S02.E11: AKA Three Lives and Counting

[The Crazed Spruce]

Shocked by her own actions and haunted by visions of Kilgrave, Jessica worries she's turning into a monster.  Trish's plans for Karl become clear.

[mledawn]

I'm glad I steered away from any spoilers, because I'm sure it was out that Tennant was back but it was a nice surprise. 

I am so over Trish.

[methodwriter85]

I'm glad they stuck to it just being hallucinations. I was worried that Kilgrave would have found some way to resurrect himself or something.

[Jediknight]

It's amazing how Tennant can make Kilgrave pure nightmare fuel, but then turn around and have some funny lines.  Even in hallucination form, his creepiness doesn't go down at all.  Best villain in the MCU.

[Wayward Son]

• I have to confess I’m far from an expert in such matters, but wouldn’t the coroner be able to tell the difference between damaged inflicted by a blunt blow to the head and falling from a rooftop? 

• Kilgrave as the little voice in Jessica’s head assuring her that she did the right thing was perfect. If Jessica’s psyche were to be separated into two parts; one part being the part that hated herself for what she did and the other part the darker aspect of her psyche which attempts to justify the murder Kilgrave is a perfect manifestation of that darker psyche.  

• The Malcolm / Jessica break up scene (for lack of a better word) was hard to watch :( . They’d better make up before the finale. 

[Sakura12]

I think that would depend how damaged the skull was. It looked Jessica dropped him on his head. If they didn't have much of the skull to work with they probably couldn't tell what caused the trauma. Plus with what they found out about the guy I'm guessing everyone was disgusted by him and weren't willing to look to deep into the how he died part. 

[dkb]

I really shouldn't love Kilgrave but I do.

There are many waves to save lives, without superpowers Trish.

I hope Jessica and Malcolm can forgive each other. I like their dynamic.

[ShellsandCheese]

On 3/12/2018 at 8:59 PM, dkb said:

I really shouldn't love Kilgrave but I do.

There are many waves to save lives, without superpowers Trish.

I hope Jessica and Malcolm can forgive each other. I like their dynamic.

Yeah! Trish just wants to be special. She’s a narcissist and probably a sociopath. Every episode, I just wanted to be like “stop, what are you doing?”. She’s consumed by a need to be special - and now she’s set off a chain of events that she won’t be able to recover from. 

 

Oh and yeah, I felt dirty watching Season One JJ because I find David Tennant so frackin hot. So hot. Did I mention he was hot? 

Edited March 15, 2018 by ShellsandCheese

[Lady Calypso]

I knew Kilgrave was coming back at some point because of promotional pictures, but I was waiting for the episode when he did. And I guess it was this one! And moreover, it was a great way to bring him back. This is why Kilgrave is my favourite villain in the Marvel universe. Menacing yet charming, and still has a hold over his victims well after his death. It's why this instantly became my favourite episode for season 2, even with the stupid Trish stuff.

It's fascinating to watch the Alisa/Jessica scene after Dale's death. Alisa seems so proud over her daughter killing Dale, making sure she cleaned up and not caring about anything else, but Jessica is so obviously distraught. It just adds another point that either Alisa has years of redemption to go, or that she may never be redeemed. The experiments completely screwed her up; she's not Jessica's mother anymore, not in the way that Jessica needs her to be. And now, with Karl dead, she's going to lose it.

The odd pairing of Jessica and hallucination Kilgrave made me chuckle more than I thought. It kind of eased the dramatic tension of the episode in general, yet it also elevated it.

Trish is an annoyance. She's doing everything wrong, all because she wants powers? Malcolm screwed up, yes, and he should have been smarter about Trish using him, but I'm really rooting for him here. But it needs to be on Jessica's end. Malcolm has done all he can with her. Jessica also could have stopped Trish but she chose Alisa over her. I think Jessica knows, deep down, that she has part of herself to blame for Trish going off the rails, which is why she took it all out on Malcolm. Hopefully both can heal and come back together as friends. 

I feel bad for Alisa's new prison guard. She genuinely didn't want to treat Alisa like an animal, connected with her, and then was horribly betrayed. And now she's going to go after Trish, so Jessica really will have to choose.

[Unusual Suspect]

This has been both an interesting and frustrating season. After Kilgrave, it's hard to have another villian top that, and I kinda like how most of the conflict isn't really good vs. evil, just trying to overcome one's own flaws. But liked all of the Marvel Netflix series, this show can really meander.

