S19.E19: Sunk Cost Fallacy

[Xeliou66]

Decided to go ahead and start the episode thread for tonight. Cabot is returning, but I’m nervous, I’m afraid they will make her unethical or even a criminal based on the preview.

[dttruman]

29 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

Decided to go ahead and start the episode thread for tonight. Cabot is returning, but I’m nervous, I’m afraid they will make her unethical or even a criminal based on the preview.

Will St Olivia bring her back from the dark side like Benson did for her step brother, or will she be just as duplicitous as Cabot and claim they are doing it for the greater good?

[Xeliou66]

52 minutes ago, dttruman said:

Will St Olivia bring her back from the dark side like Benson did for her step brother, or will she be just as duplicitous as Cabot and claim they are doing it for the greater good?

This is the main question : Will St Olivia save Cabot from going off the deep end, will St Olivia join Cabot in doing something unethical, or will Cabot go off the deep end like Dana Lewis did? Or is it possible they will kill off Cabot? 

[dttruman]

2 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

This is the main question : Will St Olivia save Cabot from going off the deep end, will St Olivia join Cabot in doing something unethical, or will Cabot go off the deep end like Dana Lewis did? Or is it possible they will kill off Cabot? 

My prediction is that Cabot will be going to prison for the greater good. Anyone else have a prediction?

[dttruman]

Maybe a bad omen for future episodes. The Stone character has only been on a few episodes, but the writers (and or producers) have decided to include his personal dilemmas in the overall episodes already. I thought he would have to be around for a couple of seasons to do that.

[Fiero425]

51 minutes ago, dttruman said:

Maybe a bad omen for future episodes. The Stone character has only been on a few episodes, but the writers (and or producers) have decided to include his personal dilemmas in the overall episodes already. I thought he would have to be around for a couple of seasons to do that.

It has Haggarty's mitts all over the plotline with Stone! As EP I expect no less; esp. since nothing was resolved with her mother, why not get into someone else's personal life? I'm still waiting for Fin to be arrested when they find Darius dead in the collapsed remains of an abandoned tenement! ;-) 

[RedheadZombie]

I was waiting to find out the MIL did the hit and run.

[Packerbrewerbadger]

Boy did Stone jump the gun on arresting the husband for murder!  Will he be disciplined for it?  Sounds like it will cost the city a bundle.   I thought Liv was really weak and unprepared when she testified in the lawsuit. She didn’t have to lie but could have come up with some better answers given her experience.  I don’t think I liked this episode but can’t pinpoint why. 

[spunky]

When will Olivia be held accountable for anything?! She didn't have to lie, but has been with SVU long enough to understand how dangerous it is for a DV victim to leave her abuser. So why be all sanctimonious, and use the law when she feels like it. The storyline about Stone's sister is nothing more than a cartoon version of mental illness. 

[rhys]

Why was the husband on his way to the safe house? In my city, no males are supposed to know where the safe house is. People don't give out the address. Cops don't know it.

Alex looked great.

[SuzieQ]

This episode annoyed me beyond belief!  Now they've taken a really straight arrow former DA who loved the law and turned her into a vigilante hero rescuing abused women.  It's like the writers have no idea who Alex Cabot was.  If it was anyone but Alex Cabot it would have been fine.  It might have even made sense if it was Casey Novak, but not Alex Cabot.  This was even worse than turning Dana Lewis into a killer. UGH!

 

The Ben Stone sister thing seemed thrown in and disjointed.  

Edited April 19, 2018 by SuzieQ

[QueenMab]

Wow. Sounds so amazing. I'm watching "Suits".

[Xeliou66]

This episode had an interesting premise but just got weaker as it went along. 

Cabot was extremely OOC, she had given up on the justice system completely and was nothing more than a vigilante it seemed. Very disappointed how they brought her back just for character assassination. 

I was surprised Cabot was allowed to represent the woman at the custody hearing, given that she had helped her fake her own death, she should’ve been sued as well. 

I thought Cabot was way out of line helping them fake their own deaths, what if the husband had been killed at Rikers? As big of an asshole as this guy was, he was still set up for something he didn’t do and he had every right to go after his ex wife and Cabot, and I was sort of glad he got away at the end. 

