S04.E10: Winner

[Tara Ariano]

 

Quote

Jimmy turns the page on his reputation; Lalo tracks a loose end in Gus' operation; Mike is forced to make a difficult decision.

[Armchair Critic]

Uh oh Kim's face at the end does not bode well for their relationship. And now he becomes Saul.

[Spartan Girl]

Yup, it's official: there is no Jimmy, only Saul.

I did love the opening flashback with Jimmy and Chuck singing karaoke. The last time they were really brothers.

[Primetimer]

Jimmy performs sincerity in support of his bar reinstatement appeal while Mike runs a Mann hunt in our EPIC OLD-SCHOOL RECAP of Better Call Saul's Season 4 finale, 'Winner.'

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[SailorGirl]

So I KNOW there's going to be another season, but if this had been the last of the series, I would be okay with it. There's still lots to see with character development, but it could have ended there and been okay. REALLY glad it isn't though!!

I enjoyed that ending so much that I didn't mind AMC's freakin' holiday commercial right after . . . 

Poor Mike. 

Whoever picked the time for and location of that shoot (no pun intended) needs an award. I know it sounds weird to say this about a murder, but that scene was gorgeous. 

S'all Good Man!! 

Is it the new season yet???? 

Edited October 9, 2018 by SailorGirl

[Bryce Lynch]

3 minutes ago, Armchair Critic said:

Uh oh Kim's face at the end does not bode well for their relationship. And now he becomes Saul.

I don't know why it was so shocking to her.  She was helping him fake grief all week. 

[Macbeth]

Oh Werner   Didn't you know that America is the last place you want to work if you want a good benefits package??  

My country is notorious for being stingy on vacation time. 

[Bryce Lynch]

Did the other 6 Germans really go home or did they go to Belize?

[JudyObscure]

Just now, Bryce Lynch said:

I don't know why it was so shocking to her.  She was helping him fake grief all week. 

I think it was because this time she had really believed he was sincere.  This time she fell for his con herself and felt like a fool.  It's a whole different thing when you're not in on the joke.

[WritinMan]

The cold opening was great--both very nice and really sad.

Poor Werner. He never really understand who he was dealing with.

Kim's reaction at the end was great.  Even if Jimmy meant a little of what he said about Chuck in that hearing, he will never admit it to anyone. Even her.

It's gonna be a long year before this show comes back....

Edited October 9, 2018 by WritinMan
Typo!

[ChromaKelly]

Look at the stars, Werner.

[WritinMan]

Also, Gale's enthusiasm was very funny.

Well, Gus didn't think so, but it made me laugh.

[Pike Ludwell]

I hated the opening. They had limited time to deal with a lot of things, and this was wasted time. At least come up with a better song for the karaoke than that piece of junk. And what about the Gene situation we saw in episode 1? They could have followed up on that.

Edited October 9, 2018 by Pat Hoolihan

[Sharper2002]

So Werner really thought he could go on vacation and come back? He really had no idea who he was dealing with. It would have been SO easy to finish the job and go home. 

Its actually probably better Mike killed Werner. With the way Gus looked, I think Mike was quite merciful in comparison.

Poor cashier at the currency exchange. He gives Mike a pass and is ultimately killed by Lalo’s nosy ass. Also, I know Mike said that Lalo wasn’t told a lot when he talked to Werner, but I think Gus knows better.

Assuming this is the beginning of the end of Kim and Jimmy. He rolled right over her with him scam and he’s a monster that can’t be contained now. 

Yay to seeing Ernesto again! But no Nacho.  :( 

Edited October 9, 2018 by Sharper2002

[Bryce Lynch]

Werner was not as bright as I thought.  His plan was lousy and he was way too relaxed at the hotel.

I'm not sure what purpose there was to killing him.  He already spilled the beans to Lalo.

I thought Mike said he would make it look like an accident and his wife would have a story of what happened to him. It looks like he got left in a hole in the desert.

Was Mike also lying about Werner's guys going home?

That scene reminded me of when Mike was going to kill Lydia and she wanted her daughter to find her and threatened to scream and force Mike to kill her as well, because she didn't want Kyyra to think Mommy abandoned her.

4 minutes ago, WritinMan said:

Also, Gale's enthusiasm was very funny.

Well, Gus didn't think so, but it made me laugh.

Gus showed him a side he hadn't seen before.  

Jimmy showed Kim a side she hadn't seen before, but probably should have.

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

17 minutes ago, JudyObscure said:

I think it was because this time she had really believed he was sincere.  This time she fell for his con herself and felt like a fool.  It's a whole different thing when you're not in on the joke.

