Amenadiel cheerfully noted. It's never happened in all of human or angel history.

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It's kinda dumb that Father Bad Guy's plan depended entirely on Dan and Maze being able to fight through more than a dozen gang members in order to make the boss spill the beans on who the killer was. And why did the killer commit suicide if he was so devout and suicide is such a big sin in the Catholic Church. Was it just so Ella could make her shish kabob quip? Because if it is, I got a good chuckle out of it, so all is forgiven.

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Regarding the scene where Chloe finally breaks down and admits to Lucifer, "I'm TERRIFIED!"
--

I'm not going to listen to anyone slag off Lauren German's acting ever again. That was amazing, and it's about time someone of the mortals in Luci's inner circle besides Linda had an appropriately freaked out reaction to the truth. And how do you as an actor convey a character's entire universe being upended, shattered and blown to pieces? 

It was an impossible moment and she conveyed it brilliantly.

Kudos, Ms. German, I knew you had it in you.

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Chloe trying to keep Lucifer from drinking anything really highlights how pointless it was to enlist her in the first place. Lucifer owns a club constantly packed with anonymous people where he swans about drinking on a regular basis, and if they've researched him they'd know that, but Chloe is the only person they've ever thought to have drug him?

On 5/10/2019 at 3:07 PM, Loandbehold said:

With the ten-episode season, there really isn't time for much filler. I have a feeling that last year, the evil priest arc would have lasted seven or eight episodes.

While I'm probably in the minority in that I like what are generally considered filler, case-of-the-week episodes, I agree that the Awkward Dance Of Secret Betrayal would have been dragged out much longer if the season had more episodes to work with, so it was a relief to be spared that.

On 5/11/2019 at 8:05 PM, tennisgurl said:

I cracked up that the priest specifically created a case to perfectly mirror Lucifer's issues because Chloe told him that he "makes the cases all about himself" because, yeah that is totally true. I mean, the show does it so much that I didnt even realize that this was super on the nose, even by this shows standards, and that it was a set up.

This. Similar to the scene in the flashback last episode, with the priest saying that Lucifer would constantly try different personas and mannerisms to win her trust; that was actually a clever argument to make considering Lucifer's longstanding habit of 'I know, I'm going to act in THIS random manner this week!'.

Edited by Emma9
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On 5/16/2019 at 3:40 PM, Emma9 said:

Chloe trying to keep Lucifer from drinking anything really highlights how pointless it was to enlist her in the first place. Lucifer owns a club constantly packed with anonymous people where he swans about drinking on a regular basis, and if they've researched him they'd know that, but Chloe is the only person they've ever thought to have drug him?

I thought it was poison. Anyway, Chloe called Father Kinley out on that when she told him she wouldn’t help. She accused him of using her specifically because they knew she makes Lucifer vulnerable to the poison/drug. It couldn’t have been anyone else.

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I thought the priest said that the stuff in the vial was some sort of hardcore sedative (or as Chloe called it, a "roofie"). It was intended to knock out Lucifer, and then the priest would do the next part of the plan, whatever that was meant to be. Exorcism, I think he told Chloe, to send Lucifer back to Hell. Though I wonder if he had more in mind, especially because he said what he would do would send Lucifer back there permanently.

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It was an impossible moment and she conveyed it brilliantly.

I agree, and I'm glad for the moment between them. I'm glad there's someone in the main cast of characters who isn't taking it so smoothly. (I mean, obviously it took Linda some time, but she did recover and I don't think she holds Lucifer's devil face against him like Chloe is. She's not afraid of him anymore, not like Chloe is.) I thought maybe they'd show Chloe slowly descending into insanity, but instead they're going with another believable reaction - terror. And I like that she's at war with those emotions, because after all their history together she does feel like he is a good person... she just wishes he didn't have that side that scares her so much. Which is pretty fascinating. I feel bad for Lucifer, though.

Dan's the one that scares me a little. He's out of control, and I get the sense that if he were to find out about Lucifer right now, Dan would have no qualms about sending him right back to Hell. Whatever it took. He's heading down a very dark path.

Edited by sinkwriter
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I found it refreshing that, perhaps for the first time in the show, Chloe was allowed to actually be wrong and to face fallout for it. Her motives and reasoning didn't come out of nowhere, but her actions were still a serious blow to their relationship. After everything they'd been through together, after the multiple times Lucifer had risked/sacrificed his life and family for her (some of which she does know about), her pushing all that history aside to only focus on him being the Devil was deserving of consequences, especially following her multiple proclamations of love and forgiveness of all aspects of him. Words like that aren't cheap, and when they were actually put to the test, Chloe did fail to follow through.

