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S02.E10: All Alone

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2 hours ago, millennium said:

The greatest takeaway from this episode was finally learning how the Weissmans can afford that amazing apartment: they can't.   It's owned by Columbia.

I really want to know why ASP didn't reveal prior to this last episode of season 2 that Midge's family's palatial digs were tied to Abe's job at the university. Like, did ASP

  • plan the housing status reveal for the end of this season—maybe to emphasize what Midge and Abe were willing to sacrifice?
  • or was the reveal a reaction to audience posts on social media about the size of the apartment—maybe she had assumed we'd know how tenured professors afford such housing, but then noticed our lack of that knowledge was a distraction from the story?
Edited by shapeshifter
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4 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

I really want to know why ASP didn't reveal prior to this last episode of season 2 that Midge's family's palatial digs were tied to Abe's job at the university. Like, did ASP

  • plan the housing status reveal for the end of this season—maybe to emphasize what Midge and Abe were willing to sacrifice?
  • or was the reveal a reaction to audience posts on social media about the size of the apartment—maybe she had assumed we'd know how tenured professors afford such housing, but then noticed our lack of that knowledge was a distraction from the story?

 

I was wondering if she thought it was assumed? Because when they said it in this episode, my reaction was "of course, that makes sense...why didn't I think of that before..." and it all fell into place. Universities own all sorts of real estate, and it makes total sense that'd be a perk of the job. Universities do what they can to attract top professors and make their quality of life appealing. I didn't give it as much thought as others here, because I have no concept of 1950s NY real estate prices. But it certainly explains where the extra money for Zelda comes from.

 

Of course, holding onto that reveal makes that moment more dramatic... And his decision totally irrational. He needs to take that sabbatical, get over his issue with receiving money he's not "earning" (not true anyway, his earlier years of service are what earned him the sabbatical), and then use that time to figure out a workable alternative, or get over his midlife crisis and get back to work. I actually refused to believe he actually gave up his tenured position and I'm assuming he's still at least putting pieces into place.

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13 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

I really want to know why ASP didn't reveal prior to this last episode of season 2 that Midge's family's palatial digs were tied to Abe's job at the university. Like, did ASP

  • plan the housing status reveal for the end of this season—maybe to emphasize what Midge and Abe were willing to sacrifice?
  • or was the reveal a reaction to audience posts on social media about the size of the apartment—maybe she had assumed we'd know how tenured professors afford such housing, but then noticed our lack of that knowledge was a distraction from the story?

Having created the illusion of a perfect 1950s family, it seems the show is now determined to knock it down.    Abe, Rose and Midge have all re-evaluated their lives and pondered decisions that could potentially shatter the lifestyle they have enjoyed thus far.   Perhaps the reveal of the apartment is another way of demonstrating that much of what we have seen to this point is a facade.

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On 12/7/2018 at 10:12 PM, hincandenza said:

The Declan Howell meetup (and his close-to-the-bone monologue about putting everything into that painting and having nothing left), Lenny Bruce talking/singing about being alone and regretting the isolation, her realization at the reception for her Catholic friend that she's losing the ability to modulate her "club" voice when around family and friends, her instant agreement to a 6-month tour and later realization that it was both totally irresponsible and something she'd agree to again in a heartbeat, and her "cheating" on Benjamin with her still-husband Joel in a desperate attempt to feel something before her new life of being the lonely comic is about to start.  

I don't think she'll be with Benjamin in season 3, for that reason.  Midge can't return to being just another happy society housewife he or anyone is expecting as we enter the 1960s, even if he is modern enough to also prefer a "weird" wife to the bland Stepford divas hanging off the likes of Joel.  After all, just after he went through a gauntlet to get her father to okay a marriage, she... turns around and leaves the country for 6 months?!?  The men she was raised to attract, and the home life she was trained from girlhood to be perfect at, are simply not compatible with who she is becoming.