Damnit, I liked the new guard.

[strippedhalo]

Wow, they have really gone all out on making Trish an unsympathetic character this season. I get that it is a combination of her crappy childhood and her addiction issues and her inferiority issues, but geez. She's fully in "ends justify the means" territory, and I hate that she's probably going to wind up with powers. They're setting Jessica up to have to choose between Alisa and Trish, and neither of them deserve her right now.

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 3/12/2018 at 8:37 AM, Jediknight said:

It's amazing how Tennant can make Kilgrave pure nightmare fuel, but then turn around and have some funny lines.  Even in hallucination form, his creepiness doesn't go down at all.  Best villain in the MCU.

Tennant is just so brilliant.  So brilliant.  

I've never liked or gotten the character of Trish nor the actor playing her, so there is no fall from grace for me.

Though I do love Malcolm and Eka Darville is always yanking at my heartstrings.

I have to admit there's a few things I've never understood.  Is Rebecca DeMornay (Dorothy?) Trish's biological mother on the show or adoptive mother?  And did she adopt Jessica when Jessica was a kid too?  

Edited March 17, 2018 by Ms Blue Jay

[Llywela]

23 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I have to admit there's a few things I've never understood.  Is Rebecca DeMornay (Dorothy?) Trish's biological mother on the show or adoptive mother?  And did she adopt Jessica when Jessica was a kid too?  

 

Dorothy is Trish's biological mother. She adopted Jessica as a teen, after her family were killed in a road accident. I forget the exact circumstances, I want to say Trish and Jess were already school friends, but might be imagining that part, Dorothy might have just seen the story in the news and decided to step in. The adoption was a publicity stunt on Dorothy's part - taking in the poor little orphan to be a sister to her precious Patsy, the kind of thing the tabloids tend to love - pretty much backfired, though, given that Jessica's close relationship with Trish cost Dorothy a large portion of her control over her daughter.

Edited March 17, 2018 by Llywela

[Ms Blue Jay]

@Llywela, thank you so much.  That makes so much sense than whatever story I had in my head.

[thuganomics85]

I knew Kilgrave was going to come back on some level, but I wish they kept David Tennant's name from the credits, because it would have made the reveal that much sweeter. Still, it was great to see him again.... well, a variation of him, at least.  While he was a great villain, having him somehow be alive would have been too much, so I like that he was a hallucination in Jessica's mind, goading her over having to kill the prison guard, and trying to make her do the same to Karl.  Glad Jessica was able to fight him off and send him away, but he'll probably always be a part of her now, or as he elegantly put it: "I'll be here if you need me."

So, Trish actually wanted Karl so he could do the same experiments that he did on Jessica on her.  Yeah, Trish is just pure nuts now.  Well, actually she's unconscious after the experiment fucked her up, but I'm sure she'll pull through.  And be greeted by a pissed off Alisa, who will no doubt hold her responsible for Karl's death.

Poor Malcolm getting stuck in the trunk of the car for God knows how long.  Had a feeling he and Jessica were going to "break-up", considering how much worse her treatment towards him was.  She really has a knack at pushing those who care for her away.  I hope she can make amends before it is too late.

Only two episodes left.  Have to think shit is really going to be hitting the fan now.

[benteen]

Always great to have DT back and he had some great lines here.  I loved the random "I want your cray cray" singing.

Trish hasn't exactly been sympathetic this season but I can't shake the feeling that she's acting this way mostly because the script demands that she does.  A few other characters feel that way this season.

Also, it's hard to believe the cops and the guards wouldn't have suspected what happened to Dale with how much Alisa was asking about him and how loudly she and Jessica were talking about him.

Edited March 23, 2018 by benteen

[ElectricBoogaloo]

One thing I will give Jessica is that unlike most of the dummies we see committing crimes on various tv shows, she was smart enough to wrap plastic bags around her boots and put on gloves before cleaning up the crime scene. I just wish she had put on gloves before typing Holiday's suicide note. When she took off all her murder clothes, I was like damn, at least go to a laundromat and wash the blood out somewhere that isn't your building before you throw them in a dumpster or burn them!

Seeing Kilgrave's creepy face again was scary on the roof, but when she imagined him in her shower I was like OH SHIT. David Tennant is so good in this role, charming and funny yet menacing and scary, even as a hallucination. Hearing him sing Trish's "I Want Your Cray Cray" song was hilariously creepy (or creepily hilarious?).