The whole "Lucifer is a spazzy, tunnel-visioned goober always trailing after eternally forgiving and patient Saint Chloe who deigns to tolerate him" had worn VERRRYYY thin by season 3. It'd both diminished Lucifer as a character and placed Chloe on an unwarranted pedestal. This was a welcome shake-up to their dynamic. She got to come back down to earth and Lucifer got to be rightfully angry with her for once and demonstrate some dignity and self-respect in the process.

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If that vial had a sedative so strong it would kill a man, then wouldn't Lucifer die if he drank it near the Detective (I love that he has that as her name in his phone)?  

I also thought when Brody mentioned that Susan had a clean drug test, that would come back. I was hoping Lucifer would've told murder guy since he made a point of saying she was still on drugs. I assume he was lied to by Father Evil but I wanted him to realize he killed totally innocent people.

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On 5/10/2019 at 2:14 AM, thuganomics85 said:

Heh, even though they don't say her name, having Eve ordering an appletini is about as on the nose as they could get!

I completely missed that. Thanks. That's why I come here.

On 5/11/2019 at 6:05 PM, tennisgurl said:

Chloe did come around to realizing that Lucifer probably isnt evil incarnate, and they will probably keep solving cases together, but its going to take a hot minute for him trust her again.

That's kind of on her though because the show has hit hard on how he punishes people for doing bad things. Lucifer has literally said that in S1. I found that annoying. Fair within the context of the show. I find it funny in the larger context with the literal billions of people on this planet; sure, the devil is going is going to come to you, personally you, and make you do something bad. Sure. Yeah. He singled you out of everyone. Ok. 

I've getting around to the show, and the netflix version is more dense so far. 

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On 5/21/2019 at 6:28 PM, sinkwriter said:

Dan's the one that scares me a little. He's out of control, and I get the sense that if he were to find out about Lucifer right now, Dan would have no qualms about sending him right back to Hell. Whatever it took. He's heading down a very dark path.

It's not clear to me why he's so mad at Lucifer for Charlotte though. Amy was with her when she was shot. Is it because of Pierce? Because Lucifer did tell them he was up to no good, and Dan was in on bringing Pierce down. 

I think it's fair that there's at least one character who is just sick of Lucifer's act. 

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I was impressed with Chloe revealing that the reason she even thought about working with the priest to send him back to Hell, was because it's terrifying for her to know she's actually dealing with the actual devil. So she's far from being OK with him, even after refusing to work with the priest against him.Lucifer proved his point when he asked Chloe if she could look at him with his devil face, and she could barely do so.

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S4 is seriously amazing. Amazing. So much better than an entire previous S3 already.

On 5/8/2019 at 12:30 PM, Helena Dax said:

I've never liked Ella and I'm not enjoying her religious crisis: on a show about angels and demons, atheism can't go anywhere.

Ella is more bearable this season but I still hope episode by episode that she'll somehow become a homicide case victim. Which: AWESOMENESS. Still for me, Worst Character Ever.

On 5/10/2019 at 1:14 AM, thuganomics85 said:

Heh, even though they don't say her name, having Eve ordering an appletini is about as on the nose as they could get!  Still, I'm looking forward towards more Inbar Lavi here.

I love Eve and am surprised to do so. But she's sweet, kind, open and innocent, no matter what she indulges in. Which is as it should be. Great casting! 

On 5/10/2019 at 5:52 AM, Delphi said:

Unicorn knives,  something I didn't think I needed but now want entirely irrationally.   I'm loving Maze this season thus far. 

Me too. Love Maze, every ep in s4. 

On 5/10/2019 at 12:07 PM, Loandbehold said:

Awww, Amenidude proposed to Dr. Linda. Awwww, she turned him down. Awwwww, he still is there to sit by her and hold her hand. 

While I loved seeing Maze and Dan going to town on the bad guys, and I can't believe I'm about to say it, but I'm concerned about what this means going forward for Det. Douche.

I'm loving Amenadiel and Linda (of course), as well as Maze supporting Dan. It feels like such believable story without effort. That visible "oh my god personality and story, shit" was everything that was wrong with s3.