One of the most poignant realizations I had while watching this was that Midge couldn’t marry Benjamin, that if she does she will perforce have to be a wife and that doing this will mean the end of her career as a comic. I don’t think Benjamin is willing to really go without a traditional wife in the way he would have to for Midge to pursue not only her career but her own growth and actualization. I felt that the marriage would destroy Midge, that pieces of her soul would be sacrificed even though she would have love and social status and acceptance in return she would lose essential portions of her true self. This horrific choice is forced on all talented women and I saw this so clearly as effervescent Midge went flying out the door after her call with Shay. Midges choice is between her heart and her soul and either way she and the people around her lose. Does it really have to be this way? 

Despite the loneliness alluded to by Bruce and Howell, I don’t think they’re alluding to the same thing. The expectations for men are different. Male artists are often infamous for their egotism, arrogance and I’ll treatment of the people around them (Picasso and Hemingway are easy examples) but this usually adds to their mythic status even if they’re judged an ass, it is all due to their genius, whereas women don’t get the same credit for the genius, but do get the opprobrium of committing a serious emotional and social crime. 

As for the Weissman’s apartment, it made some sense that the university owned it. I’d been thinking for a while that the Weissman’s seemed too wealthy for a professor. I just thought family money was bridging the gap. Good apartments in Manhattan have always been expensive. I’ve heard of universities providing a house for the President of the university but never heard of it for faculty even chairs that are endowed. I hope Abe takes the sabbatical to think too. 

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33 minutes ago, AuntieMame said:

One of the most poignant realizations I had while watching this was that Midge couldn’t marry Benjamin, that if she does she will perforce have to be a wife and that doing this will mean the end of her career as a comic. I don’t think Benjamin is willing to really go without a traditional wife in the way he would have to for Midge to pursue not only her career but her own growth and actualization. I felt that the marriage would destroy Midge, that pieces of her soul would be sacrificed even though she would have love and social status and acceptance in return she would lose essential portions of her true self. This horrific choice is forced on all talented women and I saw this so clearly as effervescent Midge went flying out the door after her call with Shay. Midges choice is between her heart and her soul and either way she and the people around her lose. Does it really have to be this way? 

Despite the loneliness alluded to by Bruce and Howell, I don’t think they’re alluding to the same thing. The expectations for men are different. Male artists are often infamous for their egotism, arrogance and I’ll treatment of the people around them (Picasso and Hemingway are easy examples) but this usually adds to their mythic status even if they’re judged an ass, it is all due to their genius, whereas women don’t get the same credit for the genius, but do get the opprobrium of committing a serious emotional and social crime. 

As for the Weissman’s apartment, it made some sense that the university owned it. I’d been thinking for a while that the Weissman’s seemed too wealthy for a professor. I just thought family money was bridging the gap. Good apartments in Manhattan have always been expensive. I’ve heard of universities providing a house for the President of the university but never heard of it for faculty even chairs that are endowed. I hope Abe takes the sabbatical to think too. 

Nice post!

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7 hours ago, AuntieMame said:

Dont get me wrong, Midge isn’t an engaged parent at this time, neither is Joel but the lion’s share of the blame and the responsibility will still go to Midge. Think about Joel accepting the same six month gig in an alternate reality. Even though I understand why my initial emotional reaction to that scenario is different. 

If Joel had the same opportunity and took it, the kids would have Zelda as a parent, because the show has recently shown the kids with Joel more than with Midge, and he actually interacts with the little boy.  The price to be paid for all the self-actualization falls heavily on the children who will grow up unmoored.  It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing, and babies don't have to be left in hot cars but it makes for more *humor* --Midge is a dynamo who goes after what she wants with gusto, and oh yeah, there's a kid in the back seat.  To me they're not showing any angst on Midge's part, it's just played for a cheap laugh. 

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4 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:

If Joel had the same opportunity and took it, the kids would have Zelda as a parent, because the show has recently shown the kids with Joel more than with Midge, and he actually interacts with the little boy.  The price to be paid for all the self-actualization falls heavily on the children who will grow up unmoored.  It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing, and babies don't have to be left in hot cars but it makes for more *humor* --Midge is a dynamo who goes after what she wants with gusto, and oh yeah, there's a kid in the back seat.  To me they're not showing any angst on Midge's part, it's just played for a cheap laugh. 

I also think that it was shown from the first episode that Joel is not prioritizing his children (leaving them to be with his secretary), while Midge's neglect is never really acknowledged.