I was glad to finally see an unhappy ending where justice wasn’t served, I honestly didn’t know if SVU would ever do that again out of fear of pissing off some of the rabid fans who view the show as some sort of therapy, but it was nice to see. That being said, the ending felt rushed, the circumstances of the crash were unclear (where was the daughter?) and it didn’t even seem like they were tracking down the driver, that would be the Homicide detectives job, would’ve been a good crossover if the Mothership was still around. 

Stone was off his game because of his sister’s situation, and he never should’ve given the go ahead to charge the husband with very little evidence. His sister’s storyline seemed pointless and just thrown in to give Peter more screen time in an episode where he didn’t have much of it, and it was very disappointing that Stone and Cabot didn’t meet.

I was glad that Benson wasn’t dragged into Stone’s personal situation, although it is strange that Stone is already calling her “Liv”, after just being around for a few months and Benson treating him like shit at the start. 

No Fin sucked, it isn’t the same without him.

[CelticBlackCat]

Stone's personal storyline with his mentally ill sister doesn't seem to have any real place in the story, yet it was the opening scene.  Where was the real Alex Cabot?  Stephanie March looked great, but the character was so OOC it makes you wonder what transformation took place for her to be such a lawbreaker with abandon.

It seems like Stone has been mesmerized by Liv, as he's now calling her.  Maybe next she'll be calling him My Petey a la the Rafa days.  Blood on the steering wheel and two missing people?  It's gotta be first degree murder!  Did scumbag husband get charged with one murder or two?  I can't remember.  Where was Ruby the daughter when the car crash/hit job happened?  Not staying with Daddy Dearest or Grandmama (that lady was a hoot though).

[QueenMab]

Liv and Petey sittin' in a tree

k i s s  ugh! oooweee!

Benson as the seductive dominatrix no younger man can resist is now, officially, hilarious. And God Almighty we KNOW. Benson has giant, mega hooter Macy parade balloon chi chi's that enter the room five minutes before she does. Is there a shirt, a blouse, a circus tent in all of NYC that can cover those gigantor funbags? ENOUGH WITH MARISKA HARGITAY'S big fat tits. I can't watch two minutes of her. I can't get past the huge tits. And her immoral unethical unprofessional sexual manipulation of her younger male colleagues. She IS her father's daughter. I tried. I can't look at her any more. Liv and Petey will have sex before the end of the season....because...."must bang Benson". Stone is Walking Dead. And Cabot and Barba should hook up, and form a club...ADA's Who Turn Into Lawbreaking Assholes. 

[dttruman]

3 hours ago, QueenMab said:

And her immoral unethical unprofessional sexual manipulation of her younger male colleagues. She IS her father's daughter. I tried. I can't look at her any more. Liv and Petey will have sex before the end of the season....because...."must bang Benson". Stone is Walking Dead. And Cabot and Barba should hook up, and form a club...ADA's Who Turn Into Lawbreaking Assholes. 

Just think if the executive producers wanted to move the format back to it's original type it was in the beginning and they wanted her out. Would bringing back Munch to be her love interest do it?

[dttruman]

7 hours ago, SuzieQ said:

This episode annoyed me beyond belief!  Now they've taken a really straight arrow former DA who loved the law and turned her into a vigilante hero rescuing abused women.  It's like the writers have no idea who Alex Cabot was.  If it was anyone but Alex Cabot it would have been fine. 

 

6 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

This episode had an interesting premise but just got weaker as it went along. 

Cabot was extremely OOC, she had given up on the justice system completely and was nothing more than a vigilante it seemed. Very disappointed how they brought her back just for character assassination. 

I was surprised Cabot was allowed to represent the woman at the custody hearing, given that she had helped her fake her own death, she should’ve been sued as well. 

I thought Cabot was way out of line helping them fake their own deaths, what if the husband had been killed at Rikers? As big of an asshole as this guy was, he was still set up for something he didn’t do and he had every right to go after his ex wife and Cabot, and I was sort of glad he got away at the end. 