Heh. Sucks for her. 

I won't feel the least bit sorry for her if she gets burned in the process. She's been up to her neck in his shenanigans. That is why I was so glad when he finally called her out on her hypocrisy last week.

[nodorothyparker]

We all knew poor doomed Werner was indeed doomed, but it didn't make it any less gutting when it happened.  There was something disturbingly beautiful about how it was framed and filmed.  Mike looked like he was wavering between weary resolve and just being sick.

Jimmy's speech to his scholarship candidate, who looked like she wanted to be anywhere but where the creepy stranger was ranting at her, was painful to watch.  She still got off lighter than Kim though, who realized too late she was dealing with Saul, not Jimmy.

[Dev F]

3 minutes ago, Sharper2002 said:

So Werner really thought he could go on vacation and come back? He really had no idea who he was dealing with. It would have been SO easy to finish the job and go home. 

It didn't occur to me till now, but Werner's foolishness basically represents Mike's feelings about his criminal activities up till now. Mike, too, has been telling himself that he can do a little bit of work for a drug kingpin, then go back to his family, then check in with the kingpin again, as if it's all no big deal. By killing Werner, Mike wasn't just busting his "murdering innocent people" cherry; he was also killing the part of himself who thought a life of crime could be Pop-Pop's little side gig.

[scenario]

2 minutes ago, Dev F said:

It didn't occur to me till now, but Werner's foolishness basically represents Mike's feelings about his criminal activities up till now. Mike, too, has been telling himself that he can do a little bit of work for a drug kingpin, then go back to his family, then check in with the kingpin again, as if it's all no big deal. By killing Werner, Mike wasn't just busting his "murdering innocent people" cherry; he was also killing the part of himself who thought a life of crime could be Pop-Pop's little side gig.

I don't think that Werner is exactly an innocent. He knew that the people he was working for were criminals. He should have known that criminals who are that secretive are not likely to be forgiving. Mike was killing someone who was in the business whether or not Werner really realized it. A serial killing killing another serial killer isn't quite the same as killing an innocent. Werner was building the infrastructure for a meth lab which will lead to the deaths of many people. He was aiding and abetting a serial killer. 

Werner wasn't exactly a criminal but he wasn't exactly a innocent either. 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

"God damn it."

I am unable to convey in words the type, nor depth, of sadness which overtook me while watching this ep.  No entertainment has ever taken me to this particular place.

[aemom]

Werner escaping cost that poor money transfer guy his life and the guy with the slushee(?) his car.

Fring can be REALLY scary when he wants to be.

It's going to be a long year waiting for next season. 

[peeayebee]

Love when Chuck takes the mic from Jimmy to sing by himself. Nice touch.

I guess I'm as naive as Werner, thinking he wouldn't be killed. 

When Jimmy put the letter away and started speaking "from the heart," I was suckered in, but just for a minute. It started to dawn on me that it was all an act. 

In his car wouldn't start and he cried, at first I thought this was his feelings about Chuck surfacing, but I suppose it was really Jimmy's realization that he was like the shoplifter and would never be accepted back into respected society.

[benteen]

I admit, I was disappointed with this episode.  Mind you, the acting was GREAT (with Odenkirk doing some Emmy-winning workd at the end) and definitely some strong scenes.  But I'm tired of these slow crawl storylines.  The superlab storyline for instance.  I'm glad he's FINALLY Saul now but still, a slow crawl of a storyline.

I agree as well that Kim shouldn't be that surprised that Jimmy was faking it and she will be deserving of her own downfall as well.

Disappointed over Howard's return and how they wasted the character.  I was really hope the theory that Bryce Lynch had last week, that HHM had taken Gus on as a client, would have come to pass.  It would be a GREAT storyline and about a thousand times better use of Howard than what the writers are currently using him for.

Not to mention it's time to for his and Mike's worlds to come together again.

Lalo seems to have the reckless stupidity of the rest of his family.

I did love the cold opening though, with Chuck unexpectedly letting his hair down and sharing some nice moments with Jimmy.  The visual during the scene where Mike shot Werner was GREAT.

Edited October 9, 2018 by benteen

[Bryce Lynch]

Was there a continuity error in the flashback?  In 108, they showed Jimmy telling Chuck he passed the bar and almost immediately Howard tells Jimmy they won't be hiring him as a lawyer.

In this flashback Jimmy kept going on about changing the firm name to HHMM.  I guess that could have been the booze talking, but Jimmy would have already known that wasn't happening.

