S01.E09: Dead Reckoning

[meira.hand]

11 hours ago, CCTC said:

I can see why Grace is upset, and technically she is not a bad actress, but the character just does not exude any empathy to anyone else, and her hurt seems to  come of as more of a woe is me rather than a sympathetic vulnerability. 

I think she IS a bad actress, unable to convey the real emotions that her words imply. Even the way she constantly plays with her hair, which is more suited to a flirtatious scene than a painful one and suggest self absorption on the part of the actress rather than the character. Yes, she is made to be a little unsympathetic probably because want to break off the relationship but it could have played in a heart wrenching way, like the situation between Lourdes and Jared. Even Danny and Ben managed to play the emotions right. The reason she triggers such vitriol here (and I am feeling it too) is not the writing, its her acting.

[snarkylady]

Why did Grace need a tombstone?  I could see a monument or memorial plaque for someone who died in a mysterious way but to me tombstone implies a dead body and in this case she didn't have one.  Meanwhile how much did the tombstone she purchased for Ben cost?

[sempervivum]

2 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I know that this pretty much guarantees a lump of coal in my stocking or reindeer shit on my roof, but that little kid that plays Cal can't act.

Plus he's not even cute. Whoever cast him needs their head examined. The only characters I actually look forward to seeing on this show are Vance (RIP?) and Olive.

[J0nas3]

2 hours ago, stealinghome said:

I actually DO want Jared to have been saved by the callings, because I think it’s a more interesting story if the passengers can bargain with them or even find a way to communicate with them.

One of my first thoughts was, ‘what if he was saved by the callings, but the price for that was Vance?’

[YaddaYadda]

I don't think I've ever come across a show where a character seems as universally hated as Grace is. It's totally fine with me. There's nothing wrong with her feelings for Ben changing. He was gone almost 6 years, presumed dead and at some point, she moved on from the life she had with him. What's not okay is the way she jerks him around. She is incredibly dishonest with her feelings and the things she wants. Grace needs to be put in a time out for the rest of her life. So, really, run Ben and run fast and far from her.

Fiona is sketchy AF. She seems to have been immune to the experiment for one, then she's taking these people who have been tortured somewhere safe. She picks up whatever research has been left behind. From her lecture, she clearly has not given up on her unethical research that Saanvi called her on. 

Vance is not dead. The way he stood there while near everyone was doubled over in pain in the boiler room, like he was having some weird dream and going to wake up type reaction was fun. You plopped him into crazy, don't take him out of crazy. Not now!

I really hate Cal. Why did they choose a weak actor and a child to carry this role is ridiculous. Also, the whole needing to suspend belief that the transport system in New York is great and will get you from Queens to Brooklyn within 10 minutes flat is such an eye roll inducing moment. Right. A bus. 

[basiltherat]

I'm sure it won't be long until Daniel is back in Grace's life, and I don't think Olive will like it this time.  She was eavesdropping on Mom's ouster of Dad and I don't think she's the type to do nothing about it!

I also must marvel at the way Childe Cal made it to the site WHICH HE KNEW NOTHING ABOUT, GRACE almost before the cavalry.

RIP (I hope temporarily) for "Bobby" Vance.

[CCTC]

18 minutes ago, basiltherat said:

She was eavesdropping on Mom's ouster of Dad and I don't think she's the type to do nothing about it!

 

There was one episode Olive bugged me, but I have generally liked her.  I think she comes across as a real teen and is likable.  I think she generally cares for both her Dad and Danny, but when you see her upset, it is because she is worried about hurting one of the men, not because she is feeling sorry for herself unlike her mother.  She also has some decent chemistry with Ben and Cal which helps you believe she cares about them and wants to connect with them, again unlike her Mother.

I am not a huge fan of TV wonderkids in general, but Cal actually does not bug me that much.

[rubyred]

I have never seen the actress playing Grace before, so I have nothing to compare it to, but IMO it's such a clear case of someone being cast for their pretty, pretty hair. The writing sucks, but a better actress would be able to neutralize it. I wonder if the writers realize how unsympathetic Grace comes across, that it seems obvious that she's been looking for an out so she can hook up with hot, hot Danny again. I don't think they do. And what a thankless role, and waste, of Daniel Sunjata.