I was glad to finally see an unhappy ending where justice wasn’t served, I honestly didn’t know if SVU would ever do that again out of fear of pissing off some of the rabid fans who view the show as some sort of therapy, but it was nice to see. That being said, the ending felt rushed, the circumstances of the crash were unclear (where was the daughter?) and it didn’t even seem like they were tracking down the driver,

Totally agree! They really over did it when Cabot helped frame the husband for murder. Is it me or did this episode do a disservice to domestic violence (DM) victims and the system? Like I have mentioned many times in the past, I am not an expert on these matters. Police are more sympathetic now and the wheels of the system move a lot faster concerning DM. As much as Cabot is an advocate, she would (or should) have had pictures taken of the wife's injuries, instead she helps her disappear and (unbelievably) frame the husband.  Hargitay and the show have been pushing the agenda of "getting help" when it concerns DV (and rightly so) over the last 10 years. Apparently the message they are trying to push now is your justified in disappearing at a moment's notice and trying to frame the abuser.

I on the other hand, wanted to see a resolution to this episode where the husband is brought to justice for having his wife killed (for closure purposes). Totally agree, it was rushed but they had to make time for Stone and his sister and also Stone and Olivia. The whole episode concerning the crime and the investigation was so badly contrived especially the ending, it forced the viewer to accept the inconceivable chain of events.

[wknt3]

The Good:
An interesting case. The biggest single improvement this season has been the return of a variety of crimes and showing us actual investigations.
Carisi and Rollins. See writers if you give us two characters and actors who have actual chemistry and don't force things, let them joke around a bit, etc. we actually want to watch it. It's basically the complete opposite of BenStone.
It was nice seeing Alex again. I don't think she was particularly well written, but it was nice to see a character returning and not spending the entire episode praising Benson.
The ending, It was nice seeing some ambiguity and that St. Benson couldn't save everyone.
A crime focused on family issues with no extended Benoah anguish!

The Bad:
No Fin. And no explanation unless I missed a line somewhere. Why would you have an episode based on the return of an old character and not include the other member of the current cast who worked with her? Especially the one who you could use to challenge her, ask the questions the viewers were asking, etc.? I never like the episodes without him as much, but this seems like a particularly bad choice for a week off.
Stone and his sister. They've done this plot before both on SVU and CI and it's never worked. Again if Vincent D'Onofrio, and Rita Moreno couldn't pull it off you're not. You've managed to move past constant soapy Benson plots and that's great, but replacing it with Stone's soapy family drama isn't any better.
I think Cabot was OOC based on what we saw of her and it wasn't really explained why she would change so dramatically.

Overall it was OK, but kind of a return to the "good idea, but didn't live up to its potential" territory that we've spent so much time in this season. I really did like seeing Alex and Liv again and if you want to put Benson in a relationship with a lawyer I think the chemistry is much better there than with the other attempts the show has made, but overall it was sort of mildly disappointing. Great premise, well acted, but the writing, while competent, just didn't quite get them to where they needed to be to pull off the great episode that could have been.

[mtlchick]

The good: The eyeglasses of justice looked fab! 

 

The bad: I said "this feels like a character assassination on Cabot."  Protecting victims I see, but it's not like her at all to frame husbands for murder, even if she turned out to be right about the result. 

 

Still trying to figure out what they plan to do with Stone and his sister, because so far, I'm not feeling it. 

[Willowsmom]

5 hours ago, dttruman said:

Just think if the executive producers wanted to move the format back to it's original type it was in the beginning and they wanted her out. Would bringing back Munch to be her love interest do it?

NOOOOOOOOO we cannot do such a horrid thing to Munch.

[pinguina]

I'll be honest - I usually turn to this program at the half way point.  I can figure out what is going on pretty quickly, this episode took me a little longer.

I can't believe that Cabot would frame someone for murder for the "greater good" (i.e. domestic violence).  She was the one who would chastise the detectives (Benson, Stabler, etc.) when they would bring in "evidence" she felt was weak or inappropriate or questionably gathered.  So to make her a vigilante was not who we (the viewers) recognized as Cabot. Having said that Olivia threw her under the bus when she was being interviewed by the husband's lawyer.  She always prevaricated before (and done it well too), yet apparently she couldn't do it this time to save an abused woman.  Plus how did Cabot become the lawyer for the wife?  Why weren't pictures taken of the wife when she arrived to the "halfway house" to have evidence for a later date?  And the ending although done to show us sometimes there isn't any closure or ending to a case, was unsatisfying because the husband was so awful and one couldn't help but think of the little girl going to live with him.