[thuganomics85]

Ah, bad karaoke!  A tale has old as time!  Loved Ernesto going all in with it at least.  And the Jimmy/Chuck duet that showed there was a fondness between them (even though I do think it was significant that we see Chuck actually take the microphone from Jimmy and do it on his own.  Even for karaoke, he has to be in charge.)  Michael McKean made the most of his two scenes this season.

I suspected that Jimmy's grand speech at the end was another con, but damn, if he (and Bob Odenkirk) didn't pull it off.  Even had Kim fooled, judging from her look.  She really seems to be realizing now just what she has gotten herself into and that even she isn't immune to getting tricked by him.  But at this point, will it even be enough for her to finally end it?  Because every time I think she will, she ends up actually going deeper in Jimmy's world of schemes and manipulations.  Really have no idea what is going to happen to her.

Oh, Werner!  You really did not see how badly you had fucked things up, huh?  I knew he was a goner and it would be at Mike's hands, because that was the only way I would be able to buy Mike still being a trusted solider for Gus on Breaking Bad, after all the fuck-ups.  In the past, I feel like Mike somewhat deluded himself over what he is really doing in this organization, but I think he has accepted it now: he is a killer for one of the most dangerous criminals in all of New Mexico.

Seeing Gale getting all excited about the future lab certainly has a sense of irony.  If he only knew how it would all turn out for him!

Looking past all of the criminal aspects (I know), Gus really is the type of boss where you almost wish he would reprimand or even yell at you when you mess up, because when he's simply silent instead, you know bad things are in store for you!

I knew what the final line was going to be, but I still loved it.  It's happening!  Saul Goodman has arrived!

Another great season.  I still can't believe they've taken what was arguably the comic relief of Breaking Bad, and have made him one of the most compelling characters on television now.  I really hope Bob Odenkirk wins at least one Emmy before the show ends.

[ahmerali]

1 hour ago, Pat Hoolihan said:

I hated the opening. They had limited time to deal with a lot of things, and this was wasted time. At least come up with a better song for the karaoke than that piece of junk. And what about the Gene situation we saw in episode 1? They could have followed up on that.

Umm, actually I think it could not have been a more perfect song selection..."But I was a fool playing by the rules?"

Sums it up perfectly.

[Bryce Lynch]

1 hour ago, Pat Hoolihan said:

I hated the opening. They had limited time to deal with a lot of things, and this was wasted time. At least come up with a better song for the karaoke than that piece of junk. And what about the Gene situation we saw in episode 1? They could have followed up on that.

I liked the opening.  It showed a different side of Chuck and a different side of their relationship.

The Gene scenes have always been limited to the opening scenes of the season premieres.

[ahmerali]

8 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Was there a continuity error in the flashback?  In 108, they showed Jimmy telling Chuck he passed the bar and almost immediately Howard tells Jimmy they won't be hiring him as a lawyer.

In this flashback Jimmy kept going on about changing the firm name to HHMM.  I guess that could have been the booze talking, but Jimmy would have already known that wasn't happening.

I just rewatched that scene, there is a cut between the time Chuck shows Jimmy his degree and the scene in the mail room where Howard is sent to give Jimmy the bad news. At the time, it obviously seemed like the two scenes were right with each other, but I guess not....

[scenario]

Jimmy's not the type to take no for an answer. He probably figured that with Chuck on his side he'd eventually change Howard's mind. 

[LittleIggy]

The beginning with Chuck and Jimmy was so touching. Who knew they were ever that close?

Werner’s demise was predictable and heartbreaking. Poor Mike.

Poor Kim. She was just stunned by Jimmy...I mean, Saul at the end.

[Bryce Lynch]

3 minutes ago, ahmerali said:

I just rewatched that scene, there is a cut between the time Chuck shows Jimmy his degree and the scene in the mail room where Howard is sent to give Jimmy the bad news. At the time, it obviously seemed like the two scenes were right with each other, but I guess not....

I think it was the same day or the next day.  They were eating cake to celebrate Jimmy passing the bar when Howard came in.

The swearing in ceremony and karaoke party probably would have been weeks later.

It could be that Jimmy was drunk and either BSing or thinking Chuck would make Howard change his mind.

[100Proof]

I'm half way through and I haven't the slightest idea wtf is going on with Jimmy. Where does he get 23k for the library. WTF is he even doing in Chucks law firm making decisions on scholarships? I;m watching this thing and have no flippin' clue on how this stuff came to be, lol

[ahmerali]

Well, I was close in my prediction....I sad that Lalo would try to track down Ziegler to try and get a jump on Fring, and he basically did that...