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Oh, hearing Lenny do his bit about ending up alone is just so painfully sad, knowing how things turn out for him. Or the bit where Midge is telling him how "everything will be alright" despite being banned from several major cities, it all hurts so much in hindsight. I do love ending on Lenny Bruce doing one of his real life bits, and I always love the friendship that he and Midge share. Despite being so different in background and personality, they're also sort of kindred spirits. 

Susie leaving Sophie Lennon's big fancy fur coat because she "already wore it twice" might be my favorite sight gaga of the season.

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Joel has done wrong for sure, but overall I still like him, and I think the actor is adorable.   I think he and Midge should keep that divorce on ice for a while.  Next season should be a major advancement to the story, if the Europeon tour actually happens.  I like the show, I like the actors, and I love the clothing.

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Question: Anyone else wondering whether Susie has taken on Sophie as a client IN ADDITION to Midge, or possibly INSTEAD of her?

I wonder because we don't see the terms agreed to, Susie seems extremely agitated about telling Midge even before she knows about the tour, they've had friction, and I get feeling that pulling something like that is something Sophie would do.

Glad to get an answer on how they afforded that apartment! Good luck packing up and downsizing lol.

FInally, ecstatic to get another shot of La Bonbonniere (here, The City Spoon), my favorite NYC diner and inspiration for one of my all time favorite CDs, Live at La Bonbonniere by Mike Viola and the Candy Butchers. 

I cant wait for S3.

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I always assumed it was Columbia housing, but I'm from the neighborhood and attended Barnard and I know all about their housing. My friend's 96 year old mother still lives in one of those apartments, which the university is probably waiting eagerly to reacquire. I have felt the show did a poor job by misleading viewers into thinking the family owned it and was rich. I meant to post about this even last year but didn't get around to it. 

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I will keep watching this show even though parts make no sense. I could not fathom the need to have Abe ratify the marriage choice and the intrusive way it was dragged out.  This is not a tradition I have ever heard of in my family or other similar Jewish families.  I like the way they juxtaposed the flashback of Midge's hesitant acceptance of Joel's proposal with her enthusiastic immediate acceptance of Shy Baldwin's tour invitation.

 

As others have noted Midge's comedy comes off as smile-at-it funny, but not like real comedy routines. I had the good fortune to see Joan Rivers perform live about 10 years ago, and it was screamingly funny. Watching live comedy does make you laugh more than seeing it on TV. But seeing Rivers on TV is funnier than Midge's routines. 

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I will keep watching this show even though parts make no sense. I could not fathom the need to have Abe ratify the marriage choice and the intrusive way it was dragged out.  This is not a tradition I have ever heard of in my family or other similar Jewish families.

In my Jewish family, my father did speak to my grandparents before proposing.  However, the situation was one where the answer was already known beforehand.  I did roll my eyes at Abe dragging the entire thing out.  It was annoying and looks just a little ridiculous given how quickly Midge seemed to decide she needed to drop Benjamin.    

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1 hour ago, GussieK said:

Watching live comedy does make you laugh more than seeing it on TV. But seeing Rivers on TV is funnier than Midge's routines. 

Since Midge's season two routines seem funnier to me than last season's, I'm hoping to eventually be wowed by her mature performance—although I expect there will still be a heartbreaking clunker in her future too. 

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2 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

In my Jewish family, my father did speak to my grandparents before proposing.  However, the situation was one where the answer was already known beforehand.  I did roll my eyes at Abe dragging the entire thing out.  It was annoying and looks just a little ridiculous given how quickly Midge seemed to decide she needed to drop Benjamin.    

Yeah I think that's the key. The outcome is usually known beforehand. Too much fake drama here. 

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No one mention of the Imogene’s baby in a drawer. I’ve never seen that before. I was born in 64 and we didn’t have a drawer. So cool.  And they way they were opening and closing it was hysterical. So fast and hard. 

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On 12/10/2018 at 4:48 PM, bybrandy said:

Midge doesn' know it but given that her father has given up the job that provides his apartment (or is at least considering it) Midge may actually need to go on the road for 6 months.  The makeup counter isn't going to keep them.  And she doesn't know about Joel's 60G.  And given Joel's history I'm not sure she could count on him keeping it.   Although his club idea might be a way to more fully integrate him in season 3 and beyond but I am SO not wishing for more Joel.