As for Stone and Benson....  I just can't!!  Did I mishear or did he say something to her about morning coffee and pastries?? BLECH!!

And finally - I really don't care to know about Stone's sister, I didn't want to to about Goren's mother and brother, or about Stabler's family or about Benson's half-brother or Amanda's crazy mom and even more crazy sister.  I just want to see them do their jobs and solve crimes.

[slowpoked]

15 hours ago, Packerbrewerbadger said:

Boy did Stone jump the gun on arresting the husband for murder!  Will he be disciplined for it?  Sounds like it will cost the city a bundle.   I thought Liv was really weak and unprepared when she testified in the lawsuit. She didn’t have to lie but could have come up with some better answers given her experience.  I don’t think I liked this episode but can’t pinpoint why. 

Yeah, part of this clusterfuck was Stone's fault. Why not charge with kidnapping? Or child endangerment? Why go for broke when you don't have the bodies yet?

1 hour ago, pinguina said:

Having said that Olivia threw her under the bus when she was being interviewed by the husband's lawyer.  She always prevaricated before (and done it well too), yet apparently she couldn't do it this time to save an abused woman.  Plus how did Cabot become the lawyer for the wife?  Why weren't pictures taken of the wife when she arrived to the "halfway house" to have evidence for a later date?  And the ending although done to show us sometimes there isn't any closure or ending to a case, was unsatisfying because the husband was so awful and one couldn't help but think of the little girl going to live with him.

This episode really has an interesting premise but went nowhere fast because of most everything that you mentioned above. That deposition with Olivia was riddled of lots of rookie mistakes! Something you'd expect probably from Carisi or Rollins, but not from the boss. What's up with letting slip about the abuse? What about just saying that you've talked to people and say the husband has a temper problem, therefore SVU is looking at potential DV issues? Or that he seems to be a serial cheater? Why drop that one ace that you have against this prick?

And how did Alex become the lawyer?! As much as her goals are noble, she's running an illegal operation. I do agree with her that the current system does not protect DV victims as much as it should. But this is just a hard turn left for Cabot's character.

And when Cabot dropped that bomb that her old client was murdered by her husband after getting out on bail in one of her old cases, I knew that poor Jules won't be for long. Because what else her character would serve but to be another moral dilemma and burden for St. Benson - "Gosh, if I had just shut up, Jules would still be alive, and Carisi would not be hurt, and now the bastard has custody of the daughter, and it's ALL MY FAULT!!!!"

[Fiero425]

1 hour ago, slowpoked said:

Yeah, part of this clusterfuck was Stone's fault. Why not charge with kidnapping? Or child endangerment? Why go for broke when you don't have the bodies yet?

This episode really has an interesting premise but went nowhere fast because of most everything that you mentioned above. That deposition with Olivia was riddled of lots of rookie mistakes! Something you'd expect probably from Carisi or Rollins, but not from the boss. What's up with letting slip about the abuse? What about just saying that you've talked to people and say the husband has a temper problem, therefore SVU is looking at potential DV issues? Or that he seems to be a serial cheater? Why drop that one ace that you have against this prick?

And how did Alex become the lawyer?! As much as her goals are noble, she's running an illegal operation. I do agree with her that the current system does not protect DV victims as much as it should. But this is just a hard turn left for Cabot's character.

And when Cabot dropped that bomb that her old client was murdered by her husband after getting out on bail in one of her old cases, I knew that poor Jules won't be for long. Because what else her character would serve but to be another moral dilemma and burden for St. Benson - "Gosh, if I had just shut up, Jules would still be alive, and Carisi would not be hurt, and now the bastard has custody of the daughter, and it's ALL MY FAULT!!!!"

I think Olivia has more to answer for in the next life after stopping transport of that heart for transplant a few weeks ago! Some kid died as a result of her "Angelic" character to not let anything slide unless it's absolutely necessary! ;-(

[Gigi43]

The Stone story still seems like it was created just because people must have pointed out Ben had a daughter and it was the only way they could explain her absence.