Now that Saul will apparently be in full gear going into next season, I'm predicting that Mike (who Lalo will still keep eyes on) will visit Saul for some sort of information or work. Lalo will get his way into Saul's place of work in a similar manner to what we saw today and scare the living daylights out of Saul to tell him with Mike wanted to know, and promising him that if he ever tells anyone, his two cousins will come looking for him.

Nacho will have to kill Lalo at some point, and Nacho will come looking to Saul for assistance, perhaps even to get hooked up with the Disappearer. That's how Saul will come to know that "It was Nacho".

And I still think, someway somehow, that Kim will also need to find the Disappearer at some point.

[Bryce Lynch]

6 hours ago, 100Proof said:

I'm half way through and I haven't the slightest idea wtf is going on with Jimmy. Where does he get 23k for the library. WTF is he even doing in Chucks law firm making decisions on scholarships? I;m watching this thing and have no flippin' clue on how this stuff came to be, lol

He probably made the 23k selling burner phones. Kim also might have loaned him some.

Earlier in the season, Howard offered to give Jimmy a spot on Chuck's scholarship fund board.  Right before Kim went off on him.

Edited October 9, 2018 by Bryce Lynch

[ahmerali]

7 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I think it was the same day or the next day.  They were eating cake to celebrate Jimmy passing the bar when Howard came in.

The swearing in ceremony and karaoke party probably would have been weeks later.

It could be that Jimmy was drunk and either BSing or thinking Chuck would make Howard change his mind.

I see what you mean, but I think the cake scene was the day he was sworn in - the scene where Jimmy presented the degree to Chuck would actually have happened weeks before. In the interim, I'm sure that Chuck strung Jimmy along and said "Oh yeah, Jimmy, once you're sworn in, I'll talk to the partners...."

I can't see the creators overlooking that in the continuity.

3 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

He probably made the 23k selling burner phones. Kim also might have loaned him some.

Earlier in the season, Howard offered to put Jimmy a spot on Chuck's scholarship fund board.  Right before Kim went off on him.

That makes perfect sense. Every season, Jimmy breaks the rules, earns a wad of cash, and then has to basically give it away to do the "right thing".

Edited October 9, 2018 by ahmerali

[Bryce Lynch]

Just now, ahmerali said:

I see what you mean, but I think the cake scene was the day he was sworn in - the scene where Jimmy presented the degree to Chuck would actually have happened weeks before. In the interim, I'm sure that Chuck strung Jimmy along and said "Oh yeah, Jimmy, once you're sworn in, I'll talk to the partners...."

I don't think so.  Howard had just heard the news (I doubt Chuck would wait until after the swearing in ceremony to tell him) and Jimmy seems to be wearing the same shirt and tie as when he told Chuck.  Kim is wearing the same clothes as when she opened the envelope.

Again, Jimmy was drunk and could have just been talking nonsense.

[desmond]

9 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

He probably made the 23k selling burner phones. Kim also might have loaned him some.

Earlier in the season, Howard offered to put Jimmy a spot on Chuck's scholarship fund board.  Right before Kim went off on him.

Don't forget Jimmy made some cash with the hummel figurine too. He also got the ~$5k from Chuck's estate and is presumably sharing a lot of expenses with Kim, who is making big money now.

[DangerousMinds]

31 minutes ago, ahmerali said:

Umm, actually I think it could not have been a more perfect song selection..."But I was a fool playing by the rules?"

Sums it up perfectly.

Plus, how could you go wrong with Abba?

[Bryce Lynch]

1 minute ago, desmond said:

Don't forget Jimmy made some cash with the hummel figurine too. He also got the ~$5k from Chuck's estate and is presumably sharing a lot of expenses with Kim, who is making big money now.

He spent the Hummel money on burner phones and then got robbed of all the money he made selling them.

He spent the inheritance money on more burner phones and made a nice profit on those, which he apparently rolled into more phones and more profits.

[desmond]

Just now, Bryce Lynch said:

He spent the Hummel money on burner phones

Ah. Was wondering how exactly he had obtained his burner phone inventory without straight-up stealing them from the store.

[100Proof]

21 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

He probably made the 23k selling burner phones. Kim also might have loaned him some.

Earlier in the season, Howard offered to put Jimmy a spot on Chuck's scholarship fund board.  Right before Kim went off on him.

Thanks.

I'm not one for remembering the trivia of past episodes on the series I watch. The overall big picture, sure. So when stuff happens that I'm supposed to be remembering some line or two of script from 5 or 6 episodes or even seasons back....hell even back to Breaking Bad... to know whats going on now, then the flipping hell with it, lol

Edited October 9, 2018 by 100Proof

[scenario]

1 minute ago, Bryce Lynch said:

He spent the Hummel money on burner phones and then got robbed of all the money he made selling them.