Generally I'm sympathetic to Ben, but I am not sympathetic to characters who insist on putting themselves in the line of fire, endangering themselves and others, for reasons.

The first thing that popped into my head when Ben hallucinated the peacock was "uh oh, polar bear!"

Why did they introduce a piece of Autumn's backstory (the "arrests") and then drop it?! I was intrigued, like was her identity stolen or something? Yeah, I'm more interested in a rando passenger day-player than the leads of the show. Uh oh.

Maybe it will be Olive who calls Grace on her shit.

[Boofish]

12 hours ago, Elih143 said:

Oh you're just sympathizing with her because she's black and female. So racist and sexist of you. ;-) Whereas on the flipside my sympathies for Ben's position has nothing to do with him being white and male. :-)

I know you're being cheeky but GRACE IS BLACK?! In my Elaine Benes voice "should we be talking about this"

Edited November 27, 2018 by Boofish

[meggonzo]

I might have missed some of the dialogue at the beginning of the show, but I missed that Ben got fired until the corporate guys showed up asking Grace questions.  Do they know Ben stole his boss' badge to get in the other building?

[stealinghome]

2 hours ago, J0nas3 said:

One of my first thoughts was, ‘what if he was saved by the callings, but the price for that was Vance?’

Yes! There is no way the callings give you something without exacting a price for it. That kind of cat and mouse I could so get into.

[green]

2 hours ago, YaddaYadda said:

I really hate Cal. Why did they choose a weak actor and a child to carry this role is ridiculous. Also, the whole needing to suspend belief that the transport system in New York is great and will get you from Queens to Brooklyn within 10 minutes flat is such an eye roll inducing moment. Right. A bus. 

And a bus that goes into some rundown, deserted factory buildings area too like it is some major bus route to service ... who?  And at evening rush hour as well.  Guess he really is The Golden Child.  And yeah the actor is really bad in that role.

Edited November 27, 2018 by green

[meep.meep]

12 hours ago, TwistedandBored said:

I didn't even know this was a mid-season finale until that "Manifest returns January 7th" promo. Whaaat!?!

 

It's the gift of time!

This show is so tiresome that we need a long break.  I truly don't know why I keep watching it.

[ottoDbusdriver]

4 hours ago, Camera One said:

So maybe what we need is more Grace centric episodes, LOL.

Next time, on a very special episode of Manifest, 
 

2 hours ago, rubyred said:

I have never seen the actress playing Grace before, so I have nothing to compare it to, but IMO it's such a clear case of someone being cast for their pretty, pretty hair. The writing sucks, but a better actress would be able to neutralize it. I wonder if the writers realize how unsympathetic Grace comes across, that it seems obvious that she's been looking for an out so she can hook up with hot, hot Danny again. I don't think they do. And what a thankless role, and waste, of Daniel Sunjata.

Then you must have missed Season 3 of 'Zoo', where she played the big bad of the season.  And she did not act well in that show either.

2 hours ago, rubyred said:

The first thing that popped into my head when Ben hallucinated the peacock was "uh oh, polar bear!"

Why did they introduce a piece of Autumn's backstory (the "arrests") and then drop it?! I was intrigued, like was her identity stolen or something? 

Can the smoke monster be far behind ?  Maybe someone somewhere turned a donkey wheel and that caused the plane to move through time and space.

I'm not sure why Autumn continued to co-operate after Belsen released her from the van.  What leverage did he still have on at that point ?

[ams1001]

12 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Ben had me rolling my eyes. You KNOW about the callings. You KNOW your son instinctively knew how to get to the subway tunnels. Yet when the same kid gives you specific instructions for where to find the other passengers and says that YOU need to go down to help them, you hesitate? Okay then.

 

Oh my god yes, I was so frustrated watching that scene! Dude, you should know better by now!

 

4 hours ago, meggonzo said:

I might have missed some of the dialogue at the beginning of the show, but I missed that Ben got fired until the corporate guys showed up asking Grace questions.  Do they know Ben stole his boss' badge to get in the other building?