 

Arrests without bodies are not made that quickly. I don't drive and even I don't think a car could do that much damage to another car and easily get away by driving off. Unless your John Reese with a truck.

 

I'm going to go with/share my father's take on the episode. "Maybe this would be okay if it wasn't her [Cabot.] But its stupid she would do this. Why are they just making people criminals now this is like Barba. They've run out of ideas. Benson should be off the job or demoted to beat in reall life."

Edited April 19, 2018 by Gigi43

[DaynaPhile]

I’m still unclear how Alex managed to frame the husband for murder. Didn’t the cops come to that conclusion all on their own? All Alex did was orchestrate what appeared to be a kidnapping, then possible murder because of the blood in the wife’s car. There was a struggle, ok. She was hurt. No proof there was a murder. She needed to disappear a wife and kid, it was the cops, Stone in particular, that decided the husband must have been the murderer and in the end, I fully believe he did orchestrate that car accident. The daughter had been taken into foster custody by that time which was why she want in the car with her mom.

 

I have to say, I would do what Alex does in a heartbeat. The law won’t protect these abused women, so they have to take it into their own hands to get away. How is that different than witness protection? Everyone thinks they’re dead, too. 

 

Olivia giving up that the wife was still alive and then somehow stupidly telling the husband where she was?! That was a travesty, and IMHO was the leading factor in the wife getting killed. No one divulges the location of a shelter like that!! I don’t know how Olivia sleeps at night. This is why I could never be a cop. The harsh line between law and lawless doesn’t make room for what is actually right. 

[Xeliou66]

Cabot was just completely OOC, I never believed that she would frame someone for something they didn’t do and then say it was fine to just leave them at Rikers. I hated how they ruined her, she was destroyed worse than Barba, I never bought that Cabot would be so unethical. 

As for the whole Stone/Benson relationship, I really hope they don’t start giving them a close relationship like whatever Benson and Barba’s relationship became, that relationship was nauseating. It is strange that Stone is already calling her “Liv”, they haven’t known each other that long and Benson has been cold with him for the most part, I just hope they don’t start hanging out constantly the way Benson and Barba did and please don’t let Benson start calling him by a pet name “Pete” or something like she did with “Rafa”.

Edited April 19, 2018 by Xeliou66

[MamaMax]

7 hours ago, mtlchick said:

The good: The eyeglasses of justice looked fab! 

 

The bad: I said "this feels like a character assassination on Cabot."  Protecting victims I see, but it's not like her at all to frame husbands for murder, even if she turned out to be right about the result. 

 

Still trying to figure out what they plan to do with Stone and his sister, because so far, I'm not feeling it. 

I was hoping Cabot was going to say, well, they shouldn't be able to convict without a body. Ha!

[CelticBlackCat]

People put into the federal witness protection program are not presumed to be dead.  There are no fake funerals or obituaries or death certificates.  They just disappear, sometimes whole families.  To learn more about the WPP, read up on Henry Hill.  He is the real-life mobster portrayed in the movie Goodfellas.

Framing someone for murder is against the law and unethical, even if it's a bad person.  Having an ex-ADA who has gone rogue is ridiculous.

I enjoyed the episode's story, but the plot holes!  Character assassination!  And now it looks as though we're entering into BenStone land.

[augmentedfourth]

Local pedant alert:

 

It was cute how Carisi mentioned that he had a cousin who lived up in Pearl River, back when it was known as Muddy Creek, but he missed it by a couple generations. My mother is 70, and by the time the family moved out of the city when she was in elementary school, it was definitely Pearl River by then. Even the local telephone exchange (remember those?) is PE. Ah, the Carisi family, always a random relative when you need one, regardless of how plausible it is. Someone else can figure out how he has a cousin who's at least in his 90s. ;) 

 

/Local pedant alert

 

I think my bar is just set way too low for this show now, as most episodes this season have elicited the same reaction: "Eh, wasn't bad, I guess?" It became obvious way too quickly that Jules wasn't going to survive until the end of the episode. Wonder if we'll ever get a follow-up like "Closure".

 

Stephanie March still looks fantastic, good for her.

 

The only reason anyone gives even a fraction of a damn about Peter and his sister is because they're Ben Stone's kids. I agree with whoever said they're giving us too much too soon on the Stone family's personal life.