I like the idea of a club. I can see Joel putting Midge as the headliner - that way they can have a professional relationship, and hopefully a friendly one.

On 12/10/2018 at 8:09 PM, shapeshifter said:

I didn't laugh so much as WTF? because I am not much taller than Susie. But then I quickly fanwanked that the coat was really a jacket with 3/4 length sleeves on Sophie.

I'm shorter than Susie (I looked it up, LOL), and that's the fanwank I did as well.

On 12/12/2018 at 5:47 AM, shapeshifter said:

And sometimes we kids felt like we were being raised by wolves.

I was raised in the military (little father involvement there except for sporadic discipline), and I've always described my rootless upbringing as being raised by wolves. No idea of societal norms outside of the rigid military standards.

On 12/14/2018 at 6:57 PM, whiporee said:

I liked Joel this entire season. I liked his club speech, too.  I didn’t like how quickly Rose became the same person again even though Abe was making efforts, and unless they are going to set Abe up as being a converted radical, not a lot f his storyline made sense.

This so much. I was so hopeful when they changed up Rose and Abe's relationship, but especially in this episode I was disappointed by Rose being pretty much the same woman as in the first episode of season 1.

On 12/16/2018 at 3:39 PM, Bec said:

I have to admit Joel arranging to have a song from Midge's favorite musical play so they can dance to it when he proposed was pretty romantic. The lead up to it, not so much, though. What with the reason for the proposal being he wanted to have sex, and the way he put pressure on her to say yes right away.

If I had someplace to be, and there's some moron stopping traffic so he can dance in the middle of the road, I would not be amused. But it's fun in a fictional scene like this. Very theatrical.

Even in the fictional scene, I couldn't help but be annoyed with the blocking of the traffic. Make it Central Park or Rockefeller Center (I'm no New Yorker, and have never been there - so these locations may not have been at all valid for 1959) - any place but in the middle of the street.

On 12/18/2018 at 1:57 AM, millennium said:

Ugh.  Joel. 

The greatest takeaway from this episode was finally learning how the Weissmans can afford that amazing apartment: they can't.   It's owned by Columbia.

See you all next year.

I said "that explains it!" and the husband looked at me confused. I had to explain how the apartment had been discussed thoroughly on the forum.

 

On 12/23/2018 at 7:30 AM, GussieK said:

As others have noted Midge's comedy comes off as smile-at-it funny, but not like real comedy routines. I had the good fortune to see Joan Rivers perform live about 10 years ago, and it was screamingly funny. Watching live comedy does make you laugh more than seeing it on TV. But seeing Rivers on TV is funnier than Midge's routines. 

Stand up comedy is often hard to replicate on a tv show - there've been a number of shows that have tried and failed (when not written by comedians themselves). But I personally think the stand-up's been pretty good here.

On 12/24/2018 at 7:44 AM, TV Diva Queen said:

No one mention of the Imogene’s baby in a drawer. I’ve never seen that before. I was born in 64 and we didn’t have a drawer. So cool.  And they way they were opening and closing it was hysterical. So fast and hard. 

God that was hysterical. Did those actually exist?

I knew Lenny Bruce survived until at least 1964, because the one routine I remember had to do with Kennedy's assassination (which I probably saw in the Dustin Hoffman movie, and '64 because I assume he didn't do it within weeks of the assassination). We watched some YouTube clips of his routines last season, and he wasn't particularly funny there - mostly because he was constrained by the standards of the day, I would think.

Midge's kids already have a solid multi-generational support system, and I'm not sure I see Midge being gone as any big change for them, given what we've seen in regards to the way they've been parented.

Of course, I'm coming at this from the perspective as the child of a career soldier, who never had any kind of an anchor in life outside of our small nuclear family. So their situation seems kind of great to me, doted over by grandparents, physical needs taken care of by the maid.

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On 12/24/2018 at 7:44 AM, TV Diva Queen said:

No one mention of the Imogene’s baby in a drawer. I’ve never seen that before. I was born in 64 and we didn’t have a drawer. So cool.  And they way they were opening and closing it was hysterical. So fast and hard. 