Alisa and Jessica's "coded" conversations at the jail a few episodes ago were terribly easy to decipher, as was their phone conversation at the beginning of this episode. Seriously, those two need to come up with more subtle ways to talk about their super sekrit stuff.

Trish is off the rails. I know that I should feel sorry for her, but it's difficult to when it's clear that this is not just the withdrawal talking. She has been jealous of Jessica's powers for years because she needs to feel special. Guess what, Trish? It's entirely possible to help people WITHOUT SPECIAL POWERS. Thousands of people do it every single day - doctors, firemen, police officers, social workers, even investigative journalists. Maybe if you focused on actually helping people instead of obsessing about how you don't have Jessica's powers, you could, you know actually help people. Gawd, I am dreading Dorothy's reaction to this. You know she will find a way to make this all Jessica's fault.

That fight between Jessica and Malcolm was so painful to watch. I hope they make up sooner rather than later.

Poor Marilyn. She was just a nice person trying to do her job while still treating Alisa like a human being and all she got for her efforts was tossed into a cement wall.

Edited March 25, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Quark]

Well it seems like things might finally be picking up.

Trish is a stupid cow.

I hope Malcolm turns out alright. I guess he will go to that guy who was trying to outcompete Jessica (can't remember his name). The one that tried to kill Jessica's Mother.

[Paloma]

UO here, but I was not happy to see Kilgrave "back" and it got really annoying as his hallucination multiplied. I do understand why Jessica would still feel haunted by him, especially after killing someone, but I think less Kilgrave in this episode would have been plenty to get the point across.

On 3/25/2018 at 7:32 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Trish is off the rails. I know that I should feel sorry for her, but it's difficult to when it's clear that this is not just the withdrawal talking. She has been jealous of Jessica's powers for years because she needs to feel special. Guess what, Trish? It's entirely possible to help people WITHOUT SPECIAL POWERS. Thousands of people do it every single day - doctors, firemen, police officers, social workers, even investigative journalists. Maybe if you focused on actually helping people instead of obsessing about how you don't have Jessica's powers, you could, you know actually help people.

I have been getting sick of Trish for quite a while, and this episode sealed it--I'm not sure her character can come back from what she's done and was trying to do. Granted, she is not a super-evil villain, but she has become really selfish. I guess I should give her a partial pass because of the drugs, but it's hard to be sympathetic. Which is funny, because I am totally sympathetic to Jessica and willing to give her a pass for worse behavior.

[Catfi9ht]

3 hours ago, Paloma said:

I have been getting sick of Trish for quite a while, and this episode sealed it--I'm not sure her character can come back from what she's done and was trying to do. Granted, she is not a super-evil villain, but she has become really selfish. I guess I should give her a partial pass because of the drugs, but it's hard to be sympathetic. Which is funny, because I am totally sympathetic to Jessica and willing to give her a pass for worse behavior.

I agree on all points. I think what makes Jessica forgivable to me is she is self-aware of her flaws and tries to navigate through them as best as she can. However, Trish is sanctimonious and self-righteous about her behavior which makes her completely unsympathetic to me.

I knew the new, nice guard was dead meat because Jessica's mom is a POS. The one person that was nice to her in prison might be dead because she had a temper tantrum. Yawn. Talk about a character with no depth.

Just wanted to give a shout-out to Jennifer Lynch directing this episode. I'm a big fan of her work and knew she would handle the hallucinations/imaginary aspects of this episode really well.

I've also noticed that the majority of the directors this season (if not all) have been women, which is really refreshing to see. However, I just wish they would have had smarter writing this season to go along with it. 

[Paloma]

8 minutes ago, Catfi9ht said:

I agree on all points. I think what makes Jessica forgivable to me is she is self-aware of her flaws and tries to navigate through them as best as she can. However, Trish is sanctimonious and self-righteous about her behavior which makes her completely unsympathetic to me.

Yes, that is exactly why I can't sympathize with Trish but can sympathize with Jessica--thanks for expressing it that way.

9 minutes ago, Catfi9ht said:

I've also noticed that the majority of the directors this season (if not all) have been women, which is really refreshing to see. However, I just wish they would have had smarter writing this season to go along with it. 

Agree on both counts.