[DaynaPhile]

3 hours ago, CelticBlackCat said:

People put into the federal witness protection program are not presumed to be dead.  There are no fake funerals or obituaries or death certificates.  They just disappear, sometimes whole families.  To learn more about the WPP, read up on Henry Hill.  He is the real-life mobster portrayed in the movie Goodfellas.

Framing someone for murder is against the law and unethical, even if it's a bad person.  Having an ex-ADA who has gone rogue is ridiculous.

I enjoyed the episode's story, but the plot holes!  Character assassination!  And now it looks as though we're entering into BenStone land.

Wasn’t Alex herself put into WPP but presumed dead? She was shot like a million seasons ago? I might be misremembering. 

 

I still don’t think she intentionally tried to frame the husband for murder. It just ended up looking like that and his innocence was collateral damage. She tried to make it look like someone snatched and killed the mom and daughter, but the detectives digging did a bit of jumping to conclusions if you ask me. 

[WendyCR72]

12 minutes ago, DaynaPhile said:

Wasn’t Alex herself put into WPP but presumed dead? She was shot like a million seasons ago? I might be misremembering. 

You're not misremembering. That happened all the way back in S5 in the episode "Loss". But then...she somehow managed to get out of it and take her own name back, etc. (Probably to accommodate the short-lived Conviction (2006 version) quasi-spinoff.)

[Vicky8675309]

Why did the SUV team show up to a missing person case or kidnapping case in the beginning of the episode? I thought they dealt with sex crimes. After that it was all downhill for me.

[Fellaway]

4 hours ago, Vicky8675309 said:

Why did the SUV team show up to a missing person case or kidnapping case in the beginning of the episode? I thought they dealt with sex crimes. After that it was all downhill for me.

I wondered that, too, then thought it might be because one of the "victims" was a child.  I believe children as victims, whatever the crime, are one of the categories of special victims SVU covers, in addition to sex crimes.

Edited April 20, 2018 by Fellaway

[Bostongirl]

Agreed that it was refreshing to see a case that did not get resolved in one episode

[MerBearHou]

never mind - figured it out!

Edited April 20, 2018 by MerBearHou

[Vicky8675309]

10 hours ago, Fellaway said:

I wondered that, too, then thought it might be because one of the "victims" was a child.  I believe children as victims, whatever the crime, are one of the categories of special victims SVU covers, in addition to sex crimes.

 

imagine all the missing kids, many would fall into the noncustodial parent taking them, cases they would have to investigate. I appreciate your rationale but it doesn't work for me. Oh well, I think I will just go with suspension of disbelief when watching this show, lol :) I don't know why but that issue (them showing up to investigate a woman and child gone missing) bothered me. There have always been pros and cons to this show but lately the cons have become more prevalent imo....but I keep watching, lol.

 

edit: I thought the show was about sex crimes and not straight up missing people/kidnappings. The abuse didn't even come up in the beginning.

Edited April 20, 2018 by Vicky8675309

[Fellaway]

4 hours ago, Vicky8675309 said:

imagine all the missing kids, many would fall into the noncustodial parent taking them, cases they would have to investigate. I appreciate your rationale but it doesn't work for me. Oh well, I think I will just go with suspension of disbelief when watching this show, lol :) I don't know why but that issue (them showing up to investigate a woman and child gone missing) bothered me. There have always been pros and cons to this show but lately the cons have become more prevalent imo....but I keep watching, lol.

 

edit: I thought the show was about sex crimes and not straight up missing people/kidnappings. The abuse didn't even come up in the beginning.

Well, it's not really my rationale.  It's been stated on the show, though, granted, I don't think since the early seasons when, I guess, they wanted to establish for viewers who a Special Victim was, that it wasn't just the sex crimes squad.  True, sex crimes makes up the bulk of the show's cases, especially as the series has progressed, but there are still cases that don't involve sex crimes. Recently, for instance, there was that case a season or so ago where the kid was kidnapped by his nanny.  

But, agreed, it's a television show, so suspension of disbelief is a requirement.  I was more bothered when Benson got involved in the search for Noah, but, of course, the show has become The Olivia Benson Hour...