I thought that was a brilliant setup! I was wondering if that's common anywhere or if it used to be. 

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4 hours ago, Gulftastic said:

God, I hope Midge isn't *ahem*pregnant*ahem* at the start of the next season. TV women are notoriously fertile during one night stands.

I think ASP could do some interesting stuff with it if they go there—both humor and exploration of societal norms of the times.

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On 12/27/2018 at 4:35 PM, txhorns79 said:

At least according to this informational film, it really was a thing. 

OMGosh..I had forgotten the poor (all female) nurses had to wear those ridiculous caps. And yep, the expectant fathers out in the waiting room smoking cigarette after cigarrete. So bizarre that we thought that was all normal back then.

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On 12/10/2018 at 1:08 PM, shron17 said:

I actually agree with both sides of this, and hate the way the children are treated, especially when they're so young.  And I get why Midge is leaving for 6 months but it's kind of like when parents get divorced and one of them moves far away.  Sure, an adult has a right to do what's best for them, but I also think all kids have the right to parents who at least attempt to do what's best for their children.  Childhood really doesn't last that long and being treated like you don't matter that much can have a huge affect on adult life.  That said, since it's TV I'm willing to let things happen in the way that's best for the show.

Midge left Baby Esther in the car when they arrived in the Catskills and didn’t remember she was there until “Jimmy” found the baby and asked if he should get her along with the rest of their luggage. I’m thinking Ethan and Esther will be just fine without Midge’s distracted, self-absorbed parenting style as long as Hilda gets to stick around. Or as long as the show doesn’t need it suddenly as a storyline, as if the kids haven’t been treated like furniture for 2 seasons...

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I need more!! I tried to watch this season slowly, but that didn't happen. 

Everytime I hear Zachary Levi, I think of Flynn Ryder. I love Flynn Ryder, as far as cartoon characters go. 

The baby drawer was hilarious and awesome! 

If Abe wants to get rid of the apartment, I'll take it. I love where they live. 

Not happy Midge went to Joel and not Benjamin.

The Lenny Bruce actor is so handsome! He does a great job, and I like the friendship between lenny and Midge. 

Do we really have to wait a whole year for more?!

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she never gave that boyfriend a chance.

She never gave that boyfriend a thought. He never entered her mind. That's what pulled her up short when her father mentioned him. That's when she learned what she needed to know: when it comes to her career, nothing else matters. Everyone else is an instrument, or an encumbrance. 

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On 12/27/2018 at 12:04 PM, Gulftastic said:

God, I hope Midge isn't *ahem*pregnant*ahem* at the start of the next season. TV women are notoriously fertile during one night stands.

Well we did get lots of talk of the horror of 3 children and Imogene and Midge always having babies together.  Also, we had the horror of the audience (the men) at Midge discussing pregnancy in her act. Can you imagine a pregnant comedienne?

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They reminded us more than once that Yom Kippur was the anniversary of Joel's leaving and Miriam's first stand-up act. 
So, in a year's time, Joel moved in and out  of an apartment with his secretary ... Joel and Miriam almost got back together .. They started seeing other people, with the blessing of their parents .. And Miriam got involved, and basically engaged, to a new man.  That seems fast.

As much as I enjoy Mrs. Masail, this season seemed more like a broad type of Vaudeville comedy at times - especially when the Weissmans and the Maisels were together.  It also seemed to go very light on social issues of the time, or using them for comedy instead highlighting them for drama. 

Miriam, Susie and Abe now appear to be the stars of the show, since each seem to get their own, mostly separate stories. And those are the actors who won awards (and it is easier to be MVP if you get to be in the game more).
The Paris trip and Abe's midlife identity crisis really did not seem to have much to do with Miriam ... and  I like Tony Shalhoub (who has been winning a lot of things lately) ... but I would like to see other characters getting more story time next season. 

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Baltimore Betty writes,

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". . . instead of going to her boyfriend and having an honest conversation about her career goals and the 6 month tour she runs to her soon to be ex...she never gave that boyfriend a chance.  I got the impression that Dr. BF would have been supportive of her choice. "

 Midge and Joel's  shared history and children have created a space where she feels safe to be vulnerable and even needy. When Midge is with Dr. BF, she is always "on", constantly performing. He likes her ceaseless stream of irreverence and sarcasm; Midge and her mother like his wealth and medical degree. Have we seen any conversations between them that indicated emotional intimacy from transparent self-disclosure?