[benteen]

On ‎3‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 7:32 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

One thing I will give Jessica is that unlike most of the dummies we see committing crimes on various tv shows, she was smart enough to wrap plastic bags around her boots and put on gloves before cleaning up the crime scene. I just wish she had put on gloves before typing Holiday's suicide note. When she took off all her murder clothes, I was like damn, at least go to a laundromat and wash the blood out somewhere that isn't your building before you throw them in a dumpster or burn them!

That lack of characters like Jessica who sneak into people's homes and don't wear gloves drives me F'ing crazy.  She'd have to wipe down Holiday's laptop after writing that note because she wasn't wearing gloves and that would make the whole thing even more suspicious than it already is.

[rmontro]

On 3/26/2018 at 9:12 AM, Paloma said:

UO here, but I was not happy to see Kilgrave "back" and it got really annoying as his hallucination multiplied. I do understand why Jessica would still feel haunted by him, especially after killing someone, but I think less Kilgrave in this episode would have been plenty to get the point across.

Agree, I could have done without all the Kilgrave stuff.  TV seems to always use this "I haven't gotten any sleep" excuse as a reason to give someone hallucinations.  That may be possible, but less would have gone a longer way IMO.  Or are they trying to show that Jessica's brain is damaged, like her mother's but not as bad?  She could have killed that innocent bystander because she was responding to her Kilgrave hallucination.

That said, it was kind of funny that he kept singing "I Want Your Cray Cray" to her.  Now there's a nightmare!

[Loandbehold]

On 3/26/2018 at 12:49 PM, Catfi9ht said:

I've also noticed that the majority of the directors this season (if not all) have been women, which is really refreshing to see. However, I just wish they would have had smarter writing this season to go along with it. 

I believe there's a link to this in the media thread. All the directors this season were women.

I was surprised that Jessica dropped the guy from the roof. I'm not sure if even hitting head first would hide the original wound. Wouldn't a coroner be able to determine that some of the damage occurred postmortem? It was good to see Jessica putting on the gloves, but she should have been wearing gloves when she broke in. Also, I was yelling at her to remember to get rid of her pants far away from the apartment. Maybe Fed Ex them to Luke and ask him to destroy them. 

Enjoyed David Tennant and his Kilgrave hallucinations. He so enjoys playing the creep factor. And is so very good at playing it. 

Poor Malcolm. Jessica will need to do a lot for them to get back together. As for Trish, I'd run the other way if I was him. Offering an addict a hit. Convincing him to help her find Karl. Assaulting and kidnapping him. Threatening him with a gun and shooting at his feet. Yeah, I'd be done with her no matter what she wants to say to me.  

[tennisgurl]

It was weirdly awesome seeing David Tennant as Kilgrave again, especially with this context. When he was alive, he was always quick to justify his shitty actions, so of course he shows up as the devil on Jessica's shoulder when shes spiraling in guilt and anger. He manages to perfectly walk that line between funny and scary. Him cheerfully singing along to Cray Cray was delightfully ridiculous. Getting that song stuck in your head is the REAL nightmare. 

I figured that the nice guard was toast, but it was probably inevitable. Alisa is a ticking time bomb, even on her good days. I feel for her, as I dont think its fully her fault she is the way she is, but she basically spends every second on the verge of tearing everyone she sees limb from limb. She is all kinds of scary. I also ended up having more sympathy for Karl than I expected to. I really do think he thought he was doing something good in his project and with Alisa. He acted terribly unethically, but it was out of a real place that wanted to help. 

Trish has officially lost her damn mind. I know its out of her addiction issues, but God dang its hard to root for her. She wants to be A Hero, and thats always been a thing with her. This relapse is just bringing it out into the foreground. She just lacks any self awareness about her flaws, in ways that Jessica and Malcolm dont. They both have big problems, but they're quite aware of them and try to fix them, when they can. Trish really always thinks that shes the hero of the story, even when her actions are decidedly unheroic. 

I hope Malcolm and Jessica make up before the season ends. Malcolm probably should have seen through Trishes bullshit, but he has feelings for her, and it impacted his judgement. Its hard to blame him for that. Plus, Jessica needs someone in her life.

[Taryn74]

42 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

Alisa is a ticking time bomb, even on her good days. I feel for her, as I dont think its fully her fault she is the way she is, but she basically spends every second on the verge of tearing everyone she sees limb from limb. She is all kinds of scary. I also ended up having more sympathy for Karl than I expected to. I really do think he thought he was doing something good in his project and with Alisa. He acted terribly unethically, but it was out of a real place that wanted to help. 