If you missed it, so did I. I was thinking, "Did we know that? Wait, did Ben know that?"

[Orillia]

12 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 

I was totally cracking up at everyone forcing their way into joining the raid. Of course it's totally normal for NSA to take along a math guy, a neuroscience professor, and two random police officers when they're doing a super sekrit raid!

Not only that , but they allow them to go along without wearing helmets.

When Grace was listing the number of days , I really thought Ben was going to say something like "2000 days , that's how many days of my life are missing "

I also hope Vance is still alive . I started out thinking he was a total idiot , and now he's one of my favorites.

The best was the mole lady situation when she was being interviewed after returning , What .... she has an outstanding warrant ... better cart her off to jail .

[Clanstarling]

19 hours ago, Frost said:

Why did they trust the doctor to take off with all the patients?  Without telling anyone where she was taking them?  Just that she knew a 'safe place.'  And why on earth do they believe Vance is dead?  Because someone told them?  After all the official lies, why would they believe anything?

Yeah, I wondered about that myself. She just "happened" to have acquired a remote place she can take them to? And that they're "Oh, okey dokey, you do that. It's not like anyone else has absconded with these people before." I don't know if she's "bad", she's just a personality type that's off putting to me, so I respond to her with a large dose of suspicion.

19 hours ago, meggonzo said:

I don't trust Fiona taking all the missing passengers with her.  What were the papers she found and took with her?

Some of the notes and test results, I think - so she has a leg up on the non-theoretical research.
 

15 hours ago, GaT said:

At least we won't be spending any more time watching them trying to find the missing passengers.

Maybe, maybe not. On the other hand, there are still plenty of passengers to mine - I don't think we've seen every one of them yet.

12 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I accidentally saw a headline about the show before I watched this episode. It said something along the lines of "no everyone survives the Manifest mid-season finale." I am a spoilerphobe so normally my reaction would be "NOOOOOOO!!!!" but this time my reaction was to start making a list of who I hoped died. Suffice it to say, I was disappointed that all we really got was Vance's alleged offscreen death which I don't buy at all. No body = not dead

I know, right? When Michaela was knocked down - I was "yay! maybe Michaela (but then, she's a lead, so I knew she wouldn't be the one), and then Jared (only because of the flipping triangle, I liked him well enough.) So Vance - but probably not because as you said, no body = not dead.

Maybe a parallel would be - no images of experimented upon passengers being safe = no safety for them.

[Camera One]

It was almost funny when Grace turned the emotional argument into a Guess The Number! game.  I know Ben is a mathematician but still... did she have the numbers prepared beforehand or something? 

I was looking at Grace's argument and it jumped around like crazy.

The procession of numbers interrupted and derailed Ben's explanation that everything he did was to protect Cal.  And then after the numbers, Grace went "So please don't ever tell me that I don't understand" except Ben was referring to Grace not understanding the callings because she wasn't on the plane.  She changed what he was actually referring to.

Her argument became "You don't know what it's like to have your child die."  But what does that have to do with anything?  Except to get Ben to admit "You're right.  I am sorry."  I'm not sure that was what he needed to be sorry for.

Then, Ben asked, "But don't you want me to do whatever it takes to keep our son safe?" and Grace replied "Is that what you call what happened this afternoon?"  Actually, the answer would have been yes.  What Ben did actually saved Cal's life.  But Ben didn't say anything.

Immediately afterwards, Grace jumped to "I thought I could ignore the last five years of my life and start over right where we left off... You're not the same.  I don't know you."  Which was another point entirely but led to Ben volunteering to move out. 

Edited November 28, 2018 by Camera One

[spottedreptile]

10 hours ago, YaddaYadda said:

I don't think I've ever come across a show where a character seems as universally hated as Grace is

Lady Mary Crawley. Beloved by Julian Fellowes, detested by nearly all the Downton viewers. Grace however is just being made out a clownish stereotype to further plot points and justify behavioural rules in other characters. Lady Mary was a pet of the writer so everyone else had to be sacrificed so she could be the focus. 

[Dowel Jones]

9 hours ago, green said:

And a bus that goes into some rundown, deserted factory buildings area too like it is some major bus route to service ... who?