He spent the inheritance money on more burner phones and made a nice profit on those, which he apparently rolled into more phones and more profits.

He's getting the phones wholesale though his job.  I'd bet it was something like $5.00 wholesale,$15.00 retail $25.00 Jimmy's price. 50 phones a week is $500 tax free profit per week to him. No one is going to question a cell phone store selling 50 phones a week except maybe the owners and they seem like the hands off types anyway. The store makes its profits and pays its taxes and Jimmy skims off of the top. 

[Amarsir]

2 hours ago, Armchair Critic said:

Uh oh Kim's face at the end does not bode well for their relationship. And now he becomes Saul.

Rhea Seehorn does such a great job with that "What have you done now?" face.

[Bryce Lynch]

2 minutes ago, scenario said:

He's getting the phones wholesale though his job.  I'd bet it was something like $5.00 wholesale,$15.00 retail $25.00 Jimmy's price. 50 phones a week is $500 tax free profit per week to him. No one is going to question a cell phone store selling 50 phones a week except maybe the owners and they seem like the hands off types anyway. The store makes its profits and pays its taxes and Jimmy skims off of the top. 

IIRC, the COD invoice on his first shipment from Voltage Wholesale to the nail salon said $20 per phone.

[scenario]

Just now, Bryce Lynch said:

IIRC, the COD invoice on his first shipment from Voltage Wholesale to the nail salon said $20 per phone.

Just adjust the numbers. Wholesale $20.00, Retail $35.00, Jimmy's price to criminals $50.00. Cheap insurance for criminals. 

The company thinks that Jimmy turned around a dying store and doesn't look too closely. Jimmy gets to be salesman of the month. His job pay's all of his expenses. So he's just putting aside the rest of the money. A trunk full of phones would be 50 or a 100 phones. (100 phones at $15 per is $1,500. )At $10 or $15 profit per phone, he could save $25,000 in a few months even if he did pay some tax on some of them to keep his peddlers licence. 

[tennisgurl]

Look at the flowers, Werner. Just look at the flowers. 

I knew that Werner was doomed, but it was still hard to watch, especially realizing that Mike would have to do it. Werner might have been a decently smart guy, but he clearly underestimated just how ruthless the guys they were working for really were. What makes it even more tragic is that this episode is not just Jimmy finally breaking bad and becoming Saul, its Mike breaking bad as well, going from "I can earn a little bit of cash illegally" to "career criminal and clean up guy for the cartel", and you could tell the exact moment he realized how deep he was in now. The scene was beautifully shot though.

Kim had no idea that she was being played just as much as everyone else, and that Jimmy is long gone, now almost permanently replaced by Saul. His conman ways were fun and exciting for her when she was his partner in crime, but knowing how far he has gone, and that she is now just one of the hapless suckers he is screwing over with his big smile and cheap suites. This is definitely the beginning of the end for him and Kim. I knew the episode would end on that line, but, cant lie, I still got goosebumps on the way a good prequel should give you. 

Seeing Chuck and Jimmy in that happier scene, with all the knowledge that we have of what comes, was surprisingly heartbreaking. 

Its going to be a long wait to see the next season. 

[Amarsir]

1 hour ago, scenario said:

I don't think that Werner is exactly an innocent. He knew that the people he was working for were criminals. He should have known that criminals who are that secretive are not likely to be forgiving. Mike was killing someone who was in the business whether or not Werner really realized it. A serial killing killing another serial killer isn't quite the same as killing an innocent. Werner was building the infrastructure for a meth lab which will lead to the deaths of many people. He was aiding and abetting a serial killer. 

Werner wasn't exactly a criminal but he wasn't exactly a innocent either. 

The thing that's weird to me is that he knew Gus's name? If you need a secret crew to build a secret location and they can't even know where it is, having a name they can drop has got to be even worse. No?

[100Proof]

I did find Werner's behavior a bit implausible, unless of course he was truly in the dark about who his employers were and what the actual purpose of the construction was. You'd think someone in the business of doing a job for the kind of people that want such projects done, would be a bit more 'hardened' himself. 

I found myself pretend yelling at the screen at him, "are you that bloody stupid??!!!"

Edited October 9, 2018 by 100Proof

[Lonesome Rhodes]

Unspoken, but very definitely part of Jimmy's agony in the Esteem, was not just that elites would never let him truly in - but that he was never truly good enough to ever have a Kim love him.

[Quilt Fairy]

Couldn't they have put in one frickin' scene with Nacho?  Especially since he should be stuck like a leech to Lalo.  Michael Mando remains chronically underutilized in this show.