[wknt3]

14 hours ago, Fellaway said:

I wondered that, too, then thought it might be because one of the "victims" was a child.  I believe children as victims, whatever the crime, are one of the categories of special victims SVU covers, in addition to sex crimes.

 

3 hours ago, Vicky8675309 said:

imagine all the missing kids, many would fall into the noncustodial parent taking them, cases they would have to investigate. I appreciate your rationale but it doesn't work for me. Oh well, I think I will just go with suspension of disbelief when watching this show, lol :) I don't know why but that issue (them showing up to investigate a woman and child gone missing) bothered me. There have always been pros and cons to this show but lately the cons have become more prevalent imo....but I keep watching, lol.

 

edit: I thought the show was about sex crimes and not straight up missing people/kidnappings. The abuse didn't even come up in the beginning.

The show is primarily about "sexually based offenses" but child abuse is routinely covered by both the real life and fictional versions of SVU and crimes involving children can be assigned as well at the discretion of the brass. And it was established pretty early on in the series ("Runaway" in mid-season 2 IIRC) that the squad can be assigned to investigate missing or kidnapped children if the case is high-profile or the parents have some kind of pull.

[ForeverAlone]

I generally liked this episode, but couldn't help but compare it to "The Undiscovered Country." Both episodes embroiled beloved ADAs in morally and legally questionable behavior. Of course this episode did Alex better, because they didn't turn her into a baby killer and put her on trial. But both episodes approached thorny ethical issues that aren't really well served by the courts and the law and didn't offer up easy answers to either problem (because there aren't easy answers to situations like this). I would have preferred a Rafael exit episode like this that dealt with the gray issues without turning him fully onto the criminal side of the law. But oh well, you can't have everything in life. 

I did like that this episode showed that there was no GOOD answer to problems such as these. Domestic violence laws can often let victims down and put them at greater risk. Alex had seen firsthand how the law can not help victims at times. But yeah Olivia was right in the sense that what Alex was doing was aiding and abetting crimes at times. It was an issue that explored both sides of it, and the outcome was unfortunately what was likely going to happen in this sort of situation. And of course Asshole Husband "won" in the end, because he is now free of his wife and will likely maintain full custody of his daughter. I do agree from an episode closure perspective if they had found some evidence he was behind the car crash, but the writers were clearly making another point here. 

Of course I think some of this could have been avoided if Peter hadn't overreached by charging him with murder without bodies or really solid evidence of their deaths. Olivia would probably have an easier time looking the other way (like she did when Avery Jordan ran off with her child at the end of "Legitimate Rape") if Asshole Husband hadn't gotten smacked around in prison and had grounds to bring a lawsuit against them all. Of course if she had learned to parse her answers to a deposition that concealed the truth without flat out committing perjury, some of this could have been avoided as well. But if Jules and Ruby had gotten away in the end, it would have undermined the story they were trying to tell (and give an opportunity for some Anguished Olivia). 

At least Alex is out there doing what she can for victims. I know what she is doing is highly questionable, but I honestly can't bring myself to feel sorry for abusers. It was good to see her again and see her in court. I always liked her cool and smart persona. 

On another note, it pays to be the showrunner's pet, because we have seen more personal stuff for Peter than we have seen for other new characters in the past. I wonder if all of this is just character stuff for the hell of it, or if it is building to something specific. 

Edited April 21, 2018 by ForeverAlone

[Xeliou66]

I thought Cabot was ruined worse than Barba. Barba had become a pathetic puppet and had been behaving OOC for a while, so I really wasn’t shocked when he let his emotions ruin his judgment, but I think he did the morally right thing by pulling the plug on the baby. Cabot on the other hand suddenly had become a vigilante who didn’t trust the law and didn’t seem to care about innocent people going to jail because of her actions, it didn’t make sense at all and she was just not remotely sympathetic to me with her attitude about an innocent person going to prison.