I think we're all misinterpreting what he said.  He literally took the bus.  It's still parked out at the intersection.

[Passepartout]

Think I was pretty hard as all of us were on Vance. Hate that he is gone now. But really think that knew Ben would lose his job. And Ben knew that I think as well. Grace really needs to cut him slack. Ben can be a jerk at times. But really Grace needs to show empathy over five years being lost and not knowing it.  

Glad that Jared is now going to get well. He and his so called wife as nice as she could be are not clicking the way he and Michaela does.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

18 hours ago, snarkylady said:

Why did Grace need a tombstone?  I could see a monument or memorial plaque for someone who died in a mysterious way but to me tombstone implies a dead body and in this case she didn't have one.  Meanwhile how much did the tombstone she purchased for Ben cost?

She got Ben's tombstone on sale at Target on November 1st when all the Halloween decorations were on clearance. She couldn't decide between the one that was foam painted grey or the flat one you can tape to the door.

[Suzysite]

16 hours ago, Boofish said:

I know you're being cheeky but GRACE IS BLACK?! In my Elaine Benes voice "should we be talking about this"

Grace isn't black.  I looked up the actress and she is Greek/Egyptian/Canadian.

Edited November 28, 2018 by Suzysite

[mertensia]

Grace acts as if Ben took Cal deliberately and ran for those 5 years, like they were in a bad Lifetime movie about mob hitmen. 

I hope Vance isn't dead.

[CCTC]

I was wondering about whether I missed Ben being fired in the previous episode.  I wonder if there will be follow-up with the people coming to look for him and why they wanted to see him, or if that was just a way to let us know he will be fired.  I will kind of miss his boss.  He could be entertaining in short intervals.  I wonder if he tore his Ben poster down from his bedroom wall when he got home.

I think the turning point for me for Grace was when she yelled at Ben for not telling her about Olive's shoplifting.  She did not even ask about the circumstances of why he did it or talk to Olive where she could have found out that it had been a bonding moment.  She was also completely insensitive to the fact that her husband just had seen his daughter bond with a father-figure who had taken his place.

[mertensia]

Grace thought - with good reason- that Ben and Cal were dead. But she hasn't missed any of Cal's life. Ben missed 5 years of Olive's. 

[Clanstarling]

11 hours ago, Camera One said:

It was almost funny when Grace turned the emotional argument into a Guess The Number! game.  I know Ben is a mathematician but still... did she have the numbers prepared beforehand or something? 

I was looking at Grace's argument and it jumped around like crazy.

The procession of numbers interrupted and derailed Ben's explanation that everything he did was to protect Cal.  And then after the numbers, Grace went "So please don't ever tell me that I don't understand" except Ben was referring to Grace not understanding the callings because she wasn't on the plane.  She changed what he was actually referring to.

Her argument became "You don't know what it's like to have your child die."  But what does that have to do with anything?  Except to get Ben to admit "You're right.  I am sorry."  I'm not sure that was what he needed to be sorry for.

Then, Ben asked, "But don't you want me to do whatever it takes to keep our son safe?" and Grace replied "Is that what you call what happened this afternoon?"  Actually, the answer would have been yes.  What Ben did actually saved Cal's life.  But Ben didn't say anything.

Immediately afterwards, Grace jumped to "I thought I could ignore the last five years of my life and start over right where we left off... You're not the same.  I don't know you."  Which was another point entirely but led to Ben volunteering to move out. 

 

Now that you lay it out like that - sounds very much like arguments I've been in (on the receiving end - but who knows, maybe I've pulled a Grace too, I'm not perfect).

I'm not crazy about Ben's "I'm going to storm the doors to protect my son armed with nothing but DAD POWER", but Grace's tirade bugged me. I don't even hate her - I'm just tired of her simply refusing to recognize that their lives are not in normal land anymore. And I feel like half of her outrage is that she planned this nice party and Ben went and ruined it by a) not being there so she was embarrassed, and b) by being fired so strange men showed up and she was even more embarrassed.