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Why is Abe in need of a lawyer?  Is he suing Bell Labs? Columbia? Getting a divorce?  Plenty of cliff hangers to end the season.

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Why is Abe in need of a lawyer?

I thought he was looking to return to his activist roots, so he was planning ahead for future arrests.  I think it's all very stupid.  On the positive side, I will never not love that you get a slightly used mink coat just for visiting Sophie's house.    

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2 hours ago, txhorns79 said:
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Why is Abe in need of a lawyer?

I thought he was looking to return to his activist roots, so he was planning ahead for future arrests. 

Hopefully we (and Rose) have dodged the bullet of Abe joining a bunch a bunch of acid-dropping free-love hippies a few years in TMMM's future.

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On 1/1/2019 at 4:00 PM, camom said:

Why is Abe in need of a lawyer?  Is he suing Bell Labs? Columbia? Getting a divorce?  Plenty of cliff hangers to end the season.

As I understood it, Abe is fighting for the intellectual property rights to the project he was working on.  Bell Labs says it belongs to Bell Labs as stipulated by his contract.

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10 hours ago, grawlix said:

As I understood it, Abe is fighting for the intellectual property rights to the project he was working on.  Bell Labs says it belongs to Bell Labs as stipulated by his contract.

If he wins the patent rights to some audio technology, no worries about affording a great apartment, and Rose's nice wardrobe. 

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8 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:
18 hours ago, grawlix said:

As I understood it, Abe is fighting for the intellectual property rights to the project he was working on.  Bell Labs says it belongs to Bell Labs as stipulated by his contract.

If he wins the patent rights to some audio technology, no worries about affording a great apartment, and Rose's nice wardrobe. 

Wow, I totally missed this.

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13 hours ago, shapeshifter said:
21 hours ago, ShadowFacts said:
On 1/2/2019 at 10:42 PM, grawlix said:

As I understood it, Abe is fighting for the intellectual property rights to the project he was working on.  Bell Labs says it belongs to Bell Labs as stipulated by his contract.

If he wins the patent rights to some audio technology, no worries about affording a great apartment, and Rose's nice wardrobe. 

Wow, I totally missed this.

It could be that with the patent he will get a lot of money (though winning the rights is unlikely, if he signed them away). On the other hand, my ex had patent rights in an emerging tech, and basically everyone just figured out a way around his design, so they didn't have to use his patent. So he got bupkus.

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1 hour ago, Clanstarling said:

It could be that with the patent he will get a lot of money (though winning the rights is unlikely, if he signed them away). On the other hand, my ex had patent rights in an emerging tech, and basically everyone just figured out a way around his design, so they didn't have to use his patent. So he got bupkus.

I don't know the status of the relevant law then (or now) but there are settlements, avoidance of bad publicity, etc. so he could come away with something. 

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1 hour ago, ShadowFacts said:

I don't know the status of the relevant law then (or now) but there are settlements, avoidance of bad publicity, etc. so he could come away with something. 

Seems like the bad publicity could go both ways - given that Bell's thinking he's a security risk (which he sort of is). Of course, his daughter-in-law is too...LOL.

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One of the most poignant realizations I had while watching this was that Midge couldn’t marry Benjamin, that if she does she will perforce have to be a wife and that doing this will mean the end of her career as a comic.

As soon as she said "yes" to opening for Shy Baldwin I spent the next several scenes wondering "what about Benjamin?" It got to the point where I just assumed she still planned to marry him and they would just work it out somehow. But as soon as Abe told her he had made a decision about him, and you saw Midge just freeze with her back to the camera, it was clear she had forgotten all about Benjamin. Didn't even stop to think about him. So the whole time Abe is talking and she's sitting there frozen, then finally gets up and faces him, without saying a word, Abe realized she was not going to marry him after all. That was such a good scene - I agree it was probably the most poignant of the season. 

So, I'm guessing no Benjamin next season.