On 5/11/2019 at 5:05 PM, tennisgurl said:

Amenadiel was so adorable with his enthusiasm for the baby, even though Linda is clearly freaking out. Even beyond Amenadiel being the baby's father and Linda's ex as well as her friend, she is certainly going to want him around because, well, we dont really know what this kids deal is yet. Have angels ever had kids with humans in this universe? Will the baby have powers? Linda might want some cosmic babysitting if her kid comes out with glowing eyes or angel wings or something!

I can't think Amen won't be around. He just has to make his case.

On 5/16/2019 at 2:18 PM, Gummo said:

I'm not going to listen to anyone slag off Lauren German's acting ever again. That was amazing, and it's about time someone of the mortals in Luci's inner circle besides Linda had an appropriately freaked out reaction to the truth. And how do you as an actor convey a character's entire universe being upended, shattered and blown to pieces? 

It was an impossible moment and she conveyed it brilliantly.

I find German mostly okay (to awful in the final eps of S3, I mean, OMG SO BAD), but she's back to being a non-entity to me in S4. She's okay. But gods above, someone please fire her makeup artists as again she seems as always to be suffering from pinkeye and consumption.

On 5/22/2019 at 3:38 AM, BabySpinach said:

I found it refreshing that, perhaps for the first time in the show, Chloe was allowed to actually be wrong and to face fallout for it. Her motives and reasoning didn't come out of nowhere, but her actions were still a serious blow to their relationship. After everything they'd been through together, after the multiple times Lucifer had risked/sacrificed his life and family for her (some of which she does know about), her pushing all that history aside to only focus on him being the Devil was deserving of consequences, especially following her multiple proclamations of love and forgiveness of all aspects of him. Words like that aren't cheap, and when they were actually put to the test, Chloe did fail to follow through.

The whole "Lucifer is a spazzy, tunnel-visioned goober always trailing after eternally forgiving and patient Saint Chloe who deigns to tolerate him" had worn VERRRYYY thin by season 3. It'd both diminished Lucifer as a character and placed Chloe on an unwarranted pedestal. This was a welcome shake-up to their dynamic. She got to come back down to earth and Lucifer got to be rightfully angry with her for once and demonstrate some dignity and self-respect in the process.

I agree with your appreciation for these elements, so we'll see what happens. I am definitely enjoying S4 far more than S3.

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20 hours ago, galaxychaser said:

Linda lost too much weight. Plus too old to get pregnant. Chloe had to much work done. She looks awful.

 

Rachel Harris was pregnant in real life when Linda was pregnant.

 

Agree about Chloe having too much work done.  

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On 5/12/2019 at 5:08 PM, HunterHunted said:

Nope. It has never happened as Amenadiel cheerfully noted. It's never happened in all of human or angel history.

No, in Genisis, "the sons of God bedded the daughters of Men" and brought forth a race of heroic giants.

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9 hours ago, Notwisconsin said:

No, in Genesis, "the sons of God bedded the daughters of Men" and brought forth a race of heroic giants.

Sure it did.  In our world in our Bible.  But Lucifer doesn't take place in our world (except on TV), so perhaps their Bible is different from ours.  Or perhaps those "sons of God" refer to beings other than true Angels.  Or, again, perhaps the Nephilim are different from Linda's baby in that they aren't truly "celestials" and hers is/will be.  Could be a lot of things.

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On 5/16/2019 at 6:40 PM, Emma9 said:

Chloe trying to keep Lucifer from drinking anything really highlights how pointless it was to enlist her in the first place. Lucifer owns a club constantly packed with anonymous people where he swans about drinking on a regular basis, and if they've researched him they'd know that, but Chloe is the only person they've ever thought to have drug him?

While I'm probably in the minority in that I like what are generally considered filler, case-of-the-week episodes, I agree that the Awkward Dance Of Secret Betrayal would have been dragged out much longer if the season had more episodes to work with, so it was a relief to be spared that.

This. Similar to the scene in the flashback last episode, with the priest saying that Lucifer would constantly try different personas and mannerisms to win her trust; that was actually a clever argument to make considering Lucifer's longstanding habit of 'I know, I'm going to act in THIS random manner this week!'.

Chloe is the one who makes him vulnerable - he can be killed when she's close to him. 

I don't like the evil Catholic priest angle. I'm not religious, it isn't that - it's that I don't like one big villain, that often.

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