I was also truly annoyed that Lourdes wasn't there in the hospital when it looked like Michaela was there for hours. They gave a nod to "she's on her way" way too late, in my opinion, since she should have been the first person called - by the hospital if no one else.  Plus, I think it would have made a better dramatic scene - the two of them worrying over the same man.

Oh, and by the way, the boiler room was the only place Ben could go? How about his father's house? And another question - now that Ben's out of the house, is Grace going to kick Michaela out too?

Edited November 28, 2018 by Clanstarling

[CCTC]

11 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

I thought those dudes that showed up at the house were "big bads".  I was shocked that they weren't at the house when Ben came home, ready to take him somewhere.

How long before Cal gets kidnapped?  I am sure Grace will blame Ben, claiming that he kidnapped Cal. 

I thought the same thing about the men showing up.  And who knows, maybe they were the big bads -  the company is involved somehow.

I thought Cal going missing or being kidnapped would be the cliffhanger.  I am guessing he will at some point, but I was pleasantly surprised when he was not.  I am not a big fan of the kidnapped child and parents chewing scenery plot points.

[Boofish]

Grace had that argument locked and loaded since the day Ben reappeared. She was stern, precise, calm and presented facts. Locked and loaded Grace; locked and loaded. Just waiting for the right moment to fire.

[Clanstarling]

2 hours ago, Boofish said:

Grace had that argument locked and loaded since the day Ben reappeared. She was stern, precise, calm and presented facts. Locked and loaded Grace; locked and loaded. Just waiting for the right moment to fire.

Not sure I'd say calm, but I agree with everything else. She's never seemed all in, and I can't blame her for that. 

[Drummer Boy-Toy]

There’s no way they’re going to bump-off NSA-Director Al Roker halfway through the first season.

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

Grace's tirade bugged me. I don't even hate her - I'm just tired of her simply refusing to recognize that their lives are not in normal land anymore.

On a better show, this could work, but here, Grace's tirades are just tiresome.
Even though in real life Grace might be going off at a magnitude 10 every day, here, it's just annoying to viewers, especially when we see it from the same viewpoint every time.
If Breaking Bad caliber writers, actors, and directors were working together, we might see Grace's expression of her feelings about Ben and Cal gradually escalate to a tsunami of emotion, soon dissolving into tears of remorse--perhaps acknowledging that she has been partly blaming Ben because she couldn't deal with her own guilt for falling in love with someone else when she thought Ben was dead (plus all the Cal issues).

9 hours ago, mertensia said:

Grace acts as if Ben took Cal deliberately and ran for those 5 years

IIRC, in the Pilot, Grace didn't want Ben and Cal to take the later plane just to get free flights later--she didn't want to be separated. There's a stage of grief that is anger--seems like Grace got stuck in anger mode regarding Ben and her grief process.

[angrypuppy]

The overacting from the actress playing Michaela is driving me absolutely bonkers. I felt nothing but the strain in my eyes from rolling them too hard when she was pleading for Jared's life in the hospital room. Ugh.

[basiltherat]

. . . or is he???? . . .

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, angrypuppy said:

The overacting from the actress playing Michaela is driving me absolutely bonkers. I felt nothing but the strain in my eyes from rolling them too hard when she was pleading for Jared's life in the hospital room. Ugh.

I was cringing over the lines--and each week she has some weird magical belief dialog to utter.
I feel sorry for the actress having to deliver these lines.
She's probably stuck between "will this role permanently lower my status as an actor?" and "I need this job."

[Clanstarling]

26 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I was cringing over the lines--and each week she has some weird magical belief dialog to utter.
I feel sorry for the actress having to deliver these lines.
She's probably stuck between "will this role permanently lower my status as an actor?" and "I need this job."

I know, me too. Seems like a cop shouldn't be so quick to jump to belief. But then, I'm not one that believes a great deal in prayer, so maybe her belief works for some.

[KaveDweller]

10 hours ago, mertensia said:

Grace thought - with good reason- that Ben and Cal were dead. But she hasn't missed any of Cal's life. Ben missed 5 years of Olive's. 

That's a really good point. Grace got Cal back, but Ben can never get what he missed back with Olive.

[cameron]

Grace and her big mouthful of teeth.