I really want to know what's going to happen with Sophie and Susie. I have a hard time believing Susie could manage Sophie's career even if she wanted to. I think this season has demonstrated that Susie is really over her head just managing a newcomer like Midge. 

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On 12/14/2018 at 7:21 PM, Kromm said:

My sole concern for the future is that Midge not get hooked on drugs or become an alcoholic.  It would be a natural next step for anything dealing with comics,

I wouldn't mind the series ending much like Mr. Saturday Night did - that would also be a natural next step.

When you're hot you're too busy to realize it, you choose the audience over your family, and sometimes once the audience has left, the family isn't there anymore, either.

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On 12/27/2018 at 5:35 PM, txhorns79 said:

At least according to this informational film, it really was a thing. 

The baby drawer thing freaked me out! I know they had it when my mom had me - she told me about it. But the way they were slamming the drawer back and forth I got the shivers.

The moms were in bed turned away from the nursery window. I got flashes of a nurse reaching in for an infant only to have the door yanked shut on the baby's head or the nurse's hands ... 

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On 12/10/2018 at 7:38 AM, ChlcGirl said:

Truthfully I have problems with both.  I understand wanting as much as possible out of life and careers .. just dont have children until you're done figuring shit out.

I dont think we'll ever see eye to eye on this so let's go back to discussing how fun the show is and how much we love it :)

While I agree that figuring things out before making important, lifelong decision is wise, you have to remember that this is in the 1950s/1960s.  People all followed a similar pattern of getting married and having kids in their early to mid-20s and then maybe began thinking about life.  It is only in the past 20 or so years that women (and men) realized that they didn't have to do that and could delay marriage and kids until they actually wanted to.  Thus, the storyline is consistent with the times.

I was disappointed that Midge didn't point out to Joel during the argument that she was open to getting back together but he said he couldn't handle her being a working comedian.  He ended the marriage twice, first after cheating on her and then this second time.

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I love the idea of Joel running a club, that would be great for both him and Midge, but those poor kids will never see their parents though I guess they should be used to it.

Edited by Armchair Critic

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On 1/3/2019 at 7:57 PM, shapeshifter said:
On 1/3/2019 at 11:44 AM, ShadowFacts said:
On 1/3/2019 at 1:42 AM, grawlix said:

As I understood it, Abe is fighting for the intellectual property rights to the project he was working on.  Bell Labs says it belongs to Bell Labs as stipulated by his contract.

If he wins the patent rights to some audio technology, no worries about affording a great apartment, and Rose's nice wardrobe. 

ow, I totally missed this.

Thank you, I missed that too and came here to ask about it.

Edited by Armchair Critic

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I love the fact that they used the bar “Dublin House” where Midge and Lenny Bruce accidentally meet up. It’s on 79th Street between Broadway and Amsterdam and the exterior has looked the same for at least the last forty years. When I was a teen, thirty years ago, it was a place that didn’t “card” teens who looked even remotely near the drinking age. At least, um, that’s what I heard from friends...

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8 hours ago, NYCFree said:

I love the fact that they used the bar “Dublin House” where Midge and Lenny Bruce accidentally meet up. It’s on 79th Street between Broadway and Amsterdam and the exterior has looked the same for at least the last forty years. When I was a teen, thirty years ago, it was a place that didn’t “card” teens who looked even remotely near the drinking age. At least, um, that’s what I heard from friends...

Heh. I'm pretty sure the statute of limitations has run out on that one.

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On 12/11/2018 at 10:48 AM, cali1981 said:

Does anyone think that Shay is, in significant part, modeled after Johnny Mathis?  He was a superstar just around the time that season 2 takes place.

Yes. Could be interesting.  

I understand her going to Joel for comfort sex.  She loves Joel.  Benjamin is a sop to her mother.  

I think that an artist has to be an artist.  Midge is an attention getter no matter where she goes.  If she can hone into a career, she will.  She has the need, which is what you have to have.  

The children of the wealthy have long been raised by others than the parents.  Midge was hardly hands-on when she was at home.  To my mind, children benefit from a cadre of loving adults.  

Whether her parents remain available will no doubt be an issue when she leaves.  We will see.

For me, the joy of the show is how erudite everyone is.  The list of great roles... and Alex saying “Richard III?” and the great fifties music.

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