Totally agree, especially on the points I bolded.

I've really spent some time thinking about why I reacted to Alisa the way I did, when Bruce Banner/Hulk is one of my favorite Marvel characters whom I am very sympathetic toward.  I think it's because Bruce is only Hulk-y when he can't control the rage monster coming out, and he tries very hard not to let himself get to that point (even sending himself off planet so he doesn't hurt anyone) whereas with Alisa it's more like she doesn't really care that the rage monster is her default setting and she only "controls herself" so she can have a chance to be out in public and be close to Jessica.  I still don't know if that's how I was supposed to see her or not, if she really was supposed to be a sympathetic character and the actress just couldn't bring the nuances needed, but I never really saw her feeling regret over the people she hurt/killed beyond how it affected her relationship with her daughter.  She had a very 'eh, collateral damage' attitude that I just couldn't get past.

[WatchrTina]

On 3/18/2018 at 2:55 AM, thuganomics85 said:

I knew Kilgrave was going to come back on some level, but I wish they kept David Tennant's name from the credits,

Aaand this is why we should all binge-watch with Netflix automatically skipping the credits.  I had no idea that Kigrave was going to show up again and I was  simultaneously delighted and horrified when he reappeared.

 

On 3/25/2018 at 6:32 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I was like damn, at least go to a laundromat and wash the blood out somewhere that isn't your building before you throw them in a dumpster or burn them!

I am horrified at the prospect that she might now get rid of the coat -- the coat we now know her dead first love (the one her mother murdered) coached her to steal.  That coat is imbued with so many conflicted emotions and memories.  Then again, Jessica is currently dealing with being haunted by her dead, psychotic, abusive, mind-controlling ex-boyfriend/brainwasher so perhaps the bad memories imbedded in that coat are just background noise, like taxis honking.

 

On 4/8/2018 at 12:27 PM, tennisgurl said:

Trish has officially lost her damn mind.

A-fucking-men.

 

Im enjoying the ride for the most part but there is some startlingly bad writing going on.  Karl's being able to almost instantly create a pop-up evil laboratory in the old, abandoned lab space using the super-serum he had stored in a U-Stor-It facility is just too silly for words.  And his doing a complete 180 from "Hey, let's create a new powered person even though it hardly ever turns out well and Patsy has no wounds that need healing to justify the risk of the procedure" to "OMG I'm so filled with remorse for the bad choices I've made I must blow myself up" was -- dare I say it -- cray cray.  Meh.  Actually it was just sloppy writing.

[Dobian]

I have a lot of mixed feelings about this season.  It's been very much more about the personal lives and dramas of the main characters than on an external evil threat.  I have liked Jeri's subplot, and Jessica's mother is interesting though pretty one-note.  But there have been a lot of inconsistencies in plot and character actions and behaviors.  A guard going into Alisa's cell alone and removing her cuffs just makes no sense given her powers.  But the biggest for me is Trish's storyline, which I just don't buy.  Yes she was an addict a long time ago, but she was having no problem managing a successful career in season one without hitting on Simpson's inhaler, and between her and Jessica it was Trish who seemed to have it together and be the source of envy, certainly not Jessica.  Her whole arc all season has felt forced to me.  I welcomed seeing Kilgrave return again, but it's kind of a letdown as he is relegated to just being a voice inside Jessica's head.  Part of me feels like they dusted him off late in the season to make up for the lack of a charismatic villain this year.

[AKA...CJ86]

Marilyn, no!  Every character I love (or begin to love) on every show I love... ends up dead.

"Trading banter with a delusion."  We've all been there.

I'm done with Trish.  Officially.  She can be Alisa fodder for all I care now.

So, Malcolm can go work with Cheng now.  I see that in his future.  I don't see Malcolm/Jessica being repairable.

This show this season, I've loved it, but it is lacking a Kilgrave. 

I thought Karl was a little too gung-ho to experiment on the lady who kidnapped him at gunpoint.  

Again, I've enjoyed the season, it's just... meandering.

[Snow Fairy]

I don't understand why Jessica wouldn't let Karl try to fix Trish. She rather took her to hospital - to doctor who don't even know what she's taken, what was going on, or how to fix it.

I understand she hates Karl, but I think he was Trish's best chance at that time