[preeya]

10 minutes ago, cameron said:

Grace and her big mouthful of teeth.

I was eagerly waiting for someone to comment on what I've noted from episode 1.

[srpturtle80]

I guess I’m in the minority, but I’m really enjoying this show and found this episode really entertaining. I truly hope Vance isn’t dead, just when I was starting to like him. 

I feel like Fiona not be trustworthy either. What were the papers she took as they were fleeing the facility?

I too hate Grace and wish she’d go far far away. 

And somewhere along the line I’ve decided that Jared is smoking hot and I don’t want him to go anywhere. Especially when he’s all suited up and wearing his tactical gear. Yum. Glad he’s OK. 

[Camera One]

I hope Fiona isn't evil.  She did seem genuinely concerned about the other passengers.  I thought it was good that she grabbed the papers to see what they were doing in the secret lab.  The way they have dealt with the character is quizzical.  They didn't show enough of her character to justify her risking herself to plant the bug at the Singularity office.  Because of this, it is possible she has another agenda.  This is the type of show where I'm seriously not sure if certain decisions are deliberate or if it's just bad writing.  

Edited November 29, 2018 by Camera One

[terxav]

Okay maybe it is just me but after Grace rattled off her numbers I wanted Ben to ask :

 

How how many days did it take you to begin dating again?

How long have you been in love with Danny?  

But my big question is how long did it take for you to spend the entire life insurance payout?

You tried and hide your relationship with Danny then accuse me of being different.   Oh and this is my house also, so we can sleep in different bedrooms but I am not leaving.  And since the woman I love no longer loves me, then I am a free agent, we can alternate nights of staying home with the kids.  You can continue your relationship with Danny, I have a doctor I will be spending time with. Lol 

 

and 828, number of the flight thay Cal and I were on from Jamaica that took 5 years to complete it’s journey.

[fauntleroy]

As of this episode the only reason I still watch is to be able to keep up with the excellent commentary here.

One cheeseball dramatic technique in play here is dithering by the goods vs decisiveness by the bads. That is, the slowness of the uptake at action time eg Dad, look over there! Cal, how did you get here! Dad, over there! Michaela, bring Cal somewhere safe! Dad, over there! Cal, what do you mean over there - do you mean here? No dad, over there! Do you mean in my hat? Etc.

All movement must be preceded by squabbling about protecting one or more of the participants - you can't go it's too dangerous, I'm going! No you're not, yes I am! Oh all right but stay in the car! So we understand how committed they are, and to take up time that could be used to advance the actual plot. The characters necessary to a scene end up at the scene anyway so of course all that could all be dispensed with.

Or incredulity at the surprising nature of any suggestion. A farmhouse upstate, rilly? Between the two trees? Where do you come up with this stuff! Oh well maybe we should have a look after the commercial.

Or applying guilt that the right action will cause drama later a la BBQ. All action is conscribed by impedimemts of mental slowness or domestic consequence. Whereas the evil lab people are remarkably brisk in their movements, able to tear down labs and move people in the time it takes our heroes to decide who rides in front or back.

Would be fun to find out some day if the writers expected viewers to have sympathy for Grace and bungled the effort Wesley Crusher style, or are aware of the unfairness of her arguments (as well described upthread) meaning have made her this harridan on purpose. If the latter okay you have made your point and if presumably the target is getting Ben and Saanvi together then move it along please.

Speaking of brisk action, the rescued people were certainly whisked off in a hurry! No autonomy for them, just transport to the next plot place god knows where. The concern for Cal's whereabouts doesn't extend to these poor souls. They'll miss Christmas! Still not noticed missing in their native countries because the rest of the world doesn't exist, only Famileee!

Edited November 29, 2018 by fauntleroy

[shapeshifter]

@fauntleroy, if the Previously TV Awards adds a category for best post this post of yours should win!
I might start referring to Grace as Grace/Wesley Crusher.

[preeya]

15 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

@fauntleroy, if the Previously TV Awards adds a category for best post this post of yours should win!
I might start referring to Grace as Grace/Wesley Crusher.

ABSOLUTELY!