Edited April 21, 2018 by Xeliou66

[ForeverAlone]

I can see Alex rationalizing that these abusers deserved to be in jail anyway for the abuse they committed, so it wasn't like truly innocent people were going to jail. It is definitely morally and ethically questionable, but it would be a consistent line of thinking for someone who was doing what she was doing. We haven't seen Alex at all in about six years (and we haven't seen her consistently in about eight years), so it's hard to say that she suddenly became a vigilante. It sounds like she has been at this for years now (though this seems to support the notion that Olivia doesn't keep in touch with people once they leave the SVU work orbit, because she had no clue what Alex was doing with her life, even though it sounds like Alex still lives in NYC. Yeah I know they joked about Alex moving to Florida, but that just didn't sound all that realistic to me). 

Edited April 21, 2018 by ForeverAlone

[ChristiKRN]

I'm still ambiguous about this episode.  I always liked Cabot, and Stephanie March always delivers when she makes an appearance.  I didn't think it was out of character for Alex to assist women and children from escaping abusive situations, as evidenced by her leaving to fight for human rights in the Congo (?). However, it was out of character for her to allow someone to be arrested for murder when a murder was not committed.  Even though the husband was a total scumbag and deserved jail time, there is a major difference in jail time for assault and murder.  Also, I believe Alex we know would have pushed Jules to file a complaint against her husband, so there was a paper trail of problems.  

I'm not at all pleased with the direction that Stone is heading.  I really thought that he was going to set SVU on the straight and narrow after his 1st episode as the ADA.  Why in God's name did he jump the shark by arresting the husband so quickly for murder?  Very impulsive move, not what I want to see from him.  Good grief, it took a few years for Liv to break Barba down; Stone looks like he is already heading in that direction after a few months.  I already feel that they are spending too much scene time  with him dealing with his sister's psychiatric issues.  The time given to those scenes this week could have been better spent on fleshing out the main storyline.

Just a few random thoughts: Carisi should never be allowed to provide protective detail ever again; I think this is the 2nd time his charge has ben killed while under his care.  I had a mental picture of the overbearing mama of the scumbag husband being behind the wheel of the SVU that killed Jules and injured Carisi. Rollins really needs to do something with her hair; it is just limp, lifeless and just plain awful (haha-I guess the hair matches the personality!).  On a positive note, no Noah drama in a while; unfortunately, no Fin this episode. 

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Post Divorce glow looks good on Stephanie March.

 

Actor who played the hubby plays Douchebags to perfection.

 

He also played one on the Cinemax series Outcast.

 

 

Phillip Winchester is very nice to look at.

 

 

That's all I got.

[TV Diva Queen]

......elite squad known as the Special Victims Unit

[millennium]

On 4/19/2018 at 1:50 AM, QueenMab said:

 

Benson as the seductive dominatrix no younger man can resist is now, officially, hilarious. And God Almighty we KNOW. Benson has giant, mega hooter Macy parade balloon chi chi's that enter the room five minutes before she does. Is there a shirt, a blouse, a circus tent in all of NYC that can cover those gigantor funbags? ENOUGH WITH MARISKA HARGITAY'S big fat tits. I can't watch two minutes of her. I can't get past the huge tits. 

They're simply davoon. 

[lavenderblue]

First time watching this one -- this episode frustrated me on multiple levels. First, it seemed like Olivia was unfamiliar with the basic premise of an underground railroad to get women and children away from abusers, not just aghast at the potentially unsavory consequences of such a system, and that made no sense for a woman who's been working in SVU for twenty years. Secondly, I agree with @DaynaPhile that it didn't really seem like they intended to frame Jules's husband; the fake kidnapping set-up was certainly ripe for indicting someone for a crime, and so was not an ethically ideal plan, but none of the "evidence" they created pointed directly at the husband -- that was SVU jumping to some major conclusions, similar to how they did with the clown guy a few episodes earlier where the girl ran off with her music teacher/father. (And in that episode there was more evidence against the falsely accused!) He did have a legal case against the squad, but I don't think it's wholly Cabot and Jules's fault that the team reached the conclusions they did.

But Olivia overall also annoyed me throughout. She's perfectly willing to go gray when it suits her cause of the week or to protect her own team, but in this instance, with her years of experience, she's convinced the legal system is a failsafe way to protect DV victims and there's no justification for disappearing, and she can't bear to be any vaguer in her deposition? Yeah, the show obviously presented her as somewhat wrong in the end by having Jules get killed, but that this is the time when she sees no moral ambiguity was bizarre to me.

Edited October 29, 2022 by lavenderblue