[Melina22]

6 hours ago, fauntleroy said:

One cheeseball dramatic technique in play here is dithering by the goods vs decisiveness by the bads. That is, the slowness of the uptake at action time eg Dad, look over there! Cal, how did you get here! Dad, over there! Michaela, bring Cal somewhere safe! Dad, over there! Cal, what do you mean over there - do you mean here? No dad, over there! Do you mean in my hat? Etc.

This! It makes me crazy. And occasionally quick on the fast forward trigger. The other cheeseball technique I hate is that the main characters never answer a direct question. First person : "Someone from the plane just told you the reason this is all happening that explains everything? What is it?" Second person: "Forget it. You wouldn't believe me." Walks away. First person:"Second person, come back! Tell me the answer! Oh, never mind." Goes back to what he was doing. 

[Dowel Jones]

On 11/28/2018 at 12:27 PM, angrypuppy said:

I felt nothing but the strain in my eyes from rolling them too hard when she was pleading for Jared's life in the hospital room. Ugh.

 

21 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

But then, I'm not one that believes a great deal in prayer, so maybe her belief works for some.

Grace:  "Please, God, please, PLEASE, PLEASE, DON'T LET HIM DIE!" (Vigorously weeping)"

God: "Oh, all right.  Quit bothering me.  I'm watching The Good Place."

[shapeshifter]

7 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

@fauntleroy, if the Previously TV Awards adds a category for best post this post of yours should win!
I might start referring to Grace as Grace/Wesley Crusher.

1 hour ago, Dowel Jones said:

Grace:  "Please, God, please, PLEASE, PLEASE, DON'T LET HIM DIE!" (Vigorously weeping)"

God: "Oh, all right.  Quit bothering me.  I'm watching The Good Place."

And if we ever do get to nominate posts for awards: Anything by @Dowel Jones

[Anela]

On 11/26/2018 at 11:40 PM, SimoneS said:

Chiming in to say: Michaela and Jared are hot together and obviously still love each other. He needs to dump his wife and go back to her.

The comments about Grace are hilarious. Yes, she is a pain, but I feel for her. She is being thrown under the bus so that Ben can hook up with the gorgeous Saanvi. 

And I don't see Danny as "poor Danny" because he didn't go away when Ben came back: he kept texting, and spending time with Olive. He didn't leave the family to deal with what had happened. But I hate the writers, and haven't watched the last few episodes, so I'm just commenting on what I saw before. If Grace is an ass, then so is he. 

[Anela]

On 11/27/2018 at 1:07 AM, Elih143 said:

Oh you're just sympathizing with her because she's black and female. So racist and sexist of you. ;-) Whereas on the flipside my sympathies for Ben's position has nothing to do with him being white and male. :-)

I don't sympathize with Grace because she isn't white, or female. I understood Ben when he hit a strange guy in his house, freaked out when he found him there alone. I can't see anyone in that scenario, shaking their hands, and making them a hot drink. They would at least be calling the police. 

On 11/27/2018 at 8:28 AM, green said:

"Uggg, my wife is the worst!  She gets upset when I return with The Golden Child half-bloodied on the latest father-son bonding adventure.  She doesn't understand I risk my life for The Golden Child every day because I am his anointed Prophet.  When I refuse to tell her the truth in detail and lie and give her only half-truths at best she gets upset for some reason.  I can't tell "the little woman" the real reason I took that job at the accounting firm because she will never understand how very special I am.  I better just stand here and silently cry and look stoically heroic than have a sit down with her and my daughter, The Golden Child and Sister Cop and explain everything truthfully from day one because how can one of the Non-Chosen ever understand me.  Oh whoa is me, sob, sigh, and boo-hoo."  -Ben, totally.

I have never ever loathed a fictional character more than self-absorbed Ben on this show.  He makes Grace seem like the adult, sane one by comparison.

 

 

Thank you! I've been feeling so alone. I don't loathe him, but I definitely don't love him, and I thought he was a douche in the first episode. The way he treated his sister, and then later admitted that he was hearing a voice, too. But I only watched one or two seasons of Once Upon a Time, and I wasn't in love with whomever he played. 

Edited November 29, 2018